No and no because they are not common sense - again extreme arguments, leg protectors and BHP limits are not no brainers - buying a jacket with armour or leather trousers is an obvious gain that enhances your riding experience as it makes you less likely to injure yourself, leg protectors and BHP limits will do that but also considerably affect the riding experience.

 

so stuffing your head in a piece of fibre glass doesn't affect your riding experience

and wearing a T-shirt has nothing to do with image, it's about the riding experience and feeling connected.
Experiencing the wind getting a proper sense of the speed you are travelling at and generally being more aware of what you are doing, and not feeling insulated in a false sense of sercurity provided by a few bits of textile leather and plastic.

Read the stuff on risk compensation and maybe you'll get it.

Oh and on the helmet thing ask your helmet manufacturer about increased neck and spinal injurieswhen wearing a helmet. oh and hope those magnificient leathers of yours magically stop the internal organ ruptures so common in motorcycle accidents.

Like I said, it's what's in the skull that keeps you alive, not what's wrapped around it.




 

got yer,,, yer bugger 

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o#o Why Ride a Motorcycle?

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I welcome compulsory protective clothing

I guess that you would have welcomed the compulsory 100BHP limit and compulsory leg protectors when they were proposed and existed, even thou that leg protectors was proved to move injuries further up the body.

They were regarded as commons sense safety proposals and that time to protect those idiots that ride around on 2 wheels instead of being safely tucked up in a side-impact airbag filled coc0on totally detached from their surroundings car.

MAG drew the line at the Helmet law for a reason, they could see that it could be the start of the racheting of bikes out of existence, due to safety issues.

Well after hanging around this board for about 9 years,
Started the new board as Sunny Intervals but decided to be me again.
 I've finally ended up with a Fazer ( It's just a rumour that I'm the place bikes come to Die Meldrinkgone  )

Some of you know me and those that don't will probs get to know me now that I've been extradited from Weegieland.

Always thought of you on a Black R6 Helen 

That's Spring Meet weekend Bert, would love to do both,(  finances permitting) can I move to make it a week later

Funney this should come up on here.

And this come my way a few days ago


https://scriptonitedaily.wordpress.com/2013/05/06/uk-government-launches-legal-review-of-assisted-suicide-in-bid-to-end-longevity-trap/


make sure you read the very last line.
But with the Tories Net contributor thing they bang on about, how long before living too long would make you a Net loss.

As a biker I wouldn't deny anybody health care, coz if you start that chit how long before we as bikers have to carry extra health care insurance because we don't travel in a safety cage, had that chit when I was a courier with life insurance policies, coz it was regarded as a dangerous occupation along with scaffolders and many other jobs.
And how long would it be before we  start regarding those born with a disability as a liability, If they require life long care, would we start treating human life as a farmer treats livestock, financial outlay of medical treatment not outweighed by the Net gains.

Yea blue LEDS lighting engine is really tacky.

But Red LEDS lighting the rear wheel now that's different 

I would say time money and space if you are doing it yourself.

I never manage to get a complete triangle, Currently have time and space but no money 

No fun in it, if you just pay somebody to do it for you.

Go read the Tony Foales explanation and you may see what I'm trying to say very badly 

