Cornering

[Steve3351]

OK Foccers, we all want to go in deeper and come out harder...but how do u know when ur at or near the limit...?
Do u just keep pushing it until u slide off...or is there some warning signs, skipping/slipping.... :evil ????
am assuming a dry road and good tyres...

[VNA]

The hero blob on yer foot peg is usually (at least it should be) the first thing to go down.
Or if you are riding a C90, the leg shield touches first, and if you don't back off the solid foot peg goes down often followed a split second later by you. :lol

[Steve3351]

Thanks for that very scientific analysis VNA.... :lol  I suppose that's a guide anyway...!!

[BBROWN1664]

:agree VNA

Another way to check is to look at the chicken strips on your tyres. If they are wider than a couple of mm, you can try harder.

[Steve3351]

Chicken Strips...??!! u mean the strip of virgin rubber between the shoulder and the main tread surface....?
mine are way too wide....... :\

[mickvp]

Aye, those “virgin” bots are called chicken strips. Because of you got them on your tyre, your too chicken to lean over more ?

[VNA]

Yup that sounds like them.  I don’t have any on the rear.


One key thing to going round corners, in my humble opinion, is to understand how the bike goes round a corner.  You need to use the bars to control the bike.  Ie counter steer.


If you ain’t already doing this then google counter steering motorcycle and start reading and watching.  If I am trying to tell you how to suck eggs – then I apologise.

[Steve3351]

yes well...I think countersteering is sort of instinctive...whats confusing is that one camp insists that TRAIL BRAKING is the way to go, while another claims engine braking and off-throttle is better...I have been trying trail braking, I think it helps the bike turn, rather than just slowing down on approach and off the brakes before turning.... 8)

[Frosties]

yes well...I think countersteering is sort of instinctive...whats confusing is that one camp insists that TRAIL BRAKING is the way to go, while another claims engine braking and off-throttle is better...I have been trying trail braking, I think it helps the bike turn, rather than just slowing down on approach and off the brakes before turning.... 8)

Trail braking will help the bike turn (loads the front) but a balanced throttle and counter steer will help you more.

[Grahamm]

I think countersteering is sort of instinctive...

It is, in the sense that you do it without thinking. It's only when you start thinking about it that it tends to go wrong! If you need to take rapid avoiding action, your brain says "pull the bars in the direction you want to go" instead of "push on the bar in the direction you want to go".

whats confusing is that one camp insists that TRAIL BRAKING is the way to go, while another claims engine braking and off-throttle is better...

Trail braking (ie using the frong brake in a turn) is not a good idea.

Throttling off or using the rear brake "pulls" the bike backwards, because the force is being applied to the rear wheel behind the centre of gravity.

Using the front brake "pushes" the bike backwards (in front of the centre of gravity), increasing the load on the front tyre contact patch and making the forks want to dive, meaning the steering will get heavy and you could risk a front-wheel slide.

Here's a link to an excellent document that gives lots of useful information about riding... http://www.fema-online.eu/uploads/docume...%20res.pdf

[VNA]

I think countersteering is sort of instinctive...

It is, in that people are taught to lean into a corner.  By leaning to the left, you push on the left bar, pushing the front wheel to the right, which makes the bike go left.  So it’s not leaning that turns the bike but the pressure you apply to the bar by leaning.


It’s not until you understand it and practise it that it becomes instinctive, and for the first time become absolutely in control of the direction of your bike.


The only way a bike will change direction is by counter steering, and it’s all in your hands.


Trail braking with the front brake requires a firmer input at the bars as the front brake will make the bike want to sit up.  As Grahamm says care is required with trail braking – that why you see racers washing out the front now and again. 

[YamFazFan]

So if you're going round say a left hand bend and look down at the handle-bars, they'll be angled to the right?.

[darrsi]

The majority of bikers will do counter steering as an immediate reaction to doing the complete opposite to begin with.
As in, i want to go more left so i turn the bars left, then suddenly realize that didn't quite work out so you intuitively move the bars the other way which suddenly gives the desired results.
But if you don't understand the physics behind it then you would always naturally nudge the bars either way until you get where you want to go.


As for chicken strips, don't ever judge me by looking at my tyres, as my bike is for the majority part a commuter bike, so the thought of leaning it over at 10-20mph in London traffic, going to and from work, just to get rid of them like some sort of neanderthal dick comparison contest doesn't really do it for me. All i'm interested in is getting there and back in one piece.  :lol

[darrsi]

So if you're going round say a left hand bend and look down at the handle-bars, they'll be angled to the right?.

Think speedway riders, that's the easiest example.
Going left around the track, but turning right. And the more right they turn the more the bike drops down making the turn sharper.

[Flooky]

I would go to a track day, or get a track tuition session, great fun and better than trying this stuff on the road.
The only way to feel the limit in relative safety.

[YamFazFan]

[quote author=YamFazFan link=topic=25373.msg299369#msg299369 date=1560580394]
So if you're going round say a left hand bend and look down at the handle-bars, they'll be angled to the right?.

Think speedway riders, that's the easiest example.
Going left around the track, but turning right. And the more right they turn the more the bike drops down making the turn sharper.
[/quote]


I'd always assumed that was just them because they were sliding on that shale stuff :rolleyes

[Frosties]

So if you're going round say a left hand bend and look down at the handle-bars, they'll be angled to the right?.

If you're going round a left hand bend and look down at your bars then yup they will be angled to the right.........at the same same as you've realised you've ploughed the hedges on the opposite side of the road and binned it  :lol :lol

[YamFazFan]

:lol

[YamFazFan]

Watched a You Tube tutorial and it just looks like steering around corners to me.


I must be already doing it

[Frosties]

So if you're going round say a left hand bend and look down at the handle-bars, they'll be angled to the right?.

Try riding in a straight line at about 30-40mph in the center of the road.....then just nudge the left bar forwards quickly and release, a bit like nudging a door open. The bike will quickly move to the left about 1.5 feet and return to a straight line. If you nudge the right bar forwards then likewise the bike will quickly move to the right.


Remember....JUST A NUDGE. The longer you nudge each side forward the further you will travel across the road.


Once you get the hang of it it's very useful for avoiding potholes, cats etc and then start trying it when cornering. Slowly, slowly fella.