old - Fazer Owners Club - old
Bikes, Hints'n'Tips => Fazer 1000/FZ1 corner => Topic started by: FuZzBoM on 22 April 2014, 02:26:39 pm
-
Hi all,
I currently have a Gen1 with 8k on the clock with following upgrades.
Ivans kit, braided lines front and rear, EBC HH Pads, pipercross air filter, blueflame end can, Hyperpro springs in forks and on shock. Just passed MOT with no advisories Bike is in mint condition.
I enjoy riding it a great deal bought it with 5k on the clock 2 years ago and done 3k since. goes well, handles well and I enjoy every factor of it. BUT I fancy something a bit newer for some reason?!
My issue is does the extra cash I will spend warrant the change?
My other issue is that I am 6'3 and 17 stone and change so thinking will the gen2 be too firm for me? I always wanted an R1 but due to my size I have avoided one after sitting on one a few years back. Just looking for a compromise I guess.
Any thoughts welcomed
-
I am the same size and weight as you and have been through the same dilemma........and decided to keep the Gen1 as it does everything I want and need it to do......the thought of selling it and then realising how good it actually was against any new purchase made the decision for me......I have mates with Fireblades, ZZR1400's and R1's and its never been an issue keeping up or overtaking them.
-
Ill try give my views on the gen 2 best i can but i dont have a bike history so i cant compare to the gen1.
I am a fat heavy bastard though.......just had a foot long steak and cheese subway om nom nom!!!, :lol
Wouldnt say i do touring....no i don't...but 300 miles a day is the usual if I'm out for the day....mine will have a gel seat.
Gen2 certainly doesnt have the following of the Gen1 & that speaks volumes but im looking for handling, not neccesarily an all rounder & i couldnt give a foc about pillions.
-
I've got a well sorted gen II which I genuinely love to bits, and I've been fortunate enough to ride a well sorted gen I similar spec to yours, albeit with an R6 shock conversion.
The bike you've got is a corker! You really won't be gaining much by changing it. The gen II is maybe slightly better handling, bit if your on the heavy side, you'll notice the lack of mid range torque on a standard bike, and the shock will need upgrading too.
You really have to tune the gen II to get the same low down thrust as a gen I, and this is gonna cost 5-6 hundred quid.
It all depends on what you want to do with the bike.
Also, the gen II isn't a good distance bike.
-
The GenII is a serious disappointment if your coming from a litre sportsbike.
It goes like a wet blanket under 7krpm until you chuck a pile of money at it to make it go properly :rolleyes
But once its sorted it goes like a '99 R1.
-
The GenII is a serious disappointment if your coming from a litre sportsbike.
I think that's a bit harsh Mattsplat, it's still a deceptively quick bike for the road.
And as quick as a 99 R1???? That's a big ask of any bike. I had one for 7 years, and have never ridden anything else like it since.
-
You've got a very low mileage Gen 1 with some seriously good mods (hence £s spent). By your own admission you are only doing 1500 miles a year.
So have you maybe got the itch to try something different?-get a good test ride to compare the torque characteristics with your current bike. Also comfort & riding position for your weight/height. If you were considering a Gen 2 are you talking stock or one with power/suspension mods already done? Theres going to be a £price involved in swapping but you wont know if its worthwhile unless you ride one.
-
Jus do a straight swap with kitcrazy...he wants...you want...no foccing...easy peasy.
Then yous can swap back in a couple years.
His bike comes with the wife mod though (see pic).
-
Usually the Spring brings an urge to change bikes and usually a few test rides makes you realise the bike you have is worth keeping.
If you are 6ft 3 I suspect you wont even need a test ride, just sit on a Gen 2 in a dealers will be enough to put you off. The footpeg / seat distance is pure sportsbike and I (at a mere 5ft 9 found it cramp inducing after an hour).
I tried a Gen 2 and the z1000sx 2014 on the same day and both are, to my mind flawed bikes trying to be too many things to too many people. Neither would have been anymore comfortable for distance riding than my RC8 with some bar risers.
I still have a Superduke for Sunday morning blasts so I bought a Gen 1 for everything else.
-
I tried a Gen 2 and the z1000sx 2014 on the same day and both are, to my mind flawed bikes trying to be too many things to too many people.
I bought a Gen 1 for everything else.
Ironic isn't it. Here are two bikes you got the impression were trying to be too many things to too many people. And yet you wound up with one of the best "all rounders" there is, and yet it was pure accident that this is what the gen 1 turned out to be, as Yamaha's marketing was "son of R1" - pretty much portraying it as a hooligan streetbike, which it most definitely isn't, leastways, not in standard form.
I haven't ridden one, but got the impression from write-ups that the Z-SX would be too similar a machine to the gen 1 to go from one to the other. What made the gen 1 better in your eyes?
And from what everyone here says, I thought the FZ1 was meant to be more sports focussed than the gen 1, and yet you say it was trying to be too many things - I thought it's place was as a sports bike for people who didn't want the cramped, stretched-arms position of an R1/Blade/GSXR etc.
