Date: 28-03-24  Time: 15:49 pm

Author Topic: What are my rear shock options ?  (Read 9320 times)

Freza

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What are my rear shock options ?
« on: 23 November 2017, 11:17:21 am »
So...my rear shock is done.
I did kebab's front forks modification (emulators) and now the front end is like new, but it highlighted the problem I've been suspecting - the rear shock needs to be changed.
All I'm finding on the internet is the YSS Z-series monoshock: http://www.wemoto.com/bikes/yamaha/fzs_600_fazer_sp/02-03/picture/rear_yss_z-series_monoshock/ which is not particularly cheap (can be found on ebay for less).


Are there any other worthy options to consider ?


Thanks

Disorderlypunk

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Re: What are my rear shock options ?
« Reply #1 on: 23 November 2017, 11:25:04 am »
there are loads of topics on using the r6 shock using a couple of tophats and new doglegs
search r6 shock in the foc-u search bar and they will pop up

Freza

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Re: What are my rear shock options ?
« Reply #2 on: 23 November 2017, 11:33:41 am »
there are loads of topics on using the r6 shock using a couple of tophats and new doglegs
search r6 shock in the foc-u search bar and they will pop up

Ok, and what year of R6 would I need to be searching for?
And where do I find separate tophats and doglegs?

celticbiker

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Re: What are my rear shock options ?
« Reply #3 on: 23 November 2017, 11:38:48 am »
There are always top  spec options too like nitron (recommended) or ohlins or hyperpro.
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Freza

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Re: What are my rear shock options ?
« Reply #4 on: 23 November 2017, 01:24:55 pm »
OK, I found a brand new R6 shock here locally, it's from a 2006-2007 R6, for 150 GBP.
Is that ok?

But now I have a problem with dogbones and tophats, where do I find that?


There are always top  spec options too like nitron (recommended) or ohlins or hyperpro.



Unfortunately I can't buy those here where I live (Croatia), which means I would need to order them online and prices are not very friendly :/
« Last Edit: 23 November 2017, 01:27:03 pm by Freza »

celticdog

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Re: What are my rear shock options ?
« Reply #5 on: 24 November 2017, 12:39:29 am »
R6 shock is the preferred option, you've done ok, there a much sought after item as an upgrade to several different bikes  :)
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tommyardin

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Re: What are my rear shock options ?
« Reply #6 on: 24 November 2017, 08:17:52 am »
Thought I had read recently on here that some have been really disappointed with their R6 conversion, and, if my memory serves me well some have gone back to the original Yamaha shock.
I went the Nitron route and am very pleased with that but it's premium price you will not get any change from 450 quid.
If the R6 shock is so good why are there so many almost new ones up for sale, it seems folk are removing them and fitting something better because they are not satisfied with the R6  performance.
You could ask 5 different people and get 5 differing opinions when it comes to suspension, Ohlin, YSS, Nitron, R6 and the list could go on, but then opinions are like arse holes everybodys got one.
Like most things in life you can ask people that might know about this or that but in the end you make a decision and go for it and then have to either live with it or start again.

Freza

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Re: What are my rear shock options ?
« Reply #7 on: 24 November 2017, 09:45:56 am »
Thanks for the honest opinion :D
Which one would you choose if you could, between Nitron, Hyperpro and Ohlins?
They're all similarly priced (around 450GBP-550€).

Only with Nitron I can choose spring weight, and it's the only shock that has compression and rebound setting together.

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Re: What are my rear shock options ?
« Reply #8 on: 24 November 2017, 09:56:30 am »
Hagon. Cheap and good. Not as good as one for 450GBP but a vast improvement over standard. Mine has been on for 20,000 miles and is as good as new

tommyardin

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Re: What are my rear shock options ?
« Reply #9 on: 24 November 2017, 12:33:53 pm »
Thanks for the honest opinion :D
Which one would you choose if you could, between Nitron, Hyperpro and Ohlins?



They're all similarly priced (around 450GBP-550€).

Only with Nitron I can choose spring weight, and it's the only shock that has compression and rebound setting together.



