Union power

[Simon.Pieman]

Capitalism is about maximizing profit and to distribute it between the owners of the capital. The main way of achieving that is to minimise the cost of production, which in a labour intensive industry means reducing the workforce and suppressing wages.

I'd like to point out that there is nothing wrong with owning the capital. I could spend my free capital on a new motorboat but I have invested in a little import/export concern which currently has two lads working 3 days a week (soon to be 5 days)
 People can be a little too polarized when it comes to capitalism v socialism or whatever politic.

[VNA - BMW Wank]

Britain's five richest families worth more than poorest 20%

http://www.theguardian.com/business/2014/mar/17/oxfam-report-scale-britain-growing-financial-inequality

[mtread]

I'd like to point out that there is nothing wrong with owning the capital. I could spend my free capital on a new motorboat but I have invested in a little import/export concern which currently has two lads working 3 days a week (soon to be 5 days)
 People can be a little too polarized when it comes to capitalism v socialism or whatever politic.

And someone else will have had to have made that motorboat, providing employment.....
This isn't a 'capitalism v socialism' issue, it's basic economics. Nothing wrong with capital being reinvested, that's the point of it. But as I said, to maximise capital you have to either sell at a higher price, increase production and therefore demand, or reduce costs. Unfortunately, the latter seems to be in fashion. Hence the need for unions.

[esetest]

And eventually there is nothing left to cut , and your pot  is empty .

I'd like to point out that there is nothing wrong with owning the capital. I could spend my free capital on a new motorboat but I have invested in a little import/export concern which currently has two lads working 3 days a week (soon to be 5 days)
 People can be a little too polarized when it comes to capitalism v socialism or whatever politic.

And someone else will have had to have made that motorboat, providing employment.....
This isn't a 'capitalism v socialism' issue, it's basic economics. Nothing wrong with capital being reinvested, that's the point of it. But as I said, to maximise capital you have to either sell at a higher price, increase production and therefore demand, or reduce costs. Unfortunately, the latter seems to be in fashion. Hence the need for unions.

[mtread]

And I need to point out that one of the most successful British companies, John Lewis Partnership/Waitrose, is 'socialist'. A workers' co-operative, the board is made up of workers' representatives, and all of the capital produced by way of profits is shared amongst the workforce, not paid to shareholders.

[lew600fazer]

And I need to point out that one of the most successful British companies, John Lewis Partnership/Waitrose, is 'socialist'. A workers' co-operative, the board is made up of workers' representatives, and all of the capital produced by way of profits is shared amongst the workforce, not paid to shareholders.

So tell me do you bank with the Co op banking group then?????

[mtread]

Erm .......  I think you will find that since its last little 'problems' the Co-Op bank is no longer a cooperative, owned by its members 
Nearest comparison is a Building Society like the Nationwide. But anyway they are all members co-operatives, not workers co-operatives.
As a customer of the Nationwide, you own part of the organisation. As a customer of Waitrose you don't.
As an employee of the Nationwide, you don't own part of the organisation. As an employee of Waitrose you do.

[Slaninar]

And someone else will have had to have made that motorboat, providing employment.....

What do you need employment for in this level of tech advance?!


You make 100.000 fazers and close the factory gates for the next 10 years. Go fishing.


Make blue jeans for all the people.


Capitalism is all about stupid things - like 1000 models of cars, clothes, services, and I see ordinary people doing 2 jobs and not spending time with kids, wifes - which should be the priority. At this level of tech advance, people should work for 2-4 hours tops, everything else is fake. Doing jobs they don't like to buy the things they don't really need.

[VNA - BMW Wank]

What we seem to increasingly have is;

Multi-national companies that don't pay their corporation tax despite making massive profits, increasingly pay large sections of their workforce the minimum wage, now often on a zero hours contract, no paid holidays, no sick pay, no pensions, no benefits whatsoever, and whilst they stuff their boots with cash, those of us who are lucky enougth to have reasonably well paid jobs have to fork out via our taxes to support the employees of these big rich companies. 

[Hedgetrimmer]

And someone else will have had to have made that motorboat, providing employment.....
This isn't a 'capitalism v socialism' issue, it's basic economics. Nothing wrong with capital being reinvested, that's the point of it. But as I said, to maximise capital you have to either sell at a higher price, increase production and therefore demand, or reduce costs. Unfortunately, the latter seems to be in fashion. Hence the need for unions.

That's NOT basic economics. You increase production to suit an increase in demand. Increasing production does not create demand.

[lew600fazer]

Erm .......  I think you will find that since its last little 'problems' the Co-Op bank is no longer a cooperative, owned by its members 
Nearest comparison is a Building Society like the Nationwide. But anyway they are all members co-operatives, not workers co-operatives.
As a customer of the Nationwide, you own part of the organisation. As a customer of Waitrose you don't.
As an employee of the Nationwide, you don't own part of the organisation. As an employee of Waitrose you do.

The CO- OP bank is or was part of the Britainia Building society so as the members own the building socety they have a share in the CO OP bank do they not??

[richfzs]

Wrong way round, lew... The coop took over the brittania - brittania now exists solely as a trading name for the coop.