Change of tyre manufacturer, more cornering confidence?

[Dead Eye]

Because I do so few miles per year every time I change I have skipped about 3 generations of "tec" and never notice a difference

I wonder if that could be why though?

Certain things take a lot of experience with before you can identify the subtleties and begin to compare. Just a random example off the top of my head is the ability to tune a guitar by ear. I have a guitar, but like fuck can I do that because I really don't use it very often.

Then again, maybe the same can be said for whether you use the tyres to their full potential. As the guy in the video stated, most of the tyres you can't tell a difference until you start leaning on them more and become more familiar with their "character"

No offence intended and you may well be perfectly correct, I'm just putting some thoughts out there and I like trying to find and explore counter-points

[esetest]

I now have Pr3,s , I used to have Bt23 , I am pushing a lot more than I used to , but that is probably having more confidence , since doing the Ron Haslem race school .

[slimwilly]

My Metzelers went to the edge today,both sides,    fantastic tyre for giving confidence, got them on my Fireblade too

[Skippernick]

Loads of good advice guys thank you.
IAM didn't pick it up because it isn't really a problem, just maybe i am pushing a bit more now and as i am due a tyre change thinking about it even more.
Love the funky chicken idea.
Think i might change tyre manufacturer just to be able to compare anyway.

[Grahamm]

Fairly sure your issue Graham is not trusting a modern motorbike tyre.

Very probably. Having had a couple of bad experiences in the past, I'm loathe to try to explore the limits when getting it wrong could be expensive or even painful

What tyres are you running..do you ride 365 all weather, bet there decent tyres and you can't remember the last time you locked the front in the wet resulting in a major.

I've got Bridgestone 023s and I ride all year around. I've only ever had the ABS on the front cut in a couple of times, once when I had to anchor up and hit a patch of gravel (fortunately I was travelling in a straight line).

Let's try asking the question this way: If I'm cornering (and barring patches of diesel etc) which tyre is likely to slide first: The front or the rear? (Naturally I don't touch the front brake when cranked over!)

I can deal with rear wheel skids (I wore out many a tyre on my bicycle when I was a kid...) so if the rear is more likely then I will probably be ok.

So which is most likely to slide?

[slimwilly]

Oh Shit,  did you say Diesel !!!!!!!

If any of us come upon something slippy when we are requiring good grip then I am afraid we are Fooced, twatted,

Yes if you brake then the wheel with most bite will go first but if you are leaning then ===good bye, sorry but not a chance,,nor any tyre will help you out.
Please mr upstairs,, don't give me diesel xx

[Slaninar]

So my bridgestone bt 23s are coming to the end, this is the second set and i ran the original bt45 for a while that came with the bike.
Now i am not a fast rider but have passed my IAM so not shite either, but i do have a cornering/leaning confidence problem. Usually I'm fine with "slow in fast out" but sometimes i go in too hot as you do and freak out about leaning more i.e. scrapping the hero blobs.
I know what to do, grip the tank counter steer more, i know this is all in my head. I know a track day would help but time and money are limited.
I don't need to scrape the blobs all the time and i know that if hedge trimmer, slim or others jumped on my bike they would have it on its side no worries, but i want to be able to do it if needed without freaking.
So here's the question would a change of tyre manufacturer i.e. carcass construction tyre feel help me, or would sticking with what i know be better. And if so which tyres, not after the latest type, but a similar type to my bt23s i.e. sport touring.


Cheers
Nick

When you train football combinations, first you train with defenders just following you. After it's become your second nature, only then can you try it with defenders pushing you and pulling your shirt. Same with any other skill. If you start training hard, scared, it will take ages. You should train a little every day and take it easy all the time. What feels slow and safe to you will start being faster and faster in mph and lean angle.


Although, with (motor)cycle riding - once you fall, the confidence does get lower buy a lot, so you take a few steps back then. But if you're persistent, you'll get there. However, if you don't have money for a track day, don't push it. No need for super leaning on public roads. It is fun, but can be dangerous. Take it easy.


