Weird Noises / Front Sprocket Troubles

[MF92]

Hi guys, having a couple of issues i cant seem to solve! any advice is appreciated!
1999 FZS600
Not sure if these two problems are related but I managed to find the sprocket problem while investigating the weird noises!Firstly, the past two or three times iv been out, at around 20-30mph (cant tell if this happens at higher speeds because of wind noise) theres a kind of squeaky, ticking noise, it almost sounds like stones are flicking up onto the down pipes but this happens on perfectly smooth roads with no loose gravel, aswell as this iv noticed a sound thats like an intermittent knocking noise coming from somewhere and a squeaky noise as though the tyre is rubbing against the fender, obviously these things arent causing the issue.
All these problems appear to be coming from the front of the bike.
 Now, the noises are one thing but as i set off home today i let the clutch out slowly and as it got to bite it felt like something in the engine got jerked, hard to explain exactly but it didnt sound or feel healthy, after that it was fine all the way home but the noises persisted, i figured it might be the clutch cable so when i got home i took of the sprocket cover to see whats going on and found what looks to be quite a serious problem. The washer between the bolt and sprocket is bent and deformed, worrying.
 Next, there are nine (i think) holes in the sprocket, some have something in, some dont. In the midst of all the road gunk that was stuck everywhere, i kept finding pieces of plastic that look like theyve sheared off something, i have no idea whats going on or where these parts have come from! Pics attached.
Im basically wanting to know if anyone can give some guidance on what it causing these noises and whether the sprocket situation is critical and contributing to the weird noises. Also the stop switch for the front brake has gone, this probably has no connection but ill mention it anyway haha Iv replaced two of these in about six months now, any ideas on how to keep em alive for a bit longer?

Thanks,

Miles

[MF92]

forgot to attach pics!

[dazza]

Hi MF92, first of all your tab washer is meant to be bent over like that, it prevents the nut from coming loose. With regards to your front brake light  switch I bet you have been replacing it with the cheap pattern ones off of ebay, don't, buy a genuine Yamaha one. I've had the same problem, the last one didn't even last a month.

[MF92]

Ah thanks shows how much i know haha, the last one I got was from the bike garage down the road now sure of the brand but i guess youre right seeing as how its gone already!

[Lez72]

Like Dazza says, the front sprocket tab washer is meant to be bent like that so that's not an issue. I have never seen a front sprocket with the holes in like yours and its definitely not a Yamaha part.

In order to try and solve the problem, the first thing I would do is totally degrease and clean inside the sprocket cover and around the front sprocket area so you have a bit better chance of seeing if anything has been rubbing or has sheared. If everything looks ok I would then order the upgraded front sprocket nut kit and a new front sprocket from Yamaha. You will then need to remove your front sprocket by bending the tab washer flat so that you can remove the nut holding the sprocket in place. Show them the nearest bin and fit the new parts which will be a reversal of the removal process. Ideally you should fit a complete chain and sprocket kit as it can generally be false economy to do it any other way. The only reason I say this is your front sprocket looks pretty worn and I'm guessing the chain may have a few tight spots.

If the noises your bike is making are being caused by a worn chain and sprocket set (which sounds likely) you will be surprised how smooth it is if new parts are fitted and adjusted correctly.

[fazersharp]

 
 
Here is what an origional (clean ) one looks like, I wonder if those bits on yours are the origional red plastic you see here

 

 
A clean cover

[Millietant]

I'm with Fazersharp on this one regarding the plastic bits - if you clean and degrease the sprocket, around it and the inside of the cover, you should be able to make out the pieces as parts of the plastic on the sprocket.


The plastic section breaking up might be one of the causes of the some of the noises you're hearing. It might just be the pictures, but your sprocket teeth look hooked (shagged) and both the chain and sprocket look rusty - ie not well lubed and likely worm out.


I'd replace both - and the rear sprocket at the same time.


Given the decent mid range power, would anyone else suggest getting a front sprocket with one extra tooth and a rear sprocket with two less teeth - from riding my son's '03 Fazer 600 I reckon the bike would pull it easily and the difference would be noticeable at cruising speeds, but not in the lower gears (might help improve fuel economy on longer runs too).


Cheers

[fazersharp]

Mine look a little bit worn in my picture but if you look athe them in real life and straight on they dont. The picture is at 16k miles
On MF92s picture of the bits do I see a hint of the same red/orange colour

[limax2]

Just to add my bit to the good info already given. The nut you need when replacing the sprocket is part number 90891-10124 and comes as a kit that includes the lock-washer. The nut is 12mm thick. The one in both sets of photo's (MF92 and fazersharps)  is the old 9mm thick nut. Do not let a Yamaha dealer sell you part number 90215-21290 just because it is still listed!
Plenty on this forum about the sprocket nut if you like lots of late night reading.

[freeware]

old vs new

[savvy]

Given the decent mid range power, would anyone else suggest getting a front sprocket with one extra tooth and a rear sprocket with two less teeth - from riding my son's '03 Fazer 600 I reckon the bike would pull it easily and the difference would be noticeable at cruising speeds, but not in the lower gears (might help improve fuel economy on longer runs too).


Cheers



Just replaced my front sprocket with +1 ie 16T and is much better in my opinion. Pulls it easily but not altered rear sprocket.

[CRH]

Given the decent mid range power, would anyone else suggest getting a front sprocket with one extra tooth and a rear sprocket with two less teeth - from riding my son's '03 Fazer 600 I reckon the bike would pull it easily and the difference would be noticeable at cruising speeds, but not in the lower gears (might help improve fuel economy on longer runs too).


