Author Topic: Mineral, Semi Synthetic or Full Synthetic for our machine? (Read 10400 times)

Camshaft · « **on:** 12 August 2013, 12:17:44 pm »

I have used semi ester Belray 10W40 for my first oil change on my 01 with 57,000kms. The guy I bought it off owned it from 1 year old, told me he used full synthetic all his ownership and tracked it 10 times in the year before he sold it (put the left peg through his calf poor bastard dodging a possum on a wet night).

Is this a suitable oil for my bike being used as a commuter plus the weekend blast finding the redline a few times?

I'm sure there are plenty here with similar riding week to week

Camshaft · « **Reply #1 on:** 12 August 2013, 12:36:49 pm »

I just checked with my GPS and apparently I am on Earth. It also told me I am on a planet somewhere in a universe somewhere. Personally I'm not sure where exactly

Australia according to my memory though. Sydney I'm sure. South of the equator.
Since I'm on the Gen 1 Thou part of this site I own and ride a Gen 1 Thou. 2001 model.

Note - a possum is a marsupial (wiki it if not sure)

PieEater · « **Reply #2 on:** 12 August 2013, 01:53:52 pm »

This part of the forum is entitled "Fazer 1000/FZ1 corner" so it's not safe to make assumptions which is why my fellow pie fan asked the question.

The Yamaha owners manual for the Fazer 1000 says to use a semi-synthetic oil which is what I use (making sure it is bike specific).

Slaninar · « **Reply #3 on:** 12 August 2013, 04:15:55 pm »

The best: fully synthetic
Good: semi synthetic
OK: mineral

stevierst · « **Reply #4 on:** 12 August 2013, 04:29:54 pm »

Quote from: Slaninar on 12 August 2013, 04:15:55 pm

The best: fully synthetic
Good: semi synthetic
OK: mineral

What about chip fat?

slimwilly · « **Reply #5 on:** 12 August 2013, 05:40:39 pm »

The stuff thats comes out of a fat birds fanny is ok !!

dickturpin · « **Reply #6 on:** 12 August 2013, 05:53:40 pm »

pie, are you sure the manual says semi? I thought it gave a spec/grade that mineral can achieve.

Falcon 269 · « **Reply #7 on:** 12 August 2013, 06:12:05 pm »

Ooh, an oil thread ... luvverly!

Semi-synth or fully synth, either will be good. I favour the fully synth flavour, personally, but that's mainly because I live in a hot climate.

Bike-specific takes out the element of uncertainty if you're not sure about auto oil additives affecting the clutch. Again, I use an auto oil but I'm sure enough of the content not to be concerned about clutch slip. On my part of the planet (must try that satnav thing ...

) bike-specific oils are about 3 to 4 times the price of auto oil!

Hedgetrimmer · « **Reply #8 on:** 12 August 2013, 06:47:11 pm »

Want to know more? Bored and got loads of time on your hands? Or just want to get thoroughly confused about the subject?
Look here...

http://foc-u.co.uk/index.php/topic,8869.0.html

dickturpin · « **Reply #9 on:** 12 August 2013, 07:13:35 pm »

my manual gives a range of viscosities and states oil must be API grade SE SF SG or higher. My last oil change was a Castrol mineral oil to API SG. So whilst I'm not saying semi synth isn't better, but aren't we getting OTT when Mr Yamaha's recommendations are within the grades available from mineral?

Discuss.....

D

VNA - BMW Wank · « **Reply #10 on:** 12 August 2013, 08:29:25 pm »

Quote

Want to know more? Bored and got loads of time on your hands? Or just want to get thoroughly confused about the subject?
Look here...
http://foc-u.co.uk/index.php/topic,8869.0.html

Aye indeed. Or just go straight to the last page if you want the highest spec bike specific semi or fully synth oil.

Basically two commonly available high spec options are;

Motul 5100 and Motul 7100.

Quote

The guy I bought it off owned it from 1 year old, told me he used full synthetic all his ownership

Bear in mind that road bike engines in general should not be fed fully synth until they have covered at least 12,000 miles.

Falcon 269 · « **Reply #11 on:** 13 August 2013, 04:46:50 am »

Quote from: dickturpin on 12 August 2013, 07:13:35 pm

my manual gives a range of viscosities and states oil must be API grade SE SF SG or higher. My last oil change was a Castrol mineral oil to API SG. So whilst I'm not saying semi synth isn't better, but aren't we getting OTT when Mr Yamaha's recommendations are within the grades available from mineral?

Discuss.....

D

First, those are minimum requirements. Say you live in deepest Wogga-Wogga and can't get latest top-spec oils, the bike will still run OK on dinosaur juice. You just need to change it more frequently.

Why? Well, it's down to how long the oil retains its viscosity and ability to protect against wear, particularly how well it resists shearing within the gearbox. A dino oil and a fully synth will give the same protection for, say, the first 1000 miles but after that the dino stuff starts to break down faster. The additives in the fully synth prevent that happening so the fully synth is still performing at close to original specs for many thousands of miles longer.

Slaninar · « **Reply #12 on:** 13 August 2013, 06:03:37 am »

Quote from: Falcon 269 on 13 August 2013, 04:46:50 am

A dino oil and a fully synth will give the same protection for, say, the first 1000 miles but after that the dino stuff starts to break down faster. The additives in the fully synth prevent that happening so the fully synth is still performing at close to original specs for many thousands of miles longer.

Mineral oil will not do the job as good even for the first 1000 miles. Not even for the first 100.

PieEater · « **Reply #13 on:** 13 August 2013, 06:50:36 am »

Quote from: dickturpin on 12 August 2013, 05:53:40 pm

pie, are you sure the manual says semi? I thought it gave a spec/grade that mineral can achieve.

