Gen 2 article by Si Hargreaves

[mickdel]

article from bike mag
nice looking bike.

[pitternator]

SH has a strong viewpoint on the FZ-1....but then so do I...after owning one !  I have never agreed with his perspective( rose tinted ) . Yes its fast in a mad revvy way, great for hooning about on. BUT I never found it " comfy" , certainly not the seat. Even after getting it totally repadded it was never really a day long item. Even after FCE, pipe and power commander its still a revvy sportbike engine, still lacked the midrange I look for in a tourer.. It all depends on what you call a sports tourer....personally IMO  its way more sports than tourer. A sporty bike which can tour...but then again Nick sanders went round the world on his R1...it all depends what fits ones needs !
But you can get them cheap.... but then so too many other bikes  are cheap which never found mass market appeal. ... I think its too easy for SH to make claims like this, and expect everyone to actually agree with him. I went from a 1050 sprint to a FZ-1 and fecks sake they are just soo diffrent bikes...yet they both get classed as " sports tourers " ! I could write  a similar article about any of the bikes which touched my spot .....

[mickdel]

Yeah, he kinda fell in love with this bike.   I've lost the article with Mike in, comparing the gen1 to an fz1.    I was wondering about the comfort,  as he's about the same size as me except much lighter, but I still couldn't see one doing a full day on it.


Also, he doesn't mention the tiny tank, or the  fact that gassing it will give him crap MPG.


I remember your bike Pitt - it was one of the most sorted fz1s.     That bike was special.    But I agree with you on the general tone of the article.    Everyone is different      Could you read it properly?  I'm still learning the posting fotos lark.


mick

[markie_wales]

The guy loved the bike. Good - that's what bike ownership is about     Will everyone agree with every point? God no! I can tour on my KTM 950 SuperEnduro (with it's 30l tank) others would say it's impossible. Comfort is so subjective as we know - I found my gen 1 standard saddle horrid to the extreme but others love them. Fuel capacity on just about every modern bike is fine for western Europe, more just makes it easier.

cheers

Markie

[mickdel]

Hey Markie 


I was thinking about you the other day mate, and was going to try and track you down.     Hope you and the family are keeping well.


Things have been pretty bad for me for the last couple of years,  but am on the upward path now,  thankfully.


I will shortly get my bike back,  as my driving ban finished in September.   


Do you fancy doing a bit of fettling on the old fazer?    I've got a few bits and bobs to fit.   Are handlebars much hassle to fit?   I fancy renthals.   


Can you pm me your email addy and phone numbers again, as I lost them when the laptop died.


Great to see you again.


Chocolate Mick

[markie_wales]

Chocolate Mick - you have a PM.

cheers

Markie

[pitternator]

Mick
I reckon my FZ-1 had enuff spent on it ! I bought it really cheap, thankfully, when Taz were punting them out ( US models, full power) at just £5995 OTR. Too good a price to miss, and I took the plunge, encouraged by claims of big power and sorted handling. I always liked the butch looks and the quality of finish. Even today I reckon the FZ-1 has one of the best finishes out there ( 2006 models  anyway). But I just found it to be the most jekyll and hyde bikes ever. So powerful - but hard to access power. Great steering,  but really hard suspension, fecking great ergonomics but an absolute plank of a seat.Stupid tank range ...once just 88 miles to reserve ! So how can this be a sports tourer !!!!   FFS its an insane claim  .....
What it is ....is  a great roadbike for blasting , and a great little track bike. TBH I would be very tempted to buy a cheap second hand one to run just as a track bike .
I did try to " tame " it down, make it better for touring , but i did not succeed, its not really what the engine was built for. However if you pay the dosh, stick all the mods on, it does give some mid range from 6k rpm, and you can use yer sat nav to find garages at 100 mile intervals!    ....one thing I dont regret is owning one...cos it all helps to broaden ones horizons.But give me a sorted gen1 for touring anyday bud. My current gen1 is absolutely superb at both doing the distance and having  fun when you get there. It sbiggest drawback now is simply the old fashioned looks....but dont be fooled that it cant hustle. Plenty of sportsbikes at cadwell can testify to that !

