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General => General => Topic started by: joebloggs on 23 May 2017, 06:49:00 am

Title: Possible terror attack Manchester
Post by: joebloggs on 23 May 2017, 06:49:00 am
https://www.google.co.uk/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=3&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=0ahUKEwj1hcixqIXUAhUKPBQKHRMgA3wQqUMIMTAC&url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.theguardian.com%2Fuk-news%2Flive%2F2017%2Fmay%2F22%2Fmanchester-arena-ariana-grande-concert-explosion-england&usg=AFQjCNEJG9wOQxPRHX2osROmHzst-37k_w&sig2=F35fIbUBiy_U15OnG8S4tg (https://www.google.co.uk/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=3&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=0ahUKEwj1hcixqIXUAhUKPBQKHRMgA3wQqUMIMTAC&url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.theguardian.com%2Fuk-news%2Flive%2F2017%2Fmay%2F22%2Fmanchester-arena-ariana-grande-concert-explosion-england&usg=AFQjCNEJG9wOQxPRHX2osROmHzst-37k_w&sig2=F35fIbUBiy_U15OnG8S4tg)

We need to really ask ourselves if religion has a place in the 21st century
Title: Re: Possible terror attack Manchester
Post by: Dudeofrude on 23 May 2017, 07:31:02 am
https://www.google.co.uk/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=3&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=0ahUKEwj1hcixqIXUAhUKPBQKHRMgA3wQqUMIMTAC&url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.theguardian.com%2Fuk-news%2Flive%2F2017%2Fmay%2F22%2Fmanchester-arena-ariana-grande-concert-explosion-england&usg=AFQjCNEJG9wOQxPRHX2osROmHzst-37k_w&sig2=F35fIbUBiy_U15OnG8S4tg (https://www.google.co.uk/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=3&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=0ahUKEwj1hcixqIXUAhUKPBQKHRMgA3wQqUMIMTAC&url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.theguardian.com%2Fuk-news%2Flive%2F2017%2Fmay%2F22%2Fmanchester-arena-ariana-grande-concert-explosion-england&usg=AFQjCNEJG9wOQxPRHX2osROmHzst-37k_w&sig2=F35fIbUBiy_U15OnG8S4tg)

We need to really ask ourselves if religion has a place in the 21st century

As much as I agree with you in terms of religion having no place in a modern world,  this isnt anything to do with it.
This is just sadistic fuck wits which want to cause harm and make a name for themselves. And I can guarantee within
 hours 'Islamic state' will claim responsibility even though they had no hand in it.
It's a very upsetting time to have children on this planet, their future doesn't look great :-(
Title: Re: Possible terror attack Manchester
Post by: Dudeofrude on 23 May 2017, 07:31:42 am
😢
Title: Re: Possible terror attack Manchester
Post by: darrsi on 23 May 2017, 07:34:49 am
It's not a "possible" terror attack, it was a scumbag suicide bomber, loaded with bolts and screws, who at least fortunately died in the process.
No need to ask my thoughts on religion, but you might have a couple of billion people to convince otherwise.


Thoughts go out to anyone affected, just so pointless.  :(
Title: Re: Possible terror attack Manchester
Post by: tommyardin on 23 May 2017, 08:44:55 am
What more can you say?
It makes you sick to your stomach to think that a human being can bring about such horrific injuries to another, as Darrsi said most likely a shrapnel type bomb designed not just to kill in the local explosion zone but to send out pieces of red hot metal like bullets in every direction causing as much harm as possible.
Why there are violent acts like this I will never understand, but it seems to be people trying to force their will over others, this is not converting anyone to your way of thinking or belief system it is mindless murder. To what gain? I have yet to understand. Thoughts and prayers to those who have lost loved ones and those who are injured.


We have recently had a post on foc-u about Brady the moors murderer, this bastard in Manchester last night took many more lives than he did, both I feel both have now got what they deserved.
I don't think many will mourn either of their passing.
My family and I are all off to the USA this coming Monday to visit my son in St Louis, Missouri, my wife is now all figity about flying.
I heard someone say that there is no such thing as a hoax bomb scare, the bomb my be a hoax but the scare is just the same for those involved, terror.
Title: Re: Possible terror attack Manchester
Post by: BBROWN1664 on 23 May 2017, 08:58:22 am
It's not a "possible" terror attack, it was a scumbag suicide bomber, loaded with bolts and screws, who at least fortunately died in the process.


Whilst I wouldn't want to waste taxpayers money on supporting this scumbag whilst he claimed we had infringed his humam rights etc, he has got away far to easily.
Title: Re: Possible terror attack Manchester
Post by: darrsi on 23 May 2017, 11:24:36 am
What more can you say?
It makes you sick to your stomach to think that a human being can bring about such horrific injuries to another, as Darrsi said most likely a shrapnel type bomb designed not just to kill in the local explosion zone but to send out pieces of red hot metal like bullets in every direction causing as much harm as possible.
Why there are violent acts like this I will never understand, but it seems to be people trying to force their will over others, this is not converting anyone to your way of thinking or belief system it is mindless murder. To what gain? I have yet to understand. Thoughts and prayers to those who have lost loved ones and those who are injured.


We have recently had a post on foc-u about Brady the moors murderer, this bastard in Manchester last night took many more lives than he did, both I feel both have now got what they deserved.
I don't think many will mourn either of their passing.
My family and I are all off to the USA this coming Monday to visit my son in St Louis, Missouri, my wife is now all figity about flying.
I heard someone say that there is no such thing as a hoax bomb scare, the bomb my be a hoax but the scare is just the same for those involved, terror.

That's the worst part about all this, there is no gain whatsoever.
He hasn't got one over on an army during battle, or even a government, he's just devastated the lives of totally innocent families on a night out, it's just utterly pointless?
Title: Re: Possible terror attack Manchester
Post by: Dave48 on 23 May 2017, 05:36:39 pm
Absolutely sickening and to achieve what purpose?
All these attacks do is heighten fear & tension between citizens of whatever religious/political persuasion they happen to believe to be right. I have no time for religion(man made designed to control people) but I do know that the main tenet of all major religions is "Love your neighbour as yourself" or words to that effect.
What can be more inhumane & hypocritical than to maim, torture & destroy other lives in the name of some god or belief system? We have been doing it to another since time began.
Cant help thinking that British "action" in collaboration with the USA against other countries which involved what they euphemistically term "collateral damage" has increased the threat of reprisals here in the UK as in Paris etc.
I believe also that the people responsible for a lot of this hatred including Tony Blair should have been made accountable through the courts for what was an illegal war.
The problem remains that a lot of money is made by the armaments industry who obviously have a vested interest in continuing strife around the world.
That  bomb attack could so easily have happened in my home city-I have grandaughters the same age as some of those innocent children killed & maimed in Manchester.

