Author Topic: Bugger (Read 8085 times)

PaulSmith · « **on:** 16 February 2015, 11:03:28 am »

A little steam while waiting at lights, and some coolant on my boot when I got to work. There is no puddle under the bike which means either it is only a small hole, or it is empty

Gen1 just turned 60k. Commute home is about 16 miles. Suggestions appreciated.

tex · « **Reply #1 on:** 16 February 2015, 11:19:26 am »

Check the fan is coming on, should come on on start up, check the coolant level, top it up, should get you home, then look for a leak

Falcon 269 · « **Reply #2 on:** 16 February 2015, 12:34:00 pm »

Which boot? Or to be more precise, which side do you think it's leaking?

PaulSmith · « **Reply #3 on:** 16 February 2015, 03:27:08 pm »

I think(hope) it is the jubilee clip on the outlet hose on the left side. It looks like it 'sprayed', so the base of the rad (on the left side), the left headers, the left side of the oil filter and the left frame and my left boot all had coolant but it stopped (or is empty) now. I ran the bike for a while and the fan kicked in.

I have no idea how full or empty the resavour(sp?) is (how the foc are you meant to tell when it is positioned in the shadows and covered in road crude?)

At £45 for the hose and £11 for the clip, I think I will pick up some rad-weld on my way home.

Grayo · « **Reply #4 on:** 16 February 2015, 03:50:18 pm »

Quote from: PaulSmith on 16 February 2015, 03:27:08 pm

I think(hope) it is the jubilee clip on the outlet hose on the left side. It looks like it 'sprayed', so the base of the rad (on the left side), the left headers, the left side of the oil filter and the left frame and my left boot all had coolant but it stopped (or is empty) now. I ran the bike for a while and the fan kicked in.

I have no idea how full or empty the resavour(sp?) is (how the foc are you meant to tell when it is positioned in the shadows and covered in road crude?)

At £45 for the hose and £11 for the clip, I think I will pick up some rad-weld on my way home.

I have a set of hoses off a Gen 2 I can send you if you can adapt any of them to fit. Some of them have clips on too.

PaulSmith · « **Reply #5 on:** 16 February 2015, 04:01:18 pm »

Thanks Grayo, that is a very kind offer. If you don't mind, I will hold off until I know exactly what needs doing.

Falcon 269 · « **Reply #6 on:** 16 February 2015, 06:02:00 pm »

Quote from: PaulSmith on 16 February 2015, 03:27:08 pm

At £45 for the hose and £11 for the clip, I think I will pick up some rad-weld on my way home.

Radweld is for bodging rads in 60s era Fords and Austins. Has no place in a high performance motorcycle motor, IMHO.

Breakers yard for a good used hose and Halfords for a jubilee clip.

AyJay · « **Reply #7 on:** 16 February 2015, 09:15:17 pm »

The nearside hose that ends up near the sprocket gets exposed to a lot of chain oil and does perish. Mine was as soft as a raw skinless sausage after 60k miles.

Also, if it's a hole in the radiator, a good radiator repair company will be able to fix it. I had a whacking great hole punched in my £660 curved ZZR radiator by a big chunk of road debris and they managed to fix it for £60. That was the bargain of the year, I can tell you.

PaulSmith · « **Reply #8 on:** 17 February 2015, 11:35:46 am »

First problem is finding exactly where the hole is. Is it the pipe, the rad or somewhere else? Any suggestions?
My best idea so far is to refill the system and run the engine until it leaks again. At which point I will have super hot high pressure fluid spraying around. Not looking forward to it.

PaulSmith · « **Reply #9 on:** 19 February 2015, 09:24:25 am »

Well, I did a coolant change and and then added a rad-weld type gunk and it seems to have sealed it. I will keep an eye on it but so far, so good.

nickodemon · « **Reply #10 on:** 20 February 2015, 12:00:47 am »

The rads on the fazer are generally pretty good. i would be more inclined to look at hoses. I wouldn't have put a 'rad weld type gunk' in, as it's more likely to be a pin hole in one of the hoses. I generally avoid putting stuff like that in a motorcycle engine when rads can be repaired fairly cheaply and a hose ain't going to break the bank... Best of luck! Hope you get a permanent solution

PaulSmith · « **Reply #11 on:** 20 February 2015, 10:25:55 am »

What is the issue with using rad weld type stuff? You are not the first person to warn me off it but no one has given me a reason yet.

ChristoT · « **Reply #12 on:** 20 February 2015, 10:27:35 am »

Good way to bung up hoses or cooling passages, IMO.

