Date: 28-03-24  Time: 17:42 pm

Author Topic: Good News!! Ian Brady is dead!!  (Read 9368 times)

darrsi

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Re: Good News!! Ian Brady is dead!!
« Reply #25 on: 17 May 2017, 10:58:07 am »
Why not just throw old Noah into the mix, who supposedly died aged 950.  :eek
If it wasn't so utterly ridiculous then it may actually be laughable.
But if it was written in a book then it must be true.  :rollin :rollin :rollin
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slappy

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Re: Good News!! Ian Brady is dead!!
« Reply #26 on: 17 May 2017, 04:10:46 pm »
Politics and religion make fairy stories seem normal.

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Re: Good News!! Ian Brady is dead!!
« Reply #27 on: 17 May 2017, 05:44:18 pm »
 
Quote
Prison is also supposed to be a deterrent. If poor, deprived little Johnny Crackhead can expect an easy ride after terrorising his neighbourhood, he isn't likely to change his ways, is he?


I sure don’t fancy prison.

Talking about your Johnny Crackhead, I remember reading of one long running experimental prison rehabilitation programme.  Basically, first time offenders like Johnny Crackhead were offered to be part of a fast track rehabilitation programme.  In exchange for active participation and good behaviour their sentence could be significantly reduced.  But first the victim had to agree to this and also to taking part.  The idea was that young or first time offenders like Johnny would have to face up to their crimes.  There were various aspects to the scheme, but one key part was several sessions sitting down face to face with the victim of whatever their crime was.


There was also a TV documentary about said scheme.  The effect on the offender was startling.  Nor was it easy viewing.  I can’t remember the precise stats for the experiment, but it was something in the order of those whom participated in it were 3 or 4 times less likely to re-offend then those who didn’t take part.  It was, in other words, fantastically successful.


As far as I know most of these schemes have been ditched.


As we can see on this thread rehabilitation of offenders is not popular and frankly not a vote winner. 


Hang em, beat em, let them rot etc is much more popular.  So brain dead banging on about being tough on crime and talking pish aboot punishing criminals etc, rather than rehabilitating them, wins votes.  But the fact is a brutal prison system that has no interests in rehabilitation breeds hardened criminals and subsequently we all suffer.

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Re: Good News!! Ian Brady is dead!!
« Reply #28 on: 17 May 2017, 08:12:56 pm »
So rehab for the offender, and what support did their victims get?

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Re: Good News!! Ian Brady is dead!!
« Reply #29 on: 17 May 2017, 09:58:13 pm »
I've got no problem with rehabilitation but that doesn't mean prison can't be hell for the people in it.
I can't see why they have niceties. There shouldn't be tvs, pool tables, gyms etc etc it should be a room with a bed and a piss hole.
Their time should involve 3 meals a day, 6 hours work, 4 hours rehabilitation, 1 hour outside and that should be that until the times up

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Re: Good News!! Ian Brady is dead!!
« Reply #30 on: 17 May 2017, 10:48:37 pm »
Hey like I say, you can send em to hell and they'll come out harder, even more fucked up, detached from society and guranteed to cause mayhem and re-offend.


Or you can strike a  balance between punishment and investing in rehabilitation and release people ready to become part of society and unlikely to reoffend. 


 But like I say, macho, testosterone fuelled brain dead bull shit is the vote winner, so our prisons are a little light on the rehabilitation projects. 
 


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Re: Good News!! Ian Brady is dead!!
« Reply #31 on: 17 May 2017, 10:55:08 pm »
Why not just throw old Noah into the mix, who supposedly died aged 950.  :eek
If it wasn't so utterly ridiculous then it may actually be laughable.
But if it was written in a book then it must be true.  :rollin :rollin :rollin


Oh Darrsi!,
The hat of arrogance fits you so well and I feel the style also suits you.
I was, and am, talking about recorded history not just in a religious book (Which you seem to believe is a book of Fairy Stories) but also in secular history books and documents. Some of the records talk about how he was despised, these people were not his friends and some spoke harshly about him, why would they do that if he did not exist.
Noah I know very little about, you seem to know more about him than I do, I did not know he allegedly lived to 950 years of age, now that does seem unbelievable as most die from heart disease or cancer or some other equally vile cause in this modern world. (note I said does seem unbelievable)


We should all be willing to be more open minded and not jump to conclusions or desissions about things that don't sit comfortably with us, just because you choose not to believe something does not make it untrue.


