Today's "What Gets My Goat" - NO POLITICS!

[Gnasher]

Wrong. Go and read the Government website on the rules of support bubbles. Also there are no restrictions on the on the size of the supporting bubbled household. And no restriction on the distance needed to travel to do the support Go and read the Government website there is no grey - its all in black and white.

There's is no way two family members and kids turning up, after driving well over a 100 miles is a support bubble, grey areas :rolleyes


If the cap fits wear it  :lol :lol :lol :lol  twats

[fazersharp]

[quote author=fazersharp link=topic=17546.msg322485#msg322485 date=1610205758]
Wrong. Go and read the Government website on the rules of support bubbles. Also there are no restrictions on the on the size of the supporting bubbled household. And no restriction on the distance needed to travel to do the support Go and read the Government website there is no grey - its all in black and white.

There's is no way two family members and kids turning up, after driving well over a 100 miles is a support bubble, grey areas :rolleyes

If the cap fits wear it  :lol :lol :lol :lol  twats
[/quote]Go and read the Gov website - any size of household can be a support bubble and the only thing it says about distance to go and support is " it is best if this is with a household who live locally".So yes of course its best if they can live locally but what about if they don't.
Also support is not limited to providing physical help or doing the shopping like you do for your neighbour but was also introduced as a recognition of those living alone and needing mental health support. 

[BBROWN1664]

[quote author=Gnasher link=topic=17546.msg322486#msg322486 date=1610206119]
[quote author=fazersharp link=topic=17546.msg322485#msg322485 date=1610205758]
Wrong. Go and read the Government website on the rules of support bubbles. Also there are no restrictions on the on the size of the supporting bubbled household. And no restriction on the distance needed to travel to do the support Go and read the Government website there is no grey - its all in black and white.

Any size household can be a support bubble but the bubbleeeee must be a single person house hold. Single person households include households that have a single parent with children under 18 or where you have older people and one is a carer for the other.



There's is no way two family members and kids turning up, after driving well over a 100 miles is a support bubble, grey areas :rolleyes

If the cap fits wear it  :lol :lol :lol :lol  twats
[/quote]Go and read the Gov website - any size of household can be a support bubble and the only thing it says about distance to go and support is " it is best if this is with a household who live locally".So yes of course its best if they can live locally but what about if they don't.
Also support is not limited to providing physical help or doing the shopping like you do for your neighbour but was also introduced as a recognition of those living alone and needing mental health support. 
[/quote]

[b1k3rdude]

From the government website -

What is a support bubble?
"If you form a support bubble, it is best if this is with a household who live locally. This will help prevent the virus spreading from an area where more people are infected." 

• This reinforces what Gnasher has said - in order words use common sense, don't be traveling 100+ miles. Also these kinds of distances will potentially run afoul of Teir travel restrictions/guidelines.
  
• And to counter the 'its all there in black and white' statement,  the above "it is best" statement above completely shuts that argument down. Clearly the government are completely incapable of being black and white about the rules, so how can they expect the population to?
  
• Regarding the number of people allowed in a support bubble, again the government have been unclear. But common sense should take over here. For example you could logically interoperate the pre-existing 'rule of six'. If both support bubbles combined is over six then, then don't be turning up with with the wife and kids. Then when you do have to do a support visit, don't be getting withing 2m of the person your doing the support visit for.
  

You cant fix stupid, turns out you can't quarantine it either. But moving on, this thread is bordering on getting political. Find something else to discuss chaps.

[BBROWN1664]

The full write up is here https://www.gov.uk/guidance/making-a-sup...-household

Who can make a support bubble
Not everybody can form a support bubble. However, on 2 December the rules changed to widen eligibility for forming one.

You can form a support bubble with another household of any size if:

you live by yourself – even if carers visit you to provide support
you are the only adult in your household who does not need continuous care as a result of a disability
your household includes a child who is under the age of one or was under that age on 2 December 2020
your household includes a child with a disability who requires continuous care and is under the age of 5, or was under that age on 2 December 2020
you are aged 16 or 17 living with others of the same age and without any adults
you are a single adult living with one or more children who are under the age of 18 or were under that age on 12 June 2020
You should not form a support bubble with a household that is part of another support bubble.