-
The z1000sx was a bike I really wanted to like. I waited for the 2014 model as I thought ABS and traction control may be worthwhile. I was less keen on the pointless engine modes (1 full power 140bhp ish and 2 x 100bhp old lady modes). However the seat is thin like a sports bike, the bike has a really nasty vibration most noticeable about 7000rpm and fit and finish are terrible. I doubt anyone that has ridden a Gen 1 would think they were similar.
The z1000sx is more akin to the Gen 2. The Yam has more power, a better seat but both are cramped in the seat peg area. That is what I mean by the Gen 2 trying to be too many things. Imagine putting handlebars on an R1 or GSXR, you get a more upright ride but you wouldnt want to tour europe on it. That is exactly what the Gen 2 felt like to me.
I already have a Superduke which is a pretty sporty riding position for an upright bike but I suspect the seat to pegs distance is actually greater on that than on the Gen2.
In 2000 I bought a new R1. I wouldnt have looked twice at the FZS1000 when it was launched the following year. But now, older and wiser, or at least creakier, the FZS is exactly what I want, nice riding position, comfortable seat, decent tank range and still goes like stink. Everything else is improveable but those fundamentals are what has made the FZS into a classic and I dont see anything else on the market to compete
-
Yeah, gotta say the comfort factor of the gen 1 is a big deal to me, as I'm not getting any younger/fitter either, but still like a bike that can shift when I want it to. And I agree, no one has come up with anything to rival it since as far as I can see. It's a hard, if unintentional, act to follow :)
-
I have to say I don't think you would get any benefit from a gen II, you already have a well sorted bike which is about as good as it is going to get in that class. If you really just want a newer version of the same, then I would look at the the z1000sx as the closest on the market to a gen1. It is not perfect and would need a few mods to bring it up to scratch, just as your existing bike needed them, but it is a decade younger and has some cool new toys to play with as well.
I wouldn't worry about the buzz through the bars that someone mentioned, as it is a quacker feature and not a problem. A buzz through the bars as you pass through a ton (just under 7k in top) is to remind you that you have passsed through a ton. What you do about it is up to you, but it does help avoid those "How the foc did I end up doing 120mph and not notice" moments that are so common on the Fazer.
-
Hmmmmmm.....interesting.
Ill keep my eye on this thread me thinks.
& ill leave my judgement of the gen2 until i ride it.
Everything ive heard thus far says that the gen 2 is the better handling.
Then a day after i do a deal on one everyone is popping out to say maybe not so.
I dunno what to believe anymore....but i wont kid myself either after a spin.
Wont be the worst test I've ever tasked myself with.
-
Hmmmmmm.....interesting.
Ill keep my eye on this thread me thinks.
& ill leave my judgement of the gen2 until i ride it.
Everything ive heard thus far says that the gen 2 is the better handling.
Then a day after i do a deal on one everyone is popping out to say maybe not so.
I dunno what to believe anymore....but i wont kid myself either after a spin.
Wont be the worst test I've ever tasked myself with.
I don't think anyone here has said that the gen 1 handles better than the 2. The question seems to be more one of riding position. I knocked up a knee pretty much in a smash - my right one doesn't bend so far without a deal of discomfort, otherwise, I'm sure I'd enjoy the 2 as much as the 1 - except maybe for the touring stuff. Stop worrying Noggy, you'll be fine with it :)
-
It's weird. I've been on this forum for many years now, and still the Gen 1 is talked about with reverence and love. There is nothing else like it and although we have had the Gen II, Ducati MonkeyStrangler and now the Z1000SX there's still something about the old bugger that means there's not a lot of point in buying either. They cost a lot more and are barely better at anything.
I bet Yamaha haven't a clue how they did it!
Still, we might get a new Fazer in the next year or so, but has anyone noticed what BMW are up to - an upright sports tourer with active suspension based on the 160bhp S1000…. now that sounds interesting.
In answer to the original post, though, yeah, get a Gen II. Great bike. The only trouble is… you have to keep the Gen I!
The only thing that gives you a real reason to change is either more comfort (tourer), much better handling (sports bike) or a lot more power - a ZZR1400 with bar risers for instance …. and that was the only thing I've come across which really made me want another bike. It's just as comfortable, just as economical and somewhat more than quicker. Servicing's expensive though.
Funny thing is, when I get back on the Gen I after a few weeks on the ZZR, I just adore riding it, even with it's spindly wobbly front forks. Must get them sorted one day.
Gen 1: Greatest bike I've ever owned. By a country mile.
-
Looks as though I opened a huge debate lol.. I like the suggestion of having 2 bikes but if I did that it would have to be a Aprilia tuono as the 2nd. I just love them. couldn't use it for touring due to my height/mass limitations along with lack of garage space so have been unable to justify it.
Also I purchased an Impreza in November last year so Mrs would kill me. So alas I must be a 1 bike man.
