Author Topic: Bike wont start (Read 3008 times)

gasmanxxxr1 · « **on:** 17 December 2016, 06:00:26 pm »

Firstly, hello to everyone, i'm a long time lurker on this site, many useful topics and threads have helped me so far with my bike so thanks for all the great reads and manuals and how to's

I have a 2001 600 fazer

This morning it started on the first time of asking with the choke right out.

As i was putting my helmet on etc i eased off on the choke, a couple of seconds later it slowly dropped revs and cut out. Started again and went through the same performance, it cut out again when i eased off the choke.

Its turning over but not firing into life

I checked the battery and it was fully charged, battery is 6 months old. New full tank of premium fuel in her.

I checked the spark plugs next and they where sparking put looked past the change date, the plug in number 3 was only half in, the washer was jammed and kind of cross threaded, this plug was very mucky and corroded, probably because it was loose all this time.

So i have changed all the plugs.

Took the fuel tank off and visual checked all lines where connected, all electrical connectors connected.

With trying to start it so many time the battery has run down to 12.2v so ive got it on charge as we speak.

Now it won't start at all and after all day messing about im stumped.

Some background on the bike.

Ive owned it 2 months, the previous owner had it 2 years and did all of 100 miles in that time. It's got 16,000 on the clock.

Its had new oil and filter, new K&N air filter and now new spark plugs since ive owned it.

When i put it in the garage last week after a 2 hour ride it seemed to be ticking over at 4000 rpm rather than 1200, not sure what was going on there.

Thanks for reading this long post and thanks in advance for pointing me in the right direction

Chris

Fazerider · « **Reply #1 on:** 17 December 2016, 06:46:07 pm »

My guess is that the carbs are clogged from having stale fuel in there. Some folks swear by magical potions you can pour into the tank that will remove all the nasty gunk, but personally I favour taking things apart and cleaning them properly.
Once they're cleaned and balanced it should be much happier.

gasmanxxxr1 · « **Reply #2 on:** 17 December 2016, 08:38:38 pm »

Thanks Fazerider,

I have run a bottle of stp through the tank in the first 2 weeks of owning the bike, any ideas where i should start tomorrow.

Is a full strip down clean needed on the carbs

darrsi · « **Reply #3 on:** 17 December 2016, 08:47:11 pm »

You might wanna read my post in the General section about starting problems, you never know, it might help.

gasmanxxxr1 · « **Reply #4 on:** 17 December 2016, 09:07:04 pm »

hi darrsi

thanks for that bud. When you had that problem and it wouldnt start, was it like the kill swith was activated as in you hit the start button and nothing happens?

My bike is turning over and visually i have a spark, its sounds like its gonna start but the engine just doesnt fire in to life

Thanks for the help so far, not going to be able to sleep tonight, just itching to start work on my bike :-)

darrsi · « **Reply #5 on:** 17 December 2016, 09:38:32 pm »

With mine the bike would turn over but not catch to start.
Eventually it would then catch but after an almighty backfire.
Main culprit so far is looking at water in the fuel system.
Try putting the bike on the centre stand and see if that helps.

bandit · « **Reply #6 on:** 17 December 2016, 10:07:17 pm »

Defo sounds fuel related as said,make sure your fuel tap is fully on under tank & make sure that you give the black pipes 3 iirc underneath the bike by the exhaust/center stand a good tug down whenever you remove or lift the tank or you risk getting a face full of fuel when you next undo the tank cap as pipes can get kinked.
Draining the float bowls might help,by undoing the drain screws with a correct descent fitting screwdriver.

gasmanxxxr1 · « **Reply #7 on:** 17 December 2016, 10:34:51 pm »

Thanks guys

Im strongly leaning to a fuel related problem, can the fuel filter be serviced at all?

It does everything but run if you know what i mean.

Gonna drain the fuel bowls on the carbs tomorrow

My fuel tank only has the fuel hose attached, there are 2 further pipes that look like the should have hoses attached. I think i read somewhere that 2001 onwards bikes dont have the hoses.

Going to try to disconect the hose from the fuel pump and see if i get fuel from then when it tries to start, squirt some carb cleaner in the spark plug holes and gennerally here, there and everywhere

darrsi · « **Reply #8 on:** 17 December 2016, 10:40:43 pm »

Fuel filter is located right under the tank, you'll have to undo the top plate but it's easy enough to see.
Probably easier to remove the tank as well, but they're only a few quid, worth changing anyway.
Unlikely to be the issue but worth eliminating anyway.

Out of curiosity, what RPM does the needle sit at when warm?

Jules-C · « **Reply #9 on:** 17 December 2016, 10:57:55 pm »

Try opening the petrol cap before trying to start it. That way even in breather hoses are linked they aren't a problem starting it.

Does the fuel pump click for about 5 seconds when you turn the ignition on after leaving bike for a while. If it only clocks once or carries on clicking for ages it could be fuel pump problem.

