HOWTO: Wheel alignment through laser chain align

[MC680x0]

PROFI CAT-SE Laser Chain Alignment tool....
Cheapest on fleabay: http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Profi-SE-CAT-M...3f3581eb76

Using the laser adjuster -  as per packaged instructions. Here I am using the PROFI CAT-SE DOT LASER tool - you dont need to buy the "line" laser at around £40 more, the dot laser is fine. Essentially the concept is that a highly machined accurate laser level line [manufactured by our efficient German "zupervolks"] is shone in a line. to test the run of the chain and thus the rear wheel alignment.  The error margin of 0.05% makes sure you get a level line. Don't rush out to buy a B&Q laser tape measure for £8.99 - they don't work as they are inaccurate. A few mm error makes all the difference.

Here is the laser in the box
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And the component parts. Simple instructions, 2x batteries, stickers and cards for awkward bikes - not needed for Fazer
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Here is the magic laser device, high engineered to an error margin of 0.05%
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Hugger off and now we can see the chain and the dirty old hugger which I've keyed down for a quick touchup
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Lets balance the wheel...First offer up the laser against the rear sprocket and the dots appear on the top of the left chain plates, you can make out the red dots in the middle of the pic. The dot just covers the thickness of the plate. Great, a reference point. The image is taken in the day, you can see the light,  but in the garage the light is very bright. Note how the dot light first hits a plate just to the left of the device, on top of the plate.
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Next I keep the laser against the sprocket but tilt up so that the dot moves along the chain to the front sprocket. The dot is not in the middle of the chain and again covers the left hand side chain plate, on the top, spot on - same as before. Image is a bit shite as the dot is actually on the top of the plate when looking down; here I'm trying to hold the laser, position it, and take a pic.
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Now titling the laser up a little more the dots move as far as I can see to the front sprocket. Dots on top of the left hand chain plate once again. Bob on, level chain, means wheel aligned. HOWEVER, the swingarm markers tell me otherwise .... lesson learned - DONT TRUST THE SWINGARM MARKERS! If the dot moved off the plate to left or right then one can deduce that the wheel is not aligned and you simply adjust the wheel adjusters to account for the misalignment. Different chains and sprockets may make the dot appear in different locations. That is fine provided you stick to the same reference point(s) along the chain. For example, if the light hits the middle of a roller, make sure it hits the middle of each roller you test along the chain. Simplez.
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Oh, nearly forgot that naughty hugger - here she is all spanky
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[Fazerider]

I prefer to line things up from first principles rather than relying on making the rear sprocket point at the front one. After all, how do you know all the other components (front sprocket, engine, front wheel etc.) are all where they're supposed to be? Your 99.95% laser accuracy could be lost amid the other factors.
A couple of straight edges and a ruler are all you need to ensure the two wheels line up parallel and central… and on mine at least, it turns out that the swingarm markings are spot on. If yours are not, just amend, or make a note of the offset you need for your markings and you don't need to measure it again. No need to buy an expensive, potentially misleading tool that then clutters up your tool box.
Nice hugger tho'.

[MC680x0]

But your argument/rationale is your own worst enemy mate.... What if your ruler isn't straight, or your reference points are not straight . you can't have it both ways  they're are lots of ways one can align a wheel, this isn't the do and end all, it's just one way and was never meant to be a 'do or die' HOWTO
I find it accurate and the bikes have been over a proffesional shop laser alignment tool costing £2500 and my mechanic said my bike was bang on in terms of rear wheel alignment  choose your method - there are so many, plenty around and this is just one that works, and works well, very well
Expensive clutter , LoL,I find £40 pennies for this , but hey if it feels expensive for aligning wheels on bikes costing grands then so be it

[darrsi]

I line the marks up, then spin the wheel.
If it looks and sounds okay, off we go.
If it looks or sounds lumpy, then it's not quite right.


£40 to line a wheel up all sounds rather unnecessary to me, but each to their own.

[midden]

Why would you want to pay £2500 to test straightness, Think I'd just buy a new bike... but hey that does put £40 in the pennies tray

£40 to line a wheel up all sounds rather unnecessary to me, but each to their own.

There's bound to be a pedantic sod point out that after 400 wheel adjustments it would only be 10p to line a wheel up  and that could be seen as a bargain  :evil

[darrsi]

Why would you want to pay £2500 to test straightness, Think I'd just buy a new bike... but hey that does put £40 in the pennies tray


[quote author=darrsi link=topic=14764.msg167312#msg167312 date=1411221954]

£40 to line a wheel up all sounds rather unnecessary to me, but each to their own.