Title: Re: Possible terror attack Manchester
Post by: Wee Rocky on 23 May 2017, 06:36:58 pm
Totally agree with you. People have the right to believe in whatever they want and I respect that but when their beliefs lead to terrorism and murder who in their right mind can agree with it. These religious fanatics are brain washed and very dangerous. Bad people do bad things but religion is the only thing that makes good people do bad things. Man made God, God didn't make man. My heart goes out to all the families that lost loved ones.
Title: Re: Possible terror attack Manchester
Post by: Townhill on 23 May 2017, 07:06:41 pm

What the Foc is going on in this world it makes me sick, defenceless innocent people out for a good time. Families who where affected by this cruel act will have to live with this for the rest of their lives.


Enough is enough forget Syria forget Afghanistan forget the Middle East it's time we shut our borders and redeploy the troops to seek out the enemy within our own community's my heart goes out to the families who have lost someone or have been injured at Manchester Arena
Title: Re: Possible terror attack Manchester
Post by: lew600fazer on 23 May 2017, 10:24:43 pm

Absolutely sickening and to achieve what purpose?
All these attacks do is heighten fear & tension between citizens of whatever religious/political persuasion they happen to believe to be right. I have no time for religion(man made designed to control people) but I do know that the main tenet of all major religions is "Love your neighbour as yourself" or words to that effect.
What can be more inhumane & hypocritical than to maim, torture & destroy other lives in the name of some god or belief system? We have been doing it to another since time began.
Cant help thinking that British "action" in collaboration with the USA against other countries which involved what they euphemistically term "collateral damage" has increased the threat of reprisals here in the UK as in Paris etc.
I believe also that the people responsible for a lot of this hatred including Tony Blair should have been made accountable through the courts for what was an illegal war.
The problem remains that a lot of money is made by the armaments industry who obviously have a vested interest in continuing strife around the world.
That  bomb attack could so easily have happened in my home city-I have grandaughters the same age as some of those innocent children killed & maimed in Manchester.


Please tell why Tony Blair ?why not Thatcher why not also mention Cameron, getting tiring now blaming Blair for everything.Thatcher & Major first gulf war. Cameron assisted in the removal of Gaddfi which as we all know has lead to the mass influx of Africans deciding to have a Mediterranean cruise,and holiday in Italy.
Title: Re: Possible terror attack Manchester
Post by: fazersharp on 23 May 2017, 10:41:50 pm


Enough is enough forget Syria forget Afghanistan forget the Middle East it's time we shut our borders and redeploy the troops to seek out the enemy within our own community's my heart goes out to the families who have lost someone or have been injured at Manchester Arena
Seems like you have got part of your wish - the threat level has been raised to severe and in doing so has released armed troops on the streets. All we need to do now is get proper full control of our borders - immigration and asylum but wait - the british public have already said that is what they want, forget the silly scaremongering about voting for more austerity and less workers rights because this threat unlike those is real and if less rights and more austerity is the price to pay then I will gladly pay it - rather pay with £ than with blood.
Title: Re: Possible terror attack Manchester
Post by: maddog04 on 23 May 2017, 11:08:04 pm
my heart goes out to everyone affected by the tragedy especially those families that have lost their loved ones, I don't know how I'd react if I lost my loved ones.

fazersharp....hear what you're saying but don't fall into the trap of excepting security at any cost.....HMG will default to austerity to justify their  means. We have/need more investment in our emergency services/security (MI 5/6, specialist Police armed response/SF) to up the ante
we can all be more vigilant but we don't need to be kept under to do it, we're the 6th most prosperous nation.....we have the money, HMG chooses not to spend it where its needed
Title: Re: Possible terror attack Manchester
Post by: joebloggs on 24 May 2017, 08:18:28 am
I think if our governments learned to take care of our own business instead of interfering in other countries politics we'd be in a lot better place.

We were all shocked and disgusted at Mondays terror attack but how many shed a tear when our armed forces, under direction of Bush and Blair, directly or indirectly killed thousands every day. Of course we did it in the name of peace so thats OK, like we can indiscriminately kill men women and children without fear of repercussion as we had the moral high ground.

Remember the first night of shock and awe, sixty five cruise missiles slammed into Baghdad and the ensuing carnage was broadcast to the work like some sick fireworks display, I can't begin to imagine the terror of that bombardment, and that was just the start. That battle is still being fought on the streets of Iraqi, women and children still paying the price of our governments actions and we wonder why we are now spending untold millions on security to try to prevent terrorist attacks that we may have asked for.

Read Blowback by Chalmers Johnson, He wrote the book before 9/11 then wrote a 2nd edition including the twin towers attack.



 
Title: Re: Possible terror attack Manchester
Post by: Dave48 on 24 May 2017, 08:46:54 am

Absolutely sickening and to achieve what purpose?
All these attacks do is heighten fear & tension between citizens of whatever religious/political persuasion they happen to believe to be right. I have no time for religion(man made designed to control people) but I do know that the main tenet of all major religions is "Love your neighbour as yourself" or words to that effect.
What can be more inhumane & hypocritical than to maim, torture & destroy other lives in the name of some god or belief system? We have been doing it to another since time began.
Cant help thinking that British "action" in collaboration with the USA against other countries which involved what they euphemistically term "collateral damage" has increased the threat of reprisals here in the UK as in Paris etc.
I believe also that the people responsible for a lot of this hatred including Tony Blair should have been made accountable through the courts for what was an illegal war.
The problem remains that a lot of money is made by the armaments industry who obviously have a vested interest in continuing strife around the world.
That  bomb attack could so easily have happened in my home city-I have grandaughters the same age as some of those innocent children killed & maimed in Manchester.


Please tell why Tony Blair ?why not Thatcher why not also mention Cameron, getting tiring now blaming Blair for everything.Thatcher & Major first gulf war. Cameron assisted in the removal of Gaddfi which as we all know has lead to the mass influx of Africans deciding to have a Mediterranean cruise,and holiday in Italy.