http://www.tonyfoale.com/Articles/Balance/BALANCE.htm


Equilibrium is achieved when the angle of lean is such as to balance the two opposing moments, the one due to centrifugal force acting outward, and the other to gravitational force acting downward (both acting through the C.of G.). The actual angle, which depends on the radius of the turn and the speed of the machine, is that at which the resultant of the two forces passes through a line joining the front and rear tyre contact patches. This is the steady-state roll axis. But how do we actually initiate the turn - do we lean or do we steer first? Let's see what happens with each method. If we turn the handle-bar in the direction in which we want to go, both centrifugal force and the front wheel precession would cause the bike to topple outward, and that leads to gravel rash. But if we momentarily try to turn the bar quickly in the opposite direction, (sometimes known as counter steering) then these two forces will combine to bank the machine to the correct side. Gravity will then augment the banking effect and this, in turn, will give rise to gyroscopic forces helping to steer the front wheel into the curve, whereupon the processes for maintaining balance as described above take over and keep the bike on our chosen path. This is all very well, I hear you say, but if this is the way to corner, how come we can steer a bike no-hands. Well, it certainly is possible to do so, but only with a lot more difficulty. Precise control and tight turns are difficult to accomplish without handle-bar manipulation. Just try it! Let's consider the no-hands situation. As we saw earlier, simply banking the bike steers the front wheel in the correct direction automatically, through precession. But how do we make the bike lean in the first place, what do we have to push against? There is nothing solid to push against and so the only way to apply bank (without the facility of steering), is to push against the machine with the inertia of our own body. This means in practice, that in order to lean the bike to the right, we must initially move our body to the left. So now we have two possible methods of initiating a turn, and it is interesting to note that in both of them (banking and reverse handle-bar torque) our physical effort is in the opposite sense to that which might be thought natural, but when learning we adapt quickly and the required action becomes subconsciously automatic. It is these reverse actions that require us to learn to ride in the first place, when learning most of us wobble about out of control until our brain latches on to the fact that counter-steering and counter-leaning is the way to do it. Once the brain has switched into reverse gear, it becomes instinctive and is usually with us for life, and we could return to riding after a long layoff with no need to relearn the art of balancing or steering. So which of these two possible methods of initiating a turn do we use in practice? We probably subconsciously combine both methods, and the pressure on the inner handgrip is partly forward (counter-steering) and partly downward (banking). Remember though, that the actual counter-steering movement is very small, since gyroscopic precession depends for its strength on the speed of movement not on the amount of movement. If you still don't believe that steering to the opposite side works, then next time you are out riding, try jerking the bars quickly to one side, and see what happens. Leave yourself plenty of road if your reactions are a bit on the slow side. Do this at about 40 mph., and don't blame me if you fall off. The relative proportions with which we combine the two methods depend partly on riding style but also on speed and machine characteristics. For example, a heavy machine with light wheels at low speeds demands a different technique from that applicable to a light weight machine with heavy wheels at high speeds, and hence the two machines will have a different feel. But humans adapt quickly and the correct technique soon becomes second nature. It may seem strange that in the above discussion no mention has been made of such important parameters as, steering geometry, wheel and tyre size, wheelbase, frame stiffness and so on. This is simply because, balance and the ability to start and maintain a turn can be achieved within a wide range of these parameters. That is not to say that these factors are unimportant. We shall now look a little more closely at one of the more important parameters that come under the heading of steering geometry, i.e. TRAIL. Consider first fig.4, which shows the basics of steering geometry.

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ME Troll  Never 

Just goes to prove my point about hard to explain,
Admittedly the handle bars rest thing may have been a little to glib.
When I first saw Counter Steering mentioned on here I envisioned Speedway style cornering, I just couldn't get my head around this pushing the bars opposite direction thing as it always gets explained. so I wandered off and did some research.

http://www.tonyfoale.com/

Tony Foales explanation was the one I found the best and he calls it Counter weighting.

People will instinctively move their bodies & twist their hips & to some extent this will assist with cornering but the majority of the work is done with the Bars & moving the body actually only improves the push on the bars.

This is true but people do not realise this. Tony explains this well, I don't know what the CBT is like now I did mine over 25 years ago, but remember when you had to salon thought the cones this is where riders should be picking the the idea and feel for countersteering I was taught by a Police rider all those years ago on the old BMF rider training scene and it was only years later after reading the Police Riders handbook that I realised that I had been taught a lot of what was in the book from day one of my training Couple of hours on a Weds evening and Sunday mornings.

Presuming you aren't just trolling, next time you're out, find a long straight bit of road (motorway, dual carriageway etc) where there isn't much traffic about and with as little as possible pressure from your hands on the bars, try the following:

1) Try steering the bike with your waist and hips.

2) Gently push on the right bar and see which way the bike goes, then try with the left.

See what happens.

At what speeds ? and do I shift my weight or do I read this literally and just push the bars without shifting weight ?

Like I said in my original reply, this explanation doesn't work for me, read what you have written literally and try it.
I prefer to say do some Wits/GP Racer weaving. then people don't focus on the one aspect of the steering process, and just try to weave and start to countersteer as they would naturally.

Trying to explain riding a bike by the written word is like trying to explain walking or swimming by the written word it, is very complicated.
Try putting one foot in front of the other to walk, without shifhting weight bending knees and ankles and moving your arms, yet everybody says walking is easy.
You just put one foot in front of the other ??????