I wanted an MT-09 but after sitting on one I decided it wasn't for me.. was hoping a Gen2 might be a good upgrade. I think for me it may be more of a sideways move? Went round Ireland 2 years ago on it and did 1400 miles in 4 days. loved it, very comfy even on the crap Irish roads. Gen2 will probably be rather harsh on the bottom when I do this years tour up Yorkshire way and the 3 national parks.
This trip is middle of May so I will have a think about it while trudge up the motorway :lol
By all means keep the thread going, is a very interesting debate.
If I come along to any ride outs this year please do not be offended if a tall fat hairy bloke asks to sit on your Gen2 :rollin
-
If you have the quest for ultimate power through tuning, that's where the gen II wins hands down.
With all the mods (full exhaust system, airbox mod and filter, ivans reflash, pc5 and map, 16/47 sprockets) you will have well over 155bhp at the wheel, and almost an R1 with flat bars (albeit a bit heavier).
With all these mods, the bike is an absolute animal! The ivans flash is supposed to remove the restrictions in the first three gears, and re-tunes the secondary flies to gain the mid range torque back. Apparently it's a bit wheelie prone after all that :o
-
Nobody has IMO got a viable gen1 alternative.I have been looking since 2005. All similar bikes have issues, and issues which will cost to sort ..on top of a hefty new price tag.I have been trying several just now and still am struggling to find something which is a step on.About the only bike I do like Is the vfr1200, and rather curiously its Xtourer brother. Why ? ...cos the engine is simply fantastic. Just as in its day the FZS engine stood head and shoulders above the rest. Chassis wise the fazer has always been simple, not terribly effective, but easily modded, and for not too much cash.Its competition was bandit , zrx1200 etc. Both quite crude. Many mags rated the GS of its day as competition, but in reality they were totally dissimilar.Owning both a GS and a fazer now I can tell you they are still totally dissimilar, bar they can overlap in roles.Its the awesome power of the fazer engine in an ordinary upright frame chassis which is the difference. Even the Z1000SX has less power ...MS and 1190 adventure almost there but with mega price tags , and high seats.
I tried the new tiger sport , but its more of a evo of the sprint than a fazer , and suffers cheapo suspension, poor screen and hard seat. Almost like the first FZ-1 !..add in a curious steering wander to the front wheel at low speeds...and its disappointing for what is almost 10k.
You could argue the world has moved on with adventure bikes, but they are simply popular because they offer the comfort and usability lost in the evo of sportsbikes into racebikes on the road. Definitely the ewan and charley effect boosted the genre, rather than road bikes like the fazer taking over. My own thoughts are the FZ-1 killed the genre cos it was too sporty in bias...leaving the way open for adventure bikes to develop. Triumph copied the GS with its tiger 1050 in 2007, which helped set the trend. Oddly the S1000R is possibly the breaking point when bikes may go back to being more road biased. I welcome the change, but budget wise, its fantastic priced money ...bikes need to be sub 10k IMO to ever become as popular. Hence why I do think Triumph have missed a great opportunity with the tiger sport. It should have been the new fazer alternative.
Mind you , purists might say that the first gen1s were overpriced, had ineffective screens, hard seats and crap rear suspension....so hey ! maybe triumph have copied the gen1 ! :rolleyes
-
So Yamaha hit on a winning bike(maybe by accident?) with the Gen 1. As Pitternator says-if the gen 2 effectively killed the genre by making it more "sporty" in seating position & engine characteristics, that begs the question:what could/should they have done to the Gen 1 to retain its essential essence/character?
History has since shown they were going in the right direction in the early 2000s by providing an alternative to racebike clones-they had the FZS models as an alternative to the R6/R1. They seemed to lose direction in recent years with no new designs & high prices. Hopefully the new models arriving now will help keep biking fun& affordable as I don't know many people willing to shell out £12 to £15 grand for a bike. So what could/should they have done to the Gen 1 in 2005 to get round the euro emissions regs at the same time keeping the essential character of the machine?
-
i have a gen 1 with nearly everything i can do on it. I rode stevierst's bike and i have to say i really like them maybe even enough to chop mine in for one i like the handling and like how much smaller and lighter they are. Also steve's growls and really is nice to ride.I'd say have a go see how it feels to you.
-
begs the question:what could/should they have done to the Gen 1 to retain its essential essence/character?
The FZ1 is not really so very far from what the gen 1 should have developed into. Give it a bit more leg room and a comfy seat and you'd be about there I reckon. With injection remapping and maybe some mild engine work, it could probably have the gen 1s wider spread of power without losing the kick at 7k-ish.
Injection and emissions regulations have definitely moved the goal posts since the gen 1 first hit the streets though, but I think some manufacturers are slowly clawing back what was lost.
-
I have a Gen2 FZ1s, and its awesome,,great fun to ride,,,tootles around town,,winds up nicely in the countryside,,goes ballistic if you use the revs :)
Plenty of 1000cc torque mid range so you can ride it like a Gen 1 i guess :)
Bars can be changed for different reaches and rearsets could be changed and i have seen seats changed,,,,,oh i have seen all these on Gen1s of course,,,so the choice is the riders of course.