Cheers



Just replaced my front sprocket with +1 ie 16T and is much better in my opinion. Pulls it easily but not altered rear sprocket.

....did mine couple of wks ago!..left rear std and like it!!...knocks revs down in 6th bt 500 and the little vibration i had before through pegs is no more!!...not chkd mileage yet but should imagine it will have improved? will post when i know .....performance still great too!!

[Soapy]

Hi CRH

Going to check my front nut this week. If it is the 9mm one I'm going to replace it for the 12mm one. While I'm at it, thinking about going for the +1 Tooth sprocket (16T) on the front. How does it effect chain adjustment length?

[savvy]

Hi CRH

Going to check my front nut this week. If it is the 9mm one I'm going to replace it for the 12mm one. While I'm at it, thinking about going for the +1 Tooth sprocket (16T) on the front. How does it effect chain adjustment length?

Ref chain lgh it made 1 mark difference on mine ie wheel had to move 1 mark closer to the engine, thats all.

[Soapy]

Thanks Savvy

Further to my previous post. I've sourced a modified nut kit at Wemoto.

Can anybody tell me the difference between the JT sprocket and the Sunstar Sprocket (twice the price) on there website

http://www.wemoto.com/bikes/yamaha/fzs_600_fazer_sp/02-03/

Sprockets are at the bottom of the page

[CRH]

Hi CRH

Going to check my front nut this week. If it is the 9mm one I'm going to replace it for the 12mm one. While I'm at it, thinking about going for the +1 Tooth sprocket (16T) on the front. How does it effect chain adjustment length?

Ref chain lgh it made 1 mark difference on mine ie wheel had to move 1 mark closer to the engine, thats all.

...yes same here approx 1 mark closer!...and i used a jt sprocket think it cost me £12...inc pnp

[savvy]

Got mine local Bike dealer at a cost of £9.00 already had a 12mm nut. Don't know what make but it wasn't OE. Bike rides like a dream now,seems a lot smoother too.

[MF92]

Thanks for all the advice!
Cleaned up the sprocket and got rid of all the rubbish that was stuck there.
Turns out that this wasn't the cause of the noises but it was actually the front brakes!


The brakes are binding but making noises like iv never heard before!
It sounds really rough when riding slowly and when braking theres almost a grinding, rough feeling through the lever.
Had both calipers in pieces, cleaned up everything, copper greased the back of the pads and its made absolutely no difference!
Plenty of life in both sets of pads so i dont think its that, possibly a warped disc?
Iv read a few threads on here saying that a warped disc isnt usually the case unless the discs are subject to ridiculous levels of heat, i thought the binding may have caused this but i had to ride about 15 miles last night to get the bike home (ridden very slowly and carefully) and when i got back, i checked the discs and they only slightly warm as youd expect from normal use, leading me to believe that the binding hasnt caused warping.

Really confused now and i wanna find a solution that isnt gonna result in a heavy amount of spending on new discs.
I would test them with a DTI but i dont have one :/
[/size]
[/size]Any suggestions?

[fazersharp]

I would still like to know what those broken bits were and if they were the red plastic thing, go any pictures now its clean

[darrsi]

Thanks for all the advice!
Cleaned up the sprocket and got rid of all the rubbish that was stuck there.
Turns out that this wasn't the cause of the noises but it was actually the front brakes!


The brakes are binding but making noises like iv never heard before!
It sounds really rough when riding slowly and when braking theres almost a grinding, rough feeling through the lever.
Had both calipers in pieces, cleaned up everything, copper greased the back of the pads and its made absolutely no difference!
Plenty of life in both sets of pads so i dont think its that, possibly a warped disc?
Iv read a few threads on here saying that a warped disc isnt usually the case unless the discs are subject to ridiculous levels of heat, i thought the binding may have caused this but i had to ride about 15 miles last night to get the bike home (ridden very slowly and carefully) and when i got back, i checked the discs and they only slightly warm as youd expect from normal use, leading me to believe that the binding hasnt caused warping.

Really confused now and i wanna find a solution that isnt gonna result in a heavy amount of spending on new discs.
I would test them with a DTI but i dont have one :/

Any suggestions?

When you say you had both calipers in pieces, what exactly did you do with them?

[MF92]

Unfortunately I didn't take any pics, Iv thrown out all the broken bits but after you posted those pics (thanks for those by the way) the parts iv found look very similar to that original component, the bikes got just over 30k on it now so i guess that part has just broken down over time.

[MF92]

When you say you had both calipers in pieces, what exactly did you do with them?

Took everything out except the pistons, gonna take a look at them now!

[fazersharp]

I belive the plastic part is to keep noise down and if you see from my picture the chain touches it so perhaps on your 30k worn one the chain itself has slaped/worn and broken/ chewed the plastic and that would make noises and jumping as the chain went over,

[darrsi]

When you say you had both calipers in pieces, what exactly did you do with them?

Took everything out except the pistons, gonna take a look at them now!

Okay, i'll hazard a guess that they'll be your problem. 

[Millietant]

Are the pads "cheap" or very metallic ?


Binding brakes means the pistons are not returning properly from the disc-face, or into the caliper, once you've let the brakes off.


This could be the pads sticking on the pins, but if you've cleaned and lubricated these, then I'd suggest the pistons are the problem - probably built up dried grunge around them (might have got into the seals as well). Personally, I'd do a proper caliper overhaul, taking the pistons out and cleaning the up (fitting new seals as well) - it's easy, doesn't take too long and doesn't cost too much.