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Bikes, Hints'n'Tips => Fazer 1000/FZ1 corner => Topic started by: Neo on 19 January 2016, 07:14:54 pm
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Hi all ok so today was my maiden voyage on the fazer after collecting at the weekend, all was well it is a lovely bike with only one issue I just hope it's not a biggy. Shifting from second to third doesn't happen a lot, by this I mean the gear lever is freely working so into first no problem back to neutral no problem into second no problem out of second gear lever returns to neutral position ready for third... Raise gear lever... Nothing.... Gear lever returns back to neutral... Try third again..... Nothing (gear lever makes the travel) but no click just smooth like nothing there.. After a few more try's eventually third is found and this is how it goes on.... But the rest of the gears seem fine the problem seems from second to third only ridden it about an hour and pleased with everything else in fact more than pleased but this is tainting my overall first impression. I have read about main selector springs failing but hope it's a) nothing serious and b) not to costly, I am good with the spanners but not keen to start removing the engine and stripping gearboxes, but gutted really but don't think its cable adjustment adjustment it's done 36k
Any help would be great thanks in advance
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If it was just a case of not going into gear smooth like from neutral to 2nd then that can happen due to poorly adjusted chain, worn gear lever. Or it could be as it was in my case the clutch basket was worn enough so that the friction plates weren't releasing and causing drag.
But the fact its happening from 2 to 3rd and that fact that its not selecting a gear at all means, could possibly you have either bent or very worn selector fork, or a very worn selector drum. and both of those are an engine split to fix. If its a broken return spring, I think Ive read there are outside the main crankcase and can be replaced easily enough. But the guy you swapped your DR400 for was CLEARLY fucking aware of the fault prior to selling it to you. I know this, because this has also happened to me.
Take the bike back to him and demand in no uncertain terms a full refund and your DR400 back, if he give you any lip state you will then include all costs incurred to date (travel to collect the bike, etc etc) to the refund price.
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If it was just a case of not going into gear smooth like from neutral to 2nd then that can happen due to poorly adjusted chain, worn gear lever. Or it could be as it was in my case the clutch basket was worn enough so that the friction plates weren't releasing and causing drag.
But the fact its happening from 2 to 3rd and that fact that its not selecting a gear at all means, could possibly you have either bent or very worn selector fork, or a very worn selector drum. and both of those are an engine split to fix. If its a broken return spring, I think Ive read there are outside the main crackcase and can be replaced easily enough. But who ever sold you the bike was CLEARLY fucking aware of the fault prior to selling it to you. I know this, because this has also happened to me.
Take the bike back to where ever or who ever you bought it from and demand in no uncertain terms a full refund, if they give you any lip state you will then include all costs incurred to date (travel to collect the bike, etc etc) to the refund price.
I was hoping it's not that serious but reading other issues on here it certainly looks like it may be this il will have a fettle tomorrow and try it again but can't see it just going away there's defiantly an issue there despite previous owner denying any issue will keep you all posted ... Thanks so far
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It sound like the selector fork/drum is damaged. :( I don't think it's the return spring,as that would affect all gears.
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As you only had a few posts, I went back through and saw you did a bike swap. I know its a pain when shit like this happen, even more so because a bike swap was involved. But when it happened to me I got the police involved, if the gearbox had locked up when I was on the motorway I would have been a jam stain.
If it is just the return spring, then according to the following links its easy to replace (it just under the shifter cover on the l/h side) and prove if its that or something more serious -
- http://www.yamahafz1oa.com/forum/showthread.php?s=&threadid=11875&highlight=shifter+spring (http://www.yamahafz1oa.com/forum/showthread.php?s=&threadid=11875&highlight=shifter+spring)
Tension Spring Part# 90506-14002-00
[update]
Ninja'd buy ND, It only takes a 10-15mins to remove the shifter cover and check the detent (return) spring, if that's in place that its "return the bike and demand your DRZ400 and what ever cash you paid back. At the end of the day you could have and there is still the risk of having a serious accident due to the gearbox locking up.
