Yeah, but I bet you all still come in and have a look, won't you :pokefun
Yeah, but I bet you all still come in and have a look, won't you :pokefun
Yeah, but I bet you all still come in and have a look, won't you :pokefun
Brilliant, no posting, no dissent.
Brilliant, no posting, no dissent. So on this thread we can all agree that Brexit is a disaster, we need another referendum to overturn it, and if not Scotland can go independent :D
Careful now.......
What a surprise! This thread has been hi jacked again by political verbal masturbation.Ogri – it wis Ogri that started it. VNA never starts political discussions. And I have most certainly never started a political thread. But I see no reason why I should not offer my opinion if others choose to make political comments or if others start political threads. However, as is often the case with those who do kick off with political comments, they do so seeking approval and applause from others and cannae handle it when somebody offers an opposing view. (no Ogri not guilty this time).
I'll be back when this has all died down.
If you want to show how much you remember from your crap grade A level Politics exam, start your own thread and leave this formerly interesting thread alone.
Please?
you gotta love the left. Diane abbot can say stuff like "white mothers aren't as good as black mothers". Jeremy Corbyn can make every jew in Britain be afraid of labour getting into power. and yet those of us who voted for Brexit for whatever our own personal reasons (mine was I hate bullies) are the racists..
I think ogri started a "gets my goat" thread asking why mps didn't get on with getting the best deal with Brexit, as opposed to actually starting a Brexit debate.And in reply I explained why they can't 'just get on with it' and then it all kicked off :eek
[size=0.85em]that it is dave! Im flogging loads of bike gear on ebay to fund our Show day purchases btw lol..[/size][/size][size=0.85em]
Oh, as a parting shot on BREXIT
Like a small child at the seaside crying because they don't want an ice cream.That's more often than not bacause they want one and get told they can't have it.
The trouble with Brexiteers is that they won't say what they want.I'll have a go :D ....I don't want the unelected Junckers and the other unelected commisioners proposing the legislation that eventually ends up becoming law in this country.
The trouble with Brexiteers is that they won't say what they want. Like a small child at the seaside crying because they don't want an ice cream. Remainers like VNA and myself come up with solutions out of the current mess, but Brexiteers just go on and on with the 'we won' chorus, without saying what they want to happen now. They are very good at knocking things down, but useless at building things up.
So come on, what's your solutions for where we are now? Soft Brexit or hard Brexit? What should our future trading relationship be with the EU? What should happen about the land boundary in Ireland? Let's hear some positive suggestions for a change?
Sometimes I feel sorry for Theresa....
But nobody has answered any of my questions...... Which is what I expected :lol :lol
As to decisions being made closer to home. Yes absolutely, but give them a clue as to what the answers are.
I'd have thought house prices falling by 10% was a good thing!.
Makes them more affordable for first time buyers and doesn't affect those who already own because everyone else's drops too.
Bring it on I say.
"Side? I am on nobody's side, because no one is on my side."I was reccomending it to others who most definately are on one side or the other.
To coin a phrase, "Brexit means dogsh*t".
I was told on Thursday I am being made redundant as a direct result of the economic contraction anticipated as a result of Brexit.
The comments so far just appear to confirm that the Brexit vote was a negative protest vote.
But that doesn't mean I don't get a vote, or the right to cast it however I wish.Quite right.
I was told on Thursday I am being made redundant as a direct result of the economic contraction anticipated as a result of Brexit.
That is shit, and you have my sincere sympathy. Being laid off due to "anticipation" is indeed a nasty way to treat your employees, especially when no exit deal has yet been struck, so no one actually knows what things will be like. I presume they will immediately invite you back and compensate you if things go better than anticipated?
I don't know many business looking forward to brexit. Maybe betting shops, loan sharks and alcohol retailers?! :-P
yet profits must be maintained. Result company wide austerity. :-(
If the world is voting against rather than for things all the time, we're in for a very bad time
I don't know many business looking forward to brexit. Maybe betting shops, loan sharks and alcohol retailers?! :-POr maybe the small businesses that can't cope with or afford the overwhelming amounts of business regulations that Brussels implements upon them?.
If the world is voting against rather than for things all the time, we're in for a very bad time
They voted for DonaldTrump in America, so it's not all against. Well it was against Clinton I grant you :lol
They voted [/size]for [/size]DonaldTrump in America, so it's not all against. Well it was against Clinton I grant you [/size]
QuoteThey voted for DonaldTrump in America, so it's not all against. Well it was against Clinton I grant you
Actually, Clinton won more votes than Trump. It was the peculiarities of their electoral college system that got Trump in. If they'd used the same system as our referendum, she'd be in :D
Those damn Remainers are all so negative, voting against Brexit! :lol:lol
Thank goodness for the peculiarities of life! :lolQuoteThey voted for DonaldTrump in America, so it's not all against. Well it was against Clinton I grant you
Actually, Clinton won more votes than Trump. It was the peculiarities of their electoral college system that got Trump in. If they'd used the same system as our referendum, she'd be in :D
I'm by no means being flippant. I fear the worst.
I'm sure there's a practical point to that argument. Damned if I can figure out what it is though
Not officially..
My company are a multi-national. I have seen the forecasted figures for next year (which take into account currency changes and economic contraction).
Also there is the consideration that my company manufacture all across Europe and sell all across Europe.. ANY tariffs or logistical delays will have a direct impact.
Plus all of my whole industry anticipates a reduction in spend. Conclusion next year will be harder than this year, yet profits must be maintained. Result company wide austerity. :-(
Those who didn't vote KNEW that this was to be their one and only chance to vote on Brexit. They CHOSE to abstain and I believe none of them felt forced NOT to vote.
Despite the JD or helped by it-- either way brilliant, I am with you.Not officially..
My company are a multi-national. I have seen the forecasted figures for next year (which take into account currency changes and economic contraction).
Also there is the consideration that my company manufacture all across Europe and sell all across Europe.. ANY tariffs or logistical delays will have a direct impact.
Plus all of my whole industry anticipates a reduction in spend. Conclusion next year will be harder than this year, yet profits must be maintained. Result company wide austerity. :-(
So, a multi national company that makes and sells all across Europe sees its whole industry predicting a reduction in spend and yet they only single out Brexit as the cause....more jumping on the bandwagon. I do feel sorry for you Brett, speaking as someone who was made redundant at 56 two years ago.
The only uncertainty about Brexit is that being peddled by the vocal minority (the constantly complaining Remain voters, as opposed to those Remain voters who have accepted the result of the real People's Vote that we had a while back) who are determined to undermine both the democratic wish of the majority of those who could actually get off their backsides and vote, and the success of our transition out of the EU. Having a united face in front of the EU would undoubtedly strengthen our chances of getting the best deal possible, everything else just strengthens our opponents negotiating position.
Those who didn't vote KNEW that this was to be their one and only chance to vote on Brexit. They CHOSE to abstain and I believe none of them felt forced NOT to vote.
So, what we have is the minority trying to undermine the democratically determined will of the people in a vote where their decision to partake placed upon them the responsibility to abide by and support the outcome, whether it was in their favour, or not.
The vocal minority crying out for a second vote are simply trying to undermine our basic democratic system, just because they wanted the ice cream and didn't get it.
Now can we get back to the original thread intention please and hopefully find some help for Bretty.
Oh crap .... too much JD.....I'm all confused about which thread I'm on now :lol :lol :lol
The only uncertainty about Brexit is that being peddled by the vocal minorityThe only uncertainty about Brexit is that there is no certainty. Will somebody please tell me what they want :'(
The only uncertainty about Brexit is that there is no certainty. Will somebody please tell me what they want :'(
I'll have a go :D ....I don't want the unelected Junckers and the other unelected commisioners proposing the legislation that eventually ends up becoming law in this country.
Don't talk about me. :-) I'm not after sympathy, just giving you my perspective on Brexit.
I was working for a big (french) multinational corporation when the original brexit vote happened. The 20% devaluation of the pound scrubbed £200mil off the value of the UK business overnight :eek . [size=78%] In my team alone, they put 70 jobs at risk and reduced the team to 35, with further cuts to follow! I left.[/size]
Now I'm at a big american corporation. They look at the UK as their European headquarters, all senior management speak English and the company is the hub for free trade into and around Europe. Now Brexit means Britain is no longer considered a hub of Europe, they will be stripping the company with the intention of devaluing and selling it.
Hence the redundancies.
Anyway, that's just my personal perspective, which just happens to be negative. Perhaps some people can tell us how they have been positively affected and cheer us all (well me) up. :b :D
Perhaps some people can tell us how they have been positively affected and cheer us all (well me) up. :b :D
The only uncertainty about Brexit is that there is no certainty. Will somebody please tell me what they want :'(
You are right, some of the consequences won't be realised for years, but some are already. As Bretty has said, the devaluation of the £ is already leading to job losses.
And yes we will stand or fall on our own merits. Isn't that exactly what the SNP in Scotland wants to do?
Incidentally we are already arranging to transfer EU laws into UK legislation. So perhaps we won't be quite so independent after all :)
Did anyone else see Andrew Marr interviewing Arron Banks on his BBC1 show this morning?.
Crickey Marr worked himself up into a tizzy!. I just wanted to tell him to calm down and relax a bit like Banks.
I don't think it can do anyone any good to get that worked up over it all :eek
The only reason you don't understand what Brexiteers want is because you ask the questions but are not prepared to listen to the answers. Plenty have virtually spelled it out for you in this very thread. You are not interested in what Brexiteers want, only in what you perceive you can get for yourself withinThat's crap. At the beginning I asked two straightforward questions. 1. What should our future trading relationship be with the EU. 2. What should be done about the Irish Border. Nobody has answered either of those. Perhaps it's because the answers are embarrassing. All Brexiteers do is say 'We won, on repeat until red in the face'
I think there's no need to worry about this. Propaganda will get the majority to vote in whichever way suits the big capital best - people are easily manipulated and media is a very powerful tool.
QuoteThe only reason you don't understand what Brexiteers want is because you ask the questions but are not prepared to listen to the answers. Plenty have virtually spelled it out for you in this very thread. You are not interested in what Brexiteers want, only in what you perceive you can get for yourself withinThat's crap. At the beginning I asked two straightforward questions. 1. What should our future trading relationship be with the EU. 2. What should be done about the Irish Border. Nobody has answered either of those. Perhaps it's because the answers are embarrassing. All Brexiteers do is say 'We won, on repeat until red in the face'
Did anyone else see Andrew Marr interviewing Arron Banks on his BBC1 show this morning?.
Crickey Marr worked himself up into a tizzy!. I just wanted to tell him to calm down and relax a bit like Banks.
I don't think it can do anyone any good to get that worked up over it all :eek
I didn't see it, but Marr used to have my respect as a journalist (and his recent series on The History of the World was excellent). If he is going that way too - and just after we got rid of that idiot Evan Davies from Newsnight, leaving only Emily Meritless to go - then I despair of the BBC. Although many did years ago.
Still, they still have Mark Urban, ex-Army tank officer, who is adopting more responsibility for presenting lately. Perhaps with his background, he'll be a bit more non-partisan, less "OMG!!!!!!" emotional (and he has written some good books on military history and presented a good documentary on tank warfare in WW2 too).
Simple. Trading should carry on as normal.N.I. should be handed over to the EU, lock, stock, and Armalite (oops, bit too cynical there! ) barrel.
You should try watching Ch4 news if you like a good comedy. Jon "High'n'Mighty' Snow is hilarious!I agree, but with a small caveat...sometimes the interviewer has no choice but to interupt because, and this applies almost exclusively to politicians, often the person being interviewed will keep deliberately drifting off-topic in order to avoid answering the actual question.
My view is simple. If you are going to invite a guest on to speak, then let them speak. If you just want to shout them down, don't be so rude and arrogant as to invite them on in the first place. And if you want to be impartial, invite on those you may not agree with as well as those you do, however disreputable they may be, if they are making the news in a significant way.
If you want to air a BBC (or whoever) opinions program, then it should be called just that, not thinly disguised as being an impartial (what a hoot!) news program.
I've heard that Arron Banks' next interview is going to be broadcast on Wormwood Scrubs radio :lol
QuoteSimple. Trading should carry on as normal.N.I. should be handed over to the EU, lock, stock, and Armalite (oops, bit too cynical there! ) barrel.
Thank you... :) Two small problemettes.
1. 'As normal' means tariff free and control free. We would have to join a Customs Union with the EU, and for that we would have to pay and take rules from them. It's called EFTA. Some Brexiteers don't like that
2. It all kicks off again, including bombing the UK (possibly by both sides)
Glad we've got that sorted....
Who told you that?. Andrew Marr?
Why? In practical terms?
[/size]You are saying we should allow ourselves to be held to ransom by such people who would resort to terrorism.Plenty would say it never ended. Violent sectarianism is still a fact there, and it has been reported it is on the rise again anyway.
The people of N.I. voted to remain in the EU. Let them, I say. Then the EU can be the ones who deal with all that sectarian nonsense. Not to mention N.I. is a net drain on the UK economy. Nothing-but-nothing-but win! [/font]
QuoteWhy? In practical terms?
Because it takes two to agree a deal, and the EU will insist on conditions. They already do for Norway and Switzerland.
You and I are both old enough to remember what it was like before the Good Friday Agreement. Yes it still happens but it's nowhere near as bad now. If NI stays in the EU then the border is between NI and GB and the loyalists kick off. If it's between NI and Eire, then the Republicans kick off. A no win situation.
QuoteWho told you that?. Andrew Marr?
No, Crapper of the Yard :)
https://news.sky.com/story/national-crime-agency-launches-investigation-into-arron-banks-11541786 (https://news.sky.com/story/national-crime-agency-launches-investigation-into-arron-banks-11541786)
And there you have immediately kowtowed to them. [/size]I asked for an explanation in practical terms, and got one in political terms. Once again showing that politics merely gets in the way of trade.We must have the courage of our convictions and insist on our own conditions. Or it's No Deal.The point is to negotiate a deal, not have one dictated. That is the very reason Brexiteers want out of that non-democratic shambles.
But I trust that if he's exonerated then the Reamainers are going to accept that result
QuoteAnd there you have immediately kowtowed to them. I asked for an explanation in practical terms, and got one in political terms. Once again showing that politics merely gets in the way of trade.We must have the courage of our convictions and insist on our own conditions. Or it's No Deal.The point is to negotiate a deal, not have one dictated. That is the very reason Brexiteers want out of that non-democratic shambles.
I completely agree, but politics was always going to get in the way.
The EU has its own problems and giving the UK exactly what it demands was never going to happen. 'Negotiate' means to the satisfaction of both sides. If both sides want something completely different, then we have No Deal. A brave move with lots of negative consequences.
As to the Irish issue, if NI remains in the EU, Scotland will want to as well. They both had similar Remain majorities.
A thread Just for VNA..... fuck off :lol
:lol He won't post on the subject now it's been syphoned off into the custom built thread. He's already tried to shift it back into 'Today's what gets my goat', but no-one would fall for it.A thread Just for VNA..... fuck off :lol
Good, innit :lol
As for the troubles returning to NI I remember them well, but as for us dealing with them again not sure the squaddies would want to do that and then face persecution (and yes I do mean persecution not prosecution) 40/50 years later when the terrorists are given a get out of jail free card.
:lol He won't post on the subject now it's been syphoned off into the custom built thread. He's already tried to shift it back into 'Today's what gets my goat', but no-one would fall for it.A thread Just for VNA..... fuck off :lol
Good, innit :lol
I like it in here. It's a good laugh....most of the time :wall :lol
and we were forced to privatise our state owned enterprises, with only the NHS surviving the cherry pickingHuh? :rolleyes I think you will find France and Germany have hung on to most of their state owned enterprises. In fact they are running ours. I think you are mistaking the EU for the Tories who privatised them (telecoms, energy, water, trains - shall I go on?)
in fact it has been very informative reading theses posts and I feel as if I have gained some real insight and understanding,Thank you for the compliment :lol
As to NI, yes hand it over to the EU, but the bombs will go off here.
I think you are mistaking the EU for the Tories who privatised them (telecoms, energy, water, trains - shall I go on?)None of the big essential industrys/services should ever have been de-nationalised. I've never agreed with that Conservative Party policy.
I suspect that's a continuation of the piss taking ;) :lolQuotein fact it has been very informative reading theses posts and I feel as if I have gained some real insight and understanding,Thank you for the compliment :lol
Terrorists are daft by definition. We will have 'betrayed them'.
I suspect that's a continuation of the piss taking [/size]
But if we followed your logic, the terrorists would win. We would simply capitulate to their demands.Wasps will leave you alone. What you don't do is prod their nest with a stick :lol
QuoteI suspect that's a continuation of the piss taking
Yes but........ I like informed debate. This country is divided down the middle like never before. Both left and right are taking both sides of the Brexit choice. As has been said here, people are fed up with their lot and the establishment that enforces it. That's worldwide. Like the industrial revolution, automation is now a significant shift. I for one, cannot understand why we are all still working a 5 day week.
The times they are a'changing..... :)
QuoteBut if we followed your logic, the terrorists would win. We would simply capitulate to their demands.Wasps will leave you alone. What you don't do is prod their nest with a stick :lol
- isn't it, as you suggest, the whole point of automation?Known as the 'Jetsons Scenario' (if you remember them). We were promised that automation would be so far developed, that life would be all leisure, and we wouldn't have to work at all. We're still waiting. :rolleyes
QuoteI suspect that's a continuation of the piss taking
Yes but........ I like informed debate.
I was referring to the tommyardin post not your reply to it [/size]
NO! :wall :lolQuoteI was referring to the tommyardin post not your reply to it
Sorry, is that again you piss taking? ;)
I could not agree more, in fact it has been very informative reading theses posts and I feel as if I have gained some real insight and understanding, so please try to ignor the piss taking, I just can’t help it.
QuoteBut I trust that if he's exonerated then the Reamainers are going to accept that result
Of course :lol I know very well Leave EU wasn't the official Leave campaign, but they were subject to the same Electoral Commission rules as the other campaigns. And it looks very much like they cheated.
I must admit, I would like to see that smug git put away. Best he avoids the showers. There's a big Greek prisoner that would like to have a few words with him :rollin
Re-run anybody? :lol
Re-run anybody? :lol
Looks like we're back in after all
A thread Just for VNA..... fuck off ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/Smileys/efocicon/lol.gif[/url])
Just as a lot of them want that terrorist loving rascally old racist Corbyn running the country.
your absolutely right mate, What the hell was I thinking... ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/Smileys/efocicon/wink.gif[/url])
I saw a thing today about a 16 year old giving a speech about 16 year olds getting the right to vote. I think thats ridiculous because they havnt got a clue and don't pay taxes etc etc. But then I would, I'm an old man.
Where did you hear that? I've never heard it.
Anyway, what is a fact is that since the referendum over half a million Leave voters have since died (well that was a waste of their time wasn't it) and more than half a million Remainers have reached voting age.
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/brexit-leave-eu-remain-vote-support-against-poll-uk-europe-final-say-yougov-second-referendum-peter-a8541971.html (https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/brexit-leave-eu-remain-vote-support-against-poll-uk-europe-final-say-yougov-second-referendum-peter-a8541971.html)
And from January it will be a clear win for Remain. Can't wait for the new referendum :D
Unfortunately, the EU referendum isn't next January. Tough old life, eh?
I think that would lead to PM resignation, vote of no confidence, General Election, and we're back to square one.
The whole idea was daft in the first place. Done to silence the Tory right and UKIP once and for all. Except it massively backfired. All about internal Tory party infighting.Indeed. Absolute utter selfishness
And here we are. A split nation with nobody happy....
Hundreds of thousands, across many industries, as companies moved thier business to Europe and we were forced to privatise our state-owned enterprises, with only the NHS surviving the cherry pickingThis was one of the problems with the EU referendum. We’d had some 37 odd years of right wing neo liberal governments. Privatise everything, even schools and hospitals have been partially privatised through the PFI PPP debacles, social and care contracts privatised, our prisons privatised, social housing – everything privatised. The Tory dream of a flexible low wage economy. Our terms and conditions slashed, pay the employee what you can get away with and maximise profit at every opportunity. Over three decades of socialism for the rich.
I don't care. I'm with ogri. I want Brexit. Unfortunately for you, I got a vote too. Deal with it. ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/Smileys/efocicon/cheesy.gif[/url])
Corbyn is one of those rare folks of whom you all complain here does not exist. He is genuine.
I often see Remainers say that the Brexiteers don't know what it was they were voting for. So, to be clear:During the 90s civil wars, my city of 200.000 got around as many refugees. Didn't like the change, even though those people speak the same language. However, the alternative was even worse - letting them die.
1. To be able to make our own laws without having undesirable/unsuitable ones thrust upon us.
2. To be able to control immigration in a way that suits us.
3. To be able to make our own trade deals around the world.
My question is, is there anyone here who doesn't want those three things for the UK, aside, obviously, from VNA, whose only concern is Scotland, and then only those Scots who agree with him?
1. To be able to make our own laws without having undesirable/unsuitable ones thrust upon us.2. To be able to control immigration in a way that suits us.3. To be able to make our own trade deals around the world
What do Remainers want
1: Be part of a trading block that has the size and power to match the rest of the world
2. Freedom of movement and opportunity for UK nationals throughout Europe
3. Continued peace in Europe
1. To be able to make our own laws without having undesirable/unsuitable ones thrust upon us.
2. To be able to control immigration in a way that suits us.
3. To be able to make our own trade deals around the world.
Quote1. To be able to make our own laws without having undesirable/unsuitable ones thrust upon us.
2. To be able to control immigration in a way that suits us.
3. To be able to make our own trade deals around the world.
Obviously to have an open free trade market across 28 countries you need to have common TRADE laws.
the EU will get a better deal if/when all members finally get around to agreeing with each other, which can take years
Why the need for common laws to trade? We traded with Europe long before we joined the EU
Free movement across europe? Weve always had it before we joined the EU. I took several continental holidays in the late 60s, just had to show a passport, thats all.You had no right to live, work or retire there. That’s what we have now.
A referendum that should have never taken place.
We are a representative democracy.
The majority of people in the UK today clearly dont want BREXIT.
You had no right to live, work or retire there. That’s what we have now.
Why the need for common laws to trade? We traded with Europe long before we joined the EUYes it was called EFTA, based around a common Customs Area. It still exists and Theresa May has ruled us out of it. So yes we can trade with Europe, and pay duties, lose trade, close factories, have Customs controls, queue up with the lorries on the M20, create an Irish border etc etc etc
Free movement across europe? Weve always had it before we joined the EU. I took several continental holidays in the late 60s, just had to show a passport, thats all.Neither did you have free health care, included roaming charges, bike insurance cover etc etc
You had no right to live, work or retire there. That’s what we have now.
So they certainly won't let us back in ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/Smileys/efocicon/rollin.gif[/url]) ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/Smileys/efocicon/rollin.gif[/url])
I had to do a double take to make sure, but he genuinely did wear a grey hoodie anorak with the hood hanging out and a red tie for the service of remembrance at The Cenotaph yesterday.
Simply because it's the National Anthem. The words are immaterial.
Personally, I couldn't care less.
Theresa doesn't know the right moves to 'Dancing Queen'
But if Jeremy Corbyn is a republican why would he join in with singing the national anthem?.
When I sing God Save The Queen I actually mean it.
:lolQuoteWhen I sing God Save The Queen I actually mean it.
For focs sake. :eek :eek :eek
I still can't find an explanation as to why Jeremy Corbin sings The National Anthem now, but didn't previously :rolleyes
I'll just have to do my own research ;) .
The consensus of opinion is that the reason he never used to sing it was because he's a commited republican and that the explanation as to why he does sing it now is because he came under pressure from his own MP's and Cabinet collegues to do so. Particularly after the 75th anniversary of The Battle Of Britain service.
HAS to?. Surely he has a choice?. The impression I get is that he was basically presurised into singing it.QuoteThe consensus of opinion is that the reason he never used to sing it was because he's a commited republican and that the explanation as to why he does sing it now is because he came under pressure from his own MP's and Cabinet collegues to do so. Particularly after the 75th anniversary of The Battle Of Britain service.
I don’t know whether he sang that abominable awful anthem in the past or not, but as I have already pointed out, he is the leader of the opposition, that means he may become the Prime Minister one day. He has to follow protocol. Simple.
On the balance of things, as they stand at the moment, I think it would be best to stay in ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/Smileys/efocicon/shocked.gif[/url])
Have you ever watched '12 Angry Men'?Only the Tony Hancock version, which is a comedy classic by the way, but not the film. I get your gist though.
'Does Magna Carta mean nothing to you........ Did she die in vain' :D
So...... if we agree terms with the EU that we stay in the Customs Union and most of the Single Market without a backstop (ie without an end date)........... then we might as well........... stay in the EU :)
At least I think that's what Arron Banks said.
We just need to get Hedgetrimmer and Ogri48 turned, and we're there ;)
That the democratic decision be not only respected, but that everybody pulled together to make it work.
I also have no idea what will happen next.That's the only thing we can all be sure of. Nobody has a clue.
QuoteI also have no idea what will happen next.That's the only thing we can all be sure of. Nobody has a clue.
:eek I think that's the first time I have actually heard Remainers admit this! What's up lads, batteries in your crystal balls run out? :lol
im also unashamedly patriotic, believe in god and country etc.I don’t see what any of that has to do with it OGRI. Do God fearing people want their country to be poorer? Do patriots want their patriotic elected representatives to vote against their own conscience and belief, to vote with Boris and Jacob, and against the best interest of their constituents?
QuoteThat the democratic decision be not only respected, but that everybody pulled together to make it work.
But that is precisely where the problem lies.
Firstly it is a referendum that should have never happened. It happened because the Tories offered it as a means to unite their party and kill UKIP – and it worked. They won the general election.
In terms of making it work,
Putting aside the disastrous campaign (LEAVE – absolute lies REMAIN – absolute fear) – nobody actually knew what BREXIT was – or rather what shape it would take. That came after the vote – when asked May told us it would be – a red white and blue BREXIT (ie she didn’t have a clue).
She then focced up by going to the electorate – she did so in order to avoid the very situation that she is in now. But that didn’t work – and as a result she is in the hands of the DUP and parliament as a whole. And anyway the Tories might be in government – by the skin of their teeth – but they are split and out of control.
But ultimately what you are asking the majority of MP’s in parliament to do OGRI is to vote to implement something that they wholeheartedly and absolutely believe is not in the best interests of their constituents or the country as a whole.
And then there is Ireland.
David Cameron offered you this referendum cos he knew the country would reject BREXIT. He was so confident he never even bothered to consider the consequences, should he turn out to be wrong. Doh! Doh doh doh doh!
I believe these may well be the first few days of a country in a full-blown crisis. I hope not, but it’s looking like it.
but it did happen mate.QuoteThat the democratic decision be not only respected, but that everybody pulled together to make it work.
But that is precisely where the problem lies.
Firstly it is a referendum that should have never happened. It happened because the Tories offered it as a means to unite their party and kill UKIP – and it worked. They won the general election.
In terms of making it work,
Putting aside the disastrous campaign (LEAVE – absolute lies REMAIN – absolute fear) – nobody actually knew what BREXIT was – or rather what shape it would take. That came after the vote – when asked May told us it would be – a red white and blue BREXIT (ie she didn’t have a clue).
She then focced up by going to the electorate – she did so in order to avoid the very situation that she is in now. But that didn’t work – and as a result she is in the hands of the DUP and parliament as a whole. And anyway the Tories might be in government – by the skin of their teeth – but they are split and out of control.
But ultimately what you are asking the majority of MP’s in parliament to do OGRI is to vote to implement something that they wholeheartedly and absolutely believe is not in the best interests of their constituents or the country as a whole.
And then there is Ireland.
David Cameron offered you this referendum cos he knew the country would reject BREXIT. He was so confident he never even bothered to consider the consequences, should he turn out to be wrong. Doh! Doh doh doh doh!
I believe these may well be the first few days of a country in a full-blown crisis. I hope not, but it’s looking like it.
To be fair to May (and I find that very difficult) she was up shit street whatever option /proposal /result she came up with.Agree.
I've just fainted..... :eek
The whole thing is about pragmatism.
QuoteThat the democratic decision be not only respected, but that everybody pulled together to make it work.
But that is precisely where the problem lies.
Firstly it is a referendum that should have never happened. It happened because the Tories offered it as a means to unite their party and kill UKIP – and it worked. They won the general election.
In terms of making it work,
Putting aside the disastrous campaign (LEAVE – absolute lies REMAIN – absolute fear) – nobody actually knew what BREXIT was – or rather what shape it would take. That came after the vote – when asked May told us it would be – a red white and blue BREXIT (ie she didn’t have a clue).
She then focced up by going to the electorate – she did so in order to avoid the very situation that she is in now. But that didn’t work – and as a result she is in the hands of the DUP and parliament as a whole. And anyway the Tories might be in government – by the skin of their teeth – but they are split and out of control.
But ultimately what you are asking the majority of MP’s in parliament to do OGRI is to vote to implement something that they wholeheartedly and absolutely believe is not in the best interests of their constituents or the country as a whole.
And then there is Ireland.
David Cameron offered you this referendum cos he knew the country would reject BREXIT. He was so confident he never even bothered to consider the consequences, should he turn out to be wrong. Doh! Doh doh doh doh!
I believe these may well be the first few days of a country in a full-blown crisis. I hope not, but it’s looking like it.
If the SNP is smart, they will be manoeuvring behind the scenes to back Brexit (they cannot be seen to be doing this).
That way, they'll be able to call for another independence referendum, which will go massively in their favour.I wouldn’t be so sure. It might, it might not. Certainly, many Scots are well peeved at this BREXIT mess that has been forced upon us by England. But then there are many within the SNP who want BREXIT, and then there is the tribal aspect of Scottish politics – the Union Jack Waving God Save the Queen Unionists – who will never ever support independence.
An independent Scotland will be able to waltz back into the arms of the EU.The most important thing for Scotland is the here and now, we can’t afford to leave the Single Market.
All the European nations must think we are all absolutely mad. :lol
They will if we accept May's deal.May is something of a survivor. But how much longer?
May is something of a survivor. But how much longer?
Her government is in ruins, the deal is dead in the water and pariamentary defeat looms.
She sure puts a brave face on it.
All the European nations must think we are all absolutely mad. :lolNever truer words spoken :lol :lol
I have come to the conclusion that the UK cannot do an acceptable deal with the EU. The only reason the EU stays in the negotiations must be that they are hoping to gain complete jurisdiction over all the UK's affairs. To me, that will always be unacceptable.
Quote from: VNA on Today at 05:51:37 PM ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/index.php/topic,24678.msg287131.html#msg287131[/url])<blockquote>All the European nations must think we are all absolutely mad. ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/Smileys/efocicon/lol.gif[/url])
</blockquote>Never truer words spoken ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/Smileys/efocicon/lol.gif[/url]) ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/Smileys/efocicon/lol.gif[/url])
Quote from: VNA on Today at 05:51:37 PM ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/index.php/topic,24678.msg287131.html#msg287131[/url])<blockquote>All the European nations must think we are all absolutely mad. ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/Smileys/efocicon/lol.gif[/url])
</blockquote>Never truer words spoken ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/Smileys/efocicon/lol.gif[/url]) ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/Smileys/efocicon/lol.gif[/url])
I've kept out of this so far.
Just to prove a point.
And I was gonna continue to keep out of it, and anyway the title of the thread pisses me off.
But;
So.......What happened to make you sell your principles up the river....Did you become a politician ? ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/Smileys/efocicon/cheesy.gif[/url])
A thread Just for VNA..... fuck off ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/Smileys/efocicon/lol.gif[/url])
QuoteSo.......What happened to make you sell your principles up the river....Did you become a politician ? ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/Smileys/efocicon/cheesy.gif[/url])
May I quote Tommy again.QuoteA thread Just for VNA..... fuck off ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/Smileys/efocicon/lol.gif[/url])
Youse lot just love it. ;)
Had everyone respected the decision, then things may have turned out differently.
This just about sums it up
Here's an item from a business column in yesterday's London Evening News, word for word :
'There's still no clarity on whether EU regulators will accept UK made medicines which haven't undergone tests on EU soil. So British firms will have to build testing labs on the continent to carry out replica tests to those done in Britain. AstraZeneca, one of our better prepared multinationals has already built a lab in Sweden to do this (pointless) duplicate work. But have all our other manufacturers? Considering such Brexit measures have cost AZ £40 million it's highly doubtful smaller firms will have done. Such situations are repeated across every industry. '
This isn't Project Fear. It's not even as if the new jobs will be in the UK. They'll be Swedish.
Welcome to Project Reality.....
Equally, EU medicines which have not undergone testing in the uk may or not be accepted here, so the european firms will have to build testing labs in the UK. Such situations are repeated across every industry :lol
So they might or they might not.
Equally, EU medicines which have not undergone testing in the uk may or not be accepted here, so the european firms will have to build testing labs in the UK. Such situations are repeated across every industry [/size]
one day we'll all look back on this and laugh. Hopefully. Or cry
Hopefully we'll live long enought to recieve their thanks. I expect they'll be praising their forebears for having the wisdom and insight to see what a corrupt undemocratic racket the whole thing was.Quoteone day we'll all look back on this and laugh. Hopefully. Or cry
It's our children and grandchildren who'll be crying. We'll be dead and despised.
Sometimes, reading this thread is like watching the history channel, with all its repeats from the whingeing, whining losers of Remain :lol
Sometimes, reading this thread is like watching the history channel, with all its repeats from the whingeing, whining losers of Remain :lol
I had a bit of a wobble the other day :o .......but I'm back where I was now :D . Normal service has been resumed ;) . I voted Leave so on reflection I feel it's only right and proper to see it through and honour that 8)
Sometimes, reading this thread is like watching the history channel, with all its repeats from the whingeing, whining losers of Remain :lol
I had a bit of a wobble the other day :o .......but I'm back where I was now :D . Normal service has been resumed ;) . I voted Leave so on reflection I feel it's only right and proper to see it through and honour that 8)
Are you sure? :lol
This deal or no deal.
Do you want to jump off the cliff yourself or be pushed?
Sometimes, reading this thread is like watching the history channel, with all its repeats from the whingeing, whining losers of Remain :lol
I had a bit of a wobble the other day :o .......but I'm back where I was now :D . Normal service has been resumed ;) . I voted Leave so on reflection I feel it's only right and proper to see it through and honour that 8)
Are you sure? :lol
I had a bit of a wobble the other day [/size] .......but I'm back where I was now . Normal service has been resumed . I voted Leave so on reflection I feel it's only right and proper to see it through and honour that
I was inebriated Tuesday evening too :o
As soon as I woke up on Wednesday I thought Foc how am I gonna wriggle out of this one and get back in the Leave camp :lol
nobody is allowed to change their mind. Ever apparently.
Anyway, I've got you all your Xmas present :)
I've decided just to take the piss :lol
Don't tell me you know what's in the box!
You think they'll be shops! :eek:lol
Therefore my final conclusion on the matter carries more weight than most ;) .And it is........Leave with no deal :D
I'm a long standing union member who believes in re-nationalising the essential public services/industries, which by the way should never have been privatised in the first place,Tell me about it :\
I've decided just to take the piss
That's the bit I missed the most during my brief foray into 'Remaining'
QuoteI've decided just to take the pissYou should have stuck with Remain, we've got all the best jokes :)
That's the bit I missed the most during my brief foray into 'Remaining'
I thank god I wore my corset for I fear my sides would have split and I only didn't laugh out loud in case my head fell off :groan
Speaking of jokes, I was so tempted to post.........'REMAIN!' :woot as a wind-up around about midnight last night :lol . Thought better of it in the end though.
What I find amazing is that the Tories (aka the government) has now split into 4 factions :
Remainers /People's Voters - Anna Soubry & Co
May's Dealers - May, Hammond etc (some of the cabinet)
Let's amend May's Dealers - Leadsom, Gove etc (some more of the current cabinet)
No Dealers - Moggites
and that doesn't even include the supporting DUP. Who just want to ensure the document excludes any mention of dinosaurs.
You honestly couldn't make it up. Meanwhile here's a reminder of the current map of Europe....
Don't know what happened there.That's what David Cameron said on the 24th of June 2016 YamFazFan
Don't know what happened there.
That's what David Cameron said on the 24th of June 2016 YamFazFan
Then there is Labour – we won’t accept any deal unless it meets our 6 point test – what the foc! What the foc is the general public supposed to make of that. They want a general election that they can’t possible get presumably so they can put forward their 6 point test or we don’t know what the fuck to do manifesto.
You honestly couldn't make it up.
Richard Littlejohn excellent Daily MailSorry?
Not sure what you mean by a 'proper free newspaper', but we get The Guardian for wrapping the spud peelings in. You can chuck the whole lot straight on the compost heap then .
Former Australia PM Tony Abbott:
"It’s pretty hard for Britain’s friends, here in Australia, to make sense of the mess that’s being made of Brexit. The referendum result was perhaps the biggest-ever vote of confidence in the United Kingdom, its past and its future. But the British establishment doesn’t seem to share that confidence and instead looks desperate to cut a deal, even if that means staying under the rule of Brussels. Looking at this from abroad, it’s baffling: the country that did the most to bring democracy into the modern world might yet throw away the chance to take charge of its own destiny.
Let’s get one thing straight: a negotiation that you’re not prepared to walk away from is not a negotiation — it’s surrender. It’s all give and no get. When David Cameron tried to renegotiate Britain’s EU membership, he was sent packing because Brussels judged (rightly) that he’d never actually back leaving. And since then, Brussels has made no real concessions to Theresa May because it judges (rightly, it seems) that she’s desperate for whatever deal she can get. The EU’s palpable desire to punish Britain for leaving vindicates the Brexit project. Its position, now, is that there’s only one ‘deal’ on offer, whereby the UK retains all of the burdens of EU membership but with no say in setting the rules. The EU seems to think that Britain will go along with this because it’s terrified of no deal. Or, to put it another way, terrified of the prospect of its own independence. But even after two years of fearmongering and vacillation, it’s not too late for robust leadership to deliver the Brexit that people voted for.
It’s time for Britain to announce what it will do if the EU can’t make an acceptable offer by March 29 next year — and how it would handle no deal. Freed from EU rules, Britain would automatically revert to world trade, using rules agreed by the World Trade Organization. It works pretty well for Australia. So why on earth would it not work just as well for the world’s fifth-largest economy? A world trade Brexit lets Britain set its own rules. It can say, right now, that it will not impose any tariff or quota on European produce and would recognise all EU product standards. That means no border controls for goods coming from Europe to Britain. You don’t need to negotiate this: just do it. If Europe knows what’s in its own best interests, it would fully reciprocate in order to maintain entirely free trade and full mutual recognition of standards right across Europe.
Next, the UK should declare that Europeans already living here should have the right to remain permanently — and, of course, become British citizens if they wish. This should be a unilateral offer. Again, you don’t need a deal. You don’t need Michel Barnier’s permission. If Europe knows what’s best for itself, it would likewise allow Britons to stay where they are. Third, there should continue to be free movement of people from Europe into Britain — but with a few conditions. Only for work, not welfare. And with a foreign worker’s tax on the employer, to make sure anyone coming in would not be displacing British workers. Fourth, no ‘divorce bill’ whatsoever should be paid to Brussels. The UK government would assume the EU’s property and liabilities in Britain, and the EU would assume Britain’s share of these in Europe. If Britain was getting its fair share, these would balance out; and if Britain wasn’t getting its fair share, it’s the EU that should be paying Britain.
Finally, there’s no need on Britain’s part for a hard border with Ireland. Britain wouldn’t be imposing tariffs on European goods, so there’s no money to collect. The UK has exactly the same product standards as the Republic, so let’s not pretend you need to check for problems we all know don’t exist. Some changes may be needed but technology allows for smart borders: there was never any need for a Cold War-style Checkpoint Charlie. Irish citizens, of course, have the right to live and work in the UK in an agreement that long predates EU membership.
Of course, the EU might not like this British leap for independence. It might hit out with tariffs and impose burdens on Britain as it does on the US — but WTO rules put a cap on any retaliatory action. The worst it can get? We’re talking levies of an average 4 or 5 per cent. Which would be more than offset by a post-Brexit devaluation of the pound (which would have the added bonus of making British goods more competitive everywhere). UK officialdom assumes that a deal is vital, which is why so little thought has been put into how Britain might just walk away. Instead, officials have concocted lurid scenarios featuring runs on the pound, gridlock at ports, grounded aircraft, hoarding of medicines and flights of investment. It’s been the pre-referendum Project Fear campaign on steroids.
And let’s not forget how employment, investment and economic growth ticked up after the referendum. As a former prime minister of Australia and a lifelong friend of your country, I would say this: Britain has nothing to lose except the shackles that the EU imposes on it. After the courage shown by its citizens in the referendum, it would be a tragedy if political leaders go wobbly now. Britain’s future has always been global, rather than just with Europe. Like so many of Britain’s admirers, I want to see this great country seize this chance and make the most of it. Tony Abbott served as Prime Minister of Australia from 2013 to 2015"
a negotiation that you’re not prepared to walk away from is not a negotiation — it’s surrender.
Quotea negotiation that you’re not prepared to walk away from is not a negotiation — it’s surrender.
Sounds a bit like - if you don't give us what we want we'll jump off a cliff.
Anyway I think she's already tried pointing a gun at her own heid. Didn't work. :lol
That's why he's the former Australian PM.....
They know full well us leaving would seriously wound them.Sorry – so May should – pull out a loaded gun, point it at her own heid, and shout at Barnier “This is going to seriously wound you!” then pull the trigger!
QuoteThey know full well us leaving would seriously wound them.Sorry – so May should – pull out a loaded gun, point it at her own heid, and shout at Barnier “This is going to seriously wound you!” then pull the trigger!
I see. :eek
Yes it would seriously wound Barnier because her head would be is up his arse just like it has been for 2 yearsQuoteThey know full well us leaving would seriously wound them.Sorry – so May should – pull out a loaded gun, point it at her own heid, and shout at Barnier “This is going to seriously wound you!” then pull the trigger!
I see. :eek
Perhaps we could ask the European court to help sort this mess out......when they've finished imposing this sort of shit on us......who the fuck do they think they are telling us who we have to house. It's a fucking joke.
Walk away from the lot of them, show a bit of backbone, get your head down and show the world what Great Britain can achieve.
The EU is nothing short of an unelected dictatorship that are acting like the bully boys in a private school.
They know full well us leaving would seriously wound them.
If only we had a leader who kept this in mind when dealing with the fucktards.
And we should listen to you because...?
Yes it would seriously wound Barnier because her head would be is up his arse just like it has been for 2 yearsQuoteThey know full well us leaving would seriously wound them.Sorry – so May should – pull out a loaded gun, point it at her own heid, and shout at Barnier “This is going to seriously wound you!” then pull the trigger!
I see. :eek
Now, I don't care what the draft deal says, it is time we just walked away from that snake pit.I agree ditch the draft deal and cancel article 50 - job done.
QuoteNow, I don't care what the draft deal says, it is time we just walked away from that snake pit.I agree ditch the draft deal and cancel any further attempts to make a deal with the EU - job done.
Scottish Independence Chap, I'm still waiting for your reply to:
And we should listen to you because...?
Scottish Independence Chap, I'm still waiting for your reply to:
And we should listen to you because...?
Are you struggling with this one VNA? What's up, having trouble with the English language? :lol
mtread, what qualifications and experience do you have that give you more knowledge than him? You're a former...what, exactly?
Quotemtread, what qualifications and experience do you have that give you more knowledge than him? You're a former...what, exactly?
I'm a retired HM Customs & Excise policy maker, and law and regulation implementer. That good enough for you? :b
TouchéQuotemtread, what qualifications and experience do you have that give you more knowledge than him? You're a former...what, exactly?
I'm a retired HM Customs & Excise policy maker, and law and regulation implementer. That good enough for you? :b
Retired? Then no, it's not good enough for me, since a former Aussie PM isn't good enough for you :lol
touché
Yeah Hedgetrimmer, you don't accept anything unless it fits your Brexit Brick Wall.
You just know he's googling shit so he can come back with a load of pointless anonymous quotes and handpicked unproven supposed facts along with plethora of eyelid closing waffle. :lol :lol :lolScottish Independence Chap, I'm still waiting for your reply to:
And we should listen to you because...?
Are you struggling with this one VNA? What's up, having trouble with the English language? :lol
Why are we waiting
VNA's hesitating
:rollin
I guess he must be realising the hypocrisy of his position.
Meanwhile, I'm just continuing to take the piss ;)
You just know he's googling shit so he can come back with a load of pointless anonymous quotes and handpicked unproven supposed facts along with plethora of eyelid closing waffle. :lol :lol :lol
Quotemtread, what qualifications and experience do you have that give you more knowledge than him? You're a former...what, exactly?
I'm a retired HM Customs & Excise policy maker, and law and regulation implementer. That good enough for you? :b
Retired? Then no, it's not good enough for me, since a former Aussie PM isn't good enough for you :lol
I was thinking oh no Hedgetrimmer's focced :'( , then the genius reply saves the day :lol
You're not likely to be focced in this argument when you're on the side of democracy,I take it you'd be quite happy with another referendum then? Just to reinforce the Leave vote of course? After all, you've got nothing to lose....
You're not likely to be focced in this argument when you're on the side of democracy, YamFazFan.Help ma boab!
It seems ze Germans along with the French are getting ready to enforce their vision of ze fourth Reich on the rest of Europe. Hopefully, just by political means this time, but it still illustrates their dislike of democracy.
It doesn't seem long ago we were getting a hammering for our old empire, and enforcing our way on others around the world. But now, suddenly, it's ok if the Franco-German "visionaries" want to do it to the rest of Europe. History shows us too that expansionism knows no bounds.
I was thinking oh no Hedgetrimmer's focced :'( , then the genius reply saves the day :lol
You're not likely to be focced in this argument when you're on the side of democracy, YamFazFan.
Mtread, if possible, and seeing as you have some experience and expertise in this area, could you explain to the forum, briefly and in layman’s terms, what is likely to happen after 29th march 2019 if the UK were to crash out of the EU with no deal?
Help ma boab!
Presumably you are in with the fruitcakes, loonies and closet racists of UKIP. :eek :eek
You're only asking mtread because you know he's going to give an answer you agree with He might well have expertise in those areas he's stated, but that's no guarantee of an unbiased opinion
You can presume what you like - ready to invoke Godwin yet? :rolleyesI had to look that up. I'd never heard of that term before and had no idea what it meant.
Has anybody here read the current draft withdrawal agreement? I have, otherwise I'd be relying on other people's biased opinions, or what's written on the side of a bus.
Good one. Somebody probably lit a fag with it or something ;)
I've been thinking about this long and hard overnight and had a bit of an epiphany. Looking at all the pros and cons, and all the suggestions on here, particularly Dazza's detailed analysis of Article 24 of the Withdrawal Agreement, and the effect on seasonal EU workers in the agricultural sector, and I'm finally persuaded we ought to Leave :'(
.
I knew you'd spot that one. Couldn't resist it .Everyone else is thinking 'what the foc are they on about?'
I'm sure I own the copyright © to some of that text [/size]
QuoteI'm sure I own the copyright © to some of that text
OK, so you could always try suing me............ in the European Courts :lol
We should treat VNA and mtread with the contempt they deserve and should totally ignore their pathetic ramblings.
We should treat VNA and mtread with the contempt they deserve and should totally ignore their pathetic ramblings.The moment VNA described everyone who voted UKIP as a closet racist tells you everything you need to know about the man.
I don't pretend to understand the complexities of the whole situation, I would bet good money to say that nobody does.
I agree with what you say. But you haven't understood what I said. Read it again.I don't need to read it again to disagree with it.
The purely technical unbiased view is that we leave without a 'transitional period'. We immediately go onto what is called '3rd Country' terms and trade with the EU as an outside country. Because we haven't joined EFTA or the EEA we would be subject to Customs controls for freight and passengers at all border points. Under EU rules we haven't agreed terms with any other countries, so by 29 March we will have no trade agreements at all, with anybody. I doubt there has been much if any preparation for this.OK.
That's just the Customs side. Similar issues with fishing, agricultural policy, medicines, air traffic, residency rights etc etc etc.
What the consequences of all that is, short term and long term, I'll let you think about.
Has anybody here read the current draft withdrawal agreement? I have, otherwise I'd be relying on other people's biased opinions, or what's written on the side of a bus.
OK.
So, say the UK crashes out of the UK on the 29th of march 2019. And say I have a small to medium manufacturing company (I don’t) making say fuel pumps for the auto industry. I’ve got a number of contracts and one very nice one with a French car maker. So twice a week I send a big truck full of fuel pumps to France. I have an ongoing order, x number of pumps per week, top quality and must be delivered on time. So it’s pretty simple, I send the pumps as asked, and they transfer the funds once a month to the company accounts. We’re in the single market so it’s no different, apart from the exchange rate, than selling in the UK. So easy.
My company has had informal reassurance through the industry that No Deal will not happen. We’ve been told May has given private assurances to the big industry bosses. Nothing to worry about really. Competition is stiff and margins are tight, but all is OK.
Shock horror we crash out of the EU.
I send truck as usual on the 30th of March. I’ve done exactly as I’ve been doing for years.
So what will happen?
OK here's a more straightforward example
Under Article 13 of the draft transition agreement between UK and EU:
''Union citizens and United Kingdom nationals shall have the right to reside in the host State
under the limitations and conditions''
As I said I've read it :)
So under a No Deal scenario, that will not apply and from the 30th March when we leave the EU with no deal, all UK citizens living in EU countries lose their right to residency, and can be sent home.
Everybody happy with that? Or didn't you realise?
Doesn't bother me. I've got no intention of living anywhere else.
I'd imagine that they'd come up with some sort of similar residency deal [/size][size=78%] [/size]
I wonder how many UK nationals living in the EU voted Leave
I wonder how many UK nationals living in the EU voted Leave
Please don't tell me you actually believe that'll happen. [/size]
Hang on a minute, I'll just check what's written on the bus.....
One thing about May's deal that is good is that those living and working here already can stay. Thereafter, those wishing to come here must fit the UK's requirements, which are not unreasonable, and is a sensible thing to do.
So out of all of those that did have a vote - I wonder how many voted for brexit.QuoteI wonder how many UK nationals living in the EU voted Leave
None. If they weren't on the electoral roll in the UK, they didn't get a vote
The EU have made it clear that the current (agreed) deal can't be amended.Well of course they will say that wont they. That's called negotiating- something that May and the other morons have not got a clue how to do.
So out of all of those that did have a vote - I wonder how many voted for brexit.
QuoteSo out of all of those that did have a vote - I wonder how many voted for brexit.
Gibraltar (which did have a vote) is probably a good indicator - 96% Remain 4% Leave.
So the Brexiteers are selfish but all those that voted to remain are not selfish.
So you're quite happy to explain to the Forum members on here living in the EU why you want them sent home then? Typical selfish Brexiteer.
QuoteOne thing about May's deal that is good is that those living and working here already can stay. Thereafter, those wishing to come here must fit the UK's requirements, which are not unreasonable, and is a sensible thing to do.
Again, factually wrong. When the transition deal starts on 30th March any other EU nationals can still come and stay and work during the transition period. After that these also can stay permanently if they've lived here for 5 years. Oh and they can bring their relatives to stay permanently. It's all in Article 13. :D
So the Brexiteers are selfish but all those that voted to remain are not selfish.
QuoteI wonder how many UK nationals living in the EU voted Leave
None. If they weren't on the electoral roll in the UK, they didn't get a vote
That's ok, because I want this deal to be rejected in Parliament,Well at least that's one thing we want the same :\
we can decide for ourselves who stays and who comes in.And so can the entire EU, or is that concept too difficult to grasp?
Remainers want Forum members to live wherever they choose.
I've just seen that bus!. Some remoaners bought it. It's now got a slogan on the side warning that UK nationals houses will be bulldozed and they'll get deported
QuoteThat's ok, because I want this deal to be rejected in Parliament,Well at least that's one thing we want the same :\
Quotewe can decide for ourselves who stays and who comes in.And so can the entire EU, or is that concept too difficult to grasp?
Blimey, don't you Brexiteers have any funny pictures of your own?
But why would you stay in a country that, having left the EU, has, by your own admission, nothing left to offer you?You are obviously missing the irony of your statement there :rolleyes
'What do we want?'......'A fourth referendum!'
No one need be deported if both sides are sensible about it. Except those living in a country illegally.Hedgetrimmer - You just don’t get it. :wall UK nationals living abroad become as you say ‘illegal’ in the event of a NO DEAL BREXIT.
So out of all of those that did have a vote - I wonder how many voted for brexit.I can tell you what we voted for here in Scotland if that helps you fazersharp. We voted overwhelmingly to REMAIN!
QuoteBut why would you stay in a country that, having left the EU, has, by your own admission, nothing left to offer you?You are obviously missing the irony of your statement there :rolleyes
The EU wants to take in anyone from anywhere in the world who shouts "refugee!" loudly enough, without making any checks before admitting them. It then wants to tell us how many of those people we should blindly accept. You see sense in that. I don't. It also wants us to take in economic migrants who do not have the qualifications we need, when our infrastructure is crumbling and those born here can't get access to the services they need as it is.
Perhaps. Care to explain it to me?
2. It's your selfish opinion that would prevent me from living in an EU country, even if I wanted to
This could be sorted if the EU had the will. It is up to us and them, no one else.
QuoteThis could be sorted if the EU had the will. It is up to us and them, no one else.
Sorry, I thought 'No deal' was No Deal. You can't have 'The bits of the deal I want, but not the rest'
If that's the way the EU wants it, then fine.
4a. Present your Export documentation to the UK Border Force officer to claim back duties and VAT.
4b. Wait while UKBF checks through your goods to make sure you are not overclaiming.
If it's across the Irish Land Border, there's an extra one too
4c. Step outside while somebody in a balaclava sets fire to your lorry
QuoteIf that's the way the EU wants it, then fine.
The word 'Deal' suggests agreement between two or more parties.
I'll be sending out dictionaries for Xmas :)
What is likely to happen next if Parliament rejects the Brexit deal but The Government wins a subsequent confidence vote?.
What is likely to happen next if Parliament rejects the Brexit deal but The Government wins a subsequent confidence vote?.
What is likely to happen next if Parliament rejects the Brexit deal but The Government wins a subsequent confidence vote?.
Then it's likely that on March 29th we will leave with no deal, as the EU will refuse any further negotiations.
The EU will miss us more than we miss them :D . Well they'll miss our cash anyway :lol .
[size=0.85em]
Blimey, don't you Brexiteers have any funny pictures of your own?
Yes
[size=0.85em][/size]
We had all this doomsday scenario stuff just before The Millenium didn't we and nothing happened. [/size] .
QuoteWe had all this doomsday scenario stuff just before The Millenium didn't we and nothing happened. .Now from all I've read on here that is the biggest piece of bollocks I've heard.
I don't think many will disagree with you there. But all of that happened when we were IN the EU. So by wanting to stay in the EU you are voting for more of the same.
What I don’t see sense in is our wars in Afghanistan, Iraq and Libya. What I don’t see sense in is funding Islamic fundamentalists around the world just as wee have done in Syria. What I don’t see sense in is selling arms to sick Wahhabist nutters in Saudia Arbaia who not only use them to kill civilans in Yemen but happen to think nothing of murdering guests to their foreign consulates.
As someone who led major projects during 5 years of preparation for the year 2000
I couldn't interest you in coming out of retirement to lead another major one for the year 2019 could I?.You've only got about 4 months this time though .
I know you're going to hate it because he refers to "Englishmen" :lol[size=78%]
[size=78%]https://m.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=2413308192062759&id=129617873765147[/size (https://m.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=2413308192062759&id=129617873765147%5b/size)]
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As someone who led major projects during 5 years of preparation for the year 2000
I couldn't interest you in coming out of retirement to lead another major one for the year 2019 could I?.
You've only got about 4 months this time though :lol .
'Your Country Needs You!' as someone once famously said. ;)
[/size]Not sure how many were at Nigel's 'Leave Means Leave' do in, where was it, oh yes Harrogate. Perhaps you could remind us :lol
The venue holds 2000 and it was approximately 2 thirds full apparently.
It was part of a tour of different venues and it was ticketed. I'd like to see how many remoaners had turned up to the London march if they'd had to pay to get in :lol .
Besides which you're always going to attract more remoaners to these things. They've more of a gripe and they desperately want to reverse the democratic decision.
The venue holds 2000 and it was approximately 2 thirds full apparently.[/size]It was part of a tour of different venues and it was ticketed. I'd like to see how many remoaners had turned up to the London march if they'd had to pay to get in .Besides which you're always going to attract more remoaners to these things. They've more of a gripe and they desperately want to reverse the democratic decision.
I don't know whether to take that as an insult or a compliment
[size=78%]I'm into insulting people and it's definitely not a compliment so maybe there's a third option[/size][/size][size=78%] [/size][/size][size=78%]
mtread, did you predict the result of the EU referendum correctly? A simple yes or no will do.No, did you? So let's hear your prediction what happens now. :pokefun
Quotemtread, did you predict the result of the EU referendum correctly? A simple yes or no will do.No, did you? So let's hear your prediction what happens now. :pokefun
mtread, did you predict the result of the EU referendum correctly?
Yep --what they going do - throw us out which would save us bothering to organise a referendum which would see us leave.
As I said, a simple one-word answer would have sufficed Why do you think you got it wrong?
Oops that was embarrassing . I missed the NOT out of ' I'm not into insulting people'.
QuoteAs I said, a simple one-word answer would have sufficed Why do you think you got it wrong?
Whereas you are not answering my question at all :)
I got it wrong for similar reasons Farage got it wrong. He thought Remain had won too. In fact he demanded another Referendum.
QuoteOops that was embarrassing . I missed the NOT out of ' I'm not into insulting people'.
I guessed as much :lol
Next thing you'll know, you be putting your X in the wrong box :b
I didn't attempt to make a prediction.
Btw, I don't much care for him either.[/size][size=78%] [/size][size=78%][/size][size=78%][/size][size=78%][/size][size=78%]Seems I've got more in common with you [/size] :eek
O no, I've caught some horrible [brackets] disease off YamFazFan :eek
QuoteI didn't attempt to make a prediction.
Because?
QuoteBtw, I don't much care for him either.Seems I've got more in common with you :eek
Whereas you are not answering my question at all :)
Please, no punch ups on municipal property ;):lol
mtread, did you predict the result of the EU referendum correctly? A simple yes or no will do.
Its all well and good predicting things on the night whilst watching the results come in, but I correctly predicted the EU vote result 2 years before it actually happened. And even before a vote was even announced.Quotemtread, did you predict the result of the EU referendum correctly? A simple yes or no will do.
Can I answer this one too? Please? :D Can I go back to 2014? :D Remember the 2014 referendum. :)
I stayed up all night for the 2014 one. Sure I wanted a YES result, and everybody around me thought it was in the bag but I knew it was very unlikely. And yup early on during the night the clues started coming that all was not well. I figured anything above 40% was a result, a victory in fact and something to take forwards. So whilst I was disappointed, and surrounded by folks who appeared to want to top themselves, I was also pleasantly surprised by 45%, almost half the country felt the way I did. I still think it was a stunning result. Was a strange night.
2016? The polls said it was safe. But I have to say I had a bad feeling in the closing days of the campaign. Didn’t stay up. But I do remember again having that bad feeling as I stood in the kitchen in front of the radio, pausing, slightly scared to turn it on. Then foc foc foc foc foc!
Its all well and good predicting things on the night whilst watching the results come in, but I correctly predicted the EU vote result 2 years before it actually happened. And even before a vote was even announced.Well OK, 2014, I knew from the start it was very unlikely. I did not expect a win. Like I say, to me, 45% felt like something of a victory, a well earnt result.
that'll be the "shit" remain campaign the gov spent millions on of our money to send a leaflet to every house to tell us to stay then mate ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/Smileys/efocicon/smile.gif[/url])
that'll be the "shit" remain campaign the gov spent millions on of our money to send a leaflet to every house to tell us to stay then mate
Whereas you are not answering my question at all
i.e why do you think Farage (and therefore yourself) predicted the outcome of the EU referendum incorrectly?
tbh it wasn't tax payers money, so hey ho.Well Arron Banks won't even tell us where the £8 million came from. Strong suggestion is that it came from the Russian Government. Which is of course illegal. But that's OK then?
At this point I feel the need to go back over to “What Gets My Goat!” AAAAAAAAAAAGH.Me too. I'm getting bored with this.
Italeave and Czech-out will happen nextQuoteWhereas you are not answering my question at all
i.e why do you think Farage (and therefore yourself) predicted the outcome of the EU referendum incorrectly?
You can't answer a question with another question.
My question (still unanswered by anybody) is what do you think is going to happen next?
Me too. I'm getting bored with this.
shall we leave it now fellers?
I think weve all had enough... ;)
Well Arron Banks won't even tell us where the £8 million came from.
If we are out of the EU within 2 years, or even close, I'll buy everybody a pint :-)
You can't answer a question with another question.
My question (still unanswered by anybody) is what do you think is going to happen next?
Here is a prediction worth remembering. :lolIt looks like we're all going thirsty then :\ . To be fair that prediction wasn't inaccurate was it?.
If we are out of the EU within 2 years, or even close, I'll buy everybody a pint :-)
If we are out of the EU within 2 years, or even close, I'll buy everybody a pint :-)Blimey, did I say that? :) How long did it take you to dig that one out :)
FINE - I will have a waffle with my pint pleaseQuoteIf we are out of the EU within 2 years, or even close, I'll buy everybody a pint :-)Blimey, did I say that? :) How long did it take you to dig that one out :)
Well it depends what we mean by 'out'. Looking at the 26 pages of waffle May released this afternoon it could mean anything.
I mean, a pint. That's nearly an armful ;)
Blimey, did I say that? ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/Smileys/efocicon/smile.gif[/url]) How long did it take you to dig that one out ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/Smileys/efocicon/smile.gif[/url])
But your pint promise was in 2016Yes and 'within 2 years, or even close' has passed since then hasn't it?. So the prediction is accurate.
So am I getting my pint or not :crazyBut your pint promise was in 2016Yes and 'within 2 years, or even close' has passed since then hasn't it?. So the prediction is accurate.
I'm still 'Leave' by the way, but I'm a stickler for these type of things :lol
...sorry 'within 2 years, or even close'. Same thing....well not the same thing...'within' isn't over is it :lol
...corrected the first sentance now, ignore the last correction :lol
Quote from: VNA on 20 November 2018, 06:19:08 PM ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/index.php/topic,24678.msg287505.html#msg287505[/url])<blockquote>
What I don’t see sense in is our wars in Afghanistan, Iraq and Libya. What I don’t see sense in is funding Islamic fundamentalists around the world just as wee have done in Syria. What I don’t see sense in is selling arms to sick Wahhabist nutters in Saudia Arbaia who not only use them to kill civilans in Yemen but happen to think nothing of murdering guests to their foreign consulates.
</blockquote>I don't think many will disagree with you there. But all of that happened when we were IN the EU. So by wanting to stay in the EU you are voting for more of the same.
My brother and Dad have both bought properties in the Romanian mountains.If there is a No Deal Brexit they may have a problem there.
I agree with Fazersharp, us leaving will unsettle the EU as other nations will follow suit.It is far from clear at the moment that will be leaving, never mind any other country trying.
This is why(and it's so foccing obvious) that they are making it as difficult as possible for us to leave.The main problem for BREXIT is the Irish border. Their member EIRE is not surprisingly insisting that the Good Friday Agreement is respected. The EU is simpy standing up for it’s members as surely you would expect it to.
I've seen groups of Eastern Europeans sleeping in a camper vans outside a building site.I would agree that it has been a big mistake to allow succession countries full freedom of movement across the EU. It was the UK’s choice not to restrict movement.
I'm being forced to get rid of a perfectly good car and buy an ULEZ compliant carULEZ is local legislation. It is not EU legislation. I agree it’s targets those who can least afford to pay, but it is not EU policy.
when the technology is there to produce any type of fuel from the atmosphere which emits no pollutants.I suspect you’d still need to buy a new motor. ;)
One thing is for sure we are fast running out of time to stop climate change.
Why we aren't jumping on this technology, only the authors of the Barcelona declaration knows. Anything to take away the hold Saudi Arabia has got over us has only got to be a positive thing for all our futures.
Why does Theresa May have to let parliament vote on her deal?It’s because the UK is a parliamentary democracy. All legislation has to be approved by parliament. May has tried to by-pass parliament but the supreme court ruled against her.
Why should Corbyn's bunch of opportunists be allowed to sink it just so that they can get one step closer to a general election.You mean the official opposition. The Labour party can’t get a general election. If there was a vote of no confidence in the government, the DUP would either vote with the Tory party or sit on the fence. Either way Labour cannot call a general election.
Surely we should be asked whether or not to accept either May's Brexit deal or a no deal Brexit?.Parliament will not accept, will not allow a no deal BREXIT. The new saying is that any deal is better than No Deal.
Here are some snippets from Mays open letter - sounds good to me - sounds like what I was expecting to receive when I voted leave.We already have control of our money. We vetoed the Euro. Meanwhile we need to pay 35 billion to begin to leave.
We will take back control of our money, by putting an end to vast annual payments to the EU.
