old - Fazer Owners Club - old
General => General => Topic started by: Hedgetrimmer on 27 July 2013, 12:54:23 pm
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Has anyone done this just finding hotels as you go? What are the good and bad points of doing it this way? Is there a website with biker-recommended hotels around Europe? Thinking of maybe next year if I can scrape together the dosh. Not decided on any definite route, would like to free-wheel it if poss. Avoiding the more expensive options, what's a realistic budget for, say, 2 weeks, without being totally strapped? And does anyone else fancy joining me (give me a bit more motivation/enjoyment)?
Would be nice to keep this thread running as a general touring-abroad hints and tips page.
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Nick,
I toured Europe with my good lady last year (in the Saab). We booked the more expensive places, like Amsterdam, Venice and Florence. That way we knew we were going to stay somewhere nice and not get ripped off. The smaller places en-route, like in the Alsace, south of Germany and Austria, we found along the way. We also took a small tent just in case we found ourselves in the middle of nowhere at silly o clock. Which we did, a few times. We also had the tablet with us, so if we found that on the day prices for a hotel were expensive in a particular town, we would go get a coffee and jump online and find the best deal for that hotel :D . Did that a few times too.
I would budget at least £100 per day, including your fuel. You can go ahead and add the cost of getting over the water on top of that too. We spent around £7G in 3 weeks, but we had a blast. We scrimped for 2 years for that holiday and we planned to come home with nothing more than memories and a full camera roll. Job done.
Pros of booking in advance - You now exactly how much your accommodation is going to cost and you can determine the standard you are going to be staying in as you go. 5* all the way, or budget with a treat at the end of each week, whatever you decide is best. You can also read reviews on places and pick exact locations based on things you would like to see and do whilst away (probably not everyday on the bike).
Cons - You have to find your accommodation, sometimes passing several places on the way. Some places you book online are not as central as you may have though (or they said).
Pros of finding as you go - You are totally free to do what you like.
Cons - Sometimes you find yourself passing by town after town after town without wanting to commit to anywhere (incase the next tow is better, and usually is, once you drive through it in the morning :lol ). You have no idea how much it will cost. Getting on and off the bike to ask hotel tariffs in 40 degree heat is going to get old fast. So a few time you will probably over pay just because you are dun for the day.
I find a mix is best. A rough route with a few set places for peace of mind, and a few days of "as the wind blows".
I am off to the Nurburgring with a friend on September 13th. We are touring Holland, Germany, France and a day in Belgium. I have booked a house in Nurburg for 3 day, from which we can explore the region (Koblenz, Bonn...), an apartment I stayed in last year in south Germany (Tenningen) for 2 nights (a day at Europa park and not on the bike) and our last night in Amsterdam. The rest of it we are just hitting the road. About a 60/40 split.
Hope this helps
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I agree withadeejaysdelight, although I dont bother with a tent.
Following on from this thread, http://foc-u.co.uk/index.php/topic,9093.0.html (http://foc-u.co.uk/index.php/topic,9093.0.html)
This place is in Braunfels in Germany from €27 a night for a single room, not onsuite but own bathroom down the corridor. Their other rooms are onsuite.
http://www.amturm.de/motorradprogramme/preise/index.html (http://www.amturm.de/motorradprogramme/preise/index.html)
Just a pub with rooms above but friendly place. Fantastic setting next to the castle.
There are some real gems out there off the beaten track.
Part of a group of hotels linked to Biker Connection.
http://biker-connection.road-concept.eu/regionen_touren.html (http://biker-connection.road-concept.eu/regionen_touren.html)
Most places in Germany are biker friendly I've found.
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Nick,
I toured Europe with my good lady last year (in the Saab). We booked the more expensive places, like Amsterdam, Venice and Florence. That way we knew we were going to stay somewhere nice and not get ripped off. The smaller places en-route, like in the Alsace, south of Germany and Austria, we found along the way. We also took a small tent just in case we found ourselves in the middle of nowhere at silly o clock. Which we did, a few times. We also had the tablet with us, so if we found that on the day prices for a hotel were expensive in a particular town, we would go get a coffee and jump online and find the best deal for that hotel :D . Did that a few times too
I would budget at least £100 per day, including your fuel. You can go ahead and add the cost of getting over the water on top of that too. We spent around £7G in 3 weeks, but we had a blast. We scrimped for 2 years for that holiday and we planned to come home with nothing more than memories and a full camera roll. Job done.
Pros of booking in advance - You now exactly how much your accommodation is going to cost and you can determine the standard you are going to be staying in as you go. 5* all the way, or budget with a treat at the end of each week, whatever you decide is best. You can also read reviews on places and pick exact locations based on things you would like to see and do whilst away (probably not everyday on the bike).
Cons - You have to find your accommodation, sometimes passing several places on the way. Some places you book online are not as central as you may have though (or they said).
Pros of finding as you go - You are totally free to do what you like.
Cons - Sometimes you find yourself passing by town after town after town without wanting to commit to anywhere (incase the next tow is better, and usually is, once you drive through it in the morning :lol ). You have no idea how much it will cost. Getting on and off the bike to ask hotel tariffs in 40 degree heat is going to get old fast. So a few time you will probably over pay just because you are dun for the day.
