old - Fazer Owners Club - old
Bikes, Hints'n'Tips => FZS600 Fazer => Topic started by: Stedman8 on 29 April 2013, 07:09:31 pm
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Today I tried to change the front and rear brake pads on my 2001 Fazer 600 - what a palaver, the new brake pads ( pyramid parts pp252 front and pp104 rear ) for the front seemed to be the wrong shape i.e. flat on top and curved underneath which is the opposite of the pads that were in it and the pyramid ones didnt seem to fit in the caliper. The rear ones seemed to fit but they were too thick to get the disc in , I tried to push the pistons back but they didnt seem to move much ( looking at the rear caliper without the pads in from the back to front direction, the left hand piston sticks out about an 1/4 inch and the right sticks about 1/2 inch and will not move any further ) I tried taking the reservoir cap off and taking out some fluid but nothing seemed to help, could any one out there please enlighten me,should the rear pistons both stick out to different lengths or should the distance be similar,thanks in advance for any help,steve
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It is possible that they are too thick, but you can pump the pistons further in, try using a c clamp with apiece of wood on top, I used a vice with a piece of wood last time.
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The pistons should go back in further than that, they should be almost flush with the caliper faces. Sounds like the calipers might need a good clean out to get the pistons moving more freely.
Chris
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With all the discussions we've had on here about braking, i don't understand why you've chosen such a naff make of pads?
For about £15 more you could have had all round SBS pads that have been thoroughly talked about, will fit properly and have a generally high review!
I dunno what rear disc you have on either, but you've bought sintered pads too, which from personal experience i wouldn't have recommended.
I will always tell anyone to spend a few more quid on pads, as i think it's kind of important to stop the bike when you want it to, rather than when lousy pads decide to kick in!
Sorry to sound a bit harsh but it's just the way i see it.
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Hi i got mine from wemoto and fit perfectly and so does everything
I've got of them
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With all the discussions we've had on here about braking, i don't understand why you've chosen such a naff make of pads?
For about £15 more you could have had all round SBS pads that have been thoroughly talked about, will fit properly and have a generally high review!
I dunno what rear disc you have on either, but you've bought sintered pads too, which from personal experience i wouldn't have recommended.
I will always tell anyone to spend a few more quid on pads, as i think it's kind of important to stop the bike when you want it to, rather than when lousy pads decide to kick in!
Sorry to sound a bit harsh but it's just the way i see it.
Dont worry Darrsi it wont be happening again ;) but we all make mistakes from time to time :) I hear what you say though,the one thing you shouldn't skimp on is the things that stop you , suffice to say the pads will be changed
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The pads probably aren't too thick. You do need to retract the pistons til they're almost flush.
The pistons get corroded and don't want to retract so pump them a bit further out and clean them properly before forcing them back in with a G clamp.
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The piston should really push back using pressure with your thumbs, if not they are probably in need of a good clean.
One thing I never skimp on is Brake parts, they are way to important.
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With all the discussions we've had on here about braking, i don't understand why you've chosen such a naff make of pads?
For about £15 more you could have had all round SBS pads that have been thoroughly talked about, will fit properly and have a generally high review!
I dunno what rear disc you have on either, but you've bought sintered pads too, which from personal experience i wouldn't have recommended.
I will always tell anyone to spend a few more quid on pads, as i think it's kind of important to stop the bike when you want it to, rather than when lousy pads decide to kick in!
Sorry to sound a bit harsh but it's just the way i see it.
Dont worry Darrsi it wont be happening again ;) but we all make mistakes from time to time :) I hear what you say though,the one thing you shouldn't skimp on is the things that stop you , suffice to say the pads will be changed
I wasn't taking a dig, honestly, i just feel that 'stopping' always comes before 'hitting'...! ! !
It's "the" most serious part of any bike!
If you don't slow down when needed, then chances are you ain't riding that bike again for a while! ;)
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I just put some £6.99 Kyoto pads on the back of mine and they have way more bite than the Goldfren that they replaced.
I wouldn't normally use cheapo ones like that but since the fronts still have about 1/3 left I wanted to do the whole lot together once those are gone :)
As for the pistons in the rear caliper, mine were a complete pain in the arse to push back in. I managed to snap my only G clamp too :rolleyes
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I just put some £6.99 Kyoto pads on the back of mine and they have way more bite than the Goldfren that they replaced.
