4 degree ignition advancer are their worth fitting?

[Ricky]

I have has a few problems starting the FZS, properly more down to me than the bike. I have been told the advancer might help, and it would hopefully help the midrange. I find when I want to over  take a car I have to go down a lot of gears, and than it still feels a bit flat.I am used to torkey twins and a GSXR 750, so may be asking to much of the Fzs.
I am hopeing to get the bike Ivanised in the spring, so do Ivansing and advancer go together, or should I just wait till the spring?

[PieEater]

Something doesn't sound right, you shouldn't be having to drop down "a lot of gears"  to overtake cars, maybe you have a European import with a restrictor kit fitted? You'll need to take one of the carb tops off to see if you can find a grommet that would prevent the slide from fully working. You could maybe check the Throttle Position Sensor to see if this is out, check Pat's guide for details on how to do this, there is a link in the FAQ. Might also be worth running some Redline fuel system cleaner through a couple of tanks in case the carbs are slightly blocked.

An ignition advancer will give you a slight boost at the bottom to mid range but it's a subtle difference not night and day. You can fit one before or after Ivanising it will still have the same affect.

[Tmation]

First check that the air filter intake isn't blocked (spare gloves or a cleaning rag are favourite here).


Check your air filter is clean while you are there.


You also need to check that your EXUP valve is working correctly, it sounds like it might not be fully opening. If there is too much slack in the cables you wont get the 7000 rpm fault code.

[unfazed]

As Tmation says check EXUP is set properly sounds like the cables have stretched or the valve is sticking,  then check the air filter and then the TPS setting .


Ivanising won't fix a problem that is already present.

[Ricky]

The bike is a import but I have had the carps balanced and checked  no pungs,,the in take is not blocked and I had the exup valve checked a few month's ago and  K&N air filter was cleaned.If you rev it though the gears from a stand still it goes well.I tend to ride the bike around in 6 gear most of the time at 60 mph plus and when I want get buy cars I find I have to drop a lot of gears to get some power. The exup valve did give me trouble when I bought the bike it was stuck shut and I got the 7000 rpm show,but the bike feels much different to then.
The bike has a K&N filter and slip on exhaust and don't know if any jeting has been changed, the needles are standard and wonder if that may be the problem. Just hope Mike can do his magic. in the spring.
I don't know any thing about TPS settings, so may look in to it.
I have spent a lot of time on big twins and GSXR 750 so it may be me, but have to say I am disappointed with the Fzs.

[unfazed]

Imported from where, as far I can remember some French one were restricted no sure about German ones.

Could also be a TPS issue set wrong they can make it feel dead.

Lift the tank locate the connector from the TPS switch on the ignition, set the kill switch to run
Disconnect the TPS connector and reconnect it.

Rev counter should go to 5000 if it stays at 0 or goes to 10000 it is out of adjustments.

O will make the bike it feel dead 10000 will not and some set it to 10 as it advances the ignition slightly

To set it loosen the 2 Security Torx bolts on the TPS and move it until the rev counter reads 5.
You can always try 10000  or the dynamic  setting later

Tighten the screws and start the bike or turn the ignition off.


Would still check the Exup is set up correctly

[Ricky]

I believe it came from the USA but not California.
If your rev it hard from a stand still it goes well but my GSXR 750  would have left it for dead.

[Tmation]

I think you are expecting too much from your Fazer and may need to adjust your riding style.


The GSXR750 weighs about 40 kg less than the Fazer, it will rev much faster due to engine tune and the gearing will be different.


The Fazer is geared for about 30 mph above its real top speed (over geared) where as sport bikes will get close to their red line in top.


Riding at 60 in 6th it will take a little while to get into its stride, I would use 4th for quick overtakes.


Like you I ride my bike in deluxe moped mode most of the time, but you will need to use lower gears to go faster.


I would still check that the EXUP is working and adjusted correctly or the bike will go flat.


Does it rev to the red line in first, second and third without problem?

[unfazed]

I believe it came from the USA but not California.
If your rev it hard from a stand still it goes well but my GSXR 750  would have left it for dead.

