Author Topic: BREXIT (Read 214740 times)

VNA - BMW Wank · « **Reply #1550 on:** 15 January 2019, 07:40:47 pm »

It's absolutely truely sunk

YamFazFan · « **Reply #1551 on:** 15 January 2019, 07:54:29 pm »

There's no denying that. The stitch up is in motion. The first step towards disregarding democracy and reversing the democratic decision.

I thought that would please you

VNA - BMW Wank · « **Reply #1552 on:** 15 January 2019, 08:32:23 pm »

Quote

There's no denying that. The stitch up is in motion. The first step towards disregarding democracy and reversing the democratic decision.

I thought that would please you

It's democracy in action. This is a PM that called a snap election in order to win a landslide so she could impose her will - but she failed.

This is a PM that called upon Tudor Laws to by-pass parliament in order to impose her will - but she failed.

This is a PM who has spent 2 years putting together a deal she knew nobody wanted, then tried to force it upon parliament by trying to drive it into march and up against a NO DEAL BREXIT - but she failed.

This is a dead duck PM.

mtread · « **Reply #1553 on:** 15 January 2019, 08:37:37 pm »

Well there we have it. Just about the biggest loss in history.
Watching the post vote interviews, both hard Brexit and soft Brexit sides claiming victory.
I'm surprised May hasn't delayed Article 50 yet. She's gambling again. I'm still betting on a Norway style Leave, full Customs Union and most Single Market. Tory Remainers + Labour with their Red Lines getting a majority ....... in which case, we should Remain

fazersharp · « **Reply #1554 on:** 15 January 2019, 08:38:20 pm »

The amount that it was voted down by is a good thing because the EU will see that and realise that they HAVE to renegotiate - otherwise the default, written in law will be a leave on WTO which they fear more than anything.

YamFazFan · « **Reply #1555 on:** 15 January 2019, 08:42:08 pm »

An important point regarding a second referendum, which is where I'm certain we are heading.
It puts Leave at a disadvantage because having already had their vote disregarded once, apathy will have set in and a 'Why bother when they just ignore us and stitch us up?' attitude prevails. Even if Leave won a second vote, who's to say that one wouldn't be ignored?.

Remain will have been given basically 'A free second spin' and will grasp it with gusto.

celticdog · « **Reply #1556 on:** 15 January 2019, 08:45:38 pm »

Just like my honourable oriental friend on his honeymoon, now is the time for an election.

YamFazFan · « **Reply #1557 on:** 15 January 2019, 08:51:13 pm »

Quote from: fazersharp on 15 January 2019, 08:38:20 pm

The amount that it was voted down by is a good thing because the EU will see that and realise that they HAVE to renegotiate - otherwise the default, written in law will be a leave on WTO which they fear more than anything.

I don't think they'll concede anything much. I reckon they will be happy to see it go to a second referendum and take their chances with that.
I wish it was No Deal, but apparently they won't even entertain that. Parliament has basically wasted the voting publics time for 2 years. Why bother involving us in the first place if our vote is going to be totally disregarded

VNA - BMW Wank · « **Reply #1558 on:** 15 January 2019, 08:53:35 pm »

Quote

An important point regarding a second referendum, which is where I'm certain we are heading.
It puts Leave at a disadvantage because having already had their vote disregarded once, apathy will have set in and a 'Why bother when they just ignore us and stitch us up?' attitude prevails. Even if Leave won a second vote, who's to say that one wouldn't be ignored?.

Remain will have been given basically 'A free second spin' and will grasp it with gusto.

No idea if there will be a second referendum or not. It's certainly more likely now than May's deal.

But as I have said again and again, if, and if, I say again if, there is second referendum it must be legally binding.

VNA - BMW Wank · « **Reply #1559 on:** 15 January 2019, 08:58:20 pm »

Quote

I reckon they will be happy to see it go to a second referendum and take their chances with that.

They (the EU) are not taking a chance with anything. If we were to leave with NO DEAL (which will not happen) the EU will take a small hit, but we will get fucked.

They are 27 countries that will continue to trade as a single market without us. We were just one out of 28.

This is our problem, not theirs. Not much they can do if the UK appears to be aff it’s heid on crack.

But NO DEAL is officially dead tonight.

mtread · « **Reply #1560 on:** 15 January 2019, 10:11:49 pm »

Quote

Parliament has basically wasted the voting publics time for 2 years.

No, Parliament has only now been consulted. May and her government has wasted the public's time for 2 and a half years. The obstinate woman could have consulted Parliament and the opposition parties a long time ago.

VNA - BMW Wank · « **Reply #1561 on:** 15 January 2019, 10:30:56 pm »

Quote

Quote<blockquote> Parliament has basically wasted the voting publics time for 2 years. </blockquote>No, Parliament has only now been consulted. May and her government has wasted the public's time for 2 and a half years. The obstinate woman could have consulted Parliament and the opposition parties a long time ago.

Indeed, she tried a snap election - that failed
She tried to by pass parliament by calling on some ancient Tudor laws - that failed too.
So she decided to press on alone, hoping to get her deal through by running us up against a potential NO DEAL - that failed too.
She is a failed PM.