In future, our laws will be made, interpreted and enforced by our own courts and legislatures.Every piece of EU legislation has been negotiated and approved by the UK. Never at any time during our membership have we lost sovereignty. But we will now. Under this deal we have to continue to comply with the customs unions rules whilst having to say whatsoever in any changes to them.
Outside the EU, we will be able to sign new trade deals with other countries and open up new markets in the fastest-growing economies around the world.
Yeah that's them :lolQuoteWhy should Corbyn's bunch of opportunists be allowed to sink it just so that they can get one step closer to a general election.You mean the official opposition.
Here are some snippets from Mays open letter - sounds good to me - sounds like what I was expecting to receive when I voted leave.
We will take back control of our borders, by putting an end to the free movement of people once and for all."Instead of an immigration system based on where a person comes from, we will build one based on the skills and talents a person has to offer.
"We will take back control of our money, by putting an end to vast annual payments to the EU.
In future, our laws will be made, interpreted and enforced by our own courts and legislatures.
We will be out of EU programmes that do not work in our interests: out of the Common Agricultural Policy that has failed our farmers, and out of the Common Fisheries Policy that has failed our coastal communities.
Instead, we will be able to design a system of agricultural support that works for us, and we will be an independent coastal state once again, with full control over our waters.
EU citizens who have built their lives in the United Kingdom will have their rights protected, as will UK citizens living elsewhere in the EU.
"A free trade area will allow goods to flow easily across our borders, protecting the many skilled jobs right across the country that rely on integrated supply-chains.
"Because our European friends will always be our allies in the fight against terrorism and organised crime, the deal will ensure that security co-operation will continue, so we can keep our people safe.
Outside the EU, we will be able to sign new trade deals with other countries and open up new markets in the fastest-growing economies around the world.
So when parliament rejects May's deal we have another referendum. If the result is again Leave we have to go through it all again and again until we vote 'Remain' and parliament votes that through.
Great ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/file:///C:/Users/garet/AppData/Local/Temp/msohtmlclip1/01/clip_image001.gif[/url]):" title="mad" class="smiley" width="16" height="16">. That's democracy in action ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/file:///C:/Users/garet/AppData/Local/Temp/msohtmlclip1/01/clip_image001.gif[/url]):" title="mad" class="smiley" width="16" height="16">.
Further second referendum would have to be legally binding. It will be final.
Does that mean it wouldn't have to go to Parliament to be voted on as this current deal is going to be?.YES!
:lolQuoteDoes that mean it wouldn't have to go to Parliament to be voted on as this current deal is going to be?.YES!
So one possible way forward is a second referendum. It would be May’s deal or ditch BREXIT. Parliament will never accept NO DEAL.
Making it legally binding, would mean it has to be acted on.
In effect you are passing the parliamentary vote to the people.
It would then be up to the people to decide if they really wish to force their elected representatives to embark on mission impossible.
What I don’t get is what do people want from BREXIT.FINALLY :rolleyes
OK so an end to freedom of movement and alternative arrangement to the common fisheries policy.
Irrespective of whether one agrees with these aims or not they are understandable. I get it.
But if the result of that second leagally binding referendum was 'Remain' (ditch Brexit), then surely the electorate who voted Leave in the first one will be going bonkers?!. They'll be blaming Parliament for robbing them of their victory won't they?.
Surely no government would ever risk such a thing.
That’s what politicians do. All the time.Or rather it’s what Tory politicians are prepared to do to win an election. They gambled the future health of the UK economy on an election. Remember Tories exist for no other reason than to rule.
FINALLY ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/Smileys/efocicon/rolleyes.gif[/url])No I've always got that.
Everything to do with the EU has been negotiated with us, nothing has been imposed on us.What is a Myth is that we actually really have any say in the EU. If we did then Camoron would of ben able to get us some concessions and there would of been no need for Brexit.But instead the EU treated him and the British people with an arrogant contempt.
The EU imposing law on us is a myth.The 27 EU countries can amend the customs union and we will have no say.
There could be further negotiation, though the EU appears to be saying very firmly that that will not be an option.Well they would say that wouldn't they - its called negotiating
Again, pretty much everybody agrees that NO DEAL is not an option. The EU won’t that say that right now, but the reality is though it wouldn’t hurt them anything as much as it would hurt us, they simply don’t want to go there either.Er I think not getting their 39 billion under a no deal might make them wince a little
Everything to do with the EU has been negotiated with us, nothing has been imposed on us.You really believe that.
Everything to do with the EU has been negotiated with us, nothing has been imposed on us.Would love to see the evidence of this statement.
Im sure Grease also negotiated,Don't think Olivia Newton John could do much negotiating in those tight trousers :eek
Why do you present that as a dooms day Armageddon to make an anti Brexit point and yet that is EXACTLY what you want to happen with your quest for scottish independence.
In other words a true BREXIT would mean the end of the United Kingdom and Great Britain.
They call it 'Qualified Majority Voting' don't they?.
Ie: the UK can vote against something, but still be forced to implement it because it was out voted by the other member states.
Why do you present that as a dooms day Armageddon to make an anti Brexit point and yet that is EXACTLY what you want to happen with your quest for scottish independence.The priority has to be full single market membership.
It's a fact that the EU has "imposed" over 52000 laws on us since 1990
You may add the poking fun symbol but you really come across as having a problem the the English.
I could do this 52000 or more times but would be simpler if you googled it like I did. ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/file:///C:/Users/garet/AppData/Local/Temp/msohtmlclip1/02/clip_image001.gif[/url])
And nowhere did I say they're all objectionable and negatively impact us.
And if you for one moment think I'm going to trawl through 52741 laws that the EU has imposed on us since 1990 you been drinking too much of that Scottish whiskey. :lol
No, not at all. I do have a problem with English politics. It’s simple – you guys get the governments you deserve :lol – I want that opportunity too. :D
Or perhaps English folks don’t like Independent minded Scots
Ok, you must get it then. We want to be in control of our own destiny, just like you do.
This is me having to explain things over and over.
Didn't you get my analogy of a toxic partner dictating to you....Of course you did so why are you still asking the same question about what Brexiteers want.
I've also previously explained that everyone, depending on their own experiences voted to leave for their own reasons.
You can imply that we are uneducated, thick, misinformed or racist but we voted out because of what we saw, felt and what was affecting us.
Do I give a fuck if the price of German cars go up.... No, even though I drive one. I'll buy Japenese or pay the extra. I really couldn't give two fucks.
OK, but you surely you don’t want to leave the EU because you love it’s rules? So what are these objectional laws – the ones you dislike and why?
Or is this all about freedom of movement, and fishing?
VNA;
OK, but you surely you don’t want to leave the EU because you love it’s rules? So what are these objectional laws – the ones you dislike and why?
Dazza;
And if you for one moment think I'm going to trawl through 52741 laws that the EU has imposed on us since 1990 you been drinking too much of that Scottish whiskey. ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/file:///C:/Users/garet/AppData/Local/Temp/msohtmlclip1/01/clip_image001.gif[/url])
It's quite plain and simple, and I can only speak for myself.... The EU is undemocratic, we didn't vote them in, we can't vote them out...... That, right there is the main reason I voted to leave.
My Great Grandad served in world war 1 and was wounded by machine gun in the leg. Luckily he survived.
My Grandad served in World war 2 in the desert under Monty. He never spoke about it right up to the day he died.
I'm not going to go into detail about my service because it's not important.
I don't believe in God but If I ever met up with them again after this life is over, I want to look them in the eye, knowing I didn't just vote to hand power over to the very nation they fought against for us.
There are many of us Englishmen who feel the same and will never change our minds.
I've served with Scots, proud Scots, good men, solid men. Men who were not only proud of being Scottish but we're also proud of being British.
I know this, you don't represent all Scottish.
I bet the fishermen would see you as a Judas.
The best thing for all is that you just accept.... We had the vote, it didn't go your way, that's it,deal with it and move on.
Get behind it and let's all make the most of any opportunities that come from it.
Stop being the voice of doom and gloom.
You wanted an independent Scotland... I don't blame you but that didn't go your way either........
It's all starting to make sense now why you cant let it go...... Don't hate us, don't hate English politics, it's all corrupt, it's all a load of bollocks. We all know that and we know there's nothing we can do about it.
We all just make the best of what we've got.
What we don't want or need is the EU thinking they know best for us too.... Because they don't,they don't give a fuck either.... Look at all the riots going on in France at the moment.
All up in arms over taxation.
The influx of Moslem men sexually assaulting German women... How do you think that's going end.
Europe is a pressure cooker waiting to explode, surely you can see that.
I'm out of this thread now, it's obvious where I stand and why.
You just need to accept you didn't get the result you wanted.
If it had gone the other way, I for one would've just accepted and got on with it.
When there's been a referendum on the matter (Leave EU), the MP's should respect the majority view of the voters within their constituency area and vote accordingly as a formality. Why should one person make out they know better than the thousands who voted otherwise?.
I'm never voting ever again in any election/referendum if that happens.Good. More power to my vote. :D
I bet the fishermen would see you as a Judas.I think that is how many see the Prime Minister Dazza. We will continue to abide by the common fisheries policy until such time as we can negotiate a new policy. That is a new policy that the EU will accept. It will ultimately be their decision not ours.
Ok lets have another referendum but the questions HAVE to include a No Deal exit as well as May's deal or stay.I voted to leave - I didn't vote for a deal - I didn't vote to give the EU 39 billion, none of that was on the ballot paper.And there should be NO debates in the run up from either side about the the pros and cons and lies and projects of fear or buses or gov printed pamphlets. It should be based on what we have learnt over the past 18 months and witnessed.If a no deal leave is on the ballot paper that is what most people will vote for - my prediction. We leave - the EU does not pass go they do not collect 39Billion. We then negotiate the bits we want how ever long the politicians want to take pissing about doing it, but we do it from a position of out and holding all the cash.I partially agree with you. Nobody knew what BREXIT would actually mean at the time of the referendum (though please remember the referendum is actually about the Tory party). Now we do. Or rather we know what the interim deal is.
Has anyone seen an itemised bill from the EU for the 39 billion.
And there should be NO debates in the run up from either side about the the pros and cons and lies and projects of fear or buses or gov printed pamphlets.You can’t do that. It would be undemocratic. Illegal in fact.
Has anyone seen an itemised bill from the EU for the 39 billion.It is simply to fulfil our contractual obligations. Remember we are fully paid up members who are in fact tearing up our contract and getting divorced. So we have already approved and committed to expenditure, projects etc etc before June 2016.
To get that you would have to elect the closet racists – ie UKIP –Whilst we are on the subject the remainers had the audacity to point at Mogs crew and call them Dads Army - all old WHITE men. Have they not seen the main Brussels bureaucrats all old WHITE men giving out their demands for quotas on migrants that countries must take, where is the diversity in the EU high command where are all the women and people of colour. I would hazard a guess that there are more people of colour in UKIP than in the corridors of Brussels.
Quote from: VNA on Today at 09:39:34 PM ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/index.php/topic,24678.msg287926.html#msg287926[/url])To get that you would have to elect the closet racists – ie UKIP –
Have they not seen the main Brussels bureaucrats all old WHITE men giving out their demands for quotas on migrants that countries must take, where is the diversity in the EU high command where are all the women and people of colour.
Brexiteers moaning (Bremoaning?)That's rubbish it doesn't work. Bregret was a good one and worked when the remainers were trying to create a narrative that a lot of brexiteers now regret voting leave, funny that one did not catch on and they have given up on that tact.
At least all of the 48% Remainers agreed fully on what they were voting for and what they were going to get as a result.I don't think that is correct as there was a lot who did not like the EU as it was but thought that they could change the EU to their liking from within. The leavers voted leave because they knew dam well that aint going to happen. Camoron proved that when he went to the EU with his begging bowl --- they just spat in it and threw him in the Channel.These are the kind of people in charge of the EU project.I would be quite happy to go back to how it all started - as a group of trading nations, without an EU army, EU laws,integrated tax and VAT. Thank the British people that Blair/Brown dare not put forward a referendum on joining the euro cause they knew how that would end.
Brexiteers moaning (Bremoaning?)OK 'Brexshiteers' then. That one stuck, if you excuse the pun :D
That's rubbish it doesn't work.
If you have free seamless trade in a single market, then you have to have harmonised taxation including VAT. And O yes, I do know what I'm talking about :DI never realised that the UK had to introduce VAT in order to join and I also did not realise that 18% all that VAT we raise goes to the EU.
I never realised that the UK had to introduce VAT in order to join and I also did not realise that 18% all that VAT we raise goes to the EU.Well that's even better then - leave the EU fully and every item with VAT will be 20% cheaper.So if VAT is harmonised how come its at different rates and on different products across the EU
QuoteI never realised that the UK had to introduce VAT in order to join and I also did not realise that 18% all that VAT we raise goes to the EU.Well that's even better then - leave the EU fully and every item with VAT will be 20% cheaper.So if VAT is harmonised how come its at different rates and on different products across the EU
The proportion of VAT we pay over to the EU is a major part of the 'membership fee' The so called £350 million a week '. All EU states pay the same proportional contribution. Its the way of making sure' bigger 'countries pay more than the smaller ones.
As to every item being 20% cheaper, I don't think your arithmetic quite works. Perhaps you could show your workings? ;)
All VAT in the EU is harmonised within boundaries, plus or minus certain percentages. Also what you can charge VAT on, and what you don't. EU 6th VAT directive.
It's to ensure that when you buy (say) Yamaha parts from Germany, you pay German VAT rather than have to reclaim it and pay UK VAT as an import.
What we're getting now (and not just on here) is a lot of Brexiteers moaning (Bremoaning?) because they are not going to get the particular version of Brexit they wanted - to just walk away immediately, pay nothing, expect the world to come beating at our door. They assume that everybody who voted Leave wanted exactly the same as them, when clearly that wasn't the case. Many wanted an EFTA /EEA type deal 'just like Norway and Switzerland who are doing so well'. But now No Deal Brexiteers try to hijack the 52% majority vote.
Well the good news is it's not going to happen. As VNA says we don't know what's next, but that's not it.
Then of course there's the current criminal investigation of Arron Banks and the indication of illegal foreign funding. They're not going to let him off the hook.
At least all of the 48% Remainers agreed fully on what they were voting for and what they were going to get as a result.
So I'm feeling more confident by the day. This is going only in one direction.
Bollocks To Brexit ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/file:///C:/Users/garet/AppData/Local/Temp/msohtmlclip1/01/clip_image001.gif[/url])
I never realised that the UK had to introduce VAT in order to joinFazersharp, VAT replaced the UK’s purchase tax. And it was definitely a step in the right direction.
As to every item being 20% cheaper, I don't think your arithmetic quite works. Perhaps you could show your workings?
Ok everything being 18% cheaperQuoteAs to every item being 20% cheaper, I don't think your arithmetic quite works. Perhaps you could show your workings?
Fazersharp still waiting to see your calculations, or is this just another Leave Lie? :pokefun
No you are still misleading everybody. It isn't 18% of the price. It is (on average) 18% of the VAT collected. So that's 18% of the (maximum) 20% of the price. Which makes things at best 3.6% cheaper. Of course we then get EU subsidies.3.6% it is then.
Is that too complicated, or just another pro Brexit lie?
The remainers love to think so as they can weaponise it in their arguments. They like to think the brexiteers are so stupid that they believed every word on the bus. The whole lies were said thing has been done to death its boring- both sides were guilty of it - er surprise ! -- they were politicians. I think the British public saw through all of it.This is just meaningless waffle. Waffle because either you are avoiding, or are in fact, unable to address the substance.
The remainers love to think so as they can weaponise it in their arguments.An interesting turn of phrase. I'll translate it as 'using real facts to prove a point' :lol
It will be a very brave (stupid) government that reverses the democratic decision of over 17 million people.Except presumably, with another referendum?
I say bring it on - lets do it all again but there must be a no deal - revert to WTO rules as an option.QuoteIt will be a very brave (stupid) government that reverses the democratic decision of over 17 million people.Except presumably, with another referendum?
I say bring it on - lets do it all again
If we don't include the stay option - then when the vote is won to leave with no deal they will never give up..
No second referendum. We voted LEAVE.
If there's a vote it should be a choice between May's Deal or No Deal.
If the vote is won to leave with no deal in that scenario. What if it's not and they win it by the same margin that Leave won the first one?.All of a sudden it'll be a 'convincing victory' and we'll stuck in that rotten to the core institution forever.If we don't include the stay option - then when the vote is won to leave with no deal they will never give up..
No second referendum. We voted LEAVE.
If there's a vote it should be a choice between May's Deal or No Deal.
No second referendum. We voted LEAVE.Fazersharp, So clearly you accept that people didn’t really know what BREXIT was when they voted for it.
If there's a vote it should be a choice between May's Deal or No Deal.
No we've had the referendum. Leave won. It's over. There should be no talk of another, only how we leave.
Not me that one -wrong quote - come back later when you have had a wee -dram or 2.QuoteNo second referendum. We voted LEAVE.Fazersharp, So clearly you accept that people didn’t really know what BREXIT was when they voted for it.
If there's a vote it should be a choice between May's Deal or No Deal.
So the EU is a black hole, sucking us in ever further, from which we can never escape, no matter what the consequences for the nationIn a word NO!
QuoteSo the EU is a black hole, sucking us in ever further, from which we can never escape, no matter what the consequences for the nationIn a word NO!
Every expert analysis demonstrates that we will be poorer under May’s deal, and considerably poorer again under a NO DEAL scenario.
In other words we benefit greatly from our full membership of the EU
Prior to EU membership, i never had to pay 20% tax on anything i boughtThat’s incorrect, as I’ve pointed out before VAT replaced the purchase tax in the UK.
So tell me again, how I'm better off in the EUAgricola you continue to blame the EU for the policies of successive UK governments, and it appears local councils too. :eek
I presume that Northern Ireland, Wales, and Scotland will also be represented.
Funny how all these predictions of the UK being this much or that much worse off have suddenly hit the headlines today. BofE for instance. And this would be the same BofE that didn't predict the 2008 financial crash? ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/Smileys/efocicon/rolleyes.gif[/url])
Governments own figures project for 15 years. So I guess in 1993, they should have been able to predict the 2008 financial crash too? ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/Smileys/efocicon/rolleyes.gif[/url])
And also a prominent 'Leave' conservative as both Theresa May and Corbyn were Remainers at the time of the referendum.Boy. That’s quite a thought. The Prime Minister and the leader of the opposition from within her party perhaps?
I suggest Jacob Rees-mogg. A well balanced debate would be good ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/Smileys/efocicon/smile.gif[/url])
QuotePrior to EU membership, i never had to pay 20% tax on anything i boughtThat’s incorrect, as I’ve pointed out before VAT replaced the purchase tax in the UK.QuoteSo tell me again, how I'm better off in the EUAgricola you continue to blame the EU for the policies of successive UK governments, and it appears local councils too. :eek
You were given a ball to kick, and like many others you kicked it hard. But I’m afraid you’ve kicked the wrong ball.
Or we could have the (failed 7 times) non MP bore Farage :lol
We never had either of those before the EUAre you just making this stuff up :rolleyes
If it's on Channel four or the BBC I expect it'll comprise of about 7 prominant Remainers and Mrs May.But that's 8 prominent Remainers ;)
QuoteWe never had either of those before the EUAre you just making this stuff up :rolleyes
We never had 'Strictly Come Dancing' before the EU either.......
Just to make one thing clear, VAT is not an EU invention. It existed before the EU, and many Non-EU countries have also adopted VAT systems.Google tells me this.
Funny how all these predictions of the UK being this much or that much worse off have suddenly hit the headlines today. BofE for instance. And this would be the same BofE that didn't predict the 2008 financial crash? :rolleyesWhat they don't realise is that it doesn't matter because those who voted leave either didnt believe the project fear and even if they did they don't care and see it as a risk or price worth paying in the long run.
Governments own figures project for 15 years. So I guess in 1993, they should have been able to predict the 2008 financial crash too? :rolleyes
In 15 years, I wonder if there'll even be an EU.
Or we could have the (failed 7 times) non MP bore Farage :lolLook at some utube of Sir Nigel Farage in action in the European parliament, and the way they treat him is pretty much how they feel about the UK.
We never had 'Strictly Come Dancing' before the EU either.......
Sadly not
What they don't realise is that it doesn't matter because those who voted leave either didnt believe the project fear and even if they did they don't care and see it as a risk or price worth paying in the long run.
Quote from: mtread on 28 November 2018, 11:46:44 PM ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/index.php/topic,24678.msg288050.html#msg288050[/url])[/size]Just to make one thing clear, VAT is not an EU invention. It existed before the EU, and many Non-EU countries have also adopted VAT systems.
Google tells me this. Was VAT introduced by the EU? VAT was originally a French idea, started in the 1950s. Britain introduced it as part of its condition of joining the European Economic Community. All countries joining the EEC had to replace their indirect taxes with the VAT.
Or we could have the (failed 7 times) non MP bore FarageFarage hardly ever turns up. He has one of the worst attendance records (Google it) ;)
Look at some utube of Sir Nigel Farage in action in the European parliament, and the way they treat him is pretty much how they feel about the UK.
the bottom line is those of us who voted to leave got shafted.
if the country and the government had held their nerve and got a good deal, it would have been fine.
but you have to hand it to the remainers (including Teresa may), they played a blinder.
Make such a piss poor jo of it all that we either come out worse or have another referendum which obviously will now go the way of remain, given that we know no one in power will fight for what we actually wanted. Add in weve been humiliated by the EU, and had two years of being slated for our racism/xenophobia/stupidity etc and its a remainers victory over democracy.
and you know what? mttreadand vna are right. I was stupid. For ever believing there was a chance the powers that be would see it through properly. oh well hey.
I for one will never vote again, nor care whos in power both here and amongst our EU overlords.
. Useless Carney with his failed forward guidance proves he knows nothingYou mean Mark Carney who graduated from Harvard with a degree with high honours in economics, before postgraduate studies at Oxford where he received masters and doctoral degrees. Then of course Goldman Sachs and the Bank of Canada before his current job.
Keep your chin up. I had a little wobble a couple of weeks ago, but I got over it thank goodness. Although in my defence I had imbibed a few too many light ales at the time ;) .
the bottom line is those of us who voted to leave got shafted.
if the country and the government had held their nerve and got a good deal, it would have been fine.
but you have to hand it to the remainers (including Teresa may), they played a blinder.
Make such a piss poor jo of it all that we either come out worse or have another referendum which obviously will now go the way of remain, given that we know no one in power will fight for what we actually wanted. Add in weve been humiliated by the EU, and had two years of being slated for our racism/xenophobia/stupidity etc and its a remainers victory over democracy.
and you know what? mttreadand vna are right. I was stupid. For ever believing there was a chance the powers that be would see it through properly. oh well hey.
I for one will never vote again, nor care whos in power both here and amongst our EU overlords.
Keep your chin up. I had a little wobble a couple of weeks ago, but I got over it thank goodness. Although in my defence I had imbibed a few too many light ales at the time ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/Smileys/efocicon/wink.gif[/url]) .
I admit the situation doesn't look good, but it's not all over yet, as much as they'd like it to be.
Fazersharp, sorry bud :oThat's alright I understand. I know that after a day managing the lairds estate that you cant wait to come home to your croft to a wee dram and a log fire and rip into the forum.
I'm quoting you quoting YamFazFan but addressing yourself :o
Doh Doh Doh! :o
Sorry.
With the pound crashing you could potentially see the cost of motorcycle such as Yamaha’s MT10, £9999.00 before the BREXT referendum, easily end up costing 14 or 15K.I don't want an MT10. I want to buy a big two-stroke like we had in the good old days 8) .
VNA you must be so conflicted because on one hand you are using brexit as a leverage tool to back up your fight for scotish independence, so if we brexit you can carry on using the "England dragging scotland out of the EU" chestnut. Yet you are backing remain and if you win that one then you put yourself one more step away from scottish independence.Fazersharp,
No wonder you are Virtually Nearly always Angry.
No wonder you are Virtually Nearly always Angry.Please if you wish to address me in full, it’s Very Nasty Andy :evil I abbreviated it when the forum moved from YUKU to it’s current host.
Quote. Useless Carney with his failed forward guidance proves he knows nothingYou mean Mark Carney who graduated from Harvard with a degree with high honours in economics, before postgraduate studies at Oxford where he received masters and doctoral degrees. Then of course Goldman Sachs and the Bank of Canada before his current job.
Where are the Leave 'experts' coming up with convincing forecasts and figures?
So........ where's the Leave experts and their forecasts then?
If you listen to his news conference this week he doesn't say anything good or bad, the words I have posted are all from that conference, and- just like all economist speak they are careful so they never say anything definite - just like a clairvoyant bulshitting giving vague responses that can cover everything.
There are no Leave forecasts because they know the results are very bad. Either that or they have trouble with 2+2. So they just criticise to deflect the truth.
He's got a doctorate in Economics for christsake. They don't dish those out for nothing.
There are no Leave forecasts because they know the results are very bad. Either that or they have trouble with 2+2. So they just criticise to deflect the truth.
Here's part of Carney's entry from Wikipedia. I suppose that's all lies too? :b
''The epoch-making feature of his tenure as Governor of the Bank of Canada remains the decision to cut the overnight rate by 50 basis points in March 2008, only one month after his appointment. While the European Central Bank delivered a rate increase in July 2008, Carney anticipated the leveraged-loan crisis would trigger global contagion. When policy rates in Canada hit the effective lower-bound, the central bank combatted the crisis with the non-standard monetary tool: "conditional commitment" in April 2009 to hold the policy rate for at least one year, in a boost to domestic credit conditions and market confidence. Output and employment began to recover from mid-2009, in part thanks to monetary stimulus. The Canadian economy outperformed those of its G7 peers during the crisis, and Canada was the first G7 nation to have both its GDP and employment recover to pre-crisis level''
He said what he was told to just like Obama who gave the game away by saying "the UK would be back of the queue" - when an American would not say queue - they would of said "line". Scripted and written for him and not off the cuff.He's got a doctorate in Economics for christsake. They don't dish those out for nothing.
There are no Leave forecasts because they know the results are very bad. Either that or they have trouble with 2+2. So they just criticise to deflect the truth.
Here's part of Carney's entry from Wikipedia. I suppose that's all lies too? :b
''The epoch-making feature of his tenure as Governor of the Bank of Canada remains the decision to cut the overnight rate by 50 basis points in March 2008, only one month after his appointment. While the European Central Bank delivered a rate increase in July 2008, Carney anticipated the leveraged-loan crisis would trigger global contagion. When policy rates in Canada hit the effective lower-bound, the central bank combatted the crisis with the non-standard monetary tool: "conditional commitment" in April 2009 to hold the policy rate for at least one year, in a boost to domestic credit conditions and market confidence. Output and employment began to recover from mid-2009, in part thanks to monetary stimulus. The Canadian economy outperformed those of its G7 peers during the crisis, and Canada was the first G7 nation to have both its GDP and employment recover to pre-crisis level''
Even a broken clock is right twice a day ;)
His average however isn't very good. Not least his forecast of instant disaster immediately following the referendum.
His average however isn't very good. Not least his forecast of instant disaster immediately following the referendum.
And there they are all in that BBC picture, 5 of the words that I said they always use.QuoteHis average however isn't very good. Not least his forecast of instant disaster immediately following the referendum.
What you mean the £ isn't at a 31 year low against the $ ! Thank goodness :rolleyes
Here's the Bank of England 's forecast he was referring to. The news is Bad, Very Bad or Crisis. Stop pretending otherwise.
Still waiting for the positive Leave forecasts that suggest this is all wrong :rolleyes
Forecasts and predictions are for Remainers who have nothing better to do. Leavers just want to get out and get on with running our country.
His average however isn't very good. Not least his forecast of instant disaster immediately following the referendum.His forecast before the referendum for a LEAVE result was rougthly increased risk of a technical recession, a significant drop in the value of the pound and an increase in inflation.
So........ where's the Leave experts and their forecasts then?Johnston and Gove. They painted it on the side of a bus. Since proven to be a lie.
So........ where's the Leave experts and their forecasts then?Here's one for you to trash :D
Minford admits his model predicts that the policy would cause the ‘elimination’ of UK manufacturing and a large increase in wage inequality.As I have said all along, it's us ordinary people that will pay the price of BREXIT. And as we have seen some already have.
Forecasts and predictions are for Remainers who have nothing better to do. Leavers just want to get out and get on with running our country.Leavers don't do forecasts and predictions because they believe 'getting back control' means we should all pay for it with more austerity.
Leavers don't do forecasts and predictions because they believe 'getting back control' means we should all pay for it with more austerity.
Leavers just want to get out and get on with running our country.
Quote from: mtread on Today at 09:45:12 PM ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/index.php/topic,24678.msg288167.html#msg288167[/url])<blockquote>
Leavers don't do forecasts and predictions because they believe 'getting back control' means we should all pay for it with more austerity.
</blockquote>
Quote from: Hedgetrimmer on Today at 12:36:36 PM ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/index.php/topic,24678.msg288128.html#msg288128[/url])Leavers just want to get out and get on with running our country.
Quote<blockquote>Minford admits his model predicts that the policy would cause the ‘elimination’ of UK manufacturing and a large increase in wage inequality.</blockquote>
Minford admits his model predicts that the policy would cause the ‘elimination’ of UK manufacturing and a large increase in wage inequality.Do you feel like you'll be a winner in a NO DEAL BREXIT?
You can’t assume Minford is impartial....or that VNA is impartial.
Never ever underestimate the Tory parties ability to connive, manipulate and cut deals to stay in power .....or Corbyn's ability to do so in order to get in power.
So you're better informed, more independant minded and a greater expert on these matters than this Minford bloke? ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/Smileys/efocicon/rolleyes.gif[/url]) .
QuoteSo you're better informed, more independant minded and a greater expert on these matters than this Minford bloke? ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/Smileys/efocicon/rolleyes.gif[/url]) .
Ah I see nobody is allowed an opinion other than YamFazFan. :eek
Summing up
Alternative economic models have different advantages and drawbacks and are suited for different purposes. Unfortunately, Minford’s model is inconsistent with two basic facts about international trade: first, that trade satisfies the gravity equation; and second, that the EU has been trade-creating, not simply a tool for trade diversion.
This implies that the model will give very unreliable predictions of the consequences of Brexit for trade and living standards. When we analyse the same scenario considered by Minford using a more realistic assessment of how UK ‘unilateral trade liberalisation’ could actually work, we find (alongside just about everyone else) that Brexit still leads to a decline in UK living standards.
Minford’s ‘Liverpool model’ with its 1970s vintage of perfect markets everywhere has a bad track record when it comes to policy analysis. For example, in 1997 the model ([url]http://www.publications.parliament.uk/pa/cm199798/cmhansrd/vo971203/debtext/71203-39.htm[/url]) predicted that the proposed national minimum wage would mean millions more unemployed. Subsequent evaluations of the minimum wage have shown that the actual effect was rather less – zero, in fact (Metcalf ([url]http://hussonet.free.fr/dp0781.pdf[/url]), 2008).
Like the other 1970s hit, we Won’t Get Fooled Again.
Minford admits his model predicts that the policy would cause the ‘elimination’ of UK manufacturing and a large increase in wage inequality.
I think Minford is absolutely wrong about that.
And can I come back to the one thing I think Minford is absolutely right about;QuoteMinford admits his model predicts that the policy would cause the ‘elimination’ of UK manufacturing and a large increase in wage inequality.
He's stopped selling European beers and wines and his prices have come down.No he hasn't and no they haven't. I think he's still selling some Guinness, and I wonder where that's brewed? He's replaced some beers and wines with inferior products :b
Be seen to putting public spaces and parts of gardens aside for allotment to grow our own itAye sadly it could come to that.
He's stopped selling European beers and wines and his prices have come down.So what do you think will happen to his prices when the pound is worth 80p to the dollar?
So what do you think will happen to his prices when the pound is worth 80p to the dollar?Lets see where you have the proof for that one then. - Or it it another remain goblin, to coin a phrase about unicorns thrown at leavers.
He's stopped selling European beers and wines and his prices have come down.[size=78%]No he hasn't and no they haven't. I think he's still selling some Guinness, and I wonder where that's brewed? He's replaced some beers and wines with inferior products :b I'd check the term 'fascist' in the dictionary if I were you.
But your missing the point....No I'm not. I'm correcting what you said. He's not replacing ALL European beers and wines, just a few.
Wetherspoon has four pubs in suburban Dublin and one in Cork.:lol :lol
It also has two undeveloped sites in Carlow and Waterford and plans to purchase more sites around Ireland.:lol :lol :lol :lol
So you are an expert then :rolleyesQuoteBut your missing the point....No I'm not. I'm correcting what you said. He's not replacing ALL European beers and wines, just a few.
As for being an 'expert', I think I was brewing beer and making wine while you were still in short trousers :b
And as for replacing Champagne. Who on earth would buy Champagne in a Wetherspoons :rollin
I'm off to get showered and down Wetherspoons for some British ChampagneI think I can say with some certainty that you never be able to find, never mind taste, British Champagne! :lol
Ok then, how about sparkling wine ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/Smileys/efocicon/lol.gif[/url])
QuoteOk then, how about sparkling wine ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/Smileys/efocicon/lol.gif[/url])
Sorry I thought you were a bloke. Enjoy. :D Personally I drink beer and whisky in the pub. ;)
Getting a bit petty now I think. And if I have to dig for victory, then Ill do it. Some of our small breweries are turning out fabulous beers, so the EU can keep its bland tasteless lagers. If we are no longer able to get bratwurst, Gorgonzola, or Belgian chocolate, so what. In the grand scheme of things, they don't matter. If house prices tumble, great news for all those poor buggers that couldn't previously afford to buy a home. If the pound falls, it'll recover, it always has. Life will go on, and rather than the pigs ear parliament over the water churning out compromises which leave half of em unhappy all the time, dictating what national governments can and cant spend their own money on, we''l be back in control of our own destiny and stand or fall by it. If the Scots want to go their own way, let them go, be interesting to see Sturgeon with the begging bowl in Brussels, in the queue behind Romania/Bulgaria etc, with absolutely no say in matters
Oh, and by the way " TREASON" - the crime of showing no loyalty to your country, especially by helping its enemies or trying to defeat its government. :)
If the Scots want to go their own way, let them go:agree Totally--- forget a scot referendum it should be an English referendum if we want to kick the scots out.For one, it would make the weather forecast much better as we would not have to sit through pointless forecasts that have to cover right up to Lerwick.
On one hand you talk about sheep and exporting/ importing being bad for the environment but on the other you seem to take umbridge with Witherspoon doing the right thing by the environment by only using UK beer/ sparkling wine.
What about all that yellow whisky stuff scotland sends to Japan, surely there is no need for all those air miles when saki tastes just as bad, so the Japanese may as well just stick to drinking that.
AND I want back the hour of daylight that scotland steals from us every October. ---Just so the farmers can see their sheep in the mornings so they they can catch them and send to New Zealand.Nothing to do with us. Nothing to do with farming either. Was supposed to be about the school kids walking to school in daylight. The sooner they keep us on summer time all year round the better. At the moment round my way the sun rises at 08.25 and sets at 15.49 – the day is 7hrs 23 minutes long and we’ve still 30 minutes to loose. Foccing murder.
so the EU can keep its bland tasteless lagers. If we are no longer able to get bratwurst, Gorgonzola, or Belgian chocolate, so what. In the grand scheme of things, they don't matter.
Belgian Trappist Dubble and Tripel, French Chimay Bleu, German purity laws and Schwarzbier.The Belgians are serious beer nuts. Don't forget Czech beer.
forget a scot referendum it should be an English referendumWell as London produces 22% of the UK GDP, we're thinking of getting rid of the rest of England :lol
I equally don't think that too much port is drunk in W-Spoons either. And we brew a very good Trappist beer right here in the uk.QuoteBelgian Trappist Dubble and Tripel, French Chimay Bleu, German purity laws and Schwarzbier.The Belgians are serious beer nuts. Don't forget Czech beer.
And Port, where is Tim going to find an alternative tae Port.
Note also that under directive 2004/38 EU migrants only have a right to residence in a member state for 3 months. After that they need to have one of three things in order to continue to stay – A job – A job lined up – or be able to demonstrate that they have the means to support themselves.
So we already have the means to control EU movement.
until a Czech-Out which is on the cards once we show that it can be done.Don't you believe it. I go to the Czech Republic and Slovakia every year. The EU are giving them too much money for them to want to leave
The more I find out the less I want to be in.Quoteuntil a Czech-Out which is on the cards once we show that it can be done.Don't you believe it. I go to the Czech Republic and Slovakia every year. The EU are giving them too much money for them to want to leave
What happens if they don't fulfil those conditions?They do not have a right to remain.
Well as London produces 22% of the UK GDP, we're thinking of getting rid of the rest of England ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/file:///C:/Users/garet/AppData/Local/Temp/msohtmlclip1/01/clip_image001.gif[/url])
QuoteWhat happens if they don't fulfil those conditions?They do not have a right to remain.
Does that mean they are sent back to the member state that they came from?.What it means is that they are no longer in the country legally. They can be removed.
Are they all removed?.QuoteDoes that mean they are sent back to the member state that they came from?.What it means is that they are no longer in the country legally. They can be removed.
Macron backs down on fuel taxWell he's only postponed it for now, but who knows. Interesting in that what he wanted to do was equalise Petrol and Diesel Excise duty, which is what the UK has done for many years
Don't know what happened to my image so I'll try again.We've seen that nonsense thing before :z . I think mtread's already posted it
I think mtread's already posted itThat is true, but I've got loads more ;)
We need to ditch BREXITJust watching parliament live. That's what quite a few MP's are saying. I'm amazed how many of them don't appear to know that there's been a referendum or the result of it :eek . Shocking really. You wouldn't think that there was anyone left in the UK who didn't know.
Remain is on a roll :lolI'm not swallowing that ;)
Quote<blockquote>Minford admits his model predicts that the policy would cause the ‘elimination’ of UK manufacturing and a large increase in wage inequality.</blockquote>
So tell me YamFazFan do you want to see UK manufacturing eliminated?
What is it that you want YamFazFan,
You never answered my question;QuoteQuote<blockquote>Minford admits his model predicts that the policy would cause the ‘elimination’ of UK manufacturing and a large increase in wage inequality.</blockquote>
So tell me YamFazFan do you want to see UK manufacturing eliminated?
I think Minford is absolutely wrong about that.
And can I come back to the one thing I think Minford is absolutely right about;QuoteMinford admits his model predicts that the policy would cause the ‘elimination’ of UK manufacturing and a large increase in wage inequality.
That's what quite a few MP's are saying. I'm amazed how many of them don't appear to know that there's been a referendum or the result of it . Shocking really. You wouldn't think that there was anyone left in the UK who didn't know.
I think Minford is absolutely wrong about that.
Isn't that what you did too :rolleyesQuoteI think Minford is absolutely wrong about that.
So what you are doing is taking an economic model and cherry picking the bits you like and dismissing those you don’t.
Isn't that what you did too ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/Smileys/efocicon/rolleyes.gif[/url])
QuoteI think Minford is absolutely wrong about that.
So what you are doing is taking an economic model and cherry picking the bits you like and dismissing those you don’t.
Ah, if only life could be like that.
And can I come back to the one thing I think Minford is absolutely right about;QuoteMinford admits his model predicts that the policy would cause the ‘elimination’ of UK manufacturing and a large increase in wage inequality.
If you count all EU regulations, EU-related Acts of Parliament, and EU-related Statutory Instruments, about 62% of laws introduced between 1993 and 2014 that apply in the UK implemented EU obligations.I find that difficult to believe. What's your source? As pointed out, the 14% figure is research in the House of Commons Library
Robert Oxley from Vote Leave says, [/size]"If you stacked the entire EU rule book it would be higher than Nelson's columWhich is of course typical Vote Leave hyperbole...
Here you go -enjoy.QuoteIf you count all EU regulations, EU-related Acts of Parliament, and EU-related Statutory Instruments, about 62% of laws introduced between 1993 and 2014 that apply in the UK implemented EU obligations.I find that difficult to believe. What's your source? As pointed out, the 14% figure is research in the House of Commons LibraryQuoteRobert Oxley from Vote Leave says, [/size]"If you stacked the entire EU rule book it would be higher than Nelson's columWhich is of course typical Vote Leave hyperbole...
[/size][size=78%] [/size]
Quote from: VNA on 04 December 2018, 08:52:44 PM ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/index.php/topic,24678.msg288378.html#msg288378[/url])
Quote
I think Minford is absolutely wrong about that.
So what you are doing is taking an economic model and cherry picking the bits you like and dismissing those you don’t.
Ah, if only life could be like that.
Quote from: VNA on 01 December 2018, 01:24:56 PM ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/index.php/topic,24678.msg288193.html#msg288193[/url])
And can I come back to the one thing I think Minford is absolutely right about;
Quote
Minford admits his model predicts that the policy would cause the ‘elimination’ of UK manufacturing and a large increase in wage inequality.
It's the possibility of Remain winning a second referendum that you need to really worry about. Does anyone seriously think it wouldn't be as close either way as the first one was?
Leave will have had to win twice. Remain only have to win once. That's why they're so keen to have another crack at it ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/file:///C:/Users/garet/AppData/Local/Temp/msohtmlclip1/01/clip_image001.gif[/url])
If there were a second, the result would be binding. Say Remain win by 52% to 48%. That's the same as the margin Leave won by in the first referendum so it's a draw over the two rounds, but only the second one counts and then we're stuck in that rotten to the core institution forever.
They'd be as ungracious in victory as they are in defeat. They would be rubbing Leaver's noses right in it.
If Remain lost again I dread to think how low they would stoop in an attempt to overturn the democratic result again.
The formal legal recommendation cites Britain's "sovereignty" in treaty-making matters and says withdrawal "may be revoked at any time" during the negotiating period, as long as it is done in good faith.
Our democracy is alive and well. :D
They'd be as ungracious in victory as they are in defeat. They would be rubbing Leaver's noses right in it.
Here you go -enjoy.https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-eu-referendum-36473105 (https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-eu-referendum-36473105)The article you quote goes on to say:
I can see your pic in post #722 on a mobile phone, but on laptop it just appears as an edit message or a blank in this mode.The quote text in your post #718 is too miniscule to read on both devices.It must be just me. I give up .
QuoteHere you go -enjoy.https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-eu-referendum-36473105 (https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-eu-referendum-36473105)The article you quote goes on to say:
''So, does that mean that the Brexiteers are right?Not according to many expert lawyers and academics. There are a number of reasons for this. Firstly, some EU regulations, like those governing tobacco and olive oil production, are agreed by all member states but don't actually affect us at all because we don't have those industries here.
We also adopt some EU regulations that simply codify existing UK law at a European level. In other words, we would have that law anyway. But perhaps the biggest way in which it is said the 62% is inflated is because it includes within it what are known as non-legislative EU regulations, which concern matters so small or routine that many people wouldn't really recognise them as law.''
Well Fazersharp, you seem to have well and truly shot yourself in the foot there :lolErr - no. all you have done is back up exactly what I said, which was
And there are laws and there are "laws"you backed me up with this bit
includes within it what are known as non-legislative EU regulations, which concern matters so small or routine that many people wouldn't really recognise them as law.''
All of which means ( according to many expert lawyers and academics) that the Brixiteers have got it wrong and it's nowhere near 62%?Laws and "laws" if you want to be pedantic about it to try and debunk figures then go ahead.
62% of UK laws and non-legislative regulations come from the EUIncluding those on Tobacco and Olive growing. The BBC examination is making the point that the 62% is totally misleading. They are the ones being pedantic. 62% is Leave's own version of 'Project Fraud'.
I still haven't got a clue as to the 'laws' you object to?This --- coming from someone who wants an independent scotlanl REALLY ! :rolleyes do you not see the irony.
And how those 'laws' are impacting on your life.
Daylight running lightsYou want to leave the EU becuase of daylight running lights?
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DtuHQVbWoAAo46o.jpg)An out of work plumber --- :rollin
You asked for one - I gave you one.QuoteDaylight running lightsYou want to leave the EU becuase of daylight running lights?
I mean what the :eek
Macron backs down on fuel tax
Abnormal curvature of bananas
A Brussels ban on bendy bananas is one of the EU’s most persistent myths.
Bananas have always been classified by quality and size for international trade. Because the standards, set by individual governments and the industry, were confusing, the European Commission was asked to draw up new rules.
Commission regulation 2257/94 decreed ([url]http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/europe/6481969.stm[/url]) that bananas in general should be “free from malformation or abnormal curvature”. Those sold as “extra class” must be perfect, “class 1” can have “slight defects of shape” and “class 2” can have full-scale “defects of shape”.
Nothing is banned under the regulation, which sets grading rules requested by industry to make sure importers – including UK wholesalers and supermarkets – know exactly what they will be getting when they order abox of bananas.
So, so far the BREXITEER foccers reasons for leaving the EU are:z
1. Day light running lights
2. Curved bananas
3. Dazza’a Great Grandfather got shot in the leg by a German 100 years ago.
Anything else?
So, so far the BREXITEER foccers reasons for leaving the EU areAnd that just goes to prove what kind of person you are.
1. Day light running lights
2. Curved bananas
3. Dazza’a Great Grandfather got shot in the leg by a German 100 years ago.
Anything else?
And that just goes to prove what kind of person you are.You did state it was one reason you wanted to leave the EU.
You can trivialise it if you like. He was lucky to survive.
Do you know what sort of an injury a high velocity round causes.
He almost lost his leg and was lucky not to lose his life.
I think only you would stoop as low as to try and make a personal comment towards my Great Grandfather.
There are plenty of other things you could have mentioned to make your point.
Anyone who carries as much VeNom As you do and obviously takes great delight in insulting people and calling everyone they don't agree with racists can't be very happy.Really :eek :eek
Yesterday ----- Macron backs down on fuel taxYou mean the same equalisation of diesel and petrol duties we have had in the UK for the last 40 odd years?
Daylight Running Lights. If the EU make them compulsory for new cars, do you really think we wouldn't if we left the EU? Are motor manufacturers really going to the expense of making special editions without them just for the UK?No of course not :rolleyes I was asked for a law I did not like and I gave one.
Never said they were anything to do with the EU - no wonder you didn't understand what the bus said.QuoteYesterday ----- Macron backs down on fuel taxAlso worth pointing out Fuel Duties are nothing to do with the EU.
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DtwPM-1XQAAb_oM.jpg)
No of course not I was asked for a law I did not like and I gave one.
Never said they were anything to do with the EU - no wonder you didn't understand what the bus said.
Agreed - BUT you can vote out the politicians who made them in this country.QuoteNo of course not I was asked for a law I did not like and I gave one.
There are lots of UK laws I'm not too keen on!
I was going to make a point about laws - EU and in general that it seems only the UK that takes them and abides by them, Doesn't matter EU - or local, if the French don't like em -------they dot get em.The UK has to do what they are told whilst the French do what they like. The French farmers just the same - as is the fishermen.QuoteNever said they were anything to do with the EU - no wonder you didn't understand what the bus said.
But this is a Brexit thread, so you did a thread :hijack and I understood the bus lie perfectly :lol
But this is a Brexit thread, so you did a thread :hijack [/font]
'and other politics' it said in steve 10562cc's OP :deal
not that it was very upmarket from in inception. as it was a post for VNA ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/Smileys/efocicon/shocked.gif[/url]) ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/Smileys/efocicon/shocked.gif[/url]) ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/Smileys/efocicon/shocked.gif[/url]) ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/Smileys/efocicon/lol.gif[/url]) ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/Smileys/efocicon/lol.gif[/url]) ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/Smileys/efocicon/lol.gif[/url]) .Cheeky bastard :foc
What is the aim of all of these Goebbels-esk propaganda cartoons is it just to name call, wind up, insult every leave voter. Surely the remainers efforts would be better spent trying to gather support for their cause and even try to reverse leave voters opinions rather than mocking the leavers, all you are doing is entrenching the leavers views.You'd be forgiven for thinking that 'Leave' had lost the referendum wouldn't you?.
What is the aim of all of these Goebbels-esk propaganda cartoons is it just to name call, wind up, insult every leave voter. Surely the remainers efforts would be better spent trying to gather support for their cause and even try to reverse leave voters opinions rather than mocking the leavers, all you are doing is entrenching the leavers views.OK
Agreed - BUT you can vote out the politicians who made them in this country.But no you can't. You can vote for one MP, one (or perhaps two) local councillors. If your candidate is elected and in opposition, you don't get what you want.
Who can blame Remain for being optimistic?. Not me. I'd be very surprised if we come out.I think you're right, but not without another referendum. If the result is something like 60:40 or above Remain they will use that to overturn the 48:52.
What's the difference with the EU?
You can't vote either in or out the unelected members of The European Commission who propose the legislation that the MEP's vote on.You can't vote for the Civil Servants who propose, write and implement the UK legislation that UK members of Parliament vote on. Who do you think prepared the Withdrawal Bill? MPs just sign stuff off.
MPs just sign stuff off.
MPs just sign stuff off.
MPs just sign stuff off.Nonsense.Been there, done it. I think you're over estimating the abilities of our 'leaders' :)
You've been an MP?No. It was either become a blood donor or join the Young Conservatives ;)
That's another thing, I have been watching the BBC doc about the foreign office and got the distinct that all the civil servants - permanent secretaries - ambassadors, all want to stay in the EU and therefore maintain the status quo keeping themselves in a cushy little job with nice pensions. All out of the direct gaze of the public.QuoteYou can't vote either in or out the unelected members of The European Commission who propose the legislation that the MEP's vote on.You can't vote for the Civil Servants who propose, write and implement the UK legislation that UK members of Parliament vote on. Who do you think prepared the Withdrawal Bill? MPs just sign stuff off.
That's another thing, I have been watching the BBC doc about the foreign office and got the distinct that all the civil servants - permanent secretaries - ambassadors, all want to stay in the EU and therefore maintain the status quo keeping themselves in a cushy little job with nice pensions. All out of the direct gaze of the public.Politicians however need to have one eye on what the voters think
You can't vote either in or out the unelected members of The European Commission who propose the legislation that the MEP's vote on.
I never had any objection to free movement within the EU.
Its all those that get in from outside, the spongers, the thieves, the disease carriers, the terrorists, those that have abandoned their wives and children, that get here, are declared illegal and disappear to work in the black economy, then want to change our society to reflect their interests.Whilst I disagree most strongly at your general description of immigrants from outside the EU Agricola, I would point out again that leaving the EU will make no difference to non-EU immigration. I would further point out that our illegal wars, proxy wars and weapons sales have contributed massively to UK immigration.
Civil Servants want continuity and stabilitySir Humphrey Appleby :lol
Sir Humphrey Appleby
Worst case scenario for me is that we have a re run of the brexit vote and we end up remaining. The EU more or less forced Ireland and Denmark to re-run elections as they didn't get the result they wanted.
That's my and others peoples biggest criticism of the EU- it's fundamentally undemocratic. Forget the racist xenophobia and the economic downturn rhetoric it's all a smokescreen. The UK is a tolerant society and still will be after brexit. I'm not sure it's the same in other places, fascism is on the rise- we need to be on our guard. Also, there are plenty of countries in the EU who have economies that are tanking- PIGS- Portugal, Italy, Greece and Spain. They don't want us to leave in case others do similar. This cartel has had it's day imho.
We'll know plan B by Wednesday.
Plan? What plan....
Plan? What plan....
Worst case scenario for me is that we have a re run of the brexit vote and we end up remaining. The EU more or less forced Ireland and Denmark to re-run elections as they didn't get the result they wanted.excellent post :thumbup
That's my and others peoples biggest criticism of the EU- it's fundamentally undemocratic. Forget the racist xenophobia and the economic downturn rhetoric it's all a smokescreen. The UK is a tolerant society and still will be after brexit. I'm not sure it's the same in other places, fascism is on the rise- we need to be on our guard. Also, there are plenty of countries in the EU who have economies that are tanking- PIGS- Portugal, Italy, Greece and Spain. They don't want us to leave in case others do similar. This cartel has had it's day imho.
Worst case scenario for me is that we have a re run of the brexit vote and we end up remaining. The EU more or less forced Ireland and Denmark to re-run elections as they didn't get the result they wanted.excellent post :thumbup
That's my and others peoples biggest criticism of the EU- it's fundamentally undemocratic. Forget the racist xenophobia and the economic downturn rhetoric it's all a smokescreen. The UK is a tolerant society and still will be after brexit. I'm not sure it's the same in other places, fascism is on the rise- we need to be on our guard. Also, there are plenty of countries in the EU who have economies that are tanking- PIGS- Portugal, Italy, Greece and Spain. They don't want us to leave in case others do similar. This cartel has had it's day imho.
Woman who keeps changing her mind
For 18 months leavers have been called racist, wanglangers, stupid, thick, old, gamon, how do you remainers think the leavers will react to all of that abuse - I say bring it on lets do it again. But if we do it again and a no deal (leave on WTO ) is not on the ballot along with no brexit then I will be opening a yellow vest shop.For 18 months Remainers have been given just as much abuse. I totally agree, bring it on with only No Deal /No Brexit on the paper. I think we both agree May's deal, and particularly her tactics for promoting it are shocking. :eek
She will get thrown back in the channel just like Cam-moron did when he went cap in hand to ask for some scraps to try and prevent a referendum in the first place. Given that and the way the UK has been treated during the negotiations.These remainers that say people voted leave to kick the political class ok then the leavers have now got even more reason to kick. For 18 months leavers have been called racist, wanglangers, stupid, thick, old, gamon, how do you remainers think the leavers will react to all of that abuse - I say bring it on lets do it again. But if we do it again and a no deal (leave on WTO ) is not on the ballot along with no brexit then I will be opening a yellow vest shop.another good post. And if the remainers get their way and our political class bottle it completely and take us crawling back to the EU on our hands and knees, how do They honestly think we would get treated from that point on?
I totally agree, bring it on with only No Deal /No Brexit on the paper.
Here are the words been used just on this thread to describe those people who voted leave
For 18 months Remainers have been given just as much abuse. I totally agree, bring it on with only No Deal /No Brexit on the paper.
It's difficult to predict what can or will happen at the moment, the situation is changing fast now.
The country is totally divided on the issue, but if you're interested in these things you can't say it's not more than a little compelling to observe whichever way you lean on the matter
Way to go - remainers, great way to persuade leave voters to change their mind. People do not liked being talked down to by you or the EU and it will be reflected so in a vote.The only person on here accused of being racist was VNA :rolleyes and even that was a joke
Here are the words been used just on this thread to describe those people who voted leave
For 18 months Remainers have been given just as much abuse. I totally agree, bring it on with only No Deal /No Brexit on the paper.
Stupid
English fools
Wanglanders
Racist
War mongers
Loonies
Fruitcakes
Liars
Silly
Pig headed
Bonkers
Crazy
Thick
Excitable
Selfish
Dinosaurs
Waffle
Small children
Nobs
Looney toons
Clueless
Xenophobic
Islamophobic
Way to go - remainers, great way to persuade leave voters to change their mind. People do not liked being talked down to by you or the EU and it will be reflected so in a vote.
I got 19/23 :) guess which way I voted hahaha
QuoteWay to go - remainers, great way to persuade leave voters to change their mind. People do not liked being talked down to by you or the EU and it will be reflected so in a vote.
The only person on here accused of being racist was VNA :rolleyes and even that was a joke
On your other point, obviously true, but reminds me of a phrase I've seen quoted - '' Not all Brexiteers are racist, but all racists are Brexiteers ''
Oh and talking of fruitcakes, loonies and closet racists;
So it’s now fruitcakes loonies and racists. I think we can drop the closet bit. :lol
And a reminder of a couple of propaganda posters for you.QuoteThe venue holds 2000 and it was approximately 2 thirds full apparently.It was part of a tour of different venues and it was ticketed. I'd like to see how many remoaners had turned up to the London march if they'd had to pay to get in .Besides which you're always going to attract more remoaners to these things. They've more of a gripe and they desperately want to reverse the democratic decision.
So 666 (that's ominous isn't it) didn't turn up. Or they were probably out busy setting fire to mosques or something....
One of the features writers on The Daily Mail is Alice Smellie. You'd have to change that wouldn't you?!. I can just imagine all the sniggering when asked...'Surname please?'.I always fancied Carol Smillie. Is that close enough? :)
I always fancied Carol Smillie.
Than let me remind you.Don't need reminding, and nobody on here has (seriously) been accused. As I said, I've not yet met a racist who voted Remain, but I've met and know lots of Brexiteers who are most certainly not racist.
I think since Farage stood down it's been a disaster. A succession of unprofessional leaders. Not a patch on him. I disagree with him, but I admire him.I think they have clearly studied the live transmissions and get the length and position just right. I want to see Kay Burliegh loose it and go down there and smack someone (she loves herself)
As to the demonstrators in Parliament Square, hilarious to see the longer and longer poles they are using to get their placards in shot :lol
I think since Farage stood down it's been a disaster. A succession of unprofessional leaders. Not a patch on him. I disagree with him, but I admire him.
As to the demonstrators in Parliament Square, hilarious to see the longer and longer poles they are using to get their placards in shot :lol
Good post.I think since Farage stood down it's been a disaster. A succession of unprofessional leaders. Not a patch on him. I disagree with him, but I admire him.
As to the demonstrators in Parliament Square, hilarious to see the longer and longer poles they are using to get their placards in shot :lol
Theres something to admire a bout a man whouses his own money for a cause he passionately belives in.
I think his loss from the stage has highlighted the complete absence from our political scene of Statesmen. There are none now. The Labour Party is not what is once was, taken over by the middle classes and just waiting the opportunity to rid itself of its current leader, whence all the old Blairites will crawl out from under the stones. You mark my words. Perhaps the loss of statesmen can be attributed to our membership of the Eu, since we have become just one of a club twenty eight on the world stage, unable to shape our own destiny, control our own economy, control our own borders. If it is to be a hard Brexit, then bring it on, the British people have faced hard times before. If it is to be a hard Brexit, then let us do our utmost to ensure that its as hard as it can be for those who have sought to put us at a disadvantage for expressing a desire to leave their organisation. The next time the Europeans need our help to save them from themselves, we should consider turning away and maintaining our links and relations with those free nations who share our views, our standards, our history. The world is bigger than the EU, evolving, nations emerging. The Chinese recognise it, filling spaces we vacated. We face challenges in the not too distant future as the climate may be changing with adverse impacts affecting our daily lives. Water companies will need to invest significant sums to ensure continuity of supplies nationwide, we may require nationalisation as the privatised companies are unlikely to be willing to divert profits to do so. Similar action may well be required in the power generation field. The EU does not approve of state owned enterprises, seeing them as distorting internal markets. Its unlikely the Prime Minister will be able to offer Parliament enough to secure the current Brexit Agreement in January, a second referendum is likely to create unrest on the streets unseen since the thirties. A hard Brexit now appears the likely outcome
What I am finding funny is the self - important news presenters getting ratty about being drowned out by the demonstrators now that they have set up their outdoor studio on collage green, they are attracting every kind of protest you can think of and not just brexit ones.The only ones I ever hear over Huw Edwards are Remainiacs demanding Brexit be overturned. I suspect that's exactly why the BBC are interviewing out there.
Oh and talking of fruitcakes, loonies and closet racists;
So it’s now fruitcakes loonies and racists. I think we can drop the closet bit. :lol
Well has anybody seen Nigel recently? I couldn’t believe it yesterday when I saw the short report on the BBC concerning his resignation from UKIP. Apparently over some little prick called Stephen Christopher Yaxley-Lennon being taken on by UKIP as an ‘advisor’.Stephen Christopher Yaxley-Lennon isn’t just a mere repugnant racist, but he is in fact a fascist. The fruitcakes, loonies and closet racists is a well known quote from David Cameron. So yes UKIP is out of the closet, and I’m afraid I fail to see what is racist about calling racists racist.
A nation belittled and treated with contempt by the rest of EuropeOh dear oh dear, the poor old UK being bullied by the other 27. Yup they have all united together to bully us. It’s all their fault.
“abusive partner spiking the drinks and inviting them to a Christmas party”.She goes on to say that it isn’t in Norway’s interest to have Britain as partners in their deal;
“I think you would mess it all up for us, the way you have messed it all up for yourselves”So it’s not just the EU that is loosing it patience with us. A great many countries round the globe think we have lost the plot – and the truth is we have. We are seen as the petty little villain no-one wants to be in the same room with.
QuoteA nation belittled and treated with contempt by the rest of Europe
Oh dear oh dear, the poor old UK being bullied by the other 27. Yup they have all united together to bully us. It’s all their fault.
I didn't once use the word bully.
you did. Twice.
freudian slip mate?
That's a genius idea.
Stephen Waxy-Lemon is a racist criminal c*nt who should be locked up and the key thrown away.
I hope she wins by a clear margin tonight, then she can carry on where she left off tomorrow.What time is the vote?.
How about convicted of mortgage fraud. How about convicted of travelling on a false passport. How about the pending prosecution for contempt of court.
He's scum.
I suggest again, you look up the definition of 'fascist'.
Oh and your very small writing just about sums up what you've said :lol
Of course The Labour Party never put party before country do they?
Thank foc for that :lolQuoteOf course The Labour Party never put party before country do they?
No, its not their turn ;)
The EU hold all the cards. They are laughing at us.I should think they are, the money they've had out of us :rolleyes .
How about convicted of mortgage fraud. How about convicted of travelling on a false passport. How about the pending prosecution for contempt of court.Indeed.
He's scum.
I suggest again, you look up the definition of 'fascist'.
Stephen Christopher Yaxley-Lennon,Convictions for drugs offenses and assault. Jailed in 2005 for assaulting an off-duty policeman.Convicted in 2011 of leading a brawl involving 100 ‘football fans’.2012 held on the charge of having entered the United States illegally on a false passport and sentenced to 10mnths in the UK.2012 sentenced to 18mnths for mortgage fraud.Member of the BNP.Founding member of the fascist EDF. He is a violent, racist, fascist thieving piece of shit. Absolute utter foccing scum
Waxy-Lemon :lol that is funny though.
But the establishment has for a long time wanted him out of the picture they don't like it when people speak an unauthorized narrative that "they" think will harm cohesion.(stand by fazersharp for the reply "like -blah-blah"--- pick an extreme example to make a one off point :z :z :z :z :z )
If you believe half the stuff you are told by the establishment then good for you - carry on watching I'm a celebrity and have a nice life.
FYI I don't believe in just about anything I am told by the political class.I have come to my conclusions through my own experience and my judgment has seen me well for the last x- number of years. (that and BEER)
You say there is no division. That statement couldn't be further from the truth.Remember, we are not talking about peaceful Muslims here.These are radical extremists, the division couldn't be any further apart.
May wins. 200 votes for, 117 against.Just seen Rees - Mogg on the telly. Not much really changes. We've just lost another day.
Um I wouldn't watch 'Celebrity' if you paid me,Then indeed you have proved yourself to be part of the champagne socialist elite ------------ I would totally watch it it you paid me.
But on the other hand I would pay to see Mogg get angry. That man dose not blink. If only Moggy was more faragey and knocked some heads together.Um I wouldn't watch 'Celebrity' if you paid me,Then indeed you have proved yourself to be part of the champagne socialist elite ------------ I would totally watch it it you paid me.
I am neither deluded or a supporter.Fuck him he's scum.
I don't judge a man by his past. It's what they do at the present which counts.
No one ever talks about the charity work or help for homeless veterans he's involved with.
Like I said, I don't agree with everything which includes any involvement with BNP or EDL (although I understand why it was formed) or football hooliganism but someone has got to look out for vulnerable underage children and the threat extremists pose to them,
Something he's been trying to do for many years.
This is the reason I won't jump on the bash Tommy bandwagon.
A lot of people have got skeletons in the cupboard but having such a high profile it's inevitable these are going to be brought up and used against you.
The fact remains is you would see this man locked up indefinitely, that's just an extreme and inhumane statement and would be a worse crime than anything he's ever done.
Think about that, you'd lock him up forever without just cause and throw away the key you said
That's just a stupid thing to say from a supposed liberal minded member of society.
God help anyone who's made mistakes in the past if everyone thought like you.
You say there is no division. That statement couldn't be further from the truth.
Remember, we are not talking about peaceful Muslims here.
These are radical extremists, the division couldn't be any further apart.
QuoteMay wins. 200 votes for, 117 against.Just seen Rees - Mogg on the telly. Not much really changes. We've just lost another day.
Then indeed you have proved yourself to be part of the champagne socialist elite ------------ I would totally watch it it you paid me.No, you're just poor. Probably lost your last 30 bob in a card game scam ;)
Then indeed you have proved yourself to be part of the champagne socialist elite ------------ I would totally watch it it you paid me.I’m all for champagne socialism. Everybody should have the right to drink champagne every day! :lol
Well, apparently that's how some people make informed opinions by sitting quietly and listening to the other side of the story. Who'd have thought it.
Fuck him he's scum.
And fuck knows what the Oxford Union were thinking of.
If The EU are at all reasonable or sensible they'll try to accommodate Mrs May's requirements to give her deal a chance of getting through Parliament now.
I don't hold out much hope of that though
Time fae a funny,
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DuPcB7PX4AIvoBT.jpg)
Well get on with it then :rolleyes . We're still waiting fae the funny.Perhaps you are having a sense of humour failure YamFazFan.
No. Ta for trying, but it's still not revived my sense of humour :\ .QuoteWell get on with it then :rolleyes . We're still waiting fae the funny.Perhaps you are having a sense of humour failure YamFazFan.