I have met a couple of guys in my life time that utterly refused to believe their wife was being unfaithful to them, because it was uncomfortable and painful so it was easier to deny it, but I'm afraid denial does not change fact.


You know I still think the world is flat and if I ride my Fazer all day and night long I will fall off the edge, because I don't believe what someone once said. 
You would OK though Darrsi because you would probably not be able to get yours started, so you would not fall off the edge, but we would all certainly hear the backfiring.
 :finger   
 
« Last Edit: 17 May 2017, 11:04:35 pm by tommyardin »

tommyardin

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Re: Good News!! Ian Brady is dead!!
« Reply #32 on: 17 May 2017, 11:00:22 pm »
Hey like I say, you can send em to hell and they'll come out harder, even more fucked up, detached from society and guranteed to cause mayhem and re-offend.


Or you can strike a  balance between punishment and investing in rehabilitation and release people ready to become part of society and unlikely to reoffend. 


 But like I say, macho, testosterone fuelled brain dead bull shit is the vote winner, so our prisons are a little light on the rehabilitation projects.


 :)
They are in the prison costing us a shed full of money it would cost next to nothing more to have a rehab programme in place and if it only stopped 10% from re-offending it would be worth it.
Sometimes showing someone a little kindness and interest produces results for the better, not always I'm sure, but sometimes it will.

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Re: Good News!! Ian Brady is dead!!
« Reply #33 on: 17 May 2017, 11:26:46 pm »
 
Quote
They are in the prison costing us a shed full of money it would cost next to nothing more to have a rehab programme


I think that’s the problem.  Rehabilitation programs whilst they may not cost a fortune, well they ain’t exactly cheap either.  They add to costs in the short term, but enable massive savings in the long term.


Quote
Sometimes showing someone a little kindness and interest produces results for the better, not always I'm sure, but sometimes it will.


Personally I’m not sure I give a flying fuck about certain criminal types.  Frankly if short, sharp, shock borstals or long term harsh heavy labour camps worked and turned out well balanced, socially minded individuals determined to make their way in society and never to reoffend, well hey that would be fine by me.  It sure sounds satisfying.


But, sadly, the reality is such policy has been proven to fail, and worse still, interestingly enough, has a habit of attracting sadistic individuals as employees. Such facilities have been proven to turn out large numbers of 5 star total nutters.  Whatever goes in comes out five times more fucked up.


On the other hand, educational rehabilitation centres that force criminals to face up to and take responsibility for their actions are proven to turn out large numbers of reformed decent individuals determined to become valued members of society.


My interest is simple, it’s only in being able to live in a civilised society, not having to worry too much about being done over, have my house broken into, or having large chunks of my tax cash wasted on dumb boot camps that are proven not to work.




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Re: Good News!! Ian Brady is dead!!
« Reply #34 on: 17 May 2017, 11:32:29 pm »
Oh and I should point out again, that when I mention rehabilitation I'm talking about full blown psychopaths - like Brady.


 People identified as and diagnosed as psychopaths are not suitable for rehabilitation.  If the diagnosis is correct, then it is not possible to rehabilitate them in any shape or form.  A psychopath with serious criminal habits will always reoffend.
 
 

darrsi

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Re: Good News!! Ian Brady is dead!!
« Reply #35 on: 17 May 2017, 11:45:41 pm »
Oh and I should point out again, that when I mention rehabilitation I'm talking about full blown psychopaths - like Brady.


 People identified as and diagnosed as psychopaths are not suitable for rehabilitation.  If the diagnosis is correct, then it is not possible to rehabilitate them in any shape or form.  A psychopath with serious criminal habits will always reoffend.


So, in your words, if they're untreatable then what should be done with them?
So far all he's done is mock people for his own pleasure. He's shown zero remorse and if he'd ever released the whereabouts of the lost boy then his game would be up, so that was his lifetime of leverage.
I"m amazed nobody inside never made a mess of him to be truthful.
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tommyardin

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Re: Good News!! Ian Brady is dead!!
« Reply #36 on: 17 May 2017, 11:52:13 pm »
Oh and I should point out again, that when I mention rehabilitation I'm not talking about full blown psychopaths - like Brady.