I wouldn't normally use cheapo ones like that but since the fronts still have about 1/3 left I wanted to do the whole lot together once those are gone :)
As for the pistons in the rear caliper, mine were a complete pain in the arse to push back in. I managed to snap my only G clamp too :rolleyes
The rear brake is generally used more for control at lower speeds, ie: traffic, so you can try different pads out until you find a set that suits your way of riding.
The trick with the rear caliper is to give it a good scrub and degrease with brake cleaner 3 times a year, and then put fresh red rubber grease on the pistons, and buff up the pad pins and smear lightly with copper grease.
If you leave them untouched over different seasons with hot, cold and wet weather's then that is when they will start misbehaving.
This is especially important if you use organic pads that create more dust, it's for that reason alone why i don't use them.
The dust just gets baked on and creates seizures.
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I'm using Ferodo organic pads on the front and don't see a lot of dust?
Maybe I need to brake a bit harder,,,,,,,
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I'm on Galfer sintered up front, which are wearing incredibly well and don't seem to be doing anything to the discs, and i'm trying SBS ceramic on the rear for the first time which bite very well and i'm more than happy with.
I was planning on trying SBS up front next time, but i've got another set of pads in my garage which are almost like new that i found, as well as the set i sent to Lewis, so may as well use them first whenever the Galfer's decide to wear out, but that won't be anytime soon by the looks of it.
For some odd reason Galfer front pads sold by Calsport on Ebay are £18 a pair, but £30 on their own website.
£24 a set difference is quite a lot (about £24 actually :rolleyes )!!!
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That's a tank of petrol worth :)
Chris
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The way the Galfers are wearing, or not wearing i should say, then even at full price they still probably make economic sense compared to a lot of other brands!
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Just ordered SBS ceramics for the back once I get the piston sorted, and EBC organics for the front, hopefully these will do the job,has anyone any experience of these and arethey a good choice - by the way many thanks everyone for the advice,Steve
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I'm trying out the SBS ceramics on the rear and am not especially sold on them. The best thing about them is that there is very little dust compared to EBC organics but they somehow don't feel as progressive as the EBCs. Could be a matter of getting used to them, but already considering going back to the old ones. Would be interested in hearing what your verdicts are Darrsi & Stedman8.
Got SBS sintered up front and very happy so far, quite a bit of dust but they don't seem too harsh on the discs and provide excellent braking. They cost £33 so not far off the bargain Galfers which were unavailable at the time.
Just ordered SBS ceramics for the back once I get the piston sorted, and EBC organics for the front, hopefully these will do the job,has anyone any experience of these and arethey a good choice - by the way many thanks everyone for the advice,Steve
Most folk go for sintered on the front but organics usually provide a better feel and smoother braking. For road use they're probably more than sufficient but whether you like them or not is down to preference. Sintered's supposed benefits are having superior wet weather performance, don't need chemical bedding in like organics, and superior power in general but I had EBC organics up front for a while and were quite happy with them and didn't notice a massive difference tbh.
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The SBS ceramics on the rear needed bedding in properly for a couple of weeks before they felt right for me, if truth be told, but i'm happy with them now.
Don't forget i'm mainly riding to work in traffic though, so bedding in could be done muck quicker if wanted.
They bite and grip well, and are very responsive in traffic so i could quite easily stop millimetres away from a subject with complete accuracy and confidence.
I really like them, but each to their own i s'pose.
I'm very interested to hear you say that the SBS sintered create dust up front, as i wasn't expecting that at all, in fact i'm a bit surprised.
The Galfers i'm using definitely don't cause dust, in fact i checked them again last night and they don't appear to be doing anything at all, no disc wear and the pads still look like new and they've been on there a few months now.
As i said earlier i have a newish set of pads in the garage still so i'm not gonna need any more for quite a while yet anyway.
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Thats good to know, I'm getting the opposite atm where although power is good, they seem a bit unpredictable. I'll give them a bit longer to see what happens as I suspect I need more time to get used to them anyway. They're paired with an EBC disc - it could be they're not a great match?
As for the sintered fronts, yes they are dusty. I have ABE discs and the combination stops incredibly well whilst retaining good feel. The finish on the discs is rougher than OEM so that is likely a contributory factor in creating more dust - I'd prefer to wear through pads than discs so thats okay by me. I'm tempted to give the Galfers a go next time though. I never knew brake pads could be so interesting :lol
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Thats good to know, I'm getting the opposite atm where although power is good, they seem a bit unpredictable. I'll give them a bit longer to see what happens as I suspect I need more time to get used to them anyway. They're paired with an EBC disc - it could be they're not a great match?
