Date: 22-05-18  Time: 18:23 PM

Author Topic: R6 shock & Debrix emulator installation [HELP!]  (Read 963 times)

Kefirchiks

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R6 shock & Debrix emulator installation [HELP!]
« on: 26 December 2017, 01:09:53 PM »
Hello, Foccers.
I have my R6 rear shock and Debrix emulators. I have a couple of installation questions, because I couldn't find any info on some things regarding these.
  • I have fitted Hyperpro progressive spring on the R6 shock (so I wouldn't need a spring spacer). The spring rate is 122Nm (about 700 lbs/in).
    If someone wants to fit this Hyperpro spring to their R6 shock, part number: SP-YA06-SSB036
    I will have my dogbones and top spacers fabricated (thanks for the Foccer, who provided drawings in another topic for all the parts).
  • Got my emulators from ebay. The title says: 41mm Fork Damper Valves TC-88 Softail Touring Dyna FXST FLST FXDWG FLT 2000-UP.
    Have tried fitted these, they fit perfectly (see for pictures down below).
So, the questions:

1. R6 rear shock nuts & bolts. So, I guess I need to reuse the top bolt from the old shock, am I correct, or do I need to find another bolt (smaller)? Because R6 shock hole is smaller than the OEM shock.
2. Do I need to drill the R6 top hole for the old bolt? Or put in new (smaller) bolt. Will it fit & hold into place into old mounting holes?
3. Why I need top-spacers? Are they for smaller bolt or R6 shock top mount is thinner than OEM, so the spacers?

4. EMULATORS! First thing I wanted to do is just put them in forks and just saw off the same height (as the emulator body) from the fork spacer. Is this correct?
5. How many holes to drill into damper rod and how big? Can someone provide bore sizes? Looking at the Race-Tech instruction and Youtube, they usually drill like 5 or 6 holes.
6. Planning to use 15W oil (light rider, about 70kg when geared up). I can easy change the oil after if needed. Or do you recommend 20W straight away?

So the summary:
1. R6 shock top bolt and holes.
2. Damper rod holes & fork spacer changes for the emulator installation + oil viscosity.


Some photos of the build.




Hyperpro spring fitted + nitrogen refilled for the shock.





Plus, a couple of mods for the Fazer.
1. Akrapovič carbon-fibre titanium slip-on from FZ1
2. Gilles rearsets
3. Radiator cover
4. Brembo radial master cylinder from R1 (focced up mine, so this one needs a replacement)






Thanks for any input, any help will be appreciated!  :kiss
« Last Edit: 26 December 2017, 02:19:24 PM by Kefirchiks »

tommyardin

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Re: R6 shock & Debrix emulator installation [HELP!]
« Reply #1 on: 26 December 2017, 05:45:56 PM »

Hi,
And welcome to the snake pit.

Firstly I can not see what bike it is you have, I am assuming its a FZS600 judging by the picture of the old shock next to your new R6 jobby,
is that right?

Your status says you don't have a bike, and, I can not see anywhere in your thread where you say what bike it is.

Now as far as the holes that you need to drill in the fork damper rods to overcome the damping effect of these rods (assuming it is a FZS600) it depends on the year of the bike as well, as the later FZS 600's had slightly shorter Damper rod that their earlier brothers and sisters.
I will try and find a write up I did in here a year or so ago how I did the job on my 2003 FZS 600 Foxeye. (Shorter Damper Rods)

tommyardin.



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tommyardin

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Re: R6 shock & Debrix emulator installation [HELP!]
« Reply #2 on: 26 December 2017, 06:06:06 PM »
http://foc-u.co.uk/index.php/topic,21600.msg248647.html#msg248647

Try the above link it might help.

What springs are you going to use in the front forks? you seem to have made no mention of front fork springs, or is it just me being a blind out fart who has drunk far to much sloe gin today (No such thing as to much sloe gin)

what ever you are doing with the front forks please don't say you are putting the original foccing Yoo Yoos back in.

I would recommend a pair of linear
springs matched to you fully clothed riding weight.