[Gnasher]

More twats https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-55601600


Or rather C*&ts  :evil

[fazersharp]

From the government website -

What is a support bubble?
"If you form a support bubble, it is best if this is with a household who live locally. This will help prevent the virus spreading from an area where more people are infected." 

• This reinforces what Gnasher has said - in order words use common sense, don't be traveling 100+ miles. Also these kinds of distances will potentially run afoul of Teir travel restrictions/guidelines.
  
• And to counter the 'its all there in black and white' statement,  the above "it is best" statement above completely shuts that argument down. Clearly the government are completely incapable of being black and white about the rules, so how can they expect the population to?
  
• Regarding the number of people allowed in a support bubble, again the government have been unclear. But common sense should take over here. For example you could logically interoperate the pre-existing 'rule of six'. If both support bubbles combined is over six then, then don't be turning up with with the wife and kids. Then when you do have to do a support visit, don't be getting withing 2m of the person your doing the support visit for.
  

You cant fix stupid, turns out you can't quarantine it either. But moving on, this thread is bordering on getting political. Find something else to discuss chaps.

Also these kinds of distances will potentially run afoul of Teir travel restrictions/guidelines.

Will put aside the fact that there are no tiers right now but when there were tiers there was no restrictions on a support bubble moving between tiers.   

"Regarding the number of people allowed in a support bubble, again the government have been unclear."

Wrong - its perfectly clear from the gov.uk site ---You can form a support bubble with another household of any size

Then when you do have to do a support visit, don't be getting within 2m of the person your doing the support visit for

.Wrong also

from the gov.uk site you do not need to maintain social distance with people in your support bubble

[fazersharp]

More twats https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-55601600


Or rather C*&ts  :evil

Yes idiots. And while I was reading it on the same page was a link to explain how support bubbles work  https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-52637354

[Gnasher]

Wrong - its perfectly clear
from the gov.uk site ---You can form a support bubble with another household of any size

Then when you do have to do a support visit, don't be getting within 2m of the person your doing the support visit for

.Wrong also

One person living alone can yes, as said my previous these I'm referring to aren't living alone, they're are living with their wife/husbands or partners. With family mum/dad and the kids turning up after driving a 100 miles plus.  Not a support bubble just selfish twats  :finger

from the gov.uk site you do not need to maintain social distance with people in your support bubble

Who mentioned anything about this?

I appears as always you don't read things fully before, going off half cocked  :lol

As said if the cap fits wear it  :rollin :rollin :rollin :rollin :rollin

[fazersharp]

Who mentioned anything about this?

I appears as always you don't read things fully before, going off half cocked  :lol

As said if the cap fits wear it  :rollin :rollin :rollin :rollin :rollin

Tiz you not reading things fully  before, going off half cocked. I was replying to B1k3rdude - he mentioned it - I even included his quoted post in my post.

Yes your neighbours seem to be breaking the law -- do the right thing and report them.

[Dudeofrude]

You can also have both a support bubble and a childcare bubble. So for instance we have my wife's best friend for a support bubble as she is a single mum of a 7 year old and has no family (except a Dad who's in a care home with dementia) then we are also in a child car bubble with the in laws so that they can have the kids over at theirs every now and again (their choice not ours)

But on the note of the lockdown, I took my kids down the seafront for our daily walk and it was packed! May aswell gave been the middle of the summer. Roads aren't really any emptier either.
I read on the news about how the Gov is moaning that more and more people are bending the rules but honestly what do they expect. After nearly a full year of restrictions People are sick to death of it all. I honestly don't know anyone that supports these restrictions or think they work and the vast majority of people would rather just be left to get on with it.

I think the disillusion is starting to set it with even the strictest of people because it feels like you can't win. You follow the rules, don't see your family, lose all your savings... and yet you still get locked down. So you may as well have ignored it all and did what you wanted.... you'd be in the same position now either way ?‍♂️

On the plus side if the infection keeps spreading the way it is we will have all had it by the end of winter. Heard immunity achieved and the government can make some money sleeing off all the vaccines to poorer countries ??