I’ll see if I can help;
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DuTTSiVXcAADw3v.jpg)
No. Ta for trying, but it's still not revived my sense of humour ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/Smileys/efocicon/undecided.gif[/url]) .
Try a funny from the other side. See if that works ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/Smileys/efocicon/wink.gif[/url]) .
It's clear that The EU want May's deal to fail. They're hoping that there's going to be a second referendum and The UK goes crawling back to them with Its tail between its legs.
We should just come out with No Deal now.
NO second referendum.
Because Remainers knew exactly what they were voting for. Unfortunately the question `Leave ' should have been amended to' Leave and then what? '. It didn't say' Leave with no deal'. Parliament won't pass a No Deal exit however much people squeal.I disagree completely. We knew what we wanted just as much as remainers did. Your taking this whole argument back to "we voted to remain because we are clever. you voted to leave because you are stupid/racist etc etc". why don't you just say it straight out? BTW Most of us who voted to leave don't give a monkeys what it takes to get out. we voted to get out and thats pretty much it. Whatever my reasons, or anybody elses who voted to leave are, they are exactly that. My reasons. Ill stand by them whatever the outcome. Not because Im stupid/racist/xenophobic etc. But because I had a vote like everybody else, and I used it as I thought best.
The blame for this rejection is purely on May not the EU. She knew where they stood. It was just a delaying tactic to avoid the defeat in Parliament.
My prediction is still
1 Defeat for her deal in Parliament
2. Labour calls No Confidence vote in Parliament
3. She loses
4. Article 50 Postponed
All she's done is delay it until after the new year. Just watch.
My reasons. Ill stand by them whatever the outcome.But like most other BREXITEERS you haven’t given any reasons. I mean so far we have;
I we switch to WTO trade, then so be it. I voted out, not because I'm stupid and don't understand politics or economics, but because I believe it would be better for us as a nation.You believe it would be better? In what way? The Bank of England forecasts a financial crises worse than that of 2008 in the event of a NO DEAL BREXIT. An economic crash. A fall in GDP of around 8%. 7.5% rise in unemployment.
My prediction is still
1 Defeat for her deal in Parliament
2. Labour calls No Confidence vote in Parliament
3. She loses
4. Article 50 Postponed
All she's done is delay it until after the new year. Just watch.
QuotePrior to EU membership, i never had to pay 20% tax on anything i boughtThat’s incorrect, as I’ve pointed out before VAT replaced the purchase tax in the UK.QuoteSo tell me again, how I'm better off in the EUAgricola you continue to blame the EU for the policies of successive UK governments, and it appears local councils too. :eek
You were given a ball to kick, and like many others you kicked it hard. But I’m afraid you’ve kicked the wrong ball.
So tell me how Im better off in the EU then
You believe it would be better? In what way? The Bank of England forecasts a financial crises worse than that of 2008 in the event of a NO DEAL BREXIT. An economic crash. A fall in GDP of around 8%. 7.5% rise in unemployment.You still don't get it do you, we don't care if we are poorer (in financial terms ) in the short term. And this is why that scaremongering is does not work, the people who have voted to leave mostly have lost jobs before - have faced hardship and got through it. The remainers on the other hand don't want their comfortable lives with jobs for life to change -they have never experienced tough times, a lot of the issues that people voted to leave for simply never touch their comfy lives and they want to stay in the EU purely for their own personal pockets.
You still don't get it do you, we don't care if we are poorer (in financial terms ) in the short term. And this is why that scaremongering is does not work, the people who have voted to leave mostly have lost jobs before - have faced hardship and got through it.
The remainers on the other hand don't want their comfortable lives with jobs for life to change -they have never experienced tough timesI think you mean Jacob Rees Mogg, Boris, David Davis, Gove, Leadsom and so forth. They will not face any hardship whatsoever. They will prosper at your expense. This is simply the continuation of the project Thatcher started in 1979. Remember 4 million unemployed?
From this very forumQuoteThe remainers on the other hand don't want their comfortable lives with jobs for life to change -they have never experienced tough timesI think you mean Jacob Rees Mogg, Boris, David Davis, Gove, Leadsom and so forth.
I want to stay in because it's best for me personally.
I'm Scottish first, European second and if push comes to shove I'll reluctantly admit to being British. Certainly the EU acts as a buffer against the more extreme Tory policies.
Who are you quoting, and what is your point?I am not going to name them because they have not posted for a while and they are not here to reply
:rolleyes :rolleyes :rolleyes :rolleyes :rolleyes :z
So you want to trash the economy, create a financial crises, create mass unemployment, increase the wealth gap, impose poverty on millions, because you don’t like daylight running lights and graded bananas
Say no more really
Quote from: VNA on 28 February 2016, 07:46:52 PM ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/index.php/topic,19420.msg225464.html#msg225464[/url]) I'm Scottish first, European second and if push comes to shove I'll reluctantly admit to being British. Certainly the EU acts as a buffer against the more extreme Tory policies.
<blockquote>
Quote<blockquote>The remainers on the other hand don't want their comfortable lives with jobs for life to change -they have never experienced tough times</blockquote>I think you mean Jacob Rees Mogg, Boris, David Davis, Gove, Leadsom and so forth.
</blockquote>From this very forum
Quote<blockquote>I want to stay in because it's best for me personally.</blockquote>
Quote from: VNA on Today at 08:21:15 PM ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/index.php/topic,24678.msg288918.html#msg288918[/url])<blockquote>Who are you quoting, and what is your point?
</blockquote>I am not going to name them because they have not posted for a while and they are not here to reply
Certainly the EU acts as a buffer against the more extreme Tory policies. which is why the more extreme right wing Tories wish rid of the EU. How many times do I need to say so.So VNA wants to stay in the EU to protect himself from the big bad nasty Westminster.
So VNA wants to stay in the EU to protect himself from the big bad nasty Westminster.
There we have it finally-- the big reason VNA wants to stay in the EU.
As I said remainders want to stay purely for their own personal reasons.
So what's stopping us adopting all the laws that we chose to keep. We leave - we take on all the laws as is and as we go we are then free to keep/amend/ delete/add new as we see fit.
I think I’ve made it clear throughout this thread why it is in the best interests of the UK to REMAIN in the EU. EU employment laws and legislation are just one of many reasons for REMAINING.
So what's stopping us adopting all the laws that we chose to keep. We leave - we take on all the laws as is and as we go we are then free to keep/amend/ delete/add new as we see fit.Many of those laws have already been dilluted by New Labour or Tory vetos. The Tories will bin the lot. The Tories believe in a low wage economy and a hire and fire culture. The BREXITEERS in the Tory party represent the extreme right of Tory ideology.
On a side note there is just no winding you up is there --- I gave it my best shot - but nothing, is it the scotish cold or the whisky that has frozen your trigger.Sorry I missed that - didn't even notice. Your habit of miss-quoting me is annoying - but it's the internet - I'm not going to get bothered about it.
Your habit of miss-quoting me is annoyingThanks for the tip ;)
Quote from: VNA on Today at 09:33:30 PM ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/index.php/topic,24678.msg288931.html#msg288931[/url])<blockquote> Your habit of miss-quoting me is annoying
</blockquote> Thanks for the tip ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/Smileys/efocicon/wink.gif[/url])
QuoteSo VNA wants to stay in the EU to protect himself from the big bad nasty Westminster.
There we have it finally-- the big reason VNA wants to stay in the EU.
As I said remainders want to stay purely for their own personal reasons.
I think I’ve made it clear throughout this thread that I am a massive Knobhead and really should stay away from the keyboard. I just can't help myself, I'm a troll and I know it but when I said why it is in the best interests of the UK to REMAIN in the EU I really meant Scotland and my own personal circumstances. Some will say EU employment laws and legislation are just one of many reasons for REMAINING but the reality is they're not worth the paper they are written on because temporary, zero hours contracts which many of the UK citizens are on makes a mockery of EU employment laws.
So far we have had two, apparently compelling, reasons to LEAVE – daylight running lights and legislation relating the grading of bananas.
Your taking this whole argument back to "we voted to remain because we are clever. you voted to leave because you are stupid/racist etc etc". why don't you just say it straight out?What a pathetic rediculous statement :rolleyes by the way it's 'You're' :)
Don't forget about my Great GrandadSorry Dazza. Was thinking about Fazersharp's reasons there.
Two pieces of EU legislation which I presume you are happy to do away with :
1.EU motor insurance regulations direct that your UK motorcycle insurance automatically covers you for 3rd party liability in any other EU country, without paying an extra premium
2. Your mobile phone roaming charges cover all EU countries. So 'roam like home' includes voice, sms and data.
All benefits from being part of the 'single market', which we will lose.
Because a Norway type deal was not on the ballot paper - that's how he knows people did not vote for it.
Again I say, how do you know all of those who voted Leave wanted a 'No Deal' version? What gives you the right to speak for 52% of the population? How do you know that none of them wanted to leave but with a Norway type deal? What utter arrogance!
Again I say, how do you know all of those who voted Leave wanted a 'No Deal' version? What gives you the right to speak for 52% of the population? How do you know that none of them wanted to leave but with a Norway type deal? What utter arrogance!
QuoteAgain I say, how do you know all of those who voted Leave wanted a 'No Deal' version? What gives you the right to speak for 52% of the population? How do you know that none of them wanted to leave but with a Norway type deal? What utter arrogance!
There's a mistake there - 28% of the population voted to leave. I think your quoted 52% refers to those that voted?
QuotePrior to EU membership, i never had to pay 20% tax on anything i boughtThat’s incorrect, as I’ve pointed out before VAT replaced the purchase tax in the UK.QuoteSo tell me again, how I'm better off in the EUAgricola you continue to blame the EU for the policies of successive UK governments, and it appears local councils too. :eek
You were given a ball to kick, and like many others you kicked it hard. But I’m afraid you’ve kicked the wrong ball.
So tell me how Im better off in the EU then
Still waiting
All the talk now is of a second referendum as the only way to break the deadlock.
They're saying that if the result is Leave again we're back were we are now and Parliament will still reject it.
If the result is Remain they'll accept it and we stay in forever more.
Because a Norway type deal was not on the ballot paper - that's how he knows people did not vote for it.Neither was 'No Deal' although you all seem to think it was......
All the talk now is of a second referendum as the only way to break the deadlock.They're saying that if the result is Leave again we're back were we are now and Parliament will still reject it.If the result is Remain they'll accept it and we stay in forever more.
Has anyone seen the vid of junker yesterday ruffling up a Woman's hair. What ever happened to "me too" Now if that was Borris who did that it would be called a sexual assault and there would be calls for him to be sacked.No I've got better things to do. Was it Theresa? :D Actually, if it was Boris it would be a sexual assault. Incidentally, where is Boris? He's gone very quiet lately. Sulking because he can't make a leadership challenge for another 12 months? :lol
Interesting article in the Guardian today (yeah I know left wing elitist rag blah blah). As you say, another referendum cannot be Remain/Leave as we would be no further forward. If it's a two choice referendum it's either got to be No Deal/Theresa's Deal, Theresa's deal /Remain or No deal /Remain. So something would have to be eliminated making one lot unhappy.But the priority of parliament is to avoid a NO DEAL BREXIT.
The other option they suggested was putting 3 on the paper, and allow a second preference vote. The worry with that is we all end up with Theresa's deal ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/Smileys/efocicon/shocked.gif[/url])
But 'Westminster' is already a minority government. They are only in power by forming a coalition with the Dinosaur Unionist Party ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/Smileys/efocicon/smile.gif[/url])
I was amazed that they actually gave us a referendum.It was done to win an election.
Amazed that the result was Leave.David Cameron never considered for one second, he would loose it. If he had, he would have never offered it in the first place.
Amazed that they said they'd honour that decision.What else could they do?
Not in the least bit amazed that it increasingly looks like it's was all for nothing. So disappointing if that happens. What will it mean for democracy?. It will alienate so many people from it. I know the Remainers would be whooping with joy, but what a hollow 'victory'.All for nothing? What do you mean? It’s about the Tory party. And haven't you noticed it has claimed two Prime Ministers (May will have to go at some point), we are on our third BREXIT secretary, the cabinet has a revolving door, and we are now effectively without government.
We probably all agree on this.
We probably all agree on this.
On second thoughts yes I agree bearing in mind that we're probably going to get robbed of our Leave victory.On the plus side, a million or so folks will get to keep their jobs :)
QuoteOn second thoughts yes I agree bearing in mind that we're probably going to get robbed of our Leave victory.On the plus side, a million or so folks will get to keep their jobs :)
For different reasons....
You - 2nd referendum
Us - No Deal
:)
Saw this posted on FB by another Foccer, makes sense to me.
I also read somewhere that Britain coming out of the EU would be the equivalent of 9 or 11 medium sized countries leaving at the same time.
It's a disaster for the EU, they're just playing hard ball and it's time we did.
Finally some sense Offering the obvious and what should be final solution
and it apparently comes from down under
Former Australian PM Tony Abbott...
"It’s pretty hard for Britain’s friends, here in Australia, to make sense of the mess that’s being made of Brexit. The referendum result was perhaps the biggest-ever vote of confidence in the United Kingdom, its past and its future. But the British establishment doesn’t seem to share that confidence and instead looks desperate to cut a deal, even if that means staying under the rule of Brussels. Looking at this from abroad, it’s baffling: the country that did the most to bring democracy into the modern world might yet throw away the chance to take charge of its own destiny.
Let’s get one thing straight: a negotiation that you’re not prepared to walk away from is not a negotiation — it’s surrender. It’s all give and no get. When David Cameron tried to renegotiate Britain’s EU membership, he was sent packing because Brussels judged (rightly) that he’d never actually back leaving. And since then, Brussels has made no real concessions to Theresa May because it judges (rightly, it seems) that she’s desperate for whatever deal she can get.
The EU’s palpable desire to punish Britain for leaving vindicates the Brexit project. Its position, now, is that there’s only one ‘deal’ on offer, whereby the UK retains all of the burdens of EU membership but with no say in setting the rules. The EU seems to think that Britain will go along with this because it’s terrified of no deal. Or, to put it another way, terrified of the prospect of its own independence.
But even after two years of fearmongering and vacillation, it’s not too late for robust leadership to deliver the Brexit that people voted for. It’s time for Britain to announce what it will do if the EU can’t make an acceptable offer by March 29 next year — and how it would handle no deal. Freed from EU rules, Britain would automatically revert to world trade, using rules agreed by the World Trade Organization. It works pretty well for Australia. So why on earth would it not work just as well for the world’s fifth-largest economy?
A world trade Brexit lets Britain set its own rules. It can say, right now, that it will not impose any tariff or quota on European produce and would recognise all EU product standards. That means no border controls for goods coming from Europe to Britain. You don’t need to negotiate this: just do it. If Europe knows what’s in its own best interests, it would fully reciprocate in order to maintain entirely free trade and full mutual recognition of standards right across Europe.
Next, the UK should declare that Europeans already living here should have the right to remain permanently — and, of course, become British citizens if they wish. This should be a unilateral offer. Again, you don’t need a deal. You don’t need Michel Barnier’s permission. If Europe knows what’s best for itself, it would likewise allow Britons to stay where they are.
Third, there should continue to be free movement of people from Europe into Britain — but with a few conditions. Only for work, not welfare. And with a foreign worker’s tax on the employer, to make sure anyone coming in would not be displacing British workers.
Fourth, no ‘divorce bill’ whatsoever should be paid to Brussels. The UK government would assume the EU’s property and liabilities in Britain, and the EU would assume Britain’s share of these in Europe. If Britain was getting its fair share, these would balance out; and if Britain wasn’t getting its fair share, it’s the EU that should be paying Britain.
Finally, there’s no need on Britain’s part for a hard border with Ireland. Britain wouldn’t be imposing tariffs on European goods, so there’s no money to collect. The UK has exactly the same product standards as the Republic, so let’s not pretend you need to check for problems we all know don’t exist. Some changes may be needed but technology allows for smart borders: there was never any need for a Cold War-style Checkpoint Charlie. Irish citizens, of course, have the right to live and work in the UK in an agreement that long predates EU membership.
Of course, the EU might not like this British leap for independence. It might hit out with tariffs and impose burdens on Britain as it does on the US — but WTO rules put a cap on any retaliatory action. The worst it can get? We’re talking levies of an average 4 or 5 per cent. Which would be more than offset by a post-Brexit devaluation of the pound (which would have the added bonus of making British goods more competitive everywhere).
UK officialdom assumes that a deal is vital, which is why so little thought has been put into how Britain might just walk away. Instead, officials have concocted lurid scenarios featuring runs on the pound, gridlock at ports, grounded aircraft, hoarding of medicines and flights of investment. It’s been the pre-referendum Project Fear campaign on steroids. And let’s not forget how employment, investment and economic growth ticked up after the referendum.
As a former prime minister of Australia and a lifelong friend of your country, I would say this: Britain has nothing to lose except the shackles that the EU imposes on it. After the courage shown by its citizens in the referendum, it would be a tragedy if political leaders go wobbly now. Britain’s future has always been global, rather than just with Europe. Like so many of Britain’s admirers, I want to see this great country seize this chance and make the most of it."
Tony Abbott served as Prime Minister of Australia from 2013 to 2015 « Last Edit: Today at 04:50:45 PM » ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/index.php?action=posthistory;topic=24678.0;msg=289014[/url])
QuoteNot again. :rolleyes
:lol
I think your throttle response is a bit slow there dazza. Pretty sure hedgetrimmer's already posted that, or most of it, in this thread.Yes I know, but I thought if VNA can keep asking the same question over and over again and ignoring what has already been answered previously then we should start posting the same things over and over again. :D
I can see there being civil unrest across the country.They are not protesting against the EU. They are protesting against their governments.
It's spreading across Europe.
I see the French lawyers have joined in and the people in Brussels have started to stir.
People are seeing the EU for what it is......
I see the French lawyers have joined in and the people in Brussels have started to stir.The 'people in Brussels' were demonstrating against the Belgian government's adoption of a UN resolution, nothing to do with the EU. But it's always easy to blame them for everything isn't it?
The 'people in Brussels' were demonstrating against the Belgian government's adoption of a UN resolutionThe unnamed "UN resolution"
QuoteI can see there being civil unrest across the country.They are not protesting against the EU. They are protesting against their governments.
It's spreading across Europe.
I see the French lawyers have joined in and the people in Brussels have started to stir.
People are seeing the EU for what it is......
Which is what we should have done. What we are doing is trying to blame the EU for the action of sucessive UK governments.
Though we may well see civil unrest if the UK leaves the EU in a NO DEAL scenario. That is perhaps when finally those who voted to LEAVE will understand that once again they have been conned.
QuoteI see the French lawyers have joined in and the people in Brussels have started to stir.The 'people in Brussels' were demonstrating against the Belgian government's adoption of a UN resolution, nothing to do with the EU. But it's always easy to blame them for everything isn't it?
Also there was a counter demonstration. This country is just as split, and I wouldn't fancy the chances of a load of old blokes against the youth of today :lol
When I voted Leave I assumed it meant a No Deal type exit.Well that's one. What about the other 16.9999999999999999 million? :) p
Hahaha....The French, Germans and Belgains....They are the EU....You're not grasping this are you .:)
Well that's one. What about the other 16.9999999999999999 million? ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/Smileys/efocicon/smile.gif[/url]) pMake that 2
Quote
QuoteHahaha....The French, Germans and Belgains....They are the EU....You're not grasping this are you .:)
So are Austria, Hungary, Italy, Poland and Slovakia. If you don't understand the concept of the EU, no wonder you vote against it :rolleyes
When I voted Leave I assumed it meant a No Deal type exit.
Make that 2
Make that 3
QuotePrior to EU membership, i never had to pay 20% tax on anything i boughtThat’s incorrect, as I’ve pointed out before VAT replaced the purchase tax in the UK.QuoteSo tell me again, how I'm better off in the EUAgricola you continue to blame the EU for the policies of successive UK governments, and it appears local councils too. :eek
You were given a ball to kick, and like many others you kicked it hard. But I’m afraid you’ve kicked the wrong ball.
So tell me how Im better off in the EU then
Still waiting
Still waiting
Maist like youse wherenae peyin attention.Where can I buy a scottish keyboard from like the one you have :pokefun
MAKE THAT 4. And Im beginning to tire a tad at the assumption that I didnt know what I was voting for. I did. And I would do the same again.make that five. and me too.... :)
QuoteSo you guys, you now tells us, voted for a NO DEAL BREXIT.
When I voted Leave I assumed it meant a No Deal type exit.
Quote
Make that 2
Quote
Make that 3
MAKE THAT 4. And Im beginning to tire a tad at the assumption that I didnt know what I was voting for. I did. And I would do the same again.
make that five. and me too.... :)
Although obviously with the caveat that if a leaver says it hes trying to speak for everybody and its utter arrogance, whereas if a remainer suggests his version of what everyone was or wasn't thinking when they voted leave it its totally okely dokely... :)QuoteYour taking this whole argument back to "we voted to remain because we are clever. you voted to leave because you are stupid/racist etc etc". why don't you just say it straight out?What a pathetic rediculous statement :rolleyes by the way it's 'You're' :)
Again I say, how do you know all of those who voted Leave wanted a 'No Deal' version? What gives you the right to speak for 52% of the population? How do you know that none of them wanted to leave but with a Norway type deal? What utter arrogance!
Again I say, how do you know all of those who voted Leave wanted a 'No Deal' version? What gives you the right to speak for 52% of the population? How do you know that none of them wanted to leave but with a Norway type deal? What utter arrogance!
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DupJtdSX4AELQqY.jpg)
So I think we can all see that voting LEAVE does not necessarily mean leaving the EU without a deal – ie a NO DEAL BREXIT.I think I've been saying that for about 20 posts. What is it that Leavers don't get? There was only one version of Remain. It was crystal clear.
I think I've been saying that for about 20 posts.I know. I know. :D
:rolleyes Get a room you two.....
Maist like youse wherenae peyin attention.Where can I buy a scottish keyboard from like the one you have :pokefun
Sorry I'll get my coat [/size]
ok.
its an emotive issue on both sides, so lets try and take that out of it.
lets assume my reason for leaving isn't valid, along with whatever every other leavers reason was.
lets assume mt tread and vna are right to say because remain had a certainty to it that leave didn't, we should have abandoned what we really wanted to do, and voted to stay in a corrupt (just in our view obviously) system, ruled by people we didn't vote for, who gradually encroached upon every aspect of our lives with rules we had no say in.
And that instead of "dying on our feet rather than living on our knees" (again just our opinions obviously), we should have stayed on our knees.
Lets go so far as to assume that they are right about everything, and the 17.4 million who voted to leave are impudent, racist, etc etc all the other names that have been thrown at us.
On Nov 10th, 2015, David Cameron, the leader of the governing party said this.
"this is a huge decision for our country., perhaps the biggest we will make in our lifetimes.And it will be the final decision...When the British people speak, their voice will be respected, not ignored. If we vote to leave, then we will leave. There will not be another renegotiation, and another referendum"
Now, perhaps it was wrong for Cameron to allow the common people to decide their future. But he did it.
And now, whether remainers like it or not, when they talk about about wanting another referendum, or "more democracy", they are fundamentally lying, they want less democracy, not more. How can you possibly argue against that? And if the government now went aginst that, how could we ever trust politicians again, or indeed ever call ourselves a democratic country.
The very nature of democracy is that "you do not confuse your own personal prejudices with divine wisdom, and if you lose, you accept your defeat with good grace"
So i'll only ask this and with the greatest of respect...Mt tread/VNA...are you not democrats? I mean if your not, obviously thats fine, each to their own, I was just sincerely wondering, thats all
Lets go so far as to assume that they are right about everything, and the 17.4 million who voted to leave are impudent, racist, etc etc all the other names that have been thrown at us.Nobody ever called Brexiteers impudent or racist. The only person I've called racist is Stephen Yaxley Lennon, and I stand by that 100%.
:eek Yes you have most definitely called leavers racistQuoteLets go so far as to assume that they are right about everything, and the 17.4 million who voted to leave are impudent, racist, etc etc all the other names that have been thrown at us.Nobody ever called Brexiteers impudent or racist.
I dont think any of them agree that the EU is perfect. How many want an EU army how many want to join the euro how many want ever increasing political integration and ever more laws being drawn up by the EU.No the EU isn't perfect. All those examples you've given either haven't happened or we have opted out of.
Yes you have most definitely called leavers racist
Right here Brexit specs in these you postedQuoteYes you have most definitely called leavers racist
Where?
The EU direction is clear and has been stated so as a goal. If the referendum is overturned and we end up staying in how much longer after that do you think we will still be able to "opt out" of elements, by staying in the whole EU project will be re- energised and accelerated so those bits you say are not perfect will only get worse.QuoteI dont think any of them agree that the EU is perfect. How many want an EU army how many want to join the euro how many want ever increasing political integration and ever more laws being drawn up by the EU.No the EU isn't perfect. All those examples you've given either haven't happened or we have opted out of.
The EU direction is clear and has been stated so as a goal. If the referendum is overturned and we end up staying in how much longer after that do you think we will still be able to "opt out" of elements, by staying in the whole EU project will be re- energised and accelerated so those bits you say are not perfect will only get worse.I think that's an exaggeration. The EU army is a proposal made by some member states, not a goal. All 27 states would have to agree.
Not me. Someone else created those. I just found them on Facebook and posted the images :lolI am sure that are lots of people in solitary confinement who would of loved to be able to use that excuse in their defence
ok.
its an emotive issue on both sides, so lets try and take that out of it.
lets assume my reason for leaving isn't valid, along with whatever every other leavers reason was.
lets assume mt tread and vna are right to say because remain had a certainty to it that leave didn't, we should have abandoned what we really wanted to do, and voted to stay in a corrupt (just in our view obviously) system, ruled by people we didn't vote for, who gradually encroached upon every aspect of our lives with rules we had no say in.
And that instead of "dying on our feet rather than living on our knees" (again just our opinions obviously), we should have stayed on our knees.
Lets go so far as to assume that they are right about everything, and the 17.4 million who voted to leave are impudent, racist, etc etc all the other names that have been thrown at us.Stephen Yaxley Lennon rightly got called out as a fascist and racist. Indeed Nigel Farage tore up his UKIP membership card in disgust at his appointment.
Now, perhaps it was wrong for Cameron to allow the common people to decide their future. But he did it.Yup in order to kill UKIP and win and election he gambled on our EU membership – membership that he himself believes is of great importance to our union. What an ass.
So i'll only ask this and with the greatest of respect...Mt tread/VNA...are you not democrats? I mean if your not, obviously thats fine, each to their own, I was just sincerely wondering, thats allFirstly, I don’t believe we should allow the Tory party to wreck this nation.
On Nov 10th, 2015, David Cameron, the leader of the governing party said this.
"this is a huge decision for our country., perhaps the biggest we will make in our lifetimes.And it will be the final decision...When the British people speak, their voice will be respected, not ignored. If we vote to leave, then we will leave. There will not be another renegotiation, and another referendum"
Now, perhaps it was wrong for Cameron to allow the common people to decide their future. But he did it.
And now, whether remainers like it or not, when they talk about about wanting another referendum, or "more democracy", they are fundamentally lying, they want less democracy, not more. How can you possibly argue against that? And if the government now went aginst that, how could we ever trust politicians again, or indeed ever call ourselves a democratic country.
The very nature of democracy is that "you do not confuse your own personal prejudices with divine wisdom, and if you lose, you accept your defeat with good grace"
So i'll only ask this and with the greatest of respect...Mt tread/VNA...are you not democrats? I mean if your not, obviously thats fine, each to their own, I was just sincerely wondering, thats all
Quoteok.
its an emotive issue on both sides, so lets try and take that out of it.
lets assume my reason for leaving isn't valid, along with whatever every other leavers reason was.
lets assume mt tread and vna are right to say because remain had a certainty to it that leave didn't, we should have abandoned what we really wanted to do, and voted to stay in a corrupt (just in our view obviously) system, ruled by people we didn't vote for, who gradually encroached upon every aspect of our lives with rules we had no say in.
And that instead of "dying on our feet rather than living on our knees" (again just our opinions obviously), we should have stayed on our knees.
Dear oh dear Ogri.
I think we have already in this thread established that the EU is actually a democratic union.
Rhetoric is all well and good. But 40 odd pages in and we are still hearing off the EU “gradually encroached upon every aspect of our lives with rules we had no say in” yet so far when pressed the foc u BREXITEERS have come up with;
Daylight running lights
Graded bananas
Oh and lets not forget Dazza’a great grandfather.QuoteLets go so far as to assume that they are right about everything, and the 17.4 million who voted to leave are impudent, racist, etc etc all the other names that have been thrown at us.Stephen Yaxley Lennon rightly got called out as a fascist and racist. Indeed Nigel Farage tore up his UKIP membership card in disgust at his appointment.QuoteNow, perhaps it was wrong for Cameron to allow the common people to decide their future. But he did it.Yup in order to kill UKIP and win and election he gambled on our EU membership – membership that he himself believes is of great importance to our union. What an ass.
QuoteSo i'll only ask this and with the greatest of respect...Mt tread/VNA...are you not democrats? I mean if your not, obviously thats fine, each to their own, I was just sincerely wondering, thats allFirstly, I don’t believe we should allow the Tory party to wreck this nation.
Secondly, I don’t believe people voted for unemployment and more food banks.
Thirdly – two countries in this union voted to REMAIN. My country voted decisively to REMAIN, I fully expect the Scottish Parliament and our representatives at Westminster to fight to REMAIN in the EU. If you believe in democracy you’ll understand and respect that.
Fourthly – BREXIT was not defined in the referendum. Yes the race card was played, the central message of being 350 million a week better off was a blatant lie and illegal foreign money was used in the campaign.
So aye some off us are mighty pissed off at this English Tory mess. Right now the UK is adrift at sea with nobody at the helm.
Not me. Someone else created those. I just found them on Facebook and posted the images :lolWow. thats a logic and mindset its just about impossible to argue with, unless you genuinely believe it yourself. I don't, so I wont.
Wow. thats a logic and mindset its just about impossible to argue with,Excellent :)
But we're not losers, it ain't over yet :DWho said I wanted a no deal ?
And you will be very very upset when you don't get your No Deal Brexit ;)
It must time fae another funny :lol
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DupnzUxWwAA7JTI.jpg)
I have just been laughing too.
Whatever's happened to Speaker Bercow's voice?.
Listening to PMQ's today he makes Brian Blessed sound like Frank Spencer :rolleyes
He's always done that. He goes up then down. Mind you, he's had a lot to shout about lately.Calm yourself man
Did you hear that Tory backbencher yesterday shout out at the SNP leader 'go back to Skye'? I'm outraged and I'm not even Scottish!
He's always done that.No he hasn't. I've been listening to it for years and it's only relatively recently that he's made it ridiculously, theatrically booming.
No I didn't hear that.
Did you hear that Tory backbencher yesterday shout out at the SNP leader 'go back to Skye'? I'm outraged and I'm not even Scottish!
Yes 'Stupid People' and he wasn't wrong :)Ahh that's what it was ;)
Where are the Leave 'funnies'? :rolleyesNone of these so called 'funnies' are actually funny though are they?. They're just political point scoring dressed up in the fake guise of 'funny'. I always imagine them being drawn by a middle class, middle aged version of Rick from The Young Ones :lol .
They have a distinct feel of Goebbels about them.Where are the Leave 'funnies'? :rolleyesNone of these so called 'funnies' are actually funny though are they?. They're just political point scoring dressed up in the fake guise of 'funny'.
Well, all that name calling definitely puts you nearer the dark side.
BTW.... Islam is not a race, it's an ideology or religion or make believe reality or whatever you want to call it but it's not a race so speaking out against radical Islamists doesn't make you a racist or a fascist.
What ever race they are is irrevelant. The majority of the Muslim rape gangs are Pakistani but we are all part of the human race so as far as I can see "racism" only exists to those who want it to.
The term racist really hasn't got much of an effect nowadays due to being overused.
« Last Edit: Today at 06:32:52 AM » ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/index.php?action=posthistory;topic=24678.0;msg=289171[/url])
Well, all that name calling definitely puts you nearer the dark side.[/size]BTW.... Islam is not a race, it's an ideology or religion or make believe reality or whatever you want to call it but it's not a race so speaking out against radical Islamists doesn't make you a racist or a fascist.What ever race they are is irrevelant. The majority of the Muslim rape gangs are Pakistani but we are all part of the human race so as far as I can see "racism" only exists to those who want it to. The term racist really hasn't got much of an effect nowadays due to being overused.
QuoteWell, all that name calling definitely puts you nearer the dark side.BTW.... Islam is not a race, it's an ideology or religion or make believe reality or whatever you want to call it but it's not a race so speaking out against radical Islamists doesn't make you a racist or a fascist.What ever race they are is irrevelant. The majority of the Muslim rape gangs are Pakistani but we are all part of the human race so as far as I can see "racism" only exists to those who want it to. The term racist really hasn't got much of an effect nowadays due to being overused.
OK it's not racism, let's just call it prejudice or illegal discrimination.
Yes I'm glad the rape gang was put away because they are criminals. Of course that nearly didn't happen because of interference by your friend Stephen Yaxley Lennon. Of course he wanted the prosecution to fail so he could be 'outraged'.
Lastly those who deny the existence of racism, or belittle it, either are blind and deaf, or have an agenda. The agenda to normalise it so it can continue unchallenged. :thumbdown
He's a family man with children of his ownStephen Yaxley Lennon is a fucking cunt.
:rollin [size=78%]QuoteHe's a family man with children of his ownStephen Yaxley Lennon is a fucking cunt.
[/font][/quote
You see, as I've said before, sometimes it's better to be the person who sits and listens rather than the so called liberal left wing anti Facists standing outside shouting out labels and names.
I see you poked your head out from your Scottish rock :lol :lol I wonder how many of these delightful gentlemen you come across up your neck of the woods.
https://m.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=346629732792700&id=381971441938916
I personally find any promotion of Stephen Yaxley Lennon offensive.:rollin :rollin :rollin Fucking snowflake :rollin :rollin :rollin
Links to so called ‘Tommy Robinson’s’ facebook page etc should have no place on this forum.
Yes, racism exists.(https://isitfunnyoroffensive.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/07/1907501_1140012262691774_2275379401696683798_n.jpg)
Dazza, this is a thread about BREXIT.
If you want promote racist fascist low life scum bag nasty bastards like Stephen Yaxley Lennon, then do it somewhere else, not on this thread, and frankly as far as I am concerned preferably not on this forum.
VNA....it's quite simpleYes it's simple Dazza, take your racist, facist pish somewhere else.
Oh and talking of fruitcakes, loonies and closet racists;
Well has anybody seen Nigel recently? I couldn’t believe it yesterday when I saw the short report on the BBC concerning his resignation from UKIP. Apparently over some little prick called Stephen Christopher Yaxley-Lennon being taken on by UKIP as an ‘advisor’.
So it’s now fruitcakes loonies and racists. I think we can drop the closet bit. :lol
QuoteWell, all that name calling definitely puts you nearer the dark side.BTW.... Islam is not a race, it's an ideology or religion or make believe reality or whatever you want to call it but it's not a race so speaking out against radical Islamists doesn't make you a racist or a fascist.What ever race they are is irrevelant. The majority of the Muslim rape gangs are Pakistani but we are all part of the human race so as far as I can see "racism" only exists to those who want it to. The term racist really hasn't got much of an effect nowadays due to being overused.
OK it's not racism, let's just call it prejudice or illegal discrimination.
Yes I'm glad the rape gang was put away because they are criminals. Of course that nearly didn't happen because of interference by your friend Stephen Yaxley Lennon.
As I was writing mine I was thinking..... I bet Fazersharp is searching for the thread where VNA firsts mentions him :lol Well done that man. :b
I think that you will find that the first mention of SCY-L was made by the one and only -----VNA, in an attempt to attach racism to the brexit result.Here you are.Oh and talking of fruitcakes, loonies and closet racists;
Well has anybody seen Nigel recently? I couldn’t believe it yesterday when I saw the short report on the BBC concerning his resignation from UKIP. Apparently over some little prick called Stephen Christopher Yaxley-Lennon being taken on by UKIP as an ‘advisor’.
So it’s now fruitcakes loonies and racists. I think we can drop the closet bit. :lol
Oh and talking of fruitcakes, loonies and closet racists;
Well has anybody seen Nigel recently? I couldn’t believe it yesterday when I saw the short report on the BBC concerning his resignation from UKIP. Apparently over some little prick called Stephen Christopher Yaxley-Lennon being taken on by UKIP as an ‘advisor’.
So it’s now fruitcakes loonies and racists. I think we can drop the closet bit. ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/Smileys/efocicon/lol.gif[/url])
QuoteOh and talking of fruitcakes, loonies and closet racists;
Well has anybody seen Nigel recently? I couldn’t believe it yesterday when I saw the short report on the BBC concerning his resignation from UKIP. Apparently over some little prick called Stephen Christopher Yaxley-Lennon being taken on by UKIP as an ‘advisor’.
So it’s now fruitcakes loonies and racists. I think we can drop the closet bit. ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/Smileys/efocicon/lol.gif[/url])
Yup, I 100% stand by that post. And yup it's 100% true that Christopher Yaxley-Lennon has been taken on by UKIP as an advisor. It's also 100% true that UKIP is now haemorrhaging members including Nigel Farage - why? - becuase they are all running out the door distancing themselves from a known hoologan, thug, racist and facist.
And of course it was UKIP that effectively delivered this referendum.
So everything I posted in relation to UKIP and Christopher Yaxley-Lennon is 100% relevent and correct.
And I make no excuses whatsoever to objecting to anybody who defends Christopher Yaxley-Lennon, and I most strongly object to the posting and linking to facist and racist material promoting Christopher Yaxley-Lennon.
This is a BREXIT thread. If you want to promote your hidious racists views and hero worship of so called Tommy Robinson, go and fuck off and do it somewhere else and not on the most popular thread on this forum - the uttery fantastic just for VNA a BREXIT thread :lol
Seriously if you wanna do that shite get your own thread.
VNA....it's quite simple.....don't keep mentioning his nameI have pointed out that YOU were the first person on here to mention his name --- that was all.It did not require a morally high ground rabid response. Just an acknowledgement that yes you were the first person to bring his name into the Brexit thread.
Let's just put this in context with facts.He did not call him nice. -- Blatant lie. --- wait a min I thought remainers did not lie.
SYL was mentioned in connection with Brexit because he is now an advisor to UKIP and has caused Farage to leave the party
SYL is a convicted criminal several times over.
Dazza defends SYL and says he's a nice misunderstood bloke
It all kicks off.....
Think you will find the 7 characters were all tradesmen 3 Brickies, 1 Plasterer, and 3 chippies Not a brit labourer there from what I remember most labourers were Germans and foccing useless. So there's another thing your wrong about. When the Dutch agents weren't trying to rip us off.I think 'labourers' was used as a generic term for workers who didn't have a proper office job :pokefun
Utterly dismayed by the rabble in the House of Commons yesterday, howling, braying, childish behaviour over the utterance of a couple of words. In ordinary life, all of us would have replied with a similar comment and moved on. Not this fucking useless shower of gnats piss. They make headline news out of it. Those ruddy foreigners must be pissing themselves at usTotally agree. The whole set up is archaic and confrontational. Facing each other. Voting by walking through separate 'lobbies'. Blackrod etc. History and ceremony is one thing, but about time they migrated out of that ridiculous building into something more suitable for a modern democratic society.
Slightly off topic, but relevant to some of my previous comments about lack of Statesmen/forgotten how to govern ourselves etc
Utterly dismayed by the rabble in the House of Commons yesterday, howling, braying, childish behaviour over the utterance of a couple of words. In ordinary life, all of us would have replied with a similar comment and moved on. Not this fucking useless shower of gnats piss. They make headline news out of it. Those ruddy foreigners must be pissing themselves at us
I think 'labourers' was used as a generic term for workers who didn't have a proper office job :pokefun
Had it been said from the Conservative side, Labour would have been going absolutely bonkers. They really are the biggest bunch of hypocrites there is.If they'd called Corbyn any sort of woman they'd have every right to.
QuoteUtterly dismayed by the rabble in the House of Commons yesterday, howling, braying, childish behaviour over the utterance of a couple of words. In ordinary life, all of us would have replied with a similar comment and moved on. Not this fucking useless shower of gnats piss. They make headline news out of it. Those ruddy foreigners must be pissing themselves at usTotally agree. The whole set up is archaic and confrontational. Facing each other. Voting by walking through separate 'lobbies'. Blackrod etc. History and ceremony is one thing, but about time they migrated out of that ridiculous building into something more suitable for a modern democratic society.
QuoteUtterly dismayed by the rabble in the House of Commons yesterday, howling, braying, childish behaviour over the utterance of a couple of words. In ordinary life, all of us would have replied with a similar comment and moved on. Not this fucking useless shower of gnats piss. They make headline news out of it. Those ruddy foreigners must be pissing themselves at usTotally agree. The whole set up is archaic and confrontational. Facing each other. Voting by walking through separate 'lobbies'. Blackrod etc. History and ceremony is one thing, but about time they migrated out of that ridiculous building into something more suitable for a modern democratic society.
QuoteUtterly dismayed by the rabble in the House of Commons yesterday, howling, braying, childish behaviour over the utterance of a couple of words. In ordinary life, all of us would have replied with a similar comment and moved on. Not this fucking useless shower of gnats piss. They make headline news out of it. Those ruddy foreigners must be pissing themselves at usTotally agree. The whole set up is archaic and confrontational. Facing each other. Voting by walking through separate 'lobbies'. Blackrod etc. History and ceremony is one thing, but about time they migrated out of that ridiculous building into something more suitable for a modern democratic society.
Foc that, can you imagine the amount of money they would spend on something more sensible? It would go massively over budget then be found not fit for purpose !
Thats normal for all government contracts. What till the bill drops through the letter box for HS2. I confidently predict at least 10 times estimates
Yes. But its not just the buildings ans sytem, its the MPs too. To be elected, you must belong to one of the two main parties, the people dont want to elect independents. That may be the system since parliament raised the cost of standing to £10k. Got to be the only workplace in the UK with subsidised bars on the premises, and its normal to turn up for work bladdered
Just saying.....The timing of it has saved Corbin -------stupid drone
stupid droneO is that what he said? :lol
:lolQuotestupid droneO is that what he said? :lol
What amuses me is that nobody is arguing about the word 'stupid' :)If it was a Woman saying stupid Man there would be nothing more said.
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DvAxAEaXcAE9aYz.jpg)Finally something non brexit propaganda AND funny. VNA has caught the Christmas spirit - or another sort of spirit
Is that Tommy's biography? :lolIf you say so. I expect you're an expert on that topic too. :lol
Good to see you have started calling him Tommy.....Probably best to get used to his name as I get the feeling you're going to be hearing a lot more from him....Nah, he's still SYL, or possibly RAH. Don't think we will hear much more from him soon. He's still on bail and the prosecution will be rerun. Hopefully he'll be back inside soon, except we'll have to hear his supporters wailing again.
Is that Tommy's biography? :lolThere you go again bringing up voldermort's name when it has been left out of the debate for a few days.
Not going to follow them as it might lead to a nasty virus :)Yeah, probably best....The reality virus has got be a bitter pill to swallow. :lol
Yes enjoy your last EuroXmas all you Remainers :lol
Have a great Christmas everyone whatever your political views.
Bring back Maggie xxxGood luck with that :rolleyes .
We had a brilliant leader for this BREXIT, the one and only Margaret Thatcher, she would of sorted the remoaners out,She did a fantastic job herein her time, sorted them unions out.Bring back Maggie xxx
Yes bring back Maggie, the supporter of the EU. Um you did know about this didn't you? :)
One of the things I notice here is that they are all separate nations flags, would that be today there would just be the 1 EU flag.QuoteWe had a brilliant leader for this BREXIT, the one and only Margaret Thatcher, she would of sorted the remoaners out,She did a fantastic job herein her time, sorted them unions out.Bring back Maggie xxx
Yes bring back Maggie, the supporter of the EU. Um you did know about this didn't you? :)
More misleading misinformation from a remainer willing to quote old news from early on in someone's life or career.Bit difficult to quote current Maggie news! One thing Maggie wouldn't have done is lead us down a path which makes this country poorer.
You haven't got to quote current news, just relevant and the most up to date.QuoteMore misleading misinformation from a remainer willing to quote old news from early on in someone's life or career.Bit difficult to quote current Maggie news! One thing Maggie wouldn't have done is lead us down a path which makes this country poorer.
And there you go providing those dodgy Internet links again ;)
Not me. Someone else created those. I just found them on Facebook and posted the images :lolI think the keyboard brings out alter egos that are tongue in cheek sometimes. I don't for one minute believe that mttread was being serious when he says "yeah I posted it, but im not the original author so therefore technically I didn't actually say it, even though I repeated it. Which I obviously didn't..." :lol :lol
I'm a hard remainer but I'm not taking this thread seriously :) And yes we have met Dazza, but I don't make a lot of noise.Yes, my mistake, always get Danish and Norweigan flags mixed up. :)
BTW (not making you look foolish) but there's no Norwegian flag on her jumper :D
I'm a hard remainer but I'm not taking this thread seriously :) And yes we have met Dazza, but I don't make a lot of noise.
BTW (not making you look foolish) but there's no Norwegian flag on her jumper :D
I think the keyboard brings out alter egos that are tongue in cheek sometimes. I don't for one minute believe that mttread was being serious when he says "yeah I posted it, but im not the original author so therefore technically I didn't actually say it, even though I repeated it. Which I obviously didn't..." :lol :lol
It's the same as when you try to discredit TR by his early misdemeanours.For somebody to be discredited they would have to have some sort of credibility. A person who takes and uses as a pseudonym, the name of a ‘celebrated’ football hooligan, just never had and never will have any credibility, and that’s without going into his string of convictions, time in jail, as well trying to get paedophiles off the hook for his own perverted narcissistic publicity gain. As for the Oxford student union, they have made themselves look pretty stupid by offering him a platform.
How many sleeps before we are a free and independent nation again?
Less than 100 now ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/Smileys/efocicon/cheesy.gif[/url]) . I've got the Champagne on ice ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/Smileys/efocicon/tongue.gif[/url]) (I've heard we won't be able to get Champagne after Brexit by the way ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/Smileys/efocicon/wink.gif[/url]) ).
Just that a bottle Veuve Clicquot Yellow Label will be 30% or more dearer due to weaker pound and the import tariff.So why don't we just not put a tariff on it then, --- wait a min thats part of being in the EU --- wait a min, we wont be in the EU --- wait a min that means we will not have to levy import taxes on non EU goods either like we have to do as part of the club ----wait a min, that means food will be CHEAPER.
So why don't we just not put a tariff on it thenI totally agree! :) We can do that by REMAINING in the EU. :) Tariff free trade! :)
I added stuff at the same time as your replyQuoteSo why don't we just not put a tariff on it thenI totally agree! :) We can do that by REMAINING in the EU. :) Tariff free trade! :)
But sadly when we leave, or rather if we leave under NO DEAL, as you seem to prefer, then we will be a third party country operating under WTO rules.
I’m not going to pretend thatI know the WTO rules on booze and tariffs. But I believe the EU places a 30% tariff on imported wine from third party countries.
So um, yeah, I might be a bit out with my price guess on Veuve Clicquot Yellow Label. Could be more like 60 quid.
But hey you want BREXIT. ;)
And also OUT.QuoteSo why don't we just not put a tariff on it thenI totally agree! :) We can do that by REMAINING in the EU. :) Tariff free trade! :)
But I believe the EU places a 30% tariff on imported wine from third party countries.WE wont be in the EU so we can do what we like, we don't have to have any tariffs on food.
WE wont be in the EU so we can do what we like, we don't have to have any tariffs on food.Hopefully mtread who has some expertise in customs will be able to put us in the picture.
Its both booze and food. Your scaremongering tactic was that food and booze will cost more due to tariffs, tariffs on non EU imports have to have the EU 30% on them --- that 30% collected go's straight to the EU coffers. When we leave we can chose not to add tariffs so imported food and booze will be cheaper. The treasury will not even miss the 30% because they don't get it anyway -- the EU gets it.QuoteWE wont be in the EU so we can do what we like, we don't have to have any tariffs on food.Hopefully mtread who has some expertise in customs will be able to put us in the picture.
But I don’t think it’s a matter of just doing as we please, as again we will be under WTO rules.
And OK, so say we can import tariff free food and drink from the EU. Can you explain how that makes sense Fazersharp, when the EU will treat us exactly as they currently treat all other third party countries. What you seem to be suggesting is no import tariff on EU booze, yet we might see 30% slapped on Scottish Whisky heading to Europe.
we might see 30% slapped on Scottish Whisky heading to Europe.And that's it isn't it, there it is -- the problem with all the remainers they only want to remain for self serving selfish reasons.
Just to make one thing clear........ we won't be leaving in a No Deal WTO scenario :)So Mr tax duty man I am correct in what I have said then about the tariffs. I don't mind waiting while you google it. You have conveniently completely side stepped my tariff points.
It just won't happen.
So all those tariff issues are hypothetical.
Just to make one thing clear........ we won't be leaving in a No Deal WTO scenario :)
It just won't happen.
So all those tariff issues are hypothetical.
So what if the EU slap 30% on scot whisky, you will still have the rest of the world to sell to without the 30% EU tax added.
we might see 30% slapped on Scottish Whisky heading to Europe.Scotch Whisky accounts for 1/5th value of all UK food and drink. It won’t just hit our industry in Scotland hard, it’s will be a major loss for the UK exchequer. So I am at a loss as to how it is you see this as selfish.
And that's it isn't it, there it is -- the problem with all the remainers they only want to remain for self serving selfish reasons.
And that's it isn't it, there it is -- the problem with all the remainers they only want to remain for self serving selfish reasons.
Scotch Whisky accounts for 1/5th value of all UK food and drink. It won’t just hit our industry in Scotland hard, it’s will be a major loss for the UK exchequer. So I am at a loss as to how it is you see this as selfish.Selfish because - need I remind you that YOU do not want to be part of the UK so why pretend you care. I think you are not thinking straight --- perhaps a little too many Christmas drams me thinks.
Selfish because - need I remind you that YOU do not want to be part of the UK so why pretend you care. I think you are not thinking straight --- perhaps a little too many Christmas drams me thinks.
I hear that TR loves your whisky.QuoteAnd how the hell is it selfish? We in Scotland don’t elect Tory governments, we didn’t want that darn referendum in 2016 and we voted decisively to REMAIN. But what you and your merry gang want to do is impose your will on us and in doing so trash our hard built industry, industry that you have been happy to benefit from.
Watching Parliament Live after work this afo, Mrs May was on top form. We're lucky we have her in charge. So glad she was victorious in that leadership challenge nonsense. Dignified, resolute and determined
So, all of the imports from Bordeaux, Burgundy and Loire are going to be replaced by Dazza's wine made from sheep droppings ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/Smileys/efocicon/lol.gif[/url])
QuoteSo, all of the imports from Bordeaux, Burgundy and Loire are going to be replaced by Dazza's wine made from sheep droppings ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/Smileys/efocicon/lol.gif[/url])
Maybe the French will snap it all up.
Quote[/size]So, all of the imports from Bordeaux, Burgundy and Loire are going to be replaced by Dazza's wine made from sheep droppings
Maybe the French will snap it all up.
</blockquote>
If there's any left for the French, they're welcome to buy it but it'll cost them 30% more. [/font]
If there's any left for the French, they're welcome to buy it but it'll cost them 30% more.But of course making wine for sale without an Excise License is an offense under the Wine and Made Wine Regulations 1989 ;)
Yes, I would love to see an Independent Scotland, but REMAINING in the EU, and continuity in doing so is a priority.
Spoken like a true civil servant.....report me if you like...... Go on, make yourself look like an evenQuoteIf there's any left for the French, they're welcome to buy it but it'll cost them 30% more.But of course making wine for sale without an Excise License is an offense under the Wine and Made Wine Regulations 1989 ;)
So, all of the imports from Bordeaux, Burgundy and Loire are going to be replaced by Dazza's wine made from sheep droppings :lolAnd BTW, those Demijon's are full of my sloe gin....My wine is kept in barrels like any self respecting wine maker. :D
QuoteWatching Parliament Live after work this afo, Mrs May was on top form. We're lucky we have her in charge. So glad she was victorious in that leadership challenge nonsense. Dignified, resolute and determined
I'll ask you again after Jan 14th :)
Yes, I would love to see an Independent Scotland, but REMAINING in the EU, and continuity in doing so is a priority.You really are confused, aren't you
So, all of the imports from Bordeaux, Burgundy and Loire are going to be replaced by Dazza's wine made from sheep droppings :lolGoing to need a bit more evidence than that I'm afraid. :D
Would love to see an ex customs pen pusher attempt to come round and arrest me.... Make sure you're wearing your POLITE hi vi so everyone knows you're a twat. :lolQuoteYes, I would love to see an Independent Scotland, but REMAINING in the EU, and continuity in doing so is a priority.You really are confused, aren't you
Welcome back, but we've moved on. We're now talking about Dazza's flogging his strange concoctions that make you go blind (especially if you're French). That is until I come round and arrest him :)
I'll still be going to the same job if/when it happens, still get taxed beyond belief, and all politicians will still be lying bullshitting useless cunts.
And no matter how much you talk or argue about it, we will still get mugged off somehow, no matter what the result is......
which as far as i can gather, we had a vote, and we're leaving Europe, so we supposedly don't have to put up with their dickhead rules and decisions.
My main gripe so far is that my local is a Wetherspoons pub and the stubborn political bellend has replaced very fine French Brandy with crass American and Australian liquid earwax just to make HIS point. That's just wrong, that's like making McDonald's a vegan eatery overnight.
You can add cheaper food and drink to that list now by removing EU tariffs.Quotewhich as far as i can gather, we had a vote, and we're leaving Europe, so we supposedly don't have to put up with their dickhead rules and decisions.Yes daylight headlamps, umm curved bananas and something about Dazza’s Great Grandfather – well these so far are the only reasons the LEAVE foccers have come up with.
You can add cheaper food and drink to that list now by removing EU tariffs.Single market Fazersharp. 28 countries trading as one. There are no tariffs. Further we have free trade access to a further 50 countries via EU free trade agreements.
Am i the only one who hasn't got a clue what Brexit means or what it's all about?No you're not the only one. Far from it. There's loads of people who either don't know or don't care about it.
I don't believe i am.
Rubbish.We will trade on WTO rules that set maximum tariffs BUT allow any member to set any amount of low (including ZERO) tariffs.The EU tariffs I was referring to are not EU to EU ones because they do not exist I was Obviously referring the ones that you have conveniently ignored which is the rest of the world. Currently within the EU we HAVE to apply what is called The Common Customs Tariff to the rest of the world which varies depending on the goods involved - anything from 0-36%.Leaving on WTO rules means that we can set our own which can be zero if we chose.QuoteYou can add cheaper food and drink to that list now by removing EU tariffs.Single market Fazersharp. 28 countries trading as one. There are no tariffs. Further we have free trade access to a further 50 countries via EU free trade agreements.
If we do a NO DEAL (which parliament should act to prevent) then we loose all that.
Leavers tell the truth,I'm sorry. I've just split my sides laughing :rollin
Rubbish.We will trade on WTO rules that set maximum tariffs BUT allow any member to set any amount of low (including ZERO) tariffs.The EU tariffs I was referring to are not EU to EU ones because they do not exist I was Obviously referring the ones that you have conveniently ignored which is the rest of the world. Currently within the EU we HAVE to apply what is called The Common Customs Tariff to the rest of the world which varies depending on the goods involved - anything from 0-36%.Leaving on WTO rules means that we can set our own which can be zero if we chose.If only it was as simple as that......
If you make your import tariffs very low or zero, other countries will flood you with cheap goodsSo we would be flooded with cheap Japanese whisky. And the UK's biggest food and drink export Scotch Whisky, a 4 billion plus a year industry, would be destroyed.
We are talking about food/drink goods that we import because we can not grow them here so it wont wreck home production.QuoteRubbish.We will trade on WTO rules that set maximum tariffs BUT allow any member to set any amount of low (including ZERO) tariffs.The EU tariffs I was referring to are not EU to EU ones because they do not exist I was Obviously referring the ones that you have conveniently ignored which is the rest of the world. Currently within the EU we HAVE to apply what is called The Common Customs Tariff to the rest of the world which varies depending on the goods involved - anything from 0-36%.Leaving on WTO rules means that we can set our own which can be zero if we chose.If only it was as simple as that......
If you make your import tariffs very low or zero, other countries will flood you with cheap goods. This will wreck your home production
Great, why should we care about that.QuoteIf you make your import tariffs very low or zero, other countries will flood you with cheap goodsSo we would be flooded with cheap Japanese whisky. And the UK's biggest food and drink export Scotch Whisky, a 4 billion plus a year industry, would be destroyed.
We are talking about food/drink goods that we import because we can not grow them here so it wont wreck home production. And by your own words it will only wreck production of sweeds and turnips.
Great, why should we care about that.So basically, you are with Professor Minford, who stands alone as an economist, and wish to see the destruction of UK industry.
:rollin :rollin :rollin :rollin This from the man who doesn't want to be a part of this great country of ours.QuoteGreat, why should we care about that.so you can destroy this great country of ours.
Good job it happened now because according to Remain there won't be any doctors or nurses left here after the end of March. I should get down there quick ;)QuoteLeavers tell the truth,I'm sorry. I've just split my sides laughing :rollin
Just to point out again :Seriously, am I missing something here. If Parliament votes down (rejects) May's Brexit deal in the second week of January and nothing more happens between then and the end of March, surely we just leave with no deal?. Without an Article 50 extension we automatically cease to be a member of The EU at the end of March don't we?.
1. Not all Leavers (by any means) want a No Deal Brexit
2. There isn't going to be a No Deal Brexit, no matter how much they want it, because
3. Parliament will decide what to do next
Good job it happened now because according to Remain there won't be any doctors or nurses left here after the end of March. I should get down there quick
Seriously, am I missing something here. If Parliament votes down (rejects) May's Brexit deal in the second week of January and nothing more happens between then and the end of March, surely we just leave with no deal?. Without an Article 50 extension we automatically cease to be a member of The EU at the end of March don't we?.Yes but that won't happen. If Parliament votes down May's deal (including any changes she makes to it) the government will extend Article 50 while something is sorted out. All the signs are there. The EU has said the UK can extend without permission. Amber Rudd (May's spokeswoman) is looking to get consent for other options (ie EFTA & EEA). Mogg and Co failed to get her ousted and have spoiled it for another 12 months. All of the opposition parties (perhaps apart from the DUP) have said they won't allow a No Deal to go through. So it's Mogg and Co + the DUP versus the rest.
Whatever happened to "No deal is better than a bad deal"QuoteSeriously, am I missing something here. If Parliament votes down (rejects) May's Brexit deal in the second week of January and nothing more happens between then and the end of March, surely we just leave with no deal?. Without an Article 50 extension we automatically cease to be a member of The EU at the end of March don't we?.Yes but that won't happen. If Parliament votes down May's deal (including any changes she makes to it) the government will extend Article 50 while something is sorted out. All the signs are there. The EU has said the UK can extend without permission. Amber Rudd (May's spokeswoman) is looking to get consent for other options (ie EFTA & EEA). Mogg and Co failed to get her ousted and have spoiled it for another 12 months. All of the opposition parties (perhaps apart from the DUP) have said they won't allow a No Deal to go through. So it's Mogg and Co + the DUP versus the rest.
So there is a lot of bluff, double bluff and brinkmanship going on at the moment on all sides.
All to play for in injury time. :)
The EU has said the UK can extend without permission.Well of course they have because they are scared sh1tless that that 35billion is going to slip out of their hands.
And to put that 35 billion into perspective..A million seconds is 11 weeks. a billion seconds is something like 32 years....Whatever happened to "No deal is better than a bad deal"QuoteSeriously, am I missing something here. If Parliament votes down (rejects) May's Brexit deal in the second week of January and nothing more happens between then and the end of March, surely we just leave with no deal?. Without an Article 50 extension we automatically cease to be a member of The EU at the end of March don't we?.Yes but that won't happen. If Parliament votes down May's deal (including any changes she makes to it) the government will extend Article 50 while something is sorted out. All the signs are there. The EU has said the UK can extend without permission. Amber Rudd (May's spokeswoman) is looking to get consent for other options (ie EFTA & EEA). Mogg and Co failed to get her ousted and have spoiled it for another 12 months. All of the opposition parties (perhaps apart from the DUP) have said they won't allow a No Deal to go through. So it's Mogg and Co + the DUP versus the rest.
So there is a lot of bluff, double bluff and brinkmanship going on at the moment on all sides.
All to play for in injury time. :)QuoteThe EU has said the UK can extend without permission.Well of course they have because they are scared sh1tless that that 35billion is going to slip out of their hands.
Whatever happened to "No deal is better than a bad deal"It's a bluff (and always was) to frighten wavering Tories into backing her deal.
Well of course they have because they are scared sh1tless that that 35billion is going to slip out of their hands.
the wisdom of generations of EnglishmenMany of whom will be dead by the time the full effects of Brexit are realised
Quotethe wisdom of generations of EnglishmenMany of whom will be dead by the time the full effects of Brexit are realised
Shame on you, for wishing to using the gullibility of youth to overturn the wisdom of generations of EnglishmenSo says Agricola.
Am i the only one who hasn't got a clue what Brexit means or what it's all about?So says Darrsi
Just lets GTFOOI ASAP.Well OK. But I'd still like to know why folks wanna do this. So 49 pages in and so far we have;
The truth is Dazza, that I don't follow your links because unlike others you can't be bothered to type out the relevant issues. Just posting links and saying 'read this' is a lazy way of responding, and I can't be bothered :lol
Just wanna make the point that we are a representative democracy.
Well then our democracy is defunct. Finished.
Quote from: mtread on Today at 12:01:59 PMVideo? Don’t remember that, don’t think I reacted to it, possibly cos I’ve never seen it.
The truth is Dazza, that I don't follow your links because unlike others you can't be bothered to type out the relevant issues. Just posting links and saying 'read this' is a lazy way of responding, and I can't be bothered :lol
Mtread, you wouldn't know the truth if it jumped up and bit you on the left testicle. Ignorance is bliss as they say.
Here's another little fact....there are a few coppers on here probably reading this who would've made many arrests in their time. I bet none of them would have threatened to come round and arrest someone, even in jest.
The fact that you did tells me you've actually never made an arrest or had the power to do so.
You are are a regular Walter Mitty with delusions of grandeur.
This is the real world mate, not your little cosseted civil servant world.
Wake up. Expand your knowledge, read the other point of views or forever remain narrow minded.
And as a bonus, you won't make yourself look like such a knob. :lol
Quote from: VNA on Today at 01:16:26 AM
Just wanna make the point that we are a representative democracy.
Well then our democracy is defunct. Finished.
Just keeps getting better doesn't it.....Now, all of a sudden VNA is concerned about democracy :rollin
And you keep on posting the same things like a broken record when the real reasons either appear to have gone over your head or you've chosen to ignore them.
The real truth here is that both your responses and belittling attitudes haven't done the remain argument any good at all.
Another interesting fact was your reaction to the video I posted with the two lovely gentleman, one ranting on about what he's going to do to anyone who converts to Christianity.
You were "offended" by who's page it came from rather than the content.....Oh dear.... You, are the reason these people are emboldened and feel they can post such offensive things and without you realising, you are the reason why support for your arch enemy "Tommy Robinson " is going to grow and grow.
So, sit back and enjoy the fruits of you being a snowflake.
You really are both blinded by your self righteousness.
you've actually never made an arrest or had the power to do so.And that is where you are.......... wrong :)
#QuotePrior to EU membership, i never had to pay 20% tax on anything i boughtThat’s incorrect, as I’ve pointed out before VAT replaced the purchase tax in the UK.QuoteSo tell me again, how I'm better off in the EUAgricola you continue to blame the EU for the policies of successive UK governments, and it appears local councils too. :eek
You were given a ball to kick, and like many others you kicked it hard. But I’m afraid you’ve kicked the wrong ball.
So tell me how Im better off in the EU then
Still waiting
Still waiting
Still waiting
4. Cheap food and drink importsSo what happened to all your scaremongering about increased food prices. Looks like that one was proved false and you now agree that there is no need for food prices to increase.
Quote from: VNA on Today at 01:10:10 PM ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/index.php/topic,24678.msg289789.html#msg289789[/url])<blockquote>4. Cheap food and drink imports
</blockquote>So what happened to all your scaremongering about increased food prices. Looks like that one was proved false and you now agree that there is no need for food prices to increase.
But now that you have been shown that you were wrong you have resorted to agreeing it can be cheaper but it will be poisoned instead. ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/Smileys/efocicon/z.gif[/url])
Apart from food prices, how about imported food availability? Held up because of additional Customs controls?
Apart from food prices, how about imported food availability? Held up because of additional Customs controls?IF there is any through lack of planning then so - be- it we will get through it and as the first couple of weeks go by then it will sort itself out because there would only be a delay for the first batches and thereafter if there is still a delay then it will not be noticed as everything will of caught up wit itself . No one will die through lack of strawberry's in march or scarce tomatoes.
im avoiding the news until we are (hopefully) out.....Stick January 14th in your diary. Worth another look then.
im avoiding the news until we are (hopefully) out.....See my post 1211 for my prediction on what will happen next.
