old - Fazer Owners Club - old
Bikes, Hints'n'Tips => FZS600 Fazer => Topic started by: xlewisbdx on 24 April 2013, 09:55:00 pm
-
I was looking these but I've been told they seem cheap...
http://bit.ly/ZNwNWh (http://bit.ly/ZNwNWh)
-
DO NOT scrimp on brake pads, it's just a dangerously false economy.
SBS seem to be the most popular choice on here, with very good references, and they're not even expensive oddly enough!
-
I'm not working so the problem is money is tight. Will those do till I get some money for them?
-
The reason I am asking is because I am having a problem with my front brakes. They are making a awful sqeaking/crunching noise. I checked the pads and here they are. I cleaned them and it's is still there.
http://imgur.com/MD8gHFY (http://imgur.com/MD8gHFY)
http://imgur.com/nSuE1xt (http://imgur.com/nSuE1xt)
-
What are we looking at? Is there something embedded in the surface?
Have you tried sandpapering them?
-
What are we looking at? Is there something embedded in the surface?
Have you tried sandpapering them?
They are just a picture of my brakes. Making a really bad sqeaking/crunching noise, I haven't tried sand papering them no.
-
Did you put a bit of copper slip on the backing plate of the pads? That's supposed to stop them squeeking a bit.
As for the crunching... can you explain it more? Everything tightened up ok?
Chris
-
The chances are the calipers need a good clean up too.
If you want send me a PM with an address and IF i have some pads in my garage i'll send you some in the post to get you by for a while.
I went through a load of pads when i had my "juddering" problem, and "think" i kept some.
I can let you know in the morning if i have or not?
If i do i'll take them to work and can post from there for next day delivery.
-
You are very kind Darrsi 8) Good on you sir!
Chris
-
The pictures seem to indicate that there is loads of life left in those pads imo
I'd suggest your problem is elsewhere.
ChristoT recently had an issue with his front brakes squeaking a lot so when he was round mine the other day, we removed the callipers, removed the pads, put some copper grease on the back and reassembled and now the squeak is completely gone. You can get a massive pot of copper grease for less than one of those cheap sets of pads you found
-
Did you put a bit of copper slip on the backing plate of the pads? That's supposed to stop them squeeking a bit.
As for the crunching... can you explain it more? Everything tightened up ok?
Chris
Everything tightened up as it should. The crunching noise/feeling comes through the handlebars and give me a tiny wobble. Tires are only 2k miles old.
-
The pictures seem to indicate that there is loads of life left in those pads imo
I'd suggest your problem is elsewhere.
ChristoT recently had an issue with his front brakes squeaking a lot so when he was round mine the other day, we removed the callipers, removed the pads, put some copper grease on the back and reassembled and now the squeak is completely gone. You can get a massive pot of copper grease for less than one of those cheap sets of pads you found
ordered some copper grease last night, should come tomorrow.
-
The chances are the calipers need a good clean up too.
If you want send me a PM with an address and IF i have some pads in my garage i'll send you some in the post to get you by for a while.
I went through a load of pads when i had my "juddering" problem, and "think" i kept some.
I can let you know in the morning if i have or not?
If i do i'll take them to work and can post from there for next day delivery.
Thank you so much, I'll send you a PM now.
-
It's certainly a cheap option to try out first and it won't do any harm :)
As I said before, the pads look like they have a lot of life left and they don't appear to be unevenly worn so its likely that you just need to give the them a bit of a greasing on the back of the pad and to maybe clean up the callipers a bit. Also, put some grease on to the pad retaining pin :)
-
Was about to say, clean up the pad pins really well and lightly copper grease them so the pads can slide properly.
And make sure there's no deep grooves for the pads to get stuck on.
-
It's certainly a cheap option to try out first and it won't do any harm :)
Was about to say, clean up the pad pins really well and lightly copper grease them so the pads can slide properly.
And make sure there's no deep grooves for the pads to get stuck on.
As I said before, the pads look like they have a lot of life left and they don't appear to be unevenly worn so its likely that you just need to give the them a bit of a greasing on the back of the pad and to maybe clean up the callipers a bit. Also, put some grease on to the pad retaining pin :)
Will do, copper grease should arrive tomorrow, I'll do it then. Again, thank to everyone for the advice and a big thanks to darrsi
-
Just noticed that no one has actually answered the thread question.