Whatever you do, never ride what scares you, that's no good. Adrenalin yes, but not fear.

[darrsi]

[quote author=Skippernick link=topic=19846.msg229127#msg229127 date=1460490009]
So my bridgestone bt 23s are coming to the end, this is the second set and i ran the original bt45 for a while that came with the bike.
Now i am not a fast rider but have passed my IAM so not shite either, but i do have a cornering/leaning confidence problem. Usually I'm fine with "slow in fast out" but sometimes i go in too hot as you do and freak out about leaning more i.e. scrapping the hero blobs.
I know what to do, grip the tank counter steer more, i know this is all in my head. I know a track day would help but time and money are limited.
I don't need to scrape the blobs all the time and i know that if hedge trimmer, slim or others jumped on my bike they would have it on its side no worries, but i want to be able to do it if needed without freaking.
So here's the question would a change of tyre manufacturer i.e. carcass construction tyre feel help me, or would sticking with what i know be better. And if so which tyres, not after the latest type, but a similar type to my bt23s i.e. sport touring.


Cheers
Nick

When you train football combinations, first you train with defenders just following you. After it's become your second nature, only then can you try it with defenders pushing you and pulling your shirt. Same with any other skill. If you start training hard, scared, it will take ages. You should train a little every day and take it easy all the time. What feels slow and safe to you will start being faster and faster in mph and lean angle.


Although, with (motor)cycle riding - once you fall, the confidence does get lower buy a lot, so you take a few steps back then. But if you're persistent, you'll get there. However, if you don't have money for a track day, don't push it. No need for super leaning on public roads. It is fun, but can be dangerous. Take it easy.


Whatever you do, never ride what scares you, that's no good. Adrenalin yes, but not fear.
[/quote]


Had a hint of Eric Cantona about your theory there Slaninar.  :lol

[Slaninar]

Had a hint of Eic Cantona about your theory there Slaninar.  :lol

YES. It is official - I am slow on the uptake. 


I really don't get this.    :wall

[darrsi]

[quote author=darrsi link=topic=19846.msg229558#msg229558 date=1460876770]
Had a hint of Eic Cantona about your theory there Slaninar.  :lol

YES. It is official - I am slow on the uptake. 


I really don't get this.    :wall
[/quote]


That's okay, i never really got Eric Cantona either.  :lol


I'm just teasing, i was just amused at how you used football training as a comparison to riding a bike around a bend.

[noggythenog]

Hey Skipper....just my noggence worth......I don't think that you should kick yourself too badly and I also don't think that you can really practice over cooking it.

you have drawn comparisons with others on here that are fast riders but even they will overcook it at times albeit maybe at different lean angles.....I am sure that they are here for the grace of god too and not from superior skill once things went tits up because to actually get to the stage of being tits up means really that planning and being controlled have already gone out the window.

I've practiced Punkstigs "funky chicken" ever since he posted it up a couple years ago and it does help become more self aware and relaxed.

I also read somewhere about sticking your leading elbow out towards where you want to go...so chin up and pointed to the exit and also the elbow.

Leaning over the tank might help a bit, more weight on the front end and better feel through the arms of what is going on via the front wheel and handlebars although on an upright bike it can be difficult to maintain.

also do you find that you have this problem even solo or is it when following others?.

and after all that noggyness & we all know I'm no guru....what would I say about tyres......If you don't do much wet weather riding then id say go for it get some sticky compounds on there, Rosso Diablo or whatever....when you see small stones sticking in them during summer it puts the mind at ease about how soft and sticky they are and the placebo effect certainly kicks in a bit so you stop worrying about them.

I highly rate the Pilot Power 2CT which I had on the FZ1 and now on the Noggysaurustrx they are great. 8)

[Slaninar]

That's okay, i never really got Eric Cantona either.  :lol


I'm just teasing, i was just amused at how you used football training as a comparison to riding a bike around a bend.