Lew I said "the people responsible".... of course this list would have to include those you mention. Perhaps Blair is top of my list since he picks up megabucks as a "f*****g PEACE ENVOY"! FFS
Title: Re: Possible terror attack Manchester
Post by: Townhill on 24 May 2017, 10:15:54 am

Sorry Fazersharp misread,

Title: Re: Possible terror attack Manchester
Post by: fazersharp on 24 May 2017, 12:14:18 pm



Enough is enough forget Syria forget Afghanistan forget the Middle East it's time we shut our borders and redeploy the troops to seek out the enemy within our own community's my heart goes out to the families who have lost someone or have been injured at Manchester Arena
Seems like you have got part of your wish - the threat level has been raised to severe and in doing so has released armed troops on the streets. All we need to do now is get proper full control of our borders - immigration and asylum but wait - the british public have already said that is what they want, forget the silly scaremongering about voting for more austerity and less workers rights because this threat unlike those is real and if less rights and more austerity is the price to pay then I will gladly pay it - rather pay with £ than with blood.


Each to their own just saying!
I was actually agreeing with you and supporting you
Title: Re: Possible terror attack Manchester
Post by: lew600fazer on 24 May 2017, 09:34:05 pm


Absolutely sickening and to achieve what purpose?
All these attacks do is heighten fear & tension between citizens of whatever religious/political persuasion they happen to believe to be right. I have no time for religion(man made designed to control people) but I do know that the main tenet of all major religions is "Love your neighbour as yourself" or words to that effect.
What can be more inhumane & hypocritical than to maim, torture & destroy other lives in the name of some god or belief system? We have been doing it to another since time began.
Cant help thinking that British "action" in collaboration with the USA against other countries which involved what they euphemistically term "collateral damage" has increased the threat of reprisals here in the UK as in Paris etc.
I believe also that the people responsible for a lot of this hatred including Tony Blair should have been made accountable through the courts for what was an illegal war.
The problem remains that a lot of money is made by the armaments industry who obviously have a vested interest in continuing strife around the world.
That  bomb attack could so easily have happened in my home city-I have grandaughters the same age as some of those innocent children killed & maimed in Manchester.


Please tell why Tony Blair ?why not Thatcher why not also mention Cameron, getting tiring now blaming Blair for everything.Thatcher & Major first gulf war. Cameron assisted in the removal of Gaddfi which as we all know has lead to the mass influx of Africans deciding to have a Mediterranean cruise,and holiday in Italy.


Lew I said "the people responsible".... of course this list would have to include those you mention. Perhaps Blair is top of my list since he picks up megabucks as a "f*****g PEACE ENVOY"! FFS
Dave do your self a favour and see how Blair spends his mega bucks for f---k sake. Did Thatcher set up a fund to help disabled service personal? No when she had her service celebrating the victory in the Falklands she insisted the DAMAGED service men be sat at the back of the Cathtedral so as to avoid them being viewed as the TV were covering the event.


According to the South Atlantic Medal Association support group more veterans have committed suicide since the war than died during the fighting. All this agony was to save the political face of Tory prime minister Margaret Thatcher, and to show that Britain was still a world player.
Title: Re: Possible terror attack Manchester
Post by: tommyardin on 24 May 2017, 11:47:26 pm
We all have a say and opinions, some differ from others, and that OK, but the common uniting fact is that we all agree that something must be done to lessen the opportunities for these bastards to harm innocents, of course we should.


But we as a nation should hang our heads in shame as during 'The British Empire' and since, we have carried out terrible, wicked, violent acts around the world under the name of Christianity.
Now whether you give any credence to Christianity is a matter of individual choice. But some of the abuse our country has metered out to others is not and should not be under the guise of Christianity, its mostly about money and the financial abuse of those who were deemed weaker or of less value. Great Britain as we were once known
(Now United Kingdom, that is a joke in itself) have been leaders in the past when it comes to violence.
I fear in many ways we are reaping what we have sewn, I'm not saying it is right or that or that we should lay down and roll over and accept it, but, we should look at the way we as a Nation conducted ourselves in the past, try and make amends, apologise where we are able and also return financially where it is possible.


Now I'm getting my head down and waiting for the flack.
Remember my opinions are just as valid as yours but they maybe different.             
Title: Re: Possible terror attack Manchester
Post by: lew600fazer on 25 May 2017, 10:07:59 am

Tommy I agree with a lot of what you are saying, but it was not the common man in the UK that suddenly said let's go and build an Empire. The common man was told what to do by the Landed Gentry , Kings and Queens , Lords & Ladies and they are still living of the plunder that took place during that so called glorious period in our bloody history.
For fecks sake the 1st world war was all about the Kings & Queens of Europe falling out , The Kaiser was pissed off because his dick was not as big as his cousins George's  dick. I am not a commie by any stretch of the imagination but the Bolsheviks perhaps went a bit to far in whacking their royals but it sorted the royals out for sure.



On February 04, 2013, Vladimir Putin, the Russian president, addressed the Duma,  (Russian Parliament), and gave a speech about the tensions  with minorities in Russia :
“In Russia live Russians.  Any minority, from anywhere, if it wants to live in Russia, to work and eat in Russia, should speak  Russian, and should respect the Russian laws.  If they prefer Sharia Law, and live the life of Muslims then we advise them to go to those places where that’s the state law.  Russia does not need Muslim minorities. Minorities need Russia, and we will not grant them special privileges, or try to change our laws to fit their desires, no matter how loud they yell ‘discrimination’. We will not tolerate disrespect of our Russian culture.  We had better learn from the suicides of America, England, Holland and  France, if we are to survive as a nation.  The Muslims are taking over those countries and they will not take over Russia.   The Russian customs and traditions are not compatible with the lack of culture or the primitive ways of  Sharia Law and Muslims.  When this honorable legislative body thinks of creating new laws, it  should have in mind the Russian national interest first, observing that the Muslim
 minorities are not Russians.
The politicians in the Duma gave Putin a five minute standing ovation.
 Concerning our pussy footing around the terror threat here in the UK and all over the EU who is getting tired of the same old Line . THE BOMBER WAS KNOWN TO THE AUTHOURITIES. The PC brigade jump on the wagon and spout on about human rights and this is why these scumbags walk amongst us day in and day out.
This pricks are being radicalised here in the schools and mosques by preachers who preach nothing but hate, but perhaps the Moslims have learnt from the Christian faith or elements within the Christian faith,  The Jesuit maxim "Give me a child for his first seven years and I'll give you the man" surely this is a form of radicalisation
Title: Re: Possible terror attack Manchester
Post by: tommyardin on 25 May 2017, 11:36:55 am
Good post lew, could not agree more with a lot you also said.