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I didn't do a deal with this man I bought the bike it was the one on here for sale by wooderson in the for sale section stupidly I didn't ride it before I forked over the money but will ride it again tomorrow just to be sure and check chain line and adjustment although I did look briefly today and it looked fine to me
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- I didn't do a deal with this man I bought the bike it was the one on here for sale by wooderson in the for sale section stupidly I didn't ride it before I forked over the money
- but will ride it again tomorrow just to be sure and check chain line and adjustment although I did look briefly today and it looked fine to me
- When a fault as serious as this presents itself, the fault falls squarely on the seller.
- I would recommend that you don't, if something in the gearbox comes loose then locks up while your riding etc. Contact the police and get a reference number, then recover the bike back to where it was bought from (bring a mate to act as a witness) and inform the seller they had better have your cash waiting.
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I didn't do a deal with this man I bought the bike it was the one on here for sale by wooderson in the for sale section stupidly I didn't ride it before I forked over the money but will ride it again tomorrow just to be sure and check chain line and adjustment although I did look briefly today and it looked fine to me
As in I didn't swap a bike I just bought it :'(
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- I didn't do a deal with this man I bought the bike it was the one on here for sale by wooderson in the for sale section stupidly I didn't ride it before I forked over the money
- but will ride it again tomorrow just to be sure and check chain line and adjustment although I did look briefly today and it looked fine to me
- When a fault as serious as this presents itself, the fault falls squarely on the seller.
- I would recommend that you don't, if something in the gearbox comes loose then locks up while your riding etc. Contact the police and get a reference number, then recover the bike back to where it was bought from (bring a mate to act as a witness) and get your cash back.
Thanks for your help
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Was it a private sale or from a business..? Im currently googling consumer rights and private sales. I am fairly certain that because the fault is serious enough that it could have potentially killed you, that you unequivocally entitled to a full refund and the police need to be made aware.
Another thing that springs to mind is the bike is not fit for purpose, due to a faulty gearbox. Also quoting the Consumer act -
"The vehicle must match the seller’s description, be roadworthy"
Clearly it dosen't, as the seller never mentioned the gearbox issue and as your not a trained mechanic you cannot be expected to spot such a serious fault, even less so as it dosen't happen all the time. So more info that seem relevant -
- http://www.which.co.uk/consumer-rights/problem/the-second-hand--car-i-bought-has-a-problem-what-are-my-rights (http://www.which.co.uk/consumer-rights/problem/the-second-hand--car-i-bought-has-a-problem-what-are-my-rights)
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Was it a private sale or from a business..? Im currently googling consumer rights and private sales. I am fairly certain that because the fault is serious enough that it could have potentially killed you, that you unequivocally entitled to a full refund and the police need to be made aware.
Another thing that springs to mind is the bike is not fit for purpose, due to a faulty gearbox. Also quoting the Consumer act -
"The vehicle must match the seller’s description, be roadworthy"
Clearly it dosen't, as the seller never mentioned the gearbox issue and as your not a trained mechanic you cannot be expected to spot such a serious fault, even less so as it dosen't happen all the time. So more info that seem relevant -
- [url]http://www.which.co.uk/consumer-rights/problem/the-second-hand--car-i-bought-has-a-problem-what-are-my-rights[/url] ([url]http://www.which.co.uk/consumer-rights/problem/the-second-hand--car-i-bought-has-a-problem-what-are-my-rights[/url])
Hi it was a private sale, the bloke seemed so genuine, when I questioned him yesterday in a text message he said he had never noticed it and he said it could be where he changed the levers to pazzo recently, I said it's not that or clutch related as all other gears and clutch bite is fine, I'll re try the bike later although I doubt it will have self healed over night, then I'll re contact the seller if there is definitely an issue and see where to go from there.
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Might be worth trying to select the gears by hand with the bike on the centre stand and turning the back wheel by hand, with the engine stopped of course.
When I say turning the back wheel I only mean rocking it backward and forward to move the gears so they can engage when you get full pedal movement, not trying to turn the engine.
If third engages engages every time that way then you might need to adjust the gear lever position to suit your own foot position. It's a long shot but if the seller is telling the truth it might sort it for you.
I have found just wearing some different boots can affect how the gear change feels.
Worth a try and if it still fails to engage gear you can demonstrate it to the seller.
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Might be worth trying to select the gears by hand with the bike on the centre stand and turning the back wheel by hand, with the engine stopped of course.
When I say turning the back wheel I only mean rocking it backward and forward to move the gears so they can engage when you get full pedal movement, not trying to turn the engine.