I find a mix is best. A rough route with a few set places for peace of mind, and a few days of "as the wind blows".
I am off to the Nurburgring with a friend on September 13th. We are touring Holland, Germany, France and a day in Belgium. I have booked a house in Nurburg for 3 day, from which we can explore the region (Koblenz, Bonn...), an apartment I stayed in last year in south Germany (Tenningen) for 2 nights (a day at Europa park and not on the bike) and our last night in Amsterdam. The rest of it we are just hitting the road. About a 60/40 split.
Hope this helps
Looks like some good advice there - many thanks.
I'm thinking about it now to give myself as much time as possible to get the money together (although still got to spend a fair bit on the bike and some new gear yet this year), and get some ideas of how I really want to do it. I've done a fair bit of UK touring with the tent now, camping is just starting to get a bit old for me now (read I'm getting a bit too decrepit for camping!), but the idea of taking a small tent and basics "just in case" sounds like a good one. I definitely won't be able to afford the more expensive hotels, just as long as I can get a good night's kip (without having to worry about whether I'll still have a bike in the morning!) and shower facilities etc. I think I'll sit back and let this thread roll (if it will), plenty of time to pick up some more tips.
I did consider some of the guided biking tours just to get me going, but don't like the idea of having mileages pre-set for me every day, as these old broken bones sometimes just scream to me "enough for today!" and would like to have a rest day here and there when I need to.
Two weeks is probably going to be realistic for me money-wise, although if I could find a way to extend it, I would of course. Still, can't see a whole continent in one trip! The Alps and/or Dolomites would be high on my priority of areas to see (love the mountains!).
And thanks for those links Phil (just caught before posting this).
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I've only done one guided holiday in Morocco. If the group gets on well and is all the same riding standard, no problem. If someone in your group is very slow its a pain in the arse.
Now I remember it, I did get caught out by not pre-booking another time. All of the hotels in Gent Belgium were full, I think the tour de France was visiting or something like that. Next town on the way back home was Bruges and that was 90% booked out. Luckily a hotellier in Gent looked on booking.com for me, otherwise it would have been dark by the time I found somewhere.
I spotted this place on the outskirts. £100 a night. The most expensive place Ive ever stayed at on tour, but it was unique.
http://www.booking.com/hotel/be/kasteel-ten-berghe.en-gb.html?aid=337733;sid=315fb1d0b138e1952f7e1fc8f0bb1522;dcid=1 (http://www.booking.com/hotel/be/kasteel-ten-berghe.en-gb.html?aid=337733;sid=315fb1d0b138e1952f7e1fc8f0bb1522;dcid=1)
If you want to wing the acommodation on the way, Id say have a look on booking.com first in the general area to see if there are any busy times like trade fairs/shows/major events on.
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pros to booking ahead
you know you've got a room for the night
you know what it's going to cost.....roughly
you choose where you want to stay
cons
you have to find the bloody place
if you decide you like it there, generally you can't stop longer as the room is let
if the place is a hole.....you've booked, tough
the laissez-faire approach
pros
you're not tied
cons
you might spend 2hrs going around biarritz trying to find 'reasonably priced' accommodation at 10pm (there is some, but you have to book it!)
my advice would be book the major stops/places she has expressed an interest in going and wing the rest.
at least in europe you get treated like a human being when you turn up on a bike!
if you have a vague itinery then perhaps the combined wisdom and knowledge of the forum could offer some advice as to places to stop.
finally, if you are stopping in 1 area and touring out, then hiring a gite (in france) is a cost effective option if split between 4 or more.
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i've been to Europe quite a few times (short and longer breaks), i camp and tend to clock miles but not at the detriment of my enjoyment.
I posted this up on a couple of other forums:
For me i want to get a decent way into Europe (Alps) without too much cost. You can stay in hotels (most exp), youth hostels (i have done this very cheap in many countries), adlers, zimmers, pensions, apartments, guesthouses. In the ski resorts and off of the beaten track some can be cheaper (euro25 /night in the summer, when business is not skiers). I generally camp though - between 8-22 euro a night. Why camp? well 90% of sites always have space for a tent and my overall costs are 25% lower. Problems with camping: amount of kit to carry, can be wet/cold, can be a pain if in transit to pitch/strike camp each day. I do have a routine. A bloody good tent also means quite pitch/strike times and plenty of dry space (I have an Italian tent, a Brenner, made for alpine climbers)
I also take a folding gas stove, so i can brew-up and eat hot food when i like. If i dont take it i spend 30euro a day on food drink minimum.
Your bike needs to be in decent fettle: i don't get it serviced beforehand (some do, I just stick to standard service routines), but i do check everything over and make sure i am not going to end up stuck on the side of the road (obviously always a chance). I do take a puncture repair kit.