[markie_wales]

Pitt

what did you used to get in "Touring" mode? I know the original Honda Hornet would run out at 80-90 if ridden hard, but if ridden gently could get significantly further. If 80 - 100 was the max that is pretty disappointing.

cheers

Markie

[pitternator]

Hi mark
I tried to soften the bike basically , from what is a balls out hard revving roadster into something closer to the gen1. Its difficult tbh basically because the engine is designed to produce big power , albeit fairly high on up in the range.I could do nothing for the tank range, though spot on fuelling helps give decent mpg when at touring speeds. For example, I went to austria this year and dek came along with his ( extremely) modded gen2. At each fill up we were putting in identical amounts of fuel, so our mpgs were identical.The gen1 has a bigger tank, so tank range is better.- at 45 mpg the gen1 will run to nearly 200 miles to empty, the gen2  150 ish...OK in the week with plenty of petrol stations about , might be more of an issue on a sunday in rural france ? I also once recorded just 90 miles to  reserve on my FZ-1 on back road riding ...yikes...
Suspension wise I did soften it off, and I am well at the heavy end of yer average FZ-1 rider. I also got the seat modded completely by Tony Archer of Huddersfield.I could do nothing to the welded on grab rails which spoils soft panniers fitting right. I did fit a ventura system though, which works very well...Handling wise I think the gen2 is sharper, but my K tech suspended gen1 is comfy with almost the same handling.( at least for road work).... I think for me the excellent mods which have been developed for the gen1 make it easier to make a gen1 sharper , than it is to make a gen2 " softer" if you know what I mean...but it is a personal choice, so horses for courses. I think you also need to include the wow factor since a decent gen2 does look much more modern than any gen1...so if you only had one bike... well I wouldnt knock folk for buying a gen2 and living with its ideosyncracies.
Engine wise the best mod is the FCE, which really makes as much diffrence IMO as a stage 1 jet kit to the gen1.Fitting a PC3 will get the mixture spot on, and improve power all through the revs. But for me the FCE gave biggest gains in low to mid range, which is what you want yer touring bike to do.There have been numerous developments for the gen2 since I had mine, but none can change cam characteristics etc, so you still have a bike which dont do that much below 6k rpm.Whereas a full monty gen1 is really producing big torque from as little as 4500 revs.And as a full monty can get around 138 at the rear wheel...does the bit extra on a gen2 really count for much at say 12k rpm....on a touring bike ??
 
What stops me buying a gen2  is IMO this relatively  small power diffrence, the shortcomings listed above, and the huge new cost now of an FZ-1 ( list price now £11k)...at that price there is a massive list of much more exotic/ diffrent bikes to choose from...maybe none of which " need" all these mods doing to them to " sort it out"...meanwhile you can still buy very cheap low mileage gen1s, pay the obligatory grand on the essential mods and have  a magnificent sports tourer for £4500 or less! You really have to want a new FZ-1.....BUT if you can pick up a nice low miler second hand FZ-1 for around £4k mark....maybe the ball is swinging the other way ???

[locksmith]

Is there such a thing as a bike that needs no mods to "sort it out" ?
Looking around different owners clubs websites you'd think not!!!  but for the rest of us normal folk, probably most bikes we buy are left well alone, including my gen2

[mickdel]

Don't go looking for problems.  They'll find you soon enough 

[paul.s]

iv got a gen 2 and i love it i like the way it turns you into a hooligan as soon as you get on it iv had lots of big modern bikes and for me its the best allrounder iv owned .i cant ride sportbikes any more due to dodgy wrists and i dont like the way most retro type bikes handle .this bikes just like what it is a sports bike with propper handle bars 

[pitternator]