 People identified as and diagnosed as psychopaths are not suitable for rehabilitation.  If the diagnosis is correct, then it is not possible to rehabilitate them in any shape or form.  A psychopath with serious criminal habits will always reoffend.


Can't argue with that.
« Last Edit: 17 May 2017, 11:55:34 pm by tommyardin »

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Re: Good News!! Ian Brady is dead!!
« Reply #37 on: 17 May 2017, 11:59:28 pm »
I was once told by a judge (yes I actually know one, and occasionally have a beer with him, well he drinks wine but you get my drift) and he told me that offenders do not go to prison to be punished but hopefully rehabilitated, having their liberty taken away for that period is the punishment.

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Re: Good News!! Ian Brady is dead!!
« Reply #38 on: 18 May 2017, 01:07:00 am »
Quote
So, in your words, if they're untreatable then what should be done with them?
.


  Today it’s pretty much accepted that true psychopaths are untreatable.  From treatments or rehabilitation, they simply learn how to be ‘better’ psychopaths.  They are simply wired up differently from the rest of us.  Some of the attempts to rehabilitate fully blown psychopaths and release them into society are, umm, well, interesting – to say the least.
 
Bear in mind that not all psychopaths are of the child murdering throat slitting variety.  Many psychopaths know how to play by the rules and live their lives amongst us (it is said a high proportion of CEOs and company chairmen are psychopathic).  Psychopaths are simply extreme sociopaths totally without conscience.  Conscience is not something they can understand and they are not capable of it.


That’s the long answer.  The short answer is make sure they can do no harm.  If they have failed to live by the rules you lock em up for life.  There's no point at any attempt to rehabilitate, and I dont believe in the death sentence (you need a fucking sociopath to carry it out FFS!)

 
Oh, how about Theresa May?  She’s a possible psychopath.  Though personally I suspect she merely  suffers from Narcissistic Personality Disorder, ditto Donald Trump.
 
Psychopaths, sociopaths and narcissists are all often extremely good at observation and working out what people want and how to charm them.  They are very often experts at telling people what they want to hear in a very convincing manner.  If highly intelligent, like Tony Blair, they have an awful habit of rising to the top of the shit heap.

darrsi

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Re: Good News!! Ian Brady is dead!!
« Reply #39 on: 18 May 2017, 06:47:39 am »
Quote
So, in your words, if they're untreatable then what should be done with them?
.


  Today it’s pretty much accepted that true psychopaths are untreatable.  From treatments or rehabilitation, they simply learn how to be ‘better’ psychopaths.  They are simply wired up differently from the rest of us.  Some of the attempts to rehabilitate fully blown psychopaths and release them into society are, umm, well, interesting – to say the least.
 
Bear in mind that not all psychopaths are of the child murdering throat slitting variety.  Many psychopaths know how to play by the rules and live their lives amongst us (it is said a high proportion of CEOs and company chairmen are psychopathic).  Psychopaths are simply extreme sociopaths totally without conscience.  Conscience is not something they can understand and they are not capable of it.


That’s the long answer.  The short answer is make sure they can do no harm.  If they have failed to live by the rules you lock em up for life.  There's no point at any attempt to rehabilitate, and I dont believe in the death sentence (you need a fucking sociopath to carry it out FFS!)

 
Oh, how about Theresa May?  She’s a possible psychopath.  Though personally I suspect she merely  suffers from Narcissistic Personality Disorder, ditto Donald Trump.
 
Psychopaths, sociopaths and narcissists are all often extremely good at observation and working out what people want and how to charm them.  They are very often experts at telling people what they want to hear in a very convincing manner.  If highly intelligent, like Tony Blair, they have an awful habit of rising to the top of the shit heap.


The amount of people i've heard say it's about time the long haul prisoner Charles Bronson (Salvador) should be released now just astonishes me, because the man is only a victim of his own wrongdoings over the years.
He can't control or behave himself whatsoever, and the thought of him being let out into today's world where the level of general respect towards other people has probably all but vanished in comparison to when he was last roaming free would most likely end in him being back inside on the same day.
The price of a pint would probably be enough to push him over the edge for starters.
More people are born because of alcohol than will ever die from it.

darrsi

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Re: Good News!! Ian Brady is dead!!
« Reply #40 on: 18 May 2017, 07:02:36 am »
Why not just throw old Noah into the mix, who supposedly died aged 950.  :eek
If it wasn't so utterly ridiculous then it may actually be laughable.
But if it was written in a book then it must be true.  :rollin :rollin :rollin