It's more complicated than that. At the moment food on lorries from France goes through unchecked roll on/roll off the ferries. After we leave (without a deal) all lorries will need export/import paperwork and will require checks. There will be continuous delays on both sides of the channel. Perishable food perishes. European suppliers will find other markets for their goods to avoid the hassle.This is what frustrates me.
Good job we've got turnips :)
once Cameron got the result he should have immediately assembled a team of lawyers, businessmen, eu experts etc etc to not only get us the best result but prove to the world and the remainers it was not only doable but would be a resounding success.
once Cameron got the result he should have immediately assembled a team of lawyers, businessmen, eu experts etc etc to not only get us the best result but prove to the world and the remainers it was not only doable but would be a resounding success. sadly, hes a politician, so we all knew that wasn't going to happen. im just hoping against hope that whatever else happens, we still get out. everything is sortable from that pointDo you know I agree with everything you've said, even as a Remainer.
I think we end up leaving, but joining EFTA /Single Market. Or doing an individual deal with the EU that very closely matches that plus some immigration /residency concessions. Not my preferred option, but it fits with 'Leave' and at the same time protects UK exporters and solves the Irish Border.
It might respect the Good Friday agreement but it’s never going to fully satisfy the two countries in this Union that voted to REMAIN.
Further the fact is that all it achieves is that we become a rule taker, as opposed to a rule maker. We would have to give up sovereignty.The BREXITEERS, who were for this during the campaign, now turn it on their head and jump on that simple fact. So you just end up in the same log jam.
I don’t know what the immigration /residency concessions would be as freedom of movement is in fact a non-issue.
Apart from food prices, how about imported food availability? Held up because of additional Customs controls?
Oh dear, here we go, another scare tactic, no food on the supermarket shelves :z
Apart from food prices, how about imported food availability? Held up because of additional Customs controls?
Oh dear, here we go, another scare tactic, no food on the supermarket shelves :z
and the next one will be the lights going out :)
Incidentally, when I agreed with Ogri48 earlier in the thread, I had what's now known as a 'YamFazFan moment'. Don't know how that happened ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/Smileys/efocicon/wall.gif[/url]) And I haven't even started drinking yet!
Incidentally, when I agreed with Ogri48 earlier in the thread, I had what's now known as a 'YamFazFan moment'. Don't know how that happened :wall And I haven't even started drinking yet!
No it isn't. When the government contracts a ferry company that doesn't have any ferries, that's usually a clue. :)Sadly, I think that's just the usual case of selective Government contracts being handed out to relations or close associates of government ministers.
The cesspit that is the EU
[url]https://m.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=377699802997385&id=1159720410844971[/url] ([url]https://m.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=377699802997385&id=1159720410844971[/url]) « Last Edit: Today at 01:13:34 PM » ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/index.php?action=posthistory;topic=24678.0;msg=289952[/url])
“Warship HMS Mersey has been deployed to intercept migrant boats in the Channel this morning. They stop being Asylum Seekers when they pass through multiple Safe countries to get here which makes them Economic migrants! So Sink Their Boats and Send Them Back To France!”Lovely, lets murder all the asylum seekers.
Oh.........Well have you had a word with yourself then about what you can and can't talk about ? :lol
Quote“Warship HMS Mersey has been deployed to intercept migrant boats in the Channel this morning. They stop being Asylum Seekers when they pass through multiple Safe countries to get here which makes them Economic migrants! So Sink Their Boats and Send Them Back To France!”
Lovely, lets murder all the asylum seekers.
It's OK Dazza, we're here to help :lolIt's o.k.Mtread, I've already got the bad stuff out of my body. :D
Oh.........Well have you had a word with yourself then about what you can and can't talk about ? ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/Smileys/efocicon/lol.gif[/url])
QuoteOh.........Well have you had a word with yourself then about what you can and can't talk about ? ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/Smileys/efocicon/lol.gif[/url])
Dammed if I do, dammed if I don’t. Can’t win with you Dazza :lol
You asked for one EU legislation and I gave you one. I chose that one because this is a biking forum and its one that particularly impacts on bikers in a negative way.
And of course not one anti-eu foccer here can name one piece of EU legislation (that legislation that, so we are told, impacts on every aspect of our life!) that has a negative impact on them – oh sorry other than one foccer doesnae like daylight running lamps, and um, well foc me I can’t remember the other.
Quote from: VNA on Today at 07:23:09 PM ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/index.php/topic,24678.msg289972.html#msg289972[/url])<blockquote>
And of course not one anti-eu foccer here can name one piece of EU legislation (that legislation that, so we are told, impacts on every aspect of our life!) that has a negative impact on them – oh sorry other than one foccer doesnae like daylight running lamps, and um, well foc me I can’t remember the other.
</blockquote>You asked for one EU legislation and I gave you one. I chose that one because this is a biking forum and its one that particularly impacts on bikers in a negative way.
And using semantics to differentiate between a law and a legislation that you have to abide by is just childish and sounds like desperation.QuoteYet surely 50 pages in we all know that the EU does not impose laws on any countries.
(https://scontent-dub4-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.15752-9/46960635_3520785361271731_3343978888609923072_n.jpg?_nc_cat=105&_nc_ht=scontent-dub4-1.xx&oh=ca8a97c594e88d7acb506db22c70e80e&oe=5CC40A6F) :eekFine- we will get wet and cold but we can swim and we will dry off, or at lease we can until the EU ban hair dryers
OK, so that's adding:
6. We want to waste more energy BY having to use the product for twice as long as before
Does that sum it up? And are you suggesting for a moment that the UK wouldn't have legislated anyway? That's the point we don't want the legislation to come from the EU. Just like VNA does not want to be ruled by Westminster.
Lovely, lets murder all the asylum seekers.That's a silly idea, we could just bulldoze and concrete over 1,000s of hectares of scotish mountains and build houses there because there is loads of wasted space that is just hired out at the moment for rich Americans to shoot sheep.
OK, so that's adding:
5. We want more air pollution
6. We want to waste more energy
7. We want to use more fossil fuels instead of sustainable bio fuel
Does that sum it up? And are you suggesting for a moment that the UK wouldn't have legislated anyway?
That's the point we don't want the legislation to come from the EU. Just like VNA does not want to be ruled by Westminster.
OK, so that's adding:
5. We want more air pollution
6. We want to waste more energy
7. We want to use more fossil fuels instead of sustainable bio fuel
Does that sum it up? And are you suggesting for a moment that the UK wouldn't have legislated anyway?
8. E10 fuel
8. Is off the list. Nothing to do with the EU.
I noticed last year in France the only choice in some filling stations was the E shit petrol or super, which is far more expensive. Not a problem for me as I only run my Fazer on super. But people could be forced, financially, to buy cheaper E based petrol only to be faced with more expense with a repair bill, or forced off the road as they can't afford a later vehicle that can run on this fuel.Good point. With fuel prices already sky-high most people are just going to fill up with whatever's cheapest.
5. Didn’t know anybody still made 2 strokes. They’ve been obsolete for 20 years. Nobody is interested in manufacturing them or buying them.Speak for yourself. I'd happily have another one. They were fantastic fun back in the day :woot
Are the rest of the world outside of the EU complying to this legislation?.
I think it requires a global effort if we're going to make a global difference.
BEXIT at the end of the day is a project in self harm. Whatever route we take, we will lose sovereignty, our standing will be reduced globally, and our economy will be negatively impacted.
Don't drop in this thread very often even though started it as a p*ss take of 2 certain members. We are now 52 pages in and for the last 30 or so pages they have not said any thing new or sensible. Will drop in again after another 10/20 pages see if they have found something more sensible to say or some cartoons that are remotely amusing. All the best for the new year as a free independent nation. again.So it's all your fault then :)
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DwF2SSEXQAYGchn.jpg)So exactly what euro millions are we giving away.
Brilliant, no posting, no dissent. So on this thread we can all agree that Brexit is a disaster, we need another referendum to overturn it, and if not Scotland can go independent :D
Careful now.......
Scotland - you mean that bit at the top where they get a Commons seat because the SNP win a constituency of 10 votes :wall
The way forward to global standards, is not leaving the EU where we will have no say in new EU standards, new standards that more than likely we will have to comply with, but increasingly EU standards are being adopted by other countries around the globe as off the shelf solutions, that also help align themselves economically with the EU in order to gain free trade access to the EU.Its a big red herring to keep repeating the mantra that whilst out we will loose our "say" in the EU. How much of a "say" does the UK actually have in anything EU related anyway.And the point of being out is that just like the rest of the world WE will be able to decide on our own standards that are fit for our own purpose and if an EU one is fit for our purpose then we will use that. Why is that so bad.
I was a remainer and still am,A very helpful and thought provoking enlightened intelligent post. Thank you.
All you leavers can go fuck yourselves!
Mtread, if you're digging out the ladybird books, don't forget this one for VNA. :lol
I was a remainer and still am,A very helpful and thought provoking enlightened intelligent post. Thank you.
All you leavers can go fuck yourselves!
How much of a "say" does the UK actually have in anything EU related anyway.As has already been pointed out, our MEP's proportionally have as much say as any other EU state. You don't join a club and expect to write all the rules.
unfortunately the majority don't share your belief in this dysfunctional bureaucracy,
So our sphere of influence and the famous "say" in the EU is 1/28th.QuoteHow much of a "say" does the UK actually have in anything EU related anyway.As has already been pointed out, our MEP's proportionally have as much say as any other EU state. You don't join a club and expect to write all the rules.
I was a remainer and still am,A very helpful and thought provoking enlightened intelligent post. Thank you.
All you leavers can go fuck yourselves!
So our sphere of influence and the famous "say" in the EU is 1/28th.Nope, much better than that
So how does that fit with your statementQuoteSo our sphere of influence and the famous "say" in the EU is 1/28th.Nope, much better than that
our MEP's proportionally have as much say as any other EU state.So now you are trying to say we get more of a say. You really are confused. And if we do have so much of a say -as you say we have then how did that help cam-moron and just look how well May is getting on, they just spit at her and call her "nebulas" .The "we have a say" is vastly overestimated and always gets rolled out as a reason to stay.
So how does that fit with your statement [/size]
Quoteour MEP's proportionally have as much say as any other EU state.
So now you are trying to say we get more of a say. You really are confused.
Which of course is to imply that this minority of the electorate have unfairly imposed their will over everyone else :rolleyesQuoteunfortunately the majority don't share your belief in this dysfunctional bureaucracy,Well 37% of the electorate didn't 2 and a half years ago, after being lied to and subject to an illegal campaign.
Its a big red herring to keep repeating the mantra that whilst out we will loose our "say" in the EU. How much of a "say" does the UK actually have in anything EU related anyway.And the point of being out is that just like the rest of the world WE will be able to decide on our own standards that are fit for our own purpose and if an EU one is fit for our purpose then we will use that. Why is that so bad.I think maybe this comes back to the English imperialistic thinking. Where everything is seen as a potential battle, an all or nothing mentality – we rule(d) the world – victory at all costs - what? what?
So our much touted "say" in the EU that will be disastrous to loose if we leave amounts to 9.7%. :rolleyes
Don't drop in this thread very often even though started it as a p*ss take of 2 certain members. We are now 52 pages in and for the last 30 or so pages they have not said any thing new or sensible. Will drop in again after another 10/20 pages see if they have found something more sensible to say or some cartoons that are remotely amusing. All the best for the new year as a free independent nation. again.It's your thread Steve.
I have just been reading through the whole post again,
I personally think that Mrs May is doing a great job with the whole crock of shit that she inherited, she herself was not a leaver but has had to accept what the general idiots populace of this country asked forI tend to agree with you – to some extent – the country ask the government to do something very stupid – and May is indeed acting accordingly. As Mr Corbyn said - stupid woman :eek
very best with a bunch of fucking wankers in both parties trying their very best to scupper the process and also assassinate her in the process.But I’ll disagree with that bit. I mean really :rolleyes It’s the not the job of opposing parties to do the work of the government. This should have potentially been nipped in the bud almost two years ago. Labour should have stood it’s ground and moved to vote down article 50.
All you leavers can go fuck yourselves!I have been trying to get them to see sense. Get them back on board. But yeah OK.
So our much touted "say" in the EU that will be disastrous to loose if we leave amounts to 9.7%.Well you suggested it was only 3.5%. As said, the idea of a 'Union' is that no one member gets to decide all the rules.
Which of course is to imply that this minority of the electorate have unfairly imposed their will over everyone else If Remain had won by the same margin there wouldn't be any such griping you can bet your bottom dollar on that The turnout was 72.2%. That was huge. If 27.8% of those eligible to vote can't be bothered to walk down to their village hall and put a cross in a box that's their choice. They are clearly happy to let the rest of us to decide for them. Remainers often try to include those who didn't vote in their statistics in order to give them a false boost.
In how many refrendums/elections do the victors receive the votes of over 50% of those eligible to vote?.QuoteWhich of course is to imply that this minority of the electorate have unfairly imposed their will over everyone else If Remain had won by the same margin there wouldn't be any such griping you can bet your bottom dollar on that The turnout was 72.2%. That was huge. If 27.8% of those eligible to vote can't be bothered to walk down to their village hall and put a cross in a box that's their choice. They are clearly happy to let the rest of us to decide for them. Remainers often try to include those who didn't vote in their statistics in order to give them a false boost.
Just pointing out that the majority of the electorate didn't vote 'not to share our belief in this dysfunctional bureaucracy'
Anyway, notice you haven't challenged the bit about lies and illegality. They may well have affected the result.
Therefore, time to vote again :)
QuoteI have just been reading through the whole post again,
Confirmation, if any was ever needed, that yardin is indeed 100% insane. :lol
QuoteI personally think that Mrs May is doing a great job with the whole crock of shit that she inherited, she herself was not a leaver but has had to accept what the general idiots populace of this country asked forI tend to agree with you – to some extent – the country ask the government to do something very stupid – and May is indeed acting accordingly. As Mr Corbyn said - stupid woman :eekQuotevery best with a bunch of fucking wankers in both parties trying their very best to scupper the process and also assassinate her in the process.But I’ll disagree with that bit. I mean really :rolleyes It’s the not the job of opposing parties to do the work of the government. This should have potentially been nipped in the bud almost two years ago. Labour should have stood it’s ground and moved to vote down article 50.
We could potentially have avoided this whole mess.QuoteAll you leavers can go fuck yourselves!I have been trying to get them to see sense. Get them back on board. But yeah OK.
My country voted decisively to REMAIN. I expect The Scottish Parliament and our Scottish MPs at Westminster to do everything within their power to stop this BREXIT madness.
I have been helped on a number of occasions with advice about suspension and speed sensors and the front sprocket and upgrade nut and the like, also, biker clothing and skid lids,All CE marked I hope.
QuoteI have just been reading through the whole post again,
Confirmation, if any was ever needed, that yardin is indeed 100% insane. :lol
QuoteI personally think that Mrs May is doing a great job with the whole crock of shit that she inherited, she herself was not a leaver but has had to accept what the general idiots populace of this country asked forI tend to agree with you – to some extent – the country ask the government to do something very stupid – and May is indeed acting accordingly. As Mr Corbyn said - stupid woman :eekQuotevery best with a bunch of fucking wankers in both parties trying their very best to scupper the process and also assassinate her in the process.But I’ll disagree with that bit. I mean really :rolleyes It’s the not the job of opposing parties to do the work of the government. This should have potentially been nipped in the bud almost two years ago. Labour should have stood it’s ground and moved to vote down article 50.
We could potentially have avoided this whole mess.QuoteAll you leavers can go fuck yourselves!I have been trying to get them to see sense. Get them back on board. But yeah OK.
My country voted decisively to REMAIN. I expect The Scottish Parliament and our Scottish MPs at Westminster to do everything within their power to stop this BREXIT madness.
Well it's good to know that there is a smidgen of consensus between us, but I am not going to dwell on it.
I should have edited my post as there was something that I think (On reflection) was not thoroughly thought out, and therefore was erroneous, that was the bit about the leavers fucking themselves, in fact I think they might have fucked us all.
I would urge some of the readers and posters not to take this banter to seriously, because that is what a lot of it is banter as i am always looking for a response, and my goodness the baited hook certainly gets some bites, you see the float bobbing and disappearing all the time. :pokefun
I honestly think that a few in here would not last 5 minutes working with a gang of brickies or ground workers, no sense of humour and take themselves all to seriously.
Especially ole Coco the Clown, I think you know who you are :pokefun chill a bit FFS. The forum is meant to be fun and a crack. There are a lot of good and helpful posts that informative, I have been helped on a number of occasions with advice about suspension and speed sensors and the front sprocket and upgrade nut and the like, also, biker clothing and skid lids, but I am not expecting the hairy arsed bikers in here to sort out the detail of Brexit FFS, we cant even agree on what the best tyre is or who manufactures the best braided brake lines. :finger
I personally think that Mrs May is doing a great job with the whole crock of shit that she inherited, she herself was not a leaver but has had to accept what the general idiots populace of this country asked forTrouble is, May called a general election when she didn't need to, lost her majority, then had to buddy up to the DUP who are holding her to ransom over her deal. So some of her problems are of her own making.
the bit about the leavers fucking themselves, in fact I think they might have fucked us all.And then there were 3. I'm just waiting for Yul Brynner and the others to turn up. Then we might have a magnificent seven :D
QuoteI have been helped on a number of occasions with advice about suspension and speed sensors and the front sprocket and upgrade nut and the like, also, biker clothing and skid lids,All CE marked I hope.
Only when your not wearing them and I can borrow yours.QuoteI have just been reading through the whole post again,
Confirmation, if any was ever needed, that yardin is indeed 100% insane. :lol
QuoteI personally think that Mrs May is doing a great job with the whole crock of shit that she inherited, she herself was not a leaver but has had to accept what the general idiots populace of this country asked forI tend to agree with you – to some extent – the country ask the government to do something very stupid – and May is indeed acting accordingly. As Mr Corbyn said - stupid woman :eekQuotevery best with a bunch of fucking wankers in both parties trying their very best to scupper the process and also assassinate her in the process.But I’ll disagree with that bit. I mean really :rolleyes It’s the not the job of opposing parties to do the work of the government. This should have potentially been nipped in the bud almost two years ago. Labour should have stood it’s ground and moved to vote down article 50.
We could potentially have avoided this whole mess.QuoteAll you leavers can go fuck yourselves!I have been trying to get them to see sense. Get them back on board. But yeah OK.
My country voted decisively to REMAIN. I expect The Scottish Parliament and our Scottish MPs at Westminster to do everything within their power to stop this BREXIT madness.
Well it's good to know that there is a smidgen of consensus between us, but I am not going to dwell on it.
I should have edited my post as there was something that I think (On reflection) was not thoroughly thought out, and therefore was erroneous, that was the bit about the leavers fucking themselves, in fact I think they might have fucked us all.
I would urge some of the readers and posters not to take this banter to seriously, because that is what a lot of it is banter as i am always looking for a response, and my goodness the baited hook certainly gets some bites, you see the float bobbing and disappearing all the time. :pokefun
I honestly think that a few in here would not last 5 minutes working with a gang of brickies or ground workers, no sense of humour and take themselves all to seriously.
Especially ole Coco the Clown, I think you know who you are :pokefun chill a bit FFS. The forum is meant to be fun and a crack. There are a lot of good and helpful posts that informative, I have been helped on a number of occasions with advice about suspension and speed sensors and the front sprocket and upgrade nut and the like, also, biker clothing and skid lids, but I am not expecting the hairy arsed bikers in here to sort out the detail of Brexit FFS, we cant even agree on what the best tyre is or who manufactures the best braided brake lines. :finger
You don't by any chance wear comedy socks and ties do you tommyardin?
I honestly think that a few in here would not last 5 minutes working with a gang of brickies or ground workers, no sense of humour and take themselves all to seriously.Every time I go past a building site they're all stood in a row, hoods pulled down, chain smoking and staring silently and blankly into their smart phones.
And there we have it.... Proof that you have indeed got delusions of grandeur.
Quote from: tommyardinQuotethe bit about the leavers fucking themselves, in fact I think they might have fucked us all.And then there were 3. I'm just waiting for Yul Brynner and the others to turn up. Then we might have a magnificent seven :D
Dazza, no it's not Merkel who is with Hitler, it's your mate Steven Yaxley Lennon. Much more in common :pokefunIf you say so mate...Lets recap on 2018 and see how much of a Nazi he really is. :)
Quote from: mtread on 05 January 2019, 11:03:47 PM ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/index.php/topic,24678.msg290092.html#msg290092[/url])<blockquote>Dazza, no it's not Merkel who is with Hitler, it's your mate Steven Yaxley Lennon. Much more in common ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/Smileys/efocicon/pokefun.gif[/url])
</blockquote>If you say so mate...Lets recap on 2018 and see how much of a Nazi he really is. ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/Smileys/efocicon/smile.gif[/url])
[url]https://m.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=1466885493447500&id=381971441938916[/url] ([url]https://m.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=1466885493447500&id=381971441938916[/url])
And there we have it.... Proof that you have indeed got delusions of grandeur.You really do believe that you are part of a fictitious band of fucking cowboys. Fucking gold.
Of course, Steven Yaxley Lennon is a reasonably intelligent man, albeit a man with strong narcissistic and more worryingly psychopathic tendencies, he gets off on his own sense of self importance along with the chaos and anarchy he creates around him.Who? Hitler?
I honestly think that a few in here would not last 5 minutes working with a gang of brickies or ground workers, no sense of humour and take themselves all to seriously.Every time I go past a building site they're all stood in a row, hoods pulled down, chain smoking and staring silently and blankly into their smart phones.
Don't look much like a bundle of laughs to me :lol
It's because everyone who smokes has to leave the site in order to do so. Usually by just a couple of feet or so. It's pretty much the rule wherever you work now in all industries.I honestly think that a few in here would not last 5 minutes working with a gang of brickies or ground workers, no sense of humour and take themselves all to seriously.Every time I go past a building site they're all stood in a row, hoods pulled down, chain smoking and staring silently and blankly into their smart phones.
Don't look much like a bundle of laughs to me :lol
Yeah but that's from round where you live, everyone is like that around there.
Where I live, and, where I worked brickies are paid for what they do, its the nature of self employment and price work, if you don't do the biz there is no dosh at the end of the week, we are not all safe workers that get paid even if we hang about all day with our finger up our nose.
Of course I am not insinuating that you do, but is that boggy on the tip of your finger? :lol
QuoteAnd there we have it.... Proof that you have indeed got delusions of grandeur.You really do believe that you are part of a fictitious band of fucking cowboys. Fucking gold.
You still haven't quite worked out yet what is a joke and what isn't? :rolleyes
Despite the fact that you're the nasty Mexican (non - EU) bandit. :lol
QuoteQuote from: mtread on 05 January 2019, 11:03:47 PM ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/index.php/topic,24678.msg290092.html#msg290092[/url])<blockquote>Dazza, no it's not Merkel who is with Hitler, it's your mate Steven Yaxley Lennon. Much more in common ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/Smileys/efocicon/pokefun.gif[/url])
</blockquote>If you say so mate...Lets recap on 2018 and see how much of a Nazi he really is. ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/Smileys/efocicon/smile.gif[/url])
[url]https://m.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=1466885493447500&id=381971441938916[/url] ([url]https://m.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=1466885493447500&id=381971441938916[/url])
Who the fuck wants to sit down and watch a PR video made for and about an extreme racist, fascist, Islamophobic thug
Well, unfortunately for you. Once you make such a sweeping, slanderous statement on a public forum,Nothing I said was slanderous. It is fact.
You hear that mtread ? I'm the referee.....that means, I'm the good so I get to be Clint Eastwood.
They can't sell road going two-strokes in the EU though due to Euro emissions laws can they. The KTM 300 wouldn't be subject to those controls as an off-road machine.I'm pretty sure, with their new TPI technology 2 stroke engine they've achieved euro 4
Everyone know the answers to those questions, Bridgestone, Hell, and Remain.
Agreed. Michelin are better than Bridgestones. ;)
Stay behind and write out 100 times "I must accept the will of the people"
Mrs May just wasted £50,ooo trying to orchestrate a traffic jam to promote project fear and they drove 20 miles turned around and came back with no issues, no shots from the accommodating news helicopters no window interviews with irate car drivers nothing. Look out for the next fear farce.Not quite sure what they were trying to prove with that.
I told you what May was trying to do and it flopped, it did not deliver the chaos and news headlines it was supposed to. Anyway there was absolutely no need to practice because we have already got operation stack for when the French farmers or fishermen or onion sellers decide to blockade the ports.QuoteMrs May just wasted £50,ooo trying to orchestrate a traffic jam to promote project fear and they drove 20 miles turned around and came back with no issues, no shots from the accommodating news helicopters no window interviews with irate car drivers nothing. Look out for the next fear farce.Not quite sure what they were trying to prove with that.
But it's nothing compared to wasting the UK economy on BREXIT.
Its a contract to provide and nothing has been handed over----- no providy - no moneAnd nothing will be handed over. It's all a bluff because 'No Deal' just won't happen :D
Well she's wasting £13.8 million on a ferry company
So I am really confused now - can you tell me which one its it - is she wasting £13.9m or not handing over £13.8mQuoteIts a contract to provide and nothing has been handed over----- no providy - no monenothing will be handed over.
You know I’m still absolutely dumbfounded by the whole thing.You have actually summed it up very well - for once.
The Tories promised a referendum on EU membership in order to unite their party so they could win an election.
They win the election and uphold their manifesto promise to hold a referendum on EU membership.
2 out of the 4 countries in the union vote to Remain, but England and Wales vote to LEAVE.
The Prime Minister resigns.
The Tories decide BREXIT it is, even though haven’t yet figured out what that actually means – a red white and blue BREXIT is what we will get – so we are told.
The official opposition (or Muppets) dutifully vote with the government to trigger article 50, even though there is no plan.
May realising she can’t get any sort of BREXIT through parliament, and sensing that Labour is weak with Jeremey Corbyn at the helm, launches a surprise general election with her ‘strong and stable’ soundbite.
A massive landslide victory will allow May to get the job done, as she pleases, and without opposition.
But what actually happens is May throws away her commons majority and sells out to the DUP to keep the Tory boat afloat.
As a last desperate act to get the job done May decides she was actually elected President of UK and that parliament will have no say in BREXIT. Naturally she falls flat on her face.
By the end of last year, she had her deal ready to present to parliament and a date for the vote was set.
Clearly not able to win the vote she pulls it.
The date has now been set for 15th January. Defeat is almost certain.
You have actually summed it up very well - for once.Well yes, of course I have. And what is it? A complete waste of time.
I am really confused now - can you tell me which one its it - is she wasting £13.9m or not handing over £13.8mNo you're right.
If the whole EU project was just about trade like how it all started out as then that would be just fine but its not is it.Perhaps the whole EU experiment / project needs to collapse and we start again with 10 or so countries as just a group of trading partners dump the EU parliment and leave it as that.But you still can't tell us what your issue with it is fazersharp.
You have actually summed it up very well - for once.Just missed out a couple of important points :
EVERYTHING except being part of a group of trading partners.QuoteIf the whole EU project was just about trade like how it all started out as then that would be just fine but its not is it.Perhaps the whole EU experiment / project needs to collapse and we start again with 10 or so countries as just a group of trading partners dump the EU parliment and leave it as that.But you still can't tell us what your issue with it is fazersharp.
EVERYTHING except being part of a group of trading partners.Which is?
I think even the most hardened remainers agree that the EU is not all perfect. But they think somehow they can improve it with their 9.7% influence. There is no changing the EU, leavers have woken up to this fact.
You often hear The EU saying how The UK can't just cherry pick all the good bits of membership (or words to that effect).
That must mean there's some crap as well then?.
I think even the most hardened remainers agree that the EU is not all perfect.Perhaps. But unlike you you, they might just know what it is they don't like.
QuoteYou hear that mtread ? I'm the referee.....that means, I'm the good so I get to be Clint Eastwood.
Dazza, You might be Clint Eastwood though, he's a friend of Trump.
I think even the most hardened remainers agree that the EU is not all perfect. But they think somehow they can improve it with their 9.7% influence. There is no changing the EU, leavers have woken up to this fact.
You often hear The EU saying how The UK can't just cherry pick all the good bits of membership (or words to that effect).
That must mean there's some crap as well then?.
The EU is an almost never ending project towards creating a European super-state and all that entails.That’s just meaningless rhetoric. In any case the EU is never going to become a super state. And if you want to guarantee that such a fantasy never happens, well stay in so you can veto what will never be proposed.
Some people are happy with that. I'm not.You are not happy about something that ain’t gonna happen.
One thing's for sure. They're right hacked off that we're getting out of it all.If you mean the EU, well of course they are not. But at the end of the day it’s gonna hurt us a heck of a lot more than it’s gonna hurt them. If we are really determined to do something stupid, well there ain’t much they can do to stop us.
If you mean the EU
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DwVS316WsAAbtIs.jpg:large)
It is pretty much the stated direction of the EU with integration deepening. Junker wants a bigger EU budget and his dream is to have a directly-elected president of the EU.In his recent state of the union speech Junker appealed to MEPs and heads of government to give the EU the powers and characteristics traditionally restricted to states.QuoteThe EU is an almost never ending project towards creating a European super-state and all that entails.That’s just meaningless rhetoric. In any case the EU is never going to become a super state. And if you want to guarantee that such a fantasy never happens, well stay in so you can veto what will never be proposed.
Quote from: VNA on Today at 10:08:56 PM ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/index.php/topic,24678.msg290198.html#msg290198[/url])<blockquote>Quote<blockquote>The EU is an almost never ending project towards creating a European super-state and all that entails.</blockquote>That’s just meaningless rhetoric. In any case the EU is never going to become a super state. And if you want to guarantee that such a fantasy never happens, well stay in so you can veto what will never be proposed.
</blockquote>It is pretty much the stated direction of the EU with integration deepening. Junker wants a bigger EU budget and his dream is to have a directly-elected president of the EU.In his recent state of the union speech Junker appealed to MEPs and heads of government to give the EU the powers and characteristics traditionally restricted to states.
The EU wants its own foreign policy with decisions made on the basis of a qualified majority vote in which the will of 55% of member states would win the day. So our so called "veto" is an impotent joke. And path to a superstate is not one leap that can be vetoed but a series of smaller steps leading to the final goal.
Even Juncker himself has conceded that the EU was “imperfect”. « Last Edit: Today at 11:00:58 PM » ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/index.php?action=posthistory;topic=24678.0;msg=290203[/url])
she will have a complete breakdown.She doesn't care. It doesn't effect her. All she ever wanted to do was play at being PM.
Just to lighten it up a bit:thumbup COYS
So if we want a trade deal but be outside of the EU, we go from 9.7% to 0%.Or 100% (veto) to 0% (No Veto)
Whoever could have imagined at the inception of the EEC that we would be where we are now?.I know, it’s amazing. A bit sad though that we’ve spent 40 years building this with our EU partners (all 27 of them – who would have ever thought!), we have been key architects in the whole thing, and now, hoodwinked by a bunch of charlatans, we could be about to throw it all away.
If that's what you're happy with fair enough. Not all of us are though. We had a referendum on it and it was rejected.
I was watching Mrs May on the TV tonight and listening to her, not just what she was saying, but her tone and watching her mannerisms, I predict if she fails and I sadly believe she will (She has very few supporters where it matters) she will have a complete breakdown.
Like a lamb to the slaughter.
The trowth is tha youse dinnae ken whit youse want. But youse dae need somewan tae wyte. And youse will wyte whom ye huv been telt tae wyte.
Me or you shooting off your/my big mouth and falling out with each other
Don't you just love rhetoric, hot air and second guessing.
Me or you shooting off your/my big mouth and falling out with each other will not make one jot or tittle of difference.
As the old saying goes 'Opinions are like Arseholes everybody has got one' and we are all different in our similarities.
I was watching Mrs May on the TV tonight and listening to her, not just what she was saying, but her tone and watching her mannerisms, I predict if she fails and I sadly believe she will (She has very few supporters where it matters) she will have a complete breakdown.
Like a lamb to the slaughter. :'(
Fixed it for you
As VNA said, if you want all the same trade agreements with the EU as before, you need to join a Customs Union with them, either within or outside of the EU. Whichever it is you need to accept a bunch of rules, otherwise don't join, or leave the club if you don't like the rules and join another club where you do like the rules, there is a much bigger club called WTO.
:rollin BOTBDon't you just love rhetoric, hot air and second guessing.
Me or you shooting off your/my big mouth and falling out with each other will not make one jot or tittle of difference.
As the old saying goes 'Opinions are like Arseholes everybody has got one' and we are all different in our similarities.
I was watching Mrs May on the TV tonight and listening to her, not just what she was saying, but her tone and watching her mannerisms, I predict if she fails and I sadly believe she will (She has very few supporters where it matters) she will have a complete breakdown.
Like a lamb to the slaughter. :'(
Yep more pearls of wisdom from the Bard Of The Bricks :lol
Keep them coming :lol
a much bigger club called WTOWhich is a bit like standing in the street, when the bouncers have chucked you out of the other clubs because you're too pissed to know what you're doing :D
Nah ----getting lost now with that oneQuotea much bigger club called WTOWhich is a bit like standing in the street, when the bouncers have chucked you out of the other clubs because you're too pissed to know what you're doing :D
Quote from: VNA on Today at 12:43:36 AM ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/index.php/topic,24678.msg290212.html#msg290212[/url])<blockquote>
The trowth is tha youse dinnae ken whit youse want. But youse dae need somewan tae wyte. And youse will wyte whom ye huv been telt tae wyte.
</blockquote>
For the benefit of those who don't read old Scots
The truth is don't know what you want. but you do need someone to blame. And you will blame who you have been told to blame.
Nah ----getting lost now with that oneOK I'll keep it simple. No Deal /WTO just ain't going to happen :)
The only way we have been screwed by them is not to be given a vote on the issue for years. My dislike of the euro project go's back many years and transcends all political parties.
We’ve been screwed by successive Tory and New Labour (Tory) governments, people are pissed off,
My dislike of the euro project go's back many years and transcends all political parties.Well yes project leave started more than two decades ago.
We have expressed why we dislike the EU. Over and over again. Your worship of it and belief that it's completely fautless and the best thing since sliced bread obviously blinkers and deafens you to what we're saying.QuoteMy dislike of the euro project go's back many years and transcends all political parties.Well yes project leave started more than two decades ago.
But it's one thing to dislike something, but quite another to be unable to express why it is you dislike something.
Though are you confusing Old English which is similar to Scots? Scots just being Scots because unlike Old English it is a living language.The only Scots I know is something to do with wellies, and why they are important :D
We have expressed why we dislike the EU. Over and over again.OK, lets see where we are with the foc-u BREXITEER list of reasons for leaving the EU;
#QuotePrior to EU membership, i never had to pay 20% tax on anything i boughtThat’s incorrect, as I’ve pointed out before VAT replaced the purchase tax in the UK.QuoteSo tell me again, how I'm better off in the EUAgricola you continue to blame the EU for the policies of successive UK governments, and it appears local councils too. :eek
You were given a ball to kick, and like many others you kicked it hard. But I’m afraid you’ve kicked the wrong ball.
So tell me how Im better off in the EU then
Still waiting
Still waiting
Still waiting
Still waiting
EU officials are not shy about letting EU citizens know what they really think of them. Following the Brexit vote, European Commission president Jean-Claude Juncker rejected British Leave voters’ capacity for independent thought by claiming we’d been brainwashed by ‘40 years of lies’. According to Juncker, the vote showed ‘something was wrong in Britain’. It has similarly libelled French, Irish and Dutch people as ‘ignorant’ when they voted against EU treaties.
Allegedly, someone has called Anna Soubry a Nartzee, or called her Narsty. Either way, wouldn't one have thought that ones MPs were up for a little name calling? Sticks and stones and all that. Bit over the top to demand the old bill calls out more men on overtime, or pulls them away from crime investigations. I'm sure they could have treated her the same as the rest of us plebs, and given her a crime number.Wasn't it her Government who cut the police. Bercow - gets on the blower to the commissioner and loads of police appear.
Jean-Claude Juncker became EC president one year after being more or less forced to resign from his position as president of Luxembourg, following a spying scandal involving the country’s intelligence service. In any country this would usually be considered the point at which your political career dies a quiet death. But the EU welcomed him aboard.
In 2006, the elected prime minister of Slovakia was instructed by Brussels to clamp down on political extremism and repress certain ways of thinking. That same year, the prime minister of Poland was forced by Brussels to declare that his government was not homophobic or anti-Semitic, and that it would not bring back the death penalty. And in 2011, the EU pressured the Hungarian government into rethinking its new constitution.Too dam right.
The EU’s risk-averse regulations are the scourge of innovation – and many are downright barmy. The price of oven gloves shot up this year after EU officials decided they would impose rigorous testing to ensure that they could withstand temperatures of up to 200 degrees centigrade. In 2010, EU officials suggested banning diabetics from driving. Luckily, this ridiculous rule was never enforced.Goodness gracious me, CE marked oven gloves that actually work :lol – why would anybody object. My understanding of the diabetics issue was that it was partly about UK MEPs trying to get the EU to raise the basic EU driving standards up to the full UK standard. In the UK diabetics who repeatedly hypo (ie their diabetes is not under control can have their licenses withdrawn.
When it comes to ignoring the democratic will of its member states, the EU has form. Its rejection of the Greek No vote in 2015 is just the tip of the iceberg. After Ireland voted to reject the Lisbon Treaty in 2008 it was forced to vote again. Under heavy pressure and borderline financial blackmail, it voted to wave it through the following year. This was the second time the Irish had been forced into a do-over. In 2002, a second referendum was held on the Treaty of Nice, after it was originally rejected in 2001. In 2005, the French rejected the EU Constitution, which was then promptly rebranded the Lisbon Treaty and pushed through the French parliament in 2009 by then president Nicolas Sarkozy.Lets hope we too get the opportunity to vote again. Now that people can see what BREXIT is about, they surely must be given the opportunity to change their minds.
European Commission president Jean-Claude Juncker rejected British Leave voters’ capacity for independent thought by claiming we’d been brainwashed by ‘40 years of lies’. According to Juncker, the vote showed ‘something was wrong in Britain’.Millions of people in the UK agree with him. And here you are Dazza spreading lie after lie.
Many in the Remain camp claim that leaving the EU is simply a xenophobic excuse for closing borders and stopping immigration.Most REMAINERS are well aware that it will make no difference to immigration. Which begs the question of why the LEAVE campaigns campaigned on immigration. More lies. It’s not an issue.
Africa gets it in the neck,It’s not surprising considering that that is the tradition of many of the EU members (particulary the UK). Not to mention the G8 (now the G7) as well. The EPA deals need to be re-negotiated with certain African, Caribbean and Pacific state.
Having finally come to terms with his lack of appeal to the electorate, he took the next logical step: the unelected position of European commissioner for transport in 1995. The EU, temple of anti-democracy, will always provide a home for unpopular politicians.Mr Kinnock was appointed to his position by the then Prime Minister - John Major
It was out of order the way they were hauranging her. It was akin to intimidation.I totally agree YanFazFan. :) A nobody, trying to become somebody, called James Goddard is the ring leader. I believe they are associates of Dazza’s hero.
What annoys me is that those idiots harm the cause that they purport to be supporting.
Meanwhile Facebook and PayPal have closed Goddard’s accounts.And the poor little snowflake doesn't like it :lol
I totally agree with this.
What annoys me is that those idiots harm the cause that they purport to be supporting.
The vast majority of Leavers want nothing to do with that sort of behaviour. They're not representative of the Leave camp.
You can always rely on Scotland being civilized and welcoming though. :rolleyes
VNA I followed your utube link and ended up finding something interesting. I do not agree with the yobish behaviour but why would She take the same route as before after coming off the bbc stage knowing what happened last time, I think the idiots fell right into an orchestrated trap designed so it could be an excuse to call in extra police and shut down the protesters.Here is the utube link. What do you make of it.Yeah an uncover policeman made em all behave like that.
I've seen with my own eyes antifa insulting and attacking TR supporters, male and female and when there's an expected reaction, MSM cameras suddenly appear out of nowhere to capture the reaction.
Groups who have joined the effort to keep Yaxley-Lennon away include Stand Up to Racism Scotland, Hearts Lads and Lassies against Fascism, Show Racism the Red Card Scotland, The Muslim Council of Scotland, and Edinburgh and Lothian Regional Equality Council.
Luke Henderson, from Unite Against Fascism Edinburgh, said the number of people who would welcome the activist to Scottish football represented a “miniscule number of racists”.
He said: “He’s a dangerous, far-right campaigner with a lengthy criminal record. He seeks to inflame Islamophobia and wider racism. There is no place for him in Scotland, or Scottish football.”
Read more at [url]http://thirdforcenews.org.uk/tfn-news/group-aims-to-keep-tommy-robinson-out-of-scottish-football#CElRIBIwELDwh6Fb.99[/url] ([url]http://thirdforcenews.org.uk/tfn-news/group-aims-to-keep-tommy-robinson-out-of-scottish-football#CElRIBIwELDwh6Fb.99[/url])
Let's just say that I was in the vicinity of Trafalgar Square on one occasion when people marched against the arrest of Tommy Robinson.Fuck SYL and fuck his supporters too.
What have you seen VNA.....fuck all. Only what the MSM wants you to see and what you want to believe.You don't know what I have or have not seen. You don't know me.
I saw with my own eyes the vast majority of those people were normal, peaceful citizens of every race, gender,age and country who were against the arrest and treatment of him.Every race, gender, age and country? Ya fud :lol
That bloke in the vid looked (to me) definitely a cop or at least someone planted there to help stir things up, search other footage of him at black rod entrance and he is the first to shout "scum" whilst looking around for support and with one hand to the right of his mouth to direct his voice to the crowd,it dose look like he put something in her staff members pocket, even if he did not there was no reaction by that staff member, nobody knows the mystery bloke, he seemed to be on his own but he has been seen before if he does not appear again then it looks like he is defiantly a "plant"Firstly who cares. These people are scum. Pure and simple.
Yes there's disgraceful behaviour on the Remain side. They haven't come out of all this with a lot of credibility.What? :eek They shouldn't have targeted Rees-Mogg's family, but apart from that? What waving EU flags from across the road?
I don't know if you've ever been involved in a protest or direct action (though the reality is that this is neither) but one thing you make sure of is who is around you.Gay pride marches don't count VNA :lol
Gay pride marches don't count VNA ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/Smileys/efocicon/lol.gif[/url])
QuoteGay pride marches don't count VNA ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/Smileys/efocicon/lol.gif[/url])
Homophobic Dazza? What a surprise!
Rattling VNA's cage is such a great pastime.
He's so predictable. :lol
Yes they are but the point is that YOU are being played just as much as the protesters are, that undercover agitator is there to whip them up - which in turn whips up the far left which then allows the establishment to clamp down in a way that otherwise would not be tolerated. You need to control your left knee-jerk because as you yourself are always keen to point out ---you are kicking out at the wrong people.QuoteThat bloke in the vid looked (to me) definitely a cop or at least someone planted there to help stir things up, search other footage of him at black rod entrance and he is the first to shout "scum" whilst looking around for support and with one hand to the right of his mouth to direct his voice to the crowd,it dose look like he put something in her staff members pocket, even if he did not there was no reaction by that staff member, nobody knows the mystery bloke, he seemed to be on his own but he has been seen before if he does not appear again then it looks like he is defiantly a "plant"Firstly who cares. These people are scum. Pure and simple.
that undercover agitator is there to whip them upThe so called undercover agitator is one of them. Doh.
Is he - have they found out who he is.Quotethat undercover agitator is there to whip them upThe so called undercover agitator is one of them. Doh.
Just watching the news and they were saying how anything can happen between now and the end of March.
Parliament voted to give the public a referendum. Leave won it. Parliament voted to trigger Article 50.
How's it possible that anything can happen?. We're leaving aren't we?. Have I missed something here? ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/file:///C:/Users/garet/AppData/Local/Temp/msohtmlclip1/01/clip_image001.gif[/url])
I'm referring to Remain trying to overturn/reverse the vote to leave and cheat us out of Brexit.No comparison with what's going on outside Parliament, and it's no excuse either.
Disgraceful.
QuoteHow's it possible that anything can happen?. We're leaving aren't we?. Have I missed something here? ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/file:///C:/Users/garet/AppData/Local/Temp/msohtmlclip1/01/clip_image001.gif[/url])
Clearly you haven’t been paying attention.
Waiting for the 700,000 Leave supporters to protest in Trafalgar Square....Don't hold your breath :lol
And the scum's next target will be Bercow after the Mail/Sun/Express write their usual venom laced headlines ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/Smileys/efocicon/sad.gif[/url])
The vast majority of Leave voters are nothing like that and don't want anything to do with that sort of thing.Absolutely :thumbup Unfortunately the Mail etc winds up the ones that are like that, and gives them 'justification'.
QuoteWaiting for the 700,000 Leave supporters to protest in Trafalgar Square....Don't hold your breath :lol
Meanwhile, how does my prediction look;
1. May fails to get her deal past parliament
2. JC calls for a vote of no confidence.
3. JC looses vote when DUP votes with Tory party.
4. Parliament in absolute deadlock and turmoil. Government has failed.
5. MP’s act across party lines and vote through a second referendum.
6. Eventually the question is Cancel article 50 or NO DEAL
7. The nightmare campaign begins.
8. The people aren’t quite crazy enough to throw themselves off a cliff, so article 50 is cancelled. It goes through with a substantial majority – people want an end this this shit.
It's looking good. We can already see that to some degree 5 is already happening.
Which in turn should mean that May won't be able put the frighteners on MP's at 1.And they have already acted to ensure that 2 will quickly follow.
Everything looks OK at the mo. :)
6. Eventually the question is "Confirm or Cancel Article 50"
8. The people confirm their original decision to leave the EU - people want an end to this shit
8. The people confirm their original decision to leave the EUAs VNA said. This is where we are now. How do you propose this takes us forward? One of the following must occur.
There is no such thing as NO DEAL. We take up where we left off before we joinedSure, no problem, and a 1970's UK economy is what you'll end up with.
If there's a second referendum and Leave win again we're back to where we are now, with Parliament refusing to pass any leave deal.
Labour will just oppose anything she proposes for the sake of it. It makes me fed up now. The Speaker annoyed me on Wednesday also. It's so blatant.
Labour will just oppose anything she proposes for the sake of it.9c is actually Labour's current proposal. She opposes it (at the moment)
There's a general election. The Conservatives split lead by Boris. Boris wins and is PM and we have a clean break from the EU
- Nigel becomes Lord and joins the government as foreign secretary.
- Tommy joins the government as Sir TRSCYL as Home secretary
- Martin Lewis becomes chancellor
- Dr Christian Jessen Health minster. ( the gay doctor on tv) I had to google his name by typing "gay doctor on tv"
- I will become transport minister and ban all cars - except for the one I have (when its raining - or damp)
- VNA becomes the PM of scotland and offers a referendum to the WHOLE of the UK for scotland to split with the UK
- scotland votes to remain in the UK and the UK votes to kick scotland out
- scotland rejoins the EU
- The uk once again enjoys bendy bananas
- scotland are forced to eat straight bananas
- [/l][/l]
Just been watching a program about the Nazis and Fascists during WW2 and the appalling crimes against humanity they committed.
I can't bear all this talk of 'scum' and 'nazis' etc...
It's just smear after smear. The vast majority of Leave voters are nothing like that and don't want anything to do with that sort of thing.
someone who is appalled by the rise of an Islamic culture who thinks they can rape our underage children is not, and will never be a Nazi..Except of course they are only appalled when it's about Muslims. When one of their own rapes underage girls, they turn a blind eye.
that is a godawful thing to say. And completely untrue.Quotesomeone who is appalled by the rise of an Islamic culture who thinks they can rape our underage children is not, and will never be a Nazi..Except of course they are only appalled when it's about Muslims. When one of their own rapes underage girls, they turn a blind eye.
Stupid statementQuotesomeone who is appalled by the rise of an Islamic culture who thinks they can rape our underage children is not, and will never be a Nazi..Except of course they are only appalled when it's about Muslims. When one of their own rapes underage girls, they turn a blind eye.
Except of course they are only appalled when it's about Muslims. When one of their own rapes underage girls, they turn a blind eye.I'm wondering what is so offensive about this statement.And why are people suddenly jumping to the defense of facists.
Its not offensive - its stupidQuoteExcept of course they are only appalled when it's about Muslims. When one of their own rapes underage girls, they turn a blind eye.I'm wondering what is so offensive about this statement.And why are people suddenly jumping to the defense of facists.
someone who is appalled by the rise of an Islamic culture who thinks they can rape our underage children is not, and will never be a Nazi..Surely this is extraordinarily offensive.
Yes but that is not in my quote is it, to which I said "not offensive but stupid" -stupid.Quotesomeone who is appalled by the rise of an Islamic culture who thinks they can rape our underage children is not, and will never be a Nazi..Surely this is extraordinarily offensive.
Except of course they are only appalled when it's about Muslims. When one of their own rapes underage girls, they turn a blind eye.What's stupid about it?
Glad to see that you are feeling better and on the mend. :thumbupQuoteExcept of course they are only appalled when it's about Muslims. When one of their own rapes underage girls, they turn a blind eye.What's stupid about it?
Glad to see that you are feeling better and on the mend. ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/Smileys/efocicon/thumbup.gif[/url])
I think I am going to open a yellow vest shop. The irony of this is that the high viz vest is not classed a protective clothing and therefore attracts VAT which -------that's rights go's to the EU :wall
, and I think it will kick off big time. (maybe rightly so ).
I'm sure it was not general comment about the majority of Muslims,But it seems to be perfectly OK on this forum to repeatedly insinuate just that. Not only that but praise for those who intimidate ethnic minorities goes largely unchallenged.
If corbin is saying he will call for no confidence in the government and a general election if May's deal does not get voted through, then wont that mean that Conservatives are more inclined to vote it through for fear of an election contest they don't want.you'd think so, but I doubt it mate. Their own personal self serving agendas come before loyalty to party or country nowadays. All the latest polls seem to indicate the majority of the public just want out with Mays deal now, but I doubt that will sway them either
If corbin is saying he will call for no confidence in the government and a general election if May's deal does not get voted through, then wont that mean that Conservatives are more inclined to vote it through for fear of an election contest they don't want.Well no, because every single Tory will vote that they have confidence in Ms May. The DUP will vote that they have confidence in May. Labour will loose the no confidence vote.
Their own personal self serving agendas come before loyalty to party or country nowadays.MP’s have a duty to represent the best interest of their constituents. That's it.
All the latest polls seem to indicate the majority of the public just want out with Mays deal now, but I doubt that will sway them eitherI haven’t seen any polls that say that. And if that is the case (and I doubt it), it’s what people in England want but it certainly ain’t what people in Northern Ireland or Scotland want.
I try to stay out of politics but I am really worried about Brexit not going ahead.(for whatever reason)Whereas a great many people are seriously worried that BREXIT may actually happen one day. That is whatever BRXIT is.
The UK is a democracy and people who voted to stay or leave should all agree that the vote should be honoured.The UK is a representative democracy. We elect people to govern in our best interest and take decisions on our behalf.
If it isn't then the whole system comes crashing down, and I think it will kick off big time. (maybe rightly so ).Whereas as what we are actually seeing is a representative democracy acting as it should. MP’s are ignoring their party whips and acting in the best interests of their constituents. :)
and therefore attracts VAT which -------that's rights go's to the EUErr no it doesn't. It's Customs Duties which go to the EU. That's because of the EU wide free trade area. A small proportion of all VAT collected goes to the EU. That's how they calculate each member state's relative contribution. Before rebates of course.
My yellow vest post was tongue in cheek and was meant as a joke - you have to go and suck the joy out of everything.Quoteand therefore attracts VAT which -------that's rights go's to the EUErr no it doesn't. It's Customs Duties which go to the EU. That's because of the EU wide free trade area. A small proportion of all VAT collected goes to the EU. That's how they calculate each member state's relative contribution. Before rebates of course.
Get it right :rolleyes
Just to suck a bit more non-existent joy out of your non-existent unfunny joke;I just like to point out that before we had VAT we had the much more complicated and costly to administer Purchase Tax.
All the latest polls seem to indicate the majority of the public just want out with Mays deal now, but I doubt that will sway them eitherI've just google poll of polls etc, and I can't come up with anything like that.
Then you should have put a wink/smiley/chuckle after! You told me off once for not doing that :):uhuh Yes you are right :eek I suppose I should of :o but no one other than a rabid remainer :evil would thought :think that I was seriously going to open a yellow vest shop :rolleyes so I did not think It needed one :pokefun ;) :smokin :kiss :lol
I just like to point out that before we had VAT we had the much more complicated and costly to administer Purchase Tax.VAT replaced Purchase Tax and Selective Employment Tax (SET). To be fair VAT is probably more costly and certainly more complicated than PT. However VAT brings in a lot more revenue than PT ever did, even allowing for inflation. But of course that is why Income Tax and Corporation Tax rates are so low. VAT is making up the difference, paying for NHS, Defence, Education etc etc.
REMAIN – 52%LEAVE – 41% :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :)I just googled how many people in the uk believes in aliens and it is also 52% (u-gov)
QuoteThere I go, sucking the joy out of everything with my specialist subject :)
Quote
Yes I've just Googled the same pages as you. .
QuoteYou said that you googled it. Or is that what constitutes as a specialist
------- DAMIT i can not get my own words out of this quote box
I just googled how many people in the uk believes in aliens and it is also 52% (u-gov)
Your above figures only add up to 93% does that mean that perhaps the missing 7% have been abducted by the aliens that the 52% believe in ( :lol ) smiley for mtread
but no one other than a rabid remainer would thought that I was seriously going to open a yellow vest shop
QuoteI'm sure it was not general comment about the majority of Muslims,But it seems to be perfectly OK on this forum to repeatedly insinuate just that. Not only that but praise for those who intimidate ethnic minorities goes largely unchallenged.
QuoteI try to stay out of politics but I am really worried about Brexit not going ahead.(for whatever reason)Whereas a great many people are seriously worried that BREXIT may actually happen one day. That is whatever BRXIT is.QuoteThe UK is a democracy and people who voted to stay or leave should all agree that the vote should be honoured.The UK is a representative democracy. We elect people to govern in our best interest and take decisions on our behalf.
Further there are four countries in the UK. We are a sovereign union. 2 out of the 4 countreis in this union voted to REMAIN.QuoteIf it isn't then the whole system comes crashing down, and I think it will kick off big time. (maybe rightly so ).Whereas as what we are actually seeing is a representative democracy acting as it should. MP’s are ignoring their party whips and acting in the best interests of their constituents. :)
As someone who has an obvious passion for politics, you should be more worried than most if the will of the people is not followed. What happens next time ? best of three ? people don't vote ? (whats the point ). just because the result doesn't suit doesn't mean its to be ignored. We should all hope this goes through cos if it doesn't its the sort of thing that causes massive unrest.
just because the result doesn't suit doesn't mean its to be ignored. We should all hope this goes through cos if it doesn't its the sort of thing that causes massive unrest.
Quotejust because the result doesn't suit doesn't mean its to be ignored. We should all hope this goes through cos if it doesn't its the sort of thing that causes massive unrest.
Flooky. I don’t think we should ever loose sight of why this referendum occurred. It was offered to the country by the Tory party as a means to unite it’s MP’s in order to win an election. They decided to gamble our membership of the EU in order to win an election. They won the election, but gamble has exploded.
You say you hope this goes through. But then what exactly is going to go through? With just a few weeks to go nobody yet knows what BREXIT is.
Again,you say we should all hope this goes through, whatever that is. But do you really think people in Scotland and Northern Ireland who voted to REMAIN all want this to go through?
what Scotland and northern Island think is also not a valid reason to not honour the voteIndeed, and that is how a great many of us feel in Scotland and Northern Ireland. As you say we don’t count, our view and our future is of no interest to Tory politicians at Westminster. Democracy is for the English, not the Scots or Irish.
Leaving the EU will be bumpy , but we and they will get over it.Indeed it will. Whatever leaving actually means - and indeed if we ever do. It will not effect those who offered us the referendum, putting party before country in doing so, nor will it effect those negotiating the deal – that if, again, there ever is a deal. However, if we leave it will be ordinary punters like you and I that pay the price.
I love bikes which is why I am on this forum so I will leave politics alone now, If I don't reply any more I am not being rude, just wanna read about bikes. Xx
If democracy was only for the English we would have been given a referendum for an independent England.That rather makes my point. People were not screaming out for a referendum on the EU. You are right to suggest it was given to us, as indeed it was.
People were not screaming out for a referendum on the EU.
ditto. I think the one thing that has come out of this thread is that nobody has changed their minds. leavers still want out. remainers still want in. it doesn't matter about facts or figures on either side. I'll never change my mind, and nor will remainers. I think the remain camp will win, and I will see the death of democracy in the uk in my lifetime. That will be a very sad day.People were not screaming out for a referendum on the EU.
I was.
People were not screaming out for a referendum on the EU.
I was.
The verdictSo, yup it always was, and always will be about the Tory party.
When pushed, 67 per cent of those polled by YouGov last month said they would rather have a referendum on Britain’s EU membership than not.
But they had to be pushed – because actually, they don’t really care. Take a closer look at the latest polls, and what you see is that a massive 97 per cent don’t consider the EU a big issue right now.
it doesn't matter about facts or figures on either side.For me that’s what always counts. I am certainly not in Michael Gove’s camp “I think that the people of this country have had enough of experts”
I think the remain camp will win,For what it's worth Ogri, I think we've all already lost.
Quote
People were not screaming out for a referendum on the EU.
I was.
Would be interested to know what you did to try get a referendum.
I don't like to agree with VNA but I agree on his last post. The whole British people have lost democracy, parliament was given an instruction by the people, whether it was the right instruction is open to debate what ever happens whether we stay in or leave we will only ever be able to speculate what might have been if we had gone the other way. Parliament has chosen to ignore the will of the people they are supposed to represent and engineer a way to get what they want in stead of preparing the country to carry out the will of the people. Our last civil war was between the people and a dictator king, lets hope the next one is not between Parliament and the people.I totally disagree with you Steve. :lol
Waiting for the 700,000 Leave supporters to protest in Trafalgar Square....
Hang on a minute.
May is trying to deliver what the people voted for.
Corbyn has said he'll deliver what the people voted for.
What's the problem?
People were not screaming out for a referendum on the EU. You are right to suggest it was given to us, as indeed it was.People did ask for it in the 2015 general election by giving 4 million votes (12.6 per cent of those cast)to UKIP Its so boring to keep repeating the "it was all about the Tories" line. It wasn't, people have been - as you say yourself "moaning over their beer" for years and 7 out of 10 labour held areas also voted to leave the eu
However, one would expect to ask for a referendum, as opposed to be given something that was never requested.
people did ask for it in the 2015 general election by giving 4 million votes (12.6 per cent of those cast)to UKIPBut that's missing the point. 87.4% obviously thought there were more important things to worry about. The fact is that the (Tory) government tabled the motion for a referendum. They did this to resolve the split in their own party once and for all. As we can see today, it has widened the split instead.
The democracy haters (Remain)...just to clarify, if they'd won the referendum then it'd be perfectly democratic :lol
Just watching the news live from the green outside Parliament. The democracy haters (Remain) are constantly striking a bell and banging a drum :z . What on earth difference does that achieve apart from irritataing the hell out of every normal (Leave) person?Oops apparently it's Leave creating the racket :o . Still wants stopping. Incredibly irritating. They say the din has been going on all day long.
all the MPs can do is play party politicsThat's one thing they most certainly are not doing :lol
There's no denying that. The stitch up is in motion. The first step towards disregarding democracy and reversing the democratic decision.
I thought that would please you ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/Smileys/efocicon/wink.gif[/url])
The amount that it was voted down by is a good thing because the EU will see that and realise that they HAVE to renegotiate - otherwise the default, written in law will be a leave on WTO which they fear more than anything.
An important point regarding a second referendum, which is where I'm certain we are heading.No idea if there will be a second referendum or not. It's certainly more likely now than May's deal. :lol
It puts Leave at a disadvantage because having already had their vote disregarded once, apathy will have set in and a 'Why bother when they just ignore us and stitch us up?' attitude prevails. Even if Leave won a second vote, who's to say that one wouldn't be ignored?.
Remain will have been given basically 'A free second spin' and will grasp it with gusto.
I reckon they will be happy to see it go to a second referendum and take their chances with that.They (the EU) are not taking a chance with anything. If we were to leave with NO DEAL (which will not happen) the EU will take a small hit, but we will get fucked.
Parliament has basically wasted the voting publics time for 2 years.No, Parliament has only now been consulted. May and her government has wasted the public's time for 2 and a half years. The obstinate woman could have consulted Parliament and the opposition parties a long time ago.
Quote<blockquote> Parliament has basically wasted the voting publics time for 2 years. </blockquote>No, Parliament has only now been consulted. May and her government has wasted the public's time for 2 and a half years. The obstinate woman could have consulted Parliament and the opposition parties a long time ago.Indeed, she tried a snap election - that failed
To be fair, whatever side you're on you couldn't beat all this for drama could you!. To people who couldn't care less it probably means nothing, but to those of us who are interested it's the equivalent of Den and Angie at Christmas 1986 :lol
The raving monster loony party policy to decimalise time makes more sense to meAlready been done. The French in 1793 :)
QuoteParliament has basically wasted the voting publics time for 2 years.No, Parliament has only now been consulted. May and her government has wasted the public's time for 2 and a half years. The obstinate woman could have consulted Parliament and the opposition parties a long time ago.
Parliament agreed to give the electorate a vote and to implement Article 50.Very true, but it's been all down to May since then.
No idea if there will be a second referendum or not. It's certainly more likely now than May's deal. :lol
But as I have said again and again, if, and if, I say again if, there is second referendum it must be legally binding.
How's The Eagle's lyric go?..."You can check out any time you like, but you can never leave"...You're spot on. It also covers May's obstinacy.
I've no doubt it will be....if the answers Remain.Legally binding means just that. Whatever the result is it has to be implemented.
So we were lied to in 2016?.
That leaflet said...'This is your decision. The government will implement what you decide'.
It didn't say....'The government will implement what you decide....as long as it can be defined' ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/Smileys/efocicon/rolleyes.gif[/url])
Well at least if there is another referendum I can look forward to there being another leaflet drop because my downpipes need re doing.
The pound will strengthenOn that point, all day yesterday the "City experts" were saying that if Mays deal is voted down then the pound will drop. --- IT went UP :wall
On that point, all day yesterday the "City experts" were saying that if Mays deal is voted down then the pound will drop. --- IT went UP :wall
VNA You like to say that the people who voted to leave were just kicking the politicians. After witnessing the last 2 years of their shenanigans then surely those who voted to leave are not about to change their minds but instead to just kick harder.
QuoteOn that point, all day yesterday the "City experts" were saying that if Mays deal is voted down then the pound will drop. --- IT went UP :wall
Tis a very fluid situation Mr Sharp. The city experts were probably figuring on a narrower defeat, with May coming back for a second vote. That would then take us closer to a NO DEAL scenario.
But the deal hasn’t just been fairly strongly rejected, it’s been annihilated, completely and utterly blitzed. I can’t see May coming back for a second vote, not without some sort of significant change.
Still anything could happen, but the general feeling has to be we are heading towards a much softer BREXIT. That can only reassure the markets.
And the value of the pound is one indicator of the overall health of our economy.
The city experts were probably figuring on a narrower defeatLike I said "Gambling"
That can only reassure the markets.Like I said "frightened children"
And the value of the pound is one indicator of the overall health of our economy.No it isn't - the value of the pound is an overall indicator of the gambling of a select few crooked city children.
:eek :eek :eek I have just heard Soubery spell out C.U.N.T in PMQ's :rolleyes :rolleyes :rolleyes :rolleyes :rolleyes :rolleyes That has got to look fantastic with the subtitles on
She once again was moaning that one of her staff was barracked on entering parliment and there were no police there.:eek :eek :eek I have just heard Soubery spell out C.U.N.T in PMQ's :rolleyes :rolleyes :rolleyes :rolleyes :rolleyes :rolleyes That has got to look fantastic with the subtitles on
Context?
Does 'Norway Deal' involve retaining freedom of movement?.Yep, Norway deal does include freedom of movement, so that's a non-starter.
<blockquote>Does 'Norway Deal' involve retaining freedom of movement?.I’d have to check the agreement.
</blockquote>Yep, Norway deal does include freedom of movement, so that's a non-starter.