My apologies, I was 100% certain that the manual specified semi-synthetic but you are correct that it doesn't, I even checked the Haynes manual to see if I was getting confused with that but Mr Haynes doesn't specify type either

AdieR · « **Reply #14 on:** 13 August 2013, 07:41:08 am »

Don't know about the 1000 off hand, but my 600 is specified as 10w30 semi synth, should think the thou is similar (maybe a different viscosity if you have high ambient temperatures).

Camshaft · « **Reply #15 on:** 13 August 2013, 08:51:47 am »

I stand corrected

re what bike...

Great feedback and will be happy to continue with the semi synthetic and save the money

Camshaft · « **Reply #16 on:** 13 August 2013, 08:52:43 am »

Quote from: PieEater on 12 August 2013, 01:53:52 pm

This part of the forum is entitled "Fazer 1000/FZ1 corner" so it's not safe to make assumptions which is why my fellow pie fan asked the question.

The Yamaha owners manual for the Fazer 1000 says to use a semi-synthetic oil which is what I use (making sure it is bike specific).

I stand corrected

re what bike

Great feedback and will be happy to continue with the semi synthetic and save the money

driller2 · « **Reply #17 on:** 13 August 2013, 09:15:07 am »

My bike is coming up for an intermediate service. Basic check all over plus new oil and filter.
Dealer wanted £200 which included £78 for 4 litres of Shell Advance 4t fully synthetic. Gulp !!
Fortunately I picked up a link to Opei Oils on 01209 215164 who next day delivered the required 4 litres for £29 plus £5 for delivery. (from Cornwall ???)
Good retail margins on oil.
Dunno if they will deliver to Spain.

PieEater · « **Reply #18 on:** 13 August 2013, 11:04:44 am »

Unless I find an offer or good deal on ebay I tend to use Halfords bike specific semi-synthetic, it tends to be a fair bit cheaper than the 'name' brands and you get 5l for your money rather than 4l. Having said that I do regular changes between 4-5k and generally fit a new filter (genuine Yamaha) each time.

Hedgetrimmer · « **Reply #19 on:** 13 August 2013, 06:38:14 pm »

Quote from: driller2 on 13 August 2013, 09:15:07 am

My bike is coming up for an intermediate service. Basic check all over plus new oil and filter.
Dealer wanted £200 which included £78 for 4 litres of Shell Advance 4t fully synthetic. Gulp !!
Fortunately I picked up a link to Opei Oils on 01209 215164 who next day delivered the required 4 litres for £29 plus £5 for delivery. (from Cornwall ???)
Good retail margins on oil.
Dunno if they will deliver to Spain.

£78?!! Just for the oil? That can't be right, surely?

Capt · « **Reply #20 on:** 13 August 2013, 07:20:48 pm »

I used to get some fully synthetic stuff called Amsoil MCF from Opei, supposed to be the best. The old girl went through a litre roughly every 1000 miles. Bike had done approx 10K so switched back to Yamalube semi, doesn't use anything now.

Capt · « **Reply #21 on:** 13 August 2013, 07:33:16 pm »

Quote from: Capt on 13 August 2013, 07:20:48 pm

I used to get some fully synthetic stuff called Amsoil MCF from Opei, supposed to be the best. The old girl went through a litre roughly every 1000 miles. Bike had done approx 10K so switched back to Yamalube semi, doesn't use anything now.

Damned IPAD, meant to say that stuff was £20 a litre!

VNA - BMW Wank · « **Reply #22 on:** 13 August 2013, 08:04:22 pm »

Quote

Dealer wanted £200 which included £78 for 4 litres of Shell Advance 4t fully synthetic.

Are you sure? That's outrageous. Name and shame.

http://www.opieoils.co.uk/pv-91507-shell-advance-ultra-4t-10w-40-performance-4-stroke-fully-synthetic-motorcycle-oil-4-litres.aspx?utm_source=ProductSearch&utm_medium=GoogleBase&utm_campaign=GoogleBase_ProductsFeed&utm_content=91507&gclid=CIaX86yN-7gCFUbHtAodqjQAtg

30 quid 48 pence, API SL too.

If anything you should be getting a discount on the retail price of oil and parts if you are putting your bike in for a service.

If I get work done on my car, for example, at my back street garage, he charges me his standard rate for labour but the parts are trade price.

pitternator · « **Reply #23 on:** 14 August 2013, 07:02:41 am »

hi driller, ducati dealers are bandwagonning BMW I see....speccing the highest possible oil that only they sell for ones bike...but have to say oil for the GS is cheaper than ur MS...

...same number of cylinders too ...

GS is supposed to only take 10/50 fully synthetic, about £50 per oil change. Why ?...as handbook allows literally almost any oil to go in it !

I too found an ebay supplier for GS oil, at £26 for 4 litres. Thats 50% savings.....

all my fazers have been fed castrol semi synthetic or yamalube , over 77k miles without any problems at all.If you are changing at 6k intervals or less I dont see why we need better oil tbh given the lack of engine wear from semi synthetic. For instance my latest fazer at 30k miles was dynoed giving nearly 140 bhp output at rear wheel.Its still a very silky powerful engine at 40k.

jackojet · « **Reply #24 on:** 14 August 2013, 07:35:55 am »

I use Castrol power 1 racing fully synth in mine.
Last time I bought some from Halfords I had an argument with the staff.
On the shelf the same oil in semi synth was £34.99 yet the fully synth was £29.99. Go to till with fully synth and they try and charge me £34.99? Tell them they got price wrong and they let me go with the fully synth for £29.99.
How can they charge more for the lesser oil?
The bike does feel smoother on the fully synth.
I don't do loads of miles so paying more for an
a oil change don't bother me