old - Fazer Owners Club - old
General => General => Topic started by: philshaq on 01 August 2012, 11:46:23 am
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Hi guys,
Quick question regarding the use of ramps…
I’m most likely going to be buying a bike tonight after a fairly long search and my idea all along has been to also buy a ramp from ebay and use this to get the bike into my back garden, up probably 4 steps totalling probably about 3.5 foot with a ramp of 2.1 meters long, but with the day of trying this getting pretty close I thought I’d ask to tap into your collectively vast knowledge!
A few questions, does anyone currently do this?
How difficult is it going to be?
Should I be looking at a longer ramp or will the gradient be ok?
What is the best method? i.e. walking at the side of it (not really an option for me as the steps aren’t wide enough) or riding it up with something to rest your feet on should you need to stop / touch down.
Do you think it will be possible to do on my own?
I was thinking about putting something into the ground at the base of the ramp for it to rest against so it doesn’t slip when I ride up it, do you think I need anything more than that?
And finally (!) will two planks be enough to put down at the sides (one each side) of the ramp for feet to be put on if I need to pause / take it slow while going up the ramp? Or should I be looking at something sturdier?
Thanks in advance,
philshaq
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Feet on the pegs, standing up (lowers the centre of gravity), big handfull of throttle and hit it at about 20mph.........
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and right through the back door into the kitchen!!
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Ah, that could be a problem. If you've got very little space I would have said walking up alongside it would be best but you have said you don't have the width which is a bit of a problem. Even that isn't without difficulties as a motorcycle without a rider tends to have a habit of spinning the wheel if you aren't careful due to the lack of weight to keep the rear wheel gripping. So if your ramp is wet, or even remotely slippery, you could end up with the bike slipping sideways and ending up on top of you. Sides to the ramp can help if you choose this way of doing it, at least it stays on the ramp then. Having loaded some very heavy motorcycles onto trailers in the past, I know this from experience and the best way is to take a long run up, get the bike straight and ride up the ramp. Even with a 2.1m ramp you are still looking at a fairly steep slope, longer would be better.
Remember, if you are riding at low speed with your feet down, the bike is at it's most unstable as your weight is on the seat so the centre of gravity is higher. Standing on the pegs lowers the centre of gravity, that's why motorcross and trials riders stand up over the slippery bits.
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Feet on the pegs, standing up (lowers the centre of gravity),
Eh?
But I agree with the method, standing up makes it easier to move your centre of balance if the bike teeters on the brink of going over.
I'd hit the ramp at 40mph, mind... 8)
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I know, takes a bit of getting your head around that by making yourself higher you are lowering the centre of gravity. Think about it, if you are sitting on the seat, a large weight is placed at the highest point of the bike so the CoG is higher. Standing up, that same weight is placed at a much lower point on the bike, the pegs, so the CoG is lowered. Think of it the same as loading a car with a roof-rack. You could put all the heavy stuff on the roof-rack and the lightweight stuff in the car. The car rolls like hell on corners because the CoG is higher. Swap things around so the heavy stuff is in the car and the lightweight stuff on the roof and it's much more stable. It's the same height and weight but you've lowered the CoG.
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I know, takes a bit of getting your head around that by making yourself higher you are lowering the centre of gravity.
You're right of course, I was confusing it with the centre of mass, er.. I think.
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Apologies for thread drift but .....
"The centre of gravity is defined as the average position of weight distribution, and mass and weight are technically different properties. However, because weight and mass are proportional, the center of gravity and center of mass refer to the same point of an object for almost all objects on and near Earth's surface."
The car roof rack example is not really valid as you talk about moving the mass and not the point where it attaches to the car. You've lowered the CoG by lowering the mass. If you leave the load on the roof but change the point where it attaches would the car handling change (assuming it is a rigid body)?
If you stand on the pegs the centre of mass will be higher (but you will have more control by moving your body from left to right). I'm with Phil .... or have I missed something here?
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Dunno, I rode a ZX6R up a flight of 6 steps into the lobby of an office block to park it once, but I did a lot of trials riding when I was younger.
It's easier then you think!
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Thanks for all your comments as always!