[BBROWN1664]

One person living alone can yes, as said my previous these I'm referring to aren't living alone, they're are living with their wife/husbands or partners. With family mum/dad and the kids turning up after driving a 100 miles plus.  Not a support bubble just selfish twats  :finger

They probably are just selfish twats but the defnition of alone includes households of more than one where the people are ill, acting as carers etc. My dad doesnt live alone. HE lives with my step mum who is undergoing cancer treatment so he is her carer. Under the rules he can form a bubble with another household. Being sensible though, he is keeping himself to himself and myself/brother are just meeting him on his driveway once or twice a week for a socially distanced beer to keep his spirits up. Its feccin cold this time of year though!!

[BBROWN1664]

and we take our own beer to keep distanced!

[Gnasher]

You can also have both a support bubble and a childcare bubble. So for instance we have my wife's best friend for a support bubble as she is a single mum of a 7 year old and has no family (except a Dad who's in a care home with dementia) then we are also in a child car bubble with the in laws so that they can have the kids over at theirs every now and again (their choice not ours)

Yep if it's them looking after your kids while you work etc, fine but only you or your Mrs should drop them off or collect them individually.  If it's just for them to see your kids, it shouldn't be happening and they/you are running a risk of them catching it, from your kids or you.  Remember under 16s mainly don't have any symptoms what's so ever, but pass it either to you or your older family members, it's also possible you or your Mrs is asymptomatic too.  The virus is spreading because people are spreading it, it's not spreading it's self, many are just in denial of this fact.  Someone known to me, was doing what your doing, his mums now sadly died  Not a risk worth taking in my book.   

But on the note of the lockdown, I took my kids down the seafront for our daily walk and it was packed! May aswell gave been the middle of the summer. Roads aren't really any emptier either.

Yep twats

I read on the news about how the Gov is moaning that more and more people are bending the rules but honestly what do they expect. After nearly a full year of restrictions People are sick to death of it all. I honestly don't know anyone that supports these restrictions or think they work and the vast majority of people would rather just be left to get on with it.

Sure and more, possibly someone you know or care about will die or be seriously buggered for sometime or the rest of their life.  I totally support these current restrictions, I for one think there not strong enough.  I want this virus beat, to achieve that we've got to step up and get on with it.

I think the disillusion is starting to set it with even the strictest of people because it feels like you can't win. You follow the rules, don't see your family, lose all your savings... and yet you still get locked down.

We can win and would be if twats didn't keep bending and breaking the rules.  That said, the government hasn't and isn't helping, with too little, too late and mixed messaging.  If you're one of the 3m ish that went self employed less than a year before this started, then yes it's hard, unfair and the government should be doing far more to help you/them.  If you're just furloughed you should be fine, providing you wasn't living beyond you means and not declaring income.  Not seeing our families is disappointing but a necessary tool to fight the virus. I've not seen my lads for well over 8 months and if it keeps going probably another 8 months, but the longer I do the safer they and I am and if we all had the same attitude this virus will get beat sooner rather than later.  We have a 2 choices, both are different levels of a shit sandwich, one ends got a lot more shit, i.e. give in more die, NHS get flattened, it goes on longer and longer, economy crashes lot of shit end or follow the advice and we get out of it little shit end?  All the winging, complaining, rule bending is futile the virus doesn't care and will kill regardless. 

Like it or not there's is no other choices, take your pick.           

So you may as well have ignored it all and did what you wanted.... you'd be in the same position now either way

But alive and not possibly damaged 

On the plus side if the infection keeps spreading the way it is we will have all had it by the end of winter. Heard immunity achieved and the government can make some money sleeing off all the vaccines to poorer countries

As far as they know you don't get any immunity, herd or otherwise many have had the virus multiple times.  I know people who work NHS front line who have and they tell me colleges of theirs have died or were/are seriously ill after catching it a second/third time.   

Yes it's crap, yes it's unfair, yes I don't like it, but none of us have much choice beyond the 2 stated above. 

[Gnasher]

They probably are just selfish twats but the defnition of alone includes households of more than one where the people are ill, acting as carers etc. My dad doesnt live alone. HE lives with my step mum who is undergoing cancer treatment so he is her carer. Under the rules he can form a bubble with another household. Being sensible though, he is keeping himself to himself and myself/brother are just meeting him on his driveway once or twice a week for a socially distanced beer to keep his spirits up. Its feccin cold this time of year though!!

