Squawking noise on and off

[fazersharp]

I've started using a paint brush with engine oil to lubricate my chain now, instead of spray lube which i used for decades, and the chain is in better condition than ever. Plus it doesn't clog up any more, it repels dirt, and the oil effectively gets into every link when applied when the chain is warm after a run plus only takes a maximum 2 minutes to apply. I have newspaper down in my garage to catch any drips, and any other excess gets flung off next time i ride it.

Where does it get flung off to. Side of trye - undertray  -underdarrsi 

As Dude says you can "carefully" spin the back wheel on the centre stand and it will just fling off in a straight line behind the bike (use newspaper), or a lot of people will run a decent rag round the chain after oiling (one that doesn't fall apart) to mop up any excess oil.
Also, as he mentions, you just use common sense about how often to oil it. It does last longer than you'd imagine but if you've just done a motorway run in a storm then it would make sense to give it a bit of aftercare, but i don't think that will apply too much with you. 
You will get an oily rear sprocket though, but that really doesn't bother me at all.

I am nearing a new chain and sprocket set although its not badly worn the chain does have a tight spot that I can not free up and I can feel it when riding. I have always used chain wax but my riding is is all dry - so that's dust and grit that sticks to the wax. So I think when I fit new I am going to give engine oil a go and see how the fling goes. But cause I like my bike clean I may end up under lubing the chain.   

Sorry for the post     shieldr

Try gear oil. It has a higher viscosity than engine oil so it's less prone to dripping or spraying off. You can get a 1 liter bottle on ebay for under £5 or probably under £10 locally. One bottle should last you a life time. I pour some into a smaller squeeze bottle and then use the small squeeze bottle and a brush to apply it to the chain. You can put a bit of cardboard down to catch any drips. The first few times I used it I was putting too much on and there was drips everywhere but now I don't really get any. All it needs is a very light coat brushed over the surface to wet it. Any more than that will spray off. Less is more

I still have to place cardboard all around the area with the wax in the can as it comes out under pressure and tends to over spray the chain.

[darrsi]

When i had my rear tyre put on by the bike shop i always use i had to adjust the chain again at home as i could hear it slightly grinding from the wheel not being totally true.

[fazersharp]

When i had my rear tyre put on by the bike shop i always use i had to adjust the chain again at home as i could hear it slightly grinding from the wheel not being totally true.

Yep I had front and back tyres fitted and when I got back I loosened every bolt they touched and re- torqued it up myself. Not saying they were wrong but much happier knowing that I did it.

[shieldr]

OK. Chain adjusted fine now and intermittent squawk apparent for a few short bursts on a 5 min run around.  Occurring at quite slow speeds, 30mph, accelerating and remaining for a few seconds easing off the throttle.  Sounds like it is coming from inside some sort of enclosure which is making me think front sprocket bearing...
Things I am sure it is not but haven't proved yet...... fork seals, brakes, chain alignment or tension.  Sounds like a blade of grass held between 2 thumbs and blown for short bursts...

[His Dudeness]

Do you lube the chain regularly? If the chain is dry lube it and see if that improves things. Assuming the chain is all good so it's lubed, the tension is right, it's aligned properly, there's no tight spots, the sprockets are good, the front sprocket nut is tight. The next thing to check is the bearings in the rear wheel. There's two in the rear wheel and one in the rear sprocket carrier as Jamieg285 said. To check them properly you have to take the rear wheel off, put your fingers in the bearings and spin the wheel and feel for binding or rough spots in the bearings. The bearing for the front sprocket is inside the engine. It's the bearing for the output shaft of the gearbox. It would be very bad if the problem was that bearing. You have to strip the whole engine to get to it but most likely it's not that bearing that is the problem. Generally they good bad from over tightening the chain not from letting the chain go too slack

[His Dudeness]

If you're sure the chain is all good and you're not comfortable taking the rear wheel off I'd recommend getting a mechanic to have a listen. A failed wheel bearing could cause an accident so you're better off being safe rather than sorry

[shieldr]

Next steps checking the rear wheel bearing.  Am still not sure but it is a process of elimination now. Seriously hope it’s not an engine rebuild but it does sound more like it is coming from that area. Would a rear wheel bearing failure only make that noise occasionally?  Thanks for the fantastic advice by the way.

[His Dudeness]

I haven't had gearbox bearing trouble but I think it's more of a low rumbling noise rather than a high pitch squawk. A high pick squawk seems more like something is rusty like a chain or a rusted wheel bearing/ sprocket carrier bearing. That's what I'd be leaning towards but it's only a guess. Is the chain oiled? If the chain has tight spots you tend to notice them through the front sprocket because it has to go around a smaller diameter. If you could get a few pictures of the chain and sprocket up or a video of the noise that might help.

[darrsi]

Tight spot in a chain should be felt on your left footrest as a bumping feeling through your foot.
Another easy way of telling, put the bike on the centre stand and slowly examine the lower part of the chain. If it's fine every link will be horizontal, but any stiff/rusted links will be slightly at an angle and will stay that way.
Dunno what condition your chain is in, but i used to give mine a good scrub with a proper chain brush using WD40 which not only cleaned it very effectively and easily of any chain lube but used to get into all parts of the chain as well, before i would lube it again afterwards after wiping off the excess.
Since i've been using the engine oil as a lube though every link on the chain remains completely free and very easily movable by my fingers.
I'll probably be trying the thicker gear oil instead soon though.
Just for the record, i always buy D.I.D. X Ring chains, not O Ring ones.   


On a side note, with the bike on the centre stand, spin the front wheel with your hand and see if any noises come from it. I would still be inclined to have the front wheel off and pack the speedo sensor with thick Lithium Grease, or axle grease, to rule that out. Just make sure you don't break the lugs when refitting the wheel.

