Emergency Vehicle/Red Light Question

[YamFazFan]

If you're sat at a red light and an emergency vehicle comes up behind you with lights flashing and siren sounding, is it against the law to cross the red light in order to allow the vehicle to proceed?.

Just observed such a situation.

The car driver was reluctant to cross the red light, but was intimidated to do so by all the surrounding drivers hooting at him.

[windyg]

My understanding is the driver would be breaking the law going across the white line against a red traffic light unless instructed to do so by a uniformed police officer / traffic warden.


Having said that if it was safe then I would probably cross the white line to let a vehicle through on Blues and Twos

[fazersharp]

My understanding is the driver would be breaking the law going across the white line against a red traffic light unless instructed to do so by a uniformed police officer / traffic warden.


Having said that if it was safe then I would probably cross the white line to let a vehicle through on Blues and Twos

What about ones that are covered by a camera

[BBROWN1664]

It is against the law to cross the stop line at a red light. FULL STOP. Only if directed to do so by the police can you legally do so. Them sitting a few cars back on blues/twos is not them telling you to do so.

That's said, common sense prevails and if it is safe to do so and there isn't a camera about, I would pull forwards and to the side to let them past.

[darrsi]

I've read a lot over the years about people moving into bus lanes to let emergency vehicles pass, then they've received a ticket in the post with a fine.
Bit harsh I reckon, as it is an emergency situation and is not done for your own gain.

[YamFazFan]

Yes it is harsh. It's instinctive to pull out of the way isn't it.

How would you prove you'd moved over for an ambulance and is there any exemption for that anyway. Very much doubt it.

They just love fining people at every opportunity nowadays.

[darrsi]

It’s just the thought of standing your ground not breaking the law versus risking someones life.
No way people should be fined for common sense.

[Robbie8666]

I've read a lot over the years about people moving into bus lanes to let emergency vehicles pass, then they've received a ticket in the post with a fine.
Bit harsh I reckon, as it is an emergency situation and is not done for your own gain.

I have been told that even blue light drivers if they go through a red light with a camera fitted have to prove they were on a 999 call via logs etc otherwise the driver can get fined!
(normally sorted out at a higher level than the driver themselves!)

[celticbiker]

Interesting points of view, I wonder however why that person has stopped at the lights in such a position that they had to move over if an emergency vehicle should appear. Why hadn't they considered this when stopping, does no-one plan ahead any more?
As for legality, I wouldn't care if I got a ticket, someones life could be on the line. If you have a dashcam (who hasn't these days) it should be easy to argue the case.

[darrsi]

Here’s another one for you to ponder, as it happened to me AGAIN tonight.


What do you do when you can blatantly see that the lights are stuck on red?


This has happened to me about 8 times now at the same lights, over the years, and you can probably guess what i do.....but what are you meant to do???

[fazersharp]

Interesting points of view, I wonder however why that person has stopped at the lights in such a position that they had to move over if an emergency vehicle should appear. Why hadn't they considered this when stopping, does no-one plan ahead any more?

Thats easy to explain - you were already stopped at the stop line before the emergency vehicle appeared.

How exactly is the red light camera triggered anyway

[Hugh Mungus]

It is against the law to cross the stop line at a red light. FULL STOP. Only if directed to do so by the police can you legally do so. Them sitting a few cars back on blues/twos is not them telling you to do so.

That's said, common sense prevails and if it is safe to do so and there isn't a camera about, I would pull forwards and to the side to let them past.

This is exactly how I understand it.


I'm not sure I could sit there and not move out of the way whether or not there was a camera about to send me a ticket.

[celticbiker]

Interesting points of view, I wonder however why that person has stopped at the lights in such a position that they had to move over if an emergency vehicle should appear. Why hadn't they considered this when stopping, does no-one plan ahead any more?

Thats easy to explain - you were already stopped at the stop line before the emergency vehicle appeared.

How exactly is the red light camera triggered anyway

So you are saying that when you (the global you, not you personally) approach a set of light or other junction, you just stop wherever you happen to be in your lane?
You don't check your mirrors and assess the traffic around you and position your vehicle accordingly before stopping?
Whether there is an emergency vehicle around or not why would you position your vehicle in such a way as to prevent one from passing if necessary?
How many times have you been filtering and come up against two cars tight up against the lane divider and you have to stop and wait for them to move or make them aware of your presence. They aren't moving and gain nothing from it. It's just lack of forward planning and lack of consideration for other road users.

[YamFazFan]

So you are saying that when you (the global you, not you personally) approach a set of light or other junction, you just stop wherever you happen to be in your lane?
You don't check your mirrors and assess the traffic around you and position your vehicle accordingly before stopping?
Whether there is an emergency vehicle around or not why would you position your vehicle in such a way as to prevent one from passing if necessary?
How many times have you been filtering and come up against two cars tight up against the lane divider and you have to stop and wait for them to move or make them aware of your presence. They aren't moving and gain nothing from it. It's just lack of forward planning and lack of consideration for other road users.