Also i dont think i'll do 400miles everyday - going down i did 850 miles from bristol to southern Germany on day 1, but after this i did mostly lower mileages and avoided motorways. The first time i went into europe i thought yeah i'm gonna do munich-vienna-bratislava-berlin etc, but it was just silly, all you are gonna see is white-lines and tarmac. The roads you want to ride will be away from motorways, but you will need them to cover large distances. Remember you may want to visit a lake, castle, shopping district, historic town or whatever - arriving at 3pm to leave again at 9am the next morning will not allow you to do it properly.
I never worry about travelling alone, i enjoy it and always seem to meet people on my travels. I have been on holiday with my mates and sometimes having your own schedule is easier than compromising with someone else.
Remember there may be days when riding is not what you want to do (a break, the weather) so i try to camp in or near to towns - this bit is easier if you are hotelling etc.
HTh
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After many tours to Europe my preference is to have one place as a base (or sometimes a two centre holiday). Spend one or two days getting there and then unpack and relax. As a first tour I would suggest the Ardennes and Eiffel mountains area or the Harz mountains. Some of the self guided tours can be a gentle introduction into touring abroad as they usually include ferries, hotels and routes http://mcitours.com/selfguided_motorcycle_tours/ (http://mcitours.com/selfguided_motorcycle_tours/).
For the Ardennes/Eiffel area you could stay somewhere like Aarchen or Trier, you can do the Mosel valley and Nurburgring form same place. Its only 3 to 4 hours from Zeebrugge or Rotterdam/Hoek Van Holland, a bit more from Calais. There are a few biker type hotels/guest houses in the area @ around 35 - 40 Euros a night.
The Harz is about 5 to 6 hours from the Dutch and Belgium ports or a full day from Calais. I took 8 hours to get from the Harz to Europort Rotterdam going across country (just using motorways in Holland) going through an area called the fazerburgland (not sure of the spelling)
I have just got back from a week in Germany on my own and had a brilliant time, I did two nights in the westerwald and three in the Harz. In the Harz I stopped at the Pension Roesneck run buy a British couple, it cost 35 Euro a night for a single on suite room and beer was 2.5 Euro for a .5L bottle. I can highly recommend it and they also loaded up routes around the Harz and other destinations on my GPS for free. Its located in the middle od bad lauterburg which has lots of good restaurants and bars. The area has loads to see and do if you need a day off the bike. [size=78%]http://www.harzbiker.co.uk/ (http://www.harzbiker.co.uk/)[/size]
[/size]Here is a better video of the Kyffhauser, one of the more intense roads in the Harz (There are loads and loads of others all mostly empty), I must sort out how to imbed the video rather than just the link.
http://youtu.be/VGqVyhC6Il4 (http://youtu.be/VGqVyhC6Il4)
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Yes, I think I like the idea of using a couple of bases so I don't have to do mega-mileage every day. Maybe 2 days to get to 1st destination with an overnight at the midway point. Then 3-4 days at 1st destination with rideouts from there. Then move to 2nd destination and repeat. Then 2 days return journey. That all sounds like a nicer pace, with more time to take in the scenery. Could this be the start of a plan?!! :eek
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Sounds like the start of a plan to me. Now all you have to do is decide on what you fancy seeing/doing on the mainland or a theme (racing/historical/bike manufacturers/WWll...) and go from there :D
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The latest issue of Ride has a free tour guide to France. I've flipped through it, there are some nice looking ones there.
Of course, I'm biased, but the Normandy and Brittany route looks nice. The first overnight stop is Dinan; my hometown. Some really lovely roads around there! And the scenery is just phenomenal.
If you go to Dinan, and if you like cider, be sure to pick up a couple of bottles of Val de Rance. It's made in a factory 5 minutes from Dinan, and has won prizes worldwide to boot! Ask Exup and Dead Eye what they thought when they sampled some of the bottles I brought back last time! ;)
Day three of that route would take you near Porcaro, and the Madone des Motards (14th and 15th of August) if you go then too!
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France I would definitely like to see a bit of, but the Alps has to be my first priority. I love the mountains, which is why I always head to Scotland/Wales/Lake District when I go in the UK. Northern France is a bit more accessible so I feel I can put it off a little longer. I like the idea of visiting some historical Norman sites and exploring some of the river valleys, so maybe in time. :)
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In May we did:
Friday: Finished work at lunchtime, rode Derby to Canterbury, stayed over night in Travel lodge. Pub.
Saturday: Ferry to Calais, ride to Luxembourg (beautiful). Highly recommended as an overnight stop if your in the area, nice city, German style bars, cheap drink and petrol. Stayed Hilton.
Sunday: Ride south through Germany, bit of a play on auto ban (135mph!) and through Black Forrest region (beautiful, great fast roads) and in to Switzerland (stunningly beautiful). Stayed Zurich Best Western.
Monday: Ride across Switzerland (did I say it's beautiful?), up and over the alps, 2100m climb, snowy at the top, then drop down via a hardcore pass in torrential rain in to North Western Italy. Stayed near Milan.
Tuesday: Ride West to East across Northern Italy around Lake Como and through a 30km tunnel! Through Dolomite Italian Alp region. Stayed in a fantastic and friendly hotel in Trento (best AND cheapest of the trip).