Depends on the pads. But decent pads seem to go for about £12-£18 a set depending on where you buy them from and the make etc. The SBS Ceramics I like are about £15-16 a set :)
-
Can you afford to buy cheap brake Pads????, I am inclined to spend a little extra for recognised brands for shear piece of mind.
I would suggest you remove the wheel and check the wheel bearings.
-
Just noticed that no one has actually answered the thread question.
Depends on the pads. But decent pads seem to go for about £12-£18 a set depending on where you buy them from and the make etc. The SBS Ceramics I like are about £15-16 a set :)
Opinion on these?
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Yamaha-FZS600-Fazer-98-03-Front-Brake-Pads-/290474701575?pt=UK_Motorcycle_Parts&hash=item43a1a43307 (http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Yamaha-FZS600-Fazer-98-03-Front-Brake-Pads-/290474701575?pt=UK_Motorcycle_Parts&hash=item43a1a43307)
-
Can you afford to buy cheap brake Pads????, I am inclined to spend a little extra for recognised brands for shear piece of mind.
I would suggest you remove the wheel and check the wheel bearings.
It's defo the brakes. Sometimes I have to pump them on once or two mind. Also checked for any leaking and there is none, the piston also move freely.
-
If you have to pump them you've probably got air in the system.
Bear in mind both those sets you've linked to are just two pads, you'll need two sets; one for each caliper.
-
How badly worn are the discs, post a picture of them.
-
How badly worn are the discs, post a picture of them.
Not badly at all. There is some form of grove in it where I think a stone has been in there and it has took a chip out.
Pictures here
http://i.imgur.com/MD8gHFY.jpg (http://i.imgur.com/MD8gHFY.jpg)
http://i.imgur.com/nSuE1xt.jpg (http://i.imgur.com/nSuE1xt.jpg)
EDIT: just realised you said the disks. I'll get a picture uploaded tomorrow.
-
If you have to pump them you've probably got air in the system.
Bear in mind both those sets you've linked to are just two pads, you'll need two sets; one for each caliper.
Would you suggest I book it in at a garage and have them bleed the brakes?
-
The pictures seem to indicate that there is loads of life left in those pads imo
I'd suggest your problem is elsewhere.
ChristoT recently had an issue with his front brakes squeaking a lot so when he was round mine the other day, we removed the callipers, removed the pads, put some copper grease on the back and reassembled and now the squeak is completely gone. You can get a massive pot of copper grease for less than one of those cheap sets of pads you found
The squeak is gone indeed!
But I now get a strange whooshing noise at about 37mph, most noticeable if I'm coasting. And I haven't a clue as to what's causing it... :wall
-
Just noticed that no one has actually answered the thread question.
Depends on the pads. But decent pads seem to go for about £12-£18 a set depending on where you buy them from and the make etc. The SBS Ceramics I like are about £15-16 a set :)
I answered the question earlier! :book
-
2 things you have said ring alarm bells.
Firstly if you can feel it through the handlebars it could aim towards head bearings, OR what ended up being my problem was a faulty/old braided brake line, which caused a "juddering" feeling on braking, which just happened to be the only thing left for me to try changing to cure it.
Because it was braided i simply didn't think it would've gone wrong.
Now i know better. :'(
Secondly, you said you have to pump the brakes a couple of times (and you feel it through the bars).
This could point at a disc problem.
If you get any warping of a disc, when you are moving it will spread the pads further apart than normal, which can result in having to pump the brake one or two times to bring them back to react, then because the disc isn't flat it can create a pulsing effect through the brake lever.
Really not good in an emergency, it will frighten the life out of you when you do a panic stop and you get a handful of sponge.
So at the moment i doubt very much it's just a simple pad issue by the sounds of things.
But you need to eliminate things one at a time.
Start with the real easy stuff like are the caliper bolts done up correctly, bleed the brakes, clean/grease the front brake lever joint, etc.
If i have pads for you i'll clean them up at work for you, i'll let you know soon. :)
-
Nothing on this thread you didn't! I can't see it, anyways...
Sent from my Nexus 4 using Tapatalk 2
-
Nothing on this thread you didn't! I can't see it, anyways...