Whether we like it or not, we the Brits are seen by a lot of the world as the has-been-bullies, those that ruled the British Empire with a rod of iron, who not only raped their lands but often their women to, of course not everyone  who was British operated like that but I'm afraid we are all grouped together because of our title 'British' that is what we are, there is no discrimination between us, we are seen as no different to the Masters and Gentry as you rightly pointed out were the implementers of the Empire and our Goverment went along because it suited them and filled the coffers. So really there is no discrimination between us, those that do as they are told and the tellers, we are all British.
Just like there is no discriminated when a zealot or a mad crazed wicked bastard sets off a bomb in an arena with thousands of children in it, it takes out innocent children both Muslim and Christian.
I honestly don't think that any of the contributors to this discussion are very far from each other in our thinking when it come to the push. But what do we do about is armed police and military walking our streets carrying automatic weapons the answer?  A idiot with a well aimed brick can get possession of and automatic weapon that can possibly fire off a hundred rounds a minute. Fucked if I know. What I do know is that I am sorry for what has lead to all this hatred and it is our children that will bear most of the brunt of it, I'm 70 and likely to go on for another ten or fifteen years my son and daughter and their children have to go on living with it and to be honest I fear it is not going to go away but most likely esculate.
Right I have now completely depressed myself where the fuck did I put that length of rope. :'(
Title: Re: Possible terror attack Manchester
Post by: esetest on 25 May 2017, 06:09:48 pm
Why is it that the Police have the powers to seize the passports of known troublemakers during football tournaments , but allow the 3000 known Jihadists to travel hither and thither , I won't say what I would do to these scum on a social platform as big brother is watching .
Title: Re: Possible terror attack Manchester
Post by: BBROWN1664 on 25 May 2017, 06:13:16 pm
There was a post I saw on faceache today.

It took days for laws to be changed to make Kodi box type devices illegal to use in the way that most people use them but its taken years to get nowhere with preventing known (or suspected) terrorists from coming into the country.
Title: Re: Possible terror attack Manchester
Post by: Dudeofrude on 25 May 2017, 07:09:48 pm
There was a post I saw on faceache today.

It took days for laws to be changed to make Kodi box type devices illegal to use in the way that most people use them but its taken years to get nowhere with preventing known (or suspected) terrorists from coming into the country.

That's because greedy fat cat corporations were losing out on millions of pounds worth of revenue, much more Important than innocent lives.

My problem with the reposonse to all these 'terrorists' attacks is that having armed guards/soldiers would have not changed a thing about what happened Monday night. It wouldn't have mattered if they had tanks parked either side of the entrance, wouldn't have mattered if they had metal detectors on the doors, NOTHING would have stopped that asshat doing what he was gonna do.
Putting the army on the streets does nothing more than intimidate the innocent and help keep US in check.
A suicide bomber has already come to terms with the fact they are gonna die so they aren't gonna be bothered who's got a gun as long as they can press their button.

Not to get all tinfoil hat on you but it does seem like there's a higher agenda here. Much like in America after 9/11 they pushed through massive amounts of laws that stripped people of their privacy in the name of keeping the country safe.
They've already started here with the snoopers charter. What's next though? How long before we all have to carry ID? How long before you have to be searched before entering shopping centers/schools/libraries etc? Before your privacy is taken away in the name of 'security'? The harsh truth is 'terrorism' is very good for governments when they have an agenda to push.

And on a final note, The truest words I've heard from a celebrity in my life, I've never thought much of Morrissey but this time he's bang on.......
Title: Re: Possible terror attack Manchester
Post by: esetest on 25 May 2017, 09:40:24 pm
Arrest  the 3000 known Jihadists fit it a small explosive charge inserted by their carotid artery , that detonated when they walk out the front door , no need for soldiers on the streets , deportation or POW camps.
Title: Re: Possible terror attack Manchester
Post by: tommyardin on 25 May 2017, 10:05:38 pm
Arrest  the 3000 known Jihadists fit it a small explosive charge inserted by their carotid artery , that detonated when they walk out the front door , no need for soldiers on the streets , deportation or POW camps.


Would not want to be a postman in that area, Mr Jihadist steps out his front door to sign for the parcel Boom One dead Jihadist, one seriously fucked postman. 
 :lol :rollin :rollin :rollin :lol
Title: Re: Possible terror attack Manchester
Post by: lew600fazer on 25 May 2017, 10:16:17 pm

There was a post I saw on faceache today.

It took days for laws to be changed to make Kodi box type devices illegal to use in the way that most people use them but its taken years to get nowhere with preventing known (or suspected) terrorists from coming into the country.

That's because greedy fat cat corporations were losing out on millions of pounds worth of revenue, much more Important than innocent lives.

My problem with the reposonse to all these 'terrorists' attacks is that having armed guards/soldiers would have not changed a thing about what happened Monday night. It wouldn't have mattered if they had tanks parked either side of the entrance, wouldn't have mattered if they had metal detectors on the doors, NOTHING would have stopped that asshat doing what he was gonna do.
Putting the army on the streets does nothing more than intimidate the innocent and help keep US in check.
A suicide bomber has already come to terms with the fact they are gonna die so they aren't gonna be bothered who's got a gun as long as they can press their button.

Not to get all tinfoil hat on you but it does seem like there's a higher agenda here. Much like in America after 9/11 they pushed through massive amounts of laws that stripped people of their privacy in the name of keeping the country safe.
They've already started here with the snoopers charter. What's next though? How long before we all have to carry ID? How long before you have to be searched before entering shopping centers/schools/libraries etc? Before your privacy is taken away in the name of 'security'? The harsh truth is 'terrorism' is very good for governments when they have an agenda to push.

And on a final note, The truest words I've heard from a celebrity in my life, I've never thought much of Morrissey but this time he's bang on.......
What is your objection to carrying an identity card? also what is your objection to being searched before entering a Shop or Sports venue Etc! We had to live with it in N Ireland for 30 years plus during the troubles. Anyone who  does object to carrying an TD card must have something to hide, Also if searched before entering a shopping centre surely the 15 seconds wasted of your life would only make your shopping experience better knowing that you may jst be a little bit safer to enjoy your day.
Title: Re: Possible terror attack Manchester
Post by: esetest on 25 May 2017, 10:26:40 pm

There was a post I saw on faceache today.

It took days for laws to be changed to make Kodi box type devices illegal to use in the way that most people use them but its taken years to get nowhere with preventing known (or suspected) terrorists from coming into the country.

That's because greedy fat cat corporations were losing out on millions of pounds worth of revenue, much more Important than innocent lives.

My problem with the reposonse to all these 'terrorists' attacks is that having armed guards/soldiers would have not changed a thing about what happened Monday night. It wouldn't have mattered if they had tanks parked either side of the entrance, wouldn't have mattered if they had metal detectors on the doors, NOTHING would have stopped that asshat doing what he was gonna do.
Putting the army on the streets does nothing more than intimidate the innocent and help keep US in check.
A suicide bomber has already come to terms with the fact they are gonna die so they aren't gonna be bothered who's got a gun as long as they can press their button.