Wednesday: Headed North via Bolzano, up and over Alps once more, via a snowy pass, dropping down in to Austria (beautiful), then on to Stuttgart in Germany.
Thursday: Back to Luxembourg, more booze.
Friday: Back to Calais, Ferry, then carry on home to Derby (about 550miles in one go!)
This was a first European tour, and we learned a lot.
Firstly, we certainly did too many miles in too short a time. 2,200 miles in eight days. I'm accustomed to high millage, and for the most part I enjoyed the riding tremendously despite minor discomfort, but there were times when it was painful.
But then again the route did give me a fantastic perspective on Western Europe as a whole which I didn't have before despite having visited many of these places by air travel.
We knew certain key areas which we'd targeted were going to be scenic with great roads, but I was genuinely surprised that perhaps 80% of our (fairly carefully planned) route led us through stunningly beautiful scenery with often thrilling roads - even those parts we had considered just motorway miles necessary to get where we were going surprised us.
Having seen so much on the first trip, I have a better perspective on where I'd like to revisit on a second. The areas that really stand out are Luxembourg, the Black Forest region of Germany, Switzerland and North Eastern Italy (dolomites). These were all stunningly beautiful with amazing roads - I'm also very much in to the rugged twisting beauty of the mountain road and these fit the bill perfectly.
Bear in mind that you can't really ride through the Alps, naturally the roads are passes and as such tend to be focused on getting from one side to another. And so if Alps are your thing then you really need to be thinking in terms of criss-crossing them from one country to another. But there are may great passes on which to do that - lookup the Stelvio pass if you fancy one of the more challenging ones!
In terms of cost, we had budgeted £1000 and came in a little under. I don't think that's bad for such an adventure!
We did hotels because not everyone in the group was comfortable camping, and a minimum of 4 star because one person in particular has too much money and is kinda stuck up. :rolleyes That was about £50/night for accommodation - you can get the Hilton for that in most of these places if you book a couple of months in advance, although personally I prefer somewhere with a bit more character. But The main reason for choosing the big hotels was parking security, we took a long chain and chained all four bikes together each night.
If I were to do it again I'd consider mixing in a bit of camping to reduce costs, with pit stops at hotels to freshen up. But it all depends on what suits the group as a whole.
I think I spent about £260 on petrol. Certainly less than 300. Being on a budget it all went on the credit card, which made it easy to total up and work out some figures. Incidentally if my calculations are correct it worked out at 72mpg, but I haven't mentioned that before because it sounded too good to be true! I spent the least, the group consisting of a FZS 600, FZ 800, some sort of Honda 1000 and ZZR 1400.
Spending money was minimal because we were knackered at the end of the day. I'd like to think next time I'll have more energy for a few drinks and a nice meal in the evening, but these trips are more about the days then the evenings, and if you've tired yourself out then I tend to view that as a good sign.
I wrote more than expected, but could carry on, there's so much to say. You mentioned you might invite others along? If once you've done your research you decide you'd like to do that then I may well be keen, but would have to let you know nearer the time, subject to holiday, funds etc of course. If you fancy a shorter tour meanwhile then hit me up any time - I nearly got in touch after you posted about your Welsh tour but couldn't get away from work that week. Same goes to anyone, I'm always up for an adventure.
Have a great time, and enjoy planning it, it's part of the fun :)
Andy
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Good post Andy. That does sound like too much mileage in a week for me nowadays, would be looking to ease the pace down a bit on a Euro trip, don't want it to be a chore. Yes I'm aware that Alpine riding means criss-crossing the mountains via passes. This is where I need to know more. Is it feasible to do day trips from one place, heading out into the mountains, maybe doing a loop via 2 passes to return to same destination in a day, or would that be too long a trip? Frankly, as it's the scenery I'd be going for, I wouldn't mind doing there-back rides on the same road.
Otherwise, I'd have to have another rethink, with overnights in more places? Which is fine as long as I don't have to do silly miles every day.
Your overall budget (under £1000) surprises me, and makes the whole idea seem more do-able, although I'd try to allow for more than this so I could relax a little with the spending. Plus, depending on what places I find, I certainly wouldn't be looking for outright luxury.
Camping is OK, it's just that if the weather turns sour it can spoil what could be a trip of a lifetime for me. Plus all the extra weight and bulk you'd have to carry, packing/unpacking every time you move etc. I haven't totally discounted it yet, but not sure it's how I'd want to go.
I'd certainly welcome anybody else to join me. Although all my UK trips I've done alone, it would add that extra dimension to have some company to share the enjoyment with. But I should warn you - I won't be trying to get the fastest possible times on those mountain roads! In fact, others could get fed up with how often I want to stop to get the camera out! Technically challenging roads don't daunt me, because I'm happy to take things slow where it's more sensible to do so. I'm happy to let the GSXR crews go sailing past in a blur!
My Welsh tour turned out to be a bit of a flop! I was so knackered after doing the Lofo ride on the Sunday, riding to Wales on Monday with an evening ride out, steaming hot sunshine with no relief and the tent an oven when I got back to it in the evenings - and the shower block on the campsite was the same, so I didn't feel particularly refreshed even after a shower. Then got home to find I'd come down with a viral infection! So you didn't miss much there.