Well at least if there is another referendum I can look forward to there being another leaflet drop because my downpipes need re doing.That looks suspiciously like an EU flag under your bike. Have you had a few too many sherbets again? ;)
the truth is even more bizarre. its a Winnie the poo duvet coverQuoteWell at least if there is another referendum I can look forward to there being another leaflet drop because my downpipes need re doing.That looks suspiciously like an EU flag under your bike. Have you had a few too many sherbets again? ;)
Does 'Norway Deal' involve retaining freedom of movement?.Yes but you have to movement around very quickly. It's cold in Norway :D
If it were EU it'd simply be a poo duvet cover :lolAfter brexit will we still be able to get duvets - they are a French thing aren't they ? Or will I have to pay a sleep a tariff. I will have to make do with the English version - an eiderdown. Or plenty of blankets and a bicycle frame :lol
Hopefully the next thing we will see happen is a move by pariament to remove the threat of a NO DEAL BREXIT.That means legislation to gurantee there cannot be a NO DEAL exit.That should give some reassurance to industry.But that is the only thing we have left with to threaten the EU with.After May promised them all the money (for nothing )on day 1
But that is the only thing we have left with to threaten the EU with.Which loosely translates into - give us what we want or we'll jump :lol
Nah I see it more like this ---QuoteBut that is the only thing we have left with to threaten the EU with.Which loosely translates into - give us what we want or we'll jump :lol
Yeah that'll work :eek
But that is the only thing we have left with to threaten the EU with.Here's how you successfully jump :eek
Which loosely translates into - give us what we want or we'll jump
Yeah that'll work
</blockquote>
Nah I see it more like this ---
May wins confidence vote by majority of 19, but it's the Labour Party who are going to control this situation from now on. Good job their leader is a eurosceptic :)
Corbyn makes it a condition in order to get May off the fence. So she has to pick which half of her party to go with. Lots of politicking going on here....
Here it is as I don't think you will see it on the BBC.:eek :eek :eek I have just heard Soubery spell out C.U.N.T in PMQ's :rolleyes :rolleyes :rolleyes :rolleyes :rolleyes :rolleyes That has got to look fantastic with the subtitles on
Context?
He's just said he'll negotiate if she takes No Deal off the table :)all the more reason not too...
can I ask the remainers this. You've seen how much the eu despise us, they have made no effort whatsoever to disguise their contempt, which is absolutely fine by me (much better to know where we stand dontcha think?)What on earth makes you think the EU despise us?
well, thats not the first time ive been called a stupid cunt (albeit a bit around the houses) and I doubt its the last. hey ho..Not at all. I am not calling you a cunt :eek I do though feel the UK has acted dreadfully towards the EU.
No deal HAS to remain on the table. Germany is in the brink of recession - the possibility of a no deal may just persuade them to renegotiate.But it won't. They've said so. That sort of brinkmanship won't work. All of the EU member states have come out today as united. Anyway, what is it exactly that you want the EU to renegotiate? A while ago on here it was all about 'No Deal' in which case there is nothing to negotiate. The EU would allow that, but of course Parliament won't :lol
Here it is as I don't think you will see it on the BBC.Excellent, good on her, except I see they have subtitled it 'Sea UNT' :lol
Quotewell, thats not the first time ive been called a stupid cunt (albeit a bit around the houses) and I doubt its the last. hey ho..Not at all. I am not calling you a cunt :eek I do though feel the UK has acted dreadfully towards the EU.
But yes in my opinion BREXIT is absolutely bonkers. It's collective madness. Our problems stem from our own sucessive governments not the actions of the EU.
I am impressed, on the other hand, how united the EU is, 27 countreis standing together. And despite our dreadful behaviour towards them, they continue to hold the door open to us.
She continues to be a stubborn woman
And Corbyn's not being a stubborn man I supposeOf course he is, but he is the official opposition. It's his job.
Now joined by SNP and Lib Dems who lay down conditions and won't talk either No trap :)Do they not realise the whole country is watching them and expects them to get together and sort this.
Just been listening to 'Remain live', sorry, 'Radio 5 live'. It's a job to tell who's the presenters and who's the callers :lolI used to listen to that a lot but not done so for a long time I had a little listen the other day and OMG the PC and virtue signalling by the presenters is borderline funny
Now joined by SNP and Lib Dems who lay down conditions and won't talk either No trap :)Do they not realise the whole country is watching them and expects them to get together and sort this.
We need to lock them all in a big room (like a pope conclave ) and not let them out until they get together and sort it. The only ones we will let out are those who can not bring themselves to work with others and my leaving they leave their MP job and can never return.
I wonder how many "I am an MP get me out of here" we would see then.
Just been listening to 'Remain live', sorry, 'Radio 5 live'. It's a job to tell who's the presenters and who's the callers :lolI used to listen to that a lot but not done so for a long time I had a little listen the other day and OMG the PC and virtue signalling by the presenters is borderline funny
"...in my opinion..."
....which of course you are totally entitled to, just like everyone else, but that's all it is, it does not make you right (or wrong).
QuoteAnd Corbyn's not being a stubborn man I supposeOf course he is, but he is the official opposition. It's his job.
Except I’ve backed up my opinion with facts.
His 'job' is to honour the Labour Party manifesto and see that Article 50 and the democratic will of the people is carried out.And he is. You are missing out the bit the bit in the manifesto that said we must join a Customs Union.
Here's a fact...52% voted Leave, 48% voted Remain ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/Smileys/efocicon/cheesy.gif[/url])
QuoteHere's a fact...52% voted Leave, 48% voted Remain ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/Smileys/efocicon/cheesy.gif[/url])
But what sort of BREXIT did they vote for?
Here's another fact;
In Scotland everything single council areae voted to REMAIN. :D
I’ve backed up my opinion with facts.Proof you talk crap.Here some real facts for you.
inflation has increased. price increases
QuoteHere's a fact...52% voted Leave, 48% voted Remain ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/Smileys/efocicon/cheesy.gif[/url])
But what sort of BREXIT did they vote for?
Here's another fact;
In Scotland everything single council areae voted to REMAIN. :D
Why can you not accept that there was a vote and, like it or not, that was the result? :lol
QuoteHis 'job' is to honour the Labour Party manifesto and see that Article 50 and the democratic will of the people is carried out.And he is. You are missing out the bit the bit in the manifesto that said we must join a Customs Union.
Can't have it both ways. He can't 'see that Article 50 and the democratic will of the people is carried out' if he's not in government :)There is only 1 Marxist on this forum ;)
Marxists are Communists. He's a Socialist
The UK inflation rate fell to 2.1% in December, from 2.3% the previous month, according to the Office for National Statistics (ONS).The Consumer Prices Index (CPI) figure was the lowest in nearly two years. Inflation is being outstripped by average UK pay growth
Proof you talk crap.Here some real facts for you.
They're not in government!!.But the government is not in government either :lol
The last thing any of us need right now is a Marxist in number 10.After years of austerity, where the rich get richer and the poor get poorer, what we need now is a Socialist in number 10 :)
There is only 1 Marxist on this forum
0.5% inflation is not a good thing for the economy which is why the BOE has 2% for its target and anything below or above then they are minded to do something about it.QuoteThe UK inflation rate fell to 2.1% in December, from 2.3% the previous month, according to the Office for National Statistics (ONS).The Consumer Prices Index (CPI) figure was the lowest in nearly two years. Inflation is being outstripped by average UK pay growth
UK inflation just before the 2016 referendum was 0.5%QuoteProof you talk crap.Here some real facts for you.
:lol :lol :lol :lol :lol :lol :lol :lol :lol :lol :lol :lol :lol
Can't have it both ways.Do you mean like when you lose a referendum, but demand a re-run?.
0.5% inflation is not a good thing for the economy which is why the BOE has 2% for its target and anything below or above then they are minded to do something about it.
Only a Marxist would welcome near to 0% inflation
Wrong again. Here from the mouth of the BOE --------Quote0.5% inflation is not a good thing for the economy which is why the BOE has 2% for its target and anything below or above then they are minded to do something about it.
Only a Marxist would welcome near to 0% inflation
Wrong again.
The BOE target is to keep inflation below 2%.
Here from the mouth of the BOE --------Here's something else from the Bank of England;
QuoteAnd Corbyn's not being a stubborn man I supposeOf course he is, but he is the official opposition. It's his job.
Anyway, May has enough problems with a divided cabinet. Gaulk says Customs Union option, Fox says not. Perhaps her first job should be to talk to them.
Hammond tells business leaders that No Deal will be taken off the table within days, yet May refuses to agree to rule it out.
SNP says this morning it won't discuss Brexit unless May considers 2nd Referendum.
Not looking good for May is it? :rolleyes
Typical VNA tactics - been proved WRONG - TWICE about the same thing and then deflects the conversation.QuoteHere from the mouth of the BOE --------Here's something else from the Bank of England;
Bank of England says no-deal Brexit would be worse than 2008 crisis Bank warns of immediate economic crash, GDP to fall by 8%, unemployment to rise to 7.5%
Not looking good for Sturgeon either, is it. She could be forced out before May ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/Smileys/efocicon/rollin.gif[/url])
QuoteHere's a fact...52% voted Leave, 48% voted Remain ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/Smileys/efocicon/cheesy.gif[/url])
But what sort of BREXIT did they vote for?
Here's another fact;
In Scotland everything single council areae voted to REMAIN. :D
Why can you not accept that there was a vote and, like it or not, that was the result? :lol
And this is interesting;
(https://www.bankofengland.co.uk/-/media/boe/images/bs/financial-stability-report/2018/november/brexit-lines-v2.svg?h=652&w=1143&hash=0BE29568A398EC2855C465545F099AF374C7013A&hash=0BE29568A398EC2855C465545F099AF374C7013A&la=en)
QuoteNot looking good for Sturgeon either, is it. She could be forced out before May ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/Smileys/efocicon/rollin.gif[/url])
Ms Sturgeon is the First Minister of Scotland. She sits in the Scottish Parliament.
Ian Blackford is the leader of the SNP at Westminster.
I was listening to a report on the Sturgeon issue on the Today Programme the other morning. I had a little chuckle I must say.Both the ex and the current first minister sound fishy to me :lol
and away he goes, sifting through his daily delivery of 50 newspapers, desperately searching for another crap cartoon, all doom and gloom.
Jeez, the penny's just dropped. VNA is Fraser. From Dads Army.
I was listening to a report on the Sturgeon issue on the Today Programme the other morning. I had a little chuckle I must say.Both the ex and the current first minister sound fishy to me :lol
I was listening to a report on the Sturgeon issue on the Today Programme the other morning. I had a little chuckle I must say.Both the ex and the current first minister sound fishy to me :lol
:D:rollin :rollin :rollin :rollin :rollin
You seem to be oblivious to political events in Scotland, perhaps you're focusing too hard on events here. Let me enlighten you. The First Minister of Scotland is facing a misconduct investigation for holding a series of meetings with a former First Minister of Scotland, who was recently under investigation himself, but has been successful in his judicial review of the allegations made against him. Why the First Minister felt the need to claim these meetings were unofficial, when government officials were present, at here home, has yet to be revealed.
This one still has some mileage to go yet. Cant wait ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/Smileys/efocicon/lol.gif[/url])
Oh, and do try and keep up ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/Smileys/efocicon/wink.gif[/url])
It took you 1 hour 20 mins to google that info :rolleyesQuoteYou seem to be oblivious to political events in Scotland, perhaps you're focusing too hard on events here. Let me enlighten you. The First Minister of Scotland is facing a misconduct investigation for holding a series of meetings with a former First Minister of Scotland, who was recently under investigation himself, but has been successful in his judicial review of the allegations made against him. Why the First Minister felt the need to claim these meetings were unofficial, when government officials were present, at here home, has yet to be revealed.
This one still has some mileage to go yet. Cant wait ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/Smileys/efocicon/lol.gif[/url])
Oh, and do try and keep up ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/Smileys/efocicon/wink.gif[/url])
The judicial review was in respect of the government investigations into sexual harassment claims against the former First Minister Alex Salmond. Mr Salmond won his case against government for not following correct procedure. The allegations against him continue to be investigated by police Scotland. The judicial review had nothing to do with the actual allegations.
Ms Sturgeon meanwhile has referred herself to the parliamentary standards committee.
Party leaders in the Scottish Parliament have agreed to set up a cross-party committee to looking into the Scottish Governments handling of their investigation into claims of sexual harassment against Alex Salmond. The committee is backed by First Minister Nicola Sturgeon.
Best to get yer foccing facts right before you lecture me on Scottish politics Agricola. :rolleyes
It took you 1 hour 20 mins to google that info ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/Smileys/efocicon/rolleyes.gif[/url])
We need to lock them all in a big room (like a pope conclave ) and not let them out until they get together and sort it.
Anyway, what's far more important is that some 97 year old driver has pulled out of a side road and written off two cars. Shouldn't be allowed out!
The UK inflation rate fell to 2.1% in December, from 2.3% the previous month, according to the Office for National Statistics (ONS).The Consumer Prices Index (CPI) figure was the lowest in nearly two years.
The Japanese made bikes are still cheaper and better than those made in the EU.I don't see the relevance of that statement, however,
QuoteYou seem to be oblivious to political events in Scotland, perhaps you're focusing too hard on events here. Let me enlighten you. The First Minister of Scotland is facing a misconduct investigation for holding a series of meetings with a former First Minister of Scotland, who was recently under investigation himself, but has been successful in his judicial review of the allegations made against him. Why the First Minister felt the need to claim these meetings were unofficial, when government officials were present, at here home, has yet to be revealed.
This one still has some mileage to go yet. Cant wait ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/Smileys/efocicon/lol.gif[/url])
Oh, and do try and keep up ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/Smileys/efocicon/wink.gif[/url])
The judicial review was in respect of the government investigations into sexual harassment claims against the former First Minister Alex Salmond. Mr Salmond won his case against government for not following correct procedure. The allegations against him continue to be investigated by police Scotland. The judicial review had nothing to do with the actual allegations.
Ms Sturgeon meanwhile has referred herself to the parliamentary standards committee.
Party leaders in the Scottish Parliament have agreed to set up a cross-party committee to looking into the Scottish Governments handling of their investigation into claims of sexual harassment against Alex Salmond. The committee is backed by First Minister Nicola Sturgeon.
Best to get yer foccing facts right before you lecture me on Scottish politics Agricola. :rolleyes
Be so kind as to indicate what it was I said that wasn't factual.I already have.
QuoteBe so kind as to indicate what it was I said that wasn't factual.I already have.
You appear to have repeated everything that I said, so your facts must be right. Well done ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/Smileys/efocicon/smile.gif[/url])
QuoteYou appear to have repeated everything that I said, so your facts must be right. Well done ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/Smileys/efocicon/smile.gif[/url])
Yes I am a cunt.
Prince Philip had a car accident and his Range Rover was written off.
All that money and nothing to chauffeur it. :lol
Now that funny is really amusing ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/Smileys/efocicon/lol.gif[/url]) . It's referring to Remain trying to reverse the referendum result and damaging democracy isn't it. Nice one ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/Smileys/efocicon/thumbup.gif[/url])
VNA is Trump.
QuoteYou appear to have repeated everything that I said, so your facts must be right. Well done ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/Smileys/efocicon/smile.gif[/url])
Yes I am a cunt.
Agreed :thumbup
And no, Remain wants even more democracy :D...right up until they've reversed the referendum result. They'll suddenly be against further 'democracy' after that ;)
And of course I think what the cartoonist is pointing out is that the USA is not the only country that the whole world is laugthing at.I'm not surprised they're laughing at The UK. They can't believe that there's such a concerted attempt to overturn the legitimate result of the referendum. They don't expect that in one of the bastions of democracy.
I'm not surprised they're laughing at The UK. They can't believe that there's such a concerted attempt to overturn the legitimate result of the referendum. They don't expect that in one of the bastions of democracy.But both the government and the main opposition are trying to deliver BREXIT.
There is nothing "free" about trade through the EU
The EU represents 25% of global GPD, it's right on our doorstep, we have a further 50 odd free trade deals via the EU round the globe, and what does the UK want to do? It wants to walk away.
There is nothing "free" about trade through the EUWould you care to explain? :rolleyes
Really ! 69 pages in and you don't realise that we have to pay to be in the trading club.QuoteThere is nothing "free" about trade through the EUWould you care to explain? :rolleyes
mtread is definitely living in an alternative reality to the rest of usIndeed I am. It's called 'the real world' :lol
Right so the £9billion (Net) we pay to the EU is just for Junkers wine cellar thenThe government’s own forecasts say that growth over the next 15 years without a deal will be 10% lower than it would otherwise have been.
rightly or wrongly, some things go beyond the facts and figures mate. I'd vote leave regardless of any of it, And so would a lot of remainers I guess.And that is beyond me. What you are saying is that you want to be poorer. What you are saying is that with our NHS we will need to decide who will live and who will die.
Being part of the UK union brings significant benefits to the economy of Scotland, but you want to leave that.
We should be working together, helping each other for our mutual success, in harmony for the good of us all, not pulling apart. Tssk, bloomin isolationists :rolleyes .
Quoterightly or wrongly, some things go beyond the facts and figures mate. I'd vote leave regardless of any of it, And so would a lot of remainers I guess.And that is beyond me. What you are saying is that you want to be poorer. What you are saying is that with our NHS we will need to decide who will live and who will die.
No, thats what you are saying.. I am saying I think we will be better off in the long run. Your letting your hatred of England fuel your anger, which I kinda get, but if you let that rage turn you into some sort of left wing fascist, then there is no arguing with you, because you refuse to recognise that people are allowed to think differently to you.
Apart from food prices, how about imported food availability? Held up because of additional Customs controls?
Oh dear, here we go, another scare tactic, no food on the supermarket shelves :z
and the next one will be the lights going out :)
No, that’s what you are saying.. I am saying I think we will be better off in the long run.But here’s what you actually said.
rightly or wrongly, some things go beyond the facts and figures mate. I'd vote leave regardless of any of it, And so would a lot of remainers I guess.What you are saying is that you don’t care about the facts and figures. The facts and figures are quite clear, the economic experts are in agreement. The economic benefit of EU membership is clear.
Your letting your hatred of England fuel your angerI have no hatred of England. None whatsoever. But when people say they don’t care, we don’t give a shit about the facts and figures, we’ve had enough of experts, we just wanna wreck the economy, well yeah I get pissed off. Like I said in another thread it really fuckin gets my goat.
But none of this matters....... because (apparently) us Remainers are going to 'steal Brexit'I've no doubt whatsoever that Brexit is going to get stolen from us.
you are certainly not going to get the 'No Deal' version you mistakenly assume 52% voted for.I don't recall any talk of 'deals' when we voted to leave the EU in the 2016 referendum. I assumed we would just come out and that's it.
There will be a deal of some sort with the EU, however much you might whinge about it.We won't even be that lucky. The arch Remainers will settle for nothing less than a total reversal of Brexit. There will be another referendum and Remain will most likely win it because a significant number of Leavers won't bother turning out again due to being ignored in the first one.
I am saying I think we will be better off in the long run.But based on what?
And youse wonder why some of us who want to stay are just a bit pissed off :lol
How about telling us a good reason why scotland should leave the UK
Not one BREXITEER foccer has come up with one single good reason for leaving the EU.
How about telling us a good reason why scotland should leave the UK
I don't recall any talk of 'deals' when we voted to leave the EU in the 2016 referendum. I assumed we would just come out and that's it.And there you have exactly summed up the current problem. The box on the paper said 'Leave'. It should have said 'Leave and then what?' It certainly didn't say 'Leave with no deal' whatever people's assumptions are now. I distinctly remember the Leave campaigns making a big point that it would be 'easy to do a trade deal with the EU once we have left'. Talk of a 'Norway style arrangement' and that the EU would be begging us for a deal.
I wonder what would happen if because of apathy and there is a low turn out and 10 million vote to stay and 9 million vote to leave. That would mean the 10 million to stay has over ridden the 17 million who wanted to leave.
I don't recall any talk of 'deals' when we voted to leave the EU in the 2016 referendum. I assumed we would just come out and that's it.Yup, people actually thought the next day we had left the EU.
They'd come out with all this guff about how the original result was invalid because 'Leave didn't know what they were voting for'Hmmmm.
So VNA wants scotland to leave the UK because a politician tricked his fellow scots to vote to stay. ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/Smileys/efocicon/rolleyes.gif[/url])Because of your one track mind and xenophobia you cannot see the similarities of your reasons to leave the UK and that of the leave the EU side.
I voted YES in 2014 because of a lifetime of governments we in Scotland did not vote for.
I voted YES becuase I've seen the impact of decades of neo liberal politics.
I voted YES becuase I wanted Scotland to be always have membership of the EU.
I voted YES in 2014 because of a lifetime of governments we in Scotland did not vote for.
Because of your one track mind and xenophobia you cannot see the similarities of your reasons to leave the UK and that of the leave the EU side.No I can't. But that is probably because there are none.
One thing though who told you that a no vote would guarantee that you remained in the EU.The president of the European Commission, Jose Manuel Barroso at the time said: "If one part of a country wants to become an independent state, of course as an independent state it has to apply for European membership according to the rules - that is obvious."Yes Better Together. The opinion Jose Manuel Barroso and a small number of others was used to try persaude Scots to vote NO.
OPINION :eek :rolleyes :rolleyes of the The president of the European Commission --- him you mean.QuoteBecause of your one track mind and xenophobia you cannot see the similarities of your reasons to leave the UK and that of the leave the EU side.No I can't. But that is probably because there are none.QuoteOne thing though who told you that a no vote would guarantee that you remained in the EU.The president of the European Commission, Jose Manuel Barroso at the time said: "If one part of a country wants to become an independent state, of course as an independent state it has to apply for European membership according to the rules - that is obvious."Yes Better Together. The opinion Jose Manuel Barroso and a small number of others was used to try persaude Scots to vote NO.
But that is probably because there are none.Proof that you are totally blinded by your own xenophobia.
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DxXOiulXQAES6af.jpg)
OPINION :eek :rolleyes :rolleyes of the The president of the European Commission --- him you mean.QuoteBecause of your one track mind and xenophobia you cannot see the similarities of your reasons to leave the UK and that of the leave the EU side.No I can't. But that is probably because there are none.QuoteOne thing though who told you that a no vote would guarantee that you remained in the EU.The president of the European Commission, Jose Manuel Barroso at the time said: "If one part of a country wants to become an independent state, of course as an independent state it has to apply for European membership according to the rules - that is obvious."Yes Better Together. The opinion Jose Manuel Barroso and a small number of others was used to try persaude Scots to vote NO.QuoteBut that is probably because there are none.Proof that you are totally blinded by your own xenophobia.
I bet you wish you had your own Tommy (Robertson ) to fight for scotland.
Just go ahead and post a few cartoons and it will all be ok
I'll have you know his proper title is HIS EXCELLENCY, THE PRESIDENT OF THE EUROPEAN UNION. I kid you not
end of discussionUnlikely ;)
When it comes to telling lies I'm surprised the Remainers pants haven't self combusted
as heated as this discussion gets, its good nobody actually falls out with anybody good and proper on this thread. at the end of the day we are all just blokes with our own opinions (and opinions as we all know are just like arseholes, we all got em) ...if we was all in the pub talking about it we'd all end just laughing it off and taking the piss out of each other. Nothing would be resolved lol. personally speaking, all this talk of the lies the leave camp told is immaterial, ive wanted to leave the eu for as long as I can remember. if that makes me imperialist, then I guess I am. Its a badge i'll wear with pride as much as resignation. we are what we are fellers..
Ex RAF Stuart Thomson of Veterans for Europe "BREXIT is the single most cowardly thing this country has ever done"
Meanwhile the Brexit rats leave the sinking ship as Dyson announces he is moving his head office to Singapore :(Highly unlikely that has anything to do with Brexit. He moved his entire manufacturing operation to Malaysia in 2002 so it was only a matter of time.
He clearly has the UK's interests at heart.....No he doesn't......but neither have lots of UK companies for a long time...... this is not something new.
None of these are anything to do with Brexit......it's all down to saving money with cheaper labour.And certainly, BREXIT will make UK labour cheaper with a weak pound and high unemployment. The Tory party of course dream of a low wage economy.
I saw in the news that car insurance is going up and one of the reasons quoted was brexit. Hows - that then.I think there are a lot of people / companies using brexit as an excuse to hike prices.
Meanwhile the Brexit rats leave the sinking ship as Dyson announces he is moving his head office to Singapore :(I see it differently It makes sense to move closer to their biggest customers which is the Asian market, it is part of Brexit that we look beyond the EU to wider global market. Its only the corporate headquarters a few people moving and he will still be paying UK tax, the company also employs 4,500 people in the UK and has a research and development in the UK, relocating the HQ will not lead to job cuts in the UK, Dyson has insisted.
Yes Fazersharp....A Henry all day long.:rollin But watch out or you will trigger the snowflakes with your racial stereotyping of names
And just to show that us Bexiteers are not racist.....I've given mine a makeover. :D
He is investing in the UK. Its only a few top brass moving to Singapore as far as I can tellYup by moving manufactuering and then the company headquaters to Singapore.
He moved his entire manufacturing operation to Malaysia in 2002That was 17 years ago. 14 years before the referendum. 5 years into a Labour government.
Only if you tell us which bit of Dyson is 'investing in the UK', and why Brexiteers listened to Jeremy Dyson (or Tim Martin for that matter) in the first place.Think you mean James Dyson. :rolleyes
Only if you tell us which bit of Dyson is 'investing in the UK', and why Brexiteers listened to Jeremy Dyson (or Tim Martin for that matter) in the first place.I thought there'd be a catch :rolleyes .
Only if you tell us which bit of Dyson is 'investing in the UK', and why Brexiteers listened to Jeremy Dyson (or Tim Martin for that matter) in the first place.Will this do https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2017/feb/28/dyson-shrugs-off-brexit-fears-with-massive-uk-expansion-plan (https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2017/feb/28/dyson-shrugs-off-brexit-fears-with-massive-uk-expansion-plan)
You seem to be oblivious to political events in Scotland, perhaps you're focusing too hard on events here. Let me enlighten you. The First Minister of Scotland is facing a misconduct investigation for holding a series of meetings with a former First Minister of Scotland, who was recently under investigation himself, but has been successful in his judicial review of the allegations made against him. Why the First Minister felt the need to claim these meetings were unofficial, when government officials were present, at here home, has yet to be revealed.
This one still has some mileage to go yet. Cant wait :lol
Oh, and do try and keep up ;)
This one still has some mileage to go yet. Cant wait :lolThat was the only bit you got right agricola. :lol
QuoteYou seem to be oblivious to political events in Scotland, perhaps you're focusing too hard on events here. Let me enlighten you. The First Minister of Scotland is facing a misconduct investigation for holding a series of meetings with a former First Minister of Scotland, who was recently under investigation himself, but has been successful in his judicial review of the allegations made against him. Why the First Minister felt the need to claim these meetings were unofficial, when government officials were present, at here home, has yet to be revealed.
This one still has some mileage to go yet. Cant wait :lol
Oh, and do try and keep up ;)
As I pointed out previously the judicial review brought by Mr Salmond was in respect of the government being in breach of it’s own procedures in their investigation of allegations made against him. It was not as you said a review of the actual allegations made against him.QuoteThis one still has some mileage to go yet. Cant wait :lolThat was the only bit you got right agricola. :lol
Former Scottish First Minister Alex Salmond arrested - https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-46984747 (https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-46984747)
Yes this one could run for a wee while. :eek
Not right to comment further till after the trial.Ah shit....You had to go and say it, didn't you. :lol
Nope, I was absolutely bang on, it was a review of the allegations, not an inquiry of the allegations.Nope sorry you don't have a clue. :lol
QuoteNope, I was absolutely bang on, it was a review of the allegations, not an inquiry of the allegations.Nope sorry I don't have a clue. :lol
Re: Just for VNA a brexit thread ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/index.php/topic,24678.msg291241.html#msg291241[/url]) « Reply #1804 on: Today at 07:51:17 PM »Quote<blockquote>Nope, I was absolutely bang on, it was a review of the allegations, not an inquiry of the allegations.</blockquote>
- Quote ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/index.php?action=post;quote=291241;topic=24678.1800;last_msg=291247[/url])
- Modify ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/index.php?action=post;msg=291241;topic=24678.1800[/url])
Nope sorry you don't have a clue. ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/Smileys/efocicon/lol.gif[/url])
a former First Minister of Scotland, who was recently under investigation himself, but has been successful in his judicial review of the allegations made against him.
QuoteRe: Just for VNA a brexit thread ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/index.php/topic,24678.msg291241.html#msg291241[/url]) « Reply #1804 on: Today at 07:51:17 PM »Quote<blockquote>Nope, I was absolutely bang on, it was a review of the allegations, not an inquiry of the allegations.</blockquote>
- Quote ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/index.php?action=post;quote=291241;topic=24678.1800;last_msg=291247[/url])
- Modify ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/index.php?action=post;msg=291241;topic=24678.1800[/url])
QuoteNope sorry you don't have a clue. ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/Smileys/efocicon/lol.gif[/url])
Agricola, Mr Salmond quit the SNP and brought a legal action against the government. It was a judicial review into government procedure. Mr Salmond alleged that the government did not correctly implement it’s own investigative procedures. He won his case.
You stated,Quotea former First Minister of Scotland, who was recently under investigation himself, but has been successful in his judicial review of the allegations made against him.
There has been no judicial review into the allegations made against Mr Salmond.
lol now thats foccing funny... :lol :lolNot right to comment further till after the trial.Ah shit....You had to go and say it, didn't you. :lol
Mr Salmond initiated a judicial review which found that the Scottish Govt, as you correctly stated, cocked up.He resinged from the SNP. He then brought a judical review against the government. His complaint was that they did not correctly follow their own proceedure. He won.
Yet the 'stupid woman' is still not listening
Yet the 'stupid woman' is still not listening
If everybody knows that No Deal isn't going to happen, how can it be a negotiating position?Yeah I too would like to know how that makes sense.
If everybody knows that No Deal isn't going to happen, how can it be a negotiating position? Or are the Tory MPs who need to be won over that stupid?
Tim complains about EU laws, but guess what, just like the BREXIT foccers here, he can’t name one law he opposes.
They do name them, but you're the self appointed judge and jury of whether those answers are acceptable and lo and behold, you dismiss them all.
I can refuse to accept that it will get dark this evening. Don't make it true tho ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/Smileys/efocicon/rolleyes.gif[/url])
just like the BREXIT foccers here, he can’t name one law he opposes.
VNA asked me to name ONE law I did not like and so gave the DRLs because IMO it negativity effects the safety and visibility of us bikers. VNA keeps deriding my view.just like the BREXIT foccers here, he can’t name one law he opposes.
If someone names a law they oppose, and you don't oppose that law, you declare that they haven't answered!. That's plain bonkers. You might disagree with their view point as is your right, but it's still an answer.
fazersharp dislikes DRL on cars. That's an answer to your question. Because you disagree you declare that it isn't an answer!.
How can ANYONE debate against reasoning like that?!
If someone names a law they oppose,So tell me what laws Tim Martin named.
fazersharp dislikes DRL on carsDon't remember that being written on the side of a bus. Someone should have told Boris :lol
Yes he's a lefty. Why is that a problem?
QuoteIf someone names a law they oppose,So tell me what laws Tim Martin named.
Indeed, correct answer.Thanks :D . I like it. If you disagree with the question/request/answer, then pretend it doesn't exist. Cheers for the top tip :thumbup .
Thanks ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/Smileys/efocicon/cheesy.gif[/url]) . I like it. If you disagree with the question/request/answer, then pretend it doesn't exist. Cheers for the top tip ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/Smileys/efocicon/thumbup.gif[/url]) .
QuoteThanks ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/Smileys/efocicon/cheesy.gif[/url]) . I like it. If you disagree with the question/request/answer, then pretend it doesn't exist. Cheers for the top tip ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/Smileys/efocicon/thumbup.gif[/url]) .
Ca you show me, or perhaps name the EU law, that when asked, Mr Martin said he objected to?
Ca you show me, or perhaps name the EU law, that when asked, Mr Martin said he objected to?
:dealIndeed, correct answer.Thanks :D . I like it. If you disagree with the question/request/answer, then pretend it doesn't exist. Cheers for the top tip :thumbup .
There's no point in naming any EU laws/rules/regulations that we object to, because you'll just start antoher session of why you think those laws are beneficial, and how stupid we Leavers are. I've said it before, I'll say it again, you always seek confrontation and disagreement, you know whats best for everyone even if they don't want it, always looking to have the last word. Are you a woman? ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/Smileys/efocicon/lol.gif[/url]) . Everytime I read your posts, I see an image of the treasoner Soubry
Quote<blockquote>Thanks . I like it. If you disagree with the question/request/answer, then pretend it doesn't exist. Cheers for the top tip .</blockquote>Is that nope. No. Indeed Mr Martin could not come up with a single EU law he objected to.
Ca you show me, or perhaps name the EU law, that when asked, Mr Martin said he objected to?
No he doesn't name a specific EU lawNow that wasn't too difficult, was it. :lol
Well you'd have to be daft to say otherwise.But
They do name them,Yes, you had a daft moment. :lol
In that 'interview' he doesn't name a specific law that he objects to for sure.He tries but fails. He doesn't know of any.
Yes he's a lefty. Why is that a problem?No. As long as it's law abiding.
Some people hold law abiding Conservative views. Is that a problem?.
I don't understand why 'lefty' was being used as an insult :rolleyes
Just watched the interview.It's excellant, isn't it?
Oh dear oh dear you are so blinkered by anything that is not on the left that you have completely missed it. The insult levied wasn't calling him a lefty, it was calling him "little" so quick to be triggered - is it cold in here - I think I have just seen a snowflake.O yes, 5 times in one paragraph :rolleyes . So, what have you got against little people, or are you using a random insult generator? :)
Its just been announced that Dyson is the 3rd highest tax payer in the UK at £127.8M.I think you mean 'was' the 3rd highest tax payers. Not when his HQ is in Singapore he won't be.
Its just been announced that Dyson is the 3rd highest tax payer in the UK at £127.8M.That is as an individual.
Like I pointed out earlier he is still a UK tax payer.And if resident in the UK will continue to be so. However, as a majority shareholder in Dyson, his tax bill in the UK will now be slashed as his company has moved to Singapore.
What is strange is that remainers seem to rejoice if a company says they are moving and if that move is damaging then better it is in their eyes.Just because we are correct, does not mean to say we take any pleasure in job losses etc, after all we are just as likely to lose our jobs a result of BREXIT as anybody else. Nor do I take any pleasure whatsoever in being poorer as a result of the BREXIT referendum – I can assure you!
After a NO deal we will be free to create more competitive environments than the EU has.I think we would be better trying to get the great many companies who dodge their taxes to actually pay them, rather than drop the rates that so many don’t pay. Of course the EU is already looking at legislation aimed at stopping companies from ducking their tax obligations. Which of course is one of the reasons that the super rich like Jacob Rees-Mogg want out.
In or out these companies do not care about the man on the streetSome do, some don’t. However, their legal obligation is to their shareholders. They also exist to make a profit, and indeed can only survive and succeed in the long term if they turn a profit. At the end of the day if there was a NO DEAL BREXIT (still a possibility, albeit an increasingly remote one) companies like Toyota, Honda, Nissan will leave the UK along with a host of other manufacturing companies. The reason companies like Toyota, Honda and Nissan came to the UK was to avoid import quotas and tariffs. They set up shop here so they could manufacture inside the EU single market.
What is strange is that remainers seem to rejoice if a company says they are moving and if that move is damaging then better it is in their eyes.When/if all their hope is lost and the UK leaves the EU (and it's still a BIG if IMHO) they'd happily lock the steering to dead ahead, jam the throttle wide open and set warp factor 10 for the centre of the sun as far as the economy is concerned.
'Rejoice' also isn't the right word. You mean 'Despair' with a hint of 'I told you so'.If/when the UK leaves The EU, do you hope the economy defies your predictions and succeeds, going from strength to strength?.
The reason companies like Toyota, Honda and Nissan came to the UK was to avoid import quotas and tariffs. They set up shop here so they could manufacture inside the EU single market.So why did they choose the UK over any other EU state in the first place.
So why did they choose the UK over any other EU state in the first place.The key thing for them was unrestricted single market access. No more import restrictions and no more tariffs. Other manufactures of course have chosen other EU countries.
What is strange is that remainers seem to rejoice if a company says they are moving and if that move is damaging then better it is in their eyes.REMAINERS do not want to see these jobs go. The BREXITEERS however don’t give a shit. Read again the most optimistic of the very very few economists that think BREXIT is a good idea. Professor Minford states quite clearly that in the event of a NO DEAL BREXIT wage inequality will increase and UK manufacturing will all but cease to exist.
What is strange is that remainers seem to rejoice if a company says they are moving and if that move is damaging then better it is in their eyes.
Because of our very slack labour laws and destruction of the unions?So the reason these companies had come here is because of our slack labour laws and yet you site that after a brexit the labour laws will be slacker which will make the UK more attractive to companies, you seem to be using the same argument to cover everything just like labour has "spent" the reversing the cuts in capital gains tax 10 times over.
QuoteSo why did they choose the UK over any other EU state in the first place.The key thing for them was unrestricted single market access. No more import restrictions and no more tariffs. Other manufactures of course have chosen other EU countries.
I don’t know precisely why they choose the UK, but I certainly welcome it. I do know we had skilled workers, and plenty of people in general looking for work. I would guess there would be government incentives. The stability of the pound would be attractive, and despite exporting much of the produce the strength of the pound, as a high proportion of the components are imported. Further the guarantee of single union agreements was key.
What the Japanese did prove though without a doubt, was the problem with the old UK manufacturers was the management, not the workforce.
But don’t think they are kidding when they say they will consider leaving if there is not a suitable BREXIT deal. Leave they will. And on top of the 10’s of thousands of jobs provided by these big manufacturers are 10’s of thousands of jobs in supporting industries.QuoteWhat is strange is that remainers seem to rejoice if a company says they are moving and if that move is damaging then better it is in their eyes.REMAINERS do not want to see these jobs go. The BREXITEERS however don’t give a shit. Read again the most optimistic of the very very few economists that think BREXIT is a good idea. Professor Minford states quite clearly that in the event of a NO DEAL BREXIT wage inequality will increase and UK manufacturing will all but cease to exist.QuoteWhat is strange is that remainers seem to rejoice if a company says they are moving and if that move is damaging then better it is in their eyes.
So again, it’s what you want. The rest of us would like to keep our jobs and our wealth thanks.
Or as I am begining to feel, the BREXITEERS don't have a fucking clue what they want, but they sure as fuck know how to get it.
So the reason these companies had come here is because of our slack labour laws and yet you site that after a brexit the labour laws will be slacker which will make the UK more attractive to companies,
The slack labour laws were never my argument - they were yours and I am pointing out that on one hand you (Mtread) say companies have come here because of slack laws and then on the other you say that laws will be slacker after a brexit. Mtread was pointing out the companies leaving and I asked why they came in the first place and he said because of slack labour laws so if you maintain that labour laws will be slacker after brexit then proof that they will not be is that the companies are choosing to leave that first came here because of slack laws.QuoteSo the reason these companies had come here is because of our slack labour laws and yet you site that after a brexit the labour laws will be slacker which will make the UK more attractive to companies,
Why don’t we re-introduce slavery? That might attack a few investors. I guess it’s a matter of how low you BREXITEERS want to go Fazersharp.
Thought the truth is as I explained, they came here for a multitude of reasons. But if they do not maintain quota free and tarriff free access to the market, including continued free import of parts and labour they will pack up and manufactuer elsewhere.
The slack labour laws were never my argument - they were yours and I am pointing out that on one hand youNot my arguement. I'm a trade unionist.
But if they do not maintain quota free and tarriff free access to the market, including continued free import of parts and labour they will pack up and manufactuer elsewhere.By free import of labour you mean CHEAP labour from poor countries who to them a low wage is a rich man's wage. That part of the EU is totally dysfunctional - in their quest to ever expand they have welcomed countries who are not financially ready.
QuoteSo the reason these companies had come here is because of our slack labour laws and yet you site that after a brexit the labour laws will be slacker which will make the UK more attractive to companies,
Why don’t we re-introduce slavery? That might attack a few investors. I guess it’s a matter of how low you BREXITEERS want to go Fazersharp.
If your case was as strong as you believe Remain would have walked it but they didn't did they.Indeed, why did people ignore the facts and vote to LEAVE. Beat the hell out of me.
Yes they were in your arguments against brexitQuoteThe slack labour laws were never my argument - they were yours and I am pointing out that on one hand youNot my arguement. I'm a trade unionist.
By free import of labour you mean CHEAP labour from poor countries who to them a low wage is a rich man's wage.No in the case of Nissan, Toyota etc, it's the ability to move between plants and manufactuerers (suppliers). This is generally at an engineering level. It's also the ability to recruit engineers from the EU as a whole.
Yes they were in your arguments against brexitNo it's not an arguement I would make. I am all for trade unions and labour rights.
what the fuck is wrong with the English.
I had a long conversation with a friend in Wales about this. We came up with the following;
It’s the low wage economy. The millions working for people like Tim Martin, on the minimum wage,
Remember Gordon Brown (the worst chancellor in British history and another cunt) – no more boom and bust. Gordon adored Fred Goodwin and friends. The people paid kings ransoms for their expertise –
what the fuck is wrong with the English.Racist remark
It’s the low wage economy.Brought about by the import of cheap labour from eastern EU states. which you welcome
Gordon adored Fred Goodwin and friends. The people paid kings ransoms for their expertise –Brexiters have been telling you leavers not to believe the "experts" for ages, funny how you pick and choose which ones you want to belive.
That's why is said they were in your arguments AGAINST brexit ------ one too many of the yellow poison me thinks, stick another log on your croft farm open fire and another ice in your glass.QuoteYes they were in your arguments against brexitNo it's not an arguement I would make. I am all for trade unions and labour rights.
That's why is said they were in your arguments AGAINST brexit ------ one too many of the yellow poison me thinks, stick another log on your croft farm open fire and another ice in your glass.Stove actually. Yes getting cold, more logs on!
I thought that France has even worse labour laws ? and yet you want to be closer to them and you want to harmonise our laws ever more with them by being in the EU. Who has said workers rights would be diminished by brexit.QuoteThat's why is said they were in your arguments AGAINST brexit ------ one too many of the yellow poison me thinks, stick another log on your croft farm open fire and another ice in your glass.Stove actually. Yes getting cold, more logs on!
Yes, yes, yes, silly me, of course. The Tories will cancel numerous Labour laws, such as the working time directive etc etc, if we leave the EU.
I thought that France has even worse labour laws ? and yet you want to be closer to them and you want to harmonise our laws ever more with them by being in the EU. Who has said workers rights would be diminished by brexit.
Wouldn't it be better for you and your trade union cause to be free of the EU and to be able to fully decide on our own laws/ legislation / workers rights that fully fits our needs.Our trade union cause. Trade unions are for all. Trade unions exist for the benefit of us all, including business. The EU is the biggest single free trading market in the world. It accounts for 25% of global GDP. It’s on our door step. We cannot afford to ignore it. It’s pretty obvious that to have such a massive and open trade arrangement, without restriction and tariff, you have to then have common standards. Trade Unionists are not by nature isolationist, we believe in rights for all, not just in the UK, not just across the EU, but ultimately common rights and standards across the globe.
By remaining in the EU you are further away from getting what you want regarding workers rights I would of thought.The dream of the Tory party is a zero hours low wage economy.
Hasn't the working time directive been agreed by the EU and we have to implement it ?
hopefully with a few tweaks and a bit of cooperation from Brussels, May's deal will now get the approval of Parliament.
So by those two statements you have backed up what the brexiters have been saying all along about the EU. You say that "The policy was negotiated with and agreed by the UK" but clearly the UK government did not fully agree with it but still we had to implement it ---- just like many of the other UK legislations that you like to point out were agreed by the UK when brexiteers say we dont like the EU legislation. Proof that we did not fully agree with it in your next sentence "Back in 2015 David Cameron tried to negotiate out of the working time directive." . Also brexiters have been saying that you can not negotiate with the EU as you have demonstrated.If you don't like the Tories then stop voting for them - I believe the phrase is
The dream of the Tory party is a zero hours low wage economy.QuoteHasn't the working time directive been agreed by the EU and we have to implement it ?
We are the EU. The policy was negotiated with and agreed by the UK along with all the other member states. The EU is a democracy after all, and one which works on the principle of consensus.
The Tories will of course aim to scrap the working time directive all with all the other EU work place legislation. Back in 2015 David Cameron tried to negotiate out of the working time directive. Mr Cameron also tried to scrap laws granting agency workers the same pay and rights as full time employees.
So I would say that if you want change then its easier to vote for and change a single countries government than it is to change their "Excellencies" in the EU
The people get the government they deserve.
We will have to abide by EU rules but have no say whatsoever in them.Like we do now -- this is what leavers have been saying when the remainers say we will have no say in EU laws if we leave. We don't have an effective say now and don't quote our veto because to my knowledge it has never been used.
We will no longer be the rule makers, we will simply become rule takers.its a fallacy to think that within the EU we are the rule makers to any degree that suits our needs
Trade Unionists are not by nature isolationist, we believe in rights for all, not just in the UK, not just across the EU, but ultimately common rights and standards across the globe.The whole of the EU is an isolationist, protectionist racket that is destroying Countries like Africa with its tariffs - how does that fit in with your rights for all across the globe.
You say that "The policy was negotiated with and agreed by the UK" but clearly the UK government did not fully agree with it but still we had to implement it ---- just like many of the other UK legislations that you like to point out were agreed by the UK when brexiteers say we dont like the EU legislation. Proof that we did not fully agree with it in your next sentence "Back in 2015 David Cameron tried to negotiate out of the working time directive." . Also brexiters have been saying that you can not negotiate with the EU as you have demonstrated.If you don't like the Tories then stop voting for them - I believe the phrase is
ive honestly yet to see an anti Brexit cartoon thats actually funny lol. now this on the other hand...
Mtread was pointing out the companies leaving and I asked why they came in the first place and he said because of slack labour laws so if you maintain that labour laws will be slacker after brexit then proof that they will not be is that the companies are choosing to leave that first came here because of slack laws.It wasn't a statement. I posed it as a question, which you obviously or conveniently missed!
ive honestly yet to see an anti Brexit cartoon thats actually funny lol. now this on the other hand...I never download files form forums, sorry. But how about this. Made me chuckle. :lol
But why choose the uk over any other countries. If it was not because our laws are slacker than the rest of the EU then what was it that made them choose us over anywhere else.QuoteMtread was pointing out the companies leaving and I asked why they came in the first place and he said because of slack labour laws so if you maintain that labour laws will be slacker after brexit then proof that they will not be is that the companies are choosing to leave that first came here because of slack laws.
Quite clearly the main reason they are in the UK is because of our custom union and single market membership. Both of which you want us to lose.
But why choose the uk over any other countries.All you need to know is that if we are outside of the single market and the customs union they will leave.
A cast of the raw crankshaft – the part of the car that translates the movement of the pistons into the rotational motion required to move the vehicle – is made by a supplier based in France.https://www.theguardian.com/business/2017/mar/03/brexit-uk-car-industry-mini-britain-eu (https://www.theguardian.com/business/2017/mar/03/brexit-uk-car-industry-mini-britain-eu)
From there it is shipped to BMW’s Hams Hall plant in Warwickshire, where it is drilled and milled into shape. When that job is complete, each crankshaft is then sent back across the Channel to Munich, where it inserted into the engine.
From Munich, it is back to the Mini plant in Oxford, where the engine is then “married” with the car.
If the car is to be sold on the continent then the crankshaft, inside the finished motor, will cross the Channel for a fourth time.
Same with the Triumph factory in Hinckley. Crankshaft blanks made in Spain, finished in Hinckley. Petrol tanks made in Italy, painted in Hinckley. Etc etc.
Bikes crated up complete and shipped to the EU.
All dependent on free movement and tariff free.
BTW have you seen the new Rocket 3? ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/Smileys/efocicon/smile.gif[/url])
The crankshaft of the BMW Mini, which is the bit which transmits the power of the engine to the wheels, crosses the English Channel three times while the car is being made. It is cast in France; it goes to a plant in Warwickshire to be milled and finished. It is then shipped to BMW’s plant in Germany where the engine is assembled and comes back as part of that whole unit to be fitted into the car at the BMW plant near Oxford. When it is exported to Europe, as very many of these cars are, it crosses the Channel for a fourth time.https://www.standard.co.uk/business/anthony-hilton-why-brexit-will-sink-the-uk-s-car-industry-a3587236.html (https://www.standard.co.uk/business/anthony-hilton-why-brexit-will-sink-the-uk-s-car-industry-a3587236.html)
This is the reality of modern sophisticated manufacturing. Three channel crossings is actually quite modest for a component. Some go back and forth much more.
You could tell a similar story about Bentley, Jaguar Land Rover or about the wings of the Airbus aircraft which are made here (though the plane as a whole is assembled in Toulouse) about much of the output of Rolls-Royce or Bae Systems, the pillar of the UK defence industry.
We don’t have nearly enough world-class manufacturing to support our exports, but what we do have is heavily dependent on key components from the rest of the European Union. This business arrangement becomes totally uneconomic if we do not continue to have free trade but instead had to pay the common EU tariff of 10%. Most of the components industry operates on a profit margin of between 5% and 10% so it would become unprofitable overnight.
And if a supplier upped prices to compensate for the tariff it would be uncompetitive. There would also be a huge additional cost in time and paperwork because the component would be subject to customs checks each time it crossed the border.
Nissan’s Sunderland car plant produces two cars a minute and uses upwards of five million components a day on its production line. The whole exercise is done on a just-in-time basis, parts are not stored in warehouses, they go straight in their container to the position on the production line where they are needed. More crucially, to avoid congestion, they have to arrive hours and sometimes minutes before they are needed. So any delay at customs on any of the five million components, almost as trivial as an official coming late back from lunch or leaving early to collect his or her child from school, could easily bring production to a halt.
Because this has the potential to destroy the profitability of the British car industry, there is brave talk about getting the components suppliers to set up plants in the UK, and the Government at one point seemed willing to subsidise such a move with taxpayers’ money. From a business point of view though it does not make sense. If more than half the components come from overseas, which they do, then it is cheaper and simpler to move the assembly factory out of Britain, not the component suppliers here.
And that is not the only problem: a detailed investigation this year by The Guardian reported that only 41% of what goes into the cars made in Britain is sourced here. This complicates the trade deals which are supposed to provide an alternative to the EU when we leave because these normally demand that what we export is in fact made in this country.
This is to prevent the UK trade deal being used as a Trojan horse by every other nation which could otherwise funnel their exports through us to gain access to these other markets. Thus the “rules of origin” for the EU’s deal with South Korea says specifically that 55% of the car parts must be sourced locally to qualify for free trade. A similar deal between us and South Korea would mean none of our cars were eligible.
Given cars are one of the few products we do export, this presents a bit of a challenge for International Trade Secretary Liam Fox and his department, which supposedly exists to make the deals on which Britain’s future will depend. Some wag suggested the grand plan was to take the other side out to lunch and persuade them to pretend that the EU counts as part of the UK in terms of sourcing. Why the other side would want to do this or accept it is less clear.
The brutal fact is that if we lose tariff-free access to the single market it will be disastrous for luxury British manufacturing.
Business knows this; the EU knows this; the rest of the world knows this — which is why so many of them have shelved all future plans to invest in the UK. But does the Government get it? Prime Minister Theresa May does not seem to but that is probably because she has spent the past 12 months refusing to talk to anyone who does not already agree with her and share her Fifties worldview.
In contrast, the ministers more closely involved with Brexit probably do get it, but don’t care or don’t want to admit it, because pointing out any of the disastrous consequences of Brexit will scupper their chances of being the next leader of the Conservative party.
This is the real reason business leaders have such withering contempt for the Government and are in despair about the future of business in the next few years, however cheerful they try to appear in public.
It takes more than last week’s publicity stunt of a meeting in Chevening to make a lasting impression on a Government where too many ministers appear willing to put self-interest and party interest before the national interest.
QuoteSo why did they choose the UK over any other EU state in the first place.The key thing for them was unrestricted single market access. No more import restrictions and no more tariffs. Other manufactures of course have chosen other EU countries.
I don’t know precisely why they choose the UK, but I certainly welcome it. I do know we had skilled workers, and plenty of people in general looking for work. I would guess there would be government incentives. The stability of the pound would be attractive, and despite exporting much of the produce the strength of the pound, as a high proportion of the components are imported. Further the guarantee of single union agreements was key.
What the Japanese did prove though without a doubt, was the problem with the old UK manufacturers was the management, not the workforce.
But don’t think they are kidding when they say they will consider leaving if there is not a suitable BREXIT deal. Leave they will. And on top of the 10’s of thousands of jobs provided by these big manufacturers are 10’s of thousands of jobs in supporting industries.QuoteWhat is strange is that remainers seem to rejoice if a company says they are moving and if that move is damaging then better it is in their eyes.REMAINERS do not want to see these jobs go. The BREXITEERS however don’t give a shit. Read again the most optimistic of the very very few economists that think BREXIT is a good idea. Professor Minford states quite clearly that in the event of a NO DEAL BREXIT wage inequality will increase and UK manufacturing will all but cease to exist.QuoteWhat is strange is that remainers seem to rejoice if a company says they are moving and if that move is damaging then better it is in their eyes.
So again, it’s what you want. The rest of us would like to keep our jobs and our wealth thanks.
Or as I am begining to feel, the BREXITEERS don't have a fucking clue what they want, but they sure as fuck know how to get it.
More on the mini crankshaft;QuoteThe crankshaft of the BMW Mini, which is the bit which transmits the power of the engine to the wheels, crosses the English Channel three times while the car is being made. It is cast in France; it goes to a plant in Warwickshire to be milled and finished. It is then shipped to BMW’s plant in Germany where the engine is assembled and comes back as part of that whole unit to be fitted into the car at the BMW plant near Oxford. When it is exported to Europe, as very many of these cars are, it crosses the Channel for a fourth time.https://www.standard.co.uk/business/anthony-hilton-why-brexit-will-sink-the-uk-s-car-industry-a3587236.html (https://www.standard.co.uk/business/anthony-hilton-why-brexit-will-sink-the-uk-s-car-industry-a3587236.html)
This is the reality of modern sophisticated manufacturing. Three channel crossings is actually quite modest for a component. Some go back and forth much more.
You could tell a similar story about Bentley, Jaguar Land Rover or about the wings of the Airbus aircraft which are made here (though the plane as a whole is assembled in Toulouse) about much of the output of Rolls-Royce or Bae Systems, the pillar of the UK defence industry.
We don’t have nearly enough world-class manufacturing to support our exports, but what we do have is heavily dependent on key components from the rest of the European Union. This business arrangement becomes totally uneconomic if we do not continue to have free trade but instead had to pay the common EU tariff of 10%. Most of the components industry operates on a profit margin of between 5% and 10% so it would become unprofitable overnight.
And if a supplier upped prices to compensate for the tariff it would be uncompetitive. There would also be a huge additional cost in time and paperwork because the component would be subject to customs checks each time it crossed the border.
Nissan’s Sunderland car plant produces two cars a minute and uses upwards of five million components a day on its production line. The whole exercise is done on a just-in-time basis, parts are not stored in warehouses, they go straight in their container to the position on the production line where they are needed. More crucially, to avoid congestion, they have to arrive hours and sometimes minutes before they are needed. So any delay at customs on any of the five million components, almost as trivial as an official coming late back from lunch or leaving early to collect his or her child from school, could easily bring production to a halt.
Because this has the potential to destroy the profitability of the British car industry, there is brave talk about getting the components suppliers to set up plants in the UK, and the Government at one point seemed willing to subsidise such a move with taxpayers’ money. From a business point of view though it does not make sense. If more than half the components come from overseas, which they do, then it is cheaper and simpler to move the assembly factory out of Britain, not the component suppliers here.
And that is not the only problem: a detailed investigation this year by The Guardian reported that only 41% of what goes into the cars made in Britain is sourced here. This complicates the trade deals which are supposed to provide an alternative to the EU when we leave because these normally demand that what we export is in fact made in this country.
This is to prevent the UK trade deal being used as a Trojan horse by every other nation which could otherwise funnel their exports through us to gain access to these other markets. Thus the “rules of origin” for the EU’s deal with South Korea says specifically that 55% of the car parts must be sourced locally to qualify for free trade. A similar deal between us and South Korea would mean none of our cars were eligible.
Given cars are one of the few products we do export, this presents a bit of a challenge for International Trade Secretary Liam Fox and his department, which supposedly exists to make the deals on which Britain’s future will depend. Some wag suggested the grand plan was to take the other side out to lunch and persuade them to pretend that the EU counts as part of the UK in terms of sourcing. Why the other side would want to do this or accept it is less clear.
The brutal fact is that if we lose tariff-free access to the single market it will be disastrous for luxury British manufacturing.
Business knows this; the EU knows this; the rest of the world knows this — which is why so many of them have shelved all future plans to invest in the UK. But does the Government get it? Prime Minister Theresa May does not seem to but that is probably because she has spent the past 12 months refusing to talk to anyone who does not already agree with her and share her Fifties worldview.
In contrast, the ministers more closely involved with Brexit probably do get it, but don’t care or don’t want to admit it, because pointing out any of the disastrous consequences of Brexit will scupper their chances of being the next leader of the Conservative party.
This is the real reason business leaders have such withering contempt for the Government and are in despair about the future of business in the next few years, however cheerful they try to appear in public.
It takes more than last week’s publicity stunt of a meeting in Chevening to make a lasting impression on a Government where too many ministers appear willing to put self-interest and party interest before the national interest.
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Dx8SjKoWwAElxsn.jpg)Now that cartoon although not funny is cleaver with bananas for guns and the original snake oil - did everyone notice the Boris tumble weed ?
The last time everything was manufactured from scratch in the same factory..... the British bike industry went down the toilet.That's because the British bike industry kept all the profits and didn't reinvest anything in development and technology unlike the Japanese.
So, we now take this back to the EU to re-negotiate. And if the refuse then they will be the ones left looking like Corbin was last week after refusing to meet May.Remember this deal took two years to negotiate across 28 countries.
So we now take this back to the EU to re negotiate. And if the refuse then they will be the ones left looking like Corbin was last week after refusing to meet May.
Quote
This just looks like running the clock down.
:guitar It's the final countdown :guitar (by Europe funnily enough :lol )
Tusk and Macron immediately said NO.They better not bloody budge one inch on the backstop.
Peace in Northern Ireland is being put on a sacrificial altar by English nationalism.
Two very conflicting statements right there.QuoteTusk and Macron immediately said NO.They better not bloody budge one inch on the backstop.
So far all amendments that include a section to force the government to take no deal off the table have been thrown out. So much for MPs never allowing a NO DealYou mean apart from the Vote that ruled out No Deal :pokefun
Using the cover of the latest vote Corbin has just offered to meet May after seeing the damage his refusal did to him in the last two weeks, what a disingenuous snake that Marxist is..
They better not bloody budge one inch on the backstopAbsolutely! The EU need to show loyalty to member Ireland, not the departing UK.
Absolutely! The EU need to show loyalty to member Ireland, not the departing UK.Yes, yes,yes.
Wrong again, the first votes that were lost had in them ways to FORCE the government to rule out a no deal which is what I posted, then after I posted a vote was won on an amendment that only had within it an UNBINDING section to say the house was opposed to a no deal but they have NO power to stop one unlike the previous votes that WERE binding and were lost.QuoteSo far all amendments that include a section to force the government to take no deal off the table have been thrown out. So much for MPs never allowing a NO DealYou mean apart from the Vote that ruled out No Deal :pokefun
Time fae a giggle. I love this. And yes he is a cunt.Yes that is funny - but what is not funny is Sam Delanys News Thing, a champagne Socialist if ever there was one who broadcasts on Russian propaganda TV.
[url]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lX7VrnNuifw[/url] ([url]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lX7VrnNuifw[/url])
Yes that is funny - but what is not funny is Sam Delanys News Thing, a champagne Socialist if ever there was one who broadcasts on Russian propaganda TV.It's funny as foc. What is funnier is that he is in fact a .............
Oh and it was won by 8 votes, hardly- as you keep saying that the MPs would NEVER allow a no deal brexit.News Flash --------- They just have-------.Er they haven't. A majority is a majority. They voted an amendment that "rejects the United Kingdom leaving the EuropeanUnion without a Withdrawal Agreement and a Framework for the Future Relationship". That's by 29th March. Only Yvette Cooper's amendment was binding, not even the Brady amendment. O and 'not binding' - that was also the 2016 referendum wasn't it :)
QuoteOh and it was won by 8 votes, hardly- as you keep saying that the MPs would NEVER allow a no deal brexit.News Flash --------- They just have-------.Er they haven't. A majority is a majority.
Time fae a giggle.
That comment right there....So a majority vote suits you now
O and 'not binding' - that was also the 2016 referendum wasn't it :)
The 'stupid woman' is only concerned with keeping the Tory party together, and couldn't give a shit about what happens to the country :(
That comment right there....So a majority vote suits you now :rolleyesThe Westminster parliament is a majority parliament. The make up of the parliament does not directly relate to the how the public voted in a general election. That a government cannot get it’s business through is most unusual. And this government holds the record for the biggest defeat in the history of the parliament. :rolleyes
I like champagne socialism Champagne Socialism = champagne for the manyYes indeed. Champagne for all, breakfast, lunch, dinner and perhaps a few in the evening too. I’m all for it.
Champagne Conservativism = this champagne is for me only
:)
Champagne Socialism most definitely isn't Champagne for the many.I know what it refers to....... by people who don't understand socialism :)
It refers to a section of the middle class who outwardly advocate socialist ideals whilst not practicing it in any way, shape or form themselves. Their Champagne isn't for sharing. Another term for them would be hypocrites.
QuoteThat comment right there....So a majority vote suits you now
Yep, if you admit 52% is 'hardly' a majority :b
I've never known a 52% minority before?Indeed. Like the majority of MPs who voted out No Deal, which needs to be respected :)
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DyMONu1X0AAsXY3.jpg:large)Well that is exactly the attitude of the EU to all the included states so long as they are not Germany or France. Thank you for posting.
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DyMONu1X0AAsXY3.jpg:large)Well that is exactly the attitude of the EU to all the included states so long as they are not Germany or France. Thank you for posting.
Here's the EU and the Remainers preferred outcomes...Right now, a NO DEAL BREXIT is still a possibility. The Tory government is still trying to run the clock down. The EU single market, as you know, accounts for 25% of global GDP, we are members of that market and enjoy quota free, tariff free trade with the 27 other countries in the EU as if we were all one country.
1) Brexit reversed and the UK remains in the EU, suitably humbled and humiliated. 2) The UK leaves under the worst possible terms and the economy suffers maximum damage as punishment and retribution for having the audacity to leave.
3) Err thats it :rolleyes
I don't want No Deal. I want them to agree a deal.What! :eek :eek :eek
But the EU are being deliberately awkward and uncompromising in helping the UK to achieve that.No the UK wants a divorce from the relationship it spent some 45 years building. We had a deal, we had the best possible deal we could have.
They're hoping that all the palatable and workable options are closed off and that remaining is all that's left.I hope so. As we all know the best deal is the deal we have. However I suspect we are leaving one way or another.
How does the EU manage its border with Brazil ?
And then there is the nightmare of the Irish border.
I think its fair to say a lot of us leavers don't want no deal, but we do want it on the table to give us leverage.So again, what is it that you want?
EU wont want it either, its just who blinks first :)My opinion is the EU will not blink. Their priority is the integrity of the single market. Secondly, they will do everything within their powers to protect one of it’s members from conflict on it’s border.
I don't want No Deal.A few weeks ago all you Leavers said you wanted No Deal! Nothing else would do. O yes you did, the evidence is on this thread.
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DyMONu1X0AAsXY3.jpg:large)and yup, that cartoon sums it all up brilliantly. And I for one am done with sucking up that fellers piss..
A few weeks ago all you Leavers said you wanted No Deal! Nothing else would do. O yes you did, the evidence is on this thread.
Does that mean people are allowed to change their minds on Brexit? ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/Smileys/efocicon/pokefun.gif[/url])
I would prefer a deal, but one that gives us much more than the one the EU has agreed with Teresa May.
What would be the point of keeping your powder dry if your not prepared to use it?
If it came to no deal, then of course it will be tough.
but aren't most things that are worth having worth fighting for?
QuoteI don't want No Deal. I want them to agree a deal.What! :eek :eek :eek
Then what is it that you want?
QuoteI don't want No Deal.A few weeks ago all you Leavers said you wanted No Deal! Nothing else would do. O yes you did, the evidence is on this thread.
im afraid I have no respect for any MPs whatsoever, but then again they very obviously feel exactly the same about me to be fair..
Calm down, calm down.QuoteI don't want No Deal.A few weeks ago all you Leavers said you wanted No Deal! Nothing else would do. O yes you did, the evidence is on this thread.
Does that mean people are allowed to change their minds on Brexit? :pokefun
QuoteI don't want No Deal. I want them to agree a deal.What! :eek :eek :eek
Calm down, calm down.
I said most recently on 25th January in this thread that 'No Deal' wasn't going to happen.
I said on 28th January that I hoped May's deal would get through Parliament.
If you still want to leave and No Deal isn't a realistic option, then Deal it is. Anything other than Remain.
Calm down, calm down.I said most recently on 25th January in this thread that 'No Deal' wasn't going to happen.I said on 28th January that I hoped May's deal would get through Parliament.If you still want to leave and No Deal isn't a realistic option, then Deal it is. Anything other than Remain.
QuoteCalm down, calm down.I said most recently on 25th January in this thread that 'No Deal' wasn't going to happen.I said on 28th January that I hoped May's deal would get through Parliament.If you still want to leave and No Deal isn't a realistic option, then Deal it is. Anything other than Remain.
So you've changed your mind. Excellent! You're in favour of a 2nd Referendum. Allow everybody else the same option. :)
So you've changed your mind. Excellent!
