Side Stand Starting Issue – Help needed.

[roadpilot3]

OK, I give up – I need help.

I have owned my beloved Fazer for about 8 months but recently it has developed a little niggle – it used to run on its side stand, but now it doesn’t.

This is what happened - At 0400hrs the other morning I warmed the bike up on its side stand as per normal.  Unlike most other days all didn’t go well and whilst overtaking a lorry in the outside lane of a busy duel carriageway in the pitch black all the lights went out – even the dashboard lights!

After a few near misses panic set in and I pulled the flasher button - to my relief the main beam pinged on main beam. With nowhere safe to pull over I rode for about 2 minutes with the flasher switch held in but this relief was short lived when the front light went out again and I was back in darkness.  Clean out of options I had to ride a little further before I could pull over and admit defeat. In a safe location I dropped the side stand and the engine stalled. 

I didn’t think too much at the time as I was relieved to still be alive but when I collected the bike a few hours later – I found it didn’t start.  I was just about to call the RAC when I found it started with the stand up so I rode it home.

In the cold light of day the lights failing turned out to be due to the ignition switch – I have replaced this with a pattern part and I now have a full a compliment of lights again. By holding in the flasher switch  I managed to burn out the switch – I brought another set of switch gear on Ebay and this all now works fine but neither of these cured the starting issue with the side stand.  I have also replaced the side stand switch but to no avail.

Has anyone else had a stand starting issue – and if so – what was it and how did you cure it?

The bike is a Gold/black/silver FZS600s.  It is a 2001 model and has only got 56000 on the clock.

Any help is much appreciated.

[markbubble]

sounds like it could be the side stand switch playing up (or the terminal loose/rusted)these can be cleaned (usually covered in road/chain muck ) iv got a spare switch somewhere if you need it

[Andy FZS]

I was thinking more around the neutral switch as if it's not in gear it should start regardless of side stand position. I also seem to think there are diodes involved somewhere but can't be sure, I'll look in the manual later if I get chance.
Andy

Sent from my GT-I9300 using Tapatalk 2

[AdieR]

One option is to bypass the sidestand switch - just beware of leaving the stand down.
I personally would check all the safety interlock circuits (stand / clutch / neutral switches, and the wiring to / from them).

Out of interest, have you checked your battery and reg/rec?

[roadpilot3]

Thanks for the all replies.
I have already ruled out the side stand switch by plugging in another one (thanks for the kind offer though Mark) – this didn’t have any effect at all but I did give it all a good clean up whilst I was there.  I thought this was going to be at fault but it wasn’t – despite the advert - life is never simples 
Andy – the neutral switch could be at fault – the neutral light works and doesn’t give false neutrals – if the switch was faulty would the light still work?  I will take this apart next week and have a look.

Adie – it is a recent battery and seems to hold its charge, whilst I’m not ruling anything out I am more confident in t e battery than the rest of the electrical gubbins that I don’t really understand – whats a Reg/Rec ?

Will add an update on here if i get any closer!

[Andy FZS]

I had a quick look at the manual and diodes are involved so I wouldn't rush to start taking your neutral switch out if the lamp works. I'll try and look at the manual on my pc were it's bigger as I looked on my tablet. Hopefully I'll get back to you later today. Unless anyone else beats me to it..........

Andy

Sent from my GT-N8010 using Tapatalk 2

[unfazed]

As there are only a few items involved here, the sidestand switch, the neutral switch the clutch lever switch and the starter cutout relay unit. You have ruled out the sidestand switch and you say the neutral light is working correctly then the two items left are the clutch lever switch and the starter cut out relay unit. The clutch lever switch and the neutral light switch over ride the sidestand switch.  As it appears to have happened when you had the incident with the ignition switch it is possible you could have burned out the diode(s) in the starter cutout relay unit. Bypass the clutch switch, with the bike on the centre stand and in neutrtal drop down the side stand, if it cuts out then replace the starter cut out relay unit. Before you replace anything check all the connections are clean including the alarm bypass connectors under the seat.
 

[AdieR]

Was the replacement s/stand switch a new unit, or secondhand from a breakers / ebay? It's not impossible for a "new" part to be faulty. (Rule #1 when fault finding - don't leave a part out of a fault finding sequence just because it's newly fitted). Further, a new switch is worthless if the wiring to / from it is damaged; heat, vibration and chemical attack can cause havoc in electrical systems. Wires can "break" internally which isn't easily seen (leading to momentary "on" / "off" as the wire moves with vibration; now it works, now it doesn't). If you haven't got one, a digital multimeter is your best friend at times like these, and needn't be expensive either.

Your reg/rec is part of your charging circuit, and a failed one can kill a battery.
Out of interest, how old was your old battery?

[unfazed]

An important consideration here, is that the sidestand switch is ruled out simply because when he puts it down the engine cuts out. If it was not working the engine would remain running.

[roadpilot3]

The side stand switch was a second hand unit but I have tested the original and found it to be working so have not changed it over.  I have also tested the clutch switch, which is fine and the neutral switch is fine (as indicated by the switch light still working).  I have found a side stand diode under the tank which I have tested and think this is fine and I have tested the wiring from this to master relay and it appears all ok.

The thought now is that it must be the master relay - on the basis that everything else seems to be working.  I have ordered a new one and will get it on there with a bit of luck by the weekend - updates to follow…..

[Jacko]

Mine once cut out and refused to start. turned out to be the wiring for the sidestand and neutral
had rubbed through behind the left hand side panel where the relays are.
new bits of wire and all good again.

[roadpilot3]

Good news - Its fixed. 
 
If anyone else gets this problem, mine turned out to be the mast relay situated on the left hand side, under the plastic panel next to the seat near the starter solenoid - £56.00 + VAT 

Thanks for all the help and replies - much appreciated.
 
Ride Safe 

[unfazed]

Just as I expected (see my first post).
This is a rare failure but most definitely caused by an over load of the diode circuitry when you tried to get around your ignition switch failure. The unit contains the fuel pump relay, the starter circuit cut out relay and a number of diodes which are also used for the bulb check when you thumb the starter button. It is a vital part of the electrical system
Glad you got sorted 

[Andy FZS]

Glad it sorted and thanks for letting us know. Now we know were to look if it happens to us.

Cheers

Andy