Bike didn't start!

[ben17484]

This morning I got on my bike to come to work and it wouldn't start. I did my usual of turning the choke on (and checked that the bar moved on the carb, so the cable is definitely working), slight throttle and starter button, but it just sat and churned away but didn't start. Eventually the batter died so i had to put the bike away and get the train to work.


I haven't used the bike in anger since last Friday, but did go for a quick spin around the block yesterday and everything seemed fine.


Where would be a good place to start looking for the issue?


Cheers,
Ben

[Fazerider]

Once hooked up to a charged battery, I'd see if there's a spark available at all 4 leads.
However, if it was my bike, I wouldn't expect it to start... full choke is a reliable way to flood it unless the temperature's about -5ºC.

[ben17484]

Ok, cheers. I'll try that on the charger.


I did wonder if I'd flooded it. Would you not use the choke at all in the spring/summer/autumn then? This is my first non fuel injected car/bike.

[bandit]

I use the choke all year round with no ill effect.
As Fazerider said charge battery & try starting again,it maybe time for a new one do you know how old it is.

[Fazerider]

Ok, cheers. I'll try that on the charger.


I did wonder if I'd flooded it. Would you not use the choke at all in the spring/summer/autumn then? This is my first non fuel injected car/bike.

I need about one quarter choke if the temperature is around freezing, but otherwise none at all.
The slow jet runs on the rich side at the usual 2-turns-out setting. In fact, I leave mine at 1.75 turns and it's still ample... but bikes vary, yours may be different.

[ben17484]

I've only had the bike a month so most of that time it has been fairly cold. Not tried starting without the choke yet but will do now the weather is a bit better.


No idea how old the battery is, but have read that even though it was turning over for quite a while (therefore I assumed the battery was fine) the batter may be at fault? If this is the case, presumably starting on a battery charger should resolve the issue and I can then replace the battery?

[Jules-C]

Often needs a bit of throttle to get started.  Try about 1/4 choke and then press starter button and gently open throttle to about 1/2 way taking about 2 seconds get there.

That often works on many bikes with chokes.

If you're used to fuel injection you've probably been told not to touch throttle when starting the engine, that's not because the engine doesn't need it but the electronics​ are doing it for you without you knowing about it.

[bandit]

ben17484,charge the battery with a charger first, not with the battery charger connected.

[ben17484]

Ok, will do cheers. So the chargers aren't like the battery boost ones that you can get for cars that will allow you to start the bike/car with the charger in boost mode whilst attached to the battery terminals?


I've ordered the battery charger which should be through tomorrow.


So even though the bike was turning over for a long time, it could still be the batter that's the issue?

[ben17484]

Another possibly stupid question - can I try and jump start the bike from my car to see if the battery is the issue?

[ben17484]

A quick google suggests I can jump start a motorbike from my car (without the engine running on the car)

[bandit]

Yes you can but be careful connecting the large car jump lead clips to the small terminals on your bike.
It is not uncommon for the original battery to last this long if it is a black battery possibly a GS Yamaha Motor Company one this would more lightly be the original Yuasa/Lucas or branded other would be later replacement with a life of around 5-10yrs service.


http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/GENUINE-YUASA-YT12B-BS-MOTORBIKE-QUAD-JETSKI-BATTERY/130494954517?_trksid=p2047675.c100005.m1851&_trkparms=aid%3D222007%26algo%3DSIC.MBE%26ao%3D2%26asc%3D40802%26meid%3D3334ef489381491cb5049e9490a8a59d%26pid%3D100005%26rk%3D2%26rkt%3D6%26mehot%3Dpp%26sd%3D300683821985

[darrsi]

I've still got issues with starting my bike as well after it's been sitting still overnight, or all day at work.
Tried everything so far, and i can't even blame the weather now either, but narrowed it down to be fuel related.


I syphoned out the fuel in the tank the other day, and drained the carbs, and there was no hint whatsoever of water in it.
But still, embarrassing as it is, i have to slosh the fuel about by rocking the bike side to side, then it will start and run perfectly.
If i try just starting it without moving it from the sidestand it simply will not have it?
Totally baffles me, but at least i know how to work around it now. 

[BBROWN1664]

1/4-1/2 choke is all I ever needed on my FZS600 to start it and then maybe a tad more to keep it running on the coldest of mornings.

It sounds like you may have flooded it and then drained the battery.

