Europe touring suggestions? Santander to...

[Bretty]

Hi All,

I'm well excited and planning a roadtrip on my FZS600. I'm keen to hear any of your hints and tips or must see suggestions! Or even to hear about any trips you've done. I've done a few tours of central Europe but this is my first time on this route.

The plan is to take the ferry to Santander. Then spend 8 days going to Barcelona, travel the French coast, Italy, Austria then back home through Germany.

I'm aiming to do 4-6hrs riding per day (do-able?)
Do I bother seeing the Pyrenees or just see the Alps?
Can you recommend any roads?
What should I see along the way? Anywhere worth spending longer than a day?
What would be a good route through the Alps? I was thinking of seeing Hitlers eagles nest through Austria.
Germany - I fancy doing a lap of the Nurnbergring, Can I just turn up?

So excited!

Thanks in advance,

Brett

[Tmation]

If you google map a rough route as you suggest, it is about 2250 miles and 40 hours of riding, realistically that will be closer to 60 with stops for lunch etc then add in stops for tolls, heavy traffic and detours your ridding day will be closer to 10 hours. That's not fun for most people  :\ 


Santander to Barcelona via the Pyrenees is an easy 3 days if you want to ride some good roads.


Take two to three weeks and see it all 

[BBROWN1664]

:agree

It is a lot of riding and not a lot of time to look around.

[pilninggas]

The Alps around Berchtesgaden (Eagles Nest) are lovely, but they can often be wet and there aren't an abundance of passes. I look further south, which is where I'll be going in the summer.

I tend to do more than 4-6 hours if I am honest, but it depends on terrain, conditions etc. As for staying anywhere more than a day, you need to see how you get on. Sometimes I have stayed somewhere as it caught my eye or other riders I spoke to said 'stay there'.

Touristfahrten at the N-Ring is usually in the evening-it rarely opens up before 1730/1800ish for all comers.

From a post I put on a forum a few years ago:

Each time i do it, i do less and less planning.

Stuff you have to tour with outside of the UK:  Passport, license (photo only in spain, italy they do not recognise the old paper only), EHIC and travel insurance.

^^ people do it like this.

For me i want to get a long way into Europe (Alps) without too much cost.  You can stay in hotels (most exp), youth hostels (i have done this very cheap in many countries), adlers, zimmers, pensions, apartments, guesthouses.  In the ski resorts and off of the beaten track some can be cheaper (euro25 /night).  I generally camp though - between 8-22 euro a night.  Why camp?  well 90% of sites always have space for a tent and my overall costs are 25% lower.  Problems with camping: amount of kit to carry, can be wet/cold, can be a pain if in transit to pitch/strike camp each day. I do have a routine.

I also take a camping gaz cooker, so i can brew-up and eat hot food when i like.  If i dont take it i spend 30euro a day on food drink minimum.

Your bike needs to be in decent fettle: i don't get it serviced beforehand (some do), but i do check everything over and make sure i am not going to end up stuck on the side of the road (obviously always a chance).

Also i dont think i'll do 400miles everyday - going down i did 850 miles from bristol to southern Germany on day 1, but after this i did mostly lower mileages and avoided motorways.  The first time i went into europe i thought yeah i'm gonna do munich-vienna-bratislava-berlin etc, but it was just silly, all you are gonna see is white-lines and tarmac.  The roads you want to ride will be away from motorways, but you will need them to cover large distances.

I never worry about travelling alone, i enjoy it and always seem to meet people on my travels.  I have been on holiday with my mates and sometimes having your own schedule is easier than compromising with someone else.

Remember there may be days when riding is not what you want to do (a break, the weather) so i try to camp in or near to towns - this bit is easier if you are hotelling etc.

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[Flooky]

I always work on 50mph.
Time you had a wee and a drink etc etc photo here and there . don't matter if your flat out while riding overall its 50mph.

[Bretty]

I reckon I'll shoot across to Barcelona in the first afternoon. Spend the next morning looking about then head along the French coast, probably stopping in Marseille or Nice.
I've seen all of the south of France before by car, I might spend half a day in Monaco, but most looking forward to Italy - Pisa, Lucca, Verona, Venice. Then either up to the Eagles Nest or across to Stelvio pass (?).
Nurnbergring, then up via the Rheine, Black Forest, or look around the Maginot or Siegfried lines (I like my world war stuff).

I reckon 250miles is an easy half day riding. 500miles probably a long full day riding.

[DekF]

I'd take note of the very good advice given above.
I've done over 30,000 miles on bikes touring Europe & distances travelled between destinations can be critical to the overall enjoyment of the trip.
We now aim for 200 - 250 mile days which affords us the time to choose good biking roads,scenery, coffee stops & lunch. Afterall, it's got to be enjoyable otherwise why bother?
For example, you expecting to go from Santander, which from memory the ferry doesn't arrive until lunchtime, to Barcelona (460 miles) by evening is unrealistic & you'll miss out on some of the finest biking roads anywhere in Europe. As TM says add in a couple of overnight stops, take in some great roads in and around the Pyrenees & you'll not regret it. We're going this year again & have some great routes mapped out. The area really is that good it shouldn't be rushed through.
You thinking 250 miles is a half days riding & 500 miles is a full day is so not true on good biking roads. Autoroutes yes, but what a waste of a trip.

[Flooky]

Couldn't agree more, if you heading for a foreign race track for an event then you just wanna get there, but if the trip is the reason for going then aiming for big miles ruins it.
I have done big mile days but good roads and great scenery beat it hands down. Don't make it a chore.