But lots of time to plan (and save) yet. Haven't even figured out what would be the best time of year to do it in.
But thanks for your post, every one so far has been a great help in showing me what's best and what to avoid.
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Good post Andy. That does sound like too much mileage in a week for me nowadays, would be looking to ease the pace down a bit on a Euro trip, don't want it to be a chore. Yes I'm aware that Alpine riding means criss-crossing the mountains via passes. This is where I need to know more. Is it feasible to do day trips from one place, heading out into the mountains, maybe doing a loop via 2 passes to return to same destination in a day, or would that be too long a trip? Frankly, as it's the scenery I'd be going for, I wouldn't mind doing there-back rides on the same road.
Otherwise, I'd have to have another rethink, with overnights in more places? Which is fine as long as I don't have to do silly miles every day.
Your overall budget (under £1000) surprises me, and makes the whole idea seem more do-able, although I'd try to allow for more than this so I could relax a little with the spending. Plus, depending on what places I find, I certainly wouldn't be looking for outright luxury.
Camping is OK, it's just that if the weather turns sour it can spoil what could be a trip of a lifetime for me. Plus all the extra weight and bulk you'd have to carry, packing/unpacking every time you move etc. I haven't totally discounted it yet, but not sure it's how I'd want to go.
I'd certainly welcome anybody else to join me. Although all my UK trips I've done alone, it would add that extra dimension to have some company to share the enjoyment with. But I should warn you - I won't be trying to get the fastest possible times on those mountain roads! In fact, others could get fed up with how often I want to stop to get the camera out! Technically challenging roads don't daunt me, because I'm happy to take things slow where it's more sensible to do so. I'm happy to let the GSXR crews go sailing past in a blur!
My Welsh tour turned out to be a bit of a flop! I was so knackered after doing the Lofo ride on the Sunday, riding to Wales on Monday with an evening ride out, steaming hot sunshine with no relief and the tent an oven when I got back to it in the evenings - and the shower block on the campsite was the same, so I didn't feel particularly refreshed even after a shower. Then got home to find I'd come down with a viral infection! So you didn't miss much there.
But lots of time to plan (and save) yet. Haven't even figured out what would be the best time of year to do it in.
But thanks for your post, every one so far has been a great help in showing me what's best and what to avoid.
I've done similar stuff to Andy's post too. I have used bolzano as a base camp; from there you can do a whole load of mountain passes and then return to Bolzano, meaning you are not constantly pitching and striking camp. Stelvio is an hour to the west, the passes of the Dolomites start 45minutes to the east.
Last year i did 13 days and it ran me £850. I'm off on thursday and have 2 returns booked 1@ 14 days and 1@21 days so i can decide how things are going - the worst it will cost me is £1100.
The weather in the Alps (excluding bavaria, which is a beautiful place but can be wet) tends to be hot/dry in the day and thundery in the evening [sound familiar?!]. having said that I have got soaked, but having a decent tent and hard luggage helps.
Everyone rides at their own pace, the sportsbike fellas are not the fastest, the Austrians on BMs tend to set the pace - they are used to the roads and also have the suspension to iron out an bumps.
When I go on thursday day one, barring delays I intend to be in Freiburg im Breisgau (google it) by 8pm, leaving Bristol at 600am, after this i'll be doing far less miles unless I pick an entirely different route between now and then!).
here's my trip from last year:
http://s695.photobucket.com/user/pilninggas/library/2012%20trip%20to%20the%20Alps?sort=3&page=1 (http://s695.photobucket.com/user/pilninggas/library/2012%20trip%20to%20the%20Alps?sort=3&page=1)
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That looks fantastic Pilninggas. That's the kind of scenery/roads I'm looking to experience! Mountains are like magnets to me - I'm either riding round them or trekking through them (in this country, anyway). In my next life, I think I'll learn to climb, too! Have a good trip on Thursday, look forward to seeing/reading an extensive account when you get back :)
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Now we have a rough idea of what you are looking for, oppenau just off the b500. There's a lovely b&b that let you use their garage and it was €15pp a night. Fantstic roads, baden-baden to the north, freiburg/titisee to the south, vosges to the west
for alps, davos as a base, hotel with witches all over it was €40 a night, but when you have done 40 alpine hairpins, you'll be sick of them! Check to see if the passes are open, many are shut up to may.
Vosges, geradmer as a base (gite) weather can be funny.
Ardeche
ligurian alps
julian alps
pyrenees
grossglockner
eiffel region
knock yer socks off!
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If camping is reduced cost, not the thing of choice, something you like, prefer - than DON'T DO IT - it's a holliday.
I love camping. In some places it can be more expensive than cheap accomodation.
If traveling in the summer time, when it is nice and warm, you can camp near the water. Put a tent up at night, remove it in the morning - you can go unnoticed, without fines or having to pay (do it outside camp sites, of course - and a bit away from the road).
Most money is spent on petrol these days - it's becoming more and more expensive.
