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Bikes, Hints'n'Tips => FZS600 Fazer => Topic started by: SteveMc278 on 02 January 2013, 12:48:34 am
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Hi people,
Have done a search but no joy. Here's my question - red oil light comes on soon after pulling away and stays on for about one mile. Oil has been changed at least 500 miles ago therefore its a light gingery colour in addition to the milky colour which having read on this site seems to be caused by condensation. So trying to see the oil level in the sight window is proving very difficult. If I knew for sure that the level was low then I could top it up which should stop the red oil light illuminating but i don't want to risk overfilling with oil. As my memory pans back to a mechanic who overfilled with oil a deisel mini bus I used to drive causing literally a black smoke screen behind me after i pulled away from every set of traffic lights. Agreed that my FZS is not Transit deisel but i just don't want to overfill my bike with oil. :( . Any suggestions?
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Put the bike on the centre stand, on a level floor, and let it tick over for a couple of minutes, then switch the engine off and keep your eye on the window, and you should see the oil gradually rise.
The oil should only be about half way up the window so if you're saying you can't see it then 'perhaps' there's either too much in there, or the oil light is doing it's job and there's not enough?
Check the colour of your coolant as well in the expansion tank, if you're saying the oil is a milky colour then you may have a dodgy gasket somewhere in which case it needs sorting out quickly?
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The oil level gauge is nearer the front of the engine so the oil moving back when under hard acceleration tends to turn the light on. The oil pressure is still fine, but that red light is disconcerting!
I fill to nearly the top of the window, a couple of hundred mL more than Darssi suggests won't cause problems. A torch may help you see what's going on behind the window.
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When i first bought my bike i took it out for a blast and on returning noticed an oil leak from around the cam chain tensioner area.
I thought i'd change the oil anyway for peace of mind, and the previous owner had put 4 litres of oil in the engine instead of around 2.5 litres. :eek
I wasn't impressed.......
All this talk about oil, i think i'll do something constructive today and go and change mine :)
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i'd probably just drain the oil and catch it in a clean container, then measure it and re use it if it's only 500 miles old. you could take the clutch cover off at the same time and give the sight glass a clean
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I changed my engine oil earlier and put in a fraction under 2.5 litres without changing the filter (next time), and the oil level after letting it settle was exactly in between the lower and upper markings by the window, or about a third of the way up in the glass window.
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''The oil level gauge is nearer the front of the engine so the oil moving back when under hard acceleration tends to turn the light on''
Bloody hell !
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Thanks for all the advice.
Its probably rare for any motor vehicle not to have a dip stick. How about retro fitting one ? ;)
If I unscrewed the oil filler cap would that reveal what the oil level is?
Best option is probably to add oil in small increments until the level shows in the sight glass.
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Empty it, then bang in 2.5 litres for starters you can't go wrong! It's obviously a bit more if the filter gets changed too.
It even says 2500ml on the engine to the left side of the window.
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My inspection glass is dark with an off centre clear circle. Cant see any min max marks. Is the clear circle in fact a large bubble?
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The clear circle is the clear glass and the marks are two dots like brail. if you canot see the oli leavel then its either too low to be seen in the window or too full, try putting on the side stand and then look, or on the side stand on a block of wood - this would tip the oli away from the window side and you can then tell if it is overfilled
We dont have dips sticks because we have somthing much better- a little window to see the oil
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The oil level gauge is nearer the front of the engine so the oil moving back when under hard acceleration tends to turn the light on. The oil pressure is still fine, but that red light is disconcerting!
I fill to nearly the top of the window, a couple of hundred mL more than Darssi suggests won't cause problems. A torch may help you see what's going on behind the window.
Yep a couple of months ago whilst cranked over and exiting a roundabout and accelerating away the light came on for about 2 seconds, I looked and the leavel was fine -between the marks like it has allways been, so I put about half an egg cup worth of oil in and no light since
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The oil level gauge is nearer the front of the engine so the oil moving back when under hard acceleration tends to turn the light on. The oil pressure is still fine, but that red light is disconcerting!
I fill to nearly the top of the window, a couple of hundred mL more than Darssi suggests won't cause problems. A torch may help you see what's going on behind the window.
Yep a couple of months ago whilst cranked over and exiting a roundabout and accelerating away the light came on for about 2 seconds, I looked and the leavel was fine -between the marks like it has allways been, so I put about half an egg cup worth of oil in and no light since
Half an egg cup?
