Author Topic: 1 centimetre (Read 5690 times)

carrier · « **on:** 14 April 2013, 08:31:55 pm »

If I leave the bike as is, it doesn't start, it turns over, but doesn't start. If I unscrew the 8mm screw at the top and slide the tank down 1 cm it starts on the button. Wtf?

I felt it deserved a new topic.

andybesy · « **Reply #1 on:** 14 April 2013, 08:33:42 pm »

Kinked fuel hose or similar?

carrier · « **Reply #2 on:** 14 April 2013, 08:55:06 pm »

Quote from: andybesy on 14 April 2013, 08:33:42 pm

Kinked fuel hose or similar?

Yeah thought about that so I passed the fuel hose under the bar instead of over... still won't work

richfzs · « **Reply #3 on:** 14 April 2013, 09:14:51 pm »

When you slide it down - where? You must be undoing the bolt at the back (concealed by the seat) as well, to slide it anywhere?

carrier · « **Reply #4 on:** 14 April 2013, 09:19:42 pm »

Quote from: richfzs on 14 April 2013, 09:14:51 pm

When you slide it down - where? You must be undoing the bolt at the back (concealed by the seat) as well, to slide it anywhere?

Nope, I literally slide it down 1 cm...if that. The back bolt is on rubber and will give ta tiny bit

Stedman8 · « **Reply #5 on:** 14 April 2013, 09:22:39 pm »

Dodgy spark plug connections ?

richfzs · « **Reply #6 on:** 14 April 2013, 09:23:11 pm »

Ah, the brute force school of mechanics

Either a trapped line, or frayed electrics that are causing a short when the tank is in its correct place. Take the tank off, and check over the wiring to/from the coils carefully.

richfzs · « **Reply #7 on:** 14 April 2013, 09:24:02 pm »

Deos it try to start, or just turn over without any coughing/spluttering?

Stedman8 · « **Reply #8 on:** 14 April 2013, 09:24:54 pm »

Does it start with the choke out?

carrier · « **Reply #9 on:** 14 April 2013, 09:28:03 pm »

Quote from: richfzs on 14 April 2013, 09:24:02 pm

Deos it try to start, or just turn over without any coughing/spluttering?

Just turns over, no coughing or anything. I've checked the wiring and it looks okay, just this one place that is a little doubt full. Don't know if I should cut off the cover and check the wires individually.

Stedman: without choke. With the tank down then 1 cm I just press the button...no throttle or anything.

Gnasher · « **Reply #10 on:** 14 April 2013, 09:39:39 pm »

What year/model is the bike?

carrier · « **Reply #11 on:** 14 April 2013, 09:44:17 pm »

Quote from: Gnasher on 14 April 2013, 09:39:39 pm

What year/model is the bike?

Fox eye 2002... silver.... in case the color makes a difference

Gnasher · « **Reply #12 on:** 14 April 2013, 10:39:47 pm »

Check the breather under the tank either the concertina rubber is fouling the tank or the pipe from the breather is blocked, the other possibility is a loose electrical connection somewhere.

bozboz · « **Reply #13 on:** 14 April 2013, 11:44:26 pm »

May not help but when my fuel pump was on its way out if i lifted the tank back it would start the bike, I think it forced fuel through. Maybe drain float bowls(easy) and hear if the pump is priming?(or leave for a day or two?) If not like others have said fouled pipe/breather or electrics...phantom.

Fazerider · « **Reply #14 on:** 15 April 2013, 01:06:20 am »

If the carbs have fuel in them it'd start and probably continue to run for a mile even with no fuel supplied to them, so a kinked hose or other blockage doesn't sound likely.

Try running the engine with the tank propped up so you can get your hand under there and try pressing on any cabling that might get disturbed when the tank is in its normal position, if the engine cuts out that should narrow down the area you need to investigate.

reillypadraig · « **Reply #15 on:** 15 April 2013, 01:26:57 am »

Same happened me, bike won't start if it thinks fuel tank isn't connected, you sliding the tank may also be moving the connection, clean the connectors, put back together firmly and should start!!!!

red98 · « **Reply #16 on:** 15 April 2013, 06:44:20 am »

while its not starting see if you have a spark at the plugs

this will tell you if its electrics of fuel

carrier · « **Reply #17 on:** 15 April 2013, 09:08:37 am »

Red98: I've checked the plugs so many times and can't see them spark on the fazer, on the monster they spark. So I'll check the bundle for a short... I'm not convinced it's the sparkplugs, but then it's just a feeling... woman's intuition.... I'm a dude... I have no good intuition.

