Date: 31-10-25  Time: 13:14 pm

Author Topic: New carbs!!!!!!!!!but.....  (Read 3746 times)

reillypadraig

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New carbs!!!!!!!!!but.....
« on: 29 January 2013, 12:21:52 am »
 Got a set of carbs!! Very clean compared to my last set, all was taken apart, inspected and put back together, had a fuel leak in 2 bowls (seals weren't doing the job) but I used 2 of the bowls I already had from last set, so I tightened the idle mixture screws in till seated and turned out 2 full turns, set the tps, adjusted the carb synch screws until they were all fairly even(by sight) will get the proper carb tune tomorrow,

...... But went to start the bike, wudnt turn over even though it was still warm from the last run I gave it on the last carbs, so I went on using full choke but then died, so I opened the fuel mix screws 1 turn each and it ran, bit poor though, so I opened them again a half a turn and it ran ok ish but still everytime I give throttle it smothers and at that setting I have fuel spitting out of the exhaust, so I turned the mix screws back down and it cuts out,

So took them out, checked everything, passages and air compressed out everything, looks too clean to have blockages but done it all the same, so set idle screws to 2 turns from seated again and put back it, almost started and tried starting by giving throttle and half throttle and full throttle but it made it worse, only starts on choke and no throttle????

Any ideas guys?

His Dudeness

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Re: New carbs!!!!!!!!!but.....
« Reply #1 on: 29 January 2013, 03:19:56 am »
i'd say the balance screws are way off. try turning the idle speed screw way up and see if you can keep the bike running off that. then get the vacuum gauges on and try roughly balancing the carbs while the idle is way up. then when you've got them reasonably balanced turn the idle back down and try balancing them properly.

red98

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Re: New carbs!!!!!!!!!but.....
« Reply #2 on: 29 January 2013, 06:58:01 am »
........+1..........do you know the history of the new carbs ?  :)

reillypadraig

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Re: New carbs!!!!!!!!!but.....
« Reply #3 on: 29 January 2013, 08:51:46 am »
they seem in fairly good condition


http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=493953147312645&set=a.484302664944360.105616.100000938936026&type=1&theater


is 2 turns from seated the factory settings? and getting to the mix screw just above the starter is a right pain, long time to do it with a pointy nose pliers

red98

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Re: New carbs!!!!!!!!!but.....
« Reply #4 on: 29 January 2013, 09:06:40 am »
two turns .i think,are factory settings but a little more would not hurt,yes i have trouble reaching the mixture screws aswell  :\ :\ ....have you checked the needle height ?.....should be on the middle grove of five  ;)

packie

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Re: New carbs!!!!!!!!!but.....
« Reply #5 on: 29 January 2013, 09:26:28 am »



is 2 turns from seated the factory settings? and getting to the mix screw just above the starter is a right pain, long time to do it with a pointy nose pliers


2 turns out is factory settings and people say here that the Fazer runs rich so you shouldn't have to back it off further really reilly!!.  :b

It's probably hard to check without a special tool, but the fuel level needs to be 4.5mm above the chamber level or float bowl. Download the manual from the website and you see what I mean. Check also that your fuel pump is ok and that you have no kinks in the line or breather hoses.

Seems to me you are starved of fuel or air, but I'd be looking at other areas other than the Pilot screws if they are set to 2 turns out. Even if the carbs were way out, she still should fire up and run IMO but I'd try what His Dudeness said anyway just as a process of elimination.  I only balanced my carbs a while back and they were way out but the bike still ran away and fired up every time. I just was the smoothest at tickover. Best of luck, man. You have great tolerance!! :wall

reillypadraig

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Re: New carbs!!!!!!!!!but.....
« Reply #6 on: 29 January 2013, 09:39:23 am »
Haha really Reilly, last time I heard that was when I was on den tv as a child and dustan said oh really? No o Reilly, got him to do the flap flaps aswel lol( that's a good long time ago) off topic abit there

Can't see if it is anything other than the screws as last carbs ran fine and I changed nothing, gonna pick up the carbtune now.