[darrsi]

I had a brainwave and wondered what Chainsaw Oil would be like on a bike chain? Kind of makes sense, they run at very high speed and are designed to have anti fling properties, but after a bit of research i was put off it for being too sticky to the point it can keep hold of road dirt, although that's what i found that proper bike lube spray did anyway.


So i'll give the heavier gear oil a try, there is a 140 version, but i'll stick with the advice and go for the tried and tested 90 grade stuff.


https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/1L-Hypoid-Gear-Oil-EP90-API-GL4-EP-90-1-litre/121636781361?hash=item1c521dfd31:g:LSUAAOSwh-1W3fEu

[Dynspud]

That's the stuff I use Darrsi and it works a treat 

[shieldr]

I haven't had gearbox bearing trouble but I think it's more of a low rumbling noise rather than a high pitch squawk. A high pick squawk seems more like something is rusty like a chain or a rusted wheel bearing/ sprocket carrier bearing. That's what I'd be leaning towards but it's only a guess. Is the chain oiled? If the chain has tight spots you tend to notice them through the front sprocket because it has to go around a smaller diameter. If you could get a few pictures of the chain and sprocket up or a video of the noise that might help.

The chain looks in great nick to me and a video of the squawk could be tricky as it only happens on the road.  I will take a close look at the chain and then get the rear wheel off next. Cheers.

[Jamieg285]

I should of added, my sprocket carrier bearing had disintegrated and separated, hence the metal on metal screeching.   It will be very obvious if this is the problem, just pull the dust seal off and look.

[shieldr]

Update: back wheel off tonight and bearings feel sound. Also took front sprocket cover off too and all looks and feels normal. Reassembled all with smidgeon of grease and squawk occurred a couple of times for a second or two on a one mile run.


I found a mcn article online about motorbike noises and it says that a squawk is most likely to be the clutch going. This sounds plausible as I never really thought this noise was from wheels, bearings or forks etc.


Any thoughts on the clutch theory and is it an easy job?


Ta

[His Dudeness]

Well that's ruled out a few things so not a waste of time. Never heard of a squawking clutch but maybe it's possible. Usually when a clutch is going it slips under heavy load. When you give it a lot of throttle the revs shot up but your speed doesn't change much. It's easy to take it apart you just have to be careful when you reassemble it that it's all sitting evenly or you can snap the pressure plate. You could try taking the oil fill cap off an listen does the squawk get louder with the cap off that would be a good indicator that it's coming from the clutch area. You might get a bit of oil spray with the fill cap off.

[darrsi]

Update: back wheel off tonight and bearings feel sound. Also took front sprocket cover off too and all looks and feels normal. Reassembled all with smidgeon of grease and squawk occurred a couple of times for a second or two on a one mile run.


I found a mcn article online about motorbike noises and it says that a squawk is most likely to be the clutch going. This sounds plausible as I never really thought this noise was from wheels, bearings or forks etc.


Any thoughts on the clutch theory and is it an easy job?


Ta

You may be thinking a bit too far ahead.
First thing i would do would be to properly adjust the clutch cable from the bottom as well as the top, and see if that makes any difference.


I'm guessing you have the correct amount of oil in the sump as well, and it is within the recommended mileage range, or does it need changing at all?


I've never heard of a clutch causing a squawking noise either to be honest.

[shieldr]

Thanks.

Need to check the clutch items you mention. All new for me.  Engine oil is clutch oil right?  If so then all is good.  In range and right level. 

If you say clutch doesn't normally cause squawk then it might be another red herring.  I thought a slightly faulty clutch would make it safe to ride until symptoms become more apparent or obvious.  I have checked brakes and bearings so think it will be safe to ride anyway.

Was also wondering if the noise could be coming from the air side.  Maybe carbs, head gasket, loose plugs....

I will see how to check and adjust the clutch cable next.  If nothing else I am learning about my bike.

Cheers

[shieldr]

Pic of front sprocket. Nothing to see other than sludge from chain lub.

[darrsi]

Bike would run terribly if there was an issue with the things you mentioned.


Engine oil level needs to be checked on the centre stand AFTER the engine has been running for 30-60 seconds so it's spread around the sump.
It will then take anout 90 seconds to settle in the sump window.....that is when you check the level.
So i would double check that to make sure it isn't low, a lot of people mistakenly check the level when the bike is cold, which is incorrect and will give a false reading.

[shieldr]

Could a bit too much oil cause this?

[His Dudeness]

I'd clean all that gunk out from the sprocket and sprocket cover. You said you thought your squawk was coming form the front sprocket area at one point. Maybe your noise has something to do with all that build up. The clutch actuator is in the sprocket cover. When you pull the clutch lever the actuator moves out and pushes against the clutch push rod. The clutch push rod is the part that's sticking out on the left of the front sprocket. All that should be clean.

[darrsi]

Could a bit too much oil cause this?

It can cause issues, but not the noise you’re describing.


Have a good read of this though, worth doing:
http://foc-u.co.uk/index.php/topic,10124.msg105459.html#msg105459

[His Dudeness]

Could a bit too much oil cause this?

It can cause issues, but not the noise you’re describing.


Have a good read of this though, worth doing:
http://foc-u.co.uk/index.php/topic,10124.msg105459.html#msg105459

This is a weird problem. We've not got a lot of information to go on. All we know is the bike has 31K on it and there's a squawk happening sometimes when he's slowing and he's not too sure where it's coming from.

So far he's found a very slack chain and he's tightened that and the squawk is still there. He's checked his chain and sprockets and his wheel bearings and sprocket carrier bearings and they're fine.

[fazersharp]

My old Sidi Vertebrata used to squawk when I walked in them.     

[Dynspud]

My missus squawks when I ride on her