Fazer Owners Club - Unofficial
Bikes, Hints'n'Tips => FZS600 Fazer => Topic started by: fazersharp on 22 December 2018, 10:55:51 am
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I will be re greasing my 20 year old (21k miles) speedo drive grease but which grease out of these two would be best.(http://foc-u.co.uk/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=24814.0;attach=34157;image)
Also - stupid question time with the front wheel out is the balance transferred to the back or do I have to chock the front up.is it necessary to take off the brake calipers or is that just to make it easier - especially when lining up to put back.Also how much grease do I use - a smear or pack it out or in between.
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Can’t see the greases you’re choosing between. I use a light moly and go for the in-between quantity: generous but not packed solid.
Even with the front wheel out the centre of gravity is forward of the centrestand so you'll either need to support the front or stick something heavy on the pillion seat.
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I just chucked a load of Wilko multi purpose grease in mine 8000 miles ago. Haven't taken it off since, but seems to have worked fine.
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Multi purpose lithium grease, easier to remove calipers better to pay attention that the rota is correctly positioned before doing up axle so not to break lugs then refit calipers.
Pack with grease as said helps to hold rota in the correct place.
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Thanks everyone for the tips.I have noticed that sometimes if you are on a phone then the pictures do not show. I use the Additional options add attachment but did a copy and paste this time.Here it is again but via additional options. Can you see it now
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How heavy on the back seat are we talking - 5 ltr water ?Where is the best place to support the front if I do that instead.
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Presumably if you use the racing grease the speedo reads faster :)
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How heavy on the back seat are we talking - 5 ltr water ?Where is the best place to support the front if I do that instead.
Always chock the bike under the headers as they turn under the bike I made up a wooden chock for the job. (Great for any maintenance)
Water container or other weight balanced on the rear seat is not safe, if it get knocked and slides off on the plastic seat cover, with front wheel out you will end up with the bike on the floor in a mess as the centre stand will slam up as the bike falls forward (Like rolling bike off the centre stand)
Pic of my chock, just gently lift the bike under the front mud guard and push the chock under the headers with your foot
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Presumably if you use the racing grease the speedo reads faster :)
Oh yeah! :rolleyes :lol
I personally would not use anything racing (lube wise) on a road bike, race machines get striped and rebuilt on a regular basis and are likely to have their oil changed and lube maintenance done every couple of races.
These racing lubes may be very good at lubing but may not be designed for the longer term maintenance of a road bike, that probably/possibly may only get oil and lube/grease maintenance once a year.
I use Castrol HMP (High Melting Point) grease for most things, it does not melt at lower temperatures and therefore stays in place better, also less mess.
Opinion only, there is nothing factual about my waffling
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Thanks for the chock help. I wasn't actually going to use a 5 ltr container - that was just a weight reference. I have some lead shooting sack things that I would use that I would take the seat off and sit in there.I think I will make a chock and use the lead and see what I need to do to balance before I remove the chock.For those that can not see the grease picture I have
Silkolene Pro RG2 or CV lith -moly grease
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Interesting waffle about the racing grease but I am thinking that the Pro RG2 "racing" has more to do with marketing than actual PRO racing use.Also lets say you are right about the strip downs, but the extreme stresses that the grease go's through would be equal to years of street riding (perhaps)
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These racing lubes may be very good at lubing but may not be designed for the longer term maintenance of a road bike, that probably/possibly may only get oil and lube/grease maintenance once a year.
:eek :eek Try 20 years :eek I have had a few new front tyres and do not know if the fitters ever added any grease --- I doubt it.
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Yes, pic is now visible, I'd use the one on the right.
I do prefer to chock the front as it's more stable, but often use an old car battery on the pillion seat as well to reduce the stress on the downpipes.
