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+--- Forum: FZS600 Fazer (https://foc-u.co.uk/mybb/forumdisplay.php?fid=78)
+--- Thread: Dropping cogs (/showthread.php?tid=59650)
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Dropping cogs - Chrisgasman - 25-07-12
Help !!
Just bought a 2001 FZS 600 last week thought I had a gem, only 17,000 miles full service history one careful only just used for parish rounds etc etc. Hmm bike jumped out of second then won't select first loads of false neutrals, gearbox sounds terrible and to top it off back wheel locked solid during downshift and had to walk home get van and pick the bugger up ! Is there a common fault with these gearboxes ? Am I going to have to pull the engine out and replace the whole box if so are cheap recons available. Would appreciate any advice with this bike haven't had a chance to bond with it yet and now my wallet is sweating.
Cheers :'(
Re: Dropping cogs - Tiberius Onklevaart - 26-07-12
Nasty mate
Gearbox issues are rare with the fazer, but its not an easy fix if they do. If its shagged you'd be as well getting a new engine. My old one had a leak at the output shaft seal. A five pound part, but an engine out and split casing type scenario to do it right. Never done it in the end.
The issue you are having is a very unusual case, although I stand to be corrected on that cos I'm no expert. There are experts here tho and they'll give more definitive answers, but its generally accepted round here that if the gearbox goes, the chances are the engine will have to go to save money. Not looked in a while but you were looking at 300-400 for a good one traditionally.
It's a great bike and I hope that someone can give you some better news than I have but I've at least prepared you for the worst case I hope. Once you get it sorted you'll see you've been unlucky and somehow managed to catch a dog. They can take a fair amount of abuse and my current one has 100k on it. Previous was at 50k before I started breaking it, but the gearbox was sound, as is my current one.
Re: Dropping cogs - b3tarev3 - 26-07-12
If you've got the spanners here's a box for £50 http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Yamaha-FZS600-FZS-600-Fazer-03-Gearbox-/120940630436?pt=UK_Motorcycle_Parts&hash=item1c289f91a4#ht_640wt_1163 -
another £60 gets you a new base n head gaskets. If i was you i'd take it back to the arse that sold it to you!
Re: Dropping cogs - limax2 - 26-07-12
(26-07-12, 08:16 PM)b3tarev3 link Wrote: If i was you i'd take it back to the arse that sold it to you!I wonder if someone on this site is feeling a little guilty now? :o
Re: Dropping cogs - Fazer Jake - 26-07-12
personally i'd start with the basics, is the clutch adjusted correctly etc.
Re: Dropping cogs - darrsi - 26-07-12
If you buy a 'working' bike in good faith you shouldn't need to be doing anything like this at all, even more so with such low mileage on a known reliable bike.
I dunno who you got it from but i would seriously consider having a word with them, because it all just sounds a bit dodgy to say the least!
Re: Dropping cogs - AdieR - 26-07-12
Did you buy privately, or from a dealer?
If you've bought from a dealer, go back to them and see what they say. Some dealers will provide a warranty of sorts on a used bike.
If you've bought privately, "caveat emptor" tends to apply, ie its mostly up to a buyer to know what they're buying and the questions to ask. If it's a private sale, it's not impossible that it's been sold due to clutch / gearbox problems.
Re: Dropping cogs - Fazerider - 27-07-12
Gearbox problems are not unusual on the FZS600.
Second gear is the one most likely to have difficulty engaging fully. If it doesn't go in solidly it tends to drop out into a false neutral, damaging the dogs further each time this happens.
The first engine I had was a bit prone to this, but it was manageable... I could usually tell whether the clunk as I changed up from first was solid enough, if it felt dodgy I'd back off and try again or short-shift up to third.
My second engine was an absolute pup. Bought it second hand off a guy who'd bought it to replace his own (which had second gear problems), but he'd never got round to fitting it. So I couldn't really complain when it turned out that second gear on it was totally shagged- would not only drop out of gear if you asked it to transmit more than about one horsepower, but made it a fight to get past second up into third.
I replaced that one a couple of years ago with one from South-West Motorcycle Salvage, just asked if he knew the box on the engine he was flogging on eBay was good- he said he couldn't vouch for it, but had another one which, though high-ish mileage, was good. And he was as good as his word, it's turned out to be fine and has done a total of around 60,000 miles.
I agree with the other comments: it's certainly worth getting back to the seller about it even if it was a private sale.
The last thing I'd do is attempt to repair the box, it's a massive task unless you're used to doing that sort of job. Swapping an engine is hard enough work for most people.