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Yeh --its a little cup that you can put a boiled egg into and it makes it eaiser to eat.
Ok may be a whole egg cup, that is all it needed to top up to keep the light off on accelerating hard. The leavel in the glass was ok before but the sensor must be very er---sensitive
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Yeh --its a little cup that you can put a boiled egg into and it makes it eaiser to eat.
:rollin :rollin :rollin :rollin
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No No No......It's soldiers who make it easier to eat
Everyone knows an egg cup is for engine oil top ups. duh
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Yeh --its a little cup that you can put a boiled egg into and it makes it eaiser to eat.
Ok may be a whole egg cup, that is all it needed to top up to keep the light off on accelerating hard. The leavel in the glass was ok before but the sensor must be very er---sensitive
Hmmm, you do understand that the little window level is a gauge for the oil level in the sump which is the width of the bike?
Half an egg cup would be like spitting in a bath to top it up.
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Accuracy and precision dear boy, accuracy and precision
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Cheers for helpful replies BTW :)
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Hmmm, you do understand that the little window level is a gauge for the oil level in the sump which is the width of the bike?
Half an egg cup would be like spitting in a bath to top it up.
Yep a very small amount, and thats the point, the window view said the level was ok, and as I dont want to overfill it I only put a small amount in and that is all it needed.I feel that the sensor is positioned very high. When it came on and the leavel through the window was ok I was thinking there was some other problem but it just needed a very small amount extra, I did not actually use an egg cup
I was trying to back up what was said about the light coming on on hard accelerating Doesn't mean that your oil is dangerously low.
Now on the same issue. I have always used Act-evo oil and have never had the oil light come on like that before when filled up ok, but this time- last year I used hein gerrick oil and the light was coming on on hard acc after 1000 miles. Given that the oil moves to the back on hard acc could it be that the hien oil is getting thinner quicker than the act evo and more readily moves to the back
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Hmmm, you do understand that the little window level is a gauge for the oil level in the sump which is the width of the bike?
Half an egg cup would be like spitting in a bath to top it up.
Yep a very small amount, and thats the point, the window view said the level was ok, and as I dont want to overfill it I only put a small amount in and that is all it needed.I feel that the sensor is positioned very high. When it came on and the leavel through the window was ok I was thinking there was some other problem but it just needed a very small amount extra, I did not actually use an egg cup
I was trying to back up what was said about the light coming on on hard accelerating Doesn't mean that your oil is dangerously low.
Now on the same issue. I have always used Act-evo oil and have never had the oil light come on like that before when filled up ok, but this time- last year I used hein gerrick oil and the light was coming on on hard acc after 1000 miles. Given that the oil moves to the back on hard acc could it be that the hien oil is getting thinner quicker than the act evo and more readily moves to the back
You mean you lied :eek I've ruined the wifes favourite egg cup and now don't even have you as back up when the shyte launches :'(
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I was just trying to give a unit of measure that even an idiot would understand to give a quick idea of an amount, gonna stick to ml in the future
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Agreed, oil glass a step backwards from the humble dipstick, even worse with a factory belly pan installed as this obscures the sight glass.
Had wondered if something off an old Yam model would fit the bill~ but that's as far as i got....wondering.
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I was just trying to give a unit of measure that even an idiot would understand to give a quick idea of an amount, gonna stick to ml in the future
ml???
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I was just trying to give a unit of measure that even an idiot would understand to give a quick idea of an amount, gonna stick to ml in the future
ml???
millilitres
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milly litres
Wish I never chipped in
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Good to see humour isn't wasted at this time of night :rolleyes ;)
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so anyway acting on Fazersharps suggestion (cheers) I put bike on sidestand to check level.
No braille like dots visible but a backplate with two hoLES.
Seeing this it's clear with centrestand the engine is overfilled. Surely such a mistake will cause serious damage :'(
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At a random guess i'd say putting the bike on the sidestand and checking the oil is like someone serving you a pint with the glass at 45 degrees........not normal or acceptable behaviour!
Centre stand (on level straight ground)
Start bike
Leave running for 30-45 seconds
Let oil level adjust for a minute
There's your oil level.
If it's above the higher dot......you focced up.