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I think that is the grease i use on the right, you can use the other one for your hair :smokin
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The manual says Apply lightweight lithium-soap base grease
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The manual says Apply lightweight lithium-soap base grease
The bike is saying "ANYTHING....PLEASE!!!" :lol
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The manual says Apply lightweight lithium-soap base grease
The bike is saying "ANYTHING....PLEASE!!!" :lol
K Y Jelly is one of the best lubes, I find it helps reduce friction and does not make a mess, its water soluble and does not mark clothing or other fabrics it may come into contact with. :rolleyes
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Going to go with chocks under headers and a weight on the back to take the the pressure off.Removing the calipers and stringing up to take the weight off the joints. (not that the wheel fitters bother).
Some things I have googled
Silkolene Pro RG2 Grease
An advanced, high melting point, racing grease. multi-functional, high performance grease with exceptional heat resisting and waterproofing properties. It has outstanding water repellence, excellent corrosion inhibition properties and high resistance to water wash-off. It is ideal for bearing and chassis lubrication and conditions of water impact.
PRO RG2 is designed to meet the stringent requirements of competition use, including off-road, and stays in place, even under high temperatures created in competition use.
This high cling formula is ideal for protecting wheel bearings, universal joints, suspension linkages and seals under the most testing conditions.
Use for wheel bearing, rose joint, marine applications and all general automotive greasing.
MOLY EP LITHIUM GREASE
is a smooth textured high melting point, water resistant lithium base grease fortified with molybdenum disulfide (moly) to reduce wear by maintaining lubrication under conditions of high friction and shock loads.
Moly Grease
Moly grease is generally used for high pressure metal sliding against metal situations.
Greases containing moly are recommended for roller bearings subjected to very heavy loads and shock loading, especially in slow, or oscillating motion such as found in universal joints and CV joints.
If such greases are used in high-speed bearings, problems can be experienced with roller "skidding" where the bearing roller fails to rotate through the full 360 degrees due to reduced friction. As a result, the roller develops flat spots, and its service life is reduced.
In addition, CV joint/Moly grease is often manufactured to NLGI Grade 1 and would therefore not be suitable for automotive wheel bearings.
Multi-purpose Lithium-based Grease
Lithium grease is used in bearings where there are rollers, or balls under the load.
Grease made with lithium soap (lithium grease) sticks particularly well to metal, is non-corrosive, can be used under heavy loads, and has good temperature tolerance. With its resistance to moisture, it is commonly used as lubricant in household products, such as electric garage doors, as well as in automotive applications, such as Constant Velocity (CV) Joints.
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Going to go with chocks under headers and a weight on the back to take the the pressure off.Removing the calipers and stringing up to take the weight off the joints. (not that the wheel fitters bother).
Some things I have googled
Silkolene Pro RG2 Grease
An advanced, high melting point, racing grease. multi-functional, high performance grease with exceptional heat resisting and waterproofing properties. It has outstanding water repellence, excellent corrosion inhibition properties and high resistance to water wash-off. It is ideal for bearing and chassis lubrication and conditions of water impact.
PRO RG2 is designed to meet the stringent requirements of competition use, including off-road, and stays in place, even under high temperatures created in competition use.
This high cling formula is ideal for protecting wheel bearings, universal joints, suspension linkages and seals under the most testing conditions.
Use for wheel bearing, rose joint, marine applications and all general automotive greasing.
MOLY EP LITHIUM GREASE
is a smooth textured high melting point, water resistant lithium base grease fortified with molybdenum disulfide (moly) to reduce wear by maintaining lubrication under conditions of high friction and shock loads.
Moly Grease
Moly grease is generally used for high pressure metal sliding against metal situations.
Greases containing moly are recommended for roller bearings subjected to very heavy loads and shock loading, especially in slow, or oscillating motion such as found in universal joints and CV joints.
If such greases are used in high-speed bearings, problems can be experienced with roller "skidding" where the bearing roller fails to rotate through the full 360 degrees due to reduced friction. As a result, the roller develops flat spots, and its service life is reduced.
In addition, CV joint/Moly grease is often manufactured to NLGI Grade 1 and would therefore not be suitable for automotive wheel bearings.
Multi-purpose Lithium-based Grease
Lithium grease is used in bearings where there are rollers, or balls under the load.