It seems that it's being starved of fuel, so I bought carb cleaner this morning and gona give it a right doing with it and the air compressor aswel to rule that out

This is gona sound childish but it one full revolution of the screwdriver? Because I seen a vid on YouTube of a guy saying one revolution but he only turned the flathead half a turn or from one face to the other, that's just confusing.
I put a spanner on top of my screwdriver,(doesn't sound dirty at all does it? Haha) and aimed it at a part of the wall and turned it until it faced that part of the wall again and called that one revolution.

packie

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Re: New carbs!!!!!!!!!but.....
« Reply #7 on: 29 January 2013, 10:04:37 am »
Haha really Reilly, last time I heard that was when I was on den tv as a child and dustan said oh really? No o Reilly, got him to do the flap flaps aswel lol( that's a good long time ago) off topic abit there

Can't see if it is anything other than the screws as last carbs ran fine and I changed nothing, gonna pick up the carbtune now.

It seems that it's being starved of fuel, so I bought carb cleaner this morning and gona give it a right doing with it and the air compressor aswel to rule that out

This is gona sound childish but it one full revolution of the screwdriver? Because I seen a vid on YouTube of a guy saying one revolution but he only turned the flathead half a turn or from one face to the other, that's just confusing.
I put a spanner on top of my screwdriver,(doesn't sound dirty at all does it? Haha) and aimed it at a part of the wall and turned it until it faced that part of the wall again and called that one revolution.
Never done the Fazer Pilots but I'd say they are positioned in around the same area as the Bandits. With the Bandit and doing it on the bike, I have this very small screwdriver that I use. And on the screwdriver body near the handle (not the handle itself) I put a mark with tippex. I then use that mark as a guide for a full turn. My understanding would be the same as yours in that yer man on the vid only did a half a turn instead of a full turn. A full turn to me would be imaging a point on the screw at 12 o clock and turning that point the all the way around to the 12 oc clock again in one full turn.

Dead Eye

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Re: New carbs!!!!!!!!!but.....
« Reply #8 on: 29 January 2013, 10:07:30 am »
+1 to turns

1 FULL turn is 360 Degrees, video you saw was wrong ;)

red98

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Re: New carbs!!!!!!!!!but.....
« Reply #9 on: 29 January 2013, 10:10:27 am »
two turns is two full turns.....you cant belive everything you see on the net  ;)  theres some funny foccers out there  :D

reillypadraig

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Re: New carbs!!!!!!!!!but.....
« Reply #10 on: 29 January 2013, 10:52:31 am »
two turns is two full turns.....you cant belive everything you see on the net  ;)  theres some funny foccers out there  :D
Lol damn right, will know in few hours if this all works

ade the blade

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Re: New carbs!!!!!!!!!but.....
« Reply #11 on: 29 January 2013, 11:42:07 am »
just keep in mind mate, yes,2 turns out is the `factory setting`. but no two engines are the same. i normally treat these `settings` as a starting point and usually find a small amount of tweaking either in or out will be required. on most bikes. very small adjustments can make a HUGE difference to the running. just my mutterings. good luck ;)

reillypadraig

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Re: New carbs!!!!!!!!!but.....
« Reply #12 on: 29 January 2013, 07:51:22 pm »
Got it going, but it won't idle, anything under 2k rev Nd it dies, first left all as factory spec and synched the carbs, but was running rich and anytime I turned it down it died, and no matter where I leave the screws it won't start straight of the button, needs a fistful of rev to start, same with moving off even though its at 2k idle

........hmm I might just be beaten on this, my knowledge had hit a dead end :wall

red98

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Re: New carbs!!!!!!!!!but.....
« Reply #13 on: 29 January 2013, 09:05:59 pm »
thinking time needed me thinks  :( :( :( :( ....did you check the needle height ?  ;)

unfazed

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Re: New carbs!!!!!!!!!but.....
« Reply #14 on: 29 January 2013, 11:56:07 pm »
Check the choke levers are seating properly.
I presume the pilots screws you are referring to are at the bottom at the inlet side of the float bowl. When you turn them fully in do not force them or you will damage the smooth surfaces. Mark the side of the carburettor with a fine marker where the slots in the jet are and turn it out 2 full turns (360 degrees per turn) to line up the slots with the marker. Do all four and then leave them alone.
Where did you get the Carbs?
There may be a  pilot fuel or air jet blocked which would explain the non tick over and difficult starting. Did you blow the jets in the direction the fuel and air flows or in reverse? Most common mistake in cleaning jets is to blow in the wrong direction and end up pushing the blockage in further and making it almost impossible to remove. The jets should always be blown in reverse once cleaned.
To balance the carbs off the bike use the smooth side (for obvious reasons) of a 4mm drill bit. Screw up the tick over screw until the drill bit just slides under the throttle butterfly and adjust the rest of the balancing screws until there are all as close as possible. That is sufficient to ensure it runs.
Out of curiosity did you do a compression check on the engine?
 