If it's below the lower dot, discard your egg from your beloved cup and with 50% shots of oil top up as required and repeat the above steps until you are happy.
Clean egg cup with non poisonous cleaning stuff, ie: Fairy Liquid......rinse thoroughly......then reinsert egg and carry on with breakfast......apologising to soldiers for the delay!
It takes a lot quicker to do than it took me to write this, bearing in mind i was on my own mission at zero dark thirty last night and got home around 3.30am. :b
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so anyway acting on Fazersharps suggestion (cheers) I put bike on sidestand to check level.
No braille like dots visible but a backplate with two hoLES.
Seeing this it's clear with centrestand the engine is overfilled. Surely such a mistake will cause serious damage :'(
First photo, look to the right of the window, can you see the braille like dots that you can't see?
They look like dots, almost braille like...... :lol
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......then reinsert egg and carry on with breakfast......apologising to soldiers for the delay!
I like that --well done :rollin
The origional poster was not sure on centrestand if he was looking at an overfilled sight glass or such an un filled oil leavle that he was lookin at no oil.... The idea to put on side stand to look was to see if there was a difference and indeed there was, so that proves the there is oil in there but it shows that there may be a little too much
If you dont want to drain out some maybe you could get a sryinge and a short piece of tube and suck some out from down the filler cap, not sure if it will work, and may be more of a faff than draining a little from the drain bolt. Watch out if you do it at the drain bolt as if you take it all the way out--which you most likley will need to, the oil will at first come at you like projectile vomit which wil go all over you -your exhaust- your hands and your drive. That is why i make the sryinge suggestion.
When I change the oil and filter I whack in 2 ltrs - maybe a bit more and then the rest I pour in an egg cup 8) at a time -waiting each time for it to get down there and looking at the window- give it chance to filter down, egg cup at a time and get the level betwix the marks- but nearer the top one than the bottom or your oil light will come on - on hard accelerating, Which refers you right back to my first post --dear liza ---dear liza---with what shall I fill it.... ....
Look again grass hopper you look but you dont see-- here are your two dots giving the upper and lower marks
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You don't check the oil until you've run and coated the engine first, which is why your egg cup theory is really not a theory at all, 'cos if you were to wait another 20 minutes the oil will rise and rise 'til you can't see a level.
If you are not starting the engine, which is sounding increasingly likely by the sounds of it, then you do not have enough oil in your engine.
Hence the reason your oil light comes on!
When the bike is static, the window will show pure oil.
When changing oil, refill with exactly 2.5 litres, start engine for 30-45 seconds, then wait and watch the oil level rise.
It will settle down after 30 odd seconds, that is your oil level.
If it ain't quite right, then top up, gradually, then start engine again and let settle before checking again.
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At a random guess i'd say putting the bike on the sidestand and checking the oil is like someone serving you a pint with the glass at 45 degrees........not normal or acceptable behaviour!
Centre stand (on level straight ground)
Start bike
Leave running for 30-45 seconds
Let oil level adjust for a minute
There's your oil level.
If it's above the higher dot......you focced up.
If it's below the lower dot, discard your egg from your beloved cup and with 50% shots of oil top up as required and repeat the above steps until you are happy.
Clean egg cup with non poisonous cleaning stuff, ie: Fairy Liquid......rinse thoroughly......then reinsert egg and carry on with breakfast......apologising to soldiers for the delay!
It takes a lot quicker to do than it took me to write this, bearing in mind i was on my own mission at zero dark thirty last night and got home around 3.30am. :b
:lol :lol :lol :lol
FWIW a 50/100ml syringe plus tubeing should be in every bikers toolkit, useful for removing excess crankcase oil ,adjusting fork oil level....bleeding troublesome brakes...well worth the price of a pint.
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You don't check the oil until you've run and coated the engine first, which is why your egg cup theory is really not a theory at all, 'cos if you were to wait another 20 minutes the oil will rise and rise 'til you can't see a level.
If you are not starting the engine, which is sounding increasingly likely by the sounds of it, then you do not have enough oil in your engine.
Hence the reason your oil light comes on!
My oil light only came on for an instance on hard accelerating and after a year and 1000 miles.
I see what you are saying about starting the engine to splash your bits with oil and then let it settle, but once you have chucked in 2.5 ltrs - you know that is in there, and then you pour in a bit at a time to get your level -- how much (i wonder) is there going to be used up coating your coggs.