Not to get all tinfoil hat on you but it does seem like there's a higher agenda here. Much like in America after 9/11 they pushed through massive amounts of laws that stripped people of their privacy in the name of keeping the country safe.
They've already started here with the snoopers charter. What's next though? How long before we all have to carry ID? How long before you have to be searched before entering shopping centers/schools/libraries etc? Before your privacy is taken away in the name of 'security'? The harsh truth is 'terrorism' is very good for governments when they have an agenda to push.

And on a final note, The truest words I've heard from a celebrity in my life, I've never thought much of Morrissey but this time he's bang on.......
What is your objection to carrying an identity card? also what is your objection to being searched before entering a Shop or Sports venue Etc! We had to live with it in N Ireland for 30 years plus during the troubles. Anyone who  does object to carrying an TD card must have something to hide, Also if searched before entering a shopping centre surely the 15 seconds wasted of your life would only make your shopping experience better knowing that you may jst be a little bit safer to enjoy your day.
My plan is cheaper , and only infringes on the rights of those intent on doing us harm , I would extend it to serial murderers and sex offenders .
Title: Re: Possible terror attack Manchester
Post by: BBROWN1664 on 26 May 2017, 07:40:27 am
What is your objection to carrying an identity card? also what is your objection to being searched before entering a Shop or Sports venue Etc! We had to live with it in N Ireland for 30 years plus during the troubles. Anyone who  does object to carrying an TD card must have something to hide, Also if searched before entering a shopping centre surely the 15 seconds wasted of your life would only make your shopping experience better knowing that you may jst be a little bit safer to enjoy your day.

How many people who object to ID cards carry around their licence or a bank card?
It's no different really and as you say Lew, the only people that are against it tend to be the ones who want to hide from something.
Title: Re: Possible terror attack Manchester
Post by: Dave48 on 26 May 2017, 09:29:24 am
I have absolutely no objection to carrying an ID card as a means of helping combat these evil minded fanatics. After all I am well known to the authorities as I  have a bank account, use a computer, smartphone,am on various governments databases eg DWP NHS etc. Any law abiding citizen would surely not object.
If the threat to our security came solely from outside our borders then we might not need  this measure but its British citizens who are being radicalised by these hate preachers,sent off abroad for "brain washing" & training in terrorism  then return to UK as though they have been for a holiday, freely admitted by our customs/border security people.
I read Lews post re Putins speech to the Russian parliament &, although I may not care for some of his actions, I wholeheartedly agree. If you want the benefits of living in a free democratic society then you abide by our rules. I am sick & tired of  hearing about burkas, Sharia Law, Faith Schools, and other forms of "special treatment"
This is Britain 2017 FFS not some foreign country stuck in the dark ages way of thinking. And if  people arent willing to become British citizens in respect of our laws & culture then why come in the first place?
You might think I am racist-I assure you I am not. I live in Birmingham the first city that will an experience a majority non-white population in the very near future.
My neighbours include white Brummies of English,Welsh, Scots & Irish descent, Afro Caribbeans, Asians of every religious persuasion & many from China, also East Europeans and we all mostly get along pretty well. There are areas of my city, however, where I feel uncomfortable & unwelcome-I guess in a similar way to how the first post war West Indiansimmigrants must have felt on arrival in the UK back in the 1940s & 50s.
Title: Re: Possible terror attack Manchester
Post by: Hedgetrimmer on 26 May 2017, 09:38:43 am

Putting the army on the streets does nothing more than intimidate the innocent and help keep US in check.



Not that I think that it's good thing that our lords and masters feel it has come to this, but why are you intimidated by our soldiers?


Can't see how it stops these nutters though. Although the point is being made that they are only being used at static facilities to free up other policing resources for the streets. Which is a finger pointed squarely at those who have cut resources and manpower down to the bone.
Title: Re: Possible terror attack Manchester
Post by: Dave48 on 26 May 2017, 09:44:57 am

Putting the army on the streets does nothing more than intimidate the innocent and help keep US in check.



Not that I think that it's good thing that our lords and masters feel it has come to this, but why are you intimidated by our soldiers?


Can't see how it stops these nutters though. Although the point is being made that they are only being used at static facilities to free up other policing resources for the streets. Which is a finger pointed squarely at those who have cut resources and manpower down to the bone.


+1
Title: Re: Possible terror attack Manchester
Post by: slappy on 26 May 2017, 03:28:49 pm
Searching people will not stop the bombers, most people doing the searches are low paid workers and have only very basic training. A small bomb can be easily concealed and can do a lot of damage.  And if you are a suicide bomber then realising you are going to be searched they will just set the bomb off anyway, they are not bothered who they kill and maim.
And as for the 3000 jihadists, that number is a joke, all the people who silently support them are just as guilty to me, when the mosque leaders start dragging these people down to the nearest cop shop then they can start blathering on about Islam being
a caring , loving,  multicultural and liberal religion.
Title: Re: Possible terror attack Manchester
Post by: BBROWN1664 on 26 May 2017, 03:37:43 pm
The unfortunate thing with all of this is they will end up with a ring of steel around venues and all it will do is move the problem back 50 m to where people are queuing to get through the scanners etc. It wont fix the problem.
Title: Re: Possible terror attack Manchester
Post by: Dudeofrude on 26 May 2017, 05:14:13 pm

Putting the army on the streets does nothing more than intimidate the innocent and help keep US in check.



Not that I think that it's good thing that our lords and masters feel it has come to this, but why are you intimidated by our soldiers?


Can't see how it stops these nutters though. Although the point is being made that they are only being used at static facilities to free up other policing resources for the streets. Which is a finger pointed squarely at those who have cut resources and manpower down to the bone.

Its not so much being intimidated by soldiers but more so guns in general.
Tell me this, hypothetically if you were out at say Alton Tower with your wife and kids and you saw armed police/soldiers walking around would that make you feel safer?  Or would it make you feel on edge because they are only there because something might happen?

I dunno about you but I don't want my kids growing up thinking it's normal to see people walking around with guns.
Think back to the Charlie hebdo shootings in France, what were them guys dressed like?
Now what would be stopping terrorists dressing like army/police here when they wanna carry out a massacre?
You'd see them walk along with guns and not give it a second thought as you'd be so used to seeing armed solders day after day?

I know those of you from Northern Ireland would be used to it but I grew up in a normal safe environment where the only people with guns were the criminals and wannabe gangsters. I'very grown up under the notion that if they have a gun they're up to no good so get the fuck out the way.