As for the sintered fronts, yes they are dusty. I have ABE discs and the combination stops incredibly well whilst retaining good feel. The finish on the discs is rougher than OEM so that is likely a contributory factor in creating more dust - I'd prefer to wear through pads than discs so thats okay by me. I'm tempted to give the Galfers a go next time though. I never knew brake pads could be so interesting :lol
Get Galfers from Calsport but on Ebay, it's much cheaper.
I had sintered Galfers with an EBC ProLite disc on the back and although the bite was second to none it ate the disc like it was made of cheese. But i must stress i had front braking issues for quite a while, so was compensating with the rear brake until i solved the problem, which took a lot of time, effort and money :'(
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I had the opposite to Fuzzy on my bike; SBS Ceramics up front and EBC Organics at the rear
Was very happy with the combo - I will be going back to this once I get paid :)
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Well you will all no doubt be pleased to hear that I managed to sort the pistons out on the rear caliper with shed loads of WD 40 several g-clamps and mucho swearing it is now working as it should and later today the new SBS ceramic pads will be going in, hopefully.So once again thanks for the advice everyone and I'll be in touch soon - the front discs and pads are up for messing with :lol
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Don't use Armstrong pads either, ever.
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I replaced the stock pads (they still had some life in them, but were glazed over) with Nissin NS (semi metalic) - I gave them a while to bed in, but I just dislike them.
I've been searching the forum for opinions on brake pads and it seems that SBS Street Excel get the best scores - but I have a few questions to the users -
Roughly how long do they last and how are they on the stock rotors (I'm not sure whether the original rotors are stainless steel).
In two weeks I'll be going for a trip with a pillion to Alps - how do the SBS deal with long term braking (lots of heat)
Thanks :)
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Got SBS ceramics on the rear which bite well, but too early for me to comment on longevity.
My Galfer pads on the front though are just ridiculously long lasting, they brake really well but i just can't understand how they aren't wearing at all, and they're not wearing the discs either?
And they're way under priced on Ebay, at just over half price http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Galfer-HH-Front-Brake-Pads-Yamaha-FZS600-FZS1000-Fazer-FZ6-FZ8-FZ1-/141014149710?pt=UK_Motorcycle_Parts_13&hash=item20d5192a4e (http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Galfer-HH-Front-Brake-Pads-Yamaha-FZS600-FZS1000-Fazer-FZ6-FZ8-FZ1-/141014149710?pt=UK_Motorcycle_Parts_13&hash=item20d5192a4e)
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Got SBS ceramics on the rear which bite well, but too early for me to comment on longevity.
My Galfer pads on the front though are just ridiculously long lasting, they brake really well but i just can't understand how they aren't wearing at all, and they're not wearing the discs either?
And they're way under priced on Ebay, at just over half price [url]http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Galfer-HH-Front-Brake-Pads-Yamaha-FZS600-FZS1000-Fazer-FZ6-FZ8-FZ1-/141014149710?pt=UK_Motorcycle_Parts_13&hash=item20d5192a4e[/url] ([url]http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Galfer-HH-Front-Brake-Pads-Yamaha-FZS600-FZS1000-Fazer-FZ6-FZ8-FZ1-/141014149710?pt=UK_Motorcycle_Parts_13&hash=item20d5192a4e[/url])
There is something wrong with this listing - the compound they mentioned is for rear brakes, and those pads are double the price on their website.
Which galfer pads do you have - is it 1375 or 1370 ?
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I know they're double price, that's why i nearly bit their hand off when i saw them, but they are the same one's as i have.
They haven't had them on there for a while, they must have new stock.
Here's another place selling them http://www.sportsbikeshop.co.uk/motorcycle_parts/content_prod/60148 (http://www.sportsbikeshop.co.uk/motorcycle_parts/content_prod/60148)
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You nearly convinced me - but still HH and semi-metallic ?
OK I've found some info about the pads:
http://www.galfer.eu/index.php/en/products-moto-eng/brake-pads (http://www.galfer.eu/index.php/en/products-moto-eng/brake-pads)
Btw how long did you have to bed them in ?