Grease made with lithium soap (lithium grease) sticks particularly well to metal, is non-corrosive, can be used under heavy loads, and has good temperature tolerance. With its resistance to moisture, it is commonly used as lubricant in household products, such as electric garage doors, as well as in automotive applications, such as Constant Velocity (CV) Joints.
Cheers for that Sharpie,
Just ordered some Silkolene Pro RG2 Grease from the Bay.
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Silkolene-Pro-RG2-Grease-500ml/370768728236?epid=1325304023&hash=item565389d0ac:g:d80AAOSw3YJZP5fc:rk:9:pf:0 (https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Silkolene-Pro-RG2-Grease-500ml/370768728236?epid=1325304023&hash=item565389d0ac:g:d80AAOSw3YJZP5fc:rk:9:pf:0)
Best price I could find.
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I still don't know which one to use, I like the RG2 one because it looks like strawberry jam. The Lith-moly one is dark grey and looks dirty.
Interesting though about using Moly grease on high speed bearings being too slippery meaning the rolling bearing does not rotate but slips across the surface causing a flat sopt.
Also I read that when talking about "high speed" its something like 10,000 rmp -dont think even Tommy's Fazer wheel bearings go that fast :lol
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I would use Lithium multi-purpose grease as used on the wheel bearings/axle as Yamaha advise as the bearings/rota are connected & mixing two different types may affect the performance of both if mixed, unless you strip the wheel down to clean the bearings out then use just one type only.
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I still don't know which one to use, I like the RG2 one because it looks like strawberry jam. The Lith-moly one is dark grey and looks dirty.
Interesting though about using Moly grease on high speed bearings being too slippery meaning the rolling bearing does not rotate but slips across the surface causing a flat sopt.
Also I read that when talking about "high speed" its something like 10,000 rmp -dont think even Tommy's Fazer wheel bearings go that fast :lol
Dark and dirty is the way to go. :thumbup
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I would use Lithium multi-purpose grease as used on the wheel bearings/axle as Yamaha advise as the bearings/rota are connected & mixing two different types may affect the performance of both if mixed, unless you strip the wheel down to clean the bearings out then use just one type only.
But I don't have plain Lithium grease as the one I have got is Lith-moly.
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It says use lithium based grease not lithium grease so what you have should do fine. I used this stuff just because that's all I had and there was no problems
(https://i.ebayimg.com/images/g/xEsAAOSw-dBTtBLO/s-l1600.jpg)
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It says use lithium based grease not lithium grease so what you have should do fine. I used this stuff just because that's all I had and there was no problems
(https://i.ebayimg.com/images/g/xEsAAOSw-dBTtBLO/s-l1600.jpg)
So yours says Moly grease/ lithium based and mine says Lithium- moly grease, sounds the same but mine is also calling itself CV -constant velocity grease.
I know it probably does not matter that much what I put in there.
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It says use lithium based grease not lithium grease so what you have should do fine. I used this stuff just because that's all I had and there was no problems
(https://i.ebayimg.com/images/g/xEsAAOSw-dBTtBLO/s-l1600.jpg)
So yours says Moly grease/ lithium based and mine says Lithium- moly grease, sounds the same but mine is also calling itself CV -constant velocity grease.
I know it probably does not matter that much what I put in there.
Molybenum disulphide is a additive added to lithium based grease for extreme pressure/load.
https://www.wilko.com/en-uk/wilko-multi-purpose-grease-tub-500g/p/0039759?nst=0&gclid=EAIaIQobChMIx63Njt623wIVg-F3Ch2fFw5EEAQYBCABEgKKx_D_BwE&gclsrc=aw.ds (https://www.wilko.com/en-uk/wilko-multi-purpose-grease-tub-500g/p/0039759?nst=0&gclid=EAIaIQobChMIx63Njt623wIVg-F3Ch2fFw5EEAQYBCABEgKKx_D_BwE&gclsrc=aw.ds)
Same thing but more £
https://www.halfords.com/motoring/engine-oils-fluids/grease/comma-multi-purpose-grease-500g# (https://www.halfords.com/motoring/engine-oils-fluids/grease/comma-multi-purpose-grease-500g#)
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Yep just general multipurpose grease with no fancy stuff in it is what you want. But at the end of the day it's not a critical part, there's no load going through it, all you're doing is stopping the plastic bit squeeking so I think a small dab of nearly any grease that you've got on the shelf will do the job fine.