-
I've had both and prefer the gen2, it's just more me !
-
I think if you have to own 1 bike only, and like sporty riding, the Gen 2 makes a strong case. i would rather have a Tuono V4 but you cant get those for less than 4k.
My preference for the Gen 1 is biased in that I intend to keep a sportier bike for fun rides and use the FZS for everything else.
-
I think if you have to own 1 bike only, and like sporty riding, the Gen 2 makes a strong case. i would rather have a Tuono V4 but you cant get those for less than 4k.
My preference for the Gen 1 is biased in that I intend to keep a sportier bike for fun rides and use the FZS for everything else.
The older Tuono V-twin was the one I had my eye on. can get a nice one for about £3k
But I just know I will be too big for it. I am in no rush to change just yet so will see what my trip in May brings. Most of my riding is out with mates for fun. only minimal touring really BUT I know I will miss it if I had something more sporty.
-
"Thinking about going from Gen1 to a gen 2.. thoughts?" (http://foc-u.co.uk/index.php/topic,12734.msg143572.html#msg143572)
NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO
-
The older Tuono V-twin was the one I had my eye on. can get a nice one for about £3k
But I just know I will be too big for it. I am in no rush to change just yet so will see what my trip in May brings. Most of my riding is out with mates for fun. only minimal touring really BUT I know I will miss it if I had something more sporty.
I wouldn't discount the early Tuono based on size, the RSV on which it is based was known to be slightly larger more accommodating sports bike than the Japanese alternatives. I am as tall as you and 'bigger boned' and when I test rode a Tuono it felt pretty good and I didn't feel it made me look stupid which I think would be a problem with a physically smaller bike like the Gen2. The Tuono I rode was the 'Factory' Racing edition with all the trick bits fitted, I came back from the ride with a silly stupid grin on my face and would have bought it there and then but it was a grand out of my reach. Having sung it's praises the Tuono does lack much of the practicality of the Gen1 and I personally would have worries about reliability and cost of ownership of anything from Italy which don't come into the equation with my Gen1.
-
"Thinking about going from Gen1 to a gen 2.. thoughts?" ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/index.php/topic,12734.msg143572.html#msg143572[/url])
NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO
:rollin
-
Don't get me wrong I love the bike. But with my mates having newer machines I feel a bit like the poor relation so to speak.
Makes me feel bad because I know I would rather have the mighty fazer over say a street triple of a v-strom 650 etc. like my mates have.
And Going touring this year my mate with the street triple said he could not do 800-900 miles in 4 days with us because the seat, riding position and lack of wind protection would kill him... I have also had no issues keeping up with him through the twisties so not a performance issue.
I dunno, maybe I am just looking to change for the wrong reasons..
-
Plenty of other bikes out there I'd like to own, but as I always say, not at the expense of my gen 1, not on the money I'm on anyway. Most knowledgeable riders tip a nod to them anyhoo - they ride with a well piloted one and then don't dismiss them out of hand any more - plus what you say about arriving at your destination without all the aches and pains, plus once Ivanised, no snatchiness like many modern injection bikes.
And I couldn't give a toss what others think about it :lol
-
Don't get me wrong I love the bike. But with my mates having newer machines I feel a bit like the poor relation so to speak.
Makes me feel bad because I know I would rather have the mighty fazer over say a street triple of a v-strom 650 etc. like my mates have.
And Going touring this year my mate with the street triple said he could not do 800-900 miles in 4 days with us because the seat, riding position and lack of wind protection would kill him... I have also had no issues keeping up with him through the twisties so not a performance issue.
I dunno, maybe I am just looking to change for the wrong reasons..
So your mates have new bikes and by the street triple admission is uncomfortable with no wind protection......but your Fazer does.....and he cant out run you on it either.....and as for the comparing a v-storm 650 to the FZS1000....hang your head in shame boy!!!!!!
-
It's interesting looking at the stats on howmanyleft.co.uk. Yamaha sold a hell of a lot more FZS model bikes such as the thou and the original Fazer 600 than the later FZ1 and FZ6 models. In fact the FZS600 sold almost 10 times better than the later bikes.
I can kind of see Yamaha back in 2004 planning the next FZ models thinking that since the uprights sold so well, they could see a shift to that kind of bike from sports bikes coming and so made the second generation machines more like sports bikes - revier engines, shorter stroke suspension and so on.
But I think they missed what was fundamentally driving sales of those bikes, and that was the sheer usability of the earlier models.
Tank range, for instance has gone down consistently over the years. I'm sure Yamaha and the other manufacturers look at the annual mileage of bikes, see 5000 miles per year and think 'oh, no one needs a big tank because they're not doing big mileages', or perhaps it's a mass centralisation question - small tank of fuel means better handling.
Also, long stroke suspension is ideal for road bikes and so are engines with loads of grunt, both attributes which Yamaha has picked up on with the new MT zero series of bikes.