To bring it back to the purpose of the thread... this picture is what I have to get it up, it's about 4 foot wide but the use of any speed is really restricted so it's going to have to be slowly slowly bike in garden.
The plus point being no-one will try to thieve it once it's there.on a ground anchor!
Thoughts...?
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cant you completely slope the width of the steps - or are you partial to the steps themselves?
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I think the missus would kick off!
Plus I'm not sure the underside of the bike would clear the top step with the front wheel on the flat but the back still coming up the ramp. Would need to be more gradual mi thinks, although not sure.
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Looks easy! Backing it down will be a tad more difficult but slowly with plenty of front brake will do the trick and fold the wing mirrors in. I had the same problem with my ZX6 when I lived in Stratford and parking on the street was not an option. The ZX made the clearance ok with the full fairing, the Fazer should piss it.
Just start slowly at the foot of the steps and the suspension does the rest.
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You are never going to get a bike up them steps,,a ramp from out in the road would be bifficult,
you need a Montesa trials bike
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I just calculated the angles with the help of pythagarus (?!) and the angle of a ramp 2meters long when resting against the top step is 21 degrees. Steep granted, but not un-scalable.
I'll have a bash next week and let you know how I get on!
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Oh god!!
Looks Like an accident waiting to happen, Like Lazarus says, could you mix up some concrete to ramp out the steps, right down to the gate, you could also angle grind off the top step even further to cut down the steep angle - if you can make sense of that you're a better man than I am..
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Move house to somewhere flatter?
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Its happening!! Its up for sale at the minute!!
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I've got it...
Stannah Stair Lift for Bikes..!
:lol
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use scaffolding planks screwed together to cover almost the entire width of the gap. length should be from the actual road to the top of the step. or better still would be to use a spacer underneath the top end so the wood is level with the upper surface. you will also need to pack out the space underneath to stop springiness. just build up using timber to the corresponding step. finally, use a rope to tie the ramp to that handrail. it will be heavy but ok. sit on the bike, slow speed, feet down.
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Pine wood will rot in a year.
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A winch! Remote controlled preferably
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Don't know how to post links, but if you look up "20 idiots on motorcycles" on utube, some of the clips are of people using ramps to TRY to load bikes on trailers.
Not sure I fancy it tbh.
Could you do something like putting a ramp on the steps and store the bike with the front wheel only as far up the steps as to allow the gate to close. Change to a solid wooden gate so ppl can't see your pride and joy, then anchor chain it there?
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Don't know how to post links, but if you look up "20 idiots on motorcycles" on utube, some of the clips are of people using ramps to TRY to load bikes on trailers.
All of them made the fatal mistake, they shut the throttle too soon. Once you decide you are going to go for it, you go for it, you don't bottle it halfway or you will end up under the bike.
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Agree with rusty, prob best option is to move the steps closer to the house if you have room. Expensive tho, and as you are intending to move in no way practical sadly
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Cheers guys, I've been having a think about your different suggestions - was tempted to go and ride it up the steps without a ramp but then I realised I didn't want to kill myself!!
I think im going to go for the 2.5meter ramp, with two lengths of wood the same length to put my feet down on either side so I can walk it up the ramp.
I think i'd have toyed with the idea of moving the steps if we were staying but you're right Bitfik its too costly...
Plus there is the advantage of it being up some steps without an easy way down if I use a removable ramp so no-one can swipe it if they fancy cutting through the lock/ground anchor and disc lock that will be on it. Plus the chain around the gate at the bottom.
If I manage it and can do it half decently I'll post a video!
What's the worst that can happen...
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I notice with the 20 idiots they all seemed to be Americans or German trying to be an American. It brings to mind the phrase ''learning to walk before you run, so first learn to hold a bike up right , then progress to taking a bike into a corner going around it and then out of a simple corner and maybe then progressing to going up a ramp.
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Make very sure the ramp is fixed top or bottom as the bike will eject it out the back. :lol
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good point Manuel! I've planned on fixing it at the bottom by securing a piece of wood into the ground for it to but up against when in place. I was also thinking of some retaining straps at the half way point.