Unless you've already seen/heard the emergency vehicle coming, and have time to hang back a bit, everyone pulls up at the white line by the lights don't they?.

In a car you don't have a lot of leeway either side to let an ambulance through if they can't use the opposing carriageway do you.

[fazersharp]

Interesting points of view, I wonder however why that person has stopped at the lights in such a position that they had to move over if an emergency vehicle should appear. Why hadn't they considered this when stopping, does no-one plan ahead any more?

Thats easy to explain - you were already stopped at the stop line before the emergency vehicle appeared.

How exactly is the red light camera triggered anyway

So you are saying that when you (the global you, not you personally) approach a set of light or other junction, you just stop wherever you happen to be in your lane?
You don't check your mirrors and assess the traffic around you and position your vehicle accordingly before stopping?
Whether there is an emergency vehicle around or not why would you position your vehicle in such a way as to prevent one from passing if necessary?
How many times have you been filtering and come up against two cars tight up against the lane divider and you have to stop and wait for them to move or make them aware of your presence. They aren't moving and gain nothing from it. It's just lack of forward planning and lack of consideration for other road users.

Sorry I was referring to being in a car, so no room to "position" other than stopping a cars length before the stop line which is what I would do to give me options when in the car if I see blues approaching from behind,   

[YamFazFan]

I'm not sure I could sit there and not move out of the way whether or not there was a camera about to send me a ticket.

I suspect most people feel that way, but in that case they should frame the law in such a way that you don't get a ticket simply for being a good citizen.

Financial punishment for just doing a good turn seems like injustice to me

[darrsi]

You lot obviously live in a different world.
In my area you fight your way to the front of the half mile traffic and plonk yourself in front of the lead car at the lights.
Anyone on blues uses the other side of the road, or wherever they please to go past you, there are no niceties about it, they just aim to get to the destination regardless.

[YamFazFan]

You lot obviously live in a different world.
In my area you fight your way to the front of the half mile traffic and plonk yourself in front of the lead car at the lights.
Anyone on blues uses the other side of the road, or wherever they please to go past you, there are no niceties about it, they just aim to get to the destination regardless.

Well said.

That's the reality of how it is most of the time in these situations.

[darrsi]

You lot obviously live in a different world.
In my area you fight your way to the front of the half mile traffic and plonk yourself in front of the lead car at the lights.
Anyone on blues uses the other side of the road, or wherever they please to go past you, there are no niceties about it, they just aim to get to the destination regardless.

Well said.

That's the reality of how it is most of the time in these situations.

Also, if you stop at the white line, or before the cycle area, 5 other motorbikes will jump in front of you 

[Grahamm]

If you're sat at a red light and an emergency vehicle comes up behind you with lights flashing and siren sounding, is it against the law to cross the red light in order to allow the vehicle to proceed?.

The simple answer is "Yes".

Unless you are directed to cross a stop line by a Police Officer in uniform, it's illegal to cross the Stop line.



Having said that, a lot of people do it, although some areas are bloody-minded enough to fine you for doing so...

https://www.rac.co.uk/drive/advice/driving-advice/fined-for-moving-out-of-the-way-of-an-ambulance/

[Frosties]

You lot obviously live in a different world.
In my area you fight your way to the front of the half mile traffic and plonk yourself in front of the lead car at the lights.
Anyone on blues uses the other side of the road, or wherever they please to go past you, there are no niceties about it, they just aim to get to the destination regardless.

Well said.

That's the reality of how it is most of the time in these situations.

Also, if you stop at the white line, or before the cycle area, 5 other scooters will jump in front of you 

Fixed that for you 

[midden]

My understanding is the driver would be breaking the law going across the white line against a red traffic light unless instructed to do so by a uniformed police officer / traffic warden.


Having said that if it was safe then I would probably cross the white line to let a vehicle through on Blues and Twos

What about ones that are covered by a camera

I have done and would still do in both car and on bike using cautiously and safely.  any camera's would pick up the emergency vehicle crossing as well so I'd have my reason to appeal any fine

[YamFazFan]

If it were inevitable that I was going to receive a fine then they can wait.

Surely they wouldn't want you to cross a red light if it's illegal.

[HarryHornby]

Blue light drivers are trained to not intimiadate car drivers into breaking the law in order for them to get through, as for the public, well they can intimidate all they like 


Blue light drivers aren't allowed to drive through a red light and expect everyone to just stop or move out of their way, I think the wording is; they can treat a red light as a give way.


Isn't it a shame in today's society where we are questioning if we would move out the way for an emergency vehicle due to scameras.  It would be interesting to see how many times people do get a fine for this and if they are successful in appeal.  Surely common sense over coffers should prevail as long as it's safe to do so and you don't leave yourself stranded in the middle of the junction causing an obstruction, or keep going and properly jump the light.

[YamFazFan]

Surely common sense over coffers should prevail

Not when there's yet another opportunity to relieve the general public of their hard earned and remind us whose boss it doesn't.