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+--- Thread: Restricted??? (/showthread.php?tid=71639)
Re: Restricted??? - ChristoT - 27-02-15
(27-02-15, 11:32 AM)Silverlegacy link Wrote: I might have to have a look at this and see if it can be done?
I have tried looking on google for any good pictures of carbs to see if its possible, but not much luck?
Has any one done any work on carbs to know if this would be the case or is there just too much in the way internally? to get a clear view?
Its either that or wait til next week to get it dyno'd
Sorry, but won't work.
The plunger (sure the name is wrong, but sod it) needs a vacuum on the engine side to draw it up, and allow fuel past the needles. All the throttle does is open a butterfly valve that increases the area, hence air/fuel flow into the engine.
Put it this way - if it weren't for the plunger, you could flood the engine by twisting the throttle with the motor off. And you won't get anything like a good enough view through to check washers.
My advice? Find a local foccer with a 600, and ask them to ride your bike. They'll know what a full power 6 should feel like! Plus, free!
Re: Restricted??? - Silverlegacy - 27-02-15
Thanks for that ChristoT.
I live in Cannock Staffordshire, so don't kniw if anyone even remotely close to me.
Looks like I might just have to wait til next week to get it dyno'd.
Although I did manage to get an Alan key on the far left carb rubber and pry it back enough to look in and there was no washer, so unless it's a genuine Yamaha one, then it's back to square one.
Re: Restricted??? - imax - 27-02-15
Thunderpantz is fairly local to you
Re: Restricted??? - Ruby Racing - 27-02-15
(27-02-15, 05:17 PM)ChristoT link Wrote: [quote author=Silverlegacy link=topic=16061.msg185025#msg185025 date=1425033146]
I might have to have a look at this and see if it can be done?
I have tried looking on google for any good pictures of carbs to see if its possible, but not much luck?
Has any one done any work on carbs to know if this would be the case or is there just too much in the way internally? to get a clear view?
Its either that or wait til next week to get it dyno'd
Sorry, but won't work.
The plunger (sure the name is wrong, but sod it) needs a vacuum on the engine side to draw it up, and allow fuel past the needles. All the throttle does is open a butterfly valve that increases the area, hence air/fuel flow into the engine.
Put it this way - if it weren't for the plunger, you could flood the engine by twisting the throttle with the motor off. And you won't get anything like a good enough view through to check washers.
My advice? Find a local foccer with a 600, and ask them to ride your bike. They'll know what a full power 6 should feel like! Plus, free!
[/quote]
Thought the restrictor might be on the air box side. It was just a thought.
Pretty sure it's called the slide, but I like plunger better! LOL
Re: Restricted??? - ChristoT - 27-02-15
(27-02-15, 08:02 PM)Ruby Racing link Wrote: [quote author=ChristoT link=topic=16061.msg185059#msg185059 date=1425053847]
[quote author=Silverlegacy link=topic=16061.msg185025#msg185025 date=1425033146]
I might have to have a look at this and see if it can be done?
I have tried looking on google for any good pictures of carbs to see if its possible, but not much luck?
Has any one done any work on carbs to know if this would be the case or is there just too much in the way internally? to get a clear view?
Its either that or wait til next week to get it dyno'd
Sorry, but won't work.
The plunger (sure the name is wrong, but sod it) needs a vacuum on the engine side to draw it up, and allow fuel past the needles. All the throttle does is open a butterfly valve that increases the area, hence air/fuel flow into the engine.
Put it this way - if it weren't for the plunger, you could flood the engine by twisting the throttle with the motor off. And you won't get anything like a good enough view through to check washers.
My advice? Find a local foccer with a 600, and ask them to ride your bike. They'll know what a full power 6 should feel like! Plus, free!
[/quote]
Thought the restrictor might be on the air box side. It was just a thought.
Pretty sure it's called the slide, but I like plunger better! LOL
[/quote]
A thought indeed, but no, it restricts total flow. If not, you could in theory flood the engine while riding.
Like I said - on the slide, couldn't be arsed to double check!
You knew what I meant, ergo, mission accomplished! :lol
Re: Restricted??? - Silverlegacy - 03-03-15
Hi All,
Had the bike Dyno'd today.
I spoke to the guy who said that its not restricted and that everything seems to be running ok, probably pushing around 80+bhp.
He did say that at the rev range i mentioned (6k+ rpm) there was a lean spot, which is why the bike bogged a bit there and said that if i wanted to solve it i should get a dyno kit and have the jets sorted? although this is like £100 for kit play £200 labour to sort it and re dyno run it.
Dont get me wrong, i do love the bike but don't really want to spend that much getting a niggle issue sotrted.