reillypadraig

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Re: New carbs!!!!!!!!!but.....
« Reply #15 on: 30 January 2013, 11:52:31 pm »
Just got a compression tester today, was messing around with the carbs, cleaned the jet that's long and has 4 holes in the bottom and put them back in, ran almost perfect! Then gave the bike a quick clean and rode it again. Started backfiring like hell and wudnt tick over, I think I have a blockage somewhere. Carb cleaner just won't do it, gona pick up a an ultra sonic cleaner in aldi tomorrow, only 20 quid, but that way they will definatly be clean and clear. Too small to put entire carbs in though, it's only ment for jewlery anyway.

Yea i checked the needles and there set to middle setting (factory)

Was so close today, had it running perfect with the odd little splutter on full throttle from low rev but other than that had full power constantly.

Everytime I put the carbs back in I set it to that 2 turns out

Also I synched the carbs with a proper carbtune.

I tried to do a compression test on 1 cylinder today but don't think I done it right or the reading is off cause it only read 100psi when the Haynes manuel says 185??

packie

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Re: New carbs!!!!!!!!!but.....
« Reply #16 on: 31 January 2013, 12:14:49 am »


I tried to do a compression test on 1 cylinder today but don't think I done it right or the reading is off cause it only read 100psi when the Haynes manuel says 185??


Sure that your manual is right? I got these from my Haynes that I downloaded from this Website:


 FZS models
Standard 213 psi (14.7 Bar)
Maximum 225 psi (15.5 Bar)
Minimum 170 psi (11.7 Bar)
Max. difference between cylinders 14.5 psi (1.0 Bar)

reillypadraig

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Re: New carbs!!!!!!!!!but.....
« Reply #17 on: 31 January 2013, 09:28:46 am »
Ur prob right, that does sound better lol, cudnt remember exactly when I got home to post that,

packie

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Re: New carbs!!!!!!!!!but.....
« Reply #18 on: 01 February 2013, 12:09:58 am »
any joy?  :car

reillypadraig

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Re: New carbs!!!!!!!!!but.....
« Reply #19 on: 01 February 2013, 01:34:12 am »
Think the compression tester was off, all the cylinders read the exact same pressure, bike idles perfect and runs smooth, but it has an odd splutter in it still, some very fine tuning now and I think I have it.really pissed of with the amount of times I'v taken the cabs in and out, I'm a pro at it now lol.
Have to get someone to look at it now, bloody 50quid an hour though for him to look at it, that's y I have to keep eliminating problems that there might be

packie

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Re: New carbs!!!!!!!!!but.....
« Reply #20 on: 01 February 2013, 10:06:12 am »
You might have competition there, Padraig. There is a lad on here who had his carbs out about 10 times to date!! His problem is runnig longer than Coranation Street!!  :'(

Be careful where that bike leads you, bud. It might become a bottomless pit for money and you could get sucked in. I bought (what I thought) was a decent bike but paid a terrible price in bad decision making.

The first bad decision was with all my 20 year experience in bikes and having owned/bought quite a few....on this deal I acted like a "first timer" getting into bikes when I bought it. In my enthusiasm to close the deal in a far and distant land, I checked nothing meticoulously. I bought it private in another County which was a first for me. I rarely buy private due to comeback issues, and buying it in another County sort of hedged me to buy it on the spot because going away to mull on it was not an option with the travel distances involved.

Even then, if I had did a thorough check all over the bike or paid for a second opinion to come with me, I would have spotted a catalogue of things wrong that would have costed a lot of money to fix. That would have at least given me the option of walking away. Instead, I got suckered into bit by a bottomless pit of money spending and bad decion making as follows.