My dream was to go to the seaside on a motorcycle. When I arrived there, put up a camp and used it as a "base" to go to the local beaches, swim everyday. Touring Europe, as a continent, not seasides, seems OK, but I'd much rather do it on a bicycle - get to feel and see more of the countryside that way, take it slower. If I had long enough holiday that is.
Travelling alone is perfect when all is well. I travel most of the time alone. But in case something bad happens, it is good to have at least one man/woman you can trust.
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In the Harz I stopped at the Pension Roesneck run buy a British couple.
Lovely couple, Jackie and Greg (and their dog Bailey) I've known them for a few years and usually manage to get over to the Harz once a year to see them. I was there just over a month ago for a week and rode with Greg everyday, as you no doubt know already he is a very fine rider indeed and to follow him is an education -no chicken strips on my Yamaha when I left! I got home via Kassel then on to Koln, Antwerp, Brugge then Calais. I should have retraced my route over there though, from the ferry I headed for Heidelberg where I stayed the night then took the glorious, twisty ans scenic '27' North to the Harz. I can thoroughly reccomend the Pension Roseneck, you need to book in advance though.
Pass me another Schierker......
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As i've mentioned in another thread i'm off to Munich in August to visit my Niece and her family but will be flying down and hiring a bike. Then i'll have the days to myself to visit as much as possible in and around southern Germany. I think Stelvio is about 450KM's away so might try to visit that. I really must sit down and get my itinerary sorted.
Mickey
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[size=78%]If you go to Dinan, and if you like cider, be sure to pick up a couple of bottles of Val de Rance. It's made in a factory 5 minutes from Dinan, and has won prizes worldwide to boot! Ask Exup and Dead Eye what they thought when they sampled some of the bottles I brought back last time! [/size] ;)
I think we need to teach Christo to drive a car so he can fill the boot up and bring some of this Cider back to Blighty?
Mickey
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Fireblake, Neuschwanstein Castle is well in range and a great ride down. A ride around that area you will find some of the most spectacular "sound of music" scenery. It is a stunning part of the world.
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[size=78%]If you go to Dinan, and if you like cider, be sure to pick up a couple of bottles of Val de Rance. It's made in a factory 5 minutes from Dinan, and has won prizes worldwide to boot! Ask Exup and Dead Eye what they thought when they sampled some of the bottles I brought back last time! [/size] ;)
I think we need to teach Christo to drive a car so he can fill the boot up and bring some of this Cider back to Blighty?
Mickey
I have panniers!! :lol :lol :lol
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We've just planned an end to end trip across the uk. So far, for 3 of us, it has cost around £500 for accommodation for a week. And that's just a night in each place and they're not fancy or anything.
We booked all the places in advance on recommendation from a friend who has done the winging it approach previously. His experience of winging it on the continent was several hours spent looking for a good place to sleep, and quite often getting charged an inflated rate, particularly the later in the day it got.
Depends what you want to do, maybe book your key places and rough it/camp in between. Wild camping is acceptable on the continent! I'd at least chuck in one of those tiny backpacking stoves to brew up in between stops if its really rural!
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Or another option for those who don't want to tour but have fun days out blatting around great roads.
A, pick a region off a Michelin map that has lots of green scenic routes.
B, go online and find a hotel that suits somewhere in the middle of the region.
C, hire a long wheelbase high roof van with two mates, load three bikes and all the clothes/riding gear you might need and drive straight to hotel.
D, next morning get up have breakfast then have a day out riding a pre planned route following all those green roads.
Get back to hotel for dinner and beer.
E, next day do it all again :)
Not the cheapest way I know, but my preferred method as I don't really like "touring" with loads of luggage on the bike.
I love it because it's like Sunday morning blast's that last all day on fantastic roads. :)
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I stayed at the Pension Roesneck in early May. As mentioned before, it is highly recommended. Greg knows most of the passes over the Alps and would give you routes to ride if you wanted them. We travelled through Holland, Germany, Austria, Switzerland, France and Spain. Apart from Pension Roesneck we just found B&B's when we were getting tired. My mate went the year before so had a few he had visited before which helped. A top tip we found was find a tourist information centre as they had good B&B's on their lists and could ring them to check price and availability. We budgeted on 100 Euros per day for fuel, food and accomodation which was about right plus the cost of ferries. The Swiss Alps for me was the highlight of the trip. Just to warn you of extras, Mont Blanc tunnel is 27 Euros, The cable car to the top of Mont Blanc is 50 Euros and the train to the top of Jungfrau is 160 euros. Check the view online before you splash the cash! :)
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My favourite stop is in kauernetal in west tyrol, situated close to switzerland, italy and germany.Close to stelvio, lots of swiss passes, passo de rombo etc. BUT its all down to weather my friends....pre booking is IMO out as its too easy to pick the wrong week ! My advice is to watch the forecast and go on spec . You will always be able to find a space in a hotel. Much much harder for a big group...maybe then you will have to pre book and risk it.
Prebooking I mean , like months in advance to suit holiday dates.
My ideal is to just go when austria has settled weather. IF the weather is good, there is no finer area to ride than tyrol and switzerland. If its wet ....uh uh. You have to have the dry weather. period.