It's become clear that No Deal is a now a non-runner. Didn't you watch/read about the amendment vote in the Commons the on Tuesday?.
If you read back through my posts you'll see I'd declared No Deal dead a while before that.
The second best option is Deal, which I'm now hoping for.
Do try to keep up
3. Customs Union and Single Market for whole UKNot Single Market. That entails so much compromise as to make Brexit virtually meaningless.
At the time No Deal appeared achievable.What do you mean achievable? You only achieve NO DEAL by failing to get a DEAL. OK, maybe such a level of incompetence takes some doing, perhaps it would be an achievement.
29th Dec '' It suits me fine if she loses the vote, we'll just come out with no deal at the end of March ''That’s because they voted for BREXIT thinking the country would be 350 million a week better off, and it would all happen the day after the vote.
17th Dec '' When I voted Leave I assumed it meant a No Deal type exit.''
I haven't changed my mind on the original question that was on the ballot paper. Leaving with a deal is still Leave.May I remind you what May’s deal is – it is a withdrawal agreement. It is not a settled position. After the 31st of march under May’s deal we are no longer members of the EU. However we will continue to have single market access to allow us to trade seamlessly with the EU whilst we negotiate our future position – ie a trade deal with the EU. That means we will follow the rules of the market, but we will no longer be involved in setting the rules. Effectively on the first of April 2019 under May’s deal we cease to be a truly sovereign state as we are right now today.
How does the EU manage its border with Brazil ?
And then there is the nightmare of the Irish border.
MESSAGE FOR THE EU- Other countries cope and prosper outside the EU, why can't we?Message for BREXITEERS – why do you want to ignore the biggest single open seamless trading market in the world. A market that we have built, promoted and prospered from for some 45 years. A market that accounts for 25% of global GDP and is right on our doorstep.
That is the ONLY bit I want to keep.QuoteMESSAGE FOR THE EU- Other countries cope and prosper outside the EU, why can't we?Message for BREXITEERS – why do you want to ignore the biggest single open seamless trading market in the world. A market that we have built, promoted and prospered from for some 45 years. A market that accounts for 25% of global GDP and is right on our doorstep.
Why do you want to erect barriers to doing business with your immediate neighbours?Isn't that exactly what the SNP have been wanting to do for years?
Isn't that exactly what the SNP have been wanting to do for years?Nope.
because I don't like living under their jackboot any more than you like living under the English one ;)QuoteMESSAGE FOR THE EU- Other countries cope and prosper outside the EU, why can't we?Message for BREXITEERS – why do you want to ignore the biggest single open seamless trading market in the world. A market that we have built, promoted and prospered from for some 45 years. A market that accounts for 25% of global GDP and is right on our doorstep.
Why do you want to erect barriers to doing business with your immediate neighbours?
or Switzerland?Switzerland isn't in the EU....... but it's in the Customs Union, the Single Market, EFTA and Schengen. All of which May has refused for the UK.
That is the ONLY bit I want to keep.But the UK can't just pick and choose the bits that suit them. Which is exactly what the EU have been telling May all along.
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DyMONu1X0AAsXY3.jpg:large)This cartoon you posted is proof that you really don't get it, you posted it as an anti brexit cartoon but totally failed to understand how leavers would see it.
QuoteThat is the ONLY bit I want to keep.But the UK can't just pick and choose the bits that suit them.
What you can't also do, is agree a deal then come back at the 59th minute wanting to change it!
But the UK can't just pick and choose the bits that suit themWhy not.
What you can't also do, is agree a deal then come back at the 59th minute wanting to change it!Why not.
because I don't like living under their jackboot any more than you like living under the English one ;)Ogri, the jackboot is used as a symbol of cruel or authoritarian behaviour or rule. Neither of which could be attributed to the EU or the UK. The use of such language, whether directed at England or the EU, is offensive, uncalled for and unhelpful.
This cartoon you posted is proof that you really don't get it, you posted it as an anti brexit cartoon but totally failed to understand how leavers would see it.No, it just made me laugh. All those wee references that come together to make it funny. Peter Brookes, the cartoonist sketches for both left and right leaning publications.
Let me try and help you.No, no, no, please fazersharp, do not even try and go there.
Take your loathing of the English and the hatread and contempt you so readily spew out against "Westminster" - actually doesn't matter to you which government sits there. Unfortunately for you Vladimir already has a job.Jesus you can't help yourself, can you? I have no loathing of the English. I have as a Scot had decades of government I did not vote for, governments that my country did not vote for. I wish England was different, but it isn’t, and it’s actually becoming increasingly extreme, so much so it even wants to walk away from the EU. England is swinging hard to the right, the extreme right.
Well a lot of your reasons and thinking are the same as a lot of leavers but instead they are directed at the way the EU is run. Strange how a scots independence voter does not want to be ruled from "westminster" all of 400 miles away but perfectly happy to take rules from Brussels 700 miles away.No absolutely not. England is increasingly suffering from nationalism. Scotland simply wants political independance, but within a wider economic union.
In order to trade with the EU Switzerland pays into the EU, has had to adopt EU laws and takes EU immigrants.How does the EU manage its border with Brazil ?
And then there is the nightmare of the Irish border.
or Switzerland?
Scotland simply wants political independanceYou will not be getting that in the EU.Since the very concept of the EU it has progressively evolved towards a political union or in EU speak - ‘institutional convergence’ with European Union member states.It starts with the expansion of the processes of economic integration, but that can only go so far without the need for ever more political integration with the ultimate goal of a Europen superstate with the old countries now just "provinces".
Quote from: VNA on 01 February 2019, 08:49:06 PM ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/index.php/topic,24678.msg291744.html#msg291744[/url])<blockquote>Quote<blockquote>MESSAGE FOR THE EU- Other countries cope and prosper outside the EU, why can't we?</blockquote> Message for BREXITEERS – why do you want to ignore the biggest single open seamless trading market in the world. A market that we have built, promoted and prospered from for some 45 years. A market that accounts for 25% of global GDP and is right on our doorstep.
</blockquote>That is the ONLY bit I want to keep.
And then there is the nightmare of the Irish border.
How does the EU manage its border with Brazil ?
Quote from: fazersharp on 31 January 2019, 09:59:29 PMSwitzerland, as far as I am aware, has not suffered long term murderous occupation and dictatorship at the hands of an imperialist nation. Nor in regaining it’s sovereignty, and indeed dignity, has it had to give up a chunk of it’s territory over to British plantationists.
Quote from: VNA on 31 January 2019, 09:14:29 PM
And then there is the nightmare of the Irish border.
How does the EU manage its border with Brazil ?
or Switzerland?
If you wanted to REMAIN in the single market, then why did you vote for BREXIT knowing that you were putting our single market membership at risk. It is absolutely essential for this countries future, and in particular for us ordinary punters in this country, that the UK continues to be part of the single market.
The EU has no shared border with Brazil.
How does the EU manage its border with Brazil ?QuoteThe EU has no shared border with Brazil.
Oh yes it has-- shows that you don't know anything other than what you google - try googling it and find out
Told you !
How does the EU manage its border with Brazil ?QuoteThe EU has no shared border with Brazil.
Oh yes it has-- shows that you don't know anything other than what you google - try googling it and find out
I've googled. It's true, it does :eek
I hardly ever even use it at full power cos it just tries to suck the whole bloody carpet up.There he go's again proving his champagne socialist credentials with his Carpet
I hardly ever even use it at full power cos it just tries to suck the whole bloody carpet up.There he go's again proving his champagne socialist credentials with his Carpet
It wishes to have its own army,Nope it’s never going to happen.
It wishes to have its own foreign policy, but again under who's direction.It can only take a position on foreign affairs if all 27(28 maybe) states are in agreement.
And what if member states do not agree with the direction taken by the foreign policies, or its army.It will never have an army, and the EU is it’s 27 (28) member states. That is what it is.
I can still remember the scenes in Spanish cities, scenes of mass rejoicing every time a BRITISH serviceman was killed in the Falklands war.Let us not forget that Great Britain raped and pillaged it’s way round the globe. Surpise surpise, GB ain't the most popular brand round the globe by a country mile.
I, like others have no objection to free movement of people from Europe, but object to the masses of economic migrants/terrorists currently being relocated into Europe by the EU, with no backgrounds, no checks, and little hope of integrating.I object to British imperialism. I object to illegal wars. I objected to the invasion and occupation of Afghanistan, as I did Iraq and objected also to Cameron’s dumb war in Libya.
and want only to impose their culture and lifestyle upon us. I don't not want the political interference.You ever heard of The British Empire? You want a discussion on imposing culture, do you? Do you think the people of Afghanistan, Iraq and Libya, just to name three welcomed our political interference? When will the UK give up it’s dirty filthy imperialistic ways.
As for right wing government, if that's what people wish for , then they'll vote for it.Yes, England voted for it and the now UK has it. That’s why we are in this foccing mess, it’s why ordinary people have paid the price for the financial crises of 2008, and it’s why we now heading into recession.
I, like other Leavers on here, likely still wish to trade with the EU, and the rest of the world. The EU now is not what it once was, a confederation of trading nations, a common market, beneficial in principle to its members. But the EU has changed, and will continue to change, becoming ever more influential in domestic affairs. It wishes to have its own army, but under who's control. It wishes to have its own foreign policy, but again under who's direction. And what if member states do not agree with the direction taken by the foreign policies, or its army. I can still remember the scenes in Spanish cities, scenes of mass rejoicing every time a BRITISH serviceman was killed in the Falklands war. I, like others have no objection to free movement of people from Europe, but object to the masses of economic migrants/terrorists currently being relocated into Europe by the EU, with no backgrounds, no checks, and little hope of integrating. Many will simply slip into the black economy, or into crime, because they are incapable of integrating, and want only to impose their culture and lifestyle upon us. I don't not want the political interference. I want to be able to elect the government of the United Kingdom, and know that that is where the responsibility lies. I do not want the United Kingdom electorate to elect a government that has committed to policies of public spending, only to find that the UNELECTED tells said government that it cannot implement those policies as they do not agree with them. Just like Italy, Greece, and Spain, with possibly Portugal not far away too.my thoughts exactly ta mate ;)
I don't expect, or particularly want you to reply, I respect your views but cannot agree with them. I said in an earlier post that the EU is like a cancer, slowly spreading, ever weakening resistance by doshing out cash to potential dissenters. That is still my view. I'm not debating it.
As for right wing government, if that's what people wish for , then they'll vote for it. Certainly, a political party that campaigns on strongly tackling crime, upping defence spending, cleaning up the streets, clamping down severely on unlicensed/illegal/untaxed vehicles/ensuring all people and business's with earnings in the UK pay the appropriate level of taxation/deporting illegal immigrants, would likely win an election
Britain did indeed fight with extraordinary determination against the Axis Powers. British civilians and servicemen and women displayed enormous bravery and sacrifice. The human and economic cost was vast. But Britain did not fight alone.
Even after the fall of Britain's W European allies in 1939-40 Britain had India, Canada, Australia, South Africa, New Zealand and many other countries in its corner. The collective economic might of the UK, its dominions and colonies approached that the of the mighty USA
Once the USA and Soviets joined it was by pooling resources and integrating command structures that the allies were able to project overwhelming strength onto the battlefield against their enemies.
British troops often went into battle under American or other allied command. And vice versa. Polish squadrons fighting under a New Zealander played a hugely important role in the Battle of Britain, while...
..on D-day British, US, Canadian and other troops landed, commanded by British general Montgomery, working to a plan set by American Supreme Commander Eisenhower. There were slightly more British Empire than US troops. (By VE Day there were many more Americans)
Meanwhile in South East Asia a vast coalition of allies fought under British supreme command.
At the very highest level Churchill, Stalin and Roosevelt debated strategy fiercely. Churchill lost, on Poland at Yalta for example, but also won on things like a French occupation zone in Germany.
At Tehran Churchill was bullied into abandoning plans in the eastern Mediterranean in favour of D-day in the west. He said he felt like the 'poor little English donkey' between the mighty Russian bear and American buffalo.
He gave in. But in return Stalin agreed to time a massive Soviet offensive in the East with the allied landings in the west and agreed to join the war against Japan.
Britain has fought in A LOT of coalitions. They are expensive, frustrating & often inefficient but we're ultimately victorious. Britain has lost only one great power war in the last 250yrs. The American Revolutionary War, when, funnily enough, Britain was fighting alone
Because I don't want all the other stuff that go's with it.Like........ jobs?
How does the EU manage its border with Brazil ?
QuoteThe EU has no shared border with Brazil.
Oh yes it has-- shows that you don't know anything other than what you google - try googling it and find out
</blockquote>
I've googled. It's true, it does
QuoteIt wishes to have its own army,Nope it’s never going to happen.Quote
Absolute bollocks, in 2018 Merkel and Macron were both backing the creation of a EU army ,
A spokesperson for the commission’s president [/size]Jean-Claude Juncker (https://www.independent.co.uk/topic/jean-claude-juncker)[/color]said he was “pleased” that the argument for the force seemed to be “going in our direction”.[/font][/color][/size][/color][/size][/color]
How does the EU manage its border with Brazil ?
The EU has no shared border with Brazil.Yes the French EU Overseas Territory shares a border with Brazil.
Quote from: VNA on 02 February 2019, 07:43:40 PM ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/index.php/topic,24678.msg291798.html#msg291798[/url])<blockquote> Quote<blockquote>It wishes to have its own army,</blockquote>Nope it’s never going to happen.
Quote<blockquote>
Absolute bollocks, in 2018 Merkel and Macron were both backing the creation of a EU army ,
A spokesperson for the commission’s president Jean-Claude Juncker ([url]https://www.independent.co.uk/topic/jean-claude-juncker[/url])said he was “pleased” that the argument for the force seemed to be “going in our direction”.</blockquote></blockquote> Report to moderator ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/index.php?action=reporttm;topic=24678.2024;msg=291825[/url]) ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/Themes/Crushing/images/ip.gif[/url]) Logged ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/index.php?action=helpadmin;help=see_member_ip[/url])
The thing is Slappy that VNA just spouts stuff off, most of it is what he wants to happen - or not happen and the rest he just does not understand, he is like the Diane Abbott of the forum ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/Smileys/efocicon/cheesy.gif[/url]) See-------
Quote from: fazersharp on 31 January 2019, 09:59:29 PM ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/index.php/topic,24678.msg291685.html#msg291685[/url])<blockquote>How does the EU manage its border with Brazil ?
</blockquote>
Quote from: VNA on 02 February 2019, 06:01:23 PM ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/index.php/topic,24678.msg291784.html#msg291784[/url])<blockquote>The EU has no shared border with Brazil.
Quote from: mtread on Today at 01:02:11 AM ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/index.php/topic,24678.msg291818.html#msg291818[/url])<blockquote> Yes the French EU Overseas Territory shares a border with Brazil.
</blockquote></blockquote> « Last Edit: Today at 11:35:18 AM » ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/index.php?action=posthistory;topic=24678.0;msg=291830[/url])
It's a closed border, unlike Switzerland. Unlike Ireland,
The problem with the Brexit referendum was not Brexit, it was the referendum. How could such a drastic decision be taken through so primitive a procedure in the first place?David Van Reybrouck
So what? Somebody googled EU Borders before someone else did. Playground stuff.Yes I did but I was fact checking something else before posting on here which is when I came across it. I thought I would save it until it was relevant to the conversation the reason I posted it was a trap for VNA to which he gladly fell into I know he would reply back saying it was wrong. Proof that a lot of what he says is also not fully correct, like "no EU army" when a quick google finds that it is a stated aim/desire of the EU. So yes I came across it whilst googling something else about the EU.
Thirdly, where did you get all that rubbish from?He got it from here - https://briefingsforbrexit.com/author/david-blake/
I did but I was fact checking something else before posting on here which is when I came across it. I thought I would save it until it was relevant to the conversation the reason I posted it was a trap for VNA to which he gladly fell into I know he would reply back saying it was wrong.So, tell us how does the EU manage it’s border with Brazil? That is the border between French Guiana and Amapa. Perhaps you can explain to us all how this is relevant to the single market and in particular how it relates to the border between Northern Ireland and Eire.
I have no idea how the border is managed. I can not explain how it is relevant at all in any way.QuoteI did but I was fact checking something else before posting on here which is when I came across it. I thought I would save it until it was relevant to the conversation the reason I posted it was a trap for VNA to which he gladly fell into I know he would reply back saying it was wrong.So, tell us how does the EU manage it’s border with Brazil? That is the border between French Guiana and Amapa. Perhaps you can explain to us all how this is relevant to the single market and in particular how it relates to the border between Northern Ireland and Eire.
I have no idea how the border is managed. I can not explain how it is relevant at all in any way.I'll help you with that. It is not relevant in any shape or form whatsoever.
One thing that has truck me in the last few months is the absolute weakness of the argument from the BREXITEERS. People who voted for BREXIT can’t actually tell you why they voted for BREXIT, at least not in real substantial factual political terms. Or if they can, to some degree, it’s daylight running lamps, bent bananas and 350 million a week more for the NHS – one non-issue and two lies there then.
Increasingly what we now hear is nationalism. English Nationalism. Patriotic fighting talk. England is at it’s best when it stands alone. Of course, they kinda forget that this is actually about the UK. And standing alone - well there was a few wee nice tweets from Dan Snow this week, I think he appears to be a little irritated at the creeping nationalism in England;QuoteBritain did indeed fight with extraordinary determination against the Axis Powers. British civilians and servicemen and women displayed enormous bravery and sacrifice. The human and economic cost was vast. But Britain did not fight alone.
Even after the fall of Britain's W European allies in 1939-40 Britain had India, Canada, Australia, South Africa, New Zealand and many other countries in its corner. The collective economic might of the UK, its dominions and colonies approached that the of the mighty USA
Once the USA and Soviets joined it was by pooling resources and integrating command structures that the allies were able to project overwhelming strength onto the battlefield against their enemies.
British troops often went into battle under American or other allied command. And vice versa. Polish squadrons fighting under a New Zealander played a hugely important role in the Battle of Britain, while...
..on D-day British, US, Canadian and other troops landed, commanded by British general Montgomery, working to a plan set by American Supreme Commander Eisenhower. There were slightly more British Empire than US troops. (By VE Day there were many more Americans)
Meanwhile in South East Asia a vast coalition of allies fought under British supreme command.
At the very highest level Churchill, Stalin and Roosevelt debated strategy fiercely. Churchill lost, on Poland at Yalta for example, but also won on things like a French occupation zone in Germany.
At Tehran Churchill was bullied into abandoning plans in the eastern Mediterranean in favour of D-day in the west. He said he felt like the 'poor little English donkey' between the mighty Russian bear and American buffalo.
He gave in. But in return Stalin agreed to time a massive Soviet offensive in the East with the allied landings in the west and agreed to join the war against Japan.
I ask how much use actually is this veto that keeps being touted whenever a negative fact is stated about the EU. Apart from 1 time I can not find when it has actually been used by us.Here is what I have found, this is how useful it is.
Back in 2011 Cameron used the UKs veto to block the revised Lisbon treaty, a new EU-wide treaty to salvage the single currency.
EU leaders promptly agreed to bypass Britain and establish a new accord on the euro among themselves. The EU appeared poised to line up 26-1 against Cameron in support of the Franco-German blueprint, leaving Britain utterly isolated.
For the first time since Britain joined the European Community in 1973, a treaty that goes to the heart of how the EU works will be struck without a British signature.
Cameron appeared initially to have lukewarm backing from Sweden, the Czech Republic and Hungary. But by all three had signalled they would take the Franco-German proposals for a new "fiscal compact" to their parliaments.
With at least 23 countries signing up for a deal conferring intrusive rights on European institutions to enforce budgetary policy in countries breaking the euro's debt and deficit rules, as well as quasi-automatic penalties for delinquents, the German chancellor, Angela Merkel, the central driver of the new regime, appeared sanguine and unbothered by the British veto.
Further more the EU has a plan to prevent EU states from using veto powers to block legislation in areas that usually demand an unanimous agreement, (LIKE AN EU ARMY Fazersharp added this) (and the EU foreign policy _Agricola)
The EU commission is now pushing for a qualified majority voting based on article 48 of the Lisbon Treaty.
For full disclosure I got my info after googling "how many times has the UK used its EU veto"
Blimey Dazza, are you going for a Foccing record! OK I'll follow your links in future :)
QuoteQuote from: VNA on 02 February 2019, 07:43:40 PM ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/index.php/topic,24678.msg291798.html#msg291798[/url])<blockquote> Quote<blockquote>It wishes to have its own army,</blockquote>Nope it’s never going to happen.
Quote<blockquote>
Absolute bollocks, in 2018 Merkel and Macron were both backing the creation of a EU army ,
A spokesperson for the commission’s president Jean-Claude Juncker ([url]https://www.independent.co.uk/topic/jean-claude-juncker[/url])said he was “pleased” that the argument for the force seemed to be “going in our direction”.</blockquote></blockquote> Report to moderator ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/index.php?action=reporttm;topic=24678.2024;msg=291825[/url]) ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/Themes/Crushing/images/ip.gif[/url]) Logged ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/index.php?action=helpadmin;help=see_member_ip[/url])
Slappy, I know they say Jean-Claude Juncker always gets what he wants. But on this one he won’t. And if you actually believe this, umm non-issue, it’s all the more reason to stay in the EU so that the UK can deploy it’s veto.
You spout more shit than an elephant with diarrhoea, the EU vision for the future is total harmonisation , that incliudes all laws, taxation and armed forces. As for all 27 countries having to agree , already the EU wants to remove this right from members when voting on tax legislation. Once the right to veto is removed from one aspect then it makes it all the easier to remove it from every other aspect.No, it does not include all laws, not even all taxation, but obviously it includes laws relevant to trade. If you have a single market you need to have common standards.
QuoteYou spout more shit than an elephant with diarrhoea, the EU vision for the future is total harmonisation , that incliudes all laws, taxation and armed forces. As for all 27 countries having to agree , already the EU wants to remove this right from members when voting on tax legislation. Once the right to veto is removed from one aspect then it makes it all the easier to remove it from every other aspect.No, it does not include all laws, not even all taxation, but obviously it includes laws relevant to trade. If you have a single market you need to have common standards.
Individuals within the EU can of course have all the delusional visions they wish. Jean-Claude Juncker is just as free to talk pure shite as you are slappy. But the reality is The EU is currently 28 countries, it is democratic – the members will decide.
So the creation of an EU army is about as likely as Turkey joining the EU and it’s whole population moving to the UK.
You truly are delusional,Sure I am. :lol
the vision is for the future not the present. No matter who head up the EU the future is a superstate where member countries will do as they are told or suffer the consequences. They have already rejected Italy 2019 budget plans as they do not meet their rules for member states that use the Euro, in other words if the EU doesn't like it they won't let you do it.
That is just a little preview of the future for EU members,.
Nissan's Europe chairman, Gianluca deFicchy, said that "the continued uncertainty around the UK's future relationship with the EU is not helping companies like ours to plan for the future".
Who do you believe?
Yes the reporter did quote that, or words to that effect, but he said that the actual decision was made for the other reasons.So are you suggesting that the Mr De Ficchy is lying? And why on earth would he lie.
Also Japan has just signed a big trade deal with the EU. Don't some of the models have Renault engines in them?It’s the Renault–Nissan–Mitsubishi Alliance.
Excuses, excuses. Just a coincidence these are all happening now, or all a big conspiracy?
I've just been reading a Financial Times report on the Nissan decision.
Like the BBC report it says that it was down to a decline in diesel vehicle sales and new Euro emission regulations.
apparently the Japanese have the same word for "problem" as they do for "opportunity"..... ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/Smileys/efocicon/wink.gif[/url])
apparently the Japanese have the same word for "problem" as they do for "opportunity".....
If Nissan point to brexit as one of the factors and its actually more expensive to build in Japan then why don't they move to France or somewhereThe problem is they don't know the future cost of manufacture at Sunderland. They have no idea what the pound will do, and no idea what their market access will be. BREXIT is a disaster. Right now they need to tool up a new line which is a major investment. Without certainty they won't do that.
You did not answer my question, if you don't know then that's fine.QuoteIf Nissan point to brexit as one of the factors and its actually more expensive to build in Japan then why don't they move to France or somewhereThe problem is they don't know the future cost of manufacture at Sunderland. They have no idea what the pound will do, and no idea what their market access will be. BREXIT is a disaster. Right now they need to tool up a new line which is a major investment. Without certainty they won't do that.
But this is what you guys voted for.
You did not answer my question, if you don't know then that's fine.Not a question I can answer. Why not ask Mr De Ficchy. Oh wait a minute, you don’t believe him.
And his quote was "the continued uncertainty around the UK's future relationship with the EU is not helping companies like ours to plan for the future". That is not him saying it is Brexit.Well what the fuck do you think he was saying? :lol Jesus Christ! :eek
And the continued uncertainty IMO is wholey down to the remainers constantly trying to frustrate, postpone, cancel, - do anything they can to disrupt brexit. If they got onboard with the majority vote from the start there be no "uncertainty".
There is no plan for no deal, because we’re going to get a great deal– Boris Johnston 11-07-17
And the continued uncertainty IMO is wholey down to the remainers constantly trying to frustrate, postpone, cancel, - do anything they can to disrupt brexit.That is just rediculous. It's all about Brexiteers frustrating a deal. DUP Brexiteers don't want a different deal between NI and GB. Tory Brexiteers don't want the same deal between UK and Eire. The two are mutually incompatible. That's why she can't get a deal and is using No Deal as a bluff. That's May's problem. Nothing to do with Remain.
Why shouldn't 'the remainers constantly trying to frustrate, postpone, cancel, - do anything they can to disrupt brexit'?
Cheers
John
If Nissan point to brexit as one of the factors and its actually more expensive to build in Japan then why don't they move to France or somewhere
QuoteYou did not answer my question, if you don't know then that's fine.Not a question I can answer.
So Tusk lets his true hatred of those who would DARE to leave the EU, he says they deserve 'special place in hell'. I think it looks like he is feeling the pressure of seeing that £39billion slipping out of his hands. And we did say the other day that the EU is almost like cult and Tusk has just confirmed it. Who in their right mind would want to be ruled by people like that.Totally agree. He's shown his true colours. It's an absolute gift to the Leave cause :) . You either Remain in the cult or you can go to hell. What a foolish thing to say. I bet he's regretting it now.
bet he's regretting it now.Bet he's not :evil About time somebody stirred things up try to get us off this merry-go-round farce.
The decline in diesel fuelled car sales and the new Euro emission standard is Europe-wide.
Which roughly translates to...'I could, but the real answer isn't the one I want to give' :lolI’m not Mr Nissan. We are though opening the door and giving Japan an excuse to bring it’s car manufacturing home. Now that Japan has a free trade deal with the EU, what do you suppose ordinary people in Japan would like their car companies to do.
So Tusk lets his true hatred of those who would DARE to leave the EU, he says they deserve 'special place in hell'. I think it looks like he is feeling the pressure of seeing that £39billion slipping out of his hands. And we did say the other day that the EU is almost like cult and Tusk has just confirmed it. Who in their right mind would want to be ruled by people like that.No he’s just letting his frustration with the childish and stupid UK show. We are behaving like absolute idiots.
I bet he's regretting it now.It’s about time somebody spelled it out.
He's right, where are Johnson, Farage and Gove now?Maintaining a dignified silence and letting Tusk's poorly chosen words damage the EU's cause all on their own hopefully :lol
Cheers
John
Because your local city will be very soon charging you to drive in to town in a diesel. In Scotland, the major cities of Glasgow, Edinburgh, Aberdeen and Dundee are planning to introduce Low Emission Zones within the next year.Changes to vehicle excise duty rates introduced in April 2018 are part of a raft of measures hitting diesel drivers.QuoteThe decline in diesel fuelled car sales and the new Euro emission standard is Europe-wide.
And if I was replacing my car tomorrow, well I’d buy a diesel, cannot see any reason why I shouldn’t.
Farage right now is on his LBC show - as he is every week day 6-7pmAmazing how he juggles that with his other job we pay him for, at the EU. The one he hardly ever turns up for.
You do not see him because the BBC or Sky do not report on most of his EU speeches like the one he gave LAST WEEK, here it is for you Sorry... (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XR2snMKWbUM#) Across platforms, the video has racked up over four million views and counting but go and try to find it on the BBC despite showing the one after and in reply to his speech which was by that rabid Verhofstadt.QuoteFarage right now is on his LBC show - as he is every week day 6-7pm
Amazing how he juggles that with his other job we pay him for, at the EU. The one he hardly ever turns up for.
Anyway I'm always too busy at that time. Pity. Try James O'Brien instead :)
Because your local city will be very soon charging you to drive in to town in a diesel.My diesel is EURO 6 compliant.
In Scotland, the major cities of Glasgow, Edinburgh, Aberdeen and Dundee are planning to introduce Low Emission Zones within the next year.My diesel is EURO 6 compliant and is exempt.
Although diesels produce 15% less CO2 than petrol cars, they emit four times more nitrogen dioxide (NO2) as well 22 times more particulate matter or PM – tiny particles that penetrate the brain, lungs and heart. I think you have been sniffing your own diesel fumes.Not the case if your diesel, like mine, is EURO 6 compliant. :D
The electorate didn't have a vote on joining The EEC. Edward Heath signed us up to it. The 1975 referendum was a vote to decide whether we remained or left.
The biggest mistake this country made was voting to join the Common Market 40 odd years ago. Should have been named the Conman market or the Federal States of Europe So we all knew what that yes vote would lead too :eek a dictatorship from Brussels some 40 odd years later.
Across platforms, the video has racked up over four million views and counting but go and try to find it on the BBC despite showing the one after and in reply to his speech which was by that rabid Verhofstadt.He’s a joke, an embarrassment. Though a joke and embarrassment that has delivered BREXIT.
QuoteBecause your local city will be very soon charging you to drive in to town in a diesel.My diesel is EURO 6 compliant.QuoteIn Scotland, the major cities of Glasgow, Edinburgh, Aberdeen and Dundee are planning to introduce Low Emission Zones within the next year.My diesel is EURO 6 compliant and is exempt.QuoteAlthough diesels produce 15% less CO2 than petrol cars, they emit four times more nitrogen dioxide (NO2) as well 22 times more particulate matter or PM – tiny particles that penetrate the brain, lungs and heart. I think you have been sniffing your own diesel fumes.Not the case if your diesel, like mine, is EURO 6 compliant. :D
The issue I have with these ULEZ zones is that they cost the least well off the most. Most of the people who service, clean and generally keep our major towns and cities running can't afford to live in them and have to travel in, often at unsociable hours when public transport isn't running.I totally agree with you. :eek :eek :eek I can swan in and out for free cos I can afford a EURO6 diesel. But people who can’t afford to buy a new motor cos the city centre regulations have changed are stuck with the charges. Yeah, it’s crap. :(
They simply can't afford to change at the drop of a hat to EURO 6 compliant vehicles. It's not a worry for the better off.
The issue I have with these ULEZ zones is that they cost the least well off the most. Most of the people who service, clean and generally keep our major towns and cities running can't afford to live in them and have to travel in, often at unsociable hours when public transport isn't running.
You know the funny thing is, the people who have pushed BREXIT, Farage, Gove, Johnston, Mogg etc etc. BREXIT won’t touch themReally?. I thought they'd got a 'Special Place In Hell' waiting for them ;)
Nigel might have lumbered us with BREXIT, but he’s not negotiating it. Nigel isn’t in government, he’s no responsibility whatsoever with the mess he has lumbered us with.Well that is the governments fault because they should of made him Sir Nigel and brought him into government.
Bleak outlook for Nissan car plant despite £40m aid.This the headline for ---- no not 2019 but 2001Big business is about money. There has been nothing to stop Nissan leaving at any time.
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/1318403/Bleak-outlook-for-Nissan-car-plant-despite-40m-aid.html (https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/1318403/Bleak-outlook-for-Nissan-car-plant-despite-40m-aid.html)
Nissan have been looking for a way out for years and using the excuse of brexit has provided them a "free pass". Like when the gov puts out bad news undercover of a bigger story.
I wonder how much the move is influenced by the fact that Nissan is majoprity owned by a French company who get massive handouts from the French government
The factory is also exploring getting most of the Micra's components from the eurozone which would be a blow to British component suppliers.What did happen was numerous parts suppliers in the UK were put out of business. Nissan then with the strong pound had the parts made in Europe. That made their overall investment in the UK work.
BREXIT - what a foccing great idea.
So Tusk lets his true hatred of those who would DARE to leave the EU, he says they deserve 'special place in hell'.
What he actually said was: there was a "special place in hell" "for those who promoted Brexit without even a sketch of a plan of how to carry it out safely"
Cameron didn't plan because he didn't expect to lose. Boris supported Brexit because he didn't expect to win.
Just heard the BBC news heavily pointing out that the Tusk "go to hell" comment was only directed at select politicians and not the wider 52% that voted leave. Brussels Broadcasting Company - :rolleyesI have seen the clip of Tusk making his statement. I have not seen the “BBC news heavily pointing out” bit you refer to. Were you watching Newsround or something? It’s pretty fucking obvious who Tusk is quite rightly pointing the finger at. >: >: >:
Just for Donald Tusks information that SPECIAL PLACE IN HELL is in the battle fields of all over Europe where millions from all over the world lay down their lives defending European freedom from tyrants and despots and lunatics. RING ANY BELLS DONALD TUSK?
I wonder if it will affect Tusk's chances of being re-elected?.
Oh hang on I forgot, he's un-elected isn't he
My favourite is - :guitar Go your own way :guitar
Every time I hear Tusk mentioned I keep thinking of the Fleetwood mac album/song that was the strange, somewhat disappointing follow-up to Rumours :guitar :lol
I wonder if it will affect Tusk's chances of being re-elected?.The European Council elects its own president. This requires a qualified majority. The president holds the post for a 2.5 year term, renewable once.
Oh hang on I forgot, he's un-elected isn't he :lol
Just for Donald Tusks information that SPECIAL PLACE IN HELL is in the battle fields of all over Europe where millions from all over the world lay down their lives defending European freedom from tyrants and despots and lunatics. RING ANY BELLS DONALD TUSK?Yes, I am sure it will Steve. Tusk is Polish. At the end of WW2 Poland was left to rot by the allies. It was to be some decades before Poland regained it's freedom.
mtread I never mentioned WW2 you were just making your usual assumptions. I said battle fields and soldiers from all over the world. Including European soldiers fighting for their freedom from tyranny. Perhaps you had conveniently forgot the Napoleonic wars of the late 1700s and early 1800s the first world war and WW2 and probably a few more skirmishes I have forgotten.Then I don't understand the point and what comparison you are making?
Quotemtread I never mentioned WW2 you were just making your usual assumptions. I said battle fields and soldiers from all over the world. Including European soldiers fighting for their freedom from tyranny. Perhaps you had conveniently forgot the Napoleonic wars of the late 1700s and early 1800s the first world war and WW2 and probably a few more skirmishes I have forgotten.Then I don't understand the point and what comparison you are making?
Bringing Europe together in economic and social union makes another war in what was our war-torn continent almost impossible.Have you seen the on-going spat with France and Italy over the last few weeks, not saying they will break out in war but there certainly does not seem to be much "union" going on between them. And with the yellow vests France seems at war with its self. That lovely rosy skipping hand in hand through the daisies EU project is not going so well. Most of it is not reported through the BBC or Sky. The yellow vests have been kicking off every weekend and now a rival red scarves movement has been set up to oppose them
My favourite is - :guitar Go your own way :guitar
Every time I hear Tusk mentioned I keep thinking of the Fleetwood mac album/song that was the strange, somewhat disappointing follow-up to Rumours :guitar :lol
Tango In The Night - Little Lies. Sums up Leave completely :lol
Actually I hated this iteration of Fleetwood Mac. Give me version 1 with Peter Green anyday :guitar
Some 79 per cent of those surveyed agreed to the statement that “the Irish Government should hold out for a legal guarantee that there will be no hard border between Northern Ireland and the Republic of Ireland even if that risk a no-deal Brexit on March 29th”.
The EU’s stance has won favour with 63 per cent of the Irish population with just 16 per cent disapproving.
Unsurprisingly, just 6 per cent of the Irish population approved of the way the UK government is handling Brexit and nearly two-thirds believe its approach to the Brexit negotiations has been “very bad”.
The reputation of the UK has taken a battering in Ireland as a result of Brexit.
Given a choice between cutting ties economically with the UK or with the EU, 81 per cent of Irish people would rather cut economic ties with the UK than the EU.
By the way, I have been wondering, what the special place in hell looks like for those who promoted BREXIT without even a sketch of a plan how to carry it safely.Donald Tusk
QuoteGood to see you have started calling him Tommy.....Probably best to get used to his name as I get the feeling you're going to be hearing a lot more from him....Nah, he's still SYL, or possibly RAH. Don't think we will hear much more from him soon.
Really ?? :eek thought you were a little less naive than that.
A new Sky news poll
the lawyers are seeking to “penetrate the veil of Lennon's finances, identify and forensically trace all of Lennon's financial assets so that he does not escape the economic consequences of his defamation of others”.
but how do they expect to add to their ranks by referencing him as SCYL or even more correct SCY-L when nobody knows who SCY-L is.Because that's his name (and hopefully it pisses him off) If I start calling myself Valentino Rossi, that doesn't make me Valentino Rossi. :)
Tusk.."theres a special place in hell for brexiteers.."moi…"yeah I know, its called the EU..."
Nah, just stick to Walter Mitty, it suits you better :lolQuotebut how do they expect to add to their ranks by referencing him as SCYL or even more correct SCY-L when nobody knows who SCY-L is.Because that's his name (and hopefully it pisses him off) If I start calling myself Valentino Rossi, that doesn't make me Valentino Rossi. :)
Dazza, a defamation case is being brought aginst your football hooligan, racist, facist thug of a hero.What is to me really interesting is;Quotethe lawyers are seeking to “penetrate the veil of Lennon's finances, identify and forensically trace all of Lennon's financial assets so that he does not escape the economic consequences of his defamation of others”.
Follow the money. If this works, we are going to find out, for example, how it is that Stephen Laxley can afford to live in a million pound home. I think this will be very intersting indeed.
So yes I do look forward to hearing more about a little fucking cunt called Laxley this year. ;)
So, the establishment are going after his money.No the people are.
I now see Nigel is going to start a new political party to fight the European Parliament elections in May when the UK inevitably extends Article 50.
You couldn't make this up :eek
I now see Nigel is going to start a new political party to fight the European Parliament elections in May when the UK inevitably extends Article 50.
You couldn't make this up :eek
"Sir Nigel" is heading up a new party called the Brexit Party in readiness to fight.
Err -that is old REAL news as I posted back in Jan 20.If you only listen the BBC and Sky then you are not going to hear much about him.
but how do they expect to add to their ranks by referencing him as SCYL or even more correct SCY-L when nobody knows who SCY-L is.
Because that's his name (and hopefully it pisses him off) If I start calling myself Valentino Rossi, that doesn't make me Valentino Rossi.
Quote
When Article 50 is (inevitably) postponed
Postponed for what purpose though?. I can't see a bit of extra time breaking the deadlock can you?.
I've got the solution. We stay in the EU, but we hold Remain to their word that the EU is as wonderful as they say.
The minute there's any economic down turn, job losses, factory closures etc etc...we leave the EU immediately.
Currently every bit of bad news is being blamed on Brexit, so it follows that if we stay in every bit of bad news will be the EU's fault.
Deal?
When Article 50 is (inevitably) postponedPostponed for what purpose though?. I can't see a bit of extra time breaking the deadlock can you?. I've got the solution. We stay in the EU, but we hold Remain to their word that the EU is as wonderful as they say.The minute there's any economic down turn, job losses, factory closures etc etc...we leave the EU immediately.Currently every bit of bad news is being blamed on Brexit, so it follows that if we stay in every bit of bad news will be the EU's fault.Deal?
The Brexit Party. I like Farage. Be good to have him centre stage again although ideally there shouldn't have been any need by this time in proceedings.OK, so what did you think would happen. What is your solution to the current situation YamFazFan?
Err -that is old REAL news as I posted back in Jan 20.Really! The BBC I think have much to answer for. Farage is a man who has repeatedly failed to get elected to parliament. UKIP’s only MP was a Tory defector and currently they have none. UKIP has a mere 24,000 members (that number is currently falling fast). Yet Farage has popped up 32 times over the years on the BBC’s flagship politics show Question Time.
If you only listen the BBC and Sky then you are not going to hear much about him.
Quote
I'm tempted by your deal, but then you'll be blaming every bit of bad news on Remaining, even if it's nothing to do with the EU
:)
That's exactly what the Remainers are already doing with regards to Leave and we haven't even left yet!
Here’s what, as far as I can see, are the current options,Option 4.....
1. NO DEAL BREXIT – which will be economically devastating for the UK and throw us into a long term recession. Motorcycle prices will soar. :eek :eek
2. May’s deal with a tweak here and there – at the end of the day May’s withdrawal agreement is just about kicking the can down the road, it will leave the UK stuck in BREXIT mode for many years to come. The backstop cannot be removed nor a time limit placed on it.
3. A Norway Type deal – EFTA-EEA membership. Which basically means single market access, but we would be able to leave common fisheries and Common Agricultural Policy (I presume this will require some negotiation). It allows a generally quick settled position to be reached. Business confidence can potentially be restored, and the government can go back to being a government again.
4. A second referendum – I think this one is now dead.
5. A general election – It could happen – what we have right now is a government in opposition. This is a situation that cannot continue indefinitely. Lifeless just now but............
6. Cancel article 50. The best option of all, but perhaps now the least likely of all. Pretty much dead.
So what do people want? Those I think are the main options. If I have missed something then do let me know.
Me? I’ll have option 6 please.
:lol Thought you was having another wobble.
Thought you was having another wobble.
As I was saying before I got called away because Dad's Army was starting, Option 4.....is out of the question :lol:lol :lol
A paper pushing HMRC clerk would know about bracketsIs that the best you can do? :lol
But this is what you guys voted for.You critisize people for taking part in a democratic vote :rolleyes
You critisize people for taking part in a democratic vote ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/file:///C:/Users/garet/AppData/Local/Temp/msohtmlclip1/01/clip_image001.gif[/url])
I'd suggest you look a bit closer to home and question why those who prior to the referendum declared that they were Remain, then didn't take part.
And here's the article set out as it appears on google for the brain boxes.
Yep, fucking lost me after the first few paragraphs :lol
THE ORIGINAL MANDATE
The original GATT Article XXIV, complemented by an “Ad Art XXIV (https://www.wto.org/english/tratop_e/region_e/region_art24_e.htm#ad)”, has been updated in 1994 with an Understanding (https://www.wto.org/english/tratop_e/region_e/region_art24_e.htm#understanding).
Article XXIV of the General Agreement on Tariffs and Trade (GATT 1947)
Territorial Application — Frontier Traffic — Customs Unions and Free-trade Areas
1. The provisions of this Agreement shall apply to the metropolitan customs territories of the contracting parties and to any other customs territories in respect of which this Agreement has been accepted under Article XXVI or is being applied under Article XXXIII or pursuant to the Protocol of Provisional Application. Each such customs territory shall, exclusively for the purposes of the territorial application of this Agreement, be treated as though it were a contracting party; Provided that the provisions of this paragraph shall not be construed to create any rights or obligations as between two or more customs territories in respect of which this Agreement has been accepted under Article XXVI or is being applied under Article XXXIII or pursuant to the Protocol of Provisional Application by a single contracting party.
2. For the purposes of this Agreement a customs territory shall be understood to mean any territory with respect to which separate tariffs or other regulations of commerce are maintained for a substantial part of the trade of such territory with other territories.
3. The provisions of this Agreement shall not be construed to prevent:
(a) Advantages accorded by any contracting party to adjacent countries in order to facilitate frontier traffic;
(b) Advantages accorded to the trade with the Free Territory of Trieste by countries contiguous to that territory, provided that such advantages are not in conflict with the Treaties of Peace arising out of the Second World War.
4. The contracting parties recognize the desirability of increasing freedom of trade by the development, through voluntary agreements, of closer integration between the economies of the countries parties to such agreements. They also recognize that the purpose of a customs union or of a free-trade area should be to facilitate trade between the constituent territories and not to raise barriers to the trade of other contracting parties with such territories.
5. Accordingly, the provisions of this Agreement shall not prevent, as between the territories of contracting parties, the formation of a customs union or of a free-trade area or the adoption of an interim agreement necessary for the formation of a customs union or of a free-trade area; Providedthat:
(a) with respect to a customs union, or an interim agreement leading to a formation of a customs union, the duties and other regulations of commerce imposed at the institution of any such union or interim agreement in respect of trade with contracting parties not parties to such union or agreement shall not on the whole be higher or more restrictive than the general incidence of the duties and regulations of commerce applicable in the constituent territories prior to the formation of such union or the adoption of such interim agreement, as the case may be;
(b) with respect to a free-trade area, or an interim agreement leading to the formation of a free-trade area, the duties and other regulations of commerce maintained in each of the constituent territories and applicable at the formation of such free–trade area or the adoption of such interim agreement to the trade of contracting parties not included in such area or not parties to such agreement shall not be higher or more restrictive than the corresponding duties and other regulations of commerce existing in the same constituent territories prior to the formation of the free-trade area, or interim agreement as the case may be; and
(c) any interim agreement referred to in subparagraphs (a) and (b) shall include a plan and schedule for the formation of such a customs union or of such a free-trade area within a reasonable length of time.
6. If, in fulfilling the requirements of subparagraph 5 (a), a contracting party proposes to increase any rate of duty inconsistently with the provisions of Article II, the procedure set forth in Article XXVIII shall apply. In providing for compensatory adjustment, due account shall be taken of the compensation already afforded by the reduction brought about in the corresponding duty of the other constituents of the union.
7. (a) Any contracting party deciding to enter into a customs union or free-trade area, or an interim agreement leading to the formation of such a union or area, shall promptly notify the CONTRACTING PARTIES and shall make available to them such information regarding the proposed union or area as will enable them to make such reports and recommendations to contracting parties as they may deem appropriate.
(b) If, after having studied the plan and schedule included in an interim agreement referred to in paragraph 5 in consultation with the parties to that agreement and taking due account of the information made available in accordance with the provisions of subparagraph (a), the CONTRACTING PARTIES find that such agreement is not likely to result in the formation of a customs union or of a free-trade area within the period contemplated by the parties to the agreement or that such period is not a reasonable one, the CONTRACTING PARTIES shall make recommendations to the parties to the agreement. The parties shall not maintain or put into force, as the case may be, such agreement if they are not prepared to modify it in accordance with these recommendations.
(c) Any substantial change in the plan or schedule referred to in paragraph 5 (c) shall be communicated to the CONTRACTING PARTIES, which may request the contracting parties concerned to consult with them if the change seems likely to jeopardize or delay unduly the formation of the customs union or of the free-trade area.
8. For the purposes of this Agreement:
(a) A customs union shall be understood to mean the substitution of a single customs territory for two or more customs territories, so that
(i) duties and other restrictive regulations of commerce (except, where necessary, those permitted under Articles XI, XII, XIII, XIV, XV and XX) are eliminated with respect to substantially all the trade between the constituent territories of the union or at least with respect to substantially all the trade in products originating in such territories, and,
(ii) subject to the provisions of paragraph 9, substantially the same duties and other regulations of commerce are applied by each of the members of the union to the trade of territories not included in the union;
(b) A free-trade area shall be understood to mean a group of two or more customs territories in which the duties and other restrictive regulations of commerce (except, where necessary, those permitted under Articles XI, XII, XIII, XIV, XV and XX) are eliminated on substantially all the trade between the constituent territories in products originating in such territories.
9. The preferences referred to in paragraph 2 of Article I shall not be affected by the formation of a customs union or of a free-trade area but may be eliminated or adjusted by means of negotiations with contracting parties affected.* This procedure of negotiations with affected contracting parties shall, in particular, apply to the elimination of preferences required to conform with the provisions of paragraph 8 (a)(i) and paragraph 8 (b).
10. The CONTRACTING PARTIES may by a two-thirds majority approve proposals which do not fully comply with the requirements of paragraphs 5 to 9 inclusive, provided that such proposals lead to the formation of a customs union or a free-trade area in the sense of this Article.
11. Taking into account the exceptional circumstances arising out of the establishment of India and Pakistan as independent States and recognizing the fact that they have long constituted an economic unit, the contracting parties agree that the provisions of this Agreement shall not prevent the two countries from entering into special arrangements with respect to the trade between them, pending the establishment of their mutual trade relations on a definitive basis.*12. Each contracting party shall take such reasonable measures as may be available to it to ensure observance of the provisions of this Agreement by the regional and local governments and authorities within its territories.
Ad Article XXIV > back to top (https://www.wto.org/english/tratop_e/region_e/region_art24_e.htm#top)
Paragraph 9
It is understood that the provisions of Article I would require that, when a product which has been imported into the territory of a member of a customs union or free-trade area at a preferential rate of duty is re-exported to the territory of another member of such union or area, the latter member should collect a duty equal to the difference between the duty already paid and any higher duty that would be payable if the product were being imported directly into its territory.
Paragraph 11
Measures adopted by India and Pakistan in order to carry out definitive trade arrangements between them, once they have been agreed upon, might depart from particular provisions of this Agreement, but these measures would in general be consistent with the objectives of the Agreement.
Understanding on the Interpretation of Article XXIV of the General Agreement on Tariffs and Trade 1994 > back to top (https://www.wto.org/english/tratop_e/region_e/region_art24_e.htm#top)
Members,
Having regard to the provisions of Article XXIV of GATT 1994;
Recognizing that customs unions and free trade areas have greatly increased in number and importance since the establishment of GATT 1947 and today cover a significant proportion of world trade;
Recognizing the contribution to the expansion of world trade that may be made by closer integration between the economies of the parties to such agreements;
Recognizing also that such contribution is increased if the elimination between the constituent territories of duties and other restrictive regulations of commerce extends to all trade, and diminished if any major sector of trade is excluded;
Reaffirming that the purpose of such agreements should be to facilitate trade between the constituent territories and not to raise barriers to the trade of other Members with such territories; and that in their formation or enlargement the parties to them should to the greatest possible extent avoid creating adverse effects on the trade of other Members;
Convinced also of the need to reinforce the effectiveness of the role of the Council for Trade in Goods in reviewing agreements notified under Article XXIV, by clarifying the criteria and procedures for the assessment of new or enlarged agreements, and improving the transparency of all Article XXIV agreements;
Recognizing the need for a common understanding of the obligations of Members under paragraph 12 of Article XXIV;
Hereby agree as follows:
1. Customs unions, free-trade areas, and interim agreements leading to the formation of a customs union or free-trade area, to be consistent with Article XXIV, must satisfy, inter alia, the provisions of paragraphs 5, 6, 7 and 8 of that Article.
Article XXIV:5 > back to top (https://www.wto.org/english/tratop_e/region_e/region_art24_e.htm#top)
2. The evaluation under paragraph 5(a) of Article XXIV of the general incidence of the duties and other regulations of commerce applicable before and after the formation of a customs union shall in respect of duties and charges be based upon an overall assessment of weighted average tariff rates and of customs duties collected. This assessment shall be based on import statistics for a previous representative period to be supplied by the customs union, on a tariff-line basis and in values and quantities, broken down by WTO country of origin. The Secretariat shall compute the weighted average tariff rates and customs duties collected in accordance with the methodology used in the assessment of tariff offers in the Uruguay Round of Multilateral Trade Negotiations. For this purpose, the duties and charges to be taken into consideration shall be the applied rates of duty. It is recognized that for the purpose of the overall assessment of the incidence of other regulations of commerce for which quantification and aggregation are difficult, the examination of individual measures, regulations, products covered and trade flows affected may be required.
3. The "reasonable length of time" referred to in paragraph 5(c) of Article XXIV should exceed 10 years only in exceptional cases. In cases where Members parties to an interim agreement believe that 10 years would be insufficient they shall provide a full explanation to the Council for Trade in Goods of the need for a longer period.
Article XXIV:6 > back to top (https://www.wto.org/english/tratop_e/region_e/region_art24_e.htm#top)
4. Paragraph 6 of Article XXIV establishes the procedure to be followed when a Member forming a customs union proposes to increase a bound rate of duty. In this regard Members reaffirm that the procedure set forth in Article XXVIII, as elaborated in the guidelines adopted on 10 November 1980 (BISD 27S/26-28) and in the Understanding on the Interpretation of Article XXVIII of GATT 1994, must be commenced before tariff concessions are modified or withdrawn upon the formation of a customs union or an interim agreement leading to the formation of a customs union.
5. These negotiations will be entered into in good faith with a view to achieving mutually satisfactory compensatory adjustment. In such negotiations, as required by paragraph 6 of Article XXIV, due account shall be taken of reductions of duties on the same tariff line made by other constituents of the customs union upon its formation. Should such reductions not be sufficient to provide the necessary compensatory adjustment, the customs union would offer compensation, which may take the form of reductions of duties on other tariff lines. Such an offer shall be taken into consideration by the Members having negotiating rights in the binding being modified or withdrawn. Should the compensatory adjustment remain unacceptable, negotiations should be continued. Where, despite such efforts, agreement in negotiations on compensatory adjustment under Article XXVIII as elaborated by the Understanding on the Interpretation of Article XXVIII of GATT 1994 cannot be reached within a reasonable period from the initiation of negotiations, the customs union shall, nevertheless, be free to modify or withdraw the concessions; affected Members shall then be free to withdraw substantially equivalent concessions in accordance with Article XXVIII.
6. GATT 1994 imposes no obligation on Members benefiting from a reduction of duties consequent upon the formation of a customs union, or an interim agreement leading to the formation of a customs union, to provide compensatory adjustment to its constituents.
Review of Customs Unions and Free-Trade Areas > back to top (https://www.wto.org/english/tratop_e/region_e/region_art24_e.htm#top)
7. All notifications made under paragraph 7(a) of Article XXIV shall be examined by a working party in the light of the relevant provisions of GATT 1994 and of paragraph 1 of this Understanding. The working party shall submit a report to the Council for Trade in Goods on its findings in this regard. The Council for Trade in Goods may make such recommendations to Members as it deems appropriate.
8. In regard to interim agreements, the working party may in its report make appropriate recommendations on the proposed time-frame and on measures required to complete the formation of the customs union or free-trade area. It may if necessary provide for further review of the agreement.
9. Members parties to an interim agreement shall notify substantial changes in the plan and schedule included in that agreement to the Council for Trade in Goods and, if so requested, the Council shall examine the changes.
10. Should an interim agreement notified under paragraph 7(a) of Article XXIV not include a plan and schedule, contrary to paragraph 5(c) of Article XXIV, the working party shall in its report recommend such a plan and schedule. The parties shall not maintain or put into force, as the case may be, such agreement if they are not prepared to modify it in accordance with these recommendations. Provision shall be made for subsequent review of the implementation of the recommendations.
11. Customs unions and constituents of free-trade areas shall report periodically to the Council for Trade in Goods, as envisaged by the CONTRACTING PARTIES to GATT 1947 in their instruction to the GATT 1947 Council concerning reports on regional agreements (BISD 18S/38), on the operation of the relevant agreement. Any significant changes and/or developments in the agreements should be reported as they occur.
Dispute Settlement > back to top (https://www.wto.org/english/tratop_e/region_e/region_art24_e.htm#top)
12. The provisions of Articles XXII and XXIII of GATT 1994 as elaborated and applied by the Dispute Settlement Understanding may be invoked with respect to any matters arising from the application of those provisions of Article XXIV relating to customs unions, free-trade areas or interim agreements leading to the formation of a customs union or free-trade area.
Article XXIV:12 > back to top (https://www.wto.org/english/tratop_e/region_e/region_art24_e.htm#top)
13. Each Member is fully responsible under GATT 1994 for the observance of all provisions of GATT 1994, and shall take such reasonable measures as may be available to it to ensure such observance by regional and local governments and authorities within its territory.
14. The provisions of Articles XXII and XXIII of GATT 1994 as elaborated and applied by the Dispute Settlement Understanding may be invoked in respect of measures affecting its observance taken by regional or local governments or authorities within the territory of a Member. When the Dispute Settlement Body has ruled that a provision of GATT 1994 has not been observed, the responsible Member shall take such reasonable measures as may be available to it to ensure its observance. The provisions relating to compensation and suspension of concessions or other obligations apply in cases where it has not been possible to secure such observance.
15. Each Member undertakes to accord sympathetic consideration to and afford adequate opportunity for consultation regarding any representations made by another Member concerning measures affecting the operation of GATT 1994 taken within the territory of the former.
we are a representative democracy[/color]
Agreed.
So why is that when the majority of UK voters decide to leave the EU, you fail to respect that view.
Quote from: VNA link=topic=24678.msg292247#msg292247 date=15498101
[color=#ff0000we are a representative democracy[/color]
Agreed.
So why is that when the majority of UK voters decide to leave the EU, you fail to respect that view.
A referendum is direct democracy, not representative democracy.
Quote from: VNA link=topic=24678.msg292247#msg292247 date=15498101
[color=#ff0000we are a representative democracy
Agreed.
So why is that when the majority of UK voters decide to leave the EU, you fail to respect that view.
A referendum is direct democracy, not representative democracy.
QuoteQuote from: VNA link=topic=24678.msg292247#msg292247 date=15498101
[color=#ff0000we are a representative democracy
Agreed.
So why is that when the majority of UK voters decide to leave the EU, you fail to respect that view.
A referendum is direct democracy, not representative democracy.
Look, will you get those foccing brackets right! :'(
Labour are red Tories are blue Remainers tell lies Leave only trueBut I've got pictures. You haven't got pictures :)
QuoteLabour are red Tories are blue Remainers tell lies Leave only trueBut I've got pictures. You haven't got pictures :)
SIx people have been charged after a number of police officers and emergency workers were attacked at a pro-Brexit [/b]yellow vest protest (https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-46851713) march in London.
Oh well, bye bye Honda.Where abouts in the EU are they moving production to do you know?.
Ain't BREXIT just swell.
Where abouts in the EU are they moving production to do you know?.As you know they are moving production to Japan.
Why not to somewhere in the EUQuoteWhere abouts in the EU are they moving production to do you know?.As you know they are moving production to Japan.
Swindon IS Honda's EU factory.I don' t get it, what am I kidding. Ok so you are saying that Swindon IS Honda's EU factory. So are you saying they are getting out of the EU full- stop and it is nothing to do with Brexit at all.
90% of production is exported to the EU.
Keep kidding yourself Fazersharp.
The darling economist of the BREXITEERS, Proffessor Patrick Minford, has made it clear that a no deal BREXIT will see British manufacturing all but eliminated. He says there will be a significant increase in the gap between rich and poor.Thank you for very clearly NOT answering my question.Or indeed you have very clearly answered it by the very act of not answering it. Maybe it was the threat of me actually fact checking that has put you off.Go ahead and deflect and divert -- not working here ;)
Two years after the vote and still nobody has a clue what BREXIT is. In two years, we have failed to negotiate a withdrawal agreement. That withdrawal agreement is supposed to be the agreement that allows us continued single market access whilst we negotiate BREXIT for real.
Businesses are losing faith in the UK.
Whilst it is a big shock that Honda are leaving, and a disaster for the workforce, it is hardly a surprise.
Thank you for very clearly NOT answering my question.They haven't announced yet. The question can't be answered, but you must admit the overall picture doesn't look good, does it?
QuoteThank you for very clearly NOT answering my question.They haven't announced yet. The question can't be answered, but you must admit the overall picture doesn't look good, does it?
QuoteThank you for very clearly NOT answering my question.They haven't announced yet. The question can't be answered
Oh well, bye bye Honda.
Ain't BREXIT just swell.
I'd have LOVED to have seen your reaction when you heard the Honda statement this morning. I bet it was priceless!. Did the air turn a subtle shade of blue? ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/Smileys/efocicon/lol.gif[/url]) ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/Smileys/efocicon/lol.gif[/url]) ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/Smileys/efocicon/lol.gif[/url])
no pain, no gain.. ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/Smileys/efocicon/smile.gif[/url])
There is one consolation for Labour though. They might have lost 7 MP's, but at least they've got Derek Hatton backApparently there are so many ex UKIP members joining local Conservative parties, the Tories are being known as 'Bluekip'. Objective to oust Remainer and Soft Brexit Tories. Expect the Tories to lose MPs soon, especially as this shit storm continues to run.
Make that 8. Another one's gone. She's sick of the anti-semitism that's rife in Labour apparently.QuoteThere is one consolation for Labour though. They might have lost 7 MP's, but at least they've got Derek Hatton backApparently there are so many ex UKIP members joining local Conservative parties, the Tories are being known as 'Bluekip'. Objective to oust Remainer and Soft Brexit Tories. Expect the Tories to lose MPs soon, especially as this shit storm continues to run.
To join the 'funny tinge' party!
The most reasonable thing to do for the leaving MPS is to stand down and trigger a by election, after all, they used the party to become MPs. However, they all realise that only rarely do independent candidates get elected in the UK. Most , if not all, would fall into that category. They are simply hanging onto the gravy train. If all of this leads to some sort of realignment in the political organisation of the nation, that may be no bad thing, since the present system is outdated and corrupted
She's sick of the anti-semitism that's rife in Labour apparently.Truly 'The Nasty Party' now
Cambridge Dictionary give two meanings for anti-semitism:In UK Englishanti-semitism: the strong dislike or cruel and unfair treatment of Jewish people.
Make that 8. Another one's gone. She's sick of the anti-semitism that's rife in Labour apparently.
Truly 'The Nasty Party' now :(
Odd isnt it, how members from the 2 major parties can now join the same independent party. One suspects that the ex labour people were always free market capitalists anyway, and sat uncomfortably in the labour group. Blairites i reckon. Good riddance. All Remoaners.Just on a technicality it's not a party.... yet :)
Yes it's quite incredible what passes some people by. For example, unfazed wasn't aware of the anti-Semitism in the Labour Party
What I wasn't aware was that there were a bunch of undercover socialists in the Conservative party.
But Jeremy Corbyn is an anti seminite, thereby a racistno hes nothes an ira sympaphiserno hes notHe has expressed sympathy with other terrorist groups toono he hasn't
The hard left spend their whole lives finger pointing. Consumed by hatred and chippynessYou could be describing the hard right (not sure about chippyness though).
The Tories supported apartheid in South Africa and wanted Nelson Mandela hanged...... as a 'terrorist'Whilst Corbyn was arrested at anti-apartheid protests.
Yes it's quite incredible what passes some people by. For example, unfazed wasn't aware of the anti-Semitism in the Labour PartyAnd no doubt like most others they can't come up with any credible evidence of such ‘anti-Semitism'.
3 of the Labour MP's who are part of the new independent party....
" Anti-Semitism is rife and tolerated"
"Labour is riddled with anti-Semitism"
"I cannot remain in a party that I have come to the conclusion is institutionally anti-Semitic"
Odd isnt it, how members from the 2 major parties can now join the same independent party. One suspects that the ex labour people were always free market capitalists anyway, and sat uncomfortably in the labour group. Blairites i reckon.
I think you totally missed the intended sarcasm :'( :rollinYes it's quite incredible what passes some people by. For example, unfazed wasn't aware of the anti-Semitism in the Labour Party
What I wasn't aware was that there were a bunch of undercover socialists in the Conservative party.
3 of the Labour MP's who are part of the new independent party....
" Anti-Semitism is rife and tolerated"
"Labour is riddled with anti-Semitism"
"I cannot remain in a party that I have come to the conclusion is institutionally anti-Semitic"
I think you totally missed the intended sarcasm :'( :rollinYes it's quite incredible what passes some people by. For example, unfazed wasn't aware of the anti-Semitism in the Labour Party
What I wasn't aware was that there were a bunch of undercover socialists in the Conservative party.
3 of the Labour MP's who are part of the new independent party....
" Anti-Semitism is rife and tolerated"
"Labour is riddled with anti-Semitism"
"I cannot remain in a party that I have come to the conclusion is institutionally anti-Semitic"
I mean Chuka Umunna – a Tory in the Labour party or what. Good riddance.Now on that point I will have to disagree :)
Splinter groups meh it's been tried before. Anyone remember the SDP?
On the other side there is a majority in the Tory party who may refuse the whip come a NO DEAL scenario.Dominic Grieve just said so on Newsnight
At least we got our bikes mate, and summer is coming... ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/Smileys/efocicon/smile.gif[/url])
We’re doomed, aye we’re aw doomed, ah tell ye, foccin doomed!Now look here. We don't want that sort of talk round here Fraser! ;)
And in the meantime big companies like Honda have lost patience, have decided the UK is a lost cause and are about to foc off.
Oh the joys of BREXIT. :)
BREXIT, what a joy. Thanks orgri, thanks for voting for mass poverty. Thanks for making us all poorer 8)
but the Labour party is not riddled with ‘anti-Semitism’.
Ask for the evidence of 'anti-semitism' and you will find little or none. (just updated that to make it clearer VNA)
QuoteYou critisize people for taking part in a democratic vote ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/file:///C:/Users/garet/AppData/Local/Temp/msohtmlclip1/01/clip_image001.gif[/url])
Nope. My criticism is that it was offered in the first place. It should have never been offered
BREXIT, what a joy. Thanks orgri, thanks for voting for mass poverty. Thanks for making us all poorer 8)
No, hes right, its all my fault. Its like when all those middle class corbynista kids at uni tell me about what its like for poor people in this country, as they turn up in their new cars (despite never having worked a day in their lives)that the "Brexit loving Nazi capitalist pigs" (their parents) have bought them. Me, having watched my mum go without food as a kid to feed me and my sisters, I aint got a fucking clue.