Can't answer that question honestly because I have no experience of the other rear shocks. I fitted the Nitron because of others opinions and I have no regrets what so ever. Yss are a good company I fitted YSS front fork emulators and I am pleased with them coupled with Ohlin Linear springs my system works well for me and all springs are my clothed riding weight matched including the  Nitron rear and Olins front.

tommyardin

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Re: What are my rear shock options ?
« Reply #10 on: 24 November 2017, 12:38:02 pm »
It would be nice to hear from riders with the R6 shock and have their opinions.
If the R6 route works for you you can save a fortune
Come on R6 brigade lets know your experiences.

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Re: What are my rear shock options ?
« Reply #11 on: 24 November 2017, 02:34:21 pm »

It would be nice to hear from riders with the R6 shock and have their opinions.
If the R6 route works for you you can save a fortune
Come on R6 brigade lets know your experiences.
I fitted the R6 shock earlier this year.
There was some improvement in the ride, but I can't say it was a dramatic one.
I am quite sure that I am the problem though, I'm simply not good enough a rider to understand what I'm feeling and make a change to the appropriate adjuster. Apart from getting the sag right all I've done is centre everything and, as that felt a bit harsh on the pot-holed and poorly repaired roads round me, backed off the three damping controls a bit.
So far, I've not had the time to work out how to get the best out of it by experimenting.
If anyone can link to (or write) an idiot's guide to setting up your R6 shock, then that would probably be a big help... particularly for those who've tried the R6 shock and gone back to the OE unit.

Freza

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Re: What are my rear shock options ?
« Reply #12 on: 24 November 2017, 05:10:43 pm »
I've made a simple comparison table for all these shocks you mentioned, with info I could gather from the internet.
This is what I came up with:





Direct link to the picture if mods find embedded picture too big.


Price in GBP with shipping and VAT refers to the Price source.
Local price is just for YSS and Bitubo, I went today to a local bike shop and that's how much it costs if you purchase them there. Added for comparison to online shops. Big difference.
Ohlins is allegedly, completely serviceable. Not sure for the others.


Now I'm in trouble  :b



« Last Edit: 24 November 2017, 05:12:09 pm by Freza »

celticbiker

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Re: What are my rear shock options ?
« Reply #13 on: 24 November 2017, 06:16:26 pm »
The nitron is serviceable and comes with ride height (or more correctly, shock length)  adjustment as standard.
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Re: What are my rear shock options ?
« Reply #14 on: 24 November 2017, 07:21:16 pm »
Pretty certain Hagon's are serviceable as well.

Got a second hand Hagon myself, does the job, but I've little to compare against other than the knackered original that was on previously. Decent enough budget option though. Also, pretty certain they do a pricer option with a external preload adjuster.

kebab19

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Re: What are my rear shock options ?
« Reply #15 on: 25 November 2017, 11:34:31 am »
Thought I had read recently on here that some have been really disappointed with their R6 conversion, and, if my memory serves me well some have gone back to the original Yamaha shock.
I went the Nitron route and am very pleased with that but it's premium price you will not get any change from 450 quid.
If the R6 shock is so good why are there so many almost new ones up for sale, it seems folk are removing them and fitting something better because they are not satisfied with the R6  performance.


Despite buggering off to the bloated monster which is the FJR1300, I find myself back here again defending the merits of R6 shocks on Fazers  :\

The original idea was Luke / Devilsyam who came up with the conversion for the FZS 1000.
In 2013, I took this idea and applied it to the FZS 600, since I had been forced to downsize, yet found both front and rear suspension to be mediocre http://foc-u.co.uk/index.php/topic,8167.0.html

It is true that the shock is not ideal for the FZS600 ...because it's ideal for an R6.  However, these shocks have a huge amount of adjustability for an OEM unit, so it's possible to adjust them until they suit the likes of Fazers. Because of the linkage unit, very little modification is needed if you're going to fit one to the 1000, but conversion for the 600 is much more involved (replacement heavier spring, top-hat spacers, top bolt and dogbones) and therefore more expensive.

When I bought my first experimental shock back in 2013, it cost me £44.  Unfortunately second-hand R6 shocks are no longer sold at such giveaway prices, and now sell for 2 - 4 times that value. Given that the conversion parts for a FZS600 cost close to £100 (unless you can fabricate your own) then the cost for a converted shock becomes a bit more expensive.   