And as previously stated it doesn't even help the situation. A bullet can't stop a bomb
Title: Re: Possible terror attack Manchester
Post by: BBROWN1664 on 26 May 2017, 05:31:31 pm
When I was a kid it was normal to see people wandering around with guns. I lived in a village and you would often see kids with toy guns or air guns and others wandering off to the fields with shotguns.
Nowadays, you try it and you would get shot for carrying a realistic looking toy gun let alone the others.
I didn't feel unsafe then and I don't feel unsafe now.

Other countries police have always carried guns, it is a shame that our police are now doing the same because of whats happening. After all, a truncheon is no use against an AK47 is it.
The army are on the streets today because of two things. 1, not all the police are trained to carry firearms (unlike other countries) and the police forces have been cut back so far that there just aren't enough of them to show a presence these days.
Title: Re: Possible terror attack Manchester
Post by: Hedgetrimmer on 26 May 2017, 05:38:21 pm
I suppose being ex military myself, I'd hardly give it a second thought. Although of course, I'd prefer us not to need it. But armed police are now a firmly established thing here. Nothing to stop terrorists dressing up as policemen anyway. I think I would be in some measure reassured near to likely targets in that at least they may be able to lessen the ability of some nutter going berserk with a lorry or something.
It'd be nice to not need a military at all, or a police force for that matter, but I guess a country has to face realities, and the powers that be are trying to do that (at last). Whether they're going the right way about it or not...


Anyway, as said, they're supposed to be on static guard of facilities, so I don't see it being a big problem. In a way, I kind of feel sorry for them being shoved in the front line (because that is what it is now, and we're all in the trenches, like it or not - sensationalist? maybe, but certainly our major cities must feel a bit like that now), as they're likely to be targets themselves, but they'll do it without question because that is their job. And what a boring job, poor sods!


What are the solutions? Cos this time, it's not going to be like the Troubles of NI - it's not resolvable by talking, it's not resolvable by changes in policy. Convert to Islam or die! That's their mantra. They have no other motives.

Title: Re: Possible terror attack Manchester
Post by: VNA - BMW Wank on 27 May 2017, 09:57:03 am
 I agree with much (though not all) of what has already been said by Dave48, joebloggs, tommyyardin, dudeofrude


The attack on Manchester is absolutely abhorrent.  We all know this, we can all agree on that.  I like many, if not all here, don't have the words the express how I feel about such actions.



But why are these things happenin?



I think Lew mentioned somewhere the first Gulf war, when he actually meant the second Gulf War.  The first being the Iran Iraq war, a proxy war indirectly funded by America via Saudi Arabia. The Americans wanted to sort Iran out after they overthrew the American puppet Mahammad Reza Pahlavi (The Shah of Iran) in an Islamic Revolution. 



And let us be clear, Mahammad Reza Pahlavi was a filthy murderous bastard of a dictator. 



So a pissed of America came up with a scheme in which another of it’s filthy murderous dictators Saddam Hussein would take on Iran.  Meanwhile the USSR decided to back Iran to the hilt.  At roughly the same time the US decided to give the USSR it’s Vietnam and destabilised Afghanistan.
And on and on and on it goes. 

Oh, and don’t forget our long-standing partners in the Middle East are Saudi Arabia, perhaps the dirtiest, nastiest most repressive regime of them all, and the birth place of Wahhabism the ideology that the so called Islamic State adhere to.  I wonder – where does IS get it’s funding from?
 This is deacdes of bloody and murderous Western foreign policy.   The British Empire may thankfully long be dead, but we are still imperialists.
So as I’ve said many times on this forum.  Who are the terrorists?  Who are the real terrorists?
Title: Re: Possible terror attack Manchester
Post by: Hedgetrimmer on 27 May 2017, 10:24:53 am
Do you know who really pisses me off? The Romans. Coming over here and imposing their way of life on us. We should bomb Italy. And while we're at it, what about the Normans? All our political woes could be said to be down to them. Time to invade Normandy.



But why are these things happenin?



We can't change the past. What is your policy for the present and future? ISIS and their plan to rule the world through an extreme version of Islam is here and now. What would you do about them? Bearing in mind that unless you convert to Islam, they'll kill you anyway, whether Britain pulls away from any dealings with Saudi, Oman, Yemen, Iraq, Afghanistan, Pakistan, U.S.A., Israel..they'll still kill you unless you convert. What would you do?
Title: Re: Possible terror attack Manchester
Post by: VNA - BMW Wank on 27 May 2017, 10:38:52 am
  So what do you suggest Hedgetrimmer?  Continue to deny our murderous role in the world?  Keep our heads buried firmly in the desert sand?



 Don’t you understand that they are our creation?   
 



 
Quote
What would you do?



 I assume you wish to continue as we are.  Continue our mad foreign policy.  Keep destroying whole nations, keep bombing and killing our way round the world in some sort of strange hope that more of what hasn’t worked in the past will somehow work tomorrow. 



As I said, who are the terrorists?

 
 
 
Title: Re: Possible terror attack Manchester
Post by: Hedgetrimmer on 27 May 2017, 10:55:13 am
I asked first. What would you do?


I'll give you some help.


Stop supplying arms to Saudi Arabia.


ISIS say boom!


Stop meddling in Iraq and Syria.


ISIS say boom!


Stop being America's poodle.


ISIS say boom!


Completely disband our military.


ISIS say boom!


Stand on a soapbox and decry our dreadful history of imperialism and meddling around the world, and promise never to do any such thing again.


ISIS say boom!


So I ask you again: what would you do?
Title: Re: Possible terror attack Manchester
Post by: VNA - BMW Wank on 27 May 2017, 11:32:54 am
 It’s simple hedgetrimmer.


I don’t believe in killing people.  I believe in peace and justice for all.
 
Title: Re: Possible terror attack Manchester
Post by: Hedgetrimmer on 27 May 2017, 11:42:42 am
It’s simple hedgetrimmer.


I don’t believe in killing people.  I believe in peace and justice for all.


I wish everyone were like that. But they're not.
Title: Re: Possible terror attack Manchester
Post by: VNA - BMW Wank on 27 May 2017, 12:13:55 pm
 David Cameron not that long ago was talking about backing the moderate and progressive Islamic rebels in Syria.  What moderate progressive Islamic rebels?  The backers of The Rebel Syrian Army are Turkey, Qatar and Saudi Arabia.  The same people who promote Wahhabist ideology.


Why do we have extremist mosques in the UK, Wahhabist mosques?  Because we are allies with and fund the Saudi Wahhabist state.  Islamic State is Wahhabism.  Saudi has promoted Wahhabism around the globe, we are allies with Saudi, we fund and promote the IS ideology. 