Yes, but they are both at risk and need support.  The law/rules allow for this as you rightly point out mate and I'm guessing you're not driving 200 plus miles round trip 

[Dudeofrude]

[quote author=Dudeofrude link=topic=17546.msg322503#msg322503 date=1610212878]
You can also have both a support bubble and a childcare bubble. So for instance we have my wife's best friend for a support bubble as she is a single mum of a 7 year old and has no family (except a Dad who's in a care home with dementia) then we are also in a child car bubble with the in laws so that they can have the kids over at theirs every now and again (their choice not ours)

Yep if it's them looking after your kids while you work etc, fine but only you or your Mrs should drop them off or collect them individually.  If it's just for them to see your kids, it shouldn't be happening and they/you are running a risk of them catching it, from your kids or you.  Remember under 16s mainly don't have any symptoms what's so ever, but pass it either to you or your older family members, it's also possible you or your Mrs is asymptomatic too.  The virus is spreading because people are spreading it, it's not spreading it's self, many are just in denial of this fact.  Someone known to me, was doing what your doing, his mums now sadly died  Not a risk worth taking in my book.   

But on the note of the lockdown, I took my kids down the seafront for our daily walk and it was packed! May aswell gave been the middle of the summer. Roads aren't really any emptier either.

Yep twats

I read on the news about how the Gov is moaning that more and more people are bending the rules but honestly what do they expect. After nearly a full year of restrictions People are sick to death of it all. I honestly don't know anyone that supports these restrictions or think they work and the vast majority of people would rather just be left to get on with it.

Sure and more, possibly someone you know or care about will die or be seriously buggered for sometime or the rest of their life.  I totally support these current restrictions, I for one think there not strong enough.  I want this virus beat, to achieve that we've got to step up and get on with it.

I think the disillusion is starting to set it with even the strictest of people because it feels like you can't win. You follow the rules, don't see your family, lose all your savings... and yet you still get locked down.

We can win and would be if twats didn't keep bending and breaking the rules.  That said, the government hasn't and isn't helping, with too little, too late and mixed messaging.  If you're one of the 3m ish that went self employed less than a year before this started, then yes it's hard, unfair and the government should be doing far more to help you/them.  If you're just furloughed you should be fine, providing you wasn't living beyond you means and not declaring income.  Not seeing our families is disappointing but a necessary tool to fight the virus. I've not seen my lads for well over 8 months and if it keeps going probably another 8 months, but the longer I do the safer they and I am and if we all had the same attitude this virus will get beat sooner rather than later.  We have a 2 choices, both are different levels of a shit sandwich, one ends got a lot more shit, i.e. give in more die, NHS get flattened, it goes on longer and longer, economy crashes lot of shit end or follow the advice and we get out of it little shit end?  All the winging, complaining, rule bending is futile the virus doesn't care and will kill regardless. 

Like it or not there's is no other choices, take your pick.           

So you may as well have ignored it all and did what you wanted.... you'd be in the same position now either way

But alive and not possibly damaged 

On the plus side if the infection keeps spreading the way it is we will have all had it by the end of winter. Heard immunity achieved and the government can make some money sleeing off all the vaccines to poorer countries

As far as they know you don't get any immunity, herd or otherwise many have had the virus multiple times.  I know people who work NHS front line who have. 

Yes it's crap, yes it's unfair, yes I don't like it, but none of us have much choice beyond the 2 stated above.
[/quote]

But the problem is that there will never be a 100% compliance around the general public. And of this virus spreads in the way they say it does then it only takes a few people not to comply and the whole thing goes tits up. Not to mention the amount of people that just don't care about the risk. They aren't worried about getting it or worried about giving it to anyone.
So the point being this asking everyone to behave approach isn't ever going to work. If everyone did exactly as they were told then there wouldn't be any crime would there ?‍♂️

Add to the fact that every man and his dog is a 'key worker' these days and you realise that this isn't really any kind of lockdown. The only people that are at home are the ones that work in pubs, gyms, hotels, shops or personal care. Around here between the supermarkets, factories, hospitals and docks I'd say well over 60% of people are still going about daily life as normal. In fact I dont actually know another person that has to stay at home like me.