That was an example of (another) motor skill... just like riding a bike. 

[Val]

You also need to be relaxed, someone once told me I should be able to flap my arms about like a chicken mid corner,
....breathe and relax. Its the way forward and round!

+1 for relaxing. With speeds you do on most A and B roads you must be able to multitask. I have noticed that if I take my mind from the corner for few seconds it helps me to be more relaxed. For example instead of looking for vanishing points and through corner I try to follow something completely not relevant to riding, turning my head in completely wrong postion and looking andd some object around, like a house, cyclist passing by, some nice blonde. That helps me relax.

If you end up in a ditch it will be your fault though not mine  :lol

[Skippernick]

Well i went out today to try my new chinky levers but also to have a play.
I have a a large quietish roundabout near me, i practised my funky chicken on the way so i'm not "holding on too tight". Name the film!!
Funky chicken is great, noggy's tip about leaning forward a bit more and pointing with the chin really helped, i like that one.
The result was no blob scraping but the 2mm of scuffed chicken strip (i hate that term as well) has gone! :woot I felt much happy leant over as well.
Just need a left hand roundabout now, anyone know of one.
Think i will change tyre manufacturer though thinking may be Michelin PR3's anyone got anything bad to say about them?

[fazersharp]

Just need a left hand roundabout now, anyone know of one.

That would be the rounabout exit !
Next step, instead of going round and round is to go in a little faster (you know the roundabout and if you have the clear view to do this), and this will be replicating the corner that you have "over cooked" so the next one you over cook one you will know what to do

[Frosties]

[quote author=Skippernick link=topic=19846.msg229638#msg229638 date=1460921625]

Just need a left hand roundabout now, anyone know of one.

That would be the rounabout exit !
Next step, instead of going round and round is to go in a little faster (you know the roundabout and if you have the clear view to do this), and this will be replicating the corner that you have "over cooked" so the next one you over cook one you will know what to do
[/quote]


Good shout by Sharpy  :thumbup

[Slaninar]

Think i will change tyre manufacturer though thinking may be Michelin PR3's anyone got anything bad to say about them?

Fabric, not metal carcass. I'd go with Metzeler Sportec M5 interact.

[Frosties]

Well i went out today to try my new chinky levers but also to have a play.
I have a a large quietish roundabout near me, i practised my funky chicken on the way so i'm not "holding on too tight". Name the film!!
Funky chicken is great, noggy's tip about leaning forward a bit more and pointing with the chin really helped, i like that one.
The result was no blob scraping but the 2mm of scuffed chicken strip (i hate that term as well) has gone! :woot I felt much happy leant over as well.
Just need a left hand roundabout now, anyone know of one.
Think i will change tyre manufacturer though thinking may be Michelin PR3's anyone got anything bad to say about them?

Good to hear the progress, pleased for you fella, and also glad that Noggy has his uses  :lol


As for the PR3's - I've found them to have good feel and cracking wet or dry grip inspiring confidence all round. I have managed to lock the front twice (around London) but this is probably down to snatching the lever and having no time for the tyre to compress.

[Punkstig]

One thing nobody's mentioned is temperature, somebody kicked off a while ago on a sports bike forum because their super sticky expensive sports tyres were slipping all over the shop scaring them and losing all confidence in corners- quite simply it wasn't possible for him to get them up to the required temperature on the road and for the time of year in order for them to start gripping.
Sports touring tyres these days are extremely well suited to our roads and temperatures, the better weather over the weekend would have made a difference though!
stay with that type imo!

[Dead Eye]

I've noticed that with my T30's on the 1000

It takes a few miles for them to get to temperature and settle as straight off of the drive they don't always feel 100% planted...

I have this persistent argument going on in my head about whether to try a new manufacturer or to stick with what I know. I really should just bite the bullet and try something else. Maybe I'll give the Metzelers a shot next time, but for now there is plenty of tread on the thou to make use of The "chicken strips" on the thou are definitely larger than on the 600 for me