Is there any other solution that might help alittle? they are a dyno dealer so probably just looking for a bit of extra business, where as my old mechanic said there wasnt really anything wrong with the bike and if alls thats wrongs with it is its running a bi t lean mid range then i can always put up with it.
I know people have mentioned air filter changes. but i dont really know what effect that will have ? I dont know much!! lol
Re: Restricted??? - Paulfzs - 03-03-15
they run lean as standard
k&n filter + new exhaust.
fixed.
Re: Restricted??? - Silverlegacy - 03-03-15
(03-03-15, 02:59 PM)Paulfzs link Wrote: they run lean as standard
k&n filter + new exhaust.
fixed.
What exactly is running lean? is that the air fuel/mixture out?
if so which way? too much fuel? too much air?
I dont know when the last time the carbs were serviced so not sure if there just dirty and jets a bit clogged up??
Re: Restricted??? - noggythenog - 03-03-15
Messing about with jets on this bike is pointless.
But a small lean spot does t quite describe your initial description which sounded much worse.
Like Paul says a k&n wont do it any harm, equally dont bother but i really think that letting another "insured" foccer have a spin is your best plan now. Sounds like it could be more in your mind like it has consumed you a bit and is just stressing you out.
A carb balance is much better idea imo than just fitting other bits like air filters.
Did the garage geezer take it for a spin or anything, obviously he hasnt said anything alarming.
Re: Restricted??? - Silverlegacy - 03-03-15
(03-03-15, 03:07 PM)noggythenog link Wrote: Sounds like it could be more in your mind like it has consumed you a bit and is just stressing you out.
A carb balance is much better idea imo than just fitting other bits like air filters.
Did the garage geezer take it for a spin or anything, obviously he hasnt said anything alarming.
Your probably right about that.
Maybe my old Fazer was just really good and notice the little things more on this expecting it to be the same.
I did a carb tune on it about 2-3 weeks ago, improved it a bit.
The garage guy didn't say much else, just said about it running lean around mid range, then discussed dyno jetting and the cost.
He said if you don't mind putting up with it, it's ok and that the bike was in ok condition and nothing major wrong with it.
So maybe it's me just over thinking it and my daily commute doesn't really give me chance to open it up much so maybe it's just a bit clogged up?? Someone said give it some stick to help clear out the carbs? Not sure if that works?? Lol
Thanks for all the help though.
Re: Restricted??? - Paulfzs - 03-03-15
more fuel than air, they did it for emissions or some jazz like that.
get a k&n itll help tons! needs more airflow.
exhaust and k&n will remove that problem.
before i changed to k&n i made some holes in my air filter and took it for a quick blast and it removed 99% of the flatspot k&n cured it.
Re: Restricted??? - Silverlegacy - 03-03-15
No he didn't mention emissions but I'm picking bike up later so will ask a few questions and see what else I can find out.
The air filter looked in ok condition but maybe just a cheap copy of original. So might try bodging it to see before I buy a k&n.
I've still got my carb tuner so might re check carbs after as well.
Re: Restricted??? - Paulfzs - 03-03-15
they run lean coming out the factory.
dont ride it for miles with holes in the air filter itll suck grit into the carbs just a little blast to see.
get a k&n anyway.
Re: Restricted??? - Silverlegacy - 03-03-15
I typed in "lean running" into Google and it said " when there is more air than fuel" and running rich is " more fuel than air"
So as my bike is running lean, does that mean I need to cut down on the amount of air?
Re: Restricted??? - Paulfzs - 03-03-15
(03-03-15, 04:05 PM)Silverlegacy link Wrote: I typed in "lean running" into Google and it said " when there is more air than fuel" and running rich is " more fuel than air"
So as my bike is running lean, does that mean I need to cut down on the amount of air?
sorry confused myself
replace where i wrote lean with rich
Re: Restricted??? - Silverlegacy - 03-03-15
Ok. Thanks paulfzs.
So if air filter won't help anymore? What you think? Carb clean ?
Don't really want to go down the jetting route??
Re: Restricted??? - Paulfzs - 03-03-15
carb clean will help but the air filter will help.
you cant jet a fazer many have tried and failed and gone back to original jets.
Re: Restricted??? - Silverlegacy - 03-03-15
Think I will swap out the filter anyway.
Think I've read on here about attempted jetting that's why I would rather avoid it and spend the money on stuff that might actually work.
Re: Restricted??? - Silverlegacy - 03-03-15
Just spoke to garage and he pretty much said the same as earlier and hopefully dyno shows this.
Running lean at between 6-7k rpm.
Re: Restricted??? - darrsi - 03-03-15
Had my bike jetted, and Dyno'd, but it jut didn't run right so I had it put back to standard and it then ran fine again.