Sent from my Nexus 4 using Tapatalk 2
"....SBS seem to be the most popular choice on here, with very good references, and they're not even expensive oddly enough!...."
WAKEY WAKEY :lol
-
"...not expensive..." that's a price isn't it? :lol
-
More of a value range :-)
Sent from my Nexus 4 using Tapatalk 2
-
Looks like your lucky day Lewis, i found a very nice pair of pads for you, they look like new. :)
Only problem is that if you get to really like them i can't actually tell you what make they are for you to get them again? :rolleyes
But i can promise you they weren't a crappy make 'cos i was trying different brands out when i had my braking problem and remember prices getting more expensive as i was trying to solve it. :\
They're in the post, you should have them tomorrow, i just need to sweet talk the receptionist first :D
-
For the sake of proper referencing, these are the pads I bought for the front - I also upgraded to HEL braided lines (this was all just before the great fire of 2012 :()
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/SBS-FRONT-BRAKE-PADS-YAMAHA-FZS-600-FAZER-1998-2003-CERAMIC-/150791446789?pt=UK_Motorcycle_Parts&hash=item231bdee105 (http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/SBS-FRONT-BRAKE-PADS-YAMAHA-FZS-600-FAZER-1998-2003-CERAMIC-/150791446789?pt=UK_Motorcycle_Parts&hash=item231bdee105)
-
Plenty of wise counsel on this topic already. I take the point that money is tight. The owner who regularly checks his/her bike & follows a service schedule will avoid a lot of unnecessary expense/heartache down the line. You describe more than one "symptom" of problems so back to basics. start with your tyre/wheel/brake discs. Next the brake callipers/hoses/master cylinder/brake fluid. Next your fork action(do you know if/when the fork oil was changed?) Next your headset bearings. I see you have a 98/99 bike-did it come with service history?
I have just bought an 03 Foxeye with most old MOT certs but no service record SO I got out Mr Haynes & am systematically working through ALL the service items. Now Yamaha recommend changing the rubber brake hoses every 4 years-mine are rubber so am ordering a set of braided hoses. They also recommend changing all the rubber seals both in the calipers & also the master cylinder internals every 2 years. If you have to spend a bit of money remember its a small price to pay for peace of mind(there are insurance implications as well if your bike is found to be unroadworthy after an accident)-Brakes & Tyres don't cut corners & compromise your safety :eek
-
Plenty of wise counsel on this topic already. I take the point that money is tight. The owner who regularly checks his/her bike & follows a service schedule will avoid a lot of unnecessary expense/heartache down the line. You describe more than one "symptom" of problems so back to basics. start with your tyre/wheel/brake discs. Next the brake callipers/hoses/master cylinder/brake fluid. Next your fork action(do you know if/when the fork oil was changed?) Next your headset bearings. I see you have a 98/99 bike-did it come with service history?
I have just bought an 03 Foxeye with most old MOT certs but no service record SO I got out Mr Haynes & am systematically working through ALL the service items. Now Yamaha recommend changing the rubber brake hoses every 4 years-mine are rubber so am ordering a set of braided hoses. They also recommend changing all the rubber seals both in the calipers & also the master cylinder internals every 2 years. If you have to spend a bit of money remember its a small price to pay for peace of mind(there are insurance implications as well if your bike is found to be unroadworthy after an accident)-Brakes & Tyres don't cut corners & compromise your safety :eek
I haven't a clue when the forks was last serviced. The bike came with a part service up to 18,000 miles. The bike is now on 29,000. How simply is it to upgrade to braided hoses and how much am I looking at spending while doing it? The rubber seals where last checked in Septemeber 2012. I have no clue when the master cylinder was last checked.
Even if the problem isn't in the brakes it sound like a good idea to upgrade to braided hoses anyway.