Fazerider: I will try that the moment I get a chance, thanks for the idea! It's so simple and yet...

bozboz: My intuition also says fuel pump... but it's usually wrong

red98 · « **Reply #18 on:** 15 April 2013, 09:26:11 am »

if you have no spark.take the tank off and have a good look at the wiring....have you checked for a spark on all four plugs ? two coils on a 600.if yes and no spark concentrate on the wiring to the coils

Dead Eye · « **Reply #19 on:** 15 April 2013, 11:15:08 am »

I'm fairly certain that the bike will run even with the fuel gauge disconnected. Me and a few others I've seen have turned the tank around to rest on the seat when doing maintenance to provide fuel but there is no way that the fuel gauge cable will stretch that far

reillypadraig · « **Reply #20 on:** 15 April 2013, 12:38:58 pm »

Quote from: Dead Eye on 15 April 2013, 11:15:08 am

I'm fairly certain that the bike will run even with the fuel gauge disconnected. Me and a few others I've seen have turned the tank around to rest on the seat when doing maintenance to provide fuel but there is no way that the fuel gauge cable will stretch that far

Now that you mention it that's right, my bad

Stedman8 · « **Reply #21 on:** 15 April 2013, 11:02:33 pm »

Check the earth on the coils see if its loose - other than that I'm out of ideas ,let us know what the culprit was ,cheers Steve

Ebme Geek · « **Reply #22 on:** 16 April 2013, 05:10:55 pm »

Quote from: carrier on 15 April 2013, 09:08:37 am

Red98: I've checked the plugs so many times and can't see them spark on the fazer, on the monster they spark. So I'll check the bundle for a short... I'm not convinced it's the sparkplugs, but then it's just a feeling... woman's intuition.... I'm a dude... I have no good intuition.

Fazerider: I will try that the moment I get a chance, thanks for the idea! It's so simple and yet...

bozboz: My intuition also says fuel pump... but it's usually wrong

Is this continuation of "always hard to start" ? - might not have been the battery afterall, but disturbance from what you did then gave a temp fix.

If you can't see a spark, you probably have not got one which means no ignition (make sure you are grounding the body of the spark plug on the top fin (not on cam cover, its rubber mounted & insulated)).

Totaly agree with Fazerider : another confidence checker, if you leave the bike turned off for more than a few minutes and then turn it back on you should get a couple of slow ticks from the fuel pump and then it stops, it is just builing up the pressure that has leaked back, and that shows there is fuel there. That and the fact that when it runs, its ok.

Forget fuel, or at least until you have sparks. Get tank proped so it wont slip, get hands in, as others mentioned general wires, coil wiring and grounds, if you get sparks try wiggling what you have found the other way, if you can turn the sparks on and off, you are probanly on it or very close. Also check the ground wire to the thermostat mount bolt is tight.

domtrails · « **Reply #23 on:** 16 April 2013, 08:40:59 pm »

Have you checked the fuel tap....

carrier · « **Reply #24 on:** 16 April 2013, 11:07:47 pm »

Quote from: Ebme Geek on 16 April 2013, 05:10:55 pm

Quote from: carrier on 15 April 2013, 09:08:37 am
Red98: I've checked the plugs so many times and can't see them spark on the fazer, on the monster they spark. So I'll check the bundle for a short... I'm not convinced it's the sparkplugs, but then it's just a feeling... woman's intuition.... I'm a dude... I have no good intuition.

Fazerider: I will try that the moment I get a chance, thanks for the idea! It's so simple and yet...

bozboz: My intuition also says fuel pump... but it's usually wrong

Is this continuation of "always hard to start" ? - might not have been the battery afterall, but disturbance from what you did then gave a temp fix.

If you can't see a spark, you probably have not got one which means no ignition (make sure you are grounding the body of the spark plug on the top fin (not on cam cover, its rubber mounted & insulated)).

Totaly agree with Fazerider : another confidence checker, if you leave the bike turned off for more than a few minutes and then turn it back on you should get a couple of slow ticks from the fuel pump and then it stops, it is just builing up the pressure that has leaked back, and that shows there is fuel there. That and the fact that when it runs, its ok.

Forget fuel, or at least until you have sparks. Get tank proped so it wont slip, get hands in, as others mentioned general wires, coil wiring and grounds, if you get sparks try wiggling what you have found the other way, if you can turn the sparks on and off, you are probanly on it or very close. Also check the ground wire to the thermostat mount bolt is tight.

No I dont think its a continuation because now its "easy to start" most of the time... I just have a gremlin somewhere.

Tried pressing down on the wires but now the fault is so intermittent it always started while I was testing. I cut the loom, noticed a lot of tape
, not sure if its original or an ex owner messed around. Under the tape looks very OEM.

The red live wire connects to a red/green wire, but they seems normal. The ht coils use the same wire in parallel as a positive but different wires as negative which go to the cdi.... other then that everything is normal looking, but still find it hard to start every other time I turn the key...

Also, brand new thing, the rev limiter doesn't work anymore, instead of it going to 12 000 and then it flickering between 11 and 12 it just kind of cuts out... I still have power , not sure what's happening there, any clues?