23-07-18, 12:42 PM
(This post was last modified: 23-07-18, 12:45 PM by Grahamm.)
Yesterday I was in Devon, having a nice surfing and biking break.
I'd been out for a great ride down the A39, then back up the B3254, when I tried to start an overtake and the bike just wasn't giving me any power 
I backed off and the engine was still running but when I opened the throttle, it just wouldn't pull.
I stopped, switched off and back on again and when I tried to start it, there was a rattling or clattering sound, so I immediately switched off again and called the RAC.
I had major hassles getting back to the campsite and then getting the bike back to Portsmouth, and then found that Vernon's Motorcycles is closing down in September and isn't taking any more work and Downeys and Bike Moto aren't open until Tuesday
The guy I spoke to at Vernons said (just a guess) that maybe a valve had dropped, but also said that it if it was something more serious, might actually be cheaper to simply buy a replacement engine, rather than pay for the workshop time to strip the current engine and rebuild it!
Still, at least Kudos to the other two bikers who pulled over when they saw me broken down, thanks to them, whoever they are :thumbup
One other thing, I'd checked the oil a few weeks ago (it was around the top of the scale) and there wasn't any dripping out in my shed or when the bike was standing, but when I checked it after the engine had cooled off a bit, it was right down the bottom of the scale. It was on a bit of a slope and canted over, but I don't think that should have made that much of a difference to the level.
(23-07-18, 12:42 PM)Grahamm link Wrote: I'd checked the oil a few weeks ago (it was around the top of the scale) and there wasn't any dripping out in my shed or when the bike was standing, but when I checked it after the engine had cooled off a bit, it was right down the bottom of the scale. It was on a bit of a slope and canted over, but I don't think that should have made that much of a difference to the level. It defiantly would make a difference through the sight glass leaned over so that is what you are seeing there
I don't do rain or threat there of. dry rider only with no shame.
(23-07-18, 01:00 PM)fazersharp link Wrote: [quote author=Grahamm link=topic=24363.msg282236#msg282236 date=1532346128]
I'd checked the oil a few weeks ago (it was around the top of the scale) and there wasn't any dripping out in my shed or when the bike was standing, but when I checked it after the engine had cooled off a bit, it was right down the bottom of the scale. It was on a bit of a slope and canted over, but I don't think that should have made that much of a difference to the level. It defiantly would make a difference through the sight glass leaned over so that is what you are seeing there
[/quote]
The FZ6 has a dipstick, not a sight glass.
I've just checked again where it's standing in my shed and although it's not been run since yesterday (normally I'd run it for a few minutes to circulate the oil and then leave it for 5-10 minutes to let it settle), there's only about 3/8" at the bottom of the dipstick, so lot of oil has gone somewhere
I'd take the plugs out and check for impact damage. Then drain the oil and check for metal. Also try turning the engine over by hand and feel for anything unusual. You could also take the valve cover off and look at the valves
(23-07-18, 12:42 PM)Grahamm link Wrote: The guy I spoke to at Vernons said (just a guess) that maybe a valve had dropped, but also said that it if it was something more serious, might actually be cheaper to simply buy a replacement engine, rather than pay for the workshop time to strip the current engine and rebuild it!
Describing engine noises etc is a bit of a minefield/guesswork. The mechanic may be spot on but he also might be a mile off. The only way to tell is to have it looked at.
Sometimes it is easier/cheaper to buy a replacement engine but you never know how good that engine is going to be until you fit it. Could turn out to be no good either so have a good think before you go down that route.
Thanks for the suggestions, but I'm going to get it looked at professionally, because inspecting valves etc is outside my experience and comfort zone, so I don't want to make it worse 
Well the consensus from the people I've spoken to is that probably a new engine is going to be the best option, because even if it's not too damaged, the cost of parts and labour is going to be excessive
I've tried one of the "contact lots of breakers" sites and got an offer of one that's done 17k miles for £660 including deilvery and another that's done just under 9k for £880.
Of course it's then going to cost about £300 to get it fitted...
I know you said your not confident in the mechanical side of things but if your willing to bin the engine anyway then surely it can't hurt to take a a stab at fixing it? Or at least finding the problem.
There's hundreds on YouTube videos that will help, as well as free workshop manuals on here and obviously the knowledgeable foccers that can answer questions.
Worse case scenario you fuck it up and have to buy a new engine anyway?