[adeejaysdelight]

I've done a bit of touring and what you are suggesting is not possible as an enjoyable holiday. 200-250 miles per day is MORE than enough. And even at that, you'll want a day off the bike. Making big mile plans is all good and well, until something happens. Example, last year I was going from Nurburg (we'll come to that in a minute) to Bagni Di Lucca in Tuscany. 1400kms. I got to about 600kms and the exhaust collapsed. This took 4hours and 325euro to repair as I was in the middle of nowhere. I'm not saying this will happen to you, but it might. Another time my friend and I took five days to ride to Tuscany via Holland, Belgium, Germany (lake konstance), Austria and the Stelvio Pass before arriving at our destination. It rained very very heavily until we reached Italy. It was miserable. You really have to consider such things.


As an additional point, and not to be a smart arse, if you want to go to the Nuremberg ring (where they tested VW Beetles and shit), that's fine. But it's probably the Nurburgring Nordschleife your talking about, and around 400km separates the two. I've done many laps at the Nurburgring in the car and on the bike over various trips. It's worth remembering that the Nurburgring is a road, not a track. There are laws in place and you should follow them. It's also important to note that you are liable for any accident you cause, which can become very expensive very quickly. Especially if you hit someones supercar. I wouldn't buy tickets for this prior to showing up because it could be raining and you'd have to be an idiot to take your bike out in the rain, or someone might crash just as you arrive and it could be closed for the rest of the day. I've been there before and it was a long wait to find out I'd wasted my money. It was worse for the three bikers and one driver that had just been killed I suppose though.


An 8 day trip I think no more than 1200 miles max. Unless you enjoy endurance riding and grinding out a challenge. But if its a leisure trip, relax and enjoy it.






http://www.nuerburgring.de/en/drives-fun...leife.html

[mtread]

:agree  I tour Europe every year and I'm with all of the above. 200-300 miles a day max, especially if you are doing it every day. What's the point of doing all autoroutes? It's the journey that counts, not the destination. Apart from the last bit coming home of course, when it's inevitably raining and you just want to get home.

[Bretty]

Thanks all, fantastic advice. I'm listening and this is exactly the sort of thing I wanted to hear.

I don't mind grinding out a couple of long days to start off, if it means I can take my time from Marseille to Genoa. I love that coastal road :-)
I think I can then see how I'm getting on, then either start heading north/home or see if I can go on into italy.

What is the most interesting route back to Calais from the alps?

[pilninggas]

I reckon I'll shoot across to Barcelona in the first afternoon. Spend the next morning looking about then head along the French coast, probably stopping in Marseille or Nice.
I've seen all of the south of France before by car, I might spend half a day in Monaco, but most looking forward to Italy - Pisa, Lucca, Verona, Venice. Then either up to the Eagles Nest or across to Stelvio pass (?).
Nurnbergring, then up via the Rheine, Black Forest, or look around the Maginot or Siegfried lines (I like my world war stuff).

I reckon 250miles is an easy half day riding. 500miles probably a long full day riding.

That seems a bit mad. The basqish area around Santander is superb and could support a fortnight of on-off riding on it's own. Don't rant over to Barcelona. Head down to Picos and get a few days in down there.

I'd strip your itinerary right down (half a day in Monaco is about right though). You are trying to do to much there in a very small window.

[Millietant]

I'm with Adeejay regarding the Nordschleife (Nurburgring) - but even more so I'd say don't go on a bike unless you've made some kind of arrangement to ride it with someone who knows the circuit, knows the rules, and can guide you round for a few laps.


First time I went was in the early 1990's - wasted my time and money - wobbled around with a couple of others who knew nothing about it for 4 laps, just getting in the way of everyone else and being a mobile roadblock. Once I'd had some instruction, it became much easier, I got to know the circuit and started to relax when riding it  - arm pump from a death-grip on the bars gets most first-timers. Certainly don't ride it with your bike fully loaded up for a tour (anything goes wrong and you lose everything).


If you must go, for your own sake and so that you don't cause problems for others, learn the rules, prepare yourself mentally and go with someone else, just in case you do bin it its best to have someone around who knows you and can help you.


On your route, make sure you ride the D500 from Waldshut, via Triberg and Freudenstadt, to Baden Baden - awesome route, awesome scenery, fantastic people.

[Oldgit]

Nice

[Cellarman]

+1 for the B500. Doing it from the French border down to the Rhine at Waldshut, can't wait awsome road

[Grayo]

+1 for the B500. Doing it from the French border down to the Rhine at Waldshut, can't wait awsome road

[Cellarman]

:agree

[pilninggas]

+1 for the B500. Doing it from the French border down to the Rhine at Waldshut, can't wait awsome road

I always think of the B500 as a warm up for the Alps (along with the Route de Ballons if you can fit it in). An awesome road that rises and peaks at the Feldbergpass.

[Cellarman]

[quote author=Cellarman link=topic=19948.msg230508#msg230508 date=1461776718]
+1 for the B500. Doing it from the French border down to the Rhine at Waldshut, can't wait awsome road

I always think of the B500 as a warm up for the Alps (along with the Route de Ballons if you can fit it in). An awesome road that rises and peaks at the Feldbergpass.
[/quote]
The Alps is exactly where we are heading,through Switzerland into France, staying in the Chamonix area

[Bretty]

Hi all,
Thanks for the tips. I just got back home from an epic European tour. 

2978miles, through 7 countries over 9 days.
My ferry to Santander was cancelled so I went via Roscoff instead.

London - Plymouth -  Roscoff - Clermont Ferrand -
Montpellier - Marseille - St Tropez - Cannes - Nice -
Monaco (lap of the F1 circuit)
Lucca - Pisa - Siena - Florence - Stelvio pass - Lake Como - generally Switzerland - Furka pass - Gotthard pass - Germany Autobahn - B500 - up into Luxembourg then across into France and back via the Euro tunnel.

The highlights were definitely the Italian passes and generally every single road in Switzerland.