Do you give it any throttle when trying to start it? Try pressing starter button with throttle closed and smoothly open throttle up so it takes about 3 seconds to fully open while pressing starter button.

gasmanxxxr1 · « **Reply #10 on:** 17 December 2016, 10:59:26 pm »

After starting the engine and letting it warm but without riding 1250 rpm, like i said after a ride out last sunday it seemed it had gone to 3000rpm just sat at traffic lights, i thought at the time i must investigate that.

How hard is it to get at the carb needles, i had the fuel tank off to day, my fuel tap passes very badly needs a refurb i think

gasmanxxxr1 · « **Reply #11 on:** 17 December 2016, 11:02:11 pm »

Hi jules

Thanks for taking the time to post, and all those who have so far, really appreciate it.

Fuel pump seems to click normally.....i think

I will try your throttle idea in the morning too, felt like i tried everything today.

I went to the garage at 10am this morning to take her for a spin, at 3.30pm i gave up trying ;-)

darrsi · « **Reply #12 on:** 17 December 2016, 11:08:40 pm »

If you use the choke, try about a third of the way BEFORE starting it, then adjust once started (if it starts) to just over 2000rpm.
Don't try and use it after starting as it all gets a bit messy.

Graham53 · « **Reply #13 on:** 17 December 2016, 11:58:31 pm »

Have you checked the carb rubbers ? If it's been idle for a long time the rubber may have deteriorated or cracked and have you got all of the rubber caps from the vacuum gauge hose fittings ? One might have been loose and come off somewhere

Jules-C · « **Reply #14 on:** 18 December 2016, 04:12:29 am »

It sounds like the fuel not getting through. It sounds wrong but if the carbs are slightly starved of fuel the idle speed can rise as the mixture gets leaner.

A problem with one carburettor shouldn't stop the engine from starting if the other 3 are ok, I would expect it to run but very rough if two carbs were working. I would concentrate on making sure the fuel is getting to the carburetors first before starting to take things to pieces

gasmanxxxr1 · « **Reply #15 on:** 18 December 2016, 10:05:43 am »

She started!!

First thing this morning, no choke and slowly opened the throttle whilst pushing the start button, took 3 attempts but got there in the end.

Thanks Jules-C for the top tip.

Seems as if she was flooded, clouds of white smoke and strong smell of petrol that cleared after about a minute.

I still have a question though, she has always need the choke to start. When i started her today she idled at 2500 rpm, like when i went for a ride last week, why has the idle speed changed from 1200 to 2500 rpm with seemingly no input from me?

My theory; the bike has been sat for a long while before i bought it, old fuel old gunged up etc. I put several tanks of premium fuel and fuel additive and do about 400 miles, everything is now freed up and clean, might need to readjust the idle speed to allow for this. Any thoughts.

Massive thank you to all who contributed and those who took the time to read through all the posts

Chris

bandit · « **Reply #16 on:** 18 December 2016, 10:28:06 am »

Let the bike warm up then adjust idle down to 1200-1250rpm hopefully you should have a steady tickover give it a couple of blips on the throttle let settle & recheck idle speed.

darrsi · « **Reply #17 on:** 18 December 2016, 02:50:38 pm »

What is the needle like on idle, is it quite stable or a bit bouncy?

gasmanxxxr1 · « **Reply #18 on:** 18 December 2016, 03:57:43 pm »

Adjusted the idle to 1200rpm seems stable

darrsi · « **Reply #19 on:** 18 December 2016, 04:11:24 pm »

Was wondering if your choke might be sticking in the on position.
That would explain flooding and high revving.
Might wanna get a bit of WD40 around where parts move on the carbs when you adjust the choke.

gasmanxxxr1 · « **Reply #20 on:** 18 December 2016, 07:18:19 pm »

Good point darrsi, it did feel like the action wasnt very smooth when i was trying yesterday.

Just spent all afternoon riding my bike, Basingstoke-Winchester-Alresford-Alton-Basingstoke.

Truly wonderful bike to ride

slappy · « **Reply #21 on:** 18 December 2016, 08:07:39 pm »

I would also check the choke cable for free movement, disconnect at carb end and see if it moves freely and easily, choke cables are often neglected .

tommyardin · « **Reply #22 on:** 18 December 2016, 08:41:51 pm »

Quote from: slappy on 18 December 2016, 08:07:39 pm

I would also check the choke cable for free movement, disconnect at carb end and see if it moves freely and easily, choke cables are often neglected .

The choke cable drops downwards after leaving the handle bars and rises again just a bit before turning 90 degrees towards the outer cable anchor point at the carbs.
My coke was getting stiffer in its action until one day it just snapped. water had got into the outer sheath and had got trapped there causing the inner to rust through.
Bought new cable pulled the inner wire out and liberally covered it with water proof red rubber grease before fitting it to the bike.
I found the choke lever at the handle bar end of the cable a bugger to fit, but the other/carb end is fine.