I am aware that Luke / Devilsyam has almost certainly sold 200+ shocks to 1000 owners.  I myself have converted 50+ shocks for the 600 owners. They have been used on many other Yamahas such as FZR600s, Thundercats, TRX850s, not to mention other Japanese manufacturer bikes. There are so many R6 shocks for sale because they've been taken from bikes being converted to the racetrack for Supersport 600 duties.  Furthermore, they are a cheap alternative to the non-rebuildable OEM unit, they can fit many other bikes and can usually be re-sold for the same price that you bought it for.

Comparison of aftermarket shock prices with features that are closest to the R6 unit:
 
Converted R6 unit £200 (separate rebound, high & low speed compression adjusters, no ride height adjustment)
YSS                       £295  (no separate high/low speed compression - compression & rebound ratio is linked, no ride height adjustment)
Hagon                   £359 (no separate high/low speed compression - compression & rebound ratio is linked, no ride height adjustment)
Bitubo xze01         £429 (no separate high/low speed compression - compression & rebound ratio is linked, no ride height adjustment)
Ohlins                   £478 (no separate high/low speed compression - compression & rebound ratio is linked, no ride height adjustment)
Nitron NTR1          £438  (no separate high/low speed compression - compression & rebound ratio is linked, ride height adjustment)
Nitron NTR2          £612 (separate compression & rebound adjustment adjusters, ride height adjustment)

As for the likes of aftermarket units, I can actually make that direct comparsion. When I had my Fazer 1000, I had both a Nitron shock (NTR2, mid-range version which is now £732) and an R6 shock. Subjectively, I would say the R6 shock was 90% as good as the Nitron, which pained me at the time as I'd splurged £562 on it back in 2010.

Finally, out of all the units I converted, I only heard of serious issues from one person and that was because the replacement spring was too heavy for his weight.  I am now curious - can you point me to the disappointed shock owners as I'd like to find what their issue(s) are and may be able to address them?

Freza

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Re: What are my rear shock options ?
« Reply #16 on: 25 November 2017, 01:02:13 pm »
Kebab can you please take a look at this ad, never mind the text, just skim through the pictures and tell me if this fits on my fazer? It's from a 06-07 R6.

http://www.njuskalo.hr/moto-dijelovi-ostali/yamaha-r6-zadnji-amortizer-plinski-original-oglas-20455764
« Last Edit: 25 November 2017, 01:02:49 pm by Freza »

vinnyb

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Re: What are my rear shock options ?
« Reply #17 on: 25 November 2017, 01:59:23 pm »


http://www.shock-factory.co.uk/m-shocks-home.html
  Maybe another option to consider. I fitted one on mine. It's not done many miles but feels really good so far.
 I paid £339 from Bike Revival, Made to order (weight, riding style, Pillion and luggage use etc.) I got it in 4 days.
« Last Edit: 25 November 2017, 02:08:05 pm by vinnyb »

Fazerider

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Re: What are my rear shock options ?
« Reply #18 on: 25 November 2017, 02:09:41 pm »
Kebab can you please take a look at this ad, never mind the text, just skim through the pictures and tell me if this fits on my fazer? It's from a 06-07 R6.

http://www.njuskalo.hr/moto-dijelovi-ostali/yamaha-r6-zadnji-amortizer-plinski-original-oglas-20455764

No, that's the earlier model. It won't fit.
See Devilsyam's post for details of how to spot the difference.


Freza

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Re: What are my rear shock options ?
« Reply #19 on: 25 November 2017, 02:27:09 pm »
Great, thanks 👍

kebab19

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Re: What are my rear shock options ?
« Reply #20 on: 25 November 2017, 02:47:14 pm »
Kebab can you please take a look at this ad, never mind the text, just skim through the pictures and tell me if this fits on my fazer? It's from a 06-07 R6.
http://www.njuskalo.hr/moto-dijelovi-ostali/yamaha-r6-zadnji-amortizer-plinski-original-oglas-20455764


Kebab can you please take a look at this ad, never mind the text, just skim through the pictures and tell me if this fits on my fazer? It's from a 06-07 R6.

http://www.njuskalo.hr/moto-dijelovi-ostali/yamaha-r6-zadnji-amortizer-plinski-original-oglas-20455764

No, that's the earlier model. It won't fit.
See Devilsyam's post for details of how to spot the difference.