Maybe they screwed up with the second gen FZ bikes because they were still stuck in the horsepower race, where every year, the bikes had to be faster so they responded by making them revier and revier. Nowadays, the horsepower race is pretty much over and again Yamaha's new MT zeroes seem to have picked up on that and instead are now trying to make the engines usable over a wide rev range (by over, I mean that if you want more power, you just get a bigger engine - the licensing laws across Europe now mean that no one is stuck with a small capacity bike and revving it's tits off)
And now we have half the biking population going over to big trailies, probably because of their usability. But they're not much cop at commuting because they are enormous and have ludicrously wide bars. Can't tell you how many times I get stuck behind these land yachts in traffic because of that. Maybe we will see more standard road bikes like the Z1000SX, MT0xx, BMW S1000S coming through once the Ewan and Charlie effect starts to wear off.
Personally, I just want a great sports tourer and they are like hen's teeth. There's only been two - the original VFR750 (the K model to be specific, the later bikes are water buffalos) and the Gen 1. I think the reason the VFR-FK was such a good sports tourer is that it was a cutting edge sports bike that just so happened to be comfortable, had a big tank and was exceptionally well made.
What I actually want now (and I've said it before) is a comfortable 1100cc Cross Plane R1 with an upright riding position, a big tank and a comfy seat. Failing that, the new BMW will probably fit the bill. What I do not want is a heavy bike. Large, certainly, because I'm 6'1", but I don't see why sports tourers have to be heavy. And from that point of view, the FZ1 Fazer was right on the money.
I'd just love to see Aprilia to take the V4 Tuono a little bit more towards the sports tourer side of things. That bike, with decent weather protection, would be the ultimate for me. It's sends shivers down my spine just thinking about it, but even if I got one, I'd have to get the tank enlarged and maybe fit the fairing from the RSV4. That's a lot of work. Oh, and then I'd do something about the chronic fuel consumption, because from what I hear, it's pretty thirsty. But still, what a machine that would be. You could do Cadwell Park on the weekend, commute to work monday to friday and then pop over to the Alps for a holiday the following week.
And that is exactly what I did on my FZS1000 a couple of years back. It didn't flinch and was totally at home doing any of those things.
Oops, I've blethered on again….
-
What I actually want now (and I've said it before) is a comfortable 1100cc Cross Plane R1 with an upright riding position, a big tank and a comfy seat. Failing that, the new BMW will probably fit the bill. What I do not want is a heavy bike. Large, certainly, because I'm 6'1", but I don't see why sports tourers have to be heavy. And from that point of view, the FZ1 Fazer was right on the money.
Hmmmm, yes I may have mentioned on several other forums that I would one day investigate fitting a cross planed crank engine into a Fazer chassis. That is surely what Yamaha should offer next to replace the current Fazer Thou? I am pretty sure the next R1 wont be a cross plane so why not keep the engine design alive in sports tourer / road bike / adventure bike varients? They could use that single base engine to compete in 3 market places at once pretty much as Triumph have with the 1050 lump.
-
Yes, and it's also what BMW are doing with the S1000 engine, and the R1200, and actually, the Gen 1 engine was derived from the R1, come to that.
Given Yamaha are putting CP2 and CP3 on the MT zero series bikes, it makes a cross plane Fazer 1000 or 1100 likely, but it's a long time coming. The CP R1 is now 5 years old.
Anyway, whatever comes, I just hope to god they don't give it a tiny tank and no weather protection.
I really like Yamahas for their engineering, so I also hope it's not too difficult to work on. The Gen 1 is a breeze, but maybe modern bikes are simply too complicated (emissions, FI etc) these days for that to be anything more than a pipe dream.
-
It's interesting looking at the stats on howmanyleft.co.uk. Yamaha sold a hell of a lot more FZS model bikes such as the thou and the original Fazer 600 than the later FZ1 and FZ6 models. In fact the FZS600 sold almost 10 times better than the later bikes.
I can kind of see Yamaha back in 2004 planning the next FZ models thinking that since the uprights sold so well, they could see a shift to that kind of bike from sports bikes coming and so made the second generation machines more like sports bikes - revier engines, shorter stroke suspension and so on.
But I think they missed what was fundamentally driving sales of those bikes, and that was the sheer usability of the earlier models.
Tank range, for instance has gone down consistently over the years. I'm sure Yamaha and the other manufacturers look at the annual mileage of bikes, see 5000 miles per year and think 'oh, no one needs a big tank because they're not doing big mileages', or perhaps it's a mass centralisation question - small tank of fuel means better handling.
Also, long stroke suspension is ideal for road bikes and so are engines with loads of grunt, both attributes which Yamaha has picked up on with the new MT zero series of bikes.
