Noise

[darrsi]

I've waited long enough now so it's eventually time to ask for your font of knowledge.

There's a noise coming from my bike that I can't even fathom out whereabouts it's even from yet due to added wind noise?

Best description is a whirring sound which seems to go along with the engine speed, most noticeable when I shut off the throttle and let the bike slow down with the engine. Imagine clicking a cable tie really quickly but it's constant.

Thing is, it only goes away when I pull the clutch in.

So that rules out anything to do with the wheels or wheel bearings.
It doesn't go away either if I use one or both brakes, it just slows the noise down, but as soon as the clutch is pulled in it's gone.

It sounds a bit too loud to me to be a vibration thing, although I've not completely ruled that out yet, but from what I can guess I don't think it's coming from the rear of the bike.
And pulling the clutch in doesn't stop the chain from moving so it can't be that either.

Any thoughts or ideas welcome, as firstly it's annoying the hell out of me, and secondly, something's obviously not right at all is it?

Cheers, D.

[BBROWN1664]

Does it make the noise when stationary? If so, it could be the clucth basket though that tends to only be at idle if the cars balance/idle speed is wrong.
is it speed sensitive? ie the faster your traveling the faster the clicking? If so, it could be a stiff link on the chain.

[darrsi]

Does it make the noise when stationary? If so, it could be the clucth basket though that tends to only be at idle if the cars balance/idle speed is wrong.
is it speed sensitive? ie the faster your traveling the faster the clicking? If so, it could be a stiff link on the chain.

It’s speed sensitive.
It’s not the chain, because i’d feel that on the footpeg, plus the chain still moves when the clutch is pulled in, which is when the noise will stop.


There’s plenty of things i can safely rule out, but it still doesn’t leave me with anything i can think of as a culprit?

[darrsi]

Just had a look over the chain, it’s in really good condition, i’ve been putting engine oil on it with a paintbrush every couple of weeks so the links were moving really easily.
Exhaust is all good, nothing loose or flapping about.


Only other moving parts i can think of, other than the engine itself, are the waterpump and the speedo sensor, but again the noise goes away with the clutch pulled in so can’t be them.
Both wheels spin quite happily on the centre stand, with the pads not even touching the discs so nothing sticking at all in the pistons.


Kinda stumped now? 

[Dudeofrude]

I may be being naive here but you've said repeatedly that the noise goes away when you pull the clutch lever? So surely the first thing to do would be check over the clutch?
I've no clue what it could be but just seems logical no?

[celticbiker]

I reckon it's the chain and sprockets.
The noise goes away when you pull the clutch because you are unloading the chain.

[darrsi]

I may be being naive here but you've said repeatedly that the noise goes away when you pull the clutch lever? So surely the first thing to do would be check over the clutch?
I've no clue what it could be but just seems logical no?

I have considered it maybe clutch slip, but i know what that feels like and the bike is showing no signs of that whatsoever, i can give the throttle a lot of welly without any slipping feeling at all, plus i remember that is more of a higher pitched grinding sound.

[darrsi]

I reckon it's the chain and sprockets.
The noise goes away when you pull the clutch because you are unloading the chain.

This is now becoming favourite, although i don't get why?
I quickly gave all the brake pad pins a clean up after work yesterday and as i had gloves on i physically felt and examined the whole chain and there were no stiff links at all and as i said earlier it appeared to be in really good nick.


So why would it suddenly start making a noise? I expect it when they're new but i've never had one make a noise before without having a stiff link?


I've now just found this article as well which does describe the same thing quite accurately.


https://www.motorcycleforum.com/59-motorcycle-repair/105036-friction-noise-deceleration.html 

[Grahamm]

Check the sprockets (especially the front one) for hooking.

I recently tightened my chain and it started making a hell of a racket when I would roll off the throttle using engine braking. The front sprocket had started to hook and once I'd replaced the chain and sprockets the noise went away.

[Hedgetrimmer]

I quickly gave all the brake pad pins a clean up after work yesterday and as i had gloves on i physically felt and examined the whole chain and there were no stiff links at all and as i said earlier it appeared to be in really good nick.


So why would it suddenly start making a noise? I expect it when they're new but i've never had one make a noise before without having a stiff link?

Wheel alignment after adjusting the chain? Perhaps combined with a particular level of wear and tear?

[darrsi]

I quickly gave all the brake pad pins a clean up after work yesterday and as i had gloves on i physically felt and examined the whole chain and there were no stiff links at all and as i said earlier it appeared to be in really good nick.


So why would it suddenly start making a noise? I expect it when they're new but i've never had one make a noise before without having a stiff link?

Wheel alignment after adjusting the chain? Perhaps combined with a particular level of wear and tear?

Seems okay, i’m a bit fussy about the wheel alignment and even had a whinge when my last tyre was fitted because it didn’t feel like it was straight enough.

[Fazerider]

I’d check the front sprocket too.
If it’s starting to get slightly hooked the chain will get a “flick” as the tooth suddenly lets go of the roller when the bottom run is under tension. If the clutch is engaged the bottom run will be slack and each link can free itself from the hook quietly. It’s a bit like the difference between twanging a rubber band when it’s taut and when it’s slack.

[darrsi]

Finally got round to having a good look at things yesterday.
Sprockets look okay to me, and as i said before there is definitely no stiff links in the chain, it's in very good condition with all links moving freely, and no hint of any knocking on the footpeg whatsoever.