In their statement Honda said it was nothing to do with Brexit. Are you saying that they are lying?.Yes.
[size=78%]Some of the group of 11 want a "peoples vote" yet wont put themselves forward for re -election after leaving the party on which they gained their seat [/size][/size][size=78%] [/size][/size][size=78%]
The first rule of Remain...Have you finally got it at last, or have you been on the juice again? ;)
Any bad news is because of Brexit.
Any good news is because Brexit hasn't happened yet.
who was it that said "politics is just showbusiness for ugly people"...They've just been shown a picture of Boris in his pants :lol
Some of the group of 11 want a "peoples vote" yet wont put themselves forward for re -election after leaving the party on which they gained their seat :rolleyes
who was it that said "politics is just showbusiness for ugly people"... :lol :lol :lol :lol :lol
In their statement Honda said it was nothing to do with Brexit. Are you saying that they are lying?Honda don’t do politics. Japanese firms also have a completely different philosophy to business than we do in the west. Honour and trust are at the forefront of everything they do, and delivering on commitments is a matter of personal responsibility. In the west we tie everything up in complex legal contracts, whereas the Japanese keep that side of things very simple.
Some of the group of 11 want a "peoples vote" yet wont put themselves forward for re -election after leaving the party on which they gained their seat :rolleyes
No, hes right, its all my fault.Of course I am Ogri. :D It’s all your foccin fault. :wall At the end of the day we have to blame somebody, and right now you’ll do just nicely. >: >: >:
Im starting to wonder if your related to my first wife.. :lolQuoteNo, hes right, its all my fault.Of course I am Ogri. :D It’s all your foccin fault. :wall At the end of the day we have to blame somebody, and right now you’ll do just nicely. >: >: >:
:lol
.3rd when May called a general election on the ticket of "brexit means brexit" so we put her back.Ah, but we didn't did we? In fact we didn't give her enough votes to form a government. Neither did we vote for a bunch of homophobic religious bigots who are keeping her in power.
Quote.3rd when May called a general election on the ticket of "brexit means brexit" so we put her back.Neither did we vote for a bunch of homophobic religious bigots who are keeping her in power.
:rollin :rollin :rollin
Neither did we vote for a bunch of homophobic religious bigots who are keeping her in power.
He's citing the extremism, intolerance and anti-Semitism. What a disgrace they are now . Truly The Nasty Party
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/D0C1-ZtWwAIVRWe.jpg)Actually the younger generation on the continent as a whole are not happy with the EU and especially the Euro.
Actually the younger generation on the continent as a whole are not happy with the EU and especially the EuroAnd your evidence for this assumption is......?
QuoteActually the younger generation on the continent as a whole are not happy with the EU and especially the EuroAnd your evidence for this assumption is......?
Fact, google it yourself.QuoteActually the younger generation on the continent as a whole are not happy with the EU and especially the EuroAnd your evidence for this assumption is......?
Anything you'll ever need to know in one video:
|
Fact, google it yourself.Do all those countries have the Mail and Express too then? ;)
It will be in similar lodges around Tokyo that Brexit’s impact on Japan’s UK investments will now be discussed. In the 1980s this is where consensus was reached that Margaret Thatcher’s commitment to the European single market and customs union, along with her labour market reforms, offered a major opportunity for Japanese business. It would allow Britain to be the place where Japan could develop its famed “just-in-time” delivery system by sourcing production across Europe, without tariffs, regulatory and customs checks, and foster the recruitment and management of talent Europe-wide. They took her at her word, and the investment boom that has transformed the British car industry was born.
Today, a new Japanese consensus has formed. The Conservative party and its leaders cannot be trusted. They ignore warnings, break their word and do not understand business – personified by Old Etonians Boris Johnson and Jacob Rees-Mogg. Brexit is a first-order disaster, striking at the heart of how Japanese companies organise themselves as “lean manufacturers”. As Honda’s Patrick Keating, its European government affairs manager, briefed (https://www.theguardian.com/business/2019/feb/21/honda-european-chief-outlined-no-deal-brexit-concerns-in-2018)a meeting in Swindon in September, Brexit is likely to interrupt the just-in-time delivery of 2 million parts a day – a fifth of which come from EU suppliers. Those suppliers would have to fill out 60,000 customs declaration forms a year, he warned. One in five of its UK workforce are EU nationals. The world of tariff-free barriers – access to the EU’s free-trade agreements with other countries, and ability to move staff between countries promised by Thatcher – has evaporated in front of Honda’s eyes. Yes, it was operating below capacity, but within the EU Honda could have taken a long-term view and braved the downturn. Brexit forced the plant’s closure and the decision to produce in Japan (https://www.theguardian.com/business/2019/feb/18/carmaker-honda-plans-to-close-swindon-factory-reports).Will Hutton (political economist, academic administrator, and journalist)
Amazing, you've called it correct AGAIN ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/Smileys/efocicon/shocked.gif[/url]) . Despite what we were all told by the Honda boss, you just knew didn't you ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/Smileys/efocicon/wink.gif[/url]) . It HAD to be that pesky Brexit and it was!.
I don't know how you do it. Right EVERY time ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/Smileys/efocicon/shocked.gif[/url]) .
Looks like May is going to do everything she possibly can to force MP’s to vote for her ‘deal’.I think that was her plan all along. 'No Deal' was never going to happen, it's just being used to frighten MPs and us. That together with 'ongoing talks with the EU' to run the clock down so that everyone will be so 'grateful' a deal is in place.
As you say, if there's a deal that is just the start of 2+ years of negotiation of what kind of long term arrangements we have with the EU.I cannot see the backstop being removed from May's deal. And considering it has taken us well over two years to fail, so far, to get a withdrawl agreement in place - well really what chance is there, if some sort of May deal goes through, of us actually being able to negotiate BREXIT for real. 2 years? No way. We could be doing this for the next decade.
I made a mistake above. The ERG don't want any part of the England to be in a Customs Union. They couldn't give a foc about the rest of the UK.Which could leave Scotland with a lot of thinking to do and maybe a second Independence referendum. We need to be in the single market. Though that may mean a hard border with England, it is fairly straightforward compared to Ireland’s porous border between north and south. If we upgrade our east coast ports, we’d be in a position to attract manufacturing business up across the border from the north of England.
I think we oughtta bin this thread now, and the jihadi bird one too. weathers changing, summers coming, we can all start enjoying the bikes again and stop being stir crazy and menstrual.. ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/Smileys/efocicon/smile.gif[/url])
fuck me you agreed with me on one out of three!!! your getting soft feller...… ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/Smileys/efocicon/wink.gif[/url]) ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/Smileys/efocicon/lol.gif[/url])
Bloody global warmingNo such thing -- its a fake
you couldn't ski this year?No but I like a winter hill walk.
Oh the UK has just had it's warmest February day since records began.Just seen the overnight forecast. Warmer in Shetland (+7) than here in Essex (-1). Bonkers.
Apparently she won the game by deporting the black ball ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/Smileys/efocicon/smile.gif[/url])
QuoteOh the UK has just had it's warmest February day since records began.Just seen the overnight forecast. Warmer in Shetland (+7) than here in Essex (-1). Bonkers.
Which face of the many he has is Corbyn wearing for that announcement
It's all starting to look good :)
You couldn't make it up.
One step at a time :)
I can tell it's going well. The Leavers are complaining :lolBlimey, Leave must be romping home if that's the barometer of success. The Remoaners have done nothing but whinge and whine ever since the morning after referendum day :lol
This is priceless...Out of desperation to stop more rebel MP's jumping ship, Corbyn's on the verge of announcing that Labour back a second referendum.Well yes, in line with what was agreed at their party conference. He's just a wee bit slow in getting there.
Why then is it that we are dancing to the Junker shuffle (is it just me that thinks he shuffles like a dementia sufferer ).Why are we trying to get the EU to change bits so May can offer it up for a vote to MPs here.Why don't we create the changes our end first that will get the deal voted through by our MPs THEN take that to the EU and let the 27 vote on that. With the threat of no deal hanging over it if they vote no then they will have brought about the no deal themselves.Wow. Twisted logic or not. :lol
QuoteThis is priceless...Out of desperation to stop more rebel MP's jumping ship, Corbyn's on the verge of announcing that Labour back a second referendum.Well yes, in line with what was agreed at their party conference. He's just a wee bit slow in getting there.
And anyway, whatever happens if the UK leaves the EU on May’s disastrous deal or No Deal, as economy slides or nosedives, as the pound weakens, as more and more companies like Honda head for the exit, as unemployment grows and a million or more become dependent on foodbanks, you lot are going to try and blame the EU.
Everything in the BREXITEERS la la land is the fault of the EU
Went up to Cambridge for a few days to see my son, the wife and me were waiting in town and got chatting to a young English guy around 35 years of age selling copies of the Big Issue.
What a cracking bloke he was telling us one joke after another, he asked if we had heard of the Brexit Christmas Dinner, no Brussels, no Turkey and no place at the table. :rollin
Employment is at a record high
Employment is at a record high
The government is quoting a figure for "employment" which includes anyone who does ONE HOUR or more of paid work in a fortnight. It also includes 844,000 people who are on zero hours contracts or doing gig economy jobs with no job security.
And the only reason wages are "rising at the fastest rate for 10 years" is that, for the previous 10 years, the government deliberately restricted wage growth.
So, please, look at the facts, not the spin.
:rolleyes
Went up to Cambridge for a few days to see my son, the wife and me were waiting in town and got chatting to a young English guy around 35 years of age selling copies of the Big Issue.
What a cracking bloke he was telling us one joke after another, he asked if we had heard of the Brexit Christmas Dinner, no Brussels, no Turkey and no place at the table. :rollin
Yep hilarious. I hope you bought a copy after all that free entertainment?
Yes he certainly had a knack for tasteless quotes. I read some of those the other week. Particularly unpleasant stuff.No, he was the best comedian on the radio ;)
''The only way you can ever accuse a Conservative of hypocrisy is if they walk past a homeless person without kicking them in the face.''Foccing brilliant! :lol
Jeremy Hardy RIP
...and Labour have suspended Chris Williamson MP from the party over his vile anti-Semitism.Bonkers. And vile? Can you produce this vile 'anti-semitism' YamFazFan? Do you have evidence?
It amazed me that so many on the right are critical of antisemitism in Labour when there is so many, including members of this forum spouting such ignorant and vile islamophobia.
Quote...and Labour have suspended Chris Williamson MP from the party over his vile anti-Semitism.Bonkers. And vile? Can you produce this vile 'anti-semitism' YamFazFan? Do you have evidence?
Free speech is what they call it, and i believe if it's allowed then views needs to be heard from different sides to be fair to all parties.I don't agree with that :lol
Whether you agree or disagree to other peoples views is your choice entirely.
It amazed me that so many on the right are critical of antisemitism in Labour when there is so many, including members of this forum spouting such ignorant and vile islamophobia.
It amazed me that so many on the right are critical of antisemitism in Labour when there is so many, including members of this forum spouting such ignorant and vile islamophobia.
Yes, let's just label it Islamaphobia and hope no one dares talk about the nationwide rape and grooming of our children...
It’s official: people who talk about the problem of Pakistani men abusing white working-class girls have no place in polite society. Raise so much as a peep of concern about Muslim grooming gangs and you’ll be expelled from the realm of the decent. You’ll be shushed, exiled, encouraged to clean out your polluted mind.
[/size]That has been the experience of Sarah Champion, Labour MP for Rotherham, who quit as shadow equalities minister ([url]http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-40952224[/url]) this week over her Sun article on the gang of largely Muslim men in Newcastle who last week were found guilty of 100 offences, including rape against women and girls. Published last Thursday, Champion’s article ([url]https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/4218648/british-pakistani-men-raping-exploiting-white-girls/[/url]) said:[/font][/size][/size]‘Britain has a problem with British Pakistani men raping and exploiting white girls.’[/font][/size]But you’re not allowed to say that, even in the wake of convictions of Pakistani and other Muslim men for scores of sexual crimes. So she had to go.
[/size]The response to her article from Labourites was swift and unforgiving. Corbynistas branded her racist ([url]http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/areeq-chowdhury/sarah-champion_b_17750700.html[/url]). Tweeters called on Corbyn to sack her (purge the misspeakers!). Labour MP Naz Shah ([url]https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2017/aug/16/sarah-champion-complaint-sun-article-british-pakistani-men[/url]) branded her article ‘irresponsible’ and ‘dangerous’. Then Corbyn welcomed ([url]http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-40952224[/url]) her stepping down on the basis that Labour will never ‘demonise any particular group’.[/font][/size]
[/size]Champion said that she was distancing ([url]https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2017/aug/16/sarah-champion-complaint-sun-article-british-pakistani-men[/url]) herself from her article. She claimed the Sun over-edited it, but really this looks like a politician denouncing herself in public, not unlike those Soviet dissenters who would slam their old beliefs once they had been successfully corrected.[/font][/size]
[/size]The hounding of Champion is in keeping with the stricture against open discussion of Muslim grooming gangs, the institutionalisation of moral evasion on this issue. From local officials in Rotherham ([url]https://www.wsj.com/articles/brendan-oneill-when-political-correctness-took-over-in-yorkshire-1409249308[/url]) who failed to act on the exploitation of girls by men of Muslim origin for nearly 20 years to certain media outlets’ caginess about using the M-word in relation to these crimes (they prefer ‘Asian’ ([url]http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-4781426/Asian-grooming-gangs-treated-race-hate-crimes.html[/url])), there’s a palpable reluctance to confront the particular problem of some Muslim men’s disdain for white working-class girls.[/font][/size]
[/size]The cowardly reluctance to talk frankly about these gangs is not only an affront to open debate, sheepishly discouraging difficult questions about multiculturalism, cultural separatism, and why it is that some Muslim men — note the word ‘some’ — seem to have a low view of working-class white girls. It is also demeaning both to working-class women and Muslims. It tells young, poor women in certain parts of the country that we don’t take their victimisation seriously. And it sends the message that Muslims are incapable of self-reflection and must be protected from robust discussion about some of the attitudes that exist ([url]http://news.sky.com/story/sex-abuse-gangs-view-white-girls-as-worthless-and-trash-10982586[/url]) within their communities.[/font][/size]
[/size]The shutting down of debate about Muslim groomers is a particularly foul snub to the less well-off women of Rotherham, Oxford ([url]http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-oxfordshire-31643791[/url]), Newcastle. They are reduced to a moral inconvenience, to pesky individuals whose suffering punctures the happy stories we tell ourselves about multiculturalism and raises questions we’d rather not ask about clashing communities in 21st-century Britain.[/font][/size]
[/size]Contrast the treatment of middle-class women who have experienced sexism with the treatment of these poorer women who have been abused and raped. When a female Labour MP is called names on Twitter or a feminist student radical overhears a sexist joke, whole new campaigns are built. War is declared on ‘lad culture’. Yvette Cooper will call on women to ‘Reclaim the Internet’. But when girls of few means and little influence are raped by Muslim men, we’d rather not know. It gets reported on, of course, but it’s soon forgotten. It’s just too complicated.
[/size]Those who suppress open discussion of Muslim grooming gangs think they’re being socially virtuous, helping to maintain peace between communities. But in truth they have made a repulsive if implicit moral decision: that protecting Islam from criticism is more important than defending the dignity of white working-class girls. They sacrifice their feminism at the altar of multiculturalism. Their concern for women and the poor evaporates in the face of Islam. No price, it seems, is too high when it comes to ringfencing Islam and aspects of Muslim culture from public questioning — even the price of letting down working-class women, or at least making them feel like second-class victims.
[/size]Then there’s the diminishing of Muslims themselves. The true prejudice lies not in those who want to have an open debate about Muslim grooming gangs, but in those who want to protect Muslims from this debate for fear that they will feel devalued or offended by it. There’s an ugly neo-colonialist bent to this idea that any criticism of Islam or its adherents is ‘Islamophobia’ and must be extinguished to preserve the sensitivities of this fragile community. It infantilises Muslims. I trust that Muslims can cope with questions about their faith and their community and will want to do something about grooming gangs; what a shame so many in the political set do not.
[/size]It isn’t people like Champion who are ‘irresponsible’ and ‘dangerous’ ([url]http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/naz-shah-sarah-champion-child-abuse-pakistani-labour-newcastle-rotherham-bradford-a7890216.html[/url]) — it is the reluctance to confront communal problems. Wishing such problems away simply allows them to fester, unresolved, undiscussed, liable to creep up on us again.[/font][/size]
Free speech is what they call it, and i believe if it's allowed then views needs to be heard from different sides to be fair to all parties.With freedom of speech comes responsibility. Freedom of speech is not carte blanche to say whatever you wish, free of facts or evidence, free of responsibility of consequence.
Whether you agree or disagree to other peoples views is your choice entirely.
Quote from: VNA on 27 February 2019, 09:43:12 PM
Quote
...and Labour have suspended Chris Williamson MP from the party over his vile anti-Semitism.
Bonkers. And vile? Can you produce this vile 'anti-semitism' YamFazFan? Do you have evidence?
I'd suggest that you ask the Labour Party for the evidence. They suspended him.
Racism is unacceptable WHICHEVER source it comes from. Just because it's coming from the left in this instance doesn't justify it.
The Minister who resigned today pretty much summed up my feelings on the matter, that there is a hard core of MPs in parliament who have never accepted the result of the referendum and the view of the people and, their constant opposition has weakened our position in negotiations with their excellencies in the EUUndoubtably mate.
Dazza, what about the women and underage children groomed and raped by members of the EDL and BNP? Is it OK to campaign against them? If so why hasn't SYL done that?Why do you keep on trying to use this to deflect attention away from the Islamic Pakistani rape gangs ?
I know the answer. Because he doesn't use freedom of speech. He only campaigns against Muslims. Because he is a racist.
QuoteQuote from: VNA on 27 February 2019, 09:43:12 PM
Quote
...and Labour have suspended Chris Williamson MP from the party over his vile anti-Semitism.
Bonkers. And vile? Can you produce this vile 'anti-semitism' YamFazFan? Do you have evidence?
I'd suggest that you ask the Labour Party for the evidence. They suspended him.
Racism is unacceptable WHICHEVER source it comes from. Just because it's coming from the left in this instance doesn't justify it.
So having called a man a vile anti-Semite, you are unable to tell us what it is he has said or done that warrants such a serious accusation.
You don’t know, do you YamFazFan.
...and Labour have suspended Chris Williamson MP from the party over his vile anti-Semitism.These are your words. Can you back them up with facts? Why is it that you have deemed, that you choose, to call Chris Williamson a vile anti-semite?
YamFazFan, I'll quote you again;Once again, you need to ask the Labour Party why they've condemned his comments and suspended him from the party.Quote...and Labour have suspended Chris Williamson MP from the party over his vile anti-Semitism.These are your words. Can you back them up with facts? Why is it that you have deemed, that you choose, to call Chris Williamson a vile anti-semite?
I DON'T represent the Labour Party ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/Smileys/efocicon/rolleyes.gif[/url])
Dazza,No....fuck off.... If it winds you up then I'm sure Steve won't mind :b
This is a thread on BREXIT. What the fuck has your criminal, violent, fradulant, facist, islamaphoic, racist, fuck whit lying fud bastard of a hero got to do with BREXIT? FFS! :'(
Please stop hijacking Steve 10562's BREXIT thread.
QuoteI DON'T represent the Labour Party ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/Smileys/efocicon/rolleyes.gif[/url])
So what you are saying is that you are calling a man a vile anti-semite without reason.
I'm sure the Labour Party must have had good reason for taking this action. Ask them.So you don't know.
QuoteFree speech is what they call it, and i believe if it's allowed then views needs to be heard from different sides to be fair to all parties.With freedom of speech comes responsibility. Freedom of speech is not carte blanche to say whatever you wish, free of facts or evidence, free of responsibility of consequence.
Whether you agree or disagree to other peoples views is your choice entirely.
Dazza’s violent, fraudulent, racist fascist hero, whom cares not for facts, evidence or consequence, will one way or another slowly learn, that just as his violent actions have consequences, his abuses of freedom of speech equally will have consequences.
Dazza, what about the women and underage children groomed and raped by members of the EDL and BNP? Is it OK to campaign against them? If so why hasn't SYL done that?There is no "campaign" against edl or bnp members pedo crimes because one is not needed because as far is I can see they are reported by the msm and completely in the public domain.
I know the answer. Because he doesn't use freedom of speech. He only campaigns against Muslims. Because he is a racist.
Dazza,This is a thread on BREXIT. What the fuck has your criminal, violent, fradulant, facist, islamaphoic, racist, fuck whit lying fud bastard of a hero got to do with BREXIT? FFS! :'(VNA it is YOU again that brought scyl into the brexit thread- here------
Please stop hijacking Steve 10562's BREXIT thread.
Indeed, where is the outrage at those promoting SCYL?No one was talking about him for a while until YOU mentioned him again. You sound like an undercover fan attempting to promote him. After all you do agree with him 100% about the saudi's
9 members of a Bradford grooming gand were sentenced to up to 20 years yesterday FACTPerhaps I should of said "in the past" it was covered up. But I just tried to search for it on the BBC news site and could not find it until I tried harder and found it not on the main page and not in the regional page but in the local bradford page and nestled down underneath a section about "Bats, Balls and Bradford girls cricket team"
They were convicted because they were criminals. It was not 'covered up'
People on here quoting 'facts' without any proof or references whatsoever.I do not randomly pluck stuff out of thin air - go on google it yourself
It's never stopped you saying what you wish?I stand by what I say. I back up what I say. With free speech comes responsibility.
QuoteI'm sure the Labour Party must have had good reason for taking this action. Ask them.So you don't know.
Perhaps I should of said "in the past" it was covered up. But I just tried to search for it on the BBC news site and could not find it until I tried harder and found it not on the main page and not in the regionalIt was on the front page the day they were convicted, and again the following day when they were sentenced. It's now slipped down the rating because it's now 'old news'
from my experience they come from all RACES, COLOURS, AND RELIGIONS, in equal numbers all as nasty and odious as one an other. As for the grooming gangs from Bradford etc lets call them what they really are that's paedophiles which has nothing to do with there religion they are they same as all other paedophiles of what ever race or religion nasty, manipulative, evil, life changing for the victims and there families pieces of work, that I have had the misfortune to have to deal with due to my job over the last 30 odd years.Well said Steve :thumbup
It was on the front page the day they were convicted, and again the following day when they were sentenced. It's now slipped down the rating because it's now 'old news'
Ah I see it was my fault that I missed it - I must of blinked.Yep, pay more attention in future :lol
Yes I think it is a conspiracy but not what you are thinking its nothing about not "upsetting the muslimics" (this statement in itself shows just show how blind and blinkered you are ) But via use of D-notices and other means the gov are worried that if too much info was to come out or too much was made of the scale of it in the msm then they fear a threat to community cohesion. Same reason you don't hear about the French yellow vests that have been going on for 15 weeks or if you do it is played down.QuoteAh I see it was my fault that I missed it - I must of blinked.Yep, pay more attention in future :lol
Of course it's all a big conspiracy by the BBC, the government, the press etc. So as not to upset those Muslimics :rolleyes
"upsetting the muslimics" (this statement in itself shows just show how blind and blinkered you are )
QuoteFree speech is what they call it, and i believe if it's allowed then views needs to be heard from different sides to be fair to all parties.With freedom of speech comes responsibility. Freedom of speech is not carte blanche to say whatever you wish, free of facts or evidence, free of responsibility of consequence.
Whether you agree or disagree to other peoples views is your choice entirely.
Dazza’s violent, fraudulent, racist fascist hero, whom cares not for facts, evidence or consequence, will one way or another slowly learn, that just as his violent actions have consequences, his abuses of freedom of speech equally will have consequences.
It's never stopped you saying what you wish?
I abhor anti-Semitism, racism and discrimination in all its forms.
Yes I think it is a conspiracy but not what you are thinking its nothing about not "upsetting the muslimics" (this statement in itself shows just show how blind and blinkered you are ) But via use of D-notices and other means the gov are worried that if too much info was to come out or too much was made of the scale of it in the msm then they fear a threat to community cohesion.No it's been all over the msm for the last few years. Benn reported and debated to death. You just ain't being paying attention Fazersharp.
Anyway, back to talking about Brexit. It's far less incendiary ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/Smileys/efocicon/smile.gif[/url])
It's being reported that Jaguar Land Rover is about to anounce major investment in it's UK advanced manufacturing worth hundreds of millions of poundsYes heard this. Great news :thumbup
WHY IS NOBODY TALKING ABOUT THE LISBON TREATY, THE TREATY THAT COMES INTO FORCE 2020, ITS WORSE THAN THE SO CALLED DEAL, IF 99% OF THE BRITISH THINK TERESA MAYS DEAL IS BAD, JUST LOOK AT THE LISBON TREATY. PEOPLE NEED TO KNOW, LEAVERS AND REMAINLooks like more made up facebook pish.
..“What will actually happen if we stay in the EU” is a question no remainer will ever answer but here it is warts and all.
Check it out if you wish ——>>
1: The UK along with all existing members of the EU lose their abstention veto in 2020 as laid down in the Lisbon Treaty when the system changes to that of majority acceptance with no abstentions or veto’s being allowed.
2: All member nations will become states of the new federal nation of the EU by 2022 as clearly laid out in the Lisbon treaty with no exceptions or veto’s.
3: All member states must adopt the Euro by 2022 and any new member state must do so within 2 years of joining the EU as laid down in the Lisbon treaty.
4: The London stock exchange will move to Frankfurt in 2020 and be integrated into the EU stock exchange resulting in a loss of 200,000 plus jobs in the UK because of the relocation. (This has already been pre-agreed and is only on a holding pattern due to the Brexit negotiations, which if Brexit does happen, the move is fully cancelled - but if not and the UK remains a member it’s full steam ahead for the move.)
5: The EU Parliament and ECJ become supreme over all legislative bodies of the UK.
6: The UK will adopt 100% of whatever the EU Parliament and ECJ lays down without any means of abstention or veto, negating the need for the UK to have the Lords or even the Commons as we know it today.
7: The UK will NOT be able to make its own trade deals.
8: The UK will NOT be able to set its own trade tariffs.
9 The UK will NOT be able to set its own trade quotas.
10: The UK loses control of its fishing rights
11: The UK loses control of its oil and gas rights
12: The UK loses control of its borders and enters the Schengen region by 2022 - as clearly laid down in the Lisbon treaty
13: The UK loses control of its planning legislation
14: The UK loses control of its armed forces including its nuclear deterrent
15: The UK loses full control of its taxation policy
16: The UK loses the ability to create its own laws and to implement them
17: The UK loses its standing in the Commonwealths
18: The UK loses control of any provinces or affiliated nations e.g.: Falklands, Cayman Islands, Gibraltar etc
19: The UK loses control of its judicial system
20: The UK loses control of its international policy
21: The UK loses full control of its national policy
22: The UK loses its right to call itself a nation in its own right.
23: The UK loses control of its space exploration program
24: The UK loses control of its Aviation and Sea lane jurisdiction
25: The UK loses its rebate in 2020 as laid down in the Lisbon treaty
26: The UK’s contribution to the EU is set to increase by an average of 1.2bn pa and by 2.3bn pa by 2020
This is the future that the youths of today think we stole from them?
They should be on their knees thanking us for saving them from being turned into Orwellian automatons!
Forget Deals no deals its time for remainers and brexiteers to unite and see whats coming before its to late. This is the whole reason they are dragging brexit out. So we can get to 2020 then we have no choices anynore.
Who knows but it's food for thought from both side if it's anything like the truthIt's fiction.
what ever may happen we're gonna be half in and out the way things are going.
as for the lisbon treaty nothing is mention the above.just google it.
About like the rest of the b*ll*cks spoken from both sides then. Non of the so called experts/MPs know what the foc is going to happen one way or the other, but I do know it wont be them is badly affectedWe do know to a degree. Economically the vast majority of economists are in agreement, whatever we do in terms of leaving the EU will have an economic impact on the UK, that is a negative impact.
I think the most likely outcome, right now, is a very slightly amended May deal.Sadly, I think you are right but the numbers in Parliament will be very close. The deal that neither side wants but gets May off the hook and saves the Tory party splitting. Disgraceful to see some Labour MPs considering voting for the deal by being bribed by May's money for poor areas. The PM who promised 2 years ago to help 'just about managing' families, and delivered nothing.
Was pretty funny.I only didn't laugh out loud for fear that if I did my head would have fallen off :rolleyes
So, Warsi says the Tory party is riddled with Islamaphobia. Does that make it a score draw YamFazFan?
Hmmmm. Doesnt seem to have hindered her too much does it. Baroness Warsi PC FRTPI, Lawyer, politician, Member of the House of Lords, former Co-Chair of the Conservative Party, and authorWhat's that got to do with anything?
So, Warsi says the Tory party is riddled with Islamaphobia. Does that make it a score draw YamFazFan?
As I said previously, I abhor racism and discrimination in all its forms.Here's some mare fae ye;
The messages included one from an individual who wrote that they would like to “turf all Muslims out of public office”. Another said they wanted to “get rid of all mosques”. Many comments were found on a Facebook group supporting Jacob Rees-Mogg.
Earlier on Tuesday, it emerged one of the party’s council candidates had previously been suspended for comparing Islam to alcoholism in a tweet in 2015. In the same year, he wrote: “Turkey buys oil from Isis. Muslims sticking together.”Looks like the Tory party is riddled with racism, bigotry and Islamophobia. And there's real evidence out there that suggests this is indeed the case.
Peter Lamb, a council candidate in Harlow, apologised earlier this month, saying: “The tweet was aimed at the extremists that have hijacked Islam and are cowardly hiding behind the religion” and that it was not meant to apply to “those who follow the religion peacefully and are contributing to the diversity of the UK”.
On Tuesday, he tweeted: “I have reflected on my comments and decided that I should step down as a local election candidate and resign [from] the Conservative party with immediate effect.”
A Conservative spokesperson told the website Politics Home that, at the time of the initial tweets, Lamb had been suspended from the party before later being readmitted by his local association. The Harlow Conservative Association chairman, Clive Souter, described the punishment as a “slap on the wrist”.
It's being reported that Jaguar Land Rover is about to anounce major investment in it's UK advanced manufacturing worth hundreds of millions of pounds....But can it make up for Honda leaving and possibly followed by BMW and Toyota in the event of a NO DEAL BREXIT?
https://uk.reuters.com/article/us-britain-autos-jlr/jaguar-land-rover-to-announce-major-uk-investment-bbc-idUKKCN1QI517 (https://uk.reuters.com/article/us-britain-autos-jlr/jaguar-land-rover-to-announce-major-uk-investment-bbc-idUKKCN1QI517)
QuoteAs I said previously, I abhor racism and discrimination in all its forms.Here's some mare fae ye;
Tories suspend 14 members over alleged Islamophobia- https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2019/mar/05/tories-suspend-14-members-over-alleged-islamophobia (https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2019/mar/05/tories-suspend-14-members-over-alleged-islamophobia)
QuoteThe messages included one from an individual who wrote that they would like to “turf all Muslims out of public office”. Another said they wanted to “get rid of all mosques”. Many comments were found on a Facebook group supporting Jacob Rees-Mogg.QuoteEarlier on Tuesday, it emerged one of the party’s council candidates had previously been suspended for comparing Islam to alcoholism in a tweet in 2015. In the same year, he wrote: “Turkey buys oil from Isis. Muslims sticking together.”Looks like the Tory party is riddled with racism, bigotry and Islamophobia. And there's real evidence out there that suggests this is indeed the case.
Peter Lamb, a council candidate in Harlow, apologised earlier this month, saying: “The tweet was aimed at the extremists that have hijacked Islam and are cowardly hiding behind the religion” and that it was not meant to apply to “those who follow the religion peacefully and are contributing to the diversity of the UK”.
On Tuesday, he tweeted: “I have reflected on my comments and decided that I should step down as a local election candidate and resign [from] the Conservative party with immediate effect.”
A Conservative spokesperson told the website Politics Home that, at the time of the initial tweets, Lamb had been suspended from the party before later being readmitted by his local association. The Harlow Conservative Association chairman, Clive Souter, described the punishment as a “slap on the wrist”.
Here we go ........ it all begins to make sense now ..... but explains a lot about the people listed below.Where do you dig this shit up from? Apart from being weak as fuck, half of it is bullshit. It makes as much sense as your previous Lisbon Treaty post.
Dominic Grieve:
owns building land in France and receives donations from German businesses.
Anna Soubry:
owns property in Portugal and gets donations from the Ulster Unionist Party (a Remain group).
Chuka Umunna:
gets hospitality and payments (along with Grieve) from the Franco(French)-British Colloque and he also took a £50,000 donation from Farr Vinters Ltd, whose main business is, in their own words, "the purchase and sale of top Bordeaux wines" as well as "an in depth range of wines from other French regions including Burgundy, the Rhône and Loire valleys, Champagne and Alsace."
Joanna Cherry:
the SNP's gob in Westminster, is yet another beneficiary of the Franco-British Colloque and also has received donations and hospitality from the Public Diplomacy Council of Catalonia (you know, that region of Spain that voted for independence which was later criminalized).
Ian Blackford:
another SNP hypocrite, has shareholdings in Commsworld - a telecoms company that relies on sub-sea links to mainland Europe.
Vince Cable:
receives hospitality from IBEC, which is an organisation representing business interests in the Republic of Ireland.
These are but a few traitors with conflicting interests.
(Source:) Register of Members' Financial Interests (as of 03/12/2018) These traitors are only interested in their own selfish affairs, not democracy orQuotethe UK as they profess publicly.
Vocal Leave supporters like Rees-Mogg, Boris, Raab, Davies and Barclay don't have anything invested in the EU (except for one fund in Ireland that exists only to facilitate business with Northern Ireland). Farage has a German wife and still thinks leaving is right! Funny that... The truth is plain to see - you need only open your eyes
Bercow has received more than £70,000 worth of freebies and earns £153,145 a year and has a grace-and-favour home in Westminster, received £18,949.80 in 2016-17 alone, and has racked up £16,948.83 in 2017-18 and a further £9,296 so far this financial year
The Duke of Wellington, educated at Eton and Oxford, is believed to have received over £80,000 in EU subsidies for part of his 7,000 acre Hampshire estate in 2015. He is also believed to have claimed other separate subsidies for land he owns in Spain and Belgium. He is also one of 17 of the UK’s 24 non-Royal Dukes who receive large annual EU farm subsidies for the land they own.
In 2015, according to official figures, the total figure was around £4.6billion, the bulk paid to aristocrats directly or to trusts, companies and entities controlled by them.
Looks like the Labour party have a little problem of their own.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/amp/uk-politics-47482048 (https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/amp/uk-politics-47482048)
hit a raw nerve VNA. ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/Smileys/efocicon/lol.gif[/url]) ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/Smileys/efocicon/lol.gif[/url])
A disorderly no-deal Brexit would be only half as damaging as the Bank of England warned three months ago, Mark Carney has said. SOURCE: The Financial Times
Just saying.
I like posting shit gets to fools who bite. as for me taking in by crap,I dont believe half the crap thats in the papers or MP's even some post on here.Well you are posting it. You need tae find better bait. Try harder. :lol
QuoteI
I went went fishing here the place would foccin explode. ;)
And there is the proof that you are just another sad pathetic internet troll.
I went went fishing here the place would foccin explode. ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/file:///C:/Users/garet/AppData/Local/Temp/msohtmlclip1/01/clip_image001.gif[/url])
It's been a stitch up from the start
I havnt seen one thats even vaguely humerous, let alone funny.Here's anither fae ye! :lol
QuoteIt's been a stitch up from the start
Absolute correct. The referendum was not held for the benefit of the people. The people frankly didn’t particularly want a referendum on the EU.
The referendum was offered in order to unite a divided Tory party for long enough to prevent Labour winning an election.
David Cameron figured he couldn’t win a majority but either as a minority government or with a liberal coalition the referendum would be voted down in parliament. So, he felt free to offer it confident that he would not be able to deliver it to the people.
But he did win a small majority and having no real choice but to put it to parliament it was voted through with that small but workable Tory majority. Still he felt no real need to worry as with a solid remain campaign the people would not be daft enough to vote to leave. So, they didn’t even consider the consequences of a leave vote.
Once held and the result over the UK as a whole (not Scotland and Northern Ireland) was to leave, well you know the rest. With May’s disastrous snap election we were delivered into the hands of the ruthless aristocratical and monied wing of the Tory party whom quickly moved the goal posts and have held the country to ransom ever since.
Here's my prediction....
The Government loses tonight's vote, but by a smaller margin than previously.Admittedly it'd be a job to beat the size of the last one .
Then tomorrow Parliament will vote to reject 'No Deal'.
Next they will vote for an extension to Article 50. The EU will grant this on condition that there's a second referendum. Parliament votes for this course of action.
Leave win the second referendum, but Parliament has the final say. The Remainers in Westminster repeatedly thwart the result and we're back to square one
which Remain will win by a comfortable majority.
Best bit I heard is that Leavers might boycott a second referendum. Bring it on... :D
so let us leave with no deal, we'll be fine in the long runBut that's not what was on the referendum ballot paper. So people didn't vote for that either.
So we have another referendum with the 2 options...'Leave with May's deal' or 'Leave with no deal'. Sorted :)Yes we have had the "do you want to remain" vote and we told them no so now the vote should be how we LEAVE. It sickens me to hear those politicians who want to reverse the referendum but will not directly say so when asked.
I was not picking any single party out for the blame of this complete shambles they have left us in, they are ALL as guilty as each other.
So we have another referendum with the 2 options...'Leave with May's deal' or 'Leave with no deal'. Sorted :)That is not a choice. I too, and with out doubt over 50% of voters would abstain. Any such referendum would be declared invalid.
There you are VNA a thread all of your own for all your clap trap on Brexit and other politics. ENJOYAlmost forgot.
The next vote may be to extend article 50. If that is what happens it will go through with a majority.
Her 'deal' is dead.You mean dead and.............(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/D1iZYKVXQAEkDMI.jpg)
Why does May think she can bring her failed deal back 3 times, yet deny a second referendum?
She might just yet get this through. Even the DUP will start shitting bricks in a day or two.Lots of arm twisting and lying going on this morning.
and Remain lost againBut that wouldn't happen :)
But that wouldn't happen :)
All those MPs who campaigned for and won their seat on the back of backing/respecting the referendum.I think it was all those MPs who represent Remain majority constituencies. Not including former Brexit Secretary Dominic Raab of course (Esher and Walton 58.4% Remain), Theresa Villiers, former NI secretary (Chipping Barnet 58.9% Remain) etc etc. All continuously voting against the wishes of their constituents.
QuoteAll those MPs who campaigned for and won their seat on the back of backing/respecting the referendum.I think it was all those MPs who represent Remain majority constituencies. Not including former Brexit Secretary Dominic Raab of course (Esher and Walton 58.4% Remain), Theresa Villiers, former NI secretary (Chipping Barnet 58.9% Remain) etc etc. All continuously voting against the wishes of their constituents.
Don't 401 out of 632 MP's, that's 63%, represent constituencys that voted Leave?Didn't realise it was a numbers thing. Thought it was about individual responsibility.
Didn't realise it was a numbers thing. Thought it was about individual responsibility.
Um because they also voted against their wishes.
Amendment calling for new referendum rejected by 334 votes to 85
You've been duped :lol
Patience good people. The only nation yet to leave the EU was Greenland, and it took them 3 years. Its not over till the fat lady sings, and I cant wait to see the smug smiles wiped off the faces of the arrogant foccers acting against the national interest
Who knows what'll happen next :eek
Yesterday Corbyn instructed his MP's to abstain in the 2nd referendum vote then straight after said how Labour support a 2nd poll, thus keeping their voters in the North happy one minute and the South the next :lol
In all likelihood Leave will get duped.You were duped in 2016.
I think there's common agreement between our two sides that there are numerous factions at work in parliament, for a variety of reasons and that you currently can't bank on any MP holding the same view for more than a second. Duplicitous foccers at workAbsolutely agree.
QuoteIn all likelihood Leave will get duped.You were duped in 2016.
Today's news funny
Why say typical - starts something then leaves it to everyone else. He started Ukip - won the referendum and quit having achieved the job- done. Its not his fault the result is being betrayed by the duplicitous shameful politicians.
Nigel Farage to lead about 68 people on his march, but then, as is typical, he starts something then bails out and leaves everyone else to sort it out for him (https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/brexit-march-leave-farage-betrayal-sunderland-london-a8826126.html)...
He started Ukip - won the referendum and quit having achieved the job- done.Yes he has made quite an impact.
Which is also not his fault but is the politicians fault because they could (should) of made him Sir or Lord Farage and brought him into the government as the minster for brexit.
He's sold you something he has absolutely no responsibility for delivering.
Which is also not his fault but is the politicians fault because they could (should) of made him Sir or Lord Farage and brought him into the government as the minster for brexit.He failed to be elected as an MP seven times :)
He failed to be elected as an MP seven times :)Yes indeed Nigel and his party have time and time again been rejected by the public. The fact is an EU referendum was not a priority for the British public.
The Tories (thankfully) want nothing to do with him.
we probably were dupedOh yes, for sure.
Proving my point about it not being his fault he is not in a position to carry out any brexit responsibility and at the same time dismissing VNAs rubbish - thank you. You can not blame him for turning away from responsibility on one hand and then rejoice at him not being elected and prevented from doing anything with the other.QuoteWhich is also not his fault but is the politicians fault because they could (should) of made him Sir or Lord Farage and brought him into the government as the minster for brexit.He failed to be elected as an MP seven times :)
The Tories (thankfully) want nothing to do with him.
He failed to be elected as an MP seven times :)
Quotewe probably were dupedOh yes, for sure.
....and here's my full quote, not just the little bit you've extracted....
Oh the 'This is your decision. The government will implement what you decide' pledge.
Time will tell I guess, but yes I agree, we probably were duped by that promise :\
Bercow rules out May's 3rd vote :eek
Blimey, he's got balls!
Blimey, he's got balls!
Berk -o decided to look it up and went 400 years back to find the ruling.
Sure has. He's got a 'Bollocks To Brexit' sticker on his car hasn't he?. Oh no it's his wife's car isn't it
If you can't have the same vote more than once then that rules out a second referendum :)
But if the question is not "Leave/ Remain", but "Leave with May's Deal / No Deal / Remain", the question is (as the Speaker said) "substantially different"
Well in that case you vote and then the highest two go through to the next round.
But if the question is not "Leave/ Remain", but "Leave with May's Deal / No Deal / Remain", the question is (as the Speaker said) "substantially different"
So you have two voting options for the Leave voters to choose from, but just one for Remain, thus splitting the Leave vote in two and guaranteeing a Remain win?.
Yes you'd love that wouldn't you :lol
You can't have a referendum with 3 options. It has to be a binary question. Parliament will get to choose the question, as they did last time. Parliament has already ruled out No Deal,so it'll be Leaving under May's Deal/Remain. Easy win :)
Parliament has already ruled out No Deal,so it'll be Leaving under May's Deal/Remain. Easy win :)
Actually I've just had a look at the latest news headlines, and I haven't a foccing clue what's going on at the moment. But I suspect I'm not alone :rolleyesMay's going to write to Tusk begging for an extension up until the end of June....or possibly longer. Up to two years longer maybe. How humiliating.
Perhaps if nobody turned out to vote the MPs all of them from every party would realise what shower of s**t the general public thought they were.Trouble is there'd always be one idiot that votes, and we'd end up with Farage in charge :pokefun
Time to roll out article 61 of the Magna Carter and withhold our tax payments.
So you have two voting options for the Leave voters to choose from, but just one for Remain, thus splitting the Leave vote in two and guaranteeing a Remain win?.
Yes you'd love that wouldn't you :lol
So you have two voting options for the Leave voters to choose from, but just one for Remain, thus splitting the Leave vote in two and guaranteeing a Remain win?.
Yes you'd love that wouldn't you :lol
Perhaps you've not heard of the Single Transferrable Vote system?
Or do you think it would be too complicated for people to be required to rank their choices as 1st, 2nd and 3rd?
Working PAYE
'Magna Carter'
1. Notify HMRC in writing that you are invoking Article 61 of the Magna Carta
three remain on the statute book.
First, the freedom of the church is confirmed
Second, the pre-existing liberties and customs of the City of London are confirmed:
Third, perhaps the most famous of all: ‘No Freeman shall be taken or imprisoned, or be disseised of his Freehold, or Liberties, or free Customs, or be outlawed, or exiled, or any other wise destroyed; nor will we not pass upon him, nor condemn him, but by lawful judgment of his Peers, or by the Law of the Land. We will sell to no man, we will not deny or defer to any man either Justice or Right.’ (Chapter 39, 1215; Chapter 29, 1225.)
I haven't a foccing clue what's going on at the moment.
They're acting all superior and pretending to think about it, but we all know that they're shitting themselves about the UK leaving with no deal, or at all, and will definitely grant it in the hope that it might lead to Article 50 being revoked or the rigged referendum that you refer to.No they are not, and no they won’t. It’s not really their problem, and they are tired of wasting time doing BREXIT. They want to move on, and if the UK is not prepared to do likewise, well the UK can move on without the EU as far as the EU is concerned.
VNA Your last cartoon is the only one of the s**t cartoons you and your side kick have posted to make me chuckle ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/Smileys/efocicon/shocked.gif[/url]) ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/Smileys/efocicon/shocked.gif[/url]) ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/Smileys/efocicon/shocked.gif[/url]) ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/Smileys/efocicon/shocked.gif[/url]) ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/Smileys/efocicon/shocked.gif[/url]) ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/Smileys/efocicon/shocked.gif[/url]) ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/Smileys/efocicon/shocked.gif[/url]) ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/Smileys/efocicon/shocked.gif[/url])
There will be many thousands marching on Saturday demanding a second referendum, me included.You don’t fancy linking up with stockbroker Nigel’s March to Leave then? :lol
You don’t fancy linking up with stockbroker Nigel’s March to Leave then?
:eek :rollin :rollin :rollin Well of course it has. I only heard about it on here and I listen to a lot of news during the day.QuoteYou don’t fancy linking up with stockbroker Nigel’s March to Leave then?
Is that still going? Seems to have disappeared off the news.
Sounds like Corbin walked into the big meeting with may and the independent group were there (Chuka ) and Corbin turned on his heels walked out muttering "he (Chuka) is not a proper political party leader".You gotta ask what was Chuka doing there – why did May invite him? Chuka Umunna is neither a leader and nor is he a member of any party. I mean what the foc. :eek
What If;Aside from that just wouldn’t happen;
Remain had won the referendum, but the govt triggered Article 50 to take us out.
How would you feel?
She's now saying the voters are very tired and just want it sorted. Yes very true Theresa,
Sounds like Corbin walked into the big meeting with may and the independent group were there (Chuka ) and Corbin turned on his heels walked out muttering "he (Chuka) is not a proper political party leader".
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2019/mar/21/petitions-site-crashes-after-thousands-back-call-to-revoke-article-50 (https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2019/mar/21/petitions-site-crashes-after-thousands-back-call-to-revoke-article-50)It does not say who started that petition - It was a woman and she was interviewed by phone on the BBC from Cyprus.
It says 600,000 have signed it. How does that top the 17.4 million who voted to leave?Well it's already well over that figure. Give it time it's only just started.
But the lady herself said that it was getting nowhere and she almost gave up but then started to tell everyone she could (via facebook I assume ) and from there it went a little viral and all BEFORE May's tv statementNow 875,000 and still rising fast.
Yeah he threw a hissy fit apparently. Any excuse to be awkward ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/file:///C:/Users/garet/AppData/Local/Temp/msohtmlclip1/01/clip_image001.gif[/url]). Labour nearly always put getting one over on the government above the national interest.
Well it's already well over that figure. Give it time it's only just started.First I have heard of it. Just signed it. Will pass 1 million very shortly.
VNA It's you the one that's spouting the same clap trap as when I unfortunately started this thread I started it so you had your own thread oh forgot about your idiot side kick could spout off and the rest of us didn't have to put up with it. Personally I bitterly regret starting it and wish the moderators would take it down before it rips apart what used to be a great forum.
QuoteYeah he threw a hissy fit apparently. Any excuse to be awkward ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/file:///C:/Users/garet/AppData/Local/Temp/msohtmlclip1/01/clip_image001.gif[/url]). Labour nearly always put getting one over on the government above the national interest.
Let me put it this way – do you think May considered inviting Anna Soubry? Yeah seriously! I mean if she wanted the so-called Independent group to be there that would have been the respectful thing to do considering she was also inviting the leader of the opposition. No of course she wouldn’t- hell would have to freeze over before May would willingly invite Soubry to the table.
So yeah it was a set up. With just a few days to go she’s deploying every dirty political trick in the book.
Of course all the conspiracy theories coming out now.
Of course it's all a big conspiracy
The only reason I started my Christchurch thread is because I have been shocked by some of the extreme views expressed on this forum. I am talking about racist, fascist and Islamophobic comments and material. Not entirely to my surprise the thread has been pretty much ignored – though I had hoped maybe folks would have at least expressed their solidarity with the Muslim communities in Christchurch and indeed here in the UK. 50 innocent people, including young children, shot dead at their place of worship.Yes it was ignored and you then bumped it yourself because it was 10 post's down.over 100 people had looked at your post by then and not one person was willing to post - not because as you say they did not want to express solidarity (in your head ) but because everyone knows that you only posted it so that you could jump on to anyone who did not fully agree with you, then you could virtue signal your way through another 100 pages. Poor F4celess fell right into your trap and as far as I could see from his post he was coming from an angle of being on your side but your are so lost in your own world view that you read what you wanted or expected to read. 258 views now and no one apart from F4celess has posted into it. (of course I discount your wing man/sidekick who is always guaranteed to back you up )
PLEASE MODS TAKE THIS THREAD DOWN WHILE WE STILL HAVE A FORUM LEFT+1
Yes it was ignored and you then bumped it yourself because it was 10 post's down.over 100 people had looked at your post by then and not one person was willing to post - not because as you say they did not want to express solidarity (in your head ) but because everyone knows that you only posted it so that you could jump on to anyone who did not fully agree with you, then you could virtue signal your way through another 100 pages. Poor F4celess fell right into your trap and as far as I could see from his post he was coming from an angle of being on your side but your are so lost in your own world view that you read what you wanted or expected to read. 258 views now and no one apart from F4celess has posted into it. (of course I discount your wing man/sidekick who is always guaranteed to back you up )
It didn't work - no one will reply, so you are bringing the subject up on this thread just to cause more arguments and discourse.
a useless, dishonest, Prime Minister, who frankly is no longer in control of anything.But that's a fair description of all Prime Ministers and Politicians......They're all thieves and liars.
But that's a fair description of all Prime Ministers and Politicians......They're all thieves and liars.They got voted in. We voted them in to represent us.
I don't really give a fuck about people in suits who got nothing in common with me.I take your point. Fair enough.
best thing to do is vote with our feet (ok fingers) im kinda sick of it too lolPlease!
Sounds like Corbin walked into the big meeting with may and the independent group were there (Chuka ) and Corbin turned on his heels walked out muttering "he (Chuka) is not a proper political party leader".
Yeah he threw a hissy fit apparently. Any excuse to be awkward :rolleyes . Labour nearly always put getting one over on the government above the national interest.
It seems to me that Tusk came out with the most sensible comments yesterday. He appeared to be saying you either back May's deal next week or leave with no deal on Friday.
It says 600,000 have signed it. How does that top the 17.4 million who voted to leave?.
I suppose that constitutes 'Democracy' in the fantasy land the Remainers seem to inhabit :rolleyes
lol here we go again...the reason (imho) that we are up shit creek is not because we voted for Brexit. its because that vote was betrayed and sabotaged time and time and time again, ultimately inevitably bringing us to where we are now. Im guessing remainers see this as some sort of victory. enjoy..But where we are now is...... leaving. Why aren't you happy? No victory for us.
The only reason I started my Christchurch thread is because I have been shocked by some of the extreme views expressed on this forum. I am talking about racist, fascist and Islamophobic comments and material. Not entirely to my surprise the thread has been pretty much ignored – though I had hoped maybe folks would have at least expressed their solidarity with the Muslim communities in Christchurch and indeed here in the UK. 50 innocent people, including young children, shot dead at their place of worship.Yes it was ignored and you then bumped it yourself because it was 10 post's down.over 100 people had looked at your post by then and not one person was willing to post - not because as you say they did not want to express solidarity (in your head ) but because everyone knows that you only posted it so that you could jump on to anyone who did not fully agree with you, then you could virtue signal your way through another 100 pages. Poor F4celess fell right into your trap and as far as I could see from his post he was coming from an angle of being on your side but your are so lost in your own world view that you read what you wanted or expected to read. 258 views now and no one apart from F4celess has posted into it. (of course I discount your wing man/sidekick who is always guaranteed to back you up )
It didn't work - no one will reply, so you are bringing the subject up on this thread just to cause more arguments and discourse.
lol here we go again...the reason (imho) that we are up shit creek is not because we voted for Brexit. its because that vote was betrayed and sabotaged time and time and time again, ultimately inevitably bringing us to where we are now. Im guessing remainers see this as some sort of victory. enjoy..
Oh well I tried, you lot need to get out more, ta ta.This will help put an end to it dude :D
Yeah it's passed two million :)Unfortunately Mrs Georgiadou who started it is not here to enjoy it because she is currently in Cyprus
I have friends who are Brexiteers.I can think of three people I know who are BREXITEERS. One is a friend, the other two I get on fine with - no problem. That's it. It really is.I work in a power station with hundreds of others. The impression I get at work, well it's hard to find a BREXITEER. Nobody thinks the EU is super great, but everybody (bar two I know) accept we have to be part of it. Simply on balance it's a pretty good thing.
Ill sign it if it tops 17 million ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/Smileys/efocicon/wink.gif[/url])
The impression I get at work, well it's hard to find a BrexiteerEssex, my MP is Mark François. I'm surrounded by them :'(
you lot need to get out more
It says 600,000 have signed it. How does that top the 17.4 million who voted to leave?.three million, five hundred and four thousand and 95 signatures.
QuoteIt says 600,000 have signed it. How does that top the 17.4 million who voted to leave?.three million, five hundred and four thousand and 95 signatures.
Wow!
3,504,095
People don't want BREXIT.
I don't see why your surprised?It's not a vote Dude, nor is it a referendum. It’s a petition.
Nobody thinks the EU is super greatYou do :lol
lol here we go again...the reason (imho) that we are up shit creek is not because we voted for Brexit. its because that vote was betrayed and sabotaged time and time and time again, ultimately inevitably bringing us to where we are now. Im guessing remainers see this as some sort of victory. enjoy..Reversing the democratic result of the referendum would bring the Remainers joy beyond compare.
three million, five hundred and four thousand and 95 signatures.They had to remove a load of the 'signatures' when there was a similar petition for a second EU referendum in 2016.
Wow!
3,504,095
People don't want BREXIT.
They had to remove a load of the 'signatures' when there was a similar petition for a second EU referendum in 2016.
BTW are the hundreds of thousands of people turning up in London today also fake?Yes they're champagne socialists ;)
Keep clutching at straws.
"All we have had is a little whimper from those who still support BREXIT." All I have done is use your method of thinking - by not being there they do not support it according to you.
We’ve just seen one the of the biggest ever protests in London, perhaps up to or more than a million people demanding a second referendum – and yes because they do not want to leave the EU.
All we have had is a little whimper from those who still support BREXIT.
"All we have had is a little whimper from those who still support BREXIT."All I have done is use your method of thinking - by not being there they do not support it according to you.Lets see what the BREXIT side can muster - so far nowt.
Well so far it is 17,410,742, and then you can add the other 10.5 million who did not bother to have a champagne socialist day out in london or cant even be bothered to stay sitting on their arse and click a few buttons.Quote"All we have had is a little whimper from those who still support BREXIT."All I have done is use your method of thinking - by not being there they do not support it according to you.Lets see what the BREXIT side can muster - so far nowt.
Good luck wriggling out of that one VNA :lol
Shame it wasn't pissing down with 70 MPH winds in London today like it was the other week
https://www.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=318686752183474&id=1159720410844971 (https://www.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=318686752183474&id=1159720410844971)
But then the sun always shines on the righteous :)
It wasn't sunny enough. :)But then the sun always shines on the righteous :)
So what went wrong on 23rd June 2016? :lol
So what went wrong on 23rd June 2016?
The most telling thing about the massive petition and the difference in remainers and leavers, is that so many of you are willing to sacrifice democracy to achieve your goal.The thing is Ogri is that it is now almost three years since that referendum.
im not scared of anything mate in truth. too old for that. im not even disappointed, or angry. If thats how the country is now, then so be it. I dont think a democratically voted decision has a time limit, it is what it is. but thats just me I guess. its a brave new world..
There are serious issues concerning our democracy that need addressed.
.....what everyone else refers to as the other side winning fair and square ;)
This Million marchers figure. The bbc have been quoting "the organisers say its over a million ". Now whenever there is a march or a strike the bbc will quote the the organisers figure and always add the line "put the police but the figure at ----??.That's it, try and discredit. I was there. The million figure was an underestimate.
.Then on top of that they do not report on the progress of Farages march,Well to be fair, they do report when the Twat In A Hat occasionally turns up for a photo opportunity to rally his hundred or so marchers. But to be honest, it's hardly worth their while, is it :)
That's it, try and discredit.
Another referendum. What are you afraid of? :lol
But we won't lose, will we :lol
Another statistic:It is not a statistic - it is a remainer unicorn.
3 years ago. People have changed their minds.
take note remoaners.
The discrepancy is partly due to how the NHS recoups the money it is owed, but also partly because the costs of treating UK citizens abroad are high in comparison to the costs of treating European citizens in the UK.
The amounts involved are relatively small compared to the overall NHS budget, so the claim that changing this “in itself would transform the financial situation of the NHS” is exaggerated.
Health charities have said that the NHS in England needs an extra £4 billion just to stop services getting worse. Even if the UK Government recouped all of the money it is entitled to, this would represent a funding increase of just 7% of this amount.
[...]
To put this figure into some context, the total budget of the NHS in England in 2018-19 is £126 billion.
In the words of Tesco "Every Little Helps"take note remoaners.
And now the facts...QuoteThe discrepancy is partly due to how the NHS recoups the money it is owed, but also partly because the costs of treating UK citizens abroad are high in comparison to the costs of treating European citizens in the UK.The figures are broadly correct, although addressing this situation would in itself only have a marginal impact on the financial situation of the NHS. (https://fullfact.org/health/how-much-does-uk-recover-health-costs-eu/)
The amounts involved are relatively small compared to the overall NHS budget, so the claim that changing this “in itself would transform the financial situation of the NHS” is exaggerated.
Health charities have said that the NHS in England needs an extra £4 billion just to stop services getting worse. Even if the UK Government recouped all of the money it is entitled to, this would represent a funding increase of just 7% of this amount.
[...]
To put this figure into some context, the total budget of the NHS in England in 2018-19 is £126 billion.
What there was yesterday was lots of young people and families. Not a grumpy old man in sight.
I can not find an official numbers estimate from an intendant body, I find this really odd as there is always a police estimate issued. The best I can find is this. Manchester Metropolitan University’s Keith Still, a world leader in crowd science who has developed mandatory event-monitoring training for police. Said “Based on the visuals from the helicopter image, it’s between 312,000 and 400,000 people,”Well of course there's not an 'official estimate' we didn't go through bloody turnstiles.
Yes but when it comes to polling day all the 'grumpy old men' (and grumpy old women let's not forget ) turn out come rain or shine.
And one person's estimate from looking at a helicopter image? Be serious :lolI thought you remainers liked the expert's.
No you're not 'interested in trying to find a true estimate '. You're just trying to discredit.You can have your 1m if you like - I am not trying to discredit it at all. I am just seeing some odd reporting of the numbers.
Anyway, I'll ask again, how many at Fartage's march?There again I have been googling to try and find out but the results are being swamped with anti brexit stuff mainly about London. I think there are a core set of marchers between 70-150 doing the whole thing.Its one thing for the champagne socialist to go and have a short stroll in London - maybe take in a theatre whilst there or that little Rupert and Poppy to the park, and a totally different thing to commit to walking 270 miles in 14 days.Sums up the difference between remain who are just looking at short term gains and rewards and the leavers who are looking wider at the long term.
So you keep reminding us :z
I was there.
No you're not 'interested in trying to find a true estimate '. You're just trying to discredit.And you're not interested in democracy if it doesn't result in the outcome you wanted.
Democracy isn't just a one off event.
mtread was at the champagne socialists, overturn democracy march on saturday :lol
That if you lose that one you'll demand a third....and a fourth............
brexit tennis.Can't be that. People move around in tennis.
QuoteThat if you lose that one you'll demand a third....and a fourth............
I do wonder if you are really understanding this YamFazFan.
The argument for, and the reason why, the government may have to return this issue to the people is that parliament is stuck. MP’s are not prepared to vote for what they see is a shit deal. MP’s are not prepared to allow a NO DEAL BREXIT as it would be devastating for our economy.
Therefore, unless they find a way to move forwards (Norway?) they will have to put the question to the people. This is not a second referendum on the EU, it is a referendum on the deal. Do you want it or not...... The question will be;
May’s Deal.
or
Cancel Article 50
It will be legally binding. There will be no further referendum.
Get it?
Where is the evidence for this remainers Unicorn "the people have changed their mind/want another vote" .That's not why the Remainers are demanding it though. They keep telling us that 'the people have changed their mind' and want another vote. They were saying that months ago.QuoteThat if you lose that one you'll demand a third....and a fourth............
I do wonder if you are really understanding this YamFazFan.
The argument for, and the reason why, the government may have to return this issue to the people is that parliament is stuck. MP’s are not prepared to vote for what they see is a shit deal. MP’s are not prepared to allow a NO DEAL BREXIT as it would be devastating for our economy.
Therefore, unless they find a way to move forwards (Norway?) they will have to put the question to the people. This is not a second referendum on the EU, it is a referendum on the deal. Do you want it or not...... The question will be;
May’s Deal.
or
Cancel Article 50
It will be legally binding. There will be no further referendum.
Get it?
you keep telling us that the people have changed their mind.
Did anyone see the channel 4 news debate where they tried to show how the young people want to remain so they assembled a group of 18 to 20 year olds to give their usual biased account and it massively backfired on them.:rollin :rollin :rollin :rollin :rollin Channel 4 really did not do their normal "research" did they. I can almost hear Jon Snows neck creak as he looks over his shoulder at his careerer with Channel 4 or the creak of Channel 4 bosses necks as they place their heads in their hands.
I think this is the one.
https://www.channel4.com/news/brexit-debate-what-young-people-really-think (https://www.channel4.com/news/brexit-debate-what-young-people-really-think)
.The people want a no deal. -- See its easy to say, just like when remainers say "the people want a new referendum" .Yes and there's 'at least one hundred, possibly one hundred and fifty' marching demanding No Deal. According to some obscure 'expert' in a helicopter. Mind you, it took him 2 hours to find them :)
So, Parliament votes 329 to 302 to debate alternative plans for Brexit :)There is nothing to be glib a about/ The only thing being lost is democracy. Vote leave won and before it is even carried out it is being eroded. backed by the BBC channel 4 and Sky
you are losing, one step at a time :)
There is nothing to be glib a about/ The only thing being lost is democracy. Vote leave won and before it is even carried out it is being eroded. backed by the BBC channel 4 and SkyI'm very glib, thank you very much. Parliament doing what May should have done 2 and a half years ago, rather than pandering to the right just to try to keep the Tories together. Parliamentary democracy at its best.
A pathetic number of votes :lol
Second referendum on its way :)
A pathetic number of votes :lol
About 10% of the Revoke petition...! :D
.
They reckon between 312,000 and 400,000 attended the march in London on Saturday.
1 million! :lol . More Remain lies :)
Who cares if it was 1 million, 2 million, 10 million or 1 man & his dog :rolleyes
Who cares if it was 1 million, 2 million, 10 million or 1 man & his dog :rolleyes
Well you did in « Reply #2731 on: Today at 10:17:45 AM » and you declared it to be "More Remain lies".
Hmm...
Who cares if it was 1 million, 2 million, 10 million or 1 man & his dog :rolleyes
OK then, there was only a third of the number they claim was there. More project fear from Remain.
Here we go again
I thought modern cars already had this technolgy. Recently saw a program which involved a crash in Ontario, and the cops just plugged in their laptop and knew the speed of the vehicle on impact and whether it was braking or not. Mentioned it to a pal who is a Volvo service manager, and apparently Volvo's have this facility.Yes Ford, Mercedes-Benz, Peugeot-Citroen, Renault and Volvo already have models available with some of the technology fitted.
.... and the UK government has decided to adopt it, even though it might not be in the EU.Yes and you have just debunked your own argument about all the remain scare mongering about the environment, crime detection, workers rights, food safety. As with the cars here ,after brexit the UK simply can agree / decide to adopt them.
And you've just debunked your argument that everything's the fault of the EU :)Nice try - I have never said that - neither have brexiters. Its just another tool in the remain book of throwbacks. I think that particular one go's between racist and didn't know what they were voting for.
