Starting Issue - AGAIN

[fazersharp]

Have you tried clicking your heels 3 times

[pilninggas]

Sounds like water in the fuel again

or fuel levels too low.

80% a fuel delivery issue.

open up a carb drain and see what comes out. then hook up a clear tube and see what the fuel level is like on carbs 1 and 4.

[Frosties]

[quote author=unfazed link=topic=21305.msg247666#msg247666 date=1481660220]
Sounds like water in the fuel again

or fuel levels too low.

80% a fuel delivery issue.

open up a carb drain and see what comes out. then hook up a clear tube and see what the fuel level is like on carbs 1 and 4.
[/quote]


Or too much fuel. He did say "it will make my exhaust look like a rocket launcher, make an almighty bang when backfiring, then ping to life."

[tommyardin]

[size=1em]W[/size][size=1em]ell reading all the stuff tat has been written on this topic, and taking into account all that Darrsi has done to rectify the fault, I will still plump for an ignition issue. [/size][size=1em]
The high tension side will take a bit of stopping and it seems that  seems that Darrsi has been through the obvious stuff on the high tension side. leads, plug caps,
HT connection at the coil packs.

Now 12 volts does not take a lot of stopping, how many times did I have to clean that contact rail on my scalextric race track because of a poor connection between the car and the rail, the cars just stopped and would go no where until the track and the pickup on the base of the car was cleaned. Low voltage need a really good contact.

I would unplug the wires one at a time that go to the coil packs and any other connections associated with the low tension side of the ignition, plug and unplug a few times to make a good contact maybe get some electrical switch cleaner and give the a spray before finally pushing them together.
The reason I am thinking ignition is the fact that fuel is obviously getting into the cylinders and then into the exhaust flooding the later with fuel and when the bike does eventually fire ignites all the fuel in the exhaust system and as they say the rest is history.

Anything that impacts the low tension side I would think is suspect, ignition switch its self maybe or handle bar kill switch, and to be honest if this proves not to be the problem you will certainly have a checked and well serviced ignition system.

Good luck darrsi, a bike that does not start well is really frustrating, and why Oh why does it always do it when you need a quick get away. :'( [/size]

[darrsi]

[quote author=pilninggas link=topic=21305.msg247669#msg247669 date=1481660652]
[quote author=unfazed link=topic=21305.msg247666#msg247666 date=1481660220]
Sounds like water in the fuel again

or fuel levels too low.

80% a fuel delivery issue.

open up a carb drain and see what comes out. then hook up a clear tube and see what the fuel level is like on carbs 1 and 4.
[/quote]


Or too much fuel. He did say "it will make my exhaust look like a rocket launcher, make an almighty bang when backfiring, then ping to life."
[/quote]


This is probably me using the choke, throttle and just about anything i can while the bike is cranking and when it does finally start i'm igniting the unburnt fuel that has already got through.
So i think the fuelling is as it should be but simply not being ignited.

[darrsi]

Sounds like water in the fuel again

I only filled the tank on Monday morning, but put a load of Isopropyl in the tank on Monday night, so that has crossed my mind again.

[darrsi]

[quote author=unfazed link=topic=21305.msg247666#msg247666 date=1481660220]
Sounds like water in the fuel again

or fuel levels too low.

80% a fuel delivery issue.

open up a carb drain and see what comes out. then hook up a clear tube and see what the fuel level is like on carbs 1 and 4.
[/quote]


The thing is though, once it catches and starts the bike immediately runs so sweet that if there wasn't enough fuel i would expect it to run at least a little rough, but it doesn't at all.
The RPM needle on tickover just sits still around the 1200 mark and the bike sounds totally fine. 

[darrsi]

Right now i'm thinking it's not fuel mixture levels, i reckon that side of things is okay, although there is a very small nagging doubt about moisture in the tank but deep down i don't feel it is this.


I'm thinking it's an electrical issue.
As i said before it's been pointed out to me that it's similar to the issue i had when i first realised the side stand switch was on its way out, so because of the ridiculous location of it, and lack of access, i bypassed it using a ScotchLock connector.
Whether something has failed there i'm not sure, and due to working hours i don't have any daylight to play with at the moment, not until the weekend anyway.
 