So whats the betting on me managing it, or does everyone think I'm going to end up trapped under the bike on the steps until I die of starvation or blood loss?!! now that will be something to watch on youtube...
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Hope it all goes well m8. Please tell us!
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Did you not like the winch idea? Maybe someone local could let you try before you buy?
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Make sure the ramp has a decent non-slip surface, otherwise even with the slightest damp the bike will go sideways.
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My second idea is to buy a crane dickturpin... that should sort it out!
None slip is a must, I'll either make sure it's got it on or put it on after with glue and sharp sand.
Cheers guys, I'll let you all know.
Phil
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i would make a concrete ramp from top step to gate,sit astride the bike with feet on the floor and ease up using throttle and clutch.....if your using the bike every day i would also remove the hand rail.........good luck ;)
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My bike got picked up yesterday by the seller, dealers, a slight misfire at low speed,just turn the throttle a bit it splutters and then goes well,,haha too well,,anyway the had a marvelous set of steel galvanised ramps to get the bikes in the transit van.
Then on the site i am working at they have steel scaffold planks with grip cutouts,raised holes for grip,,a couple of them in a line would be perfect,better than wood,,perhaps
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My bike got picked up yesterday by the seller, dealers, a slight misfire at low speed,just turn the throttle a bit it splutters and then goes well,,haha too well,,anyway the had a marvelous set of steel galvanised ramps to get the bikes in the transit van.
Then on the site i am working at they have steel scaffold planks with grip cutouts,raised holes for grip,,a couple of them in a line would be perfect,better than wood,,perhaps
yes....much better than wood....wood outside is never going to last ;)
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Why not build up slowly with a couple of ramps and some oil drums, get your confidence up over some obstacles before attempting the steps
:lol
Kickstart here we come!
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Like this you mean?
http://youtu.be/AP4yJDGHZBc?t=40s (http://youtu.be/AP4yJDGHZBc?t=40s)
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"wood outside is never going to last "
trees seem to manage fine.
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Trees do seem to do fine, but I wouldn't want to ride a bike up one...
THanks for the suggestions as always, I may try going for smaller heights to start with... Its only 28inch high though so not too bad!
I've bought a 7.5foot 18inch wide ramp, that should sort it out, just need two pieces of wood the same length to put down for my feet as I'm going to take it up nice and slow with my feet down on the planks on either side... then I've just go to get it back down!!!hahahaha...
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Back downs the trickey bit....
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Get some wood made up or make yourself ,triangular to fill the space of the steps thus making a slope,you can make them stay in place by affixing battens each side then just simply lift off after use.
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Well. I passed my test today. (Wooooooooooo)!!!
Picked up the beast from my dads, he followed me through on his blade and helped me practice. Here is the photographic evidence that it worked, nill broken bones, no more scratches, and only a mildly annoyed wife!
I think that's a successful day all around!!
Now I've got to do it in the wet...
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Why is hte wife annoyed?
1) The bike at all?
2) The bike in hte garden?
3) the ramps?
4) Its just how she is?
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Option 2!
"where's my garden gone?!!" Its not for long, we will be moving out soon...
She's now looking at eternity rings, as I've got a treat for me! Can't argue really. She's pretty cool!
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well done m8 :thumbup
remember- they arent called ETERNITY rings for nothing ;)
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Firstly, congrats on passing your test! I wish you many happy and safe years riding!
Also well done on the ramp thing, have you tried taking it down yet? Shouldn't be a problem I think.
Finally well done on keeping her indoors happy! No mean feat in itself!
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Cheers guys.
I ended up out on it for about 3 hours today, so much fun!
Can't believe how rapid it is, it's definitely braver than I am, and probably will be for some time!
Bitfik; thanks, I've had it down and up a few times, practiced a few times with my dad there incase I over balanced. I'll get a video up soon,speed is key (just like everything else, although the missus would disagree...!)
Phil
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Why sideways
(http://i470.photobucket.com/albums/rr61/slimwilly/redfz.jpg)
is this correct!whats going on :rolleyes
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Cheers Manuel. I'm posting from a smart phone, not sure why they are rotating when I upload...
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I thought it was right the first time. I figured he'd got it up the ramp and then it fell over.......