Not sure how I would bleed the brakes I would have to get a haynes manual. ( I have the downloaded one)
-
Looks like your lucky day Lewis, i found a very nice pair of pads for you, they look like new. :)
Only problem is that if you get to really like them i can't actually tell you what make they are for you to get them again? :rolleyes
But i can promise you they weren't a crappy make 'cos i was trying different brands out when i had my braking problem and remember prices getting more expensive as i was trying to solve it. :\
They're in the post, you should have them tomorrow, i just need to sweet talk the receptionist first :D
You sir should have a medal. Thank you :-)
-
:lol I think Yamaha err on the side of caution when it comes to master cylinder internals-I have previously changed these at recommended interval-only to find no visible signs of wear on the rubber seals. However with a 14/15 year old bike they will have seen a lot of action so something to consider. Rubber brake hoses deteriorate structurally and eventually weaken so will bulge under braking pressure reducing brake force to pistons & reducing "feel" at lever. The cheapest option for front is to order two lines that run from master cylinder one to each wheel-avoiding the "splitter" that sits on the lower fork yoke. Always some good deals on Hel lines on ebay. It is best to buy Yamaha seals for the brake pistons as they will always fit unlike some makes of pattern seals!
If you are relatively new to all this maintenance stuff-ask on the forum if theres any members in your area who could lend a hand. Im a bit far away in theWest Mids unfortunately. What I can offer is a 50gm pot of red rubber brake grease-for the pistons that is!. just send me a PM with your address. Good luck :lol
-
What's the story with braided hoses?
I understand they make your brakes feel stiffer. I reckon my brakes feel fine (I don't ride hard) so this is not a big deal for me.
Presumably they are more expensive than rubber hoses and are more inclined to corrosion (the braiding is usually galvanised steel wire no?).
Does anybody install rubber hoses any more?
-
Just had a look on eBay for some braided hose lines. I would like the orange ones as they will go with my bike ;)
So am i right in thinking this is the front [size=78%]http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Venhill-brake-line-kit-for-Yam-FZS-600-Fazer-97-03-race-design-stainless-braided-/200745837708?pt=UK_Motorcycle_Parts&hash=item2ebd62648c (http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Venhill-brake-line-kit-for-Yam-FZS-600-Fazer-97-03-race-design-stainless-braided-/200745837708?pt=UK_Motorcycle_Parts&hash=item2ebd62648c)[/size]
and this is the rear [size=78%]http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Venhill-brake-line-Yamaha-FZS-600-Fazer-1998-03-rear-stainless-braided-/200710958081?pt=UK_Motorcycle_Parts&hash=item2ebb4e2c01 (http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Venhill-brake-line-Yamaha-FZS-600-Fazer-1998-03-rear-stainless-braided-/200710958081?pt=UK_Motorcycle_Parts&hash=item2ebb4e2c01)[/size]
Will they be good enough for the job?
Edit: I could always ring my local bike mechanic up and ask him to bleed the front brakes and take a look at them and make sure they work as they should. I'll tell him the symptoms I have told you guys. I'm sure he'll know what to do and eliminate the problem one by one and fot the braided lines.
-
elbrownos-braided lines are made from stainless steel with an outer coating-either clear or coloured. They don't bulge under pressure so transmit the fluid pressure from lever to pistons more effectively than rubber that deteriorates with age/use. So although perhaps dearer they generally last a long time. Tip. Don't fit alloy bolts(race fittings)-they will corrode with road salt. :'( Use stainless. :lol
-
Venhill reputable supplier. That's the set up you want . Are Hel or Goodridge any cheaper?
-
I was looking in to HEL lines this morning, then decided that the measly £6 in my bank account was going to cut it :P
Cheapest set I found was £52 delivered on eBay :) Had them before and the completely changed the feel of the brakes. So much more powerful and easy to control. Having said that I never used to have any issues on my old '99 model. Current one has once or twice left me feeling like I wasn't going to stop in time and that wasn't under extreme circumstances either. Felt more like brake fade but I hadn't previously been grabbing at the brakes. In any case, I'll sort it all out once I have the money.
Bleeding the brakes is simple enough;
1. Fill reservoir
2. Open bleed nipple
3. Pull brake lever
4. Close bleed nipple
5. Release brake lever
6. Repeat until no more air comes out
If brakes don't feel hard enough, continue bleeding. One other option is to zip tie the lever and leave it overnight and try again :)
First time I did this on the bike I didn't have a hose or anything so just used an old rag to catch the fluid coming from the bleed nipple. Second time round was on my car after a brake line failed whilst on a dual carriageway approaching a roundabout a bit fast (that was NOT fun!). Using some clear pipe was definitely easier
-
Will they be good enough for the job?