Progressive springs are and always will be a compromise, they will be better than the original springs if they are true progressives. but one spring to fit all rider weights is always going to be a compromise.

Now Jenny who weights in at 8 stones fitted progressives, and Nigel, who weighs in at 17 stone fitted progressive  :eek  How the fuck does that work? In a nut shell 'very poorly'
I received a lot of help from (Kebab19) a foccer in here when I did my front suspension upgrade. there is a lot of wisdom in this forum, but it is equally balanced out with a lot of pissing taking and bull shit.Enjoy your stay.
 :thumbup     

     
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Kefirchiks

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Re: R6 shock & Debrix emulator installation [HELP!]
« Reply #3 on: 26 December 2017, 07:05:12 PM »
what ever you are doing with the front forks please don't say you are putting the original foccing Yoo Yoos back in.
I would recommend a pair of linear
springs matched to you fully clothed riding weight.
Yes, at the moment stock springs are going back in.
Bike: FZS 600 (2003 Foxeye).

I have browsed the forums very throughly and found a couple of things:
1. Rear shock: needs top spacers and new M10 bolt (10x80mm).
2. Emulators: drill 4 x 10mm holes into damper rod

kebab19

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Re: R6 shock & Debrix emulator installation [HELP!]
« Reply #4 on: 29 December 2017, 06:15:10 PM »
Hello and welcome,
The R6 shock's top mount is 10mm diameter as opposed to the 12 mm of the standard FZS600 shock. If you have access to the right equipment you can drill the top mount out to 12mm, but there is not a lot of room for error if your drill goes off-centre.
The alternative is to fit a 10mm bolt with two 'top-hat' spacers to take up the slack. They 'insert' into the frame's mounting point for the shock.

Emulators. Yes, fitted they raise the suspension parts by about 13.5mm, so just cut that same amount off both of the metal spacers that sit in the forks.  Four 10mm diameter holes would be enough to overcome the standard valving circuit. And 15w oil should be fine for your weight.

Have to agree with Tommy, ditch the standard springs as soon as you can afford to in order to get the full benefit. Linear SV650 springs would be virtually the same length.

Kefirchiks

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Re: R6 shock & Debrix emulator installation [HELP!]
« Reply #5 on: 29 December 2017, 06:52:22 PM »
Today drilled the holes with 9.5mm drill and used Dremel to make them a tad bit wider, also drilling off any metal particles which occurred on the edges when drilling with big drill.
I know about the springs, yes. Looking forward to fit some Hyperpro ones, but not at the moment (summer time is far, far away where I live).
Also, fitted the R6 shock. Bought M10 bolt (80mm) and it fits perfectly. Now just waiting for my top spacers.

How about the oil quantity (in ml) or oil level (in mm from top) ? What do you suggest?

Plus, managed to almost fit my Akrapovič from FZ1, just need 60 to 40mm exhaust reducer, because Akra titanium midpipe is 60mm.

daviee

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Re: R6 shock & Debrix emulator installation [HELP!]
« Reply #6 on: 30 December 2017, 07:34:49 PM »
can i ask what size emulators you used ?


Jules-C

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Re: R6 shock & Debrix emulator installation [HELP!]
« Reply #7 on: 30 December 2017, 08:29:18 PM »
Gives the details in the original post

Got my emulators from ebay. The title says: 41mm Fork Damper Valves TC-88 Softail Touring Dyna FXST FLST FXDWG FLT 2000-UP.

daviee

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Re: R6 shock & Debrix emulator installation [HELP!]
« Reply #8 on: 31 December 2017, 07:14:39 PM »
you get them from the states ?


Kefirchiks

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Re: R6 shock & Debrix emulator installation [HELP!]
« Reply #9 on: 02 January 2018, 11:53:43 AM »
you get them from the states ?
Yes.