Anyway I spose I do actually start the engine cos when I have filled I go for a quick spin -wait to cool down and then check and top up if needed.
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You don't check the oil until you've run and coated the engine first, which is why your egg cup theory is really not a theory at all, 'cos if you were to wait another 20 minutes the oil will rise and rise 'til you can't see a level.
If you are not starting the engine, which is sounding increasingly likely by the sounds of it, then you do not have enough oil in your engine.
Hence the reason your oil light comes on!
My oil light only came on for an instance on hard accelerating and after a year and 1000 miles.
I see what you are saying about starting the engine to splash your bits with oil and then let it settle, but once you have chucked in 2.5 ltrs - you know that is in there, and then you pour in a bit at a time to get your level -- how much (i wonder) is there going to be used up coating your coggs.
Anyway I spose I do actually start the engine cos when I have filled I go for a quick spin -wait to cool down and then check and top up if needed.
Waiting for it to cool down just throws everything i said out of the window.
Wait for the level to settle, we're talking seconds, not minutes.
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I dont think that either way -either of us is going to be far out.
As the same amount of hot or warm oil or cold is still going to left stuck on the coggs as that is what it is supposed to do.
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Well i won't be far out, i've been doing it for 26 years now......thanks for the instructions though :lol
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I hope that we have both helped all future readers and the origional poster.
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I hope that we have both helped all future readers and the origional poster.
This has definitely helped me! I was unaware that you had to run the engine before checking the level, so no wonder I got the red light of death!
I just added 50ml of oil whenever it came on though so I reckon I'm ok.
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I hope that we have both helped all future readers and the origional poster.
This has definitely helped me! I was unaware that you had to run the engine before checking the level, so no wonder I got the red light of death!
I just added 50ml of oil whenever it came on though so I reckon I'm ok.
Good to hear :)
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Wow some one swallowed a rather large sarcasm pill today, or was it just a clever dick?
The reason I posted and why Fazersharp suggested putting on sidestand was because I couldn't see a level and therefore didn't know if that was oil behind the glass or just the colour of the glass. A simple obvious suggestion and not one requiring a rocket scientists degree. Thankfully.
By putting on centre stand I was able to see an empty chamber without first dumping oil and now know what I should be seeing on centre stand after engine running.
Possibly due to having tinkered with cars and m/bikes, including the whole complete strip down and rebuild in living room and bathroom did I think to actually think of checking level on sidestand. It's just sometimes good to take a thing apart to see how it works.
First photo, look to the right of the window, can you see the braille like dots that you can't see?
They look like dots, almost braille like......
Excellent suggestion. Again not Rocket science but I was looking for dots on/in the glass so was blind (excuse the pun) to the braille on the side. But hey as I've always said if we were all perfect it would take the attention away from the smug bastards :D
Thanks for all your help
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Incidentally just been out to recheck and decided to look at glass while engine was running. The oil drops to only just below the top dot while running and the reason I was not seeing a level when getting down after engine stopped is because it literally refills in seconds. So I would now ask (if I hadn't been made to feel silly for asking questions with obvious answers) If anyone had looked at glass while engine was running and taken mental note where their level is in relation to dots.
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Incidentally just been out to recheck and decided to look at glass while engine was running. The oil drops to only just below the top dot while running and the reason I was not seeing a level when getting down after engine stopped is because it literally refills in seconds. So I would now ask (if I hadn't been made to feel silly for asking questions with obvious answers) If anyone had looked at glass while engine was running and taken mental note where their level is in relation to dots.
....Mmmmm?...now that is wierd midden?....mine dissapears completely when i run mine!!..and only show the correct level again when i switch off?... :rolleyes ....that is on center stand btw?
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Wow some one swallowed a rather large sarcasm pill today, or was it just a clever dick?
The reason I posted and why Fazersharp suggested putting on sidestand was because I couldn't see a level and therefore didn't know if that was oil behind the glass or just the colour of the glass. A simple obvious suggestion and not one requiring a rocket scientists degree. Thankfully.
By putting on centre stand I was able to see an empty chamber without first dumping oil and now know what I should be seeing on centre stand after engine running.
Possibly due to having tinkered with cars and m/bikes, including the whole complete strip down and rebuild in living room and bathroom did I think to actually think of checking level on sidestand. It's just sometimes good to take a thing apart to see how it works.