Cost wise my favourite hotel does half board for around 70 quid a night , with great food and reasonable drink prices.Fuel in austria is one of the cheapest too, and its a country totally dedicated to the tourist and is mostly biker friendly.
But you have to have the weather....believe me, in 5 seperate visits I have had only smatterings of dry weather interspersed with cloud or rain. All because we prebooked a tour and had to take what came.
Yet its just 1 overnight stop from calais to get there, so it is possible to just go on spec.
Switzerland btw is very expensive to stop eat and drink, far cheaper in neighbouring austria !
Northern spain and possibly the french alps are the nearest thing to guarenteed settled weather booking in advance, but even then it does rain there from time to time !
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Yes, that's the problem with mountain regions. They generate their own weather systems and you just have to live with what you get. Have heard stories of climbers pitching close to their intended routes and then having to wait for weeks until conditions were right. In some years, those conditions never materialise, and they end up packing up and going home having achieved nothing. I've been really lucky with the weather on UK trips to Scotland, Wales & the Lakes so far, but I suppose that luck can't last forever. And of course, the Alps are a bit more extensive/extreme compared to our own little hills.
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Toured Europe every year since '93, most trips have been a mixture of pre-booked and 'see where we end up' Usually start looking for accommodation around 4:30pm -only twice have we struggled to find somewhere but always managed.
In June this year we did a 10 day/2500 mile trip staying in Heidelberg, Livigno, 3 nights in Imola for WSB, Grindelwald & Cochem. Room prices between 35-60 euro. Cost worked out at approx. 100 euro daily...thats room, food, fuel.
July we headed off for 18 days/3800 miles, Goslar, Dresden, Krakow, Debrecen, Brasov, Bruck An Der Leitha, Kistelek, Schlusselfeld & Brodenbach. Room prices between 35-70 euro. Cost worked out at approx. 85 euro daily, cheaper as had 4 days sightseeing & food/drink considerably cheaper in Poland, Hungary & Romania.
Going back to Brodenbach end of the month for Nurburgring WSB, done a 4 night deal with Hotel @ 35euro night.
If you end up on the Autobahns don't use the service stations, follow the Autohos signs...they'll take you to a Truck stop..much better ;)
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Debrecen, Brasov,
Nice 1st post. I'm heading that way next month. Is most of Hungary flat and boring or is there plenty to see along the way. I guess Romania has plenty of accommodation in the touristy parts, but what about elsewhere? Any highlights/lowlights from either countries?
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Debrecen, Brasov,
Nice 1st post. I'm heading that way next month. Is most of Hungary flat and boring or is there plenty to see along the way. I guess Romania has plenty of accommodation in the touristy parts, but what about elsewhere? Any highlights/lowlights from either countries?
Bukk Mountain area in North very nice, first time in Hungary and impressed- clean, cheap, well surfaced roads, will be going again next year to explore.
In Romania you'll only find accommodation in towns not in small villages, food & people fine but roads & traffic horrendous. Approach roads to Transfaragaren pass horrendous, Dracula's Castle near Brasov with a visit.
I won't be in a hurry to go back.
Oh.. Money, you will need local currency contrary to advice I was given.
Enjoy your trip ;-)
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Phones & predictive text!
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I love the way this thread is shaping up. I hope it's a help to a lot of folks - if I can get it together to do this, I know the suggestions and advice here will be a great help to me. :)
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Bukk Mountain area in North very nice, first time in Hungary and impressed- clean, cheap, well surfaced roads, will be going again next year to explore.
In Romania you'll only find accommodation in towns not in small villages, food & people fine but roads & traffic horrendous. Approach roads to Transfaragaren pass horrendous, Dracula's Castle near Brasov with a visit.
I won't be in a hurry to go back.
Oh.. Money, you will need local currency contrary to advice I was given.
Enjoy your trip ;-)
This the route I'm thinking of, if I go via Slovakia. http://goo.gl/maps/aKwdr (http://goo.gl/maps/aKwdr)
The google streetview van went around in July-October 2012 and in some places its following a truck for miles and cant overtake, others there is quite a traffic queue behind it :lol Most of the roads look decent enough, road surface is no worse than the UK. The roads through higher land between smaller towns look the worse.
I've looked on Romanian bike tour companies websites and they dont bother with the Prislop Pass in the north, perhaps for that reason. They drop down via Bistrita.
I'm guessing the major roads between the major towns will be the busiest traffic wise. On those I've found a long queue behind trucks on single carraigeway roads. So maybe I'll look for secondary roads if its annoying.
I can't imagine a local tour companies going to rubbish places, so I've nicked some of their routes. http://motoromania.com/index.htm (http://motoromania.com/index.htm) This one has a top 5 and spotted the DN57 Danube route so I'll be doing that.
Hopefully and damaged roads from last winter will be repaired by now.
I met some Romanians in Germany. They said avoid the bigger hotels in the touristy areas as they are more expensive and that the pensions/guesthouses are far better value and for money there are plenty of cash machines in towns. They said have plum brandy as an apperitif but dont do a session on it. They also said around Bucarest the drivers are nutters and they go to Transfagarasan on weekends so its busy. So I'll avoid there at the weekend hopefully.