Kefirchiks

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Re: R6 shock & Debrix emulator installation [HELP!]
« Reply #10 on: 02 January 2018, 11:59:23 AM »
Have to agree with Tommy, ditch the standard springs as soon as you can afford to in order to get the full benefit. Linear SV650 springs would be virtually the same length.
So, what year I should look into? 99-02?
Found Hypepro linear ones. Cost about 120€, but I guess I can get them much cheaper through my local Hyperpro dealer.

kebab19

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Re: R6 shock & Debrix emulator installation [HELP!]
« Reply #11 on: 02 January 2018, 07:09:13 PM »
Don't forget that Wemoto do the YSS emulators, slightly more expensive but less hassle than import tax etc from the States.
http://www.wemoto.com/bikes/yamaha/fzs_600_fazer/98-99/picture/fork_valves/


Kefirchiks

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Re: R6 shock & Debrix emulator installation [HELP!]
« Reply #12 on: 11 March 2018, 03:07:19 PM »
Hello again. I have chosen to buy some linear springs, to fit into newly rebuilt forks.
The first question: which springs from which year SV650? I have R6 shock fitted in the back, so will it affect something in the front?
I'm looking at Ohlins linear front fork springs, because I can buy them locally here and that would be a great upgrade over the original Yamaha yo-yoos.

Full geared up weight: about 70kg. But casually taking a passenger!
Using 15W fork oil /w Debrix emulators.
Original spacers are not cut yet. Waiting for the spring install.

For example: if I needed 8N/mm springs, would it be best to get 8.5N/mm spring just to compensate for the passenger?
In conclusion: Which Ohlins linear springs to get? 7N/mm? 8N/mm? Other?


tommyardin

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Re: R6 shock & Debrix emulator installation [HELP!]
« Reply #13 on: 11 March 2018, 11:48:34 PM »
Hello and welcome,
The R6 shock's top mount is 10mm diameter as opposed to the 12 mm of the standard FZS600 shock. If you have access to the right equipment you can drill the top mount out to 12mm, but there is not a lot of room for error if your drill goes off-centre.
The alternative is to fit a 10mm bolt with two 'top-hat' spacers to take up the slack. They 'insert' into the frame's mounting point for the shock.

Emulators. Yes, fitted they raise the suspension parts by about 13.5mm, so just cut that same amount off both of the metal spacers that sit in the forks.  Four 10mm diameter holes would be enough to overcome the standard valving circuit. And 15w oil should be fine for your weight.

Have to agree with Tommy, ditch the standard springs as soon as you can afford to in order to get the full benefit. Linear SV650 springs would be virtually the same length.


The Suzuki SV650 Ohlin linear springs are a little shorter than the standard Yamaha springs, but the height of the Emulators make up for that difference, be very careful drilling out the damper rods as If you come to far up the dampers it can mess with the damping. Also worth noting is that the damper rods on the latest 2003 Foxeye are shorter maybe 20
 mm than the earlier FZS  600's and this impacts the tolerance with the drilling out of the dampers. 2003 damper rod length is 190 mm
« Last Edit: 12 March 2018, 12:12:48 AM by tommyardin »
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tommyardin

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Re: R6 shock & Debrix emulator installation [HELP!]
« Reply #14 on: 12 March 2018, 12:14:52 AM »
Pics of my dampers after drilling.
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Kefirchiks

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Re: R6 shock & Debrix emulator installation [HELP!]
« Reply #15 on: 13 March 2018, 07:31:36 AM »
I just want to know if 8N/mm spring rate for Ohlins springs will be okay for my full weight with equip + casually a passenger.

kebab19

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Re: R6 shock & Debrix emulator installation [HELP!]
« Reply #16 on: 13 March 2018, 07:50:05 PM »
Use this chart to determine what springs suits best:

http://www.mad-ducati.com/Technical/racetech/SpringChart.html

Sport line as opposed to Supersport.  FZS600 is probably around 475lbs fully fueled, then add your own weight (with all your riding gear on).  Don't worry too much about pillion, get it right for you if most of your time is spent solo .  You could always max the preload with the pillion to compensate a fair bit.

I would estimate you'd need either 8.5 or 9.0 springs.  I'm about 75kg/165lbs and with my original GoldValve conversion (from memory) went with 8.5 springs.  You can always compensate either way with slightly less / more oil...