Yes, I can really see its full of families mtread, more like the pill popping junkies you get at Glastonbury.You should have been there Dazza ;)
Ok then :DI'll scream and scream and scream, until I'm sick.
Another doozy from the EU EU plans speed-limiting technology for new cars from 2022All new cars could be fitted with special devices from 2022 to automatically make them keep to the speed limit after new EU rules were provisionally agreed.cars will also be fitted with compulsory data recorders "black boxes". So if you have an accident, the police and your insurance company will know whether you've been keeping your foot down and routinely ignoring the car's warnings.
Indeed. The day might come when they take down all the unnecessary speed cameras :)That's right they will not be necessary because through the gps system that controls it, the fine will be instantly taken from your bank account.
Sorry Dazza. Don't follow your links. They're all bollocks. If you want to say something, say it here :)Don't worry I have clicked the link so you don't have to and here are a few screen shots for you. I really feel relived that our future may be in the hands of this lot.
. I really feel relived that our future may be in the hands of this lot.But it isn't.
I agree it's a terrible idea, and our (current) government has decided they are going to do it as well anyway.Finally an admittance that the EU dictators dish out some stupid bad ideas. And our gov HAVE to adopt it because we were and still are in the EU. At least out of the EU we can actually blame and change our own government.
I'm fearful of the whole idea of autonomous cars or even large scale 'driver assist', of which this is the worst example. I don't want somebody's software deciding whether I survive.
Here's a couple of pictures giving a better idea of the day. You may spot a couple of your mates :lolYes I recognise one of them
Yes I recognise one of themThat would be difficult. He's dead. :)
I agree it's a terrible idea, and our (current) government has decided they are going to do it as well anyway.No, I don’t much fancy it either, but our government is already looking at adopting it.
Oh the petitions,Tusk had the audacity to stand up in the EU parliment as say "You can not betray the 6 million who marched and signed the petition to revoke article 50" :eek :eek
Revoke article 50 is now 5,881,298 and still rising as I type this.
The we want NO DEAL petition is 581,777
With a petition approaching 6 million and some one million people taking to the streets of London last weekend. Well it is clear people want their say. And there is no thirst whatsoever in the country for NO DEAL.
Tories again putting their party before country.But all parties do that. As I've said before, all Politicians are thieves and liars. All Politicians are in it for their own personal gain. There is not one Party or Politician who really gives a flying fuck about the hard working man on the street as long as they are doing very nicely out of it. The usual case of "Fuck you Jack, I'm alright."
:agree Yes - so why on earth would someone want and extra layer of politicians within the EUTories again putting their party before country.But all parties do that. As I've said before, all Politicians are thieves and liars. All Politicians are in it for their own personal gain. There is not one Party or Politician who really gives a flying fuck about the hard working man on the street as long as they are doing very nicely out of it. The usual case of "Fuck you Jack, I'm alright."
Latest news. May offers to resign if they back her deal. Tories again putting their party before country.
Yes - so why on earth would someone want and extra layer of politicians within the EUBecause they're a foc site better than the crap we currently have in the UK :)
But all parties do that. As I've said before, all Politicians are thieves and liars. All Politicians are in it for their own personal gain. There is not one Party or Politician who really gives a flying fuck about the hard working man on the street as long as they are doing very nicely out of it. The usual case of "Fuck you Jack, I'm alright."No, I can’t agree with that.
Because they're a foc site better than the crap we currently have in the UK ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/Smileys/efocicon/smile.gif[/url])
So what happens on Monday?. Do they have another go at this?
Yes all my own work (and Paul Simons) though that you would of noticed 50 ways to leave your lover
Watch out tomorrow at the leave means leave rally in London as its likely to be infiltrated by antifa/hope not hate who are going to cause trouble and make it look like its the brexiteres. Then watch how it is flashed all over the news when for 2 weeks the news have not said a thing about the 400 mile march. Wouldn't be the first time the BBC have been caught working with these far left wing groups.It's like living under the third Reich. State controlled propaganda machine in full flow and all the leftie brown shirts waiting in the wings to kick off.
Watch out tomorrow at the leave means leave rally in LondonThe age old tactic of getting your defence in first :rolleyes I take it by 'infiltrate' you just mean 'outnumber'. Because Nigel's rally has just been...... pathetic.
Nigel was on top form with his speech in Westminster today. Brilliant speaker :)Very much agree, and he didn't need any notes. :lol
Very much agree, and he didn't need any notes. ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/Smileys/efocicon/lol.gif[/url])
Apparently the commemorative 50p has been put on hold....
People's Vote march - a million people - no arrestsAnd it's statements like that that make you look like an idiot.
Leave Means Leave march - a few thousand - Latest from the Met - As of 21:00hrs five arrests have been made at the demonstrations in Central London today: x2 for assault, x1 drunk & disorderly, x1 for assaulting a police officer & x1 male arrested after being identified as wanted for an offence in Herts. All are in custody.
Just saying..... :rolleyes
Leave Means Leave march - a few thousand - Latest from the Met - As of 21:00hrs five arrests have been made at the demonstrations in Central London today: x2 for assault, x1 drunk & disorderly, x1 for assaulting a police officer & x1 male arrested after being identified as wanted for an offence in Herts. All are in custody.I am surprised the figure is so low especially as they are all supposed to be fascist, racist, thick, thugs. Or maybe its because they are all OAPs with walking frames.5 arrests up to 9 pm I would of thought that was less than a normal Friday in London. :rolleyes :rolleyes
Just saying..... :rolleyes
People's Vote march - a million people - no arrestsThe Remainers would have been too busy eating their Waitrose prawn sandwiches, on their weekend jaunt. People had to put themselves out to attend yesterday being a work day.
Leave Means Leave march - a few thousand - Latest from the Met - As of 21:00hrs five arrests have been made at the demonstrations in Central London today: x2 for assault, x1 drunk & disorderly, x1 for assaulting a police officer & x1 male arrested after being identified as wanted for an offence in Herts. All are in custody.
Just saying..... :rolleyes
And it's statements like that that make you look like an idiot.The actual headline from the Met for the people's vote march was ....no significant arrests... However, guess what, one of my old school mates was on duty as a Metropolitan police officer on the March and he informed me that his squad alone made 47 arrests.You keep saying a million, what a load of shit. Professional military analysts put the figure between 180000 and 230000...... Yep, that's as close as they can estimate given the location.I was there today and knew I would be quizzed over numbers so I took my clicker and done a head count as they were herded down Whitehall.
When I got got to 100000 I realised that's all my clicker went up to so then had to keep a record of how many times my clicker zeroed ..... Guess what....... I totally lost count after 1 million.
I am surprised the figure is so low especially as they are all supposed to be fascist, racist, thick, thugs. Or maybe its because they are all OAPs with walking frames.5 arrests up to 9 pm I would of thought that was less than a normal Friday in London.
The Remainers would have been too busy eating their Waitrose prawn sandwiches, on their weekend jaunt. People had to put themselves out to attend yesterday being a work day.You mean some of them have actually got jobs? :eek
The very idea of Tommy Robinson (https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/tommy-robinson) being at the centre of the Brexit debate is too awful to contemplate"
https://twitter.com/i/status/1111715367615901701 (https://twitter.com/i/status/1111715367615901701)QuoteI was surprised too. I expected it to kick off between Nigel's crowd and the UKIP/SYL mob.
Its time to re-title this thread to "The VNA and MTread Thread". I think everyone else is pissed off with being talked down tothats why I stopped posting in it. no loss I know... :lol :lol
Anyway, our cartoons and pictures are quite funny, you must admit :DErrr......no !!......Although the Royal Mail one was mildly amusing.....
If there is an election and the country ends up being run by three people (Corbyn, mcdonnell and abbot)......................Well, umm, how about....................
This is funny;
[url]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PNc8aR-OTE8[/url] ([url]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PNc8aR-OTE8[/url])
Quite an achievement… a panel where Will Self isn’t the most annoying participant.
Do you mind, that's my MP ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/Smileys/efocicon/shocked.gif[/url])
you remoaners will believe any thing that the lying papers will print.You mean like this.................
Remainers can't even grasp that the EU money that is used in our country is actually our money
So if I have got this correct.
Scotland's MPs tonight have voted positively for all 4 options.Not quite. The SNP abstained on Ken Clarke's 'Customs Union only' vote, which lead to it losing by 3 votes
Fight! Fight! Fight!
So if I have got this correct.
Scotland's MPs tonight have voted positively for all 4 options.
Not quite. The SNP abstained on Ken Clarke's 'Customs Union only' vote, which lead to it losing by 3 votes
Stop Press. May's latest announcement this evening 'The Labour Party is now in charge of Brexit' ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/file:///C:/Users/garet/AppData/Local/Temp/msohtmlclip1/01/clip_image001.gif[/url])She is clearly rejecting NO DEAL and asking for a further extension. But it remains anybody’s guess if any sort of deal can be reached. This is still all about the Troy Party.
Brexit uncertainty has cost Britain £600 million a week - Goldman Sachshttps://uk.reuters.com/article/uk-britain-eu-goldmansachs/brexit-uncertainty-has-cost-britain-600-million-a-week-goldman-sachs-idUKKCN1RD1T8 (https://uk.reuters.com/article/uk-britain-eu-goldmansachs/brexit-uncertainty-has-cost-britain-600-million-a-week-goldman-sachs-idUKKCN1RD1T8)
NO DEAL is still the default position. We leave on the 12th April.
We are reliant on the EU offering an extension. I’m not sure that – having a chat with Jeremy is going to cut the mustard. But lets see what happens.
This is getting desperate. And if all that is achieved is a customs union, which is what I expect, well there is then a high possibility of a second Scottish Independence referendum. If that happens, the Tories will refuse permission, the Scottish Parliament will do it anyway and the UK’s constructional crises will continue to get worse.
The Tories have once again completely fucked everything up.
You have to be careful with referendums. Youve lost the last 2 ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/file:///C:/Users/garet/AppData/Local/Temp/msohtmlclip1/01/clip_image001.gif[/url])
Stop Press. May's latest announcement this evening 'The Labour Party is now in charge of Brexit' :)
The Tories have once again completely fucked everything up.Indeed. You have to wonder why May didn't seek cooperation two years ago.
I admire the prime minister, think she’s a hero, and have been one of her strong supporters.Which suggests The Chief Political editor of the Telegraph is off his trolley. However…..
It is practically certain that the next Tory leader will rip up Mrs May’s deal, however sensible and well-intentioned, and then embark on another two-year-long attritional battle with Europe. Does anybody truly want this? And just think what damage will be done to Britain as a nation.But the EU isn’t prepared to renegotiate. And of course, May’s Deal settles nothing. The risk is actually that the next Tory PM, that is if May ever goes, will crash us out of the EU.
Investment-led growth has collapsed, and we need to stare that undeniable fact squarely in the face. Just look at the events of the early months of this year.Yup totally agree with him there.
I vividly recall the wave of national elation when Margaret Thatcher brought Japanese car manufacturers to the declining north-east of England in the 1980s. This was a turning point in British industrial history.And I agree again, that BREXIT is risking the desolation of British manufacturing industry. The Japanese car manufacturers are already leaving.
When she was home secretary, Theresa May kept promising to combat the relatively high levels of immigration. The reality was she was powerless to do anything about it.That’s simply not true. The truth is that she would not apply the rules of freedom of movement. The truth is that freedom of movement within the EU is not an issue for the UK.
The EU has just signed a huge, ground-breaking free-trade deal with Japan. If we leave, we must begin complex negotiations to get something as good. Does anyone seriously think we could get something better?Which is why we need to kill BREXIT now. It’s possible that if we did Honda could be persuaded to stay. And Nissan and Toyota persuaded not to leave as they are without doubt gearing up to do.
All that will happen in future is that the UK, post Brexit, will be forced to ask to piggyback on EU trade deals with, say, Japan to secure equal terms. Our only argument will be that the aggregation of our market to the EU’s will add strength. Which is no more than the restoration of the position had we remained in the EU.Absolutely agree. We already have and will get further excellent free trade agreements round the globe with continued EU membership. Outside the EU if we manage to squeeze the same quality of deals, well to do so will practically take mirracles.
The Brexiteers made a succession of claims about leaving the EU that have turned out to be untrue. They said it would be quick and easy. They said that a raft of trade deals would be available by the time we left the EU. To quote Liam Fox, “The free trade agreement that we will have to do with the European Union should be one of the easiest in human history. ”Yes, Peter Oborne and your paper was part of the driving force behind the lies. Surely this man should either persuade the editor and board of this paper to change tack, or leave. This is not any ordinary issue. It will, and may already be, determining the economic future of the UK. BREXIT is in fact an extraordinary exercise in self harm. And powers like The Telegraph have extraordinary in terms of influencing BREXIT.
Great solution, just too easy isn't it ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/Smileys/efocicon/rollin.gif[/url]) ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/Smileys/efocicon/rollin.gif[/url]) ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/Smileys/efocicon/rollin.gif[/url])
Watching the house of Parliament in action is nearly better than watching 'Yes Minister'. ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/file:///C:/Users/garet/AppData/Local/Temp/msohtmlclip1/02/clip_image001.gif[/url])
Personally, whilst there is the possibility of civil unrest, at least to some small degree, I cannot see any risk of civil war. I mean the 2014 Scottish Independence Referendum passed largely without incidence.It may not be a civil war as we know of in the past but will be in the same vane of families and friends and neighbours turning against each other, if there is not a quick fix, but a recession/depression then it could escalate to be more serious and even though nobody wants it, with people playing the blame game.
.The difference there was that nothing changed, but Brexit is a different story completely. There will be major changes.
I mean the 2014 Scottish Independence Referendum passed largely without incidence.
People in Southern Ireland are concerned, but not as much as people Northern Ireland, there is a generation of people in Northern Ireland who have never known trouble times thanks to the Good Friday agreement. They voted to stay in the EU and the party holding the balance of power in Westminister seem to have forgotten that.
But are people in Ireland concerned? A hard BREXIT, should it happen, will have a massive economic impact on ordinary people in the UK. We do a shit load of trade with Ireland, and I would guess we are your biggest agricultural customer. A hard BREXIT won’t hit you as hard as us, but Ireland could be dragged into recession to some degree.
Then of course the most important part for me is that we cannot undermine The Good Friday agreement. A hard BREXIT effectively tears up that agreement and forces a border between NI and Eire. I don’t think a hard BREXIT will happen, but it could happen.
The difference there was that nothing changed, but Brexit is a different story completely. There will be major changes.But nothing has yet changed with BREXIT. And with luck nothing will change, but there is a different mood in England and small but not insignificant extreme right.
Brexit is probably the one thing that may result in a United IrelandI have been wondering that perhaps, more and more, young Unionists will begin to understand that their so-called Tory friends in England don’t actually give a flying fuck about them. That even they might begin to consider that they might just have a brighter future in a united Ireland.
Wealthy people like Nigel Farage who earns between 500,000 to 800,000 a year and can afford private planes to bring him to meetings and Boris Johnson earning over 500,000 a year (Both with net worths over 1.5 million) do not have the will of the working class at heart only what they can gain from the chaos.Yes, and according to Professor Minford, the darling economist of the Brexiteers, there is big money for them to be made from a hard BREXIT. Don’t forget Jacob Rees Mogg – net worth 150 million.
That figure is the celebrity net worth per year. Their personal wealth is probably 100 times that, but did not think it was worth checking :lol :lol :lol
As for Farage and Johnson, did you get your decimal place in the wrong place? I would expect them both to worth a heck of a lot more than 1.5 million.
How, exactly, is 82 "near 100" FFS!Errrm it's 18 short of 100 and 82 away from 0. Seems nearer 100 to me :rolleyes .
Theresa May said today the local election results gave both the Conservatives and Labour a simple message "to get on with Brexit".
Let's have a look at those results in detail shall we :rolleyes
If that's the case then hardly anyone will vote for Nigel's Brexit Party in the European Parliament election.
Assuming the UK is actually taking part, we'll find out soon won't we
How, exactly, is 82 "near 100" FFS!Errrm it's 18 short of 100 and 82 away from 0. Seems nearer 100 to me
It wouldn't get any comedy awards either.
That's the most unfunny 'joke' I've ever heard :rolleyes
They're going for £20,000+ now. Bloody BREXIT ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/Smileys/efocicon/wall.gif[/url])
QuoteThey're going for £20,000+ now. Bloody BREXIT ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/Smileys/efocicon/wall.gif[/url])
No need to panic, a brand new Z900RS is yours for £10200 quid.
I gotta admit it makes no sense now that I ride like an old fart, but i'd love an mt10... :)You should take one out for a spin. I didn’t even manage to get a mile from the dealership before I’d pulled a wheelie. It can be civil, but it’s an absolute brute when you try and spank it.
The Z900RS is the best looking road bike currently available IMHO. Not got the power of the MT10, but I like the retro looks.Not seen one in the flash, but the photos do now’t for me.
But pre referendum it was 10k on the road. Now it’s 12k.
Wonder what sort of discount I can get.
Bloody BREXIT.
Anyway why on earth would you buy a Z900RS over a Speed Twin?
If you want cool retro looks in a modern bike then the speed twin hits the spot.
That's a bit like saying why on earth would you buy a red bike instead of a blue one. It's all down to individual taste. There's no right or wrong answer.
We all have our own individual opinions and likes. Would you believe it, some people even voted for Brexit :eek
([url]http://kickstart.bikeexif.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/01/2019-triumph-speed-twin-review-5.jpg[/url])
Or,
(https://cmsimages-alt.kbb.com/content/dam/kbb-editorial/motorcycles/2018/2018-Kawasaki-Z900RS-55.jpg)
May 8th Euro elections poll puts Nigel's Brexit Party on 34%, Labour 21%, Lib Dems 12%, Tories 11%, Green 8%, UKIP 4%, SNP 4%, Change UK 3%.https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2019/may/11/poll-surge-for-farage-panic-conservatives-and-labour (https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2019/may/11/poll-surge-for-farage-panic-conservatives-and-labour)
QuoteMay 8th Euro elections poll puts Nigel's Brexit Party on 34%, Labour 21%, Lib Dems 12%, Tories 11%, Green 8%, UKIP 4%, SNP 4%, Change UK 3%.https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2019/may/11/poll-surge-for-farage-panic-conservatives-and-labour (https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2019/may/11/poll-surge-for-farage-panic-conservatives-and-labour)
You've been reading the Guardian! :eek
Anyway, if you remember the polls in 2016 put Remain ahead. Tactical voting on the 23rd could destroy the frogface one.
Nigel says that the policy of the BREXIT party is not to have a manifesto. :eek
I guess, sort of vote for us and see what you get. Maybe they should call themselves the lucky dip party.
Worth watching – Andrew Marr absolutely destroys Nigel Farage.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/p078zjlq (https://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/p078zjlq)
Is this what you really want?
Voting for a party that has publicly said it will publish its manifesto after the election :rolleyes You lot are easily fooled (again)
THIS THREAD GOT FAR MORE INTERESTING WHEN WE WERE TALKING BIKES. SAME BIASED B****KS COMING FROM THE SAME 2 MOUTHS.
If you look back I have asked for it to be removed on more than 1 occasion. It was titled just for VNA trouble was we all joined in and are now suffering the consequences.
If you look back I have asked for it to be removed on more than 1 occasion. It was titled just for VNA trouble was we all joined in and are now suffering the consequences.
I might be wrong, but as the creator you're able to edit/alter the thread title though aren't you?.
Couldn't you just rename it something non-descript and hope it slips away into obscurity? :lol
THIS THREAD GOT FAR MORE INTERESTING WHEN WE WERE TALKING BIKES. SAME BIASED B****KS COMING FROM THE SAME 2 MOUTHS.
So-called "political animals" are the worst kind of person. Promoting division, stirring argument, self-righteous, arrogant pricks, the lot of em.
BUT...
You started this thread steve... :b
It should be removed from the forum.
I wonder if you’d laugh if someone threw something all over your misses or children.I very much doubt it.
TommyRobinson.......MEP for the North East.
I wonder if you’d laugh if someone threw something all over your misses or children.He’s gonna get a lot more than a milk shake in his face over the next few months , and yeah it’s gonna put one big foccing smile on ma face. Bye bye SCYL.
QuoteI wonder if you’d laugh if someone threw something all over your misses or children.I very much doubt it.
My 'child' is 36 and 20 stone. The perpetrator wouldn't have got anywhere near him :D
Anyway, Tommy Ten Names likes starting trouble and then playing the victim. It's a far right thing.
I think his point was more like what if it was acid?I think you'll find the bloke was drinking the stuff before he threw it....
I never saw him drink anything by the way, all i saw was some majorly smug grin as he launched the container.When you read about the full report, SYL and his followers approached him first and baited him. SYL wants to portray himself as the victim, always. The thrower is now also getting death threats.
QuoteI never saw him drink anything by the way, all i saw was some majorly smug grin as he launched the container.When you read about the full report, SYL and his followers approached him first and baited him. SYL wants to portray himself as the victim, always. The thrower is now also getting death threats.
As to 'always set in our ways', well perhaps it's not just us, is it?
I have many friends who voted Leave. We accept each others' view. I don't have any friends that support SYL.
SCYL is a thug. A football hooligan who’ll stick you in hospital for wearing the ‘wrong’ colours.https://l.facebook.com/l.php?u=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.youtube.com%2Fwatch%3Fv%3DlFY6oWjqJsA&h=AT1eWwZkGYpL68_-doCnKZOt8iBfzkmsW7q3dNGK_JdxiPMBIsx4Kk7wJjXpwiCQHtPJHE8OsU_iofc3xCUxc-4_G_uWIb3BFN5v4qS4tZn59YUaV5mHYqdiBt0&s=1 (https://l.facebook.com/l.php?u=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.youtube.com%2Fwatch%3Fv%3DlFY6oWjqJsA&h=AT1eWwZkGYpL68_-doCnKZOt8iBfzkmsW7q3dNGK_JdxiPMBIsx4Kk7wJjXpwiCQHtPJHE8OsU_iofc3xCUxc-4_G_uWIb3BFN5v4qS4tZn59YUaV5mHYqdiBt0&s=1)
He fights and attacks people for fun. He’s got multiple convictions, yes including assault.
He’s a fascist, a bigot and a racist.
He’s a man who tries to get paedophiles of the hook for his own narcissistic pleasure and to try and incite racist bigoted violence.
The man is an utter cunt. Foc him.
Carl Benjamin and Stephen Christopher Yaxley-Lennon are now it appears being regularly pelted with milkshakes as they tour the country campaigning for the Euro elections. :)So from the look of it you think that's all ok and completely acceptable then.
Carl has managed three shakes in three consecutive days. :) :) :)
Stephen is trailing him slightly at the moment with only two milk shakes in two consecutive days. :) :)
If either of them decide to venture North of the border I’d be happy to buy them a milkshake or two. ;) :D :lol
Would be difficult to argue otherwise I guess?.Only if they get over 50% :b
Yep, the two left wingers think it's perfectly acceptable to assault someone with a different point of view from themselves.Like I said at the beginning, this is going to be an interesting social experiment.The only ones who really condone violence are the supposed liberals.BTW....Tommy Robinson has got more integrity in his left bollock than most of the MP's in Parliament and most definitely the two left wing fuckwits on here Now, where's that popcorn ?
QuoteWould be difficult to argue otherwise I guess?.Only if they get over 50% :b
It wouldn't make a lot of difference if they got 90%.Nigel reckons he's going to get 110%. It must be true, he's written it on the side of a bus :)
https://l.facebook.com/l.php?u=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.tr.news%2Fislamic-attack-what-really-happened-yesterday-in-oldham%2F&h=AT0-II4Xe1vnjc4bKie165oEjag2ortUNRdLqhR24ERDolayjxzXwD48j1TcpotEy1H2tWmemkfMAueZcXELJ1lc1VB1t0LuLl4bzKHinQOFpo_d8Ub2KIXbYyk9x0z2AJqncDw&s=1 (https://l.facebook.com/l.php?u=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.tr.news%2Fislamic-attack-what-really-happened-yesterday-in-oldham%2F&h=AT0-II4Xe1vnjc4bKie165oEjag2ortUNRdLqhR24ERDolayjxzXwD48j1TcpotEy1H2tWmemkfMAueZcXELJ1lc1VB1t0LuLl4bzKHinQOFpo_d8Ub2KIXbYyk9x0z2AJqncDw&s=1)
People who are condoning the "milk shaking" are implying that physical violence against politicians is acceptable.In a democracy you argue and debate and vote, you don’t use violence. But in the view of those cheering the assault, violence is acceptable.What impact do you think this message you are supporting will have on some angry members of the public who think Brexit-betraying Labour and Tory MPs are traitors.You can’t claim that a handful of men shouting in Anna Soubry’s face outside Parliament is an outrage against the democratic process but the assaulting of other electoral candidates is fine.
QuoteIt wouldn't make a lot of difference if they got 90%.Nigel reckons he's going to get 110%. It must be true, he's written it on the side of a bus :)
Open top I expect with solid tyres, vintage 1917. Last seen giving mystery tours of the High Street
I bet he doesn't even own a bus! ;) [/font]
In that case The Brexit Party can add on 50% of the Labour vote (the Northern half) and most of the Conservative vote.Well that'll be another 1% (combined). I expect the Tories and Labour to do very badly.
I see Nigel Farage has had a milkshake thrown over him now.Does the idiot who chucked it seriously think that he's done the Remain cause any good?
Anyway, the Brexit Party is being rumbled :)
I think just about everybody has already made up their minds.Correct - that happened in 2016
Now beer - I can agree with.
Although he spoilt Nigel's day, I reckon the twat who chucked the milkshake probably did himself a favour by not drinking it.
In today's paper it says he's a Corbynite hipster that brews craft beer and hates Tories. What a surprise.
Judging by the pictures he doesn't look like he hates fast food outlets though :rolleyes
Now beer - I can agree with.
Although he spoilt Nigel's day, I reckon the twat who chucked the milkshake probably did himself a favour by not drinking it.
In today's paper it says he's a Corbynite hipster that brews craft beer and hates Tories. What a surprise.
Judging by the pictures he doesn't look like he hates fast food outlets though :rolleyes
Ask them for advice - tell them about your larger drinking and that you want to see what all of this "real ale" thing is all about and they will be more than happy to point you into the direction an appropriate one to try. Go for a half or if it is a proper full blown festival - rather than a pub with a few extra guest beers on then you should be able to buy in 1/3rd glassesNow beer - I can agree with.
Although he spoilt Nigel's day, I reckon the twat who chucked the milkshake probably did himself a favour by not drinking it.
In today's paper it says he's a Corbynite hipster that brews craft beer and hates Tories. What a surprise.
Judging by the pictures he doesn't look like he hates fast food outlets though :rolleyes
I can't get into real ale. I have tried but I think I've been drinking lager for too long now :lol .
Even went on the tour of the St Austell brewery the other week. Gorgeous aroma, but it still hasn't won me over :\ . There's a big beer festival on all week here now so maybe I ought to get down there.
Yep, the two left wingers think it's perfectly acceptable to assault someone with a different point of view from themselves.
Like I said at the beginning, this is going to be an interesting social experiment.
The only ones who really condone violence are the supposed liberals.
Official party policy is Out, but on their type of deal. Any other type of deal/no deal = second referendum. You clearly weren't paying attention :lol
Brexit and UKIP ones went straight in the recycling. Too hard for AndrexActually our brexit party one would be the best for the loo as it is a uncoated plain paper and A4 but the ukip one is a glossy A5 - not good for the loo.
Getting a collection of leaflets now but found a good use for one of them.
ABB - Anybody But Boris :eek
81 year old peacefully and democratically campaigning for The Brexit Party has milkshake thrown over him...Yep the likes of VNA think its funny.
https://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/1131606/brexit-former-paratrooper-attacked-brexit-rosette (https://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/1131606/brexit-former-paratrooper-attacked-brexit-rosette)
Tactics straight out of the natzi election rule book.Milkshakes vs Death threats and worse?
81 year old peacefully and democratically campaigning for The Brexit Party has milkshake thrown over him...
81 year old peacefully and democratically campaigning for The Brexit Party has milkshake thrown over him...
Did he? Look at the pictures of Farage and the others who *were* hit by milkshakes and compare them to this guy and notice the complete difference in the splash patterns and the fact that this guy has clean trousers and shoes.
Was he really "attacked"? Or was this actually "friendly fire"...?
I thought we'd already heard all of the Remainers conspiracy theories regarding the whole Brexit episode, but that's definitely one of the bestHere's a picture of Farage having been hit by a milkshake (which is a *liquid* that, surprisingly, tends to spread and run when it's thrown at someone instead of staying in discreet blobs...)
That's a new one Grahamm.So far no credible witnesses, no description of the attacker, and well, no nothing. Seems a bit fishy.
Welcome back. You're just in time for the European Parliament election results .The press appears to have lost interest :rolleyes It's all about the Tories (yet) again.
QuoteWelcome back. You're just in time for the European Parliament election results .The press appears to have lost interest :rolleyes
It's always a sure sign that your argument is lost when you have to resort to throwing food or drink.It’s a harmless way of letting fascists, racists, liars and bigots know that they are not welcome.
QuoteIt's always a sure sign that your argument is lost when you have to resort to throwing food or drink.It’s a harmless way of letting fascists, racists, liars and bigots know that they are not welcome.
It also makes pompous, narcissistic wankers look stupid. They hate the resultant images.
And of course it's fun. :)
No one should be throwing ANYTHING at ANYBODY whatever their political persuasion.I agree.
Bit of a rename againCall it what you want Steve. It is, and always will be your thread. You started it :D
These people are not respectable politicians dedicated to serving their constituents or committed to the betterment of the country as a whole.what about the old feller who was an ex para?
We are not talking of people of a political persuasion.
They are dishonest con-merchants, opportunistic, divisive, dangerous wankers.
Foc Nigel Farage. Foc em. He’s a cunt of a man.
And trying to justify it by citing an MP who got murdered by a nut case, right wing or otherwise, speaks volumes too.Agree, it does speak volumes. Thomas Mair was a right wing Brexit supporting terrorist inspired by the lies about immigration and Europe spouted by Farage and his like.
what about the old feller who was an ex para?Smells a bit fishy that one. Doesn’t add up. Fake.
Thats the problem when anybody justifies such ridiculous acts. People use that justification to carry them on against anybody they see fit to warrant it.Like the 19 year old British lassie whom you’d like to see have her throat cut?
Apparently the Farage milkshake was 'Banana & Salted caramel' flavour.Nice. :)
In retrospect I reckon Nigel was lucky. If the bloke had actually drunk any of it Farage would more than likely have been covered in vomit
QuoteApparently the Farage milkshake was 'Banana & Salted caramel' flavour.Nice. :)
Especially when Labour commits to Remain...... which will be tomorrow :D
Well the regions are still declaring, but I'm predicting that there will be more Remain MEPs than Leave ones.Eh :rolleyes -- is your name mtread Abbott
Eh -- is your name mtread Abbott
Here are the results so far for EU seats. Scotland are still to announce and so are NI
There will be more Lib Dem + Green + SNP + Plaid Cymru + Labour MEPs than there are Brexit Party + UKIP ones.
I'm leaving the Tories out of the calculation as they are 50:50
The majority UK representation in the EU Parliament will be pro Europe :)
Greens are pro EU but people are not voting for them because of that - they are voting for the green issueNonsense. There you go, putting your spin on the outcome. Just coincidence that Labour won most of its seats in strong Remain areas?
Greens are pro EU but people are not voting for them because of that - they are voting for the green issueThat's exactly what Ann Widdecombe said. Are you dancing partners? :lol
If you really wanted to remain you would vote Lib Dem otherwise you risk splitting the vote, so you wouldn't vote green for remain, you vote green for the green issue -who have gained momentum on the back of the recent protests.QuoteGreens are pro EU but people are not voting for them because of that - they are voting for the green issueThat's exactly what Ann Widdecombe said. Are you dancing partners? :lol
There's your democratic confirmation, the will of the people has switched from Leave to Remain.As clearly displayed by this results map of England and Wales :lol ...
There's your democratic confirmation, the will of the people has switched from Leave to Remain.As clearly displayed by this results map of England and Wales :lol ...
latest news- the brexit party have just released their new 'milkshake proof' uniform . . .
So what would the results be if this was general electionSimple, come a general election The Brexit Party will nose dive. They have no policies and no manifesto. They need to try and find 650 candidates. That could be 650 candidates out on the street without any real organisation behind them, and 650 candidates popping up in the media no doubt contradicting each other over what their polices should be, because they haven’t sat down together and figured out what they stand for other than BREXIT.
This is the first election I've ever seen where the party that came second with almost half the seats of the winning one has still claimed outright victory :rolleyes
C’mon chaps, it’s bank holiday,Must be an English bank holiday. Just back fae work.
whilst Labour has the opportunity to speak out on behalf of the majority who now clearly want an end to all of this and sweep to power in a Landslide election.:rollin :rollin :rollin
Shame you couldn’t make it to Margate with us mtreadGood one Dazza :thumbup But that colour would clash with my jacket.
If you could show some proof that the old feller getting milkshaked was fake that would be good. Or perhaps me posting anywhere on any forum that a 19 year old girl should have her throat cut?Quotewhat about the old feller who was an ex para?Smells a bit fishy that one. Doesn’t add up. Fake.QuoteThats the problem when anybody justifies such ridiculous acts. People use that justification to carry them on against anybody they see fit to warrant it.Like the 19 year old British lassie whom you’d like to see have her throat cut?
We are talking milkshakes here Ogri.
If you could show some proof that the old feller getting milkshaked was fakeUm I think you'll find it works the other way round. Things have to be proven to be a fact. Basic concept of common law.
I try really hard not to get involved in mud slinging and name calling on the old internet, because i'd much rather say something to someones face. But you are a patronising prick mtread, who constantly tries to take the high morale ground, and I'm done interacting with someone like that. I'll stick to the fazer thou threads, and you can stick to acting like everybody else here doesn't warrant a civil reply.
I try really hard not to get involved in mud slinging and name calling on the old interneObviously you don't. :rolleyes
Its because they've lost the argument. They are ever more trivial, insulting, and arrogant.Jesus Christ it's a just a disagreement over politics. Just like half the country is divided at the moment. (Some) Leavers just can't understand why anybody should dare to disagree with them. Lighten up you two.
If you could show some proof that the old feller getting milkshaked was fake that would be good.Yes I feel mtread is correct. It looks like dirty tricks. A set up. Fake news.
Or perhaps me posting anywhere on any forum that a 19 year old girl should have her throat cut?Oh I am sorry, you just wanted her murdered, you didn't state how the act should be carried out. I apologise for that, but you did express support for the summary execution of a pregnant teenage girl.
But you are a patronising prick mtread, who constantly tries to take the high morale ground, and I'm done interacting with someone like that.Chill out dude. Seriously ;)
Its because they've lost the argument.
(Some) Leavers just can't understand why anybody should dare to disagree with them.
The vast majority of leavers have just voted to leave on WTO rules.Trump-- the scotts are happy to insult him with one hand but even happier to take his golf course money with the other.
Not to mention the vast majority of leavers have no real clue as to why they want to leave in the first place.
BREXIT is the UK’s Trump moment – and it’s quite a moment. :eek
As clearly displayed by this results map of England and Wales :lol ...
The vast majority of leavers have just voted to leave on WTO rules.How do you figure that? Which is, in any case, different from actually knwoing why you want to leave.
Would have been there, but I'm now in Carlisle on the way to Remain Central.
Sorted :thumbup ...As clearly displayed by this results map of England and Wales :lol ...
Now try showing us one weighted by population (you know, the *number* of people who voted) instead of area, because, surprisingly, large sections of empty space don't actually vote... :rolleyes
The leavers who voted for the Brexit party did so knowing that the brexit party have said that voting for them is a vote to leave on WTO rules. I would not expect you to know that because you and your side kick are too busy mutually masturbating each other over your side kicks tommy robbo thread.QuoteThe vast majority of leavers have just voted to leave on WTO rules.How do you figure that? Which is, in any case, different from actually knwoing why you want to leave.
Would have been there, but I'm now in Carlisle on the way to Remain Central.
Every time Carlisle is mentioned I can almost smell those biscuits cooking :b
The leavers who voted for the Brexit party did so knowing that the brexit party have said that voting for them is a vote to leave on WTO rules.
I try really hard not to get involved in mud slinging and name calling on the old internet, because i'd much rather say something to someones face. But you are a patronising prick mtread, who constantly tries to take the high morale ground, and I'm done interacting with someone like that. I'll stick to the fazer thou threads, and you can stick to acting like everybody else here doesn't warrant a civil reply.
By your side on this one fella - you can VNA to the same group as Mtread - respect other views ffs!
But you are a patronising prick mtread:lol
Now try showing us one weighted by population (you know, the *number* of people who voted) instead of area, because, surprisingly, large sections of empty space don't actually vote... :rolleyesSorted :thumbup ...
So, the country is split (more or less) in half between hard Brexit and hard Remain. How do we get out of this mess?I’m gonna disagree with you, but please don’t call me a prick. :lol
Oh and PS, the number of people who signed the petition Revoke Article 50 and remain in the EU - 6,085,326
This Government will not revoke Article 50. We will honour the result of the 2016 referendum and work with Parliament to deliver a deal that ensures we leave the European Union.
But...... in the international standard ISO list of 'countries' Northern Ireland is described as a 'province' not a 'country'. Probably so as not to upset Eire.
There I go, being a 'patronising prick' yet again ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/Smileys/efocicon/lol.gif[/url])
On the other hand, yes Revoke Article 50, and think about leaving the EU in another 40 years time. You know it makes senseGood plan, I'll be long dead by then. :lol
Err, no, that just shows areas, not the number of people.
Bank holiday Monday ;) .
Carlisle - I smell no biscuits either.
Biscuit Means Biscuit!:lol
Oh and PS, the number of people who signed the petition Revoke Article 50 and remain in the EU - 6,085,326'The number of people who signed the petition'...that's a bold claim claim given the findings of exactly who, or rather what, has 'voted', and how many times, in previous online petitions :lol .
The trouble with referendums is that unless the majority is a big one, the 'problem' continues.
We really have no choice. We need to move on. It is time to cancel article 50.
Minus the Green vote, which could be as much down to David Attenborough and the fact that the environmental crisis is never out of the news at the moment, as it is Brexit and it's 4,697,611 against 5,802,996.Now try showing us one weighted by population (you know, the *number* of people who voted) instead of area, because, surprisingly, large sections of empty space don't actually vote... :rolleyesSorted :thumbup ...
Err, no, that just shows areas, not the number of people.
Whilst you're looking for that, here's some interesting figures on the number of votes for you...
The Brexit Party - 5,248,533
UKIP - 554,463
Total - 5,802,996
Lib Dems - 3,367,284
Greens - 2,023,380
SNP - 594,553
Plaid Cymru - 163,928
Change UK - 571,846
Total - 6,720,991
Oh and PS, the number of people who signed the petition Revoke Article 50 and remain in the EU - 6,085,326
Two out of four countries in our union voted to REMAIN in the EU.One country and one province ;)
David Cameron made perhaps the biggest blunder in UK political history.I think May comes a close second. If, straight after the referendum, she had ignored her hard Brexit ERG and approached Labour to agree to go to the EU for a soft Brexit, (rightly or wrongly) we'd be out by now. The parliamentary majority would be there, despite the hard Brexiteers or Remainers. But of course her pride /obstinacy /self interest meant she wouldn't. Her tactics were stupid. That's how history will judge her.
ou know full well that's not going to happen. There wouldn't be a Parliamentary majority for it. Nowhere near.
Minus the Green vote, which could be as much down to David Attenborough and the fact that the environmental crisis is never out of the news at the moment, as it is Brexit and it's 4,697,611 against 5,802,996.Are you making this up :lol The Green Party have been absolutely clear they are a Remain Party since the beginning.
One country and one province ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/file:///C:/Users/garet/AppData/Local/Temp/msohtmlclip1/02/clip_image001.gif[/url])
I think May comes a close second. If, straight after the referendum, she had ignored her hard Brexit ERG and approached Labour to agree to go to the EU for a soft Brexit, (rightly or wrongly) we'd be out by now. The parliamentary majority would be there, despite the hard Brexiteers or Remainers. But of course her pride /obstinacy /self interest meant she wouldn't. Her tactics were stupid. That's how history will judge her.
Are you making this up ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/Smileys/efocicon/lol.gif[/url]) The Green Party have been absolutely clear they are a Remain Party since the beginning.
And do not forget that the outcome of the EU elections is Labour becoming a REMAIN party.
Thanks Nige :D
Indeed. You would not vote Green if you fundamentally opposed the EU. The Green Party is a pro EU party – no question.
That's obviously a big fat lie. It's a well known fact (Known by at least 2 people) that every single person who voted Green, only voted for them because they are anti Brexit, they don't actually give a toss about the environment and the big move to Green parties throughout Europe is entirely Brexit related too by the way. ;)Indeed. You would not vote Green if you fundamentally opposed the EU. The Green Party is a pro EU party – no question.
25% of Green Party voters opted for Leave in the 2016 EU referendum apparently ;)
Just a couple of Light Ales in the Hand and Racquet ;)That's a positive blow-out compared with the 3 steaming hot mugs of chicory essence No Change UK shared leaning up against Fred's Pie Stall in the market square ;)
Err, no, that just shows areas, not the number of people.
Yes I was aware of that Grahamm ;) . I just liked the look of it and knew that you wouldn't :lol .
Oh and PS, the number of people who signed the petition Revoke Article 50 and remain in the EU - 6,085,326'The number of people who signed the petition'...that's a bold claim claim given the findings of exactly who, or rather what, has 'voted', and how many times, in previous online petitions
I'll stick to the only count that truly matters thanks Grahamm. The election system where only real, registered and eligible voters participate
Minus the Green vote, which could be as much down to David Attenborough and the fact that the environmental crisis is never out of the news at the moment, as it is Brexit and it's 4,697,611 against 5,802,996.
I wish to announce......... that I will not be standing as a candidate for leader of the Conservative Party.
By the way, remind us how many people signed the "Leave" petition.
QuoteI'll stick to the only count that truly matters thanks Grahamm. The election system where only real, registered and eligible voters participate
Yeah, about that... UK government may face court action after EU citizens denied vote (https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2019/may/23/eu-citizens-denied-vote-european-election-polling-booths-admin-errors)
If there has been an injustice regarding voter eligibility then I sincerely hope that it's corrected. I guess we'll just have to wait and see :) .
It doesn't shake my faith in the democratic system though Grahamm. Does it you?.
Err, WTF? The Green Party has been in favour of Remain from the start!!
I heard this story this morning on the radio and it was a Polish caller and I understood that it was EU nationals wanting to vote for parties in their own country but were just wanting to do it from this one. The caller went on to explain that they made a few calls to Poland and got it all sorted.QuoteI'll stick to the only count that truly matters thanks Grahamm. The election system where only real, registered and eligible voters participate
Yeah, about that... UK government may face court action after EU citizens denied vote (https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2019/may/23/eu-citizens-denied-vote-european-election-polling-booths-admin-errors)
If there has been an injustice regarding voter eligibility then I sincerely hope that it's corrected. I guess we'll just have to wait and see :) .
It doesn't shake my faith in the democratic system though Grahamm. Does it you?.
I respect everybody's views. I just don't happen to agree with them. And I can do that without actually calling them pricks :lol
Carlisle - I smell no biscuits either. Mind you in a Premier Inn all I can smell is harpic :)
So, the country is split (more or less) in half between hard Brexit and hard Remain. How do we get out of this mess?
Implying that someone is a prick on a face to face basis is still grounds for a fucking slap in my book - but you'd avoid that wouldn't you....You clearly don't understand. I don't call anybody a prick, unless I know them very well :)
I heard this story this morning on the radio and it was a Polish caller and I understood that it was EU nationals wanting to vote for parties in their own country but were just wanting to do it from this one. The caller went on to explain that they made a few calls to Poland and got it all sorted.I think you're right, it was for voting in their own country, but not sure they all could get it resolved with 'a few calls'. What's clear was that there was a cock up due to the short notice.
it is being portrayed that they are being prevented to vote for one of the remain parties when they were not even trying to vote for any uk party.QuoteI heard this story this morning on the radio and it was a Polish caller and I understood that it was EU nationals wanting to vote for parties in their own country but were just wanting to do it from this one. The caller went on to explain that they made a few calls to Poland and got it all sorted.I think you're right, it was for voting in their own country, but not sure they all could get it resolved with 'a few calls'. What's clear was that there was a cock up due to the short notice.
Very true of the party, but not all of their voters. As mentioned previously, 25% voted 'Leave' in the 2016 EU referendum.
Can I just post this again;
Harley Davidson looking for a European manufactuering base.
https://www.motorcyclenews.com/news/2019/may/harley-davidson-build-europe/ (https://www.motorcyclenews.com/news/2019/may/harley-davidson-build-europe/)
But of course like a great many companies one country they will not be considering right now is the UK.
Very true of the party, but not all of their voters. As mentioned previously, 25% voted 'Leave' in the 2016 EU referendum.
So what? How someone voted previously doesn't mean that they will vote the same way next time (unless you're a rabid "my Party right or wrong" supporter).
Quote from: VNA on 28 May 2019, 11:12:02 PM
Can I just post this again;
Harley Davidson looking for a European manufactuering base.
https://www.motorcyclenews.com/news/2019/may/harley-davidson-build-europe/ (https://www.motorcyclenews.com/news/2019/may/harley-davidson-build-europe/)
But of course like a great many companies one country they will not be considering right now is the UK.
Thank foc for that :lol
I'm with you there Hedgetrimmer over priced crap
Also there is another 3.6 million votes that you can remove from the remain tally.Very true of the party, but not all of their voters. As mentioned previously, 25% voted 'Leave' in the 2016 EU referendum.
So what? How someone voted previously doesn't mean that they will vote the same way next time (unless you're a rabid "my Party right or wrong" supporter).
And you don't know that they have changed their minds either.
However when you were adding up the various parties EU Parliament election votes into Remain V Leave totals the other day, you'd put every single Green voter into 'Remain' :rolleyes
Oh and apparently around 30% of Liberal Democrat supporters voted Leave in 2016, but you've put 100% of them in your 'Remain' tally too :\
We will become poorer outside the EU.
Are you heading up to Scotland mtread?.Well, we're not all Rob Roys ;)
He's also looked more like a Foreign Secretary....... than his predecessor
- Jeremy Hunt looks the most like a prime minister.
- [/l][/l]
25% of Green Party voters opted for Leave in the 2016 EU referendum apparentlyWhere did you get that figure from? The one I've seen says 20%, and that's YouGov which is usually pretty reliable.
Quote25% of Green Party voters opted for Leave in the 2016 EU referendum apparentlyWhere did you get that figure from? The one I've seen says 20%, and that's YouGov which is usually pretty reliable.
https://yougov.co.uk/topics/politics/articles-reports/2016/06/27/how-britain-voted (https://yougov.co.uk/topics/politics/articles-reports/2016/06/27/how-britain-voted)
:lolQuoteAre you heading up to Scotland mtread?.Well, we're not all Rob Roys ;)
Hancock ;)
In other news, I see the Tory leadership fight has kicked off :lurk They're all stabbing each other in the back?
Who's your Least Worst candidate? Mine's Jeremy Hunt. He's slightly less obnoxious than most of the others
QuoteQuote from: VNA on 28 May 2019, 11:12:02 PM
Can I just post this again;
Harley Davidson looking for a European manufactuering base.
https://www.motorcyclenews.com/news/2019/may/harley-davidson-build-europe/ (https://www.motorcyclenews.com/news/2019/may/harley-davidson-build-europe/)
But of course like a great many companies one country they will not be considering right now is the UK.QuoteThank foc for that :lol
QuoteI'm with you there Hedgetrimmer over priced crap
I agree. I have no interest in Harley Davidsons. But I would quite happily see them manufactured here for the UK and Euro market.
You are talking quality well paid jobs.
But the reality is Harley Davidson will not consider the UK as a manufacturing base for even a nono second.
Nissan has cancelled the UK production of the X-Trail in the UK. Honda is moving out lock, stop and barrel. Schaeffler are moving out. Michelin are moving out. There is now a growing list of companies moving part or all of their production out of the UK.
The priority for these manufactures is to access the EU single market. Even your darling economist Professor Minford, in his frankly flawed positive analysis of a NO DEAL BREXIT, admits that UK manufacturing will be all but wiped out.
I am, and continue to be, at a complete and total loss as to why any ordinary person in the UK would wish the UK to leave the EU and the single market.
We will become poorer outside the EU.
Hancock
Our Councils/local authorities are severely cash strapped, the NHS is chronically underfunded, the roads have all been carpet bombed with no hope of quality repairs, some people cant get to see a GP without a 2 week wait, we cant build our own power stations without funding/materials/labour/expertise from abroad, the streets are overrun by criminal gangs with no hope of apprehending many of them (and they know it), our schools churn out people unfit for the world of work cos they cant read or write, let alone string a sentence together.Nothing to do with the EU. Deliberate underfunding by Tory government imposed austerity, following collapse of unregulated banking system. For which we are all still paying, unless you are rich enough to avoid.
Fixed it for you.QuoteOur Councils/local authorities are severely cash strapped, the NHS is chronically underfunded, the roads have all been carpet bombed with no hope of quality repairs, some people cant get to see a GP without a 2 week wait, we cant build our own power stations without funding/materials/labour/expertise from abroad, the streets are overrun by criminal gangs with no hope of apprehending many of them (and they know it), our schools churn out people unfit for the world of work cos they cant read or write, let alone string a sentence together.Nothing to do with the EU. Deliberate underfunding by Tory government imposed austerity, following collapse of the labour party's unregulated banking system. For which we are all still paying, unless you are rich enough to avoid.
Our membership of the EU has not been a Golden Period of British historyThat is not what I said. And yes you are correct, we have suffered decades of manufacturing decline though decades of neo liberal politics.
Our Councils/local authorities are severely cash strapped,They lost massive amounts of income and assets due to Tory polices. Councils were forced to sell their housing stocks for example. Millions of people are now stuck with massive mortgages or paying rip off rents.
the NHS is chronically underfundedOver the last few decades there has been tax after tax cut for the well off, whilst taxes have increased overall for ordinary working people. We have financed our infrastructure with private money and ended up paying for often substandard civil projects several times over. We have been absolutely screwed on endless infrastructure projects.
we cant build our own power stations without funding/materials/labour/expertise from abroad,Again, the Tories choose to privatise our utilities allowing most of them to fall in to foreign ownership who take the profit out of the country. We choose, not can’t, not to build our own utilities but to have other countries finance, build and take the profit. Your rich Tory masters are investing their own money in the companies now building our infrastructure. They also look to those companies for directorships and consultancy work once they have left parliament.
Fixed it for you.New Labour = Tories.
Not denying it. But the imposed austerity and dismantling of the state, is all Tory. Something they were delighted to have an excuse for.What gets me is that you and your little red book waving mate think that all brexit supporters are also Conservative supporters, you constantly attack the conservatives - you will garner no argument from me with that tact. Yet you will constantly defend labours record which is far from perfect either. All governments (so far ) are self serving self and party first with their snouts in the trough and by leaving the EU and cutting out that whole layer of politicians we are making the trough shorter.
Well I'm fairly certain he's SNPNo I am not a direct member of any politcal party. I am an affliated member of The Labour party.
However when you were adding up the various parties EU Parliament election votes into Remain V Leave totals the other day, you'd put every single Green voter into 'Remain'
What gets me is that you and your little red book waving mate think that all brexit supporters are also Conservative supporters, you constantly attack the conservatives - you will garner no argument from me with that tact. Yet you will constantly defend labours record which is far from perfect either.I wonder if I am the “little red book waving mate”
I remember the New Labour period well. I stopped my political levy during that period as a result of New Labour. I made it clear to my union brothers and sistersl, as well as friends and associates that I viewed Tony Blair and New Labour in the same manner I viewed The Tories, as enemies of our people and our country.
QuoteWhat gets me is that you and your little red book waving mate think that all brexit supporters are also Conservative supporters, you constantly attack the conservatives - you will garner no argument from me with that tact. Yet you will constantly defend labours record which is far from perfect either.I wonder if I am the “little red book waving mate”
I remember the New Labour period well. I stopped my political levy during that period as a result of New Labour. I made it clear to my union brothers and sistersl, as well as friends and associates that I viewed Tony Blair and New Labour in the same manner I viewed The Tories, as enemies of our people and our country. And in Scotland Labour is yet to recover from that betrayal.
Thankfully New Labour is dead, and once again The Labour Party can be seen as the party of the many not the few.
But on BREXIT, The Labour Party is a mess. Mr Corbyn seems to want to have a think about things and discuss it in September at the party conference. He better wake up, in Scotland The Labour Party is now on life support, and if Mr Corbyn doesn’t make some decisive decision soon and firmly oppose BREXIT, well The Labour Party right across the UK could end up in intensive care along with the Tory Party.
It is clear that the BREXIT dream is just that, a dream, a fantasy built on lies. If we want to protect our jobs and our economy, if we want to protect our future and environment, if we want to be part of the modern world – we must cancel article 50.
New Labour is far from dead. Its core still sits in the House, waiting for the right moment to ditch Corbine. I amazed you, of all people, think it dead ([url]http://foc-u.co.uk/Smileys/efocicon/shocked.gif[/url])
It is also clear there is a majority in the country in favour of remaining in the EU.
Meanwhile on a brighter note. There is always the possibility of the upcoming new Prime Minister being put on trial for abusing public office. And hopefully other candidates will now be charged. Imagine that a UK PM facing jail!
Labour must take a principled stand.
last Thursday made that clear beyond any reasonable doubt :lolWhat I am saying is this YamFazFan, is that if Labour now backs REMAIN, if Labour now commits to either a second referendum or cancelling article 50, well its job done.
It is also clear there is a majority in the country in favour of remaining in the EU.
How can anyone know that when two thirds of the country couldn't even be bothered to vote?
So you are quite happy to demonise "populist" parties in the EU but its ok if it is something popular with you. Shameful going after votes just to try to get in power. All along it has been in Labours interest to make brexit as hard as possible.Quotelast Thursday made that clear beyond any reasonable doubt :lolWhat I am saying is this YamFazFan, is that if Labour now backs REMAIN, if Labour now commits to either a second referendum or cancelling article 50, well its job done.
And the message will be clear for The Tories. You deliver BREXIT and you will pay the political price. Let them own BREXIT.
It is also clear there is a majority in the country in favour of remaining in the EU.
How can anyone know that when two thirds of the country couldn't even be bothered to vote?
If there is a general election before brexit is delivered then Nigel Farage needs to start choosing the wallpaper for No10.Won't happen. If the Tories back a Brexit (in any form) Brexit Party's support will dissolve. Farage has failed to be elected as an MP 7 times already. 'Mr Populist' provides too simple solutions for what are complicated issues, and nobody would trust him to run a country.
All along it has been in Labours interest to make brexit as hard as possible.:rolleyes
If there is a general election before brexit is delivered then Nigel Farage needs to start choosing the wallpaper for No10.The BREXIT party does not have any policies, nor does it have 650 candidates.
Apart from Brexit, what policies of the Brexit Party do you find attractive?Privatise the NHS :eek :lol :lol :lol
The BREXIT party will do about as well as UKIP ever did. Remember UKIP :lol
didn't they win the 2014 European Parliament elections?.Well they had the largest number of UK MEPs, but not a majority. I wouldn't call that a 'win'.
Well they had the largest number of UK MEPs, but not a majority. I wouldn't call that a 'win'.Only the SNP have ever won an election that cannot be won.
You only 'win' if you have more than all of your combined opposition. Only then can you dictate outcomes. Otherwise you are powerless.
Sorry that’s nonsense.No it isn't. If the combined opposition(s) have more than you they can form a coalition government, and hey presto, you are the opposition, without power. Then you're 'win' disappears. It's happened often.
The winner in politics is the party with the biggest share of the vote, or the largest number of seats.
No it isn't. If the combined opposition(s) have more than you they can form a coalition government, and hey presto, you are the opposition, without power. Then you're 'win' disappears. It's happened often.
agreed
Trump for leadership of the Tory Party.
Why are people so determined to wreck our economy. Why are so many ordinary people in England and Wales desperate to be poorer?Try asking Corbyn & Khan re The USA and the special relationship ;)
Try asking Corbyn & Khan re The USA and the special relationship
You can add Emily Thornberry to that list - she is spiting bile about Trump at anyone who will point a camera at her. Corbin is an embarrassment.Why are people so determined to wreck our economy. Why are so many ordinary people in England and Wales desperate to be poorer?Try asking Corbyn & Khan re The USA and the special relationship ;)
QuoteTry asking Corbyn & Khan re The USA and the special relationship
When Trump is gone (soon) it'll be back on track :)
Meanwhile "Anna Soubry has become leader of Change UK after six MPs quit the party.The newly formed party split as high-profile figures like Chuka Umunna and ex-leader Heidi Allen walked out."
How much economic pain would we have to suffer if Corbyn gets his hands on the keys to number 10 in the not too distant future?.
Meanwhile "Anna Soubry has become leader of Change UK after six MPs quit the party.The newly formed party split as high-profile figures like Chuka Umunna and ex-leader Heidi Allen walked out."
And Nigel farage meets with Trump like a proper soon to be PM - unlike Corbin.
Ooh, look at all the peace loving lefties.....complete fukwits, the lot of them.Shocking - also that poor little 5 foot PCO looks absolutely terrified.Corbyn should take the blame for the way he whipped people up in his speech he sounded like a extremest fanatic
https://www.facebook.com/raheemkassam/videos/611386889375916/ (https://www.facebook.com/raheemkassam/videos/611386889375916/)
Ooh, look at all the peace loving lefties.....complete fukwits, the lot of them.
What is it with the Labour Party that senior figures are unwilling to welcome the Leader of the free world on a State visit.Not just the Labur Party, also Tories, Lid Dems, SNP,Plaid Cymru and Greens..............
So do you think Obama was a better PresidentQuoteWhat is it with the Labour Party that senior figures are unwilling to welcome the Leader of the free world on a State visit.Not just the Labur Party, also Tories, Lid Dems, SNP,Plaid Cymru and Greens..............
And here he is :lol :lol :lol
(https://pbs.twimg.com/card_img/1135546172897157120/uXXvExNe?format=jpg&name=600x314)
Can't wait to be out of the EU, I did not vote for another government in Brussels, I voted for free trade only in1974Happy 4th of June - another Remain day people! :lol
Because of a pathetic shambles of a Tory government, who will do anything to stay in power [/color]Correct, and then there is also Labour who will do anything to GET in power.Its time for a change - starting with Peterborough tomorrow.
How did we move from the NHS getting 350million to the NHS being "on the table" as part of a trade agreement.How?
Correct, and then there is also Labour who will do anything to GET in power.Its time for a change - starting with Peterborough tomorrow.
something Trump came out with yesterday at the press conference and then rowed back on later in an interview.Are you possibly suggesting Trump talks out of his arse, and hasn't a clue what he's saying from one minute to the next? :lol
Still not sure what the Brexit Party's policies are, apart from Brexit. :rolleyes
Quotesomething Trump came out with yesterday at the press conference and then rowed back on later in an interview.Are you possibly suggesting Trump talks out of his arse, and hasn't a clue what he's saying from one minute to the next? :lol
One was aclaimlie made on the side of a bus during the 2016 EU referendum campaign and the other is something Trump came out with yesterday at the press conference and then rowed back on later in an interview.
Corrected it for you ;)
No No the sky collapsing was also included.One was aclaimlie made on the side of a bus during the 2016 EU referendum campaign and the other is something Trump came out with yesterday at the press conference and then rowed back on later in an interview.
Corrected it for you ;)
The £350 million issue is a dispute between gross and net figures isn't it?. Approx £350 million is the 'bill', but it's reduced to around £250 million after rebates?.
However many lies did Project Fear tell during the referendum campaign?. We were led to believe everything bar the sky collapsing in was going to befall us if Leave won :lol
The £350 million issue is a dispute between gross and net figures isn't it?. Approx £350 million is the 'bill', but it's reduced to around £250 million after rebates?No it’s much more than that. Firstly it’s about fact. The 350 million for our NHS was a lie. Just to be clear, as some folks don’t seem to understand what a lie is;
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/D8UaDxsV4AgmNQy.jpg)
It's time for a change - starting with Peterborough tomorrow.
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/D8UaDxsV4AgmNQy.jpg)
QuoteIt's time for a change - starting with Peterborough tomorrow.Oh dear :lol
Meanwhile on a brighter note. There is always the possibility of the upcoming new Prime Minister being put on trial for abusing public office. And hopefully other candidates will now be charged. Imagine that a UK PM facing jail!You're going to need a vivid imagination, the attempt has just been dismissed by The High Court. They said it was 'politically motivated and vexatious'.
The 350 million for our NHS was a lie. Just to be clear, as some folks don’t seem to understand what a lie is;The high court does.
This is particularly important as the intention was to get people to vote based on this deception.The high court didn't think so
It’s absolutely and utterly unacceptable.The high court accepts it.
I reckon The Brexit Party did very well for a new party, only losing victory by 683 votes.But they lost :)
That's right, just think what they can do when they have some policies.If I was a Lib dem supporter and therefore a remainer I would of voted Labour just to keep the brexit party out. I wonder how many lib dem voters did that.QuoteI reckon The Brexit Party did very well for a new party, only losing victory by 683 votes.A party with no policies, no manifesto
TBH, if they can't win in Peterborough, they can't win anywhere.
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/D8UaDxsV4AgmNQy.jpg)
I wonder how many lib dem voters did that.Probably none. They only got 3.3% of the vote in the 2017 General election.
Yes they certainly did. That's the result and everyone should acknowledge that. It's just a shame a lot of the Remainers don't feel the same about the EU referendum :rolleyes .QuoteI reckon The Brexit Party did very well for a new party, only losing victory by 683 votes.But they lost :)
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/D8UaDxsV4AgmNQy.jpg)
Still waiting for your apology VNA for your feckin piss taking piece of shit cartoon. Not like you to keep your mouth shut.
along with this complete bollox never ending Brexit thread.
along with this complete bollox never ending Brexit thread.
When Brexit ends the thread ends :deal
So in other words it's got years & years to run yet :lol
along with this complete bollox never ending Brexit thread.
When Brexit ends the thread ends :deal
So in other words it's got years & years to run yet :lol
Already feels that long since it all started :groan
VNA - you were online last night 11pm !!! You have read the requests for a reply but appear so feckin arrogant that you deem an apology is not required. Why not open your mouth and explain why no apology is required ??? You're always more than happy to be a gob shite elsewhere so balls in one hand and type with the other.
VNA - you were online last night 11pm !!! You have read the requests for a reply but appear so feckin arrogant that you deem an apology is not required. Why not open your mouth and explain why no apology is required ??? You're always more than happy to be a gob shite elsewhere so balls in one hand and type with the other.
And again today at 1pm........but still no balls to reply. How about you simply modify your feckin offensive cartoon then you won't have to type jack shit. Tw@ !!
VNA - you were online last night 11pm !!! You have read the requests for a reply but appear so feckin arrogant that you deem an apology is not required. Why not open your mouth and explain why no apology is required ??? You're always more than happy to be a gob shite elsewhere so balls in one hand and type with the other.
And again today at 1pm........but still no balls to reply. How about you simply modify your feckin offensive cartoon then you won't have to type jack shit. Tw@ !!
And yet again at 11.30pm - you really are a spineless self righteous cunt. A patronising, arrogant waste of space.
VNA - feel like apologising ???I am at a loss as to what I am to apologise for. Have I to apologise for your need to be offended? Have I to apologise for your inability to understand a simple cartoon? Am I to apologise for a sense of humour failure on your part? I am to somehow apologise on behalf of the cartoonist Dave Brown, or apologise on behalf of the national newspaper that published his cartoon?
And yet again at 11.30pm - you really are a spineless self righteous cunt. A patronising, arrogant waste of space.Wow! My access to this forum is being monitored by another member. I didn’t even know you could do that. It perhaps suggests you have issues Frosties. Though on a positive note, well if this is all you have to get mad and upset at, then lucky you!
QuoteVNA - feel like apologising ???I am at a loss as to what I am to apologise for. I doubt you've ever apologised for anything in your lifetime
QuoteAnd yet again at 11.30pm - you really are a spineless self righteous cunt. A patronising, arrogant waste of space.Wow! My access to this forum is being monitored by another member. I didn’t even know you could do that. It perhaps suggests you have issues Frosties. Yup...I have a serious issue with you. Though on a positive note, well if this is all you have to get mad and upset at, then lucky you! Lucky me is when you can say it to my face.
Donald Trump laying a reef at the D Day Commemorations frankly makes me wanna puke.
Bullshit, waffle and general bollocks from a shameless self righteous cunt - Just let me know when you plan a tour and post up your itinerary so we can talk about it
Correct, and then there is also Labour who will do anything to GET in power.Its time for a change - starting with Peterborough tomorrow.Oh yes. BREXIT party fails at its first attempt to elect an MP. Excellent! :)
The high court accepts it.We will need to wait for the full verdict to be published. The court has not, as yet, commented on whether Boris lied or not. Not that we really need The High Court to tell us that he lied. He clearly did.
The Brexit Party don't need a manifesto. All we need is for them to get us out of the EU. Then we can look at who we want to take the country forward, and I only hope by then the rest have seen that some things need some serious tweaking. Not holding my breath though.