There's bound to be a pedantic sod point out that after 400 wheel adjustments it would only be 10p to line a wheel up  and that could be seen as a bargain  :evil
[/quote]


Still 10p more than i've ever paid. 

[midden]

I wonder  :think how many times will a wheel be realigned in a bikes lifetime  :evil

[darrsi]

I wonder  :think how many times will a wheel be realigned in a bikes lifetime  :evil

Quite a lot i s'pose, rear shock, wheel/swing arm bearings, chains, sprockets, tyres (punctures), etc.

[darrsi]

One look at the chain will tell you if it's offset or not.
It will grind and try to correct itself and will generally look and sound shit.

[MC680x0]

[quote author=midden link=topic=14764.msg167319#msg167319 date=1411225304]
I wonder  :think how many times will a wheel be realigned in a bikes lifetime  :evil

Quite a lot i s'pose, rear shock, wheel/swing arm bearings, chains, sprockets, tyres (punctures), etc.
[/quote]
Precisely.

[MC680x0]

Why would you want to pay £2500 to test straightness, Think I'd just buy a new bike... but hey that does put £40 in the pennies tray

Because he runs a large shop repair centre, races for Honda, owns several top o range bikes, knows his stuff , views quality and safety as #1…and can probably afford it.
Me,£40 is enough from my bank. Used it 17 times already on  jobs for me n others  ,so it's paid for itself

Like I said, it's just one methods.. you don't have to use it.
Wishing you Safe riding

[Neon Knight]

Well I found it interesting if nothing else, the alignment marks on my swingarm are out so it's useful to hear an alternative to looking at the chain and trusting to the unfortunately untrustworthy human eyeball or my faith in "the force" to get such an important aspect of motorcycling safety correct.  :lol

[MC680x0]

Well I found it interesting if nothing else, the alignment marks on my swingarm are out so it's useful to hear an alternative to looking at the chain and trusting to the unfortunately untrustworthy human eyeball or my faith in "the force" to get such an important aspect of motorcycling safety correct.  :lol

I think this is the intelligence in the topic. Safety. This isn't about fuel consumption, or speed, or any other performance issue. This is about safety, and about  one of the two only wheels we have. So what price one puts on this can be debated tool the cows come home, but i heartedly agree with you, in that I wouldn't trust my eyeball of a guess of whether it 'looks' straight or my hearing if it 'sounds' OK. This is important as you right say and worthy of £40 (or a weeks fuel cost for me)
You have made the point well.
And for other readers.. it was £32 not 40 , don't know where I got £40 from

[midden]

[quote author=Neon Knight link=topic=14764.msg167355#msg167355 date=1411237734]
Well I found it interesting if nothing else, the alignment marks on my swingarm are out so it's useful to hear an alternative to looking at the chain and trusting to the unfortunately untrustworthy human eyeball or my faith in "the force" to get such an important aspect of motorcycling safety correct.  :lol

I think this is the intelligence in the topic. Safety. This isn't about fuel consumption, or speed, or any other performance issue. This is about safety, and about  one of the two only wheels we have. So what price one puts on this can be debated tool the cows come home, but i heartedly agree with you, in that I wouldn't trust my eyeball of a guess of whether it 'looks' straight or my hearing if it 'sounds' OK. This is important as you right say and worthy of £40 (or a weeks fuel cost for me)
You have made the point well.
And for other readers.. it was £32 not 40 , don't know where I got £40 from
[/quote]
I think Fazerider made a valid point, there are other factors which could effect the accuracy of the laser tool and it is also true that chain alignment can be checked by slowly rotating the wheel and feeling,looking and listening for snagging.
As for the safety issue I feel wheel alignment is more important than chain alignment and the first ride after refitting the wheel should be taken with caution until the feel of ride establishes confidence.
That said I do see a place for the laser tool especially with regards to a recent thread where the foccer found keeping the wheel true to the wheel alignment marks difficult when tightening the nut. With the use of the laser he would be able to monitor the line while tightening.
£40 can and does seem a lot for a tool of some convenience but then when you read on this forum the amounts people are prepared to pay for trivial things like stainless engine bolts perhaps £40 is good value for another gizmo  

[darrsi]

[quote author=tweetytek link=topic=14764.msg167357#msg167357 date=1411238244]
[quote author=Neon Knight link=topic=14764.msg167355#msg167355 date=1411237734]
Well I found it interesting if nothing else, the alignment marks on my swingarm are out so it's useful to hear an alternative to looking at the chain and trusting to the unfortunately untrustworthy human eyeball or my faith in "the force" to get such an important aspect of motorcycling safety correct.  :lol

