old - Fazer Owners Club - old
Bikes, Hints'n'Tips => FZS600 Fazer => Topic started by: mickvp on 17 March 2014, 05:48:46 pm
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So after my bike lying for 3-4 weeks, it appears it has not done the rear caliper any favours. The function has been greatly reduced, and the brake is sticking. I assume (?) That this means the caliper will need stripped and cleaned and rebuilt, which is fine, can anyone tell me how many seals I need to do this? I see wemoto selling them as singles, and they don't do a kit for the rear calipers.
I'm not interested in changing for a thou caliper, as I really want to keep it OEM (I plan on selling soon, so don't want the hassle of explaining that the rear caliper is different to someone who may not be a member from here).
Aside from giving the piston a good clean and changing the seals, is there anything else I should be looking at that may be affecting the performance? The fluid is only 4 month old, so I'm confident that's ok, although it may need bled again too?
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If you're redoing the seals then it'll need new fluid and need bled again.
There are two pistons so you'll need two fluid seals and two dust seals to complete the job. If you split the caliper then there is a very small rubber seal between the two halves. Apparently no one makes a proper replacement for it but I just reused mine, as others have done, and it's been fine. It doesn't wear out like the ones at the pistons as there is nothing rubbing on it. Splitting the caliper makes it much easier to do the seals although I only did it so that it was easier to paint it.
Chris
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I had good results with these seals
http://www.bitzforbikes.co.uk/Yamaha/FZS_600/Fazer_98_-_03/Caliper_Piston_and_Seal_Kits_ (http://www.bitzforbikes.co.uk/Yamaha/FZS_600/Fazer_98_-_03/Caliper_Piston_and_Seal_Kits_)
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Yeah, I know I'll need it off to do the seals, which will mean putting more new fluid in, I was simply hi lighting that the stuff in was new in case people thought to ask if the stuff in there had degraded.
So I need 4 seals then 2 dust seals, and 2 fluid seals. Magic, I'll get those ordered up as it's brutal not having any back brake :lol
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If you don't think it needs the seals done then just push the pistons out a bit, not fully! and polish them, then push them back in, might solve it with a lot less hassle.
Chris
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I suppose I could try that, but I suspect the calliper may be on its original seals, and polishing in that way is generally a temp fix. If I'm selling it I would rather do a pukka job on it. I'm a bit OCD that way :o
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Me too but it might sort it. Try it first, save you money and a lot of time. I presume you have a decent metal polish. I used Gtechniq M1 on mine and they came up like new.
Chris
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I've got polish coming out my ears at the minute, yes. Seems like I'm never done buying detailing kit to try out. Some britemax twins should work wonders :)
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Haha, tell me about it. Just spent a small fortune on some new bits and pieces: Megs Mf pads, Iron x, AF tough coat, oblitarate, triple. Really liking the AF stuff just now. Never used the britemax twins but heard and seen very good results.
Chris
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Some of the AF range is excellent,James who owns it is a really nice fella as well. Tripple in particular is excellent
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Some of the AF range is excellent,James who owns it is a really nice fella as well. Tripple in particular is excellent
Yeah, been really impressed by their range. Only tried triple on a small area but it was very nice to use. Tough coat is working very well, beading like a demon, just not sure how long it'll last.
Chris
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Depending on how much you use your bike, don't be surprised to still see beading after 3 months.
I've switched over to CarPro hydro 2 as my main sealant, not as durable as tough coat/cquartz uk, but it's quicker and easier to apply so I just do it more regularly as part of a wash routine.
Anyway, we have gone a bit geek, anymore of this and we will be outed on here I reckon :lol
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I've got EXO on the bike. Put the tough coat on the car to try it out.
Main sealant is EXO but the tough coat I'll use when I do friends cars etc or my favourite wax, colli 915, so easy on easy off and so durable for a wax.
Hahaha, yeah. better start a detailing thread if we want to keep this chat going. haha
Sorry everyone...
Chris
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I never understood a word.....please explain.lol
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Car/bike cleaning products ;)
Find out more at www.detailingworld.co.uk (http://www.detailingworld.co.uk) if you want to clean things like an OCD person.
Chris
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Yous pair need yur heads detailed :b
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Chris... I think you mean www.detailingnation.com mate ;)
I hear the admin on there are excellent :rollin
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Chris... I think you mean [url=http://www.detailingnation.com]www.detailingnation.com[/url] ([url]http://www.detailingnation.com[/url]) mate ;)
I hear the admin on there are excellent :rollin
Yeah ^^ that's the place I meant lads, you go there :D
Chris
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A good old clean and application of red rubber grease might do the job, might save you the hassle of a rebuild.
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So what does that involve then, cleaning it obviously, do you just put plenty round the pistons and on the back of the pads then?
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Bad weather encourages crap to build up inside the pivot of the rear brake lever, give it a spray with brake cleaner or even WD40 and then drop some 3 in 1 oil onto it and you'll be amazed at how it can improve braking sharpness.
It may not be your actual issue but you should do this every month to keep it clean anyway.