Actually... although I never updated my original R6 shock thread, I got my hands on the earlier 2006-07 shock, modified it and ran it in my own 600 for 15 months with no issues. So technically, unlike for the Fazer1000 it can be squeezed into the 600's frame, but is a VERY tight fit & requires a little bit of filing to the top reservoir. If that doesn't sound appealing, track down the later 2008 owards version of the shock, which fits more easily.
« Last Edit: 25 November 2017, 02:53:21 pm by kebab19 »

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Re: What are my rear shock options ?
« Reply #21 on: 29 November 2017, 08:52:33 am »
I purchased the R6 shock, from a very helpful Foccer.


It had an uprated spring fitted. It has completely transformed the handling of my bike.


Both solo and two up the handling is vastly improved.  The immense amount of adjustability means i can set it up just right for touring, solo or two up, or a Sunday blast.


Hands down the single best mod i have ever made to my Fazer


I dont know about the stock R6 spring, some riders who dont like the R6 stock spring, might benefit from getting it upgraded rather than going for a £450 option with less adjustablility.




On a separate note, it has shown the front end up as really week so i am going to replace the springs as the cheaper way of getting better front end feel. Can anyone on here vouch for some springs, (linear or progressive,) they use themselves?
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Re: What are my rear shock options ?
« Reply #22 on: 29 November 2017, 09:20:58 am »
I did my rear shock conversion a long time ago before the R6 conversion idea was out there and the only inexpensive choice really was sticking on a shock from a fazer thou - it works well enough for me and is a massive improvement over the original.
There has always been expensive after market upgrades available but an Olin's shock would cost more than my wee fazer is worth!
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tommyardin

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Re: What are my rear shock options ?
« Reply #23 on: 29 November 2017, 09:43:15 am »
Shocks like most things when we first get them we play with all the options available, Compression and Rebound not forgetting PreLoad, then we start raising or lowering that back end by dog-bone changes raising the front fork stanchions up through the steering head yokes effectively lower the front, because that has an impact on the rear suspension to.
We keep trying to fine tune everything and are never quite sure we have got it to its premium settings, a little tweek here a little adjustment there, short blast out, Mmmm still not sure its quite right, back in the shed or workshop for a few more adjustments and on it goes, we can spend more and more time fine tuning and never really be sure we have it quite right.
There comes a stage that we just say 'foc it' and get on a enjoy riding the bike and enjoy her for the bike she is.

Sounds like me with the new Computer, Tablet, Smartphone I get them and want to know everything about it all the apps that are on it and all the settings must be just right and when I feel I have got it setup perfectly I make calls and text people on it  :'(    Doh! 

tommyardin

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Re: What are my rear shock options ?
« Reply #24 on: 29 November 2017, 09:46:18 am »
I've made a simple comparison table for all these shocks you mentioned, with info I could gather from the internet.
This is what I came up with:





Direct link to the picture if mods find embedded picture too big.


Price in GBP with shipping and VAT refers to the Price source.
Local price is just for YSS and Bitubo, I went today to a local bike shop and that's how much it costs if you purchase them there. Added for comparison to online shops. Big difference.
Ohlins is allegedly, completely serviceable. Not sure for the others.


Now I'm in trouble  :b


Nitron Shocks are completely serviceable as well, return to Nitron 3 or 4 working day turnaround from arrival at Nitron.
I have the Nitron R1 on the FZS600 great shock (about £460), vast improvement in ride comfort one or two up. Handling is more positive and is planted, the bike turns in quicker, but you never feel it's getting away from you.
Bearing in mind the front forks on my bike were sorted out at the same time as fitting the Nitron, Ohlin Linears and YSS emus, another great mod. 


My wrists and lower back are in agreement with my daughter and wife who both say it is a much more smooth and stable ride, The Nitron is a great mod and I am sure all the other After Market shocks mentioned in the post will be a huge improvement over the standard Yamaha shock, bearing in mind most of the original shocks on the back of the FZS 600's are at least 14 years old and possibly got 50 or 60K miles on them.
Two up with my Original Yammy shock the rear-hugger used to strike the underside of the seat on fast bumps, I not a heavy guy at about 12.5 stones and my daughter about 9 stones and the Mrs at 8, so not a heavy load, No you silly bugger not all three of us at the same time DOH! 
« Last Edit: 29 November 2017, 10:04:41 am by tommyardin »