Oh Darrsi!,
The hat of arrogance fits you so well and I feel the style also suits you.
I was, and am, talking about recorded history not just in a religious book (Which you seem to believe is a book of Fairy Stories) but also in secular history books and documents. Some of the records talk about how he was despised, these people were not his friends and some spoke harshly about him, why would they do that if he did not exist.
Noah I know very little about, you seem to know more about him than I do, I did not know he allegedly lived to 950 years of age, now that does seem unbelievable as most die from heart disease or cancer or some other equally vile cause in this modern world. (note I said does seem unbelievable)


We should all be willing to be more open minded and not jump to conclusions or desissions about things that don't sit comfortably with us, just because you choose not to believe something does not make it untrue.


I have met a couple of guys in my life time that utterly refused to believe their wife was being unfaithful to them, because it was uncomfortable and painful so it was easier to deny it, but I'm afraid denial does not change fact.


You know I still think the world is flat and if I ride my Fazer all day and night long I will fall off the edge, because I don't believe what someone once said. 
You would OK though Darrsi because you would probably not be able to get yours started, so you would not fall off the edge, but we would all certainly hear the backfiring.
 :finger   
 


Are you still talking about him? (yaaaawn)
People "documented" as living for over 900 years old does tend to stick in my mind, mainly because it's complete and utter fabricated bullshit, and not physically possible due to a mountainous list of reasons, which if you can't comprehend then that's not my problem.
You carry on and read your book fella, it's not affecting my daily life whatsoever. I'm only 750 years young, wait 'til i'm older though and i'll prove it was all nonsense.  :rollin

ps: the bike starts and runs just fine.  :)
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Re: Good News!! Ian Brady is dead!!
« Reply #41 on: 18 May 2017, 08:52:29 am »
Rehab is fine if you catch them young or its a first offence. Too often we see habitual criminals on the tv where they have done community service, had fines, had probation and several jail terms and still have fresh offence lists as long as your arm to be "taken into consideration" when they appear in court where they are then told "don't do it again, pay us £10p per week and fec off out of my court". That's not a deterrent, that's just paying 10p per week for the huge amount of crack they bought by selling our stolen stuff. Prison doesn't work on these people. Removal of hands might teach them though.

More serious offenders like armed robbers, yes prison. A stint in there may teach them to straighten up their ways. after that.....

The most serious offenders, like Brady, who knew what they were doing and we have evidence to prove it, are beyond rehabilitation. Death penalty here.
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tommyardin

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Re: Good News!! Ian Brady is dead!!
« Reply #42 on: 18 May 2017, 09:53:28 am »
Why not just throw old Noah into the mix, who supposedly died aged 950.  :eek
If it wasn't so utterly ridiculous then it may actually be laughable.
But if it was written in a book then it must be true.  :rollin :rollin :rollin


Oh Darrsi!,
The hat of arrogance fits you so well and I feel the style also suits you.
I was, and am, talking about recorded history not just in a religious book (Which you seem to believe is a book of Fairy Stories) but also in secular history books and documents. Some of the records talk about how he was despised, these people were not his friends and some spoke harshly about him, why would they do that if he did not exist.
Noah I know very little about, you seem to know more about him than I do, I did not know he allegedly lived to 950 years of age, now that does seem unbelievable as most die from heart disease or cancer or some other equally vile cause in this modern world. (note I said does seem unbelievable)


We should all be willing to be more open minded and not jump to conclusions or desissions about things that don't sit comfortably with us, just because you choose not to believe something does not make it untrue.


I have met a couple of guys in my life time that utterly refused to believe their wife was being unfaithful to them, because it was uncomfortable and painful so it was easier to deny it, but I'm afraid denial does not change fact.


You know I still think the world is flat and if I ride my Fazer all day and night long I will fall off the edge, because I don't believe what someone once said. 
You would OK though Darrsi because you would probably not be able to get yours started, so you would not fall off the edge, but we would all certainly hear the backfiring.
 :finger   
 


Are you still talking about him? (yaaaawn)
People "documented" as living for over 900 years old does tend to stick in my mind, mainly because it's complete and utter fabricated bullshit, and not physically possible due to a mountainous list of reasons, which if you can't comprehend then that's not my problem.
You carry on and read your book fella, it's not affecting my daily life whatsoever. I'm only 750 years young, wait 'til i'm older though and i'll prove it was all nonsense.  :rollin

ps: the bike starts and runs just fine.  :)


Well I'm pleased your bike is running well now, ride safe because you don't want to end your 750 year reign of life just yet.

