old - Fazer Owners Club - old
Bikes, Hints'n'Tips => FZS600 Fazer => Topic started by: Lawrence on 18 June 2012, 10:05:23 pm
-
Had another problem develop this afternoon. Coming home from work I filled up with petrol, same petrol station as usual (same pump even) but when I went to restart the bike just cranked over and over and didn't want to fire. Tried a few times, then waited a minute and tried again, more cranking, then it fired up the instant I pressed the button! Remainder of the journey (another 45 miles ish) it was fine. When I got home I switched it off and tried starting again and it did the same thing. It'll just randomly start working and when it does it fires up straight away. Big backfire out of the exhaust on two occasions but that's just down to all the fuel going through it and not being burnt off I guess.
To add to this, I went for a quick run down the road and when I was turning round in a layby, sitting still in neutral it just conked out - not like a stall, but like I'd turned the ignition off. Once I'd got it going again it rode home perfectly, plenty of power, no missing or anything.
Now this definitely sounds electrical to me, but what could it be? It was wet this morning, but it was wet last week and had no issues then... anyone got any ideas? Need it for work and I can't really afford to have it off the road for any amount of time :(
Ta very much :D
-
Sounds electrical to me as well. If you used the side stand when you stopped it could be the cut out switch on the side stand sticking. Worth a quick check.
-
The side stand stops it cranking though doesn't it?
Might just be water in the coil(s?) from the rain this morning maybe? I'll see how it starts in the morning...
-
Worth checking your electrical / ignition circuits for breaks / chafing / corrosion as well as water ingress.
Anything going through plugs / sockets can be a menace.
-
Start simple, charge the battery.......and make sure plugs haven't come loose at all, it happens ;)
Also, make sure the rubber flaps in front of the plugs are pushed forward protecting them from water.
-
a good close inspection of all electriacal connections for anything amiss...take the tank off and check the coil connections.....battery,side stand cut out check the lot ;)
-
Started first push of the button today :D So looks like it was water in something, possibly side stand switch or killswitch maybe? I'll go over all the joins with contact cleaner tonight and check plug caps are down firmly, flap things are in the right place etc.
It has now however developed a chirping noise on overrun... I think it's something to do with the clutch mechanism inside the sprocket cover (I had that off yesterday to check out the nut) so need to take that off again and stick a bit of new grease in it.
-
Has it got an alarm or immob?
-
Nope, no fob and no key chip.
-
Well rules that out then!
-
Started fine this morning but I've just come out of work and it took aaaages to get it going. I've had to turn it off to go in somewhere and now it won't start again O_o battery is going to die sooner or later.
-
I've found the Fazer to be easier than any bike i've ever had to bump start, have you tried that out of interest?
Battery leads done up tightly?
-
I've bumped it before (before this problem appeared) no problems, I tried bumping it yesterday and it just didn't want to fire. I'm going to get new plugs tomorrow and try that, I'll also get my meter on the coils etc and see what's up.
-
when its not starting see if you have a spark by taking the plug out re-connecting the ht lead and earthing the plug on the engine fins and turn the engine over with iginition on ;)
-
Just read your original post again, i don't s'pose you've had your tank up, or off, at all and perhaps kinked a fuel pipe?
And are you getting the clicking noise of the fuel pump when ignition is turned on?
I'm wondering if it's fuel starvation?
Doubt very much if it's the actual plugs, a clean up and checking the gaps will probably be okay for them.
-
Red: Last time I tried that it was the one time it actually started up :lol I'll give it another go tomorrow.
Darrsi: I have had the tank off/up, but not for a couple of days before this started. I'm pretty sure it's electrical from the way it'll crank over without a hint of firing for ages, then just as you're about to give up you hit it one more time and bingo it fires up instantly! Plugs look a bit scabby so I don't think a new set will hurt and for the sake of a tenner or so it does at worst rule them out.
-
if i was you i would re.check the pipes under tank??......could be restricting fuel...or breather pipe trapped causing vacuum in tank?
-
I'll definitely take a look at that tomorrow, want to check out the pump/relay while I'm under there.
As for breathers, there aren't any :look just two connectors on the bottom of the tank... I know they're not blocked though because I tipped the tank up a bit too far last time it was off and petrol leaked out of them :rolleyes
-
to chk for any vacuum in tank?...when youve had it running for a bit and it stops on you?...open filler cap and see if it hisssses? if it does?....it shudnt??? ;) ...thats what could be happenin ? you run for a bit ?..then it Stops?.. if it was a vacuum problem it would stop fuel going to carbs?....intermittantly!!