Re: Dropping cogs - Chrisgasman - 29-07-12
Cheers for your help I bought it privately and spoke to the bloke and I think he was genuinely gutted about it but sold as seen and it was fine for the first 10 miles so just unlucky I guess. going to pull the lump out with a friend and see what's inside then decide on what to do will definitely look at that gearbox for £50 though cheers. Think its going to get a respray and a belly pan at the same time, might as well do it properly if its coming to bits !! :\
Re: Dropping cogs - CRH - 29-07-12
(29-07-12, 02:01 PM)Chrisgasman link Wrote: Cheers for your help I bought it privately and spoke to the bloke and I think he was genuinely gutted about it but sold as seen and it was fine for the first 10 miles so just unlucky I guess. going to pull the lump out with a friend and see what's inside then decide on what to do will definitely look at that gearbox for £50 though cheers. Think its going to get a respray and a belly pan at the same time, might as well do it properly if its coming to bits !! :\....sorry matey!!...but i think you will find he did know what was wrong with it??....10 miles after buying it?? :rolleyes ....may be sold as seen but i do think if you had persued it you would defo have a case for your money back!!!!!!!!!!!!.....personaly i would have returned it and parked it between his fkn legs
......its going to end up being a costly fazer when youve finished!!!!!!!!! :\ ...........
Re: Dropping cogs - darrsi - 29-07-12
Yeah, i have to agree with CRH on this one, i don't believe for one second that he never knew there was a problem!
Surely if the bike managed only 10 miles then it was not fit for purpose? And unless he explicitly told you it had a dodgy gearbox when taking your money then i would think it was a case of misrepresentation.
I must say though you seem to be taking this all very well. If it was me i would not be very happy at all.......
Re: Dropping cogs - AdieR - 29-07-12
Private sale - therefore you'll have little comeback, hence the age-old advice "if you're not sure, take a clued up mate with you".
Buying from a (decent) dealer tends to cost a bit more - but it'll give you a point of contact if you need it, and some may provide some sort of interim warranty (I got 2 months when I bought mine in March).
A seller doesn't necessarily need to inform you of the bad points - its up to a potential buyer to ask the right questions in which case the seller is obliged to give you an honest answer.
Private sale "caveat emptor" http://www.bikelawyer.co.uk/mcn-law-columns/private-sale
Re: Dropping cogs - darrsi - 29-07-12
Lawyers are the biggest bunch of liars going, they certainly know how to bend the truth in their favour!!! :rolleyes
Even if he'd taken someone with him, d'ya think they would've picked up on that problem without taking it for a test ride, in which case he'd have had to hand the money over anyway AND legally be insured??
If that'd broken down on the test ride that would've become his problem instantly, so i'm presuming it was all done in good faith without a ride?
This just sounds like a wrong'un to me, plain and simple!
I find it difficult to believe this was just a case of very bad luck, i had the false neutral problem and it's something that started gradually and got worse over time, NOT all hell breaking loose over 10 miles.
Re: Dropping cogs - misterjayb1 - 29-07-12
Smell a rat my self.... The Buyer does say tho bike was ok for 10 miles so how would seller have known?.. Me personally would have gone straight back but does say in black and white you havnt got a leg to stand on...
Re: Dropping cogs - AdieR - 30-07-12
"Sold as seen" - says it all; its even more reason to beware when buying. It's a sellers favourite way of passing the buck (aka "I'm having trouble with it / I can't guarantee it'll work as intended and don't want to spend the time / money to put it right, so someone else can have the problem instead").
Re: Dropping cogs - darrsi - 30-07-12
I'm actually scared to ask the question how much the bike cost?
At 17,000 miles i doubt it was a total bargain?
Re: Dropping cogs - Lawrence - 31-07-12
(29-07-12, 07:07 PM)AdieR link Wrote: Private sale - therefore you'll have little comeback, hence the age-old advice "if you're not sure, take a clued up mate with you".
Buying from a (decent) dealer tends to cost a bit more - but it'll give you a point of contact if you need it, and some may provide some sort of interim warranty (I got 2 months when I bought mine in March).
A seller doesn't necessarily need to inform you of the bad points - its up to a potential buyer to ask the right questions in which case the seller is obliged to give you an honest answer.
Private sale "caveat emptor" http://www.bikelawyer.co.uk/mcn-law-columns/private-sale
Afaik legally they don't have to tell you it's been written off unless you ask. If they don't lie, they've not done anything wrong.
Re: Dropping cogs - darrsi - 31-07-12
Now we're crossing over to a moral issue aren't we?
It's all about having a conscience or not, or if you are simply the type of person to blatantly rip someone off and not give a monkeys about it!!! :rolleyes
Re: Dropping cogs - Lawrence - 01-08-12
(31-07-12, 02:05 PM)darrsi link Wrote: Now we're crossing over to a moral issue aren't we?Yep, but when it comes to flogging something that's about to cost them a lot of money, most people will forget certain details.
It's all about having a conscience or not, or if you are simply the type of person to blatantly rip someone off and not give a monkeys about it!!! :rolleyes
Re: Dropping cogs - darrsi - 01-08-12
Lawrence, you wouldn't be a lawyer by any chance would you? :lol