This is our mess.


And I fear there will be a lot more "boom" as you say Hedgetrimmer.   
 
Title: Re: Possible terror attack Manchester
Post by: darrsi on 27 May 2017, 01:29:47 pm
If we can supposedly put a number on highly threatening jihadists in the UK, then surely that means we know who and where they are doesn't it?
So why can't we strike first, deporting any non UK born suspects for starters, regardless of their claims that their own homeland is dangerous for them (not our fault), and detain the others under terrorism laws, and see if the threat suddenly subsides.
Meanwhile, when we see dubious looking people at our borders with suspicious amounts of stamps on their passports fling in from known threatening countries, then if they're not born here tell them to fuck right off and bar them for life, and if they are born here then detain them and question them over suspected terrorist activity.
The PC brigade will whinge like mad, but rather them than us having to deal with the aftermath of a bomb blowing up completely innocent people at a pop concert for example.   
We've gotta start somewhere, and it sounds like a reasonable plan to me.
Title: Re: Possible terror attack Manchester
Post by: VNA - BMW Wank on 27 May 2017, 02:09:24 pm
 
Quote
So why can't we strike first, deporting any non UK born suspects for starters, regardless of their claims that their own homeland is dangerous for them (not our fault), and detain the others under terrorism laws, and see if the threat suddenly subsides.

Complete waste of time. 



You can’t deport a suspect.  If we lock people up or deport them based on suspicion – well you’ve just created a police state.


Not our fault?  We start llegal and immoral wars.  We rob countries blind across the globe, we undermine democracy and support brutal dictatorships and we support proxy wars.  Not our fault – I mean where the fuck do you start will all imperialistic murderous shit either carried out or sponsored by our country.


At the end of the day, as horrible as it is to contemplate, what happened in Manchester is collateral damage.


And anyway such actions just will breed more terrorists.  Our prisons will just become breeding centres for Wahhabist terrorism.  Muslim communities will be seen as suspect communities, breeding more resentment and ideal fodder for the Saudi sponsored Imams in our Saudi built mosques.


Quote
and see if the threat suddenly subsides.


Ho ho!  “Boom”.
 
Title: Re: Possible terror attack Manchester
Post by: fazersharp on 27 May 2017, 02:13:14 pm
If we can supposedly put a number on highly threatening jihadists in the UK, then surely that means we know who and where they are doesn't it?
So why can't we strike first, deporting any non UK born suspects for starters, regardless of their claims that their own homeland is dangerous for them (not our fault), and detain the others under terrorism laws, and see if the threat suddenly subsides.
Meanwhile, when we see dubious looking people at our borders with suspicious amounts of stamps on their passports fling in from known threatening countries, then if they're not born here tell them to fuck right off and bar them for life, and if they are born here then detain them and question them over suspected terrorist activity.
The PC brigade will whinge like mad, but rather them than us having to deal with the aftermath of a bomb blowing up completely innocent people at a pop concert for example.   
We've gotta start somewhere, and it sounds like a reasonable plan to me.
When we finally brexit proper we can be free to do all of that without having the European Court of Justice and  European Court of Human rights overruling all our efforts.
We need our own Guantanamo bay, maybe we could use the Falklands, stopping them at the border is what Trump suggested and he got all kinds of flack for that but it makes sense to say we dont want people coming here who have nothing but bad intentions.

This has been going through my mind, the father of the bomber came here after fleeing Gadafi's Libya we opened our doors to him and gave him refuge, then we helped destroy his enemy and we are repaid by his son murdering people of the very nation that was his savour. So the people who say its because we got rid of Gadfi doesn't make sense, it doesn't fit this story and makes no difference to what happened.

Also corbin saying they shall not win on one hand and then on the other saying he will alter our foreign policy when that is exactly what they want, if he does that then the terrorism will get worse because they will see that the bombing is working. Yes by all means slowly alter our foreign policy but don't announce it and make it an issue and say its to reduce the treat to us.     
                   
Title: Re: Possible terror attack Manchester
Post by: joebloggs on 27 May 2017, 03:18:25 pm
Set them free from tyranny?
Id put a weeks wages on many missing the stability that Saddam Hussein etc gave them.
Title: Re: Possible terror attack Manchester
Post by: VNA - BMW Wank on 27 May 2017, 03:19:39 pm
 
Quote
When we finally brexit proper


If we Brexit.  ‘God’ help us if we do.


Quote
European Court of Human rights overruling all our efforts.


That’s a separate issue from the EU.  And yup May wants to tear it up.  Tear up the court that Winston Churchill worked so hard to create. 



Quote
We need our own Guantanamo bay, maybe we could use the Falklands, stopping them at the border is what Trump


Fuck Yeah!  Let’s take our inspiration from Bush and Trump.  Let’s keep doing stuff that’s never ever worked in the hope that someday that shit that’s never ever worked magically works! 



Quote
Libya we opened our doors to him and gave him refuge, then we helped destroy his enemy and we are repaid by his son murdering people of the very nation that was his savour.


We’ve left Libya as a lawless non-functioning state which is now riddled with extreme terrorists (IS).  Just like we did in Iraq.  Oh yeah the people of Afghanistan, Iran and Libya, to name just three countries have so much to thank us gracious generous helpful British.  So kind of us to lay their countries’ to waste.


Quote
Also corbin saying they shall not win on one hand and then on the other saying he will alter our foreign policy when that is exactly what they want


No, they want what you are proposing.  They want you to feed the flames. 
Corbyn is of course absolutely right.  This is all our making.  And fazersharp and darrsi want more.


Meanwhile as you mention Trump.  He’s just done a 110 billion dollar aems deal with the Wahhabist Saudi state, the most backward repressive state in the world. The very country that attacked the Twin Towers and the inspiration and backers of the Islamic State.  You just couldn’t make this shit up!
Title: Re: Possible terror attack Manchester
Post by: lew600fazer on 27 May 2017, 04:36:04 pm

VNA I am getting really worried now I am agreeing more and more with what you say, feck me I need to lie down lol, seriously though we are only reaping what we sowed, years and years of aggression handed out by the British Empire or rather the ruling upper classes. But it is Joe public who will pay the price re terror attacks while the landed gentry sit safe in their stately homes.


I see the security level has now been down graded from Critical to Severe,  why simples seeing as it is a bank holiday the caring Tory Government would not be wanting to pay the police and security forces extra overtime now would they.