PaulSmith · « **Reply #13 on:** 20 February 2015, 03:14:23 pm »

Quote from: ChristoT on 20 February 2015, 10:27:35 am

Good way to bung up hoses or cooling passages, IMO.

It would be a pretty focing useless for repairing radiators if it foced the radiators instead of repairing them, don't you think?

Fazafou · « **Reply #14 on:** 20 February 2015, 03:59:01 pm »

Quote from: PaulSmith on 20 February 2015, 03:14:23 pm

It would be a pretty focing useless for repairing radiators if it foced the radiators instead of repairing them, don't you think?

You're missing the point.

Radweld is an old 'get you home' product, the idea being you chucked it in, it sealed the hole and you got the motor back to then drain the system and sort the issue.

It's not really meant as a long term solution and can slowly start to bung up pipes and fine coolant channels. Also if your head gasket ever leaks you end up with it in your combustion chamber.

Motorcycle engines operates at much higher stresses than the engines radweld was originally designed for.

Choice is yours of course, it may not have any detrimental effect, but why risk it.

PaulSmith · « **Reply #15 on:** 20 February 2015, 04:13:28 pm »

Thanks, you are the first person to give actual reasons.

PaulSmith · « **Reply #16 on:** 20 February 2015, 05:22:12 pm »

I have been doing a bit of research and it seems that there are a lot of horror stories about using radweld, k-seal etc. on the net but they are usually from individuals who had a problem that either radweld couldn't fix, or having fixed their problem system, they later had a bigger problem and they believe radweld made it worse. Very few offered any evidence to blame radweld and I can't find any mechanics or dealers nay-saying it, but quite a few the recommend it (in moderation).

I think for the moment I will apply the same reasoning I would when using tyre gunk. It can fix a small problem, but not a big one.

Fazafou · « **Reply #17 on:** 20 February 2015, 05:23:15 pm »

No probs

You'll probably be fine for a while in all fairness, but worth getting it sorted properly when you get a chance.

nickodemon · « **Reply #18 on:** 20 February 2015, 10:29:43 pm »

Sorry i didn't get back to you sooner

Rad weld is to seal a leaking radiator, so you can get home. You don't use it for sealing hoses. The problem with this type of product is that it coats everything in the coolant path, so you will coat the coolant cylinder walls, hoses and of course the radiator. You should have tried replacing the hose that was leaking. I would have dried everything off then ran engine until hot and found leak. If it was the radiator - remove and get repaired. Rad weld is only a temporary repair.

PaulSmith · « **Reply #19 on:** 26 February 2015, 11:06:45 am »

Details

broken brackets equals broken rad

Update:

The radweld did its job, but didn't address the cause of the problem. Something you might want to check yourselves.

The fan for the radiator is held in a mild steel cage, mounted to the rad at three points. On of the holders had rotted through letting the edge of the cage rub against the back of the rad. This was probably going on for quite some time. When a second one gave out, the whole cage rubbed against, and eventually, through the rad. Apart from the hole the rad weld fixed, there are at least two other leak points. I have pulled the rad and am shipping it to a rad fixer place I have heard good things about, but I am not holding out much hope. I suggest you get out your torches and angled mirrors and check the back of your rads for damage before it is too late.

PaulSmith · « **Reply #20 on:** 12 March 2015, 10:33:54 am »

I am back on the road again

Happy days

Radfix is Galway did an excellent job sorting my radiator for very little money and mentioned that if it was totally borked, they would be able to build a new one for me by keeping the reservoirs and replacing the centre with one from a car radiator. (This wouldn't work for genII's because they use curved rads).

The fan proved to be more of a problem as there are very few available. I got mine from Holland were there were two, and I found one other in Italy and one in Poland.

nickodemon · « **Reply #21 on:** 12 March 2015, 05:12:00 pm »

Good stuff

Just in time for spring! That's the first time i have heard of the fan rotting, but it's good you have put it on the forum. I bet everyone with a high mileage fazer is out in the garage checking....

AyJay · « **Reply #22 on:** 12 March 2015, 11:08:23 pm »

Err, yeah... I'm off to the garage right now.....

Thanks for the head's up, Paul.

devilsyam · « **Reply #23 on:** 13 March 2015, 01:48:07 am »

Early r1 fan fits

PaulSmith · « **Reply #24 on:** 13 March 2015, 10:34:13 am »

At one point I was seriously thinking of making a new frame for the fan from an old biscuit tin, but I couldn't find one thin enough or rusty enough.

Thanks for the hint about old R1 fans, I am sure that will help somebody keep their baby on the road.