Maybe they screwed up with the second gen FZ bikes because they were still stuck in the horsepower race, where every year, the bikes had to be faster so they responded by making them revier and revier. Nowadays, the horsepower race is pretty much over and again Yamaha's new MT zeroes seem to have picked up on that and instead are now trying to make the engines usable over a wide rev range (by over, I mean that if you want more power, you just get a bigger engine - the licensing laws across Europe now mean that no one is stuck with a small capacity bike and revving it's tits off)
And now we have half the biking population going over to big trailies, probably because of their usability. But they're not much cop at commuting because they are enormous and have ludicrously wide bars. Can't tell you how many times I get stuck behind these land yachts in traffic because of that. Maybe we will see more standard road bikes like the Z1000SX, MT0xx, BMW S1000S coming through once the Ewan and Charlie effect starts to wear off.
Personally, I just want a great sports tourer and they are like hen's teeth. There's only been two - the original VFR750 (the K model to be specific, the later bikes are water buffalos) and the Gen 1. I think the reason the VFR-FK was such a good sports tourer is that it was a cutting edge sports bike that just so happened to be comfortable, had a big tank and was exceptionally well made.
What I actually want now (and I've said it before) is a comfortable 1100cc Cross Plane R1 with an upright riding position, a big tank and a comfy seat. Failing that, the new BMW will probably fit the bill. What I do not want is a heavy bike. Large, certainly, because I'm 6'1", but I don't see why sports tourers have to be heavy. And from that point of view, the FZ1 Fazer was right on the money.
I'd just love to see Aprilia to take the V4 Tuono a little bit more towards the sports tourer side of things. That bike, with decent weather protection, would be the ultimate for me. It's sends shivers down my spine just thinking about it, but even if I got one, I'd have to get the tank enlarged and maybe fit the fairing from the RSV4. That's a lot of work. Oh, and then I'd do something about the chronic fuel consumption, because from what I hear, it's pretty thirsty. But still, what a machine that would be. You could do Cadwell Park on the weekend, commute to work monday to friday and then pop over to the Alps for a holiday the following week.
And that is exactly what I did on my FZS1000 a couple of years back. It didn't flinch and was totally at home doing any of those things.
Oops, I've blethered on again….
the latest model tuono v4 has a larger tank and there are several companies that make larger screens. I love mine. Engine is utterly sublime and the sound of the v4 is heaven. Still wouldn'[size=78%]t sell my gen 1 tho[/size] :)
-
So your mates have new bikes and by the street triple admission is uncomfortable with no wind protection......but your Fazer does.....and he cant out run you on it either.....and as for the comparing a v-storm 650 to the FZS1000....hang your head in shame boy!!!!!!
Neither was a comparison as such.. Both very different bikes really. I was only stating what bikes my mates have and having been out on them they are not what I would ideally go for.
the V-Strom 650 ins't to be mocked though. I was very impressed with its engine, may not have the top end of the Fazer (or any large-ish inline 4) but usable grunt out of corners is good. I would have one over the Street triple any day of the week but then with my size that is not surprising.
I have also been lucky enough to ride the 2013 Hayabusa. amazing bike can be a pussycat or a complete animal, but riding position would get to me after a while and I may lose my licence!! was doing over 3 figures at one point and honestly didn't realise.
-
the latest model tuono v4 has a larger tank and there are several companies that make larger screens. I love mine. Engine is utterly sublime and the sound of the v4 is heaven. Still wouldn't sell my gen 1 tho :)
Yes, I saw that at the bike show last year. It's still not going to do 200 miles on a tank like the Fazer though. And yes, when I test rode one, I was deeply impressed with that engine….
If I won the lottery, first bike I'd get is the RSV4 (that is a MotoGp bike, no question about it), second the Tuono. Third, I rebuild my old Fazer, blueprint the engine and find a way to make the Ohlins Mechatronic active suspension work on it.
-
I can forgive the poor fuel economy because it is such an outstanding bike to ride. I could travel as many miles on it as my fazer in comfort, but it would cost in fuel. I only use it for 2-300 mile weekend blasts. My fazer is waiting on a steering stem being sent to me from america, as i'm fitting a 2008 R1 front end onto it. (Must be trying to make it like my v4..) I have owned lot's of bikes, but for all round useability gen 1 fazers are brilliant.
-
...Personally, I just want a great sports tourer and they are like hen's teeth. There's only been two - the original VFR750 (the K model to be specific, the later bikes are water buffalos) and the Gen 1. I think the reason the VFR-FK was such a good sports tourer is that it was a cutting edge sports bike that just so happened to be comfortable, had a big tank and was exceptionally well made.
….
There was a third, truely great sports tourer, better even then the VFR or the gen1.
Stuning engine straight out of a top sports bike.
Most comfortable saddle ever put on a bike.
Great protection wind without being a land yacht.
Great looks.
Handling to keep up with top sports bikes.
Good range with 200miles between fills.
Integrated luggage.
It was a bike you could ride for 300 miles, dump the luggage and scrap knee sliders on alpine passes. And do it all again tomorrow.
The Aprilia Futura.
Nobody bought it.