So really the only options are a 100% lockdown of everyone (as done in other countries) ,keep faffing about like they are (which is getting us nowhere), or just don't bother. And I think we know which one its going to be

[Dudeofrude]

And as a side note I think maybe this conversation would be better moved over to the "Will you take the Vax" convo as seems to have gone a bit off topic here

[BBROWN1664]

I'm guessing you're not driving 200 plus miles round trip 

Not after 4 pints :rollin

[Gnasher]

But the problem is that there will never be a 100% compliance around the general public.

Quite right, we don't need 100% we need the a healthy majority, the same we get with crime.  There always going to be a small % who'll will commit crime no matter what but its small and we manage it. 

And of this virus spreads in the way they say it does then it only takes a few people not to comply and the whole thing goes tits up.

It's not what I'm saying it's what's happening.  If the government got test and trace sorted out properly as they were told i.e locally and not via private company's and all the other failed crap they've been doing we'd keep on top of it as other countries have done.   

[
Not to mention the amount of people that just don't care about the risk. They aren't worried about getting it or worried about giving it to anyone.

Like the % that commit crime we sort them, end of.

So the point being this asking everyone to behave approach isn't ever going to work.

Nobody wanted WW2 other than those that started it, but they like we had/have no choice it got to be done.   

If everyone did exactly as they were told then there wouldn't be any crime would there

Mentioned above some will always commit crime that's why we have laws.  But like crime any law has to be written so it's enforceable and proportionate to the situation and has to be seen to be enforced, then it will be followed by the vast majority. 

Add to the fact that every man and his dog is a 'key worker' these days and you realise that this isn't really any kind of lockdown.

Yes I agree there's is too many classed as 'key workers' but that is the government trying to appease their mates and save money to some extent .  The list now needs really looking at, trimed and those that aren't and caught working, the above applies. 

The only people that are at home are the ones that work in pubs, gyms, hotels, shops or personal care. Around here between the supermarkets, factories, hospitals and docks I'd say well over 60% of people are still going about daily life as normal. In fact I dont actually know another person that has to stay at home like me.

Most I know are working from home, my 2 lads are both lost their jobs, both got new ones, one lost his new job, the other is still working from home.  Areas of the country will be very different, factory work mostly can't be done from home, but the owners should be following the rules.  I grant you some aren't, forcing workers in when they shouldn't be, but that's due to government turning a blind eye and money etc.

So really the only options are a 100% lockdown of everyone (as done in other countries) ,keep faffing about like they are (which is getting us nowhere), or just don't bother. And I think we know which one its going to be

Yes, we need to do what we did in Mar, had we stayed locked for longer, sorted out test & trace etc we'd be in a very different position, we didn't but that's a whole new topic.

Sadly there's just 2 choices as mentioned earlier, both are crap but one is less crap and with a light at the end of the tunnel, the other utter chaos. 

[Gnasher]

Twats who think lockdown rules don't apply to them and have scant regard for their relatives or others :finger :evil

I live in a very quiet area in the countryside, I'm the easily the youngest by at least 15 yrs or so.  My road/cul-de-sac is mainly just drive ways with the odd bit of parking on the road leading to it, the road is normally empty save the odd car.  This morning it's full I mean rammed, 12 cars, driven by 40 - 60yrs olds who don't live here, some with kids visiting mum/dad etc, I know a good few live in London and East Anglia, which are between 120 - 170 miles away one way :eek :eek :eek

WTF, they're just not getting it no wonder this thing is spreading like wildfire, when mum/dad/nan/grandad catch it and die they'll be saying "I don't know how he/she got it we were so careful" TWATS absolute C*^ts  :evil 

Little and very sad update on the above.  This week we've had a few more doctors cars and an ambulance or two which is way more than normal.  While at work today, we've had two more ambulances turn up I'm told, 3, people from 2 households have now been taken into hospital, you can guess what with, oh yes Covid, all are in the late 70's with health issues. 

Both houses had visits last Sat from relatives who come from London or the East of England.  Less than a week and now they're in serious trouble by TWATS  :finger I really hope they make it back out.   

Really pisses me off, it's not a bloody game  :evil :evil