One thing that i have thought of though is that the noise only started after i starting brushing engine oil on the chain every other week.
For decades i've only ever used chain lube before on all my chains.


So am i hearing a different chain noise that i'm simply not used to?
Chain lube can be thick and gungy, whereas engine oil has made the chain look and feel like new.


Might be a coincidence, but i realigned the wheel again anyway and oiled it again and the noise is still there.


Just a thought, maybe the cause?

[agricola]

Clean the oil off the chain, then put chain lube back on. See if the noise changes

[darrsi]

Clean the oil off the chain, then put chain lube back on. See if the noise changes

Yeah i know what you're saying, i've already considered that, but the chain looks so healthy, if that's the right terminology, that i kind of feel a bit reluctant to gunge it back up again, but i'll probably have to use it as a process of elimination.
If my hearing wasn't so over sensitive it wouldn't be an issue but i can hear a pin drop from a mile away so to me it's overly irritating. 

[Skippernick]

Clean the oil off the chain, then put chain lube back on. See if the noise changes

Yeah i know what you're saying, i've already considered that, but the chain looks so healthy, if that's the right terminology, that i kind of feel a bit reluctant to gunge it back up again, but i'll probably have to use it as a process of elimination.
If my hearing wasn't so over sensitive it wouldn't be an issue but i can hear a pin drop from a mile away so to me it's overly irritating. 

WHAT, couldn't hear you!!

[darrsi]

Clean the oil off the chain, then put chain lube back on. See if the noise changes

Yeah i know what you're saying, i've already considered that, but the chain looks so healthy, if that's the right terminology, that i kind of feel a bit reluctant to gunge it back up again, but i'll probably have to use it as a process of elimination.
If my hearing wasn't so over sensitive it wouldn't be an issue but i can hear a pin drop from a mile away so to me it's overly irritating. 

WHAT, couldn't hear you!!

I heard you type that 

[darrsi]

Had to go to work on Sunday so when i got home and the chain was still warm i gave it a good spraying of Wurth chain lube to see if it makes any difference to the noise.


Lo and behold, on the way to work this morning the noise has reduced by as much as 70% i reckon.
I can still hear it a little bit but metal on metal is never gonna be silent, and because of how much quieter it is i probably never even noticed it before.


So at least it’s not actually a problem as such, just a bit annoying to hear, but it would seem the engine oil just free’s up every link so much that the chain plays a different tune to what i’ve always been used to. 

[darrsi]

Well that was shortlived 


I reckon that the journey to work this morning was enough to flick off any excess lube, then on the way home tonight the noise was a bit lively again.
Not as bad as before but it was still there, it’s just bloody aggravating. 

[Hedgetrimmer]

Have you tried earplugs?


Glue them all round the inside of the chain 

[Hugh Mungus]

Have you tried earplugs?


Glue them all round the inside of the chain 

Or better still, glue them into your ears.

[darrsi]

Poxy noise is getting more irritating, i'm now thinking it could be to do with the chain slider, maybe worn, but can't examine it or be sure without stripping it down which right now is a bit of a no no due to needing the bike at a moments notice.
There's no performance issues, and still no feeling whatsoever through the footpeg, so "i don't think" any harm is being done, but the whirring sound is a bit vexing.

[Hedgetrimmer]

You say that the noise stops when you pull the clutch in and that this rules out wheel bearings. But pulling the clutch in removes drive from the rear wheel, which removes a force applied; if the bearings are starting to fail, I think they would be affected by this. Obviously eventually they'd get to a point where it would be detected all the time, clutch or no clutch, but you wouldn't want it to get to that point.


I'd also look at condition of the cush drive rubbers, and I still can't help but feel the chain can't be ruled out yet.
My chain slider is pretty worn, grooved, but doesn't cause any noise, still has plenty of thickness to do its job. I reckon that's a red herring.

[darrsi]

You say that the noise stops when you pull the clutch in and that this rules out wheel bearings. But pulling the clutch in removes drive from the rear wheel, which removes a force applied; if the bearings are starting to fail, I think they would be affected by this. Obviously eventually they'd get to a point where it would be detected all the time, clutch or no clutch, but you wouldn't want it to get to that point.


I'd also look at condition of the cush drive rubbers, and I still can't help but feel the chain can't be ruled out yet.
My chain slider is pretty worn, grooved, but doesn't cause any noise, still has plenty of thickness to do its job. I reckon that's a red herring.

I changed the cush drive rubbers a few years ago just for the sake of it, but the ones i removed looked like fine anyway.
If it was rear wheel bearings would i not hear "something" spinning the wheel on the centre stand?
It spins very freely either way, with no binding or anything going on.

[Hedgetrimmer]

I changed the cush drive rubbers a few years ago just for the sake of it, but the ones i removed looked like fine anyway.
If it was rear wheel bearings would i not hear "something" spinning the wheel on the centre stand?
It spins very freely either way, with no binding or anything going on.

I'm quite particular about wheel bearings, as I've had a set fail catastrophically in far less than ideal conditions before. I also checked mine more recently (different bike) just using the "excess movement, spin wheel, check it spins freely, listen for noise" method. Seemed fine. Shortly after, took the bike for a service to have a bearing found to be on the edge of failure. What mileage is on the current bearings?


Remember that when you just spin the wheel by hand to check, the wheel is not under the load it would be from the engine, clutch out.