Lock
I cant accept your comments when it comes to a stock 06 FZ-1 ! No way. The bike left the factory with glaring issues. The fuelling ( on a FI bike ! ) was appalling. When it was dynoed, rencullen almost laffed at how bad it was....and to make my point clear ...when you ride the bike before and after the effect was just so dramatic.Even more so after a FCE is fitted... But what actually is the " mod" ?...hmm, yes , just getting the fuelling right in the first place. Not actually a mod at all.Maybe later FZ-1s were better , but not the 06. In many ways I do believe Yam wanted the bike to have a more manic streak , to get away from the criticism of the gen1 not being hooligan enuff.Cos to my mind this is exactly what the FZ-1 was back then. Almost  a ride me if you dare type of bike, rather than  a get on settle down, and lets go type of bike the gen1 is. I believe this is what SH laments about when he looks back on the FZ-1 he had.He comes across as a hard on  sports type rider , always wanting a blast about rather than a kick back type of ride.Like I said above, even with over £1000 of engine mods, the thing still always wanted to take you faster than you wanted. Its in its blood IMO, a by product of having so much power so high in the rev range , coming in in just a few thousand revs.. Hence why I dont see it at all as a sports tourer. I see it more like my speed triple...that too being  a bike its almost impossible to ride at any sort of sensible pace for too long. But at least that has perfect fuelling and low down torque ! ..oh and   a comfy seat ...lol...but its still a mad ride.Great as a second bike, but no way an allrounder as  such , let alone a sports tourer.A bike designed and built for blasting around on the road, not for long distance work or really cruising about.
Maybe also SH reflections indicate a general softening of later bikes ??...odd since then as sportsbikes have gone to being such focused track tools....and the development of the full on naked bikes too.Makes me think its just a bike which hit his sweet spot.Maybe if I had not had such an unpleasant experience with mine I may have seen it in a better light.But owning it right on the heels of a sorted gen1 and the sprint , it seemed incredibly  unfinished and out of synch with what I actually wanted in an allrounder.

[PieEater]

iv got a gen 2 and i love it i like the way it turns you into a hooligan as soon as you get on it iv had lots of big modern bikes and for me its the best allrounder iv owned .i cant ride sportbikes any more due to dodgy wrists and i dont like the way most retro type bikes handle .this bikes just like what it is a sports bike with propper handle bars 

What you obviously wanted was sports bike behaviour and performance without the racing crouch and obviously your FZ1 hits the spot. But "a sports bike with propper handle bars" is not the same thing as an "allrounder", there are a number of other bikes that have a better mix of engine characteristics, tank range, pillion provision, comfort etc whilst still retaining enough performance to satisfy the hooligan urge when it takes hold.

[markie_wales]

Don't go looking for problems.  They'll find you soon enough 

 And usually on my drive accompanied by Chocolate....


Pitt - if you are getting 150 miles when touring, IMHO that's more than enough for western European touring. Even French petrol stations take UK cards on a Sunday nowadays!!

cheers

Markie

[PieEater]

Is there such a thing as a bike that needs no mods to "sort it out" ?
Looking around different owners clubs websites you'd think not!!!  but for the rest of us normal folk, probably most bikes we buy are left well alone, including my gen2

My 11 year old bike was obviously going to need some refurbishment due to wear and tear. It was also going to need some upgrading because it wasn't designed to cope with my size and weight. The suspenson front and back was going to need tweaking to cope with my requirements. My preference for the look of the bike was to replace the screen I bought it with for another better looking one. I knew that the bikes fuelling was compromised resulting in a degredation in performance so I chose to resolve this. The standard exhaust was heavy and restrictive so I chose to replace it with one that was lighter and less restrictive. Given the choice over the unweildy and restricted bike I originally bought and the sharp handling ultra responsive bike I now own there is no competition, if "normal folk" are riding around on unmodded bikes good for them but count me lucky for being "abnormal".

[pitternator]

Hi mark
Yes that is true. two yrs ago I used my tesco credit card to fill up several bikes at Lansleburg high in the french alps at an unmanned petrol stop.( but those riders's cards did not work ! )
 But there still are areas you need to be careful of in rural france. ie keep a topped up tank always , as it can be 50 miles to a gas station. The sat nav is just so useful here, sniffing out available fuel staions.On a FZ-1 you do have to always think fuel range in such areas. Especially if you are using revs ! Not so bad at touring speed though.