I think this is the intelligence in the topic. Safety. This isn't about fuel consumption, or speed, or any other performance issue. This is about safety, and about  one of the two only wheels we have. So what price one puts on this can be debated tool the cows come home, but i heartedly agree with you, in that I wouldn't trust my eyeball of a guess of whether it 'looks' straight or my hearing if it 'sounds' OK. This is important as you right say and worthy of £40 (or a weeks fuel cost for me)
You have made the point well.
And for other readers.. it was £32 not 40 , don't know where I got £40 from
[/quote]
I think Fazerider made a valid point, there are other factors which could effect the accuracy of the laser tool and it is also true that chain alignment can be checked by slowly rotating the wheel and feeling,looking and listening for snagging.
As for the safety issue I feel wheel alignment is more important than chain alignment and the first ride after refitting the wheel should be taken with caution until the feel of ride establishes confidence.
That said I do see a place for the laser tool especially with regards to a recent thread where the foccer found keeping the wheel true to the wheel alignment marks difficult when tightening the nut. With the use of the laser he would be able to monitor the line while tightening.
£40 can and does seem a lot for a tool of some convenience but then when you read on this forum the amounts people are prepared to pay for trivial things like stainless engine bolts perhaps £40 is good value for another gizmo
[/quote]


Like these you mean.....bargain. 


http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/TITANIUM-GOLD-...1e8f254f18

[midden]

[quote author=midden link=topic=14764.msg167375#msg167375 date=1411242063]
[quote author=tweetytek link=topic=14764.msg167357#msg167357 date=1411238244]
[quote author=Neon Knight link=topic=14764.msg167355#msg167355 date=1411237734]
Well I found it interesting if nothing else, the alignment marks on my swingarm are out so it's useful to hear an alternative to looking at the chain and trusting to the unfortunately untrustworthy human eyeball or my faith in "the force" to get such an important aspect of motorcycling safety correct.  :lol

I think this is the intelligence in the topic. Safety. This isn't about fuel consumption, or speed, or any other performance issue. This is about safety, and about  one of the two only wheels we have. So what price one puts on this can be debated tool the cows come home, but i heartedly agree with you, in that I wouldn't trust my eyeball of a guess of whether it 'looks' straight or my hearing if it 'sounds' OK. This is important as you right say and worthy of £40 (or a weeks fuel cost for me)
You have made the point well.
And for other readers.. it was £32 not 40 , don't know where I got £40 from
[/quote]
I think Fazerider made a valid point, there are other factors which could effect the accuracy of the laser tool and it is also true that chain alignment can be checked by slowly rotating the wheel and feeling,looking and listening for snagging.
As for the safety issue I feel wheel alignment is more important than chain alignment and the first ride after refitting the wheel should be taken with caution until the feel of ride establishes confidence.
That said I do see a place for the laser tool especially with regards to a recent thread where the foccer found keeping the wheel true to the wheel alignment marks difficult when tightening the nut. With the use of the laser he would be able to monitor the line while tightening.
£40 can and does seem a lot for a tool of some convenience but then when you read on this forum the amounts people are prepared to pay for trivial things like stainless engine bolts perhaps £40 is good value for another gizmo
[/quote]


Like these you mean.....bargain. 


http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/TITANIUM-GOLD-...1e8f254f18
[/quote]

Yeah that's the kind of thing and I suppose if you're gonna crash through ill fitted wheel or chain you want your Smalls to look good. A bit like underwear

[MC680x0]

And for the more discerning rider wondering 'why!? Cos who cares' then why not prove your man muscle credentials and plumb for one of these.
http://www.youtube.com/embed/77fNYjhbXWU...autoplay=1

http://www.hotlicksexhaust.com/videos

[Razgruff]

And for the more discerning rider wondering 'why!? Cos who cares' then why not prove your man muscle credentials and plumb for one of these.
http://www.youtube.com/embed/77fNYjhbXWU...autoplay=1

http://www.hotlicksexhaust.com/videos

FFS it aint rocket science. Way too much over thinking in this thread

[MC680x0]

Well,I started off with good intentions to help and serve the community, but then succumb to forces and frekin joined in.

[midden]

[quote author=tweetytek link=topic=14764.msg167427#msg167427 date=1411285373]
And for the more discerning rider wondering 'why!? Cos who cares' then why not prove your man muscle credentials and plumb for one of these.
http://www.youtube.com/embed/77fNYjhbXWU...autoplay=1

http://www.hotlicksexhaust.com/videos

FFS it aint rocket science. Way too much over thinking in this thread
[/quote]
You've disappointed a lot of people now. I hope you can live with the guilt