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Re: Good News!! Ian Brady is dead!!
« Reply #43 on: 18 May 2017, 10:12:00 am »
If you read your bible you will know that it was the norm to live for 100s of years, some confuse the flood with the notion that god after the flood then restricted mans lifespan to 120 years, which is not correct the 120 years was how much longer god was willing to put up with the evil corrupt ways of man and breeding with the fallen before he would bring the flood upon the earth.
Noah was 500 when he was given the heads up by god

I consider myself agnostic by the way, but I have read a lot of the bible and intend to read all the religions books at some stage. But I dont ride my bike enough as it is.



 
« Last Edit: 18 May 2017, 10:12:54 am by fazersharp »
I don't do rain or threat there of. dry rider only with no shame.

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Re: Good News!! Ian Brady is dead!!
« Reply #44 on: 18 May 2017, 10:31:29 am »
Quote
I consider myself agnostic by the way,

I used to think I was agnostic, then I realised I wasn't too sure about it.

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Re: Good News!! Ian Brady is dead!!
« Reply #45 on: 18 May 2017, 10:32:49 am »
Quote
I consider myself agnostic by the way,

I used to think I was agnostic, then I realised I wasn't too sure about it.

Exactly
I don't do rain or threat there of. dry rider only with no shame.

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Re: Good News!! Ian Brady is dead!!
« Reply #46 on: 18 May 2017, 10:50:23 am »
That's when I realised I was an atheist.

Pet hate is Jehova's Winess types knocking on my door;

Me - Goodday but no thanks I'm an atheist.

God's cold caller - You know I used to be like that too.

Me - no you didn't.  Goodbye.

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Re: Good News!! Ian Brady is dead!!
« Reply #47 on: 18 May 2017, 11:24:36 am »
That's when I realised I was an atheist.

Pet hate is Jehova's Winess types knocking on my door;

Me - Goodday but no thanks I'm an atheist.

God's cold caller - You know I used to be like that too.

Me - no you didn't.  Goodbye.

.
I have got myself on the Jo-hos black list of "do not call" after a very long debate with them on religious issues I wouldnt let them go (good reason to avail yourself of the bible) oh and aliens I think is what swung it for me.
I found out when I asked them once why they dont call anymore when I was out in front of my house and they were passing and was told that my house has been put on a "No Call" list  :rollin
« Last Edit: 18 May 2017, 11:25:48 am by fazersharp »
I don't do rain or threat there of. dry rider only with no shame.

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Re: Good News!! Ian Brady is dead!!
« Reply #48 on: 18 May 2017, 11:27:41 am »
Me, just like Sharpie, open minded and interested in all sorts of history, and the history of the Bible is interesting. It has shaped and moulded many nations and some were so convinced of its truth that they lived their lives under it's authority. A life of selfless sacrifice serving others. Now it might not be your cup of tea, but many have benefited from their sacrifice.

The likes of Lord Shaftesbury (Anthony Ashley Cooper) and Dr Bernardo were Christians and did amazing things with their wealth to help others because they were convinced of the truth that they read in the Scriptures.

It also is/was the way this country was governed and shaped for many years, its apart of our roots and heritage. Again I'm not saying it was all good and that people sometimes got it wrong with decisions made, but overall this country was a better place to live for most people because of our Christian routes. Aged parents lived with their families and were looked after by their children, now days we put them in a home were people who often don't even have the same language look after them/keep them quiet, they are often lonely and sad and they live out their last few years in isolation. To be honest I'm hoping for better things.
Who knows I might even go and live with Darrsi and his family he seems to be going on for a long time as he is 750 years old already, what the chance Darrsi lol! :thumbup
« Last Edit: 18 May 2017, 12:08:27 pm by tommyardin »

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Re: Good News!! Ian Brady is dead!!
« Reply #49 on: 18 May 2017, 11:41:53 am »
My method-

Good morning/afternoon sir, We're from the church of latter day saints/Jehovah/Pentecostal etc

Really? Wow, I didn't know he'd opened another branch!

They tend to leave after that opening gambit.
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