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+--- Thread: Cam timing - advice please! (/showthread.php?tid=68064)
Cam timing - advice please! - Lawrence - 05-04-14
Not sure this is right and would explain my shitty running, can anyone say for sure?
Thanks very much
Re: Cam timing - advice please! - Lawrence - 05-04-14
Actual cam lobes visible in these photos.
Re: Cam timing - advice please! - Fazerider - 05-04-14
The lobe position diagram in the manual is a little unclear and it's hard to judge accurately from photos, I'm suspicious of the inlet timing in particular though can't imagine it would be running at all if it's as far out as it looks to me. Can you see the timing mark on the cams?
Bear in mind the cams run at half engine speed so you may have to give the crank another turn.
Re: Cam timing - advice please! - Lawrence - 05-04-14
It's running like a complete sack of crap at the moment, won't go over about 55 mph. I'll take another look...
Cam timing - advice please! - Lawrence - 05-04-14
The black dots on the cam shafts line up exactly with the little prong things on the cam cap:
![[Image: va6etymy.jpg]](http://img.tapatalk.com/d/14/04/05/va6etymy.jpg)
The crank is lined up spot on too so looks like it's all good. It certainly looks off to me but if it's all lined up right...
Re: Cam timing - advice please! - His Dudeness - 05-04-14
It's hard to tell from your pictures, your eye has to be dead inline with the markings to get a true idea. Are you saying everything lines up correctly but it looks off? How's that?
Re: Cam timing - advice please! - Lawrence - 05-04-14
The marks line up when looking at them straight on, it just looks like the cams are out of position
Back to the drawing board I guess, either that or it's going on ebay.
Re: Cam timing - advice please! - unfazed - 05-04-14
If the dots on the cam and cam cap marks do not line up it is usually caused by a worn cam chain.
However the FZS600 will run happily with the marks out by the very small amount you have shown in the picture. The wear on my chain had the cam timing out by one tooth before I changed it and it still ran cleanly to the red line, but rattled like Foc
You certainly have the signs of a worn cam chain.
I think your problem is elsewhere.
What mileage is on the bike?
Did it happen suddenly or over a few weeks.
What did you change before it happened?
Check
Clogged air filter,
Something under the seat blocking the air filter inlet
Clogged fuel filter
Kinked fuel line
Some body put restrictors in when you were not looking :lol
Water in the fuel (a lot of it)
Intake manifolds leaking
Diaphragms perforated
Coil or plug cap issues Make sure caps screwed on the leads fully.
Loose or corroded electrical connections
Dodgy or worn plugs.
Valve clearances incorrect
Worn valve seats
Compression low
Check the simple things first as the list is almost endless.
Re: Cam timing - advice please! - Fazerider - 05-04-14
Ah! I've just worked out the difficulty I had with the manual drawing...
It's drawn as a plan view to show the timing marks, but inlet and exhaust are shown independently, so not as they actually appear when looking down on the top of the engine.
The end-on view showing the lobes has top at the left (indicated by the continuation of the construction line).
So your cams look as they should.
Re: Cam timing - advice please! - red98 - 05-04-14
From what I can see in the pictures..all looks good......cam marks have to be spot on with the prongs with the cam lobes on no1 cylinder facing away from each other, T mark has to align with the join of the upper and lower crankcases......have you had the cams out reacently ?
Re: Cam timing - advice please! - Lawrence - 05-04-14
(05-04-14, 01:22 PM)unfazed link Wrote: If the dots on the cam and cam cap marks do not line up it is usually caused by a worn cam chain.I'll get my compression tester in it if I can and see what that gives. Would be nice to get it back on the road at some point...
However the FZS600 will run happily with the marks out by the very small amount you have shown in the picture. The wear on my chain had the cam timing out by one tooth before I changed it and it still ran cleanly to the red line, but rattled like Foc
You certainly have the signs of a worn cam chain.
I think your problem is elsewhere.
What mileage is on the bike? 57k now
Did it happen suddenly or over a few weeks. fairly quickly but tbh I don't remember how long it took to get really bad
What did you change before it happened? Immediately before, nothing
Check
Clogged air filter, Haven't replaced it but I have taken it out completely as a test. No difference.
Something under the seat blocking the air filter inlet Checked. Still acts the same with the seat/rubber thing/airbox lid all off
Clogged fuel filter Don't think it's this as it's getting way too much fuel rather than not enough
Kinked fuel line See above
Some body put restrictors in when you were not looking :lol Pity it's not that easy
Water in the fuel (a lot of it) I've started it up a few times when the carbs were empty (after priming them first), if there was a lot of water I guess it wouldn't run at all as the carbs would only have water in them, no fuel?
Intake manifolds leaking As in the rubber carb-head bits? They looked ok last time I checked
Diaphragms perforated All ok. Also does it with a different set of carbs.
Coil or plug cap issues Make sure caps screwed on the leads fully. Coils and caps have been changed
Loose or corroded electrical connections Possible, I've checked everything I can get to and nothing looked corroded or discoloured
Dodgy or worn plugs. Changed
Valve clearances incorrect Never been done afaik, would this cause overfuelling like this?
Worn valve seats No idea, what would cause that?
Compression low I'll test it if I can get my tester in the gap...
Check the simple things first as the list is almost endless. Yeah I've found that already
(05-04-14, 02:37 PM)red98 link Wrote: From what I can see in the pictures..all looks good......cam marks have to be spot on with the prongs with the cam lobes on no1 cylinder facing away from each other, T mark has to align with the join of the upper and lower crankcases......have you had the cams out reacently ?Nope, never. Which is why I was worried if they were wrong, how had it happened.
Re: Cam timing - advice please! - unfazed - 05-04-14
Check the choke is working correctly and all the plungers return fully.
Check the float heights with a clear plastic tube attached to the drain hole. Hold it up the side and fuel should line up near the top of the float bowl. If looks wrong start the bike and the fuel should settle before getting worried :-)
If compression checks out then it looks like dirty carburettors, like the emulsion tubes or main jets
Pull all the connectors in the box under the tank and give them a quick spray of WD40.
Valve clearance would really want to out of adjustment by a long way to have effects on running.
As you have the cam cover off you may as well check them.