When I got the bike home, I discovered that the brake discs were under the limit and needed replacing. That including the pads, costed a kings ramson and that is were my problems began. Now I was totally committed to the bike and could not walk away unless I took a heavy loss. When doing that job I found that they butchered the bleed nipple on the rear caliper and it was a small bit iffy anyway so I decided to get a secondhand Fazer thou one instead. Then I discovered that the rear master cylinder was butchered and had to get a second hand one, and in the process, I cracked the Master cylinder's mounting riders footplate that had to be replaced too. I was well up to my armpits invested in the bike now.

Then I had camchain problems which the previous owners load pipe masked over. I decided to buy a quite pipe for it and that's when I heard all the camchain rattles. I knew that the camchain was knackered. No problem there. But on inspecting it further, some dipsh!t had the same problem earlier but decided to weld a lump of metal onto the tip of the tensioner to take up the slack further instead of replacing the camchain. The result for me was a chamchain and a new tensioner had to be fitted. It was getting to be a joke at this stage.

I then had an electrical problem that would cut the bike dead unexpectantly at take off. Actually when I first noticed it, I noticed it because I bloody fell off the bike as it threw me off balance. Luckily (my first bit of luck!) there was no damage to the bodywork but I did snap the front brake lever in two which had to be replaced. I eventually sorted it to being a loose wire on a connecting block down by the relays. That I sorted myself at no expense, but it was effecting my moral big time at this stage. I nearly sold it to the breakers for 500 quid!!

Next up was a fork leg that was badly corroded that I didn't spot. Had to get a second hand one.

Now I have tight spots in two places on my chain and sprockets, I just bought a new set as we speak. I said to myself, I might as well go the full hog, so I bought a K&N filter for it as i'm going to balance the carbs pretty soon.

The bike has been running well now for the last 1,000 miles and i'm really enjoying it. Hopefully all my problems (major ones) are behind me. It's a fantasic bike when running well and really suits me.  I have a fine bike now, no doubt. But the money that the bike costed and what I put into it would have gotten me a 4-5 year old newer version. And if I ever sell it on, it will always be for a big loss now. I suppose it has thought me a few valuable and major lessons too going forward, so that's a plus too. So be careful were that bike takes you because you could be entering a place of no return like me if someone takes about 4-5 hours to fix it at €50 a hour.

Rant over.!...ha ha!  :2guns

reillypadraig

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Re: New carbs!!!!!!!!!but.....
« Reply #21 on: 01 February 2013, 12:45:49 pm »
your dead right there


i bought for 750 and it now stands me about 1100 and its still not running, i should have just waited for a decent running bike but (i knew it all at the time) silly me


i had to buy clutch level & cable
gear selector
new rear brake pads(but then the caliper was shit, thanks again for that, it runs nearly too wel, rear wheel locks with anything over fairish force, think only one piston working well)
had to replace clutch but old engine had better clutch in it
had to but engine mounting bolts
oil & oil filter
50 for new choke plunger but then old carbs wer fucked so waste of money
new rear indicators
rear fender has  half missing under the seat needs replacing
had to temp fix the speedo but need new one
have over 200hours spent on fucked up electrics and bad connections(i bought the bike last august!!the bank holiday weekend)
new fuel filter
i coulod rant on for hours at this but im not ready to give the bike into urman until im 100% sure all it needs its mix screw twiddling

packie

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Re: New carbs!!!!!!!!!but.....
« Reply #22 on: 01 February 2013, 06:26:47 pm »
..only €200 away from what you spent. It's on the website for the last month or two, so I'd say it would have gone for a €1,100 if you waved it in front of the guy.


http://www.donedeal.ie/for-sale/motorbikes/4310233

reillypadraig

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Re: New carbs!!!!!!!!!but.....
« Reply #23 on: 02 February 2013, 11:56:32 am »
i know, seen that and all, even seen a cbr for 800 quid, a week after i bought the fazer and not a thing wrong with it, seen the bike before and all, guy was emigrating and just wanted cash there and then.


wel its back to removing the carbs again and proding trough the holes to see if there is and dirt left in my jets

packie

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Re: New carbs!!!!!!!!!but.....
« Reply #24 on: 02 February 2013, 01:16:34 pm »
Have fun  :fish