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If you want to get fancy. The manual shows the symbol LS next to the speedo drive so this is what Yamaha recommend using https://www.shopyamaha.com/product/details/race-grease?b=Search&d=31 (https://www.shopyamaha.com/product/details/race-grease?b=Search&d=31)|31&ls=yamaha-motor-company&dealernumber=
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If you want to get fancy. The manual shows the symbol LS next to the speedo drive so this is what Yamaha recommend using https://www.shopyamaha.com/product/details/race-grease?b=Search&d=31 (https://www.shopyamaha.com/product/details/race-grease?b=Search&d=31)|31&ls=yamaha-motor-company&dealernumber=
Molybedenum is a general slip agent that is often added to car engine oils, they say it makes oil more slippery without changing the viscocity of the oil. That’s why they (not sure who they are) say you should not use oils with this additive in vehicles with wet clutches.
I have heard others say I have used oil with moly in my bike for years and it’s never done any damage, well good luck.
Yet others will say with equal value I have driven for thousands of miles without a seat belt on and have never gone through a windscreen, well good luck with that one as well.
On the subject of lube for the speed sensor Yamaha probably know best.
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If you want to get fancy. The manual shows the symbol LS next to the speedo drive so this is what Yamaha recommend using https://www.shopyamaha.com/product/details/race-grease?b=Search&d=31 (https://www.shopyamaha.com/product/details/race-grease?b=Search&d=31)|31&ls=yamaha-motor-company&dealernumber=
Molybedenum is a general slip agent that is often added to car engine oils, they say it makes oil more slippery without changing the viscocity of the oil. That’s why they (not sure who they are) say you should not use oils with this additive in vehicles with wet clutches.
I have heard others say I have used oil with moly in my bike for years and it’s never done any damage, well good luck.
Yet others will say with equal value I have driven for thousands of miles without a seat belt on and have never gone through a windscreen, well good luck with that one as well.
On the subject of lube for the speed sensor Yamaha probably know best.
So as we are all saying & Yamaha to, LS = Lightweight Lithium Soap Base Grease. MS = Molybedenum Disulphide Grease. :)
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I'm amazed the thing is even still working after 20 years of possibly not being lubed. Would've thought the lugs would've called it a day by now, so without intending to sound negative, don't be totally shocked at the small chance it might fall to bits in your hands when you remove it, because the original rotor sensors are a bit more fragile than the replacement ones.
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I'm amazed the thing is even still working after 20 years of possibly not being lubed. Would've thought the lugs would've called it a day by now, so without intending to sound negative, don't be totally shocked at the small chance it might fall to bits in your hands when you remove it, because the original rotor sensors are a bit more fragile than the replacement ones.
Although 20 years old its only 21k miles and the last 17k miles have been dry ones. There is no squeaking at the moment.
Yes I have read on here about how fragile they are and wont be surprised to see it in bits. But I had the front tyre replaced back in the summer with no issues, it would of been picked up by the fitter wouldn't it.
When I do it I will document it with lots of pictures to post back here.
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it would of been picked up by the fitter wouldn't it[/size].
Yes, you have to pull the drive out of the way after you've taken the front wheel spindle out. I remember one grumpy fitter supergluing the lugs back on when I took it in for its first tyre change. Well only fair, he broke them off :lol
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I'm amazed the thing is even still working after 20 years of possibly not being lubed. Would've thought the lugs would've called it a day by now, so without intending to sound negative, don't be totally shocked at the small chance it might fall to bits in your hands when you remove it, because the original rotor sensors are a bit more fragile than the replacement ones.
Although 20 years old its only 21k miles and the last 17k miles have been dry ones. There is no squeaking at the moment.
Yes I have read on here about how fragile they are and wont be surprised to see it in bits. But I had the front tyre replaced back in the summer with no issues, it would of been picked up by the fitter wouldn't it.
When I do it I will document it with lots of pictures to post back here.