First photo, look to the right of the window, can you see the braille like dots that you can't see?
They look like dots, almost braille like......
Excellent suggestion. Again not Rocket science but I was looking for dots on/in the glass so was blind (excuse the pun) to the braille on the side. But hey as I've always said if we were all perfect it would take the attention away from the smug bastards :D
Thanks for all your help
Take no notice of me fella, i'm on a recovery mission from last night still, i'm only kidding :b
On the oil note, it does sound like you have a bit too much in there?
When you switch the engine off you should be watching the oil level rise to where you want it to be between the dots.
If you don't actually know how much is in there i'd suggest letting a bit out and getting it right.
When i bought my bike the previous owner put 4 litres of oil in instead of 2.5, and when i eventually took it for a spin it caused a gasket leak :'(
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All done in good spirits, both ways ;)
so I've been riding bike a month now with it overfilled. here's hoping seals still ok. best act now.
Cheers also CRH :)
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All done in good spirits, both ways ;)
so I've been riding bike a month now with it overfilled. here's hoping seals still ok. best act now.
Cheers also CRH :)
Do you have any history of anything on the bike at all, as in oil changes, filters, etc?
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after 1st and 2nd service official stamped then 3rd and 4th penned by owner i presume. the fourth showing oil and filter change in June last year (if to be believed). the bikes only done 1k miles since and 700 of those by me. think i'll find a straw and suck some out for now :)
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after 1st and 2nd service official stamped then 3rd and 4th penned by owner i presume. the fourth showing oil and filter change in June last year (if to be believed). the bikes only done 1k miles since and 700 of those by me. think i'll find a straw and suck some out for now :)
You can undo the sump bolt and let a bit out into a clean container then re-use if necessary.
If you leave the filler cap done up it won't shoot out so mad as well.
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K just to bore u on this one last time.
I decided to go the suck it thru straw and took out (rather slowly) 400ml (that is millilitres as I've recently discovered :rollin ) which took the oil level below top dot so then run the engines for a good few mins plus. oil not visible while running and then after switching off and leaving for about 5min I got the level in pic which I think is acceptable.
As for the 400ml I will keep for a day in case top up required before using to make some Girt lush biker chips :rolleyes
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Quite a bit over then, well at least it's sorted now, and you now know the correct procedure too. :)
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Gonna do it all in one post
I just added 50ml of oil whenever it came on though so I reckon I'm ok.
That would be about an egg cup then.
When i bought my bike the previous owner put 4 litres of oil in instead of 2.5,
Woh I had no idea you could even get that much in---they must of filled it to the top of the filler cap--like when you do your coolent
I decided to go the suck it thru straw and took out (rather slowly)
I am so glad that this worked, its exactly how I used to do stuff like that so got some srynges now
If you leave the filler cap done up it won't shoot out so mad as well.
Great tip
And looking at your oil that red colour is the same as castrel act-evo
Also any sarky -ness that others see, I usually just see as lighthearted and jokey and I can give out just as much, just so long as I can see that people are getting the idea im sposed to be being funny
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I'm still a little confused by the oil level check. With the engine running the oil level disappears completely. As soon as I stop the engine the sight glass fills up to the top and beyond in a few seconds. So how do I check the level properly?
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What you are doing is checking it correctly. And what your check is showing is your bike is overfilled with oil.
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I'm still a little confused by the oil level check. With the engine running the oil level disappears completely. As soon as I stop the engine the sight glass fills up to the top and beyond in a few seconds. So how do I check the level properly?
With the engine running the oil is doing it's job being chucked about lubricating everything.
When you stop the engine, with bike on the centre stand, it should settle in about a minute and should be about two thirds up between the lower/upper markings next to the window.
If it goes above that you have too much in and you should let a bit out of the sump bolt then go through the motions of starting/checking/topping up(gradually) until it levels in the correct place.
Too much oil can cause problems as well as too little.
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If you're not sure how much is in it just drain it all out and fill it with the correct amount that's stated in the manual. Measure it out and don't worry about the sight glass. If you put in what it says in the manual it'll come to the correct level in the glass. You can't go wrong.
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([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=5723.0;attach=8017;image[/url])
This looks about as much as an egg cup :b
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Ok I'll drain some out. Thanks