You must have definitely a problem with your 1000, I have ridden both and there is no way a bog standard K4/K5 Gsxr750 would leave my bog standard 1000 for dead. (to compare like year with like year)

I also know for a fact that the Fzs1000 will give a 2014 Gsxr750 a good run for its money, finally losing out on top speed, which surprised me especially as it's over 20kg heavier with an ould fellow riding the Fazer.
The Fazers are not sportsbikes just superb all rounder which requires a totally different riding style with the 1000 needing a little more fettling to make it so more than the 600.

In any case and any bike over 600 I have ridden I would never just roll on the throttle at 60mph in top gear to overtake unless it was on a very long free straight road. I would like Tmation drop 1 or 2 gears and go

 

[Ricky]

I am properly wrong to compere one bike against another, especially when I have not ridden the GSXR in over a year, but I rode the bike for 8 years and loved how the bike made its power, you are right I may be expecting to much of the Fzs.
If you go from a standing start the bike revs to the red line and goes very well and makes power .I ride round in 6 at 60mph and I find dropping one gear does northing , you have to go to at least  4 .
I will look at the exup valve but have rode the bike with a closed stuck valve when I first bought the bike ,and the bike feels much better than then.

[unfazed]

Check the TPS also

[Timbo]

Ricky

The Fazer should go like sheeet of a shovel.


As others have mentioned I think you are running too high a gear, peak power is 8000rpm +. Try keeping a gear to match your speed and maintain 6000 to 8000rpm. Then you always be just under the power band and "ready to go". Fuel consumption will not suffer for it, I have ridden mine that way on both my Fazers and I regularly get 45mpg, if not more. I might use 6th gear on the motorways but the rest of the time on national speed limit back roads I'll use 4th and no more. Rarely 5th unless the road really straightens out.


Try it!


Bw

[Mick-H]

What size sprockets are you running.
If I'm doing 60 in top it'll pick up and overtake with no problem at all, admitted if I knock it down to 4th before the overtake then it is much much faster but I usually find that 6th will do the job.

[BBROWN1664]

I suspect Ricky is expecting to ride the FZS1000 as if it were a sports bike and in the intervening months since he rode the GSXR has forgotten that he would normally only be in 4th gear at the same speed and so did pick up a bit quicker than the FZS when in 6th. This is probably because the FZS is far more refined and encourages a more refined way of riding then the hooligan GSXR did.

[Ricky]

The rear sprocket is a 44, not sure about the front, 6th gear is 4000rpm 60mph.
I am hoping to look at the exup valve on Wednesday.
The bike has a K&N filter and a slipon exhaust, the needles are stock but don't know if the jets have been changed, could this be a symptom of low power when opening the throttle?

[Ricky]

Just checked the EXUP valve, the cables where completely lose, the vale was not moving at all.Using Pat page as a guide I have tried to tighten the cables but when set at about 1.5 mm of play I get the 7000rpm  fault code,  so I loosen the cables and I can not get the fork shape to line up with the hole, it is close ,the fork is just before the hole. How close can you get to lining it up?
All so when you turn the bike off, the fork is at 10 o'clock and the hole is at 9 o'clock is this right, and when I rev the bike the valve does not seem to move much.

[unfazed]

If you turn the ignition off with the kill switch, it will reset to the default position, (this is the time to check its position)
If your turn it off with the ignition switch it will not reset until you turn it back on.

A common mistake is to turn the engine off with the key and try to reset the exup.

When you are setting the exup.
1. Turn the ignition  on (do not start the engine) wait 5 to 10 secs, turn it off again.
2. Not set your EXUP.
3. When you think you have it set correctly, start the bike, let it tick over, turn it off with the kill switch, you will hear the servo whirring under the tank and now check the setting again.

If it is not correct turn off the ignition and readjust it and go back to 3 again

[Millietant]

The problem might still be more than just an EXUP valve issue.


The GSXR 750 should be a gutless wheezer at 60mph in high gears compared to your Fazer. I've ridden my brothers GSXR 750 immediately after our '01 Fazer and I have to rev it far higher and keep changing down gears to get anything like the overtaking power of the Fazer at 50-70 mph.


The one thing I love about the Fazer is the way it pulls from even 40 mph in top gear if you want it too. My Aprillia RSV Mille doesn't have the same low down pull as the Fazer, but even at 6000rpm it feels like it's running at 3000 rpm in comparison to an inline 4, so it actually "feels" like it has good low down power.