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What's wrong with that compound, i've had no issues at all?
The rear one's ate a new EBC Pro-Lite disc though, but i was using it a lot due to a front brake problem i had for months.
Didn't take long to bed in, i've had them on for months but they look like i put them on yesterday.
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I've always found that a combination of sintered pads front, standard rear work well? Don't know about the 6s, but the thous can lock up the rear easily. 50 miles of careful use is usually enough for pads and new discs to bed in.
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Fitted a set of SBS Sintered to the fronts today, will have to see how good they are. One thing has already improve and thats lever movement. The lever only move a small amount compared to my old pads.
I just went down the end of my road to make sure everything was good and when i got back into the garage i noticed the front wheel does not spin as easy as it did. There's a small amount of binding going on and assume they just need to bed in and hopefully this will free up with some miles??
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Fitted a set of SBS Sintered to the fronts today, will have to see how good they are. One thing has already improve and thats lever movement. The lever only move a small amount compared to my old pads.
I just went down the end of my road to make sure everything was good and when i got back into the garage i noticed the front wheel does not spin as easy as it did. There's a small amount of binding going on and assume they just need to bed in and hopefully this will free up with some miles??
You'll get a tiny bit of binding just through the sheer width of new pads, as long as your calipers are functioning okay it'll free up after a while.
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Fitted a set of SBS Sintered to the fronts today, will have to see how good they are. One thing has already improve and thats lever movement. The lever only move a small amount compared to my old pads.
I just went down the end of my road to make sure everything was good and when i got back into the garage i noticed the front wheel does not spin as easy as it did. There's a small amount of binding going on and assume they just need to bed in and hopefully this will free up with some miles??
You'll get a tiny bit of binding just through the sheer width of new pads, as long as your calipers are functioning okay it'll free up after a while.
Coolio, thought it would, cheers darrsi.
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Just checked out the ebay link Darssi but a bit confused as to whether the pads are a full set, ie: four pads for both discs, or just two pads, it doesn't seem to mention it.
Cheers.
G ; )
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Two pads. "Listing is for a set of pads for one brake caliper."
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Cheers bud.
G ; )
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I might have some pistons for FZS 600 rear caliper - I remember buying some from wemoto, but in the end I went for FZS 1000's caliper (I wasn't able to get the pistons out from the old one in the first place).
Will check later and let you know
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Bloody typical! Just brought and fitted some new pads for my bike and then found this>>
http://www.halfords.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/product_storeId_10001_catalogId_10151_productId_224422_langId_-1_categoryId_246903 (http://www.halfords.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/product_storeId_10001_catalogId_10151_productId_224422_langId_-1_categoryId_246903)
Looks like Halfords are getting rid of some old stock. Going by the Ferodo website those pads should fit the fazer.>>>>>> http://www.ferodoracing.com/catalogue/search.php?search=motorcycle_vehicle&cat=brake_pads (http://www.ferodoracing.com/catalogue/search.php?search=motorcycle_vehicle&cat=brake_pads)
For anyone else who needs pads.
Mark
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Bloody typical! Just brought and fitted some new pads for my bike and then found this>>
[url]http://www.halfords.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/product_storeId_10001_catalogId_10151_productId_224422_langId_-1_categoryId_246903[/url] ([url]http://www.halfords.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/product_storeId_10001_catalogId_10151_productId_224422_langId_-1_categoryId_246903[/url])
Looks like Halfords are getting rid of some old stock. Going by the Ferodo website those pads should fit the fazer.>>>>>> [url]http://www.ferodoracing.com/catalogue/search.php?search=motorcycle_vehicle&cat=brake_pads[/url] ([url]http://www.ferodoracing.com/catalogue/search.php?search=motorcycle_vehicle&cat=brake_pads[/url])
For anyone else who needs pads.
Mark
That certainly is a bargain but you have chosen a very good set of tried and tested pads for your bike, so don't be too disheartened ;)
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Bloody typical! Just brought and fitted some new pads for my bike and then found this>>
[url]http://www.halfords.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/product_storeId_10001_catalogId_10151_productId_224422_langId_-1_categoryId_246903[/url] ([url]http://www.halfords.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/product_storeId_10001_catalogId_10151_productId_224422_langId_-1_categoryId_246903[/url])
Looks like Halfords are getting rid of some old stock. Going by the Ferodo website those pads should fit the fazer.>>>>>> [url]http://www.ferodoracing.com/catalogue/search.php?search=motorcycle_vehicle&cat=brake_pads[/url] ([url]http://www.ferodoracing.com/catalogue/search.php?search=motorcycle_vehicle&cat=brake_pads[/url])
For anyone else who needs pads.