-
It's only cut out once, but that was more like hitting the killswitch than fuel starvation - it just died, no spluttering/rough running. It has failed to start twice now when leaving petrol stations, so there shouldn't be a vacuum immediately after filling up.
Fairly sure it's electrical, got a feeling it's plugs or pump but will have to do some investigation tomorrow.
-
whilst you at it ?...chk for water in petrol?
-
For the record 99.9% Isopropyl Alcohol binds with water in the fuel tank, and then it gets burnt off.
I put 200ml in every full tank of fuel over winter otherwise it suffers from carb icing, not only does it get rid of any water it also lowers the freezing point.
But that's a totally different story..........
-
Just tried it, pump primed fine but no spark on cranking! What's the prime suspect for this? Do these bikes have one coil or 2/4? Anything else that can get tempramental and give results like this?
-
2 coils...and yes! it could be your ecu playing up?....rarely give bother though?...even if one coil had gone down?...i would have thought it would still start>...albiet only on 2 cylinders?......one for mr blade or red98 me thinks?? :rolleyes
-
your ecu is tucked away under seat behind your toolkit!!!....chk if the plugs to it are tight and that its bone dry?....not much else you can do but try another if its suspect?.......couple on ebay for £10.00........ ;)
-
when you say no spark,is that on all plugs ?...as crh says 2 coils, mounted next to fuel pump,one coil supplies cly 1+4 the other 2+3.i`ll be surprised if both coils have failed at the same time...yes should run on 2 cylinders,did you replace the plugs ? check the ends of the ht leads these go hard after time,they can be trimmed and then re-fit the cap...not too much though as wont reach the plug,then its new coil time ;)
if no spark on any plugs i would look at side stand switch,kill switch and ignition switch next :)
-
and??....if none of the above??......chaqnge the ecu?? :rolleyes
-
and??....if none of the above??......chaqnge the ecu?? :rolleyes
if none of the above........4.5 ltrs of best unleaded and a nice shiny new ciggy lighter. never fails !! :lol :lol :lol :lol :lol :lol
-
Plugs were changed today, didn't really make any difference but the old ones were pretty scabby - two of them looked like they'd been sitting in a puddle for a while. The one with no spark was cyl 4, I didn't check the others but I'll take a spare plug with my tomorrow so that when it does it I can check them all.
I'll check out the ECU, I agree it seems unlikely that both coils would die at the same time. Might be the weekend before I get to check it out, hopefully it won't screw me around too much tomorrow/Friday.
Thanks for the advice so far, hopefully I can get this sorted out asap - I do 600 miles a week on it just going to work :D
-
good idea taking plug with you....starting point has to be to see if you have/have not got a spark on all of the plugs / cylinders :) .......do you know how long the old plugs have been in the bike ?
-
No idea, a couple of years at least judging from the condition of them.
-
have you got a spark on plugs #1 and 4? if so then left ( sat on bike ) coil should be fine. #2 and 3 are right hand. if no sparks at all good chance problem is in ecu / ignitor box of tricks as clive ( crh) has stated.........either that or it was a lucky guess knowing him :rollin :rollin :rollin :rollin only kidding clive :rolleyes :rolleyes :rolleyes
-
have you got a spark on plugs #1 and 4? if so then left ( sat on bike ) coil should be fine. #2 and 3 are right hand. if no sparks at all good chance problem is in ecu / ignitor box of tricks as clive ( crh) has stated.........either that or it was a lucky guess knowing him :rollin :rollin :rollin :rollin only kidding clive :rolleyes :rolleyes :rolleyes
.....lucky guess!!!!! how dare you? :eek .....and i thought you was my pal????? :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( .......cum along red? ..... :b ......ime not speaking to that blade bloke agen?....until he makes a retraction!!!!! :(
-
have you got a spark on plugs #1 and 4? if so then left ( sat on bike ) coil should be fine. #2 and 3 are right hand. if no sparks at all good chance problem is in ecu / ignitor box of tricks as clive ( crh) has stated.........either that or it was a lucky guess knowing him :rollin :rollin :rollin :rollin only kidding clive :rolleyes :rolleyes :rolleyes
.....lucky guess!!!!! how dare you? :eek .....and i thought you was my pal????? :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( .......cum along red? ..... :b ......ime not speaking to that blade bloke agen?....until he makes a retraction!!!!! :(
think i read that too quick............sounded pretty sexual. yucky :rollin :rollin :rollin :rollin :rollin :rollin
-
no!!!! not sexual at all!!!!!.........but???? :rolleyes ......he did ask me if i would do his housework for him?...whilst he played around with his ..genny!????? :b ....of cause i declined!!!!! ;)
-
now now boys,calm down your both getting over excited...and you know what happened last time......