Mind you, at those lower speeds, my '89 FJ 1200 pulls far better than even the Fazer, in top gear.

[Ricky]

Been out on the bike, what a difference, much better power, it picks up very well.
I want to see the mackanic who served the bike 5 months ago and he looked at the EXOP valve and he says the cables are to tight,but the way he sets up the valve is different to pats page,I now wounder if the EXUP was set up right from the start.
I have slackened the cables a bit, but no mater what I do I can not line up the fork with the hole when you kill the engine with the kill switch, it is close. Does it have to be spot on ,or will close do? If no how do I get it spot on.

[unfazed]

You shorten one cable and lenghten the other to get the valve to rotate to the correct position.
Take up all the slack on one cable with the adjuster and add slack with the other adjuster.
 
For example if you need to rotate the fork down adjust the slack out of the cable by screwing out the adjuster on the lower cable then screw in the adjuster in the other cable until you have 1.5mm slack back in the system. After each adjustment start the engine let it Idle and then turn off the engine with the kill switch to check it.

A fiddly job but persevere

[tommyardin]

I have has a few problems starting the FZS, properly more down to me than the bike. I have been told the advancer might help, and it would hopefully help the midrange. I find when I want to over  take a car I have to go down a lot of gears, and than it still feels a bit flat.I am used to torkey twins and a GSXR 750, so may be asking to much of the Fzs.
I am hopeing to get the bike Ivanised in the spring, so do Ivansing and advancer go together, or should I just wait till the spring?

Holy shit!
Ricky I read with suprise that you have to drop a load of gogs to overtake on a Gen 1 1K Fazer. I personally have never ridden one, but, I have the baby version the 'FZS600' Fox Eye, and, if I need to overtake and I am in top gear (6th) at about 60 mph, I drop 2 gears, gun it and it goes like shit off a shovel, or if you prefer a more genteel term, like a rabbit on steroids. The acceleration is vivid to say the least and one needs to keep ones wits about them as it screams up passed 13K RPM into the red very easily with front wheel tapping the tarmac as it wants to lift, select the next cog and you get a punch in the small of you back as the speed continues to rapidly climb. I would suggest you do a full service on all the things recommended in this post, that Gen 1 should almost rip your arms out of your shoulders if you gun it hard. That machine has the Modified R1 lump in it, a race bred engine softened very slightly for the road, giving it more mid range grunt at the sacrifice of a small amount of top end.
I really believe the Gen 1 is the way I will go as it has soo much to offer in power, comfort and reliability provided you keep up with the maintenance. Good luck and i hope you get it sorted and I think when you do the old GSXR 750 will not be top machine.     

[Ricky]

A few months on and I am now 100% sure the machinic set up the exup valve wrong and has been setting  up other valves wrong for a long time.
The bike is a different  bike, it makes power  from start to finish.  I don't  have to drop a lot of gears to pass cars, and another  massive  difference  is the starting  of the bike. Before  the valve was set up by me it was a pig to start, you never new what you where going to get,hot or cold, you had to give it a lot of revs  to have any hope. Now it starts  with very little  or no revs and you don't need choke at all. Once started  you need a very small amount of that throttle  to keep it ticking over  when cold. I don't even use the choke at the minute,  but may have to if weather gets very cold.
I did not realise  just how important  the exup valve is and I wonder how others have managed with badly  or struck or even  with it removed?

[Falcon 269]

On the Gen 1, the EXUP needs to be in good working order and properly adjusted to get the best out of the motor.  Some - a few - will tell you that they removed theirs or wired it open with no ill effects.  Most will say otherwise.

Believe the majority.

[ogri48]

Glad you got it sorted. As others have said, the torque available from these lumps is phenonemal, especially given how long ago they came about in the original bike. Mine pulls in top from 25mph..I've taken to riding it on my everyday commute like a 1000 cc twist and go, stick it in top and leave it there, even through the villages down to Chepstow. Helluva bike, they really are

[Ricky]

My bike will run in 6th gear  at 800 rpm about 18 mph and keep going all the way to flat out. It does this even when the exup was not set up properly. I do love the way that I am not up and down the box.
I had a BMW GS 1200 wc which if you went below 1400 it would  be like a switch and just die, it was not nice.