If third engages engages every time that way then you might need to adjust the gear lever position to suit your own foot position. It's a long shot but if the seller is telling the truth it might sort it for you.
I have found just wearing some different boots can affect how the gear change feels.
Worth a try and if it still fails to engage gear you can demonstrate it to the seller.
agreed I tried this yesterday and it goes in absolutely fine will try today with flip flops briefly so I get full feel I really think the seller is genuine hence the doubt in myself I hope it's me as I LOVE the bike
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UPDATE ... Just been out for an hour with trainers on eeek... But I could feel the heat change better and all gears now work fine (embarrassed) not sure why it did it yesterday... Must be boots in a certain position insipid I did fettle with the chain and linkages and whilst sometimes the gear lever seems stiff coming back down through the box it's bearable so looks like it was operator error in this case which is good as I love the bike it's brill around town easy to go to 20 in top then pull away and nice and balanced plenty of poke God knows why you'd want more !! I'll keep you all posted with progression but all seems well so thanks for all your advice on here you all top people
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UPDATE ... Just been out for an hour with trainers on eeek... But I could feel the heat change better and all gears now work fine (embarrassed) not sure why it did it yesterday... Must be boots in a certain position insipid I did fettle with the chain and linkages and whilst sometimes the gear lever seems stiff coming back down through the box it's bearable so looks like it was operator error in this case which is good as I love the bike it's brill around town easy to go to 20 in top then pull away and nice and balanced plenty of poke God knows why you'd want more !! I'll keep you all posted with progression but all seems well so thanks for all your advice on here you all top people
edit.. Gear changer not heat changer .... Apple typo grrrr
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Glad to see it wasn't a major problem :) I'm already spending money on mine, needs the fork seals changing but I've done it before on other bikes and there is a decent guide on the older Fazer forum, the yuku one, so I should be good to do this at the weekend.
Hope to see your around.
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Cheers Tom I could have popped in earlier I just went to Bognor on the "shake down" run with me trainers on as mentioned, yours looks nice mate my number is 07414140141 if you want to meet up for a ride out?? Did you get yours locally? People on here say there faster in blue
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Ps good luck with the fork seals ha e you a workshop manual?
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Carl salter has various manuals you can download
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I didn't know about that website, I'll bookmark that one. Thanks but like I said I found a pretty comprehensive guide here:
http://fazerowners.yuku.com/topic/23188/HOWTO-Forks-Seals-Bushes-and-Oil#.Vp9UF1OLRUc (http://fazerowners.yuku.com/topic/23188/HOWTO-Forks-Seals-Bushes-and-Oil#.Vp9UF1OLRUc)
Looked through it and it all looks right, plus since I've done it before shouldn't be a problem.
I'll shoot you a message and we'll meet up sometime, be good to have a blast when I can afford the fuel xD
It's nippy compared to the DRZ, I'll give it that. Comfy as well.
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went to bognor eh? i'm just outside portsmouth, maybe a southern meet and ride might happen?
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went to bognor eh? i'm just outside portsmouth, maybe a southern meet and ride might happen?
sounds like a plan man :-)
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Good to hear it's sorted. The time to be embarrassed would have been if you had turned up at the sellers place with the fraud squad!!!
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There is something i was thinking about when you said the gear lever had been changed. What might be worth checking is the linkage rod that goes through the frame. If it is incorrectly adjusted the rod may be touching the frame when the lever is fully extended and therefore not allowing the gear to be fully selected.
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There is something i was thinking about when you said the gear lever had been changed. What might be worth checking is the linkage rod that goes through the frame. If it is incorrectly adjusted the rod may be touching the frame when the lever is fully extended and therefore not allowing the gear to be fully selected.
good idea ill look into that, just glad it rode ok today, do you all fill the oil between the lines on the sight glass? my site glass was full so i emptied out a little out the drain plug it was literally only at the top of the site glass
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Keep the oil level right at the top line. The oil light comes on if the level falls below half way, particularly if you accelerate hard when the oil level is down there.
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Keep the oil level right at the top line. The oil light comes on if the level falls below half way, particularly if you accelerate hard when the oil level is down there.
thanks for the advice
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1. You may have got the R1 shift mod fitted which can mean the rod rubs the frame. Bend the rod a little if it does..... Or I have the standard shift arm from long gone 02 here somewhere.