back to the problem ,if no spark on any cylinders i too would suggest changing ecu,simple job,2 plugs,2 screws,job done....as you know i do have a spare but not for sale...if your local your welcome to come round and try it ;)
-
now now boys,calm down your both getting over excited...and you know what happened last time......
back to the problem ,if no spark on any cylinders i too would suggest changing ecu,simple job,2 plugs,2 screws,job done....as you know i do have a spare but not for sale...if your local your welcome to come round and try it ;)
pot / kettle....................................filth !! :evil
-
new that was wrong as i was typing it :o ...trying to be all polite tonight and not lower myself to you levels...these guys are just here for a bit of help...this is foc-u.......FAZER OWNERS CLUB.....not the filth sites you spend most of your lonley nights on..... ;)
-
new that was wrong as i was typing it :o ...trying to be all polite tonight and not lower myself to you levels...these guys are just here for a bit of help...this is foc-u.......FAZER OWNERS CLUB.....not the filth sites you spend most of your lonley nights on..... ;)
read between the smut and the advice is there for our fellow owners.........as we go through the keyhole !!!!!!!!!!! :lol oh and i aint watched `greasing up those nipples` on BSA for beginners for quite a few weeks now :rollin :rollin :rollin :rollin :rollin :rollin anyway,it sounds like you`re gonna build a monastery and sell lavendar soap before long brother !! :lol :lol :lol :lol
-
oooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooh !!!!!........ADE?.......reds gone straight????????...... :eek ...he doesnt want to be in our gang no more??
-
oooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooh !!!!!........ADE?.......reds gone straight????????...... :eek ...he doesnt want to be in our gang no more??
dont worry clive, he`s into us for too many bucks..............got him by the short and curlies !! :b
-
your right as allways ade!!.....he would be lost without us?......specialy now hes got a gen 1..... :rolleyes ...cant wait t take that t bits??
-
time for beddy byes children.......busy one tomorrow :rolleyes . sleep tight and...
keep those hands on top of the duvet :rollin :rollin :rollin :rollin :rollin :rollin :rollin :rollin A.T.B has left the forum !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
-
I dunno, you leave the place unattended for a couple of hours... :lol
Anyway, it behaved itself today, started (cold and warm/hot) perfectly every time. I did notice though that I've got a bit of hesitation when snapping the throttle open at motorway speeds - holds back for a couple of seconds and then starts pulling. Quite possibly related, or could this be down to having an aftermarket can on it?
Red, bit far to go to try it out as I'm in Colchester, but thanks for the offer. There are loads on ebay so if I do narrow it down to that, I'll get one off there. Got to check all the plugs/connectors first to make sure none are corroded or anything.
-
wouldnt hurt pocket to much to pick up a spare ecu?......for the sake of a tenner?.....if it does turn out to be that?....and goes altogether ? you may wish you had?? ;) .......simple job to swap?....
-
Think I might've fixed it! Just went to start it up and it didn't want to know... moved the steering left/right a few times and tried again, nothing... tried killswitch a few times, still nothing... ignition off/on a few times and it fired up straight away :D Loads of contact cleaner down the keyhole and turned the key a few times to get it all round the switch so hopefully it won't happen again, time will tell I guess. Will also find out of this was related to the hesitation, but I'm not too hopeful there to be honest.
Got rid of the chirping noise too, loosened off the chain by half a turn and gave it a clean/lube.
I also learnt to move the chain round by turning the wheel, not the chain, because if you move it round when your thumb is nearer the sprocket than you thought it gets squished and bloody hurts :'(
-
Think I might've fixed it! Just went to start it up and it didn't want to know... moved the steering left/right a few times and tried again, nothing... tried killswitch a few times, still nothing... ignition off/on a few times and it fired up straight away :D Loads of contact cleaner down the keyhole and turned the key a few times to get it all round the switch so hopefully it won't happen again, time will tell I guess. Will also find out of this was related to the hesitation, but I'm not too hopeful there to be honest.
Got rid of the chirping noise too, loosened off the chain by half a turn and gave it a clean/lube.
I also learnt to move the chain round by turning the wheel, not the chain, because if you move it round when your thumb is nearer the sprocket than you thought it gets squished and bloody hurts :'(
i think we have all done that at some point mate......at least you were sensible and had engine off. doesn`t bear thinking about. good to see ya making headway ;) . be wary of what you spray in keyholes. wd40 etc tend to do `the biz` but attract more grit and dirt than ever before, leading to future probs. try and use graphite powder. only need a little. just as good without the headache. cheers Ade :)
-
I used contact cleaner which should dissolve any shite that's in there on the switch contacts. I don't have any graphite powder but I'll see if I can get my hands on some. Hopefully a clean has fixed it :)
-
a few crushed pencil leads would suffice me thinks?.... ;)
-
I used contact cleaner which should dissolve any shite that's in there on the switch contacts. I don't have any graphite powder but I'll see if I can get my hands on some. Hopefully a clean has fixed it :)
nice one lawrence....fingers crossed it solves the problem....dont forget to update.... ;)
-
red?....did you get some tyres?