Only 3 weeks to go :b
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Well I'm back, everything in one piece.
After Nurburgring WSB I headed south east in the direction of Vienna for a day and a half of boring autobahn to get the mileage out of the way.
After that, I followed the Danube around the North of Budapest and into the hills of north Hungary to Eger.
Across the very flat Hungarian plains to Romania. Satu Mare, Baia Mare then over the hills to Sighetu Marmatiei. Happy Cemetery, wooden churches of Maramures county.
Past the ski resort of Borsa and over the Prislop Pass, to the Bucovina county and its many 5,000 year old painted monastaries.
South to Piatra Neamt. Bit of a concrete jungle of tower blocks, but not too bad, watched Romania v Hungary Euro footy in a bar, 3-0 so the locals were happy.
South through the Bicaz gorge and Hungarian speaking area to the old Saxon town of Sighsoara for the weekend. There was a film/folk/music festival going on so that was lucky, it added to the atomsphere.
After that the fortified church of Viscri, then onwards to the Transfagarasan Pass. I had planned to go to Brasov/Bran first, but the weather forecast looked better to do it straight away.
Great views in 20c and sunshine. Bran for a couple of days, 'Draculas' castle & Peles castle. The B&B was owned by a Brit who had been there for 15 years and filled me in on a few things about the Romanians. Past Brasov, nice view from the top of the hills. The forecast rain didnt really materialise in the valleys, just enough to dampen the roads for a while.
Past the Transfagarasan Pass again, dry in the valley, pissing down up top so I didn't bother going past 1/2 way up again.
West past Sibiu, another castle at Hunedoara where I met a Polish couple on DR400/Transalp 600. They were doing a camping trip and said up the mountains they woke to frost.
They said the Romanian roads were better than the Polish roads overall, but the Poles tarmac all their roads, the Romanians dont. They were keeping off the main roads sticking to th minor roads. There was another group of Poles on enduro bikes who had vanned them down there.
Down to Orsovo and along the Danube valley. I had planned to find a guesthouse on the river, but a road closure meant a long detour and then it started pissing down and got dark early so stayed on Orsovo. It took a while, maybe 1/2 hour, to find somewhere to stay as several places had closed after the main tourist season.
Up to Timisoara, with its work in progress museum of the revolution in 1989. An old man showed me around, very interesting.
Then back to Hungary, to Pecs, then Lake Balaton, home of millions of midges. I was going to go to Croatia, but the forecast there wasn't good, so back to Austria, light rain and cold for a couple of days before it perked up back to sun and 20c.
Motorail overnight from Innsbruck to Dusseldorf to bypass 400 miles of boring motorways, then home.
Romanian accomodation was excellent. A little time spent researching where to go meant quality cheap guesthouses. Even those I turned up on the off chance were good, just looked for the '3 daisy' tourist board rating. Hosts were all very helpfull.
In the north, prices were about £25 for b&b inc dinner with a couple of 500ml bottles of moonshine plum or pear brandy on the table if required. It tasted fine, wasnt sure of the %, so didnt want to risk a hangover next day so took it steady. The VFM guesthouses in Sighisoara were all full due to the festival, so the €45 a night 4 star hotel had to do. Most parts of the country on the tourist trail had loads of places to stay. Food was fine, as was the beer and wine. Very little imported from far away countries here.
Romanian roads were shit through to so new and fresh I could have written my name in the tarmac. Sometimes from 1 extreme to the other around a bend. Fully adjustable rear shock was adjusted many times to find a decent Romanian bouncy setting.
Quite a few newly weds spend day 2 of their 3 day long weddings being photographed around the more pretty castles and towns, mingling with tourists.
Fascinating country, with a lot to see and do. Well worth a visit but not if you are just requiring fast speedy riding for your holidays.
Main part of the route
http://goo.gl/maps/OyRIU (http://goo.gl/maps/OyRIU)
(http://imageshack.us/a/img593/3048/2wzv.jpg) (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/593/2wzv.jpg/)
(http://imageshack.us/a/img209/3266/m4iu.jpg) (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/209/m4iu.jpg/)
(http://imageshack.us/a/img833/1574/omcy.jpg) (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/833/omcy.jpg/)
(http://imageshack.us/a/img10/425/w09v.jpg) (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/10/w09v.jpg/)
(http://imageshack.us/a/img560/5924/7x3f.jpg) (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/560/7x3f.jpg/)
(http://imageshack.us/a/img51/6580/2rf3.jpg) (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/51/2rf3.jpg/)
(http://imageshack.us/a/img59/7465/t9gs.jpg) (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/59/t9gs.jpg/)
(http://imageshack.us/a/img856/79/52mq.jpg) (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/856/52mq.jpg/)
(http://imageshack.us/a/img203/9562/rxkz.jpg) (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/203/rxkz.jpg/)
Far too many photos here
http://www.photobox.co.uk/album/2098824729 (http://www.photobox.co.uk/album/2098824729)
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That was amazing, thanks for that,it looked great, how many miles,, still , its the sort of trip we all should do one day.