Title: Re: Possible terror attack Manchester
Post by: fazersharp on 27 May 2017, 04:45:50 pm

I see the security level has now been down graded from Critical to Severe,  why simples seeing as it is a bank holiday the caring Tory Government would not be wanting to pay the police and security forces extra overtime now would they.
Sounds to me very much like in Jaws when the Mayer is telling everyone the water is safe because the town is loosing money.   
Title: Re: Possible terror attack Manchester
Post by: darrsi on 27 May 2017, 04:45:56 pm
Yeah, 'cos Libya & Iraq were such jolly countries to live in before the leaders were taken out.
Nobody predicted the formation of ISIS, and their totally hands on barbarity. These people are just nutters due mainly to their backward thinking god bothering ways.


Anyway, stop picking holes in what everyone is saying, and give your opinion of how to resolve all this shit going on?
We have to start somewhere, whether it is deemed right or wrong, again by the PC brigade. Personally i think the mass immigration needs to stop for starters, EVERYONE i've ever spoken to about it said beforehand that crime would go up, there would be housing, school and NHS problems, and i dread to think how much more the benefits system pays out, but it's actually a lot worse than i ever imagined if truth be told.
Title: Re: Possible terror attack Manchester
Post by: darrsi on 27 May 2017, 04:47:39 pm

I see the security level has now been down graded from Critical to Severe,  why simples seeing as it is a bank holiday the caring Tory Government would not be wanting to pay the police and security forces extra overtime now would they.
Sounds to me very much like in Jaws when the Mayer is telling everyone the water is safe because the town is loosing money.   


Well the way this country is sinking at the moment "We're gonna need a bigger boat."  :lol
Title: Re: Possible terror attack Manchester
Post by: Dave48 on 27 May 2017, 05:02:54 pm
Our "special relationship" with Saudi Arabia couldnt possibly have anything to do with our complete dependence on oil could it?
We throw up our hands in horror when others attack our way of life and when the likes of May states that there is absolutely no excuse for the recent actions of terrorists she is unable/unwilling to see that we, the West, are seen as the agressors that provoke such retaliation. She was trying to imply that Corbyn was in some sort of sympathy with terrorist action because of our past disastrous involvements in others affairs.
It is fundamentally wrong for any individual/nation to impose his/their will on another but this is the crux of the matter. (One mans terrorist is another mans freedom fighter etc etc).
The real problem as I see it is economic in that the developed countries in the western world will go to any lengths to ensure the flow of oil. Simultaneously, the poorer nations want their share of the cake but that would mean the rich cutting back which few will accept.
How do you get people to agree to share the planets resources as fairly as possible when we operate on fear & greed?
Title: Re: Possible terror attack Manchester
Post by: fazersharp on 27 May 2017, 05:30:12 pm
Our "special relationship" with Saudi Arabia couldnt possibly have anything to do with our complete dependence on oil could it?
Yes that's right the Saudis have loads of oil, the sooner it runs out the better and we can turn to solar power -------- hold on they have also got loads of sunshine too DAMIT!
Title: Re: Possible terror attack Manchester
Post by: Hedgetrimmer on 27 May 2017, 05:34:09 pm
Our "special relationship" with Saudi Arabia couldnt possibly have anything to do with our complete dependence on oil could it?
Yes that's right the Saudis have loads of oil, the sooner it runs out the better and we can turn to solar power -------- hold on they have also got loads of sunshine too DAMIT!


 :lol


Not much water in the desert. Perhaps we can do a straight swap. (Cue hose pipe ban  :rolleyes ).
Title: Re: Possible terror attack Manchester
Post by: VNA - BMW Wank on 27 May 2017, 05:34:19 pm
 
Quote
seriously though we are only reaping what we sowed, years and years of aggression handed out by the British Empire or rather the ruling upper classes. But it is Joe public who will pay the price re terror attacks while the landed gentry sit safe in their stately homes.
We are a democracy Lew.  “The only thing necessary for evil to triumph is for good men to do nothing.”   Edmund Burke
Quote
Our "special relationship" with Saudi Arabia couldnt possibly have anything to do with our complete dependence on oil could it?
Well we are hooked on it.  And in return the Saudi’s get to spend all the money they got from us on weapons – which seems to be one of the few major industries we have left.  And of course you ain’t gonna sell weapons unless there is conflict.
Quote
How do you get people to agree to share the planets resources as fairly as possible when we operate on fear & greed?
Steady on Dave!  Fairness?  That’s what we have people like Saddam Hussein for.  We put him in charge, he got all the money, the people got fuck all and we got cheap oil.  And of course, we got to sell him loads of weapons after we encouraged him to wage war against Iran.  But then he had to get a bit uppity didn’t he.  So we had to make up a cock and bull story in order to carry out some regime change.
Quote
Nobody predicted the formation of ISIS, and their totally hands on barbarity.
It’s just an evolution Islamic terrorism, we’ve been feeding it for years, it’s shocking but no surprise.  Such barbarism is nothing new, it’s the sheer scale of it now.
Title: Re: Possible terror attack Manchester
Post by: Hedgetrimmer on 27 May 2017, 05:39:27 pm

Anyway, stop picking holes in what everyone is saying, and give your opinion of how to resolve all this shit going on?


Quote from: VNA
Ok, here's what we do....


 :eek


He didn't really say this  :pokefun
Title: Re: Possible terror attack Manchester
Post by: slappy on 27 May 2017, 08:34:36 pm
If it is all our own fault because our ancestors went empire building then why has ISIS killed more muslims than non muslims?

Title: Re: Possible terror attack Manchester
Post by: joebloggs on 28 May 2017, 12:06:29 am
Remove ISIS then get the hell out of the middle east would be my first suggestion, if another dictator takes control, so be it, not our problem. Providing the oil keeps flowing I couldn't give a dam what goes on in the country.



 
Title: Re: Possible terror attack Manchester
Post by: VNA - BMW Wank on 28 May 2017, 09:10:19 am
  It would appear that known Libyan members of Islamic Terrorist organisations were allowed free travel between the UK and Libya in order to fight against the Gadhafi regime.
Some even had counter terrorism controls lifted (house arrest).  Ie People who had links to terrorist organisations – al Qaeda for example - and considered a risk to the UK were allowed to organise and move freely between the UK and Libya.
And who ordered this?  The Home Secretary at the time was Theresa May.
http://www.heraldscotland.com/news/15314062.Manchester_terror_attack__May_presided_over_open_door_policy_for_Libyan_terror_suspects_fighting_Gaddafi/ (http://www.heraldscotland.com/news/15314062.Manchester_terror_attack__May_presided_over_open_door_policy_for_Libyan_terror_suspects_fighting_Gaddafi/)