-
a few crushed pencil leads would suffice me thinks?.... ;)
Good thinking Batman, I'll give that a bash :thumbup
I'll give it a few days and report back :)
-
a few crushed pencil leads would suffice me thinks?.... ;)
cheapskate......always one. been there. done that. not the same :nana
-
red?....did you get some tyres?
hi crh......no :\ ...work got in the way this weekend that and taking wife`s car to bodyshop :rolleyes :rolleyes ....was hoping to go to kennington but just did`nt get time...still lots of money earnt this weekend and cassington bike night tommrow...time to show off the thou :D
-
red?....did you get some tyres?
hi crh......no :\ ...work got in the way this weekend that and taking wife`s car to bodyshop :rolleyes :rolleyes ....was hoping to go to kennington but just did`nt get time...still lots of money earnt this weekend and cassington bike night tommrow...time to show off the thou :D
and my new leopardskin mankini !!! :rollin :rollin :rollin :rollin :rollin you two are hijacking threads again. bad boys !!
-
red?....did you get some tyres?
hi crh......no :\ ...work got in the way this weekend that and taking wife`s car to bodyshop :rolleyes :rolleyes ....was hoping to go to kennington but just did`nt get time...still lots of money earnt this weekend and cassington bike night tommrow...time to show off the thou :D
......Go on then? whats she hit? :rolleyes
-
ade!!! do you mind??...me and the red are trying to have a proper conflab here?... :b .........
-
red?....did you get some tyres?
hi crh......no :\ ...work got in the way this weekend that and taking wife`s car to bodyshop :rolleyes :rolleyes ....was hoping to go to kennington but just did`nt get time...still lots of money earnt this weekend and cassington bike night tommrow...time to show off the thou :D
......Go on then? whats she hit? :rolleyes
bollards
-
ade!!! do you mind??...me and the red are trying to have a proper conflab here?... :b .........
[/
ooooooooooooooo.....[ shows handbag] :lol
-
red?....did you get some tyres?
hi crh......no :\ ...work got in the way this weekend that and taking wife`s car to bodyshop :rolleyes :rolleyes ....was hoping to go to kennington but just did`nt get time...still lots of money earnt this weekend and cassington bike night tommrow...time to show off the thou :D
and my new leopardskin mankini !!! :rollin :rollin :rollin :rollin :rollin you two are hijacking threads again. bad boys !!
leopardskin..........so last year.....zebra skin for me with matching gloves :rollin :rollin
-
red?....did you get some tyres?
hi crh......no :\ ...work got in the way this weekend that and taking wife`s car to bodyshop :rolleyes :rolleyes ....was hoping to go to kennington but just did`nt get time...still lots of money earnt this weekend and cassington bike night tommrow...time to show off the thou :D
......Go on then? whats she hit? :rolleyes
bollards
charmin?? :eek ...only asked what she,d hit???????????????????? :\
-
red?....did you get some tyres?
hi crh......no :\ ...work got in the way this weekend that and taking wife`s car to bodyshop :rolleyes :rolleyes ....was hoping to go to kennington but just did`nt get time...still lots of money earnt this weekend and cassington bike night tommrow...time to show off the thou :D
and my new leopardskin mankini !!! :rollin :rollin :rollin :rollin :rollin you two are hijacking threads again. bad boys !!
no not hijacking...........just filling in until next update........and giving lawrence some fashion tips along the way :D
-
red?....did you get some tyres?
hi crh......no :\ ...work got in the way this weekend that and taking wife`s car to bodyshop :rolleyes :rolleyes ....was hoping to go to kennington but just did`nt get time...still lots of money earnt this weekend and cassington bike night tommrow...time to show off the thou :D
and my new leopardskin mankini !!! :rollin :rollin :rollin :rollin :rollin you two are hijacking threads again. bad boys !!
no not hijacking...........just filling in until next update........and giving lawrence some fashion tips along the way :D
sick and bloody twisted ,as usual :lol :lol :lol :lol :lol :lol :lol :lol :lol . gloves sound worrying !!