Edit: I could always ring my local bike mechanic up and ask him to bleed the front brakes and take a look at them and make sure they work as they should. I'll tell him the symptoms I have told you guys. I'm sure he'll know what to do and eliminate the problem one by one and fot the braided lines.
Venhill, HEL, Goodridge are all good names :)
Try and do the work yourself, its simple and will save you a fortune on labour if you are tight for cash!
-
So am I right in thinking I am bleeding one caliper at a time?
-
That's right, one calliper at a time :)
-
I'll get some brake fluid and spend a little time with it at weekend. Those two link I posted, the front brake will I need to order two front brake ones are just the one?
-
Order just the one as its a set and provides both front lines :)
Obviously the new "race" setup that you order is two lines that go direct from the Master cylinder straight to each calliper, whereas the existing setup has 3 lines (join in the middle). The race setup is cheaper and probably easier to deal with as well :) As always, any questions, ask away :D
-
elbrownos-braided lines are made from stainless steel with an outer coating-either clear or coloured. They don't bulge under pressure so transmit the fluid pressure from lever to pistons more effectively than rubber that deteriorates with age/use. So although perhaps dearer they generally last a long time. Tip. Don't fit alloy bolts(race fittings)-they will corrode with road salt. :'( Use stainless. :lol
Unless you're me and get a faulty braided line that caused juddering and a world of pain :'(
I've yet to see any complaints by anyone else about them though, which is probably why i was looking elsewhere for a fix because there wasn't any info online about them failing, but they are definitely way superior to standard lines.
-
If you're going to be changing brake lines and or bleeding your brakes then make sure you know what you're doing or you may not be able to stop when you get out on the road.
I found this video helpful Delboy's Garage, Harley Sportster Brake Hose Change. (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F2vLLC4iC78#ws)
Be good to have a friend who knows what they're doing there to help too ;)
Take care,
Chris
-
The pictures seem to indicate that there is loads of life left in those pads imo
I'd suggest your problem is elsewhere.
ChristoT recently had an issue with his front brakes squeaking a lot so when he was round mine the other day, we removed the callipers, removed the pads, put some copper grease on the back and reassembled and now the squeak is completely gone. You can get a massive pot of copper grease for less than one of those cheap sets of pads you found
The squeak is gone indeed!
But I now get a strange whooshing noise at about 37mph, most noticeable if I'm coasting. And I haven't a clue as to what's causing it... :wall
Are you running standard or non standard discs?
-
Dont forget when playing with brake fluid, it eats through paint, so if you do spill any on paintwork then clean it off really well.
When bleeding the brakes on a fazer do you need to unbolt the caliper and rotate it to get all the air out?
-
Just keep bleeding it until it looks like all the air has gone, but having the brake lever pulled in overnight can work wonders if you're still not 100%.
-
ebc hh £36 on ebay inc delivery
-
Good news! The squeeking/crunching noise has gone. I put some copper grease on the back of the pads.
I will await the arrival of the second set of pads from Darrsi (The Legend that he is) and I will then bleed the brakes tomorrow :)
-
Glad to hear it! Giving the calipers a good clean won't do any harm though ;)
-
Yeah, bit of a faux pas on my part, for some reason i had rear brake in my mind and only sent him the one pair of pads!!
Other pair is en route, special delivery :)
-
Glad to hear it! Giving the calipers a good clean won't do any harm though ;)
Will be doing tomorrow before I bleed them :)
Yeah, bit of a faux pas on my part, for some reason i had rear brake in my mind and only sent him the one pair of pads!!
Other pair is en route, special delivery :)
You're still the man :)
-
Going to order some new front brake seals. When fitting them is there any special way? I watched a video on how to split and replace the seals and the guy mentioned that they need to go in a certain way. For example when the seal is in you should feel the lip as you move your finger out. Is this the same with the Fazer or not?
-
Going to order some new front brake seals. When fitting them is there any special way? I watched a video on how to split and replace the seals and the guy mentioned that they need to go in a certain way. For example when the seal is in you should feel the lip as you move your finger out. Is this the same with the Fazer or not?
Smear the seals with red rubber grease when putting them in, and give the grooves they sit in a good clean with a toothbrush, preferably using brake cleaner.