Emergency Vehicle/Red Light Question

[darrsi]

[quote author=darrsi link=topic=23573.msg273094#msg273094 date=1514559302]
Nobody answered my previous question before so i'll ask again?


What exactly are you s'posed to do when the lights are stuck on red??

As far as I'm aware it's still illegal to cross a red light, even in those circumstances.

So unless in the case of a motorcycle you could legally wheel it around the offending light, I guess you'd have to find an alternative route.
[/quote]


This is my point, near my work there's a set of lights where this has happened to me about 8 times now.


I'm generally stuffed, just sitting there watching all the other lights keep changing other than the one i'm looking at, the traffic (near the A40) takes minutes to become a major tailback, and it's illegal to use a phone whilst driving.


Fooked.....

[darrsi]

http://news.bbc.co.uk/local/derby/hi/peo...741601.stm

[YamFazFan]

That BBC article makes perfect common sense to me. It would be ridiculous to expect motorists to sit there all day when there's clearly a fault with the lights.

But at the same time the authorities have got to show common sense and not fine those drivers for doing so.

That's my exact same gripe with crossing the white line at a red light to allow an ambulance to proceed. Not the action of doing so, but the draconian punishment that may follow doing what seems the common sense thing.

[fazersharp]

I have been in this situation especially when I know the lights and know the order of when mine should be green. So I have sat there and watched the sequence go through 2 or 3 times and each time missing out my lights and yet there was the gap when everyone elses lights were on red which is when mine should be on green.

[YamFazFan]

I have been in this situation especially when I know the lights and know the order of when mine should be green. So I have sat there and watched the sequence go through 2 or 3 times and each time missing out my lights and yet there was the gap when everyone elses lights were on red which is when mine should be on green.

That sounds like a fault to me, but there's a couple of junctions round this way that are set so that drivers turning right don't get a green light every single time all the lights go through their phases.

I think they are deliberately set that way if they think it's not a busy turning aren't they?.

[Grahamm]

[size=1em]There has been an article in MCN recently saying that it is even illegal to push a motorcycle across, (not along, but across) a pavement if it does not have road side drop kerbs, drop kerbs constitute a right of passage for a motor vehicle, as in someone driveway.[/size]

I am assuming that Motor Cycle News know what they are on about.

There's an article from a motorcycle solicitors here about riding on the pavement: https://www.whitedalton.co.uk/motorbike-...-pavement/

If you keep it short and don't act like a twat, you'll probably be ok.

[YamFazFan]

If you keep it short and don't act like a twat, you'll probably be ok.

.....so long as you are doing it in order to reach a parking place according to the article. That would preclude doing so in order to dodge a faulty traffic light.

I'd love to see someone who genuinely is riding a short way on the pavement to reach a parking space, trying to explain that it is in fact a legal manoeuvre to the copper that's just nicked them :lol

[darrsi]

I have been in this situation especially when I know the lights and know the order of when mine should be green. So I have sat there and watched the sequence go through 2 or 3 times and each time missing out my lights and yet there was the gap when everyone elses lights were on red which is when mine should be on green.

At the crossroads i keep getting caught out at, my lights aren't part of the normal sequence, they just stay stuck on red whilst the other three carry on regardless and miss it out.
As you say, i too know the sequence off by heart so just time it right then give the throttle a bit of welly and i'm off.
The junction is about a mile from the A40, so traffic will literally back up in a few minutes during rush hour. Add to the fact they've very poorly redesigned the road and pavement a little further on and it becomes an absolute nightmare very quickly, to the point i ride a longer way home now to avoid it all but at least i'm constantly moving.

[His Dudeness]

[quote author=fazersharp link=topic=23573.msg273116#msg273116 date=1514631727]
I have been in this situation especially when I know the lights and know the order of when mine should be green. So I have sat there and watched the sequence go through 2 or 3 times and each time missing out my lights and yet there was the gap when everyone elses lights were on red which is when mine should be on green.

At the crossroads i keep getting caught out at, my lights aren't part of the normal sequence, they just stay stuck on red whilst the other three carry on regardless and miss it out.
As you say, i too know the sequence off by heart so just time it right then give the throttle a bit of welly and i'm off.
The junction is about a mile from the A40, so traffic will literally back up in a few minutes during rush hour. Add to the fact they've very poorly redesigned the road and pavement a little further on and it becomes an absolute nightmare very quickly, to the point i ride a longer way home now to avoid it all but at least i'm constantly moving.
[/quote]

Is it just the bike that doesn't trigger the sequence or cars too? If it's just the bike if you look down at the road as you approach the lights you should see a box shape cut into the road. Try stopping with your wheels right on top of one of the lines of the box and that will give you the best chance of triggering the lights.

[darrsi]

[quote author=darrsi link=topic=23573.msg273124#msg273124 date=1514640514]
[quote author=fazersharp link=topic=23573.msg273116#msg273116 date=1514631727]
I have been in this situation especially when I know the lights and know the order of when mine should be green. So I have sat there and watched the sequence go through 2 or 3 times and each time missing out my lights and yet there was the gap when everyone elses lights were on red which is when mine should be on green.