YamFazFan · « **Reply #1562 on:** 15 January 2019, 10:41:31 pm »

To be fair, whatever side you're on you couldn't beat all this for drama could you!. To people who couldn't care less it probably means nothing, but to those of us who are interested it's the equivalent of Den and Angie at Christmas 1986

celticdog · « **Reply #1563 on:** 15 January 2019, 10:42:30 pm »

Quote from: YamFazFan on 15 January 2019, 10:41:31 pm

To be fair, whatever side you're on you couldn't beat all this for drama could you!. To people who couldn't care less it probably means nothing, but to those of us who are interested it's the equivalent of Den and Angie at Christmas 1986

Agreed, what a fucking waste of time. So now it looks like it's back to the polls again until we vote to remain in the EU. Railroaded just like Denmark and the Republic of Ireland to vote how they want us to.
Lets face it we can't fucking leave this undemocratic behemoth of a quango. Well fellow sheeple, it seems here is no democracy it's all an illusion. The raving monster loony party policy to decimalise time makes more sense to me at the moment than anything coming out of Westminster or the EU for that matter.

mtread · « **Reply #1564 on:** 15 January 2019, 11:09:34 pm »

Quote

The raving monster loony party policy to decimalise time makes more sense to me

Already been done. The French in 1793

Yes it's all quite a drama, but I'm thinking more Basil and Sybil than Den and Angie

YamFazFan · « **Reply #1565 on:** 15 January 2019, 11:55:11 pm »

Quote from: mtread on 15 January 2019, 10:11:49 pm

Quote
Parliament has basically wasted the voting publics time for 2 years.
No, Parliament has only now been consulted. May and her government has wasted the public's time for 2 and a half years. The obstinate woman could have consulted Parliament and the opposition parties a long time ago.

Parliament agreed to give the electorate a vote and to implement Article 50.

mtread · « **Reply #1566 on:** 16 January 2019, 12:10:48 am »

Quote

Parliament agreed to give the electorate a vote and to implement Article 50.

Very true, but it's been all down to May since then.

Actually I've decided it's more Rene and Edith - '' You stupid woman'' and the French and Germans are all laughing at her.

She's backed herself into a corner. If she comes back with a similar deal, she will lose the vote again. Perhaps by a smaller margin, but she will lose.
If she goes for a harder Brexit she'll lose half her party.
If she goes for a softer Brexit she'll lose the other half.
If she does nothing and goes for No Deal, Parliament will take over and a majority will veto it and extend Article 50.

There is nothing she can do. Corbyn currently holds all the best cards.

YamFazFan · « **Reply #1567 on:** 16 January 2019, 08:34:12 am »

Quote from: VNA on 15 January 2019, 08:53:35 pm

No idea if there will be a second referendum or not. It's certainly more likely now than May's deal.
But as I have said again and again, if, and if, I say again if, there is second referendum it must be legally binding.

I've no doubt it will be....if the answers Remain.

How's The Eagle's lyric go?..."You can check out any time you like, but you can never leave"....

Oldgit · « **Reply #1568 on:** 16 January 2019, 10:19:18 am »

May to stand down, R Mogg for PM--now that would set the cat among the pigeons.

mtread · « **Reply #1569 on:** 16 January 2019, 10:35:48 am »

Quote

How's The Eagle's lyric go?..."You can check out any time you like, but you can never leave"...

You're spot on. It also covers May's obstinacy.
'' They stab it with their steely knives, But they just can't kill the beast''

VNA - BMW Wank · « **Reply #1570 on:** 16 January 2019, 11:26:48 am »

Quote

I've no doubt it will be....if the answers Remain.

Legally binding means just that. Whatever the result is it has to be implemented.

Naturally some folks will ask why was the 2016 not legally binding. The simple answer to that is that to be legally binding the result has to be defined. And that was the big problem with the 2016 referendum, BREXIT was not defined. So the 2016 refenedum was a simple consultative ballot.

So that means if there is a second referendum it has to be a very specific question.

Which in turn is where the problem lies. It will be a nightmare defining the question. I’m not sure it can be done as it has to be agreed by parliament.

I would argue the following;

May’s deal is officially the only deal on offer. It’s a withdrawal deal, with our settled position to be negotiated over the next few years. It’s been agreed by the government and ratified with the 27 remaining EU states. It is defined and can be implemented.
Therefore;

Do you wish implement the governments withdrawal act and LEAVE the EU.

Or

Do you wish to cancel article 50 and REMAIN in the EU.

That would allow a legally binding referendum to take place.

YamFazFan · « **Reply #1571 on:** 16 January 2019, 11:43:51 am »

So we were lied to in 2016?.

That leaflet said...'This is your decision. The government will implement what you decide'.

It didn't say....'The government will implement what you decide....as long as it can be defined'

VNA - BMW Wank · « **Reply #1572 on:** 16 January 2019, 11:59:22 am »

Quote

So we were lied to in 2016?.

That leaflet said...'This is your decision. The government will implement what you decide'.

It didn't say....'The government will implement what you decide....as long as it can be defined'

Well you have been used. As I keep saying this only occurred as a means to unite the Tory party in order to win an election. And DC never thought for one minute that people would actually be daft enough to vote to leave the EU. But then he’s a millionaire living in the Westminster bubble. He has no idea whatsoever how tough life is for millions in this country and how disenfranchised they feel.

But no you were not lied to. And May’s government, as hopeless as it is, has spent 2 years getting a withdrawal agreement together and tried every trick in the book to try and implement it.

fazersharp · « **Reply #1573 on:** 16 January 2019, 12:04:30 pm »

Well at least if there is another referendum I can look forward to there being another leaflet drop because my downpipes need re doing.

VNA - BMW Wank · « **Reply #1574 on:** 16 January 2019, 12:19:16 pm »

Quote

Well at least if there is another referendum I can look forward to there being another leaflet drop because my downpipes need re doing.

Aye, well, and if you are a good boy and engage yer brain you’ll vote to cancel article 50.

That way everybody will keep their jobs. The pound will strengthen, inflation will fall, and you’ll be able to forget about painting yer downpipes as you’ll have your new bike as a result of falling new motorcycle prices.