Charge the battery or jump start the bike with a small amount of choke (or none to start with)

[ben17484]

I've still got issues with starting my bike as well after it's been sitting still overnight, or all day at work.
Tried everything so far, and i can't even blame the weather now either, but narrowed it down to be fuel related.


I syphoned out the fuel in the tank the other day, and drained the carbs, and there was no hint whatsoever of water in it.
But still, embarrassing as it is, i have to slosh the fuel about by rocking the bike side to side, then it will start and run perfectly.
If i try just starting it without moving it from the sidestand it simply will not have it?
Totally baffles me, but at least i know how to work around it now. 

Funny you should say that - the only time i've had any issue before was when starting up to come home from work one day on the side stand and it wouldn't start. I then sat on the bike and rocked it and it started ok. I would have had at least over a half a tank of petrol, so it shouldn't have needed the rocking. That's the only time I've had it happen though.


I wonder why that is.

[darrsi]

I've still got issues with starting my bike as well after it's been sitting still overnight, or all day at work.
Tried everything so far, and i can't even blame the weather now either, but narrowed it down to be fuel related.


I syphoned out the fuel in the tank the other day, and drained the carbs, and there was no hint whatsoever of water in it.
But still, embarrassing as it is, i have to slosh the fuel about by rocking the bike side to side, then it will start and run perfectly.
If i try just starting it without moving it from the sidestand it simply will not have it?
Totally baffles me, but at least i know how to work around it now. 

Funny you should say that - the only time i've had any issue before was when starting up to come home from work one day on the side stand and it wouldn't start. I then sat on the bike and rocked it and it started ok. I would have had at least over a half a tank of petrol, so it shouldn't have needed the rocking. That's the only time I've had it happen though.


I wonder why that is.

I really don't know but if you find out please don't hesitate to let me know. 

[Grayo]

If the bike needs to be upright then this sounds like a problem with the tilt switch to me.

[ben17484]

I've still got issues with starting my bike as well after it's been sitting still overnight, or all day at work.
Tried everything so far, and i can't even blame the weather now either, but narrowed it down to be fuel related.


I syphoned out the fuel in the tank the other day, and drained the carbs, and there was no hint whatsoever of water in it.
But still, embarrassing as it is, i have to slosh the fuel about by rocking the bike side to side, then it will start and run perfectly.
If i try just starting it without moving it from the sidestand it simply will not have it?
Totally baffles me, but at least i know how to work around it now. 

Funny you should say that - the only time i've had any issue before was when starting up to come home from work one day on the side stand and it wouldn't start. I then sat on the bike and rocked it and it started ok. I would have had at least over a half a tank of petrol, so it shouldn't have needed the rocking. That's the only time I've had it happen though.


I wonder why that is.

I really don't know but if you find out please don't hesitate to let me know. 

will do - but I'll more than likely just keep rocking it like you do

[ben17484]

If the bike needs to be upright then this sounds like a problem with the tilt switch to me.

I've only had it happen once (well, twice including today). I did try putting it on the center stand this morning just in case it was something to do with the side stand switch, but to no avail. Could have been flooded by that point though.


Do you know where the tilt switch is and how to test it?

[darrsi]

If the bike needs to be upright then this sounds like a problem with the tilt switch to me.

Just had a look around the site and apparently the FZS600 doesn't have a tilt sensor.

[Grayo]

Ah, that's my fault for not checking first. I wrongly assumed that they were Gen 1 thous. I didn't notice that it was posted in the FZS600 section.

[darrsi]

Ah, that's my fault for not checking first. I wrongly assumed that they were Gen 1 thous. I didn't notice that it was posted in the FZS600 section.

No worries, i found a post where Fazerider was talking about it but then obviously found out they never had them.
I must say though it's a very annoying issue that has totally stumped me now.

[His Dudeness]

maybe rocking it side to side causes the floats to move slightly and gets petrol flowing into the carb

[darrsi]

maybe rocking it side to side causes the floats to move slightly and gets petrol flowing into the carb

Had major trouble starting it again tonight, it will start for a split second then just stop dead.
It did this a few times, then i had to do the rocking thing, in front of a crowd of visitors outside my work, and it started for a few seconds this time then cut out again.
Then after a few more attempts of plunging the forks using the front brake it started properly then ran perfectly all the way home, no stuttering or spluttering and it pulled hard in any gear, as if there was no problem at all?
It's driving me bonkers!

[His Dudeness]

Does it happen when it's parked on the center stand?