-
I did :'(:'(:'(:'(:'(
-
Yeah it's fairly comfy, I used to do sailsbury to Blackpool on a friday, then back again on Sunday. 480 mile round trip.
It did however have terrible fuel injection, poor ground clearance, an affinity to set on fire for no reason! And it probably the most expensive wheel bearings on the planet!
The engine fell out of tune within a week of being tweaked, and was a pig at dialling the power in for the bends. It was petrifying in the winter!!! Dashboards used to melt down, and replacing them was over a grand!
And 200 miles to a tank????? Best was about 170-180 afaicr.
It looked good, and sounded great. A bit half hearted really, couldn't wait to get rid!
-
As long as your only thinking :lol
-
It was a bike you could ride for 300 miles, dump the luggage and scrap knee sliders on alpine passes. And do it all again tomorrow.
The Aprilia Futura.
Nobody bought it.
Ah. Now I did look at the Futura and Falco. They were interesting bikes and what stopped me buying one (I test rode the Falco) was the Gen 1. Simply, it had a load more engine and was much smoother than either. That's another thing about the Gen 1, you can trickle that baby down to 20mph in 6th and it will still pull away without much complaint. Yes, most inline 4s will, but V-Twins will jump clean out of the chassis if you try that.
-
I had a tuned falco and i really liked it. It had a great engine. I only sold it because i was offered stupid money for it. Really nice handling also. I bought a vstrom 1000 as it had a v twin engine, but it was crap. Handling poor, brakes poor and it was really lumpy around town. The falco was surprisinlg smooth low down with a midrange to die for.
-
The Japs cant really do big twins though can they. Their best effort was the SP1/2 which was only a spite attack on Ducati in WSB. Pity they didnt continue to develop that though as everyone I know who has one loves it.
I had an 04 RSV Factory which was basically the same engine as Falco, Futura. It was a nice bike but after a couple of years I was quite happy to lose 30% and buy a fireblade.
-
The Japs cant really do big twins though can they. Their best effort was the SP1/2 which was only a spite attack on Ducati in WSB. Pity they didnt continue to develop that though as everyone I know who has one loves it.
I had an 04 RSV Factory which was basically the same engine as Falco, Futura. It was a nice bike but after a couple of years I was quite happy to lose 30% and buy a fireblade.
Everything I've read says Suzuki had a hit with the TL1000 motor - pity 'bout the chassis though. I've just found out one of our reps at work has one he has thrown £££££££s at, including a complete revamp of the rear suspension set up, and a not-very-mild engine tune. He's supposed to be e-mailing me a pic of it soon. Track-only bike. I'll get him to list the complete spec too, as it sounds like a proper monster!
-
I must admit talk of this has opened the door to me looking at other bikes..
Always liked the VTR1000. only issue is small tank and I have heard from previous owners they do have a drinking problem.. Heard rumours of less than 100 miles to a tank if ridden hard.
On the v-twin theme I also like the SV1000. Probably a classic for the more upright riding position. again small-ish tank and limited range.
Apart from that I guess it is onto Ducati's.. ST2/ST4 or even stretch to an ST3.
Do I really gain anything though?
-
The only thing you gain from an Italian bike is soul. Jap bikes are definitely more reliable , but lack the character of italian bikes. I'm fortunate at the moment i can own both, but if i could only have one it would be the fazer. I may not get the thrill of the aprilia, but i know i could drive the fazer round the world twice and not worry about it.
-
just go test ride 1, simples,
i come from gsxr 1000k6 to a gen 2 and am full ivanising at the moment and suspension after that,
i brought mine cos my mrs did not like ballistic gsxr1000 rides cos pillions to high,
i find the gen 2 really comfortable i got a home made 1/4 turn quick action throttle too, by far the best mod so far and only a few pence to make,
i really starting to enjoy mine now im appreciating it for what it is rather than wanting it to be some thing else, just about to tour europe for few days two up too on it inc nurenberg ring...its a true all rounder
-
we done about 200 miles today and i took the cb1300 because i thought it would be more comfy for the missus, but she far prefers the fz1. pushing her on it around my mates, she said she now prefers it over the gen 1 i had too. it seems pillions can feel a certain amout of what the rider does, especially with regards to a lighter more nimble bike. the better power to weight ratio and newer suspension along with ABS make flinging it around and late braking etc a lot easier for me, especially two up, and she can feel it somehow. im still a huge fan of gen ones, but you cant get awayu from the fact that they are getting on..unless you get a very well maintained bike, its going to feel its age.
gen1s score high with everybody because they are a fantastic used bike and massively good buy for what they cost, but it would seem gen 2s have to be ultra cheap to sell second hand now too. so realistically you can get the newer bike with decent mods for only a grand or so more than a clean gen1, or even the same price. you cant go wrong with either, but i still prefer the tauter, lighter sharpness of my fz1, and it was relatively very easy to get into 145plus bhp land. take advantage of the cheapness of either..
-
Seems to make sense old mate..