It's only a plastic ring that needs a splodge of grease on it.
I could probably get you a film crew together though if you wanna go the whole hog. :lol
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it would of been picked up by the fitter wouldn't it.
Yes, you have to pull the drive out of the way after you've taken the front wheel spindle out. I remember one grumpy fitter supergluing the lugs back on when I took it in for its first tyre change. Well only fair, he broke them off :lol
I have watched them do it - either from afar with the last one or through the steam of a cup of tea the time before that and they just seemed to remove calipers take out the spindle and that was that, didn't see any other "fiddling"
Anyone go any pictures of it in situ as I am not sure how it sits. After removing the calipers and spindle do I remove the wheel by first moving it to the left / away from the sensor whilst supporting the wheel, otherwise the weight of the wheel will snap the lugs wont it ?
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I'm amazed the thing is even still working after 20 years of possibly not being lubed. Would've thought the lugs would've called it a day by now, so without intending to sound negative, don't be totally shocked at the small chance it might fall to bits in your hands when you remove it, because the original rotor sensors are a bit more fragile than the replacement ones.
Although 20 years old its only 21k miles and the last 17k miles have been dry ones. There is no squeaking at the moment.
Yes I have read on here about how fragile they are and wont be surprised to see it in bits. But I had the front tyre replaced back in the summer with no issues, it would of been picked up by the fitter wouldn't it.
When I do it I will document it with lots of pictures to post back here.
It's only a plastic ring that needs a splodge of grease on it.
I could probably get you a film crew together though if you wanna go the whole hog. :lol
I wanted to document the condition of 20 year old grease how dry - or not it is. But yeh - send them over :D
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it would of been picked up by the fitter wouldn't it.
Yes, you have to pull the drive out of the way after you've taken the front wheel spindle out. I remember one grumpy fitter supergluing the lugs back on when I took it in for its first tyre change. Well only fair, he broke them off :lol
I have watched them do it - either from afar with the last one or through the steam of a cup of tea the time before that and they just seemed to remove calipers take out the spindle and that was that, didn't see any other "fiddling"
Anyone go any pictures of it in situ as I am not sure how it sits. After removing the calipers and spindle do I remove the wheel by first moving it to the left / away from the sensor whilst supporting the wheel, otherwise the weight of the wheel will snap the lugs wont it ?
The outer casing of the sensor has a slot on it which needs to be paired with a guide on the left fork.
Like a sort of tongue and groove scenario.
But it has to be done with the lugs in position and the housing sitting correctly, which is why a good dollop of grease actually helps when refitting.
It is fiddly the first time, but i learned rather quickly when i snapped the lugs on mine not to do it again.
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As you slide the axle out support the weight of the wheel with your hand ;) You can do it fazersharp we believe in you ;) ......next thread posted is what is the best glue for sticking the tabs back on my speedo :lol
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Ok job done today. I now realise that I have only been going half as fast as I thought because I only have 1 lug :lol .
The rotor has already had one of its lugs snapped off by one of the previous tyre fitters :lmao2 but there did seem to be enough grease and not dry at all. I find it had to believe its almost 21 year old grease but also hard to believe that one of the tyre monkeys added any either.I cleaned it up and added my own grease so I know its done. I used my RG grease.
I made some wooden chocks that fit over the lower frame and also took the seat off and added some weights to the top of the undertray.
All torqued up. Not been for a test ride yet to test the rotor - might snap only on one lug with the new stiffer grease.
Pictures below - first one is the (21 year old grease ? )
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If anyone asks tell them you were going so fast the speedo couldn't handle the G force and blew apart ;)
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If anyone asks tell them you were going so fast the speedo couldn't handle the G force and blew apart ;)
Totally believable with a black bike.
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Test ride today and the front wheel did not fall off and the spedo is working.
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Always a good sign when the wheel doesn't fall off
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Always a good sign when the wheel doesn't fall off
Can not ever be too sure so I stopped a couple of times the check that it was still there.
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Always a good sign when the wheel doesn't fall off
Can not ever be too sure so I stopped a couple of times the check that it was still there.
:lol