2. Put the oil back to the top of the sight glass or you will get paranoid when the low oil LEVEL light comes on when you are riding....
Whale
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Great! I'll check the linkage for signs of rubbing and also top up the oil again thanks for all your help so friendly here
8)
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Only came across this now.
This is a common enough problem with a badly adjusted gear lever and easy enough to check and for some strange reason effect 2nd to 3rd gear mostly.
Ride the bike and when you are in second gear move your foot away from the lever completely, then return you foot to change gear again.
If it goes in every time you do this then the lever is adjusted to low
The problem occurs because the lever has not returned completely to the home position as your boot is holding it slightly off the home position and when you go to change again you get the blank as you describe.
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Only came across this now.
This is a common enough problem with a badly adjusted gear lever and easy enough to check and for some strange reason effect 2nd to 3rd gear mostly.
Ride the bike and when you are in second gear move your foot away from the lever completely, then return you foot to change gear again.
If it goes in every time you do this then the lever is adjusted to low
The problem occurs because the lever has not returned completely to the home position as your boot is holding it slightly off the home position and when you go to change again you get the blank as you describe.
This would explain it, if needed I assume you can adjust the position via the linking rod rather than on the splines?
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Yes you can adjust the height by rotating the linking rod. Check the position of the gear lever where it attaches to the splines. There is a dot on the shaft that should line up with gear lever arm. Make sure that you check if the linkage rod is rubbing on the frame. If it's adjusted correctly it should be completely clear of the frame with lever in up change and down change position. :)
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Only came across this now.
This is a common enough problem with a badly adjusted gear lever and easy enough to check and for some strange reason effect 2nd to 3rd gear mostly.
Ride the bike and when you are in second gear move your foot away from the lever completely, then return you foot to change gear again.
If it goes in every time you do this then the lever is adjusted to low
The problem occurs because the lever has not returned completely to the home position as your boot is holding it slightly off the home position and when you go to change again you get the blank as you describe.
This would explain it, if needed I assume you can adjust the position via the linking rod rather than on the splines?
I had this problem on my thou when I first got it, adjusted lever up a fair bit never had a problem since
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Yes you can adjust the height by rotating the linking rod. Check the position of the gear lever where it attaches to the splines. There is a dot on the shaft that should line up with gear lever arm. Make sure that you check if the linkage rod is rubbing on the frame. If it's adjusted correctly it should be completely clear of the frame with lever in up change and down change position. :)
may have a look tomorrow afternoon if I get finished early and the rain that is forcased slings it hook, I'll check make sure the dots line up would never had known that !
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Yes you can adjust the height by rotating the linking rod. Check the position of the gear lever where it attaches to the splines. There is a dot on the shaft that should line up with gear lever arm. Make sure that you check if the linkage rod is rubbing on the frame. If it's adjusted correctly it should be completely clear of the frame with lever in up change and down change position. :)
Line the punch mark on shaft up with the slot in the shift arm first, then adjust the rod.
Remember the lock nut nearest the lever is a left hand thread, normal tightening rotation loosens it
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Handy tip easy to monkey it if you didn't know that and I didn't! So thanks again
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:thumbup
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While you're in that area, check that the Rose joints are aligned correctly and greased. If the joints are twisted towards the edge of their rotational limit, they tend to bind a little.
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All excellent advice & suggestions. Its amazing what a little "fine tuning" can make to the feel & action of controls. While you are checking have a look at clutch adjustment. Even angle of levers & pedals in relation to bars/footpegs can make a huge difference. Dont be embarrassed-we are all learning new stuff every day! :lol
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All excellent advice & suggestions. Its amazing what a little "fine tuning" can make to the feel & action of controls. While you are checking have a look at clutch adjustment. Even angle of levers & pedals in relation to bars/footpegs can make a huge difference. Dont be embarrassed-we are all learning new stuff every day! :lol
Thanks dave, I did actually adjust the lever position the other day both the clutch and the brake lever were to low for me now it's more comfy
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Glad to see this wasn't as serious as first feared.
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Glad to see this wasn't as serious as first feared.
No, all seems ok thanks, not had the weather to try it again but on the last ride it seemed to be ok thanks again for the help