I bought mine without looking at it,without riding one, just paid and ordered it,,not worried at all,,see,we are mostly uite adaptable,,i guess i made a good choice,,i am pleased,thats what counts. :)
-
we done about 200 miles today and i took the cb1300 because i thought it would be more comfy for the missus, but she far prefers the fz1. pushing her on it around my mates, she said she now prefers it over the gen 1 i had too. it seems pillions can feel a certain amout of what the rider does, especially with regards to a lighter more nimble bike. the better power to weight ratio and newer suspension along with ABS make flinging it around and late braking etc a lot easier for me, especially two up, and she can feel it somehow. im still a huge fan of gen ones, but you cant get awayu from the fact that they are getting on..unless you get a very well maintained bike, its going to feel its age.
gen1s score high with everybody because they are a fantastic used bike and massively good buy for what they cost, but it would seem gen 2s have to be ultra cheap to sell second hand now too. so realistically you can get the newer bike with decent mods for only a grand or so more than a clean gen1, or even the same price. you cant go wrong with either, but i still prefer the tauter, lighter sharpness of my fz1, and it was relatively very easy to get into 145plus bhp land. take advantage of the cheapness of either..
You're only saying that cos you're selling yours - oh wait, mrs says she likes it? Wasting your breath then...... :lol
-
If he's selling it why would he need to say anything in it's favour.
Give up while you're still behind Nick :b
Cue an influx of the window licking sycophants :lol
-
(http://img.tapatalk.com/d/14/05/06/pede7eha.jpg)
-
:rolleyes on cue
-
Lol I'm not selling it now, mainly because she wants to keep it. I already make far too many selfish decisions in our relationship without listening to her, so I gotta conced. She loves going fast, and the gen 2 feels faster to her than any other I've owned apart from the busa, but more importantly when we do go a bit lairy, she feels safest on the fz1. I'd rather keep the cb as it's a rarity with the fairing and it's always nice to have summat different. But like I said, she's a good woman, I gotta cut her some slack...
i mean, how many wimmin let you keep a bike in the front room, along with all your bass gear... :D
-
Yep shes a keeper ogri.
-
Bravo there Ogri, what a girl! 8)
-
Thats odd,,all very very wrong :)
-
Stepford wives comes to mind :lol
-
(http://img.tapatalk.com/d/14/05/06/pede7eha.jpg)
Ok, just to keep Exupnut happy, my turn to swing the handbag :rolleyes
If he's selling it why would he need to say anything in it's favour.
Give up while you're still behind Nick :b
Cue an influx of the window licking sycophants :lol
Let's just look at that statement a sec.
A couple of hypothetical scenarios:
1. I have a Honda Superdream for sale. It's a proper rustbucket, cam chain rattles like a good un, tyres, chain kit and pads are shot, no T&T, and doesn't run properly. Can't be bothered to sort. Make me an offer.
2. I have a classic Superdream for sale, in excellent condition. New tyres, chain kit and pads recently fitted. Full resto carried out, this bike is like new, and runs like, well, like a (Super)dream! Sensible offers considered.
(Yeah, I know, who'd want it anyway? :lol )
So why WOULD you say anything in the bike's favour? :D
BTW:
(http://i1291.photobucket.com/albums/b550/nicknicklxs/20140309_125256_zps94fbc6c3.jpg) (http://s1291.photobucket.com/user/nicknicklxs/media/20140309_125256_zps94fbc6c3.jpg.html)
SFS? ;)
MeeeeOOOOWWWWW!! :lol
-
:)
To misquote the bard:
Me thinks thou doth protest too much
Ask your bud Dazza, he explained it in eloquent prose "do you think it's the shit colour" :\
-
most definitely because we all know blue is best :D
-
At the end of the day - it's not as if the Gen2 is a new bike. It's been around since 2006 via a few upgrades i.e the shitty fuel mapping.
I reckon it's getting to be a bit of a Bandit bike:
Suzuki - 1200 /1250 (Mk1 /Mk2 /etc)
Yamaha - FZFazer - FZ1 Fazer (Gen1 / Gen2)
I have only ever ridden the Gen2 & I think it's a brilliant bike.
Just my opinion - which is like an arsehole - everbodys got one! :)
-
At the end of the day - it's not as if the Gen2 is a new bike. It's been around since 2006 via a few upgrades i.e the shitty fuel mapping.
I reckon it's getting to be a bit of a Bandit bike:
Suzuki - 1200 /1250 (Mk1 /Mk2 /etc)
Yamaha - FZFazer - FZ1 Fazer (Gen1 / Gen2)
I have only ever ridden the Gen2 & I think it's a brilliant bike.
Just my opinion - which is like an arsehole - everbodys got one! :)
Both gens are obviously cracking bikes. But to mention either one in the same paragraph as a B**dit, foc me, you know how to make enemies! :lol
-
:thumbup , yeah :foc even trying to compare Fazers to Bandits
-
Lol I had a early bandit 12, fantastic engine but shit handling. I know they got em better foro the race series, but still nothing like as good as a fazer IMHOIMHO