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That's a good shout actually darrsi, and something that's probably overdue given I've been out and been caught in the wet a couple of times. Likely that's contributing to my troubles as well, as I have found I also needed to flick the pedal back up with my toe as the spring just wasn't persuading it enough.
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Best stuff to use is brake cleaner and red rubber grease to achieve the same - there is a risk wd40 and similar can damage the rubber seals although admittedly I've used that and gt85 in the past with no ill effects. See the link for a good guide.
http://www.bikesandtravels.co.uk/biker.aspx?ride=156&info=1 (http://www.bikesandtravels.co.uk/biker.aspx?ride=156&info=1)
Once a piston is cleaned, I smear it lightly with red rubber grease before pushing the piston back into the caliper, and wipe off excess which will attract dirt or run off onto the braking surfaces. As the pistons might need more persuading to move this time, you could try wd40 or similar to free them up but would not use too much too regularly - my 2 pence worth. Rest is covered in the guide I think. Back of the pads and brake pins, use a little copper grease not the red stuff.
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Thanks for that fuzzy, that's a great guide.
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Best stuff to use is brake cleaner and red rubber grease to achieve the same - there is a risk wd40 and similar can damage the rubber seals although admittedly I've used that and gt85 in the past with no ill effects. See the link for a good guide.
[url]http://www.bikesandtravels.co.uk/biker.aspx?ride=156&info=1[/url] ([url]http://www.bikesandtravels.co.uk/biker.aspx?ride=156&info=1[/url])
Once a piston is cleaned, I smear it lightly with red rubber grease before pushing the piston back into the caliper, and wipe off excess which will attract dirt or run off onto the braking surfaces. As the pistons might need more persuading to move this time, you could try wd40 or similar to free them up but would not use too much too regularly - my 2 pence worth. Rest is covered in the guide I think. Back of the pads and brake pins, use a little copper grease not the red stuff.
I'm only on about the lever pivot with the WD40, i wouldn't go near the calipers with it.
Calipers are strictly brake cleaner only, as it leaves no residue at all. I've used a normal degreaser spray before and the residue left behind caused the pistons to misbehave, even though i used plenty of red rubber grease.
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Ah, see what you mean now, that's a good tip :thumbup
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Thanks for the tips guys. I popped the calliper off today and there were a multitude of issues.
The calliper had a lot of crud in it and the pads were catching on the sides, so I gave the runner portions a good clean and scrap out with a blunt screwdriver. I also took a file to the sides of the pads to get the crud and surface rust off.
I Then followed your guide for doing the pistons fuzzy, except using brake cleaner instead of kerosene/brake fluid. Took ages to get the pistons to spin to do the back, but I got there :)
Put it all back together with some liberal pyroplex grease, then copper slipped the back of the pads and built it all up. Also a fair bit of crap on the pins for the pads, so gave them a wee rub with emery too before greasing.
I did your tip as well punk sting and attacked the brake lever pin with release oil, then oiled it with some light oil.
I've not had a chance to get out and test it yet (but I will be leaving for uni soon so will get a good 30 miles to check everything), however, even just on spinning the back wheel and pressing it is night and day, so it appears to have done the trick.
Thanks again :)
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Actually, "punk sting" wasn't even on this post, but it made me laugh anyway. :lol
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Actually, "punk sting" wasn't even on this post, but it made me laugh anyway. :lol
ha! apologies Darrsi, I dont know why I thought it wa punkstig (and of course, punk sting is an autocorrect fail and not even a member on here :lol).
Anyway, 'twas a top tip mate, ill need to keep an eye on that bit and keep it clean and well oiled :)
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Actually, "punk sting" wasn't even on this post, but it made me laugh anyway. :lol
ha! apologies Darrsi, I dont know why I thought it wa punkstig (and of course, punk sting is an autocorrect fail and not even a member on here :lol ).
Anyway, 'twas a top tip mate, ill need to keep an eye on that bit and keep it clean and well oiled :)
When it's nice and clean and lubed you'll notice how very little you need to tap the foot lever for a good response, and you'll also feel when it clogs up a bit as well in the future, it's very simple but effective.
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Glad you got it sorted. I don't bother with spinning the pistons, too much effort.
Instead, I remove the metal pad spring insert (know what I mean?) at the bottom of the rear caliper. This allows better access for a toothbrush to clean, or a finger to smear red grease, round the other side of the piston. When you remove the pad spring, it also allows you to clean out any crud caught at the bottom of the caliper. A lot can accumulate there because the caliper has two smallish drainage holes which are then mostly obscured by the pad spring - a design flaw really. Might be worth trying next time - getting the springy thing out can be tricky to begin with but you'll soon get a knack for it.
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I know the spring you mean. Does that just pop put then (I.e. there's no screws or clips holding it in?)
I'll try that next time :)
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No springs or screws - It's held in by a lip cast into one half of the caliper. So you kinda have to slide it in and out (ooh er) sideways and maneuver it about a little. Once you figure it out it's easy and is quicker than spinning the pistons.