I'll try it with the stand up this morning and see if it makes any difference, and let you know later.


I still have my "old" plugs i could try putting back in, but both sets are Iridium and i just can't see them being the culprit.
If i had an iffy ignition switch would that not just kill everything? I'm getting power to lights and everything else, although saving power by making sure everything is off when trying to start it.


If it was the coils were breaking down, then yet again i would've thought the bike would've run a bit rough all round, possibly randomly die on me in running, or misfire, but it just doesn't.


By the way, bike electrics are just not my thing.


I'll keep you posted.

[red98]

Hi darrsi....not read the whole thread but whereabouts is the scotchlock connector ?......iam not a fan of these things on bikes , too much of a moisture trap for my liking........I would check this first....

[darrsi]

Hi darrsi....not read the whole thread but whereabouts is the scotchlock connector ?......iam not a fan of these things on bikes , too much of a moisture trap for my liking........I would check this first....

Under the left side panel, so fairly well covered, but i'm gonna check it out, probably on Saturday now though as i'm not a fan of working in the dark and prefer to see what's going on.

[darrsi]

Wheeled the bike out the garage, put it on the centre stand (side stand up), and it started instantly, no choke or anything.  :woot

That doesn't mean it's instantly fixed, I want it to do the same again this evening after work, so if it starts again straight away i'll look into another way of securely bypassing the side stand switch, either soldering, using a connecting block, or maybe even one of those solder/heatshrink jobbies that were on here the other day.

Just spoke to a work colleague who was unfortunately just walking out of reception last night when my bike backfired, he said he nearly filled his pants.  :rollin

[tommyardin]

Found this on Face Book, I know its got nothing to do with this thread but it made me smile.
So here goes:

[darrsi]

Found this on Face Book, I know its got nothing to do with this thread but it made me smile.
So here goes:

That all looks and sounds rather familiar  :lol

[darrsi]

Bike started on the centre stand again, outside work this evening, first go.
I can't believe that poxy side stand switch can cause so much grief.
At least i have a good idea of the cause now, which is the main thing.

[His Dudeness]

If the side stand switch has been bypassed the position of the stand shouldn't have any effect on the bike. All that side stand switch is doing is connecting a wire together when the stand is up. By bypassing it you've permanently joined the wire so the position of the stand should now have no effect. That's why bypassing it is a bit dodgy, you can ride off with your stand down. Is you side stand still connected to the main loom? If it is then disconnect it and you can use two spade terminals on a loop of wire to bypass it. It's a bodge but it works

http://i183.photobucket.com/albums/x237/...0-1807.jpg

[unfazed]

Just a quick one on the side stand switch, If it was the issue it would not operate the starter and would not be turning over.
Side stand switch is not the issue, the fact the engine turns over rules out the starting circuit of which the side stand switch is a part of.

[darrsi]

Just a quick one on the side stand switch, If it was the issue it would not operate the starter and would not be turning over.
Side stand switch is not the issue, the fact the engine turns over rules out the starting circuit of which the side stand switch is a part of.

Started instantly 4 times in a row now, morning and evening, with the side stand up!
That can't be coincidence surely?

[fazerscotty]

If its starting when the side stands up or when its on the centre stand then I would hazard a guess that something ain't right with the float bowls or the level of fuel in them when its lent over. Or maybe the fuel pick up in the tank?
Just a thought..........

[darrsi]

If its starting when the side stands up or when its on the centre stand then I would hazard a guess that something ain't right with the float bowls or the level of fuel in them when its lent over. Or maybe the fuel pick up in the tank?
Just a thought..........

I will try starting the bike whilst sitting on it when it's upright, but with the sidestand still down, and try your theory out when i go to work in an hour.

[darrsi]

If its starting when the side stands up or when its on the centre stand then I would hazard a guess that something ain't right with the float bowls or the level of fuel in them when its lent over. Or maybe the fuel pick up in the tank?
Just a thought..........

So......I sat on the bike with the bike in upright position, sidestand down.......and it started.

Now, before getting too excited, I still have to bear in mind that I've got my bike tanked up with around 400ml of 99% proof booze in case it had moisture in the system and that may also have made an improvement, so what I need to do when going home from work tonight is try it again on the side stand and see what happens?

I'll keep you posted.