At the crossroads i keep getting caught out at, my lights aren't part of the normal sequence, they just stay stuck on red whilst the other three carry on regardless and miss it out.
As you say, i too know the sequence off by heart so just time it right then give the throttle a bit of welly and i'm off.
The junction is about a mile from the A40, so traffic will literally back up in a few minutes during rush hour. Add to the fact they've very poorly redesigned the road and pavement a little further on and it becomes an absolute nightmare very quickly, to the point i ride a longer way home now to avoid it all but at least i'm constantly moving.
[/quote]

Is it just the bike that doesn't trigger the sequence or cars too? If it's just the bike if you look down at the road as you approach the lights you should see a box shape cut into the road. Try stopping with your wheels right on top of one of the lines of the box and that will give you the best chance of triggering the lights.


[/quote]


Nothing to do with that at all, this is a very busy road.
The lights just keep fucking up, simple as that, they don't need triggering.

[His Dudeness]

Must be just broken then. You could report it https://www.gov.uk/report-problem-traffic-light

[darrsi]

Must be just broken then. You could report it https://www.gov.uk/report-problem-traffic-light

The point was more about what are you s'posed to legally or sensibly do when you're actually stuck there at that time.
I've rung the council before when i've eventually got home, but that would be around 30mins later.
30mins of stoppage in that road would cause major traffic, and i mean a lot. Then it would take time to send someone out as well, so i dread to think how long it would take to fix, unless they can sort it via computer, which sounds feasible?
The Italian Job springs to mind.  :lol

[Grahamm]

Is it just the bike that doesn't trigger the sequence or cars too? If it's just the bike if you look down at the road as you approach the lights you should see a box shape cut into the road. Try stopping with your wheels right on top of one of the lines of the box and that will give you the best chance of triggering the lights.

Unfortunately sometimes the Induction Loop just isn't set to be sensitive enough to pick up the smaller amount of metal in a bike, compared to a car

[darrsi]

[quote author=His Dudeness link=topic=23573.msg273130#msg273130 date=1514652861]
Is it just the bike that doesn't trigger the sequence or cars too? If it's just the bike if you look down at the road as you approach the lights you should see a box shape cut into the road. Try stopping with your wheels right on top of one of the lines of the box and that will give you the best chance of triggering the lights.

Unfortunately sometimes the Induction Loop just isn't set to be sensitive enough to pick up the smaller amount of metal in a bike, compared to a car
[/quote]


There's a set of lights literally across the road from where i live that has this type of sensor. Why the lights are even there is completely puzzling because it's a very quiet side road with just houses and a dead end?
But i have a mate who lives there so have popped round his house then sat like a total plum at these lights that haven't picked up the sense that my bike is even there many times before. I now just have a quick glance around to see who's about then ride straight through it. Again, i know the sequence so can very safely exit the road without any danger issues at all.

[tommyardin]

Must be just broken then. You could report it https://www.gov.uk/report-problem-traffic-light

But don't sit on your bike and phone them on your mobile  :lol

[darrsi]

[quote author=His Dudeness link=topic=23573.msg273132#msg273132 date=1514653556]
Must be just broken then. You could report it https://www.gov.uk/report-problem-traffic-light

But don't sit on your bike and phone them on your mobile  :lol
[/quote]


Or park your bike on the pavement.
To help, or react, someone will no doubt break another law somehow.

[YamFazFan]

To help, or react, someone will no doubt break another law somehow.

Yep, and then they can impose yet another fine.

There's a fine for pretty much any petty misdemeanour nowadays from dropping crumbs for pigeons to leaving your wheely bin out on the wrong day.

It's all about extracting the maximum amount of cash from the public and reminding us who is boss.

[darrsi]

[quote author=darrsi link=topic=23573.msg273158#msg273158 date=1514729084]
To help, or react, someone will no doubt break another law somehow.

Yep, and then they can impose yet another fine.

There's a fine for pretty much any petty misdemeanour nowadays from dropping crumbs for pigeons to leaving your wheely bin out on the wrong day.

It's all about extracting the maximum amount of cash from the public and reminding us who is boss.
[/quote]


The one that always bothers me is the £80 fine for dropping a cigarette butt, but feel free to light as many fireworks as you like, littering wherever they land, with no worries about any penalty charge at all?
Add to that, is it such a great idea to sell high explosives to the general public?
I think not, especially these days.

[Slaninar]

Law, justice and even common sense are not always "aligned".

As for any moral dilemmas, IMO, when choosing for oneself which laws are just and common sense, one can often be subjective and unjust. When doing so for no personal gain (like when moving to let an emergency vehicle pass), the chance of being subjective and unjust is very low.

Still, I wouldn't be amazed to get fined for doing the right thing - whenever braking the law, one should be ready to accept the risks and consequences. Worse than a fine would be a scenario where moving at a red light causes a (fatal?) accident (Murphy's law?).

[YamFazFan]

The one that always bothers me is the £80 fine for dropping a cigarette butt

It's an easy target. They can lurk about and predict almost down to the second when it gets chucked on the floor.

The fine is out of all proportion to the 'crime'.

But hey, when did that last matter? :rolleyes