Also in the process you'd learn how to remove an engine from the bike (which to be honest is actually really simple) so you could save a few quid and fit the new one yourself?
Just a thought :-)
(24-07-18, 02:28 PM)Dudeofrude link Wrote: I know you said your not confident in the mechanical side of things but if your willing to bin the engine anyway then surely it can't hurt to take a a stab at fixing it? Or at least finding the problem.
Lol! You're absolutely right and that just occurred to me too, I literally just came online to to post about that 
:thumbup
Would be interesting to find out what it was and what caused it, that kind of thing is not normal is it :o on (semmi) modern bikes - how many mile has it done
I don't do rain or threat there of. dry rider only with no shame.
(24-07-18, 09:39 PM)fazersharp link Wrote: Would be interesting to find out what it was and what caused it, that kind of thing is not normal is it :o on (semmi) modern bikes - how many mile has it done
It's done about 65k, but it's probably partly my own fault.
When I got the 24k service done it cost me the best part of £1000 because, for some reason, the valves were tight instead of loose and (although I can't prove it) I'm sure the workshop charged me for the time it was sitting on the bench whilst they were contacting Yamaha and trying to figure out what went wrong. I just never went back there.
When it got up to around 48k I was planning on starting to look at doing my own maintenance and working up to things like checking valve clearances, but I've had a lot of stress and hassle over the past couple of years and that just got forgotten about
So it may be that it was something that could have been sorted if only...
I see
I don't do rain or threat there of. dry rider only with no shame.
The plan is the workshop is going to pick it up this afternoon and have a quick listen/ look to see if it's fixable.
If not, I'll have to get a replacement from the breakers (£540 plus £120 to ship because it needs a pallet!) and then pay around £250-£300 for them to install it.
I've actually just been looking at it because I decided to clear some of the rust and crap off the header bolts and noticed that the thin metal around the top of the pipes (not the pipes themselves) has rusted through. I hope that's not going to be more expense...
Quote:If not, I'll have to get a replacement from the breakers (£540 plus £120 to ship because it needs a pallet!) and then pay around £250-£300 for them to install it.
That's coming on a grand to fix, and it's a used engine.
How many miles are on your bike?
At a grand to fix, maybe you should consider buying something else.
Either that or just get something new on PCP :lol .
(25-07-18, 06:38 PM)VNA link Wrote: Quote:If not, I'll have to get a replacement from the breakers (£540 plus £120 to ship because it needs a pallet!) and then pay around £250-£300 for them to install it.
That's coming on a grand to fix, and it's a used engine.
How many miles are on your bike?
The bike has done 65k, but I've just put on new chain and sprockets, air filter, brake pads and had new headset bearings installed.
Frankly, had I known the engine would break, I'd have thought about getting a replacement, but now I've done all that work, I'll stick with it.
The workshop has picked up the bike today and they're going to have a look and see if it's fixable.
If not, I'll get the new engine sent down tomorrow and then I can practice working on the old one.
Have you missed a gear and over revved it recently?
Sounds like the van chain might have jumped a tooth or two.
The tdm's could withstand three teeth before doing any damage but not sure about Fazers.
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(25-07-18, 06:53 PM)celticbiker link Wrote: Have you missed a gear and over revved it recently?
Not that I'm aware of.
I think, shortly before this happened (not sure exactly how long) there was a mometary "skip" in the engine note, but it seemed to still be running ok until the events in the OP took place.
It does sound similar to a cam chain jumping one or two teeth.
If the tensioner was weak it could happen.
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I know the bike has gone to the workshop but I was wondering if any Foccers local to you could help out with an engine change etc. Some of us would help out for cups of tea and bacon sarnies in return...
Well, I've heard back from the workshop and apparently my big end (oo-err missus) has gone on number 4 cylinder.
This is pretty terminal and, although it is fixable, it's more financially viable to replace an engine that had done 65,000 miles with one that has done 17,000 miles.
About the only good news was that it wasn't my fault, the mechanic said "it's unusual, but certainly not unheard of". I hadn't been thrashing it to the redline or running it without oil in, so there was no way that it could have been predicted short of a complete strip-down and examination.
Oh well, at least I'll have the old engine to practice doing some of the more intricate maintenance work on before I do it on the one in the bike now...  hrug:
PS Oh, and it turns out that when you buy a "complete engine" from a breakers, apparently that *doesn't* include the alternator and the starter motor. Good job those are still ok...!
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