-
red?....did you get some tyres?
hi crh......no :\ ...work got in the way this weekend that and taking wife`s car to bodyshop :rolleyes :rolleyes ....was hoping to go to kennington but just did`nt get time...still lots of money earnt this weekend and cassington bike night tommrow...time to show off the thou :D
......Go on then? whats she hit? :rolleyes
bollards
charmin?? :eek ...only asked what she,d hit???????????????????? :\
...ade! think red got it on him? only asked what wifey hit?..told me to bollards? :eek
-
red?....did you get some tyres?
might be wrong, but i think our mate was `refused his pleasures` last night. hence the stroppy / bitchyness :rollin
:rollin :rollin :rollin :rollin :rollin :rollin
hi crh......no :\ ...work got in the way this weekend that and taking wife`s car to bodyshop :rolleyes :rolleyes ....was hoping to go to kennington but just did`nt get time...still lots of money earnt this weekend and cassington bike night tommrow...time to show off the thou :D
......Go on then? whats she hit? :rolleyes
bollards
charmin?? :eek ...only asked what she,d hit???????????????????? :\
...ade! think red got it on him? only asked what wifey hit?..told me to bollards? :eek
-
bollards............car park bollards :rollin :rollin :rollin .....now i thinking....4 candles ;)
-
bollards............car park bollards :rollin :rollin :rollin .....now i thinking....4 candles ;)
........now!,now!..no need for that is there red?......i was being genuinly concerned? :rolleyes ....
-
car park bollards at school while dropping my son off....3 days in a friends bodyshop....repaint rear wing and blend into door....£200 all in.....nice to have good friends :D
-
car park bollards at school while dropping my son off....3 days in a friends bodyshop....repaint rear wing and blend into door....£200 all in.....nice to have good friends :D
......Ouch!!....easy done though int it?...unlike my missis?...brand spanking new car,parked across top of our drive?...4times on trot this happened?...could never catch the twat that kept doing it!!...so just joking one day,i said to her?...if that twat does it again?...back into it!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!......and guess what??????? :eek ......
-
Right... behaved itself today, started perfectly after filling up with petrol and the hesitation is gone :thumbup So it's looking good, hopefully it won't re-appear later in the week.
And the chirping noise on overrun is gone, I think the chain was too tight :groan
-
Right... behaved itself today, started perfectly after filling up with petrol and the hesitation is gone :thumbup So it's looking good, hopefully it won't re-appear later in the week.
And the chirping noise on overrun is gone, I think the chain was too tight :groan
maybe the little chicks fledged and flew the nest. fingers crossed thats you sorted then matey ;)
-
It honestly sounded like there was a couple of sparrows wedged under there somewhere :look
I also managed to average 64.4mpg over todays commute which was good :D I worked it out that roughly 1mpg lost/gained costs/saves me £50 per year and I was budgeting for 55mpg, so well pleased with that.
-
nice one lawrence........and excellent mpg.......until the weekend ;)
-
Right... behaved itself today, started perfectly after filling up with petrol and the hesitation is gone :thumbup So it's looking good, hopefully it won't re-appear later in the week.
And the chirping noise on overrun is gone, I think the chain was too tight :groan
.....well lawrence ime so glad that between us we sorted your problem??? :D .....see?...we didnt need ..red or ade the blade after all?....i take it you did the grafite trick with the pencils?? ;) .....
-
Quick update - it's been fine all week, started first time every time :)
-
Quick update - it's been fine all week, started first time every time :)
result........keep those fingers crossed ;)
-
nice work lawrence....iam pleased that you got it fixed.......realy pleased :'( :'( :'(
-
Not as pleased as I am that it didn't turn out an un-findable fault like yours :eek
-
yes....great feeling when you solve a problem.....iam sure i`ll get mine sorted but very busy at work at mo....but fingers crossed i should be able to get the tyres this weekend........enjoy you bike :D
-
Lawrence, I assume you still have not had the problem come back, it sounds the same as my problem, engine turns but does not fire, and has cut out once without warning, as if i turned it off, yet suddenly it is all fine and runs like a dream, Ignition you cleaned with contact cleaner? this is my next option! thanks
-
It's been good as gold since, squirt some contact cleaner down the key hole and turn it on/off a few times. It could also be the killswitch possibly. When it fails to start try doing each switch one at a time, but try to start it after each one... that way you'll find out exactly what it is that's stopping it :)
In other news, my cam chain has finally adjusted itself and stopped rattling too :woot
-
thats great news Lawrence, just out of interest had you been out in wet weather prior to this happening?
cheers
-
Yes, it started happening shortly after it got absolutely soaked. Once it started doing it though it didn't matter if it was wet or not. Since cleaning it's been out in the rain and been fine.