FZs 1000 starting issues

[Lord_D]

So, after 6 months of perfect running, my Fazer has become very hard to start.
2006 FZs 1000, 20k miles.

The battery turns it over just fine, and from cold, on full choke, it will catch for a second, but before it will idle, it dies. And then it will spin and spin and make no attempt to fire.

I checked the plugs (CR9E) and they look like they have been there for a long time but were a good colour, sort of grey to tan with no soot and dry.

I thought it a good idea to change them anyway, so a set of iridiums went in this afternoon, but still the same.

I took out the air filter and it is dirty, but not blocked by any means.

I tried it without the air filter too, just the airbox lid on and same behaviour.

I also took no. 1 HT lead off and put in one of the old plugs and turned it over with the plug on the cylinder head and the spark looked good.

Am I missing anything obvious?

Cheers,

LD

[agricola]

Im guessing if the plugs are dry when after the motor, that its a fuel problem. Might catch initially as the float bowls empty, but after that no further fuel. And as no cylinders are firing, Id start at the tank and work forwards

[Lord_D]

Thanks @Agricola, tried that.

Took the feed pip to the carbs off at the pump and put on another bit of pipe and it is definitely pumping fuel.

I also undid the float drain from carb no.4 and loads of fuel came out, so I'm kind of baffled as to how the plugs appeared dry.

Bloody thing.

[stet]

An old dodge if you suspect lack of, or bad fuel, in the engine inlet is to sprinkle petrol or alcohol or starting fluid on the air filter (don't overdo it).

(1) If the engine starts and runs for a minute or so, you know there is a problem with the fuel/air.

(2) If the engine starts and then, after a minute or so, runs fairly normally, you know that the fuel/air mixture at start up is not sufficiently rich for starting (choke).

(3) If the engine will not start you know that the core problem is not the start fuel/air.

(Note that I have no actual experience with the FZS 1000)

[Lord_D]

Thanks @Stet.

I have put a fuel booster into the fuel just in case I got a bad tank.

However, the battery is not great, so need a new one anyway.

Have not tried the spray into the intake. Need to get a can of brake cleaner - I've heard that will do

Has anyone heard of tight exhaust valve clearances causing these kinds of problems?

Has been suggested elsewhere but I've no experience with these engines so don't know enough about it.

[stet]

Thanks @Stet.

No sweat!

However, the battery is not great, so need a new one anyway.

So long as the engine is cranking at normal full speed, the battery should not be the cause of the problem.

Need to get a can of brake cleaner - I've heard that will do

You never know what brake cleaner is. It could be CTC which does not burn.

Has anyone heard of tight exhaust valve clearances causing these kinds of problems?

Tight exhaust and/or inlet valve clearances can cause big problems but, from the symptoms that you describe, it is unlikely to be the root cause (in my opinion that is).

[Hugh Mungus]

I used GT85 (similar to WD40) to get a motor started when it was proving to be difficult (squirted into the airbox) - but this was a bike that had been stood for ages, once it had fired up and run for ten minutes it started up with no problems.


Is the fuel pump whirring away and stopping as normal when the ignition key is turned?
Have you tried half choke instead of full?
Has the bike been stood for any length of time?

[Lord_D]

Right, have a can of GT85, don't need brake cleaner then.

Going to try a new battery anyway, as I said, it was a bit low so no harm.

Bike was in constant use, in fact the first time it happened was coming out of work having ridden it there that morning.

Fuel pump appears to be working, and when I took the outlet pipe off, it pumped away as it cranked.

Anyway, fired up my old road legal ZXR-R, so that will do for the next few days.

[stet]

Many flammable fluids will work but, for best results, a high volatility, low flash-point, 'low residue' liquid is advisable: petrol, alcohol, starting fluid (ether), would be good. Lubricants, for example, leave a 'residue' (coating of oil).

[Hugh Mungus]

Bike was in constant use, in fact the first time it happened was coming out of work having ridden it there that morning.

OK, so it's not something you've done then - as in doing a bit of maintenance and suddenly it's not running properly.


A new battery will help the starter motor spin for a bit longer but once the engine has started it should keep going regardless, so if your current battery will start the bike it is not a battery problem.
Have you checked the choke cable hasn't become detached at the carbs or has snapped?

[Lord_D]

@Hugh_Mungus
Yeah, that is a good point.
I doubt valves would go so far out literally over a few hours and uniformly across four cylinders.

Anyway, got a fancy lithium battery and a charger, so will pop that in this evening, but yes I would tend to agree it sounds like something else.

Fingers crossed.

Actually, I've noticed the ignition barrel has gotten very sticky again.
I had previously just soaked it in GT85 and it sorted it out. But, it is very sticky again.

Is it possible that it is not making some connection or doing so intermittently that might affect starting?

[ptolemyx]

Is the choke cable actually operating the choke could be loose at the carb' clamp. I believe stock (non Ivanised) FZS1000 will not start when cold without choke - as advised by Falcon 269 when he Ivanised mine the other day.

[BBROWN1664]

Try 50% choke instead of full choke

[Lord_D]

Well, after putting in the new battery, I got it started and figured out what was wrong.

The choke cable was broken.

So a combination of weak battery and broken choke cable left it with these symptoms.

Everyday is a school day!

[Hugh Mungus]

Hurrah. Glad you got it sorted and it wasn't a major problem 

[Lord_D]

Aye, managed to source a cable repair kit and cobbled together something that worked.

Seems to be OK now, but will order a proper one when the festive madness has passed.

Also, I got a ScottOiler kit for my pressie - Score!