Mark
Thanks for that ;) just reserved a set to keep as spares
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Let me think....... ;)
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Good find, I won't need new front pads for a while but I've reserved 2 pairs for when I do. They look reasonable.
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Good find but just to. Let people know it appears to be for reserve and collect, if they don't have them anywhere local to you then tough!
These are the brake pads I've got on atm and used for track, they're more expensive than the platinum series they do, personally I prefer the platinum for road riding but these are good!
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Another good deal on at Halfrauds at the moment - £10 oil
http://www.halfords.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/SearchCmd?storeId=10001&catalogId=10151&langId=-1&action=discount&promotionCode=232174 (http://www.halfords.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/SearchCmd?storeId=10001&catalogId=10151&langId=-1&action=discount&promotionCode=232174)
Halfords 5W30 Fully Synthetic 4L (usually £34)
Halfords 5W40 Fully Synthetic 4L (usually £34)
Halfords 5W30 Semi Synthetic 4L (usually £24)
Halfords 10W40 Semi Synthetic 4L (usually £17)
Which of these would you put in the Fazer? I usually use Castrol GTX 10W40
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Another good deal on at Halfrauds at the moment - £10 oil
[url]http://www.halfords.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/SearchCmd?storeId=10001&catalogId=10151&langId=-1&action=discount&promotionCode=232174[/url] ([url]http://www.halfords.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/SearchCmd?storeId=10001&catalogId=10151&langId=-1&action=discount&promotionCode=232174[/url])
Halfords 5W30 Fully Synthetic 4L (usually £34)
Halfords 5W40 Fully Synthetic 4L (usually £34)
Halfords 5W30 Semi Synthetic 4L (usually £24)
Halfords 10W40 Semi Synthetic 4L (usually £17)
Which of these would you put in the Fazer? I usually use Castrol GTX 10W40
The only one that says 10w40
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Hi,
Can you guys hear the brake pads binding on the discs when you push the bike ?
Up to around 3 weeks ago I had OEM pads, replaced them with Nissin NS (they were rubbish), and three days ago I've put on SDS Street Excel - they brake quite well, but as soon as I've put them on the binding started - I can rotate the wheel without a problem, if I push it, it will stop after half a turn. I've checked, cleaned and put some rubber grease on the pistons - they seem to be fine, I was able to push all of them in with my fingers. I've also made sure that the master cylinder is not overfilled with brake fluid.
Is it normal for Sintered pads ?
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Since you've just put them on I'd suggest you need to wait for them to bed in properly with the discs which can take a while if you aren't aggressive with them
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The dust seal is supposed to retract the piston slightly, so if your pistons aren't retracting I'd suspect the dust seals.
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Hi Anarch,
After fitting my new SBS pads I had exactly the binding you described. Wheel would rotate by hand, but you could really hear the binding like a whoosing noise, and after a firm push the wheel would rotate only half a turn. Exactly as you describe.
Since it was the first time I'd fitted pads in ages I had em checked out at local Yam dealership and they said it was fine, binding wasn't too bad. They did do a little copper grease for me.
Mine have now freed up just fine, and it's since gone through an MOT with no advisories. With a bit of luck yours will be fine, but meanwhile take care in the wet!
Andy
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Hi Anarch,
After fitting my new SBS pads I had exactly the binding you described. Wheel would rotate by hand, but you could really hear the binding like a whoosing noise, and after a firm push the wheel would rotate only half a turn. Exactly as you describe.
Since it was the first time I'd fitted pads in ages I had em checked out at local Yam dealership and they said it was fine, binding wasn't too bad. They did do a little copper grease for me.
Mine have now freed up just fine, and it's since gone through an MOT with no advisories. With a bit of luck yours will be fine, but meanwhile take care in the wet!
Andy
You Sir are a Hero !
Thanks a lot :) I was worried that my discs might melt in the middle of Alps
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Just got Ferodo HH sintered road pads for front £10 all in
Yes £5 a caliper
Bargain.
Got 4 cr9e spark plugs and front pads for £24