Date: 16-10-18  Time: 20:48 PM

Author Topic: Header refurb questions  (Read 2211 times)

GhostCat

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Header refurb questions
« on: 23 March 2017, 05:40:47 PM »
Hi
still got the original headers on my 2000 Fazer, I have got some exhaust paint and I've started plus gassing the nuts. Just wondering whether I should get new gaskets, and if so what type, copper or fibre ? Also could I replace the nuts with stainless, and if so where would I get the correct spec nuts. M6 stainless.. flanged ?  Connector nuts ?


tia Ghostcat

daviee

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Re: Header refurb questions
« Reply #1 on: 23 March 2017, 06:24:01 PM »
paint it on the bike you will more than likely  snap at least one stud cause more heart ache

Bretty

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Re: Header refurb questions
« Reply #2 on: 23 March 2017, 06:27:21 PM »
That's good advice!
a snapped stud is a massive ball ache. But to answer your question. I've used and reused a few gaskets and prefer the fibre gaskets as they always seem to seal better with less torque. Also I use the standard Yamaha nuts on my studs, and give them a good painting with copper compound every couple of months.
-suck-squeeze-bang-blow-

GhostCat

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Re: Header refurb questions
« Reply #3 on: 23 March 2017, 09:01:36 PM »
Thanks for the tips chaps, but the collector part is looking pretty ropy and I am looking to fit stainless headers when funds allow, so I need to sort out the nuts/studs anyway. Thing about the Yamaha nuts is, they are rusty as hell so they must be made out of recycled Austin Allegroes




Ghostcat

Bretty

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Re: Header refurb questions
« Reply #4 on: 23 March 2017, 10:52:31 PM »
If you're buying new nuts anyway, consider getting a nut splitter, or dremel to remove the old nuts. And/or a blowtorch. It's always a laugh snapping off a stud. 
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fazersharp

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Re: Header refurb questions
« Reply #5 on: 23 March 2017, 11:01:54 PM »
Dont be in any rush and keep soaking those nuts, I used a syringe to get right in there
I don't do rain or threat there of. dry rider only with no shame.

tommyardin

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Re: Header refurb questions
« Reply #6 on: 24 March 2017, 12:32:07 AM »
Thanks for the tips chaps, but the collector part is looking pretty ropy and I am looking to fit stainless headers when funds allow, so I need to sort out the nuts/studs anyway. Thing about the Yamaha nuts is, they are rusty as hell so they must be made out of recycled Austin All Aggro




Ghostcat


Ahh! The Austin All Aggro, what a piece of shit. I had one many years ago but to be honest it was not the only time that British Leyland painted a turd, there was the Morris Marina as well. it was about that time when British Leyland and MotherCare joined force and produced the Marina, the only car with a built in rattle.
How the f--k did they get away with it? 90 to 100K out of an 1800cc engine if you were very lucky, they used to burn oil as a fast rate of knots, what they did not burn they leaked out.
Is it any wonder that they went out of production with the likes of Honda producing the Accord and Toyota producing cars like the Corona and Corolla. Sadly the British bike market went the same way and to be honest (IMO) it was no wonder the Honda 250 Dream was faster than most British 500's a lot more reliable handled better and did not thrown 1/2 pint of oil up you shin every 50 miles. RIP British Leyland (You Bastards) :eek
I spent half my life getting drunk and chasing pussy, the other half I just wasted.

Panthor

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Re: Header refurb questions
« Reply #7 on: 24 March 2017, 12:15:45 PM »
I refurbed mine a while ago and didn't have any issues getting them off after 2 weeks of daily spraying with wd40, although mine doesn't get used in the wet. Also I reused the gaskets and didn't have any issues.
They lasted 2 more years but now I have stainless and new gaskets.

Zark

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Re: Header refurb questions
« Reply #8 on: 24 March 2017, 09:30:12 PM »
Dont be in any rush and keep soaking those nuts, I used a syringe to get right in there

^^This... I did kitchen roll soaked in plusgas wrapped around the studs for a week... Came off no drama...

fazersharp

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Re: Header refurb questions
« Reply #9 on: 24 March 2017, 10:45:05 PM »
With a syringe you can get right at the back of the header bracket flange and squirt it down the bolt hole from the back towards the nut, every time it did this I did it after a ride so it was dry and I could see it seep through to the flange on the nut so I knew it was getting in there and not just wetting the surface.

I was in no rush but am getting nearer to needing new pipes so did not want the nightmare of snapped studs on top of everything else, they came of and I put back on with copper grease.   
BUT REMEMBER -- dry miles only for me for the last 17 years 
« Last Edit: 24 March 2017, 10:46:09 PM by fazersharp »
I don't do rain or threat there of. dry rider only with no shame.

LozGreen

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Re: Header refurb questions
« Reply #10 on: 28 March 2017, 02:07:18 PM »
Having recently removed studs from 2 head cylinders - lots of plus gas, and when they don't shift. Lots of heat..

Saw a tip on one forum - if you don't have a blowtorch - get a kitchen one.. £16 from Amazon and got the gas from a local Cookshop for £3 a tin. Then light up any offending studs for a minute or 2 , and voila the buggers come off with ease. Then afterwards the missus has a new toy for the kitchen :D




Disorderlypunk

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Re: Header refurb questions
« Reply #11 on: 28 March 2017, 02:38:08 PM »
unless absolutly needed do not remove exhaust, i was badly blowing past gasket so time to replace them
ooh stuck studs time for plus gas, time and muscles - ooh crap broken studs

i now have the head off (took about 5 hours with cups of coffee)
it is a ball ache to get the carbs out, head is now being sent to a better engineer than me to be drilled out
but bought pod filters and jets to make carb instalation easier, no more airbox wedging

Paul

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Re: Header refurb questions
« Reply #12 on: 29 March 2017, 06:57:45 AM »
I've got stainless steel headers and take them off once a year to clean the exhaust system.


I've never replaced the exhaust gaskets.
I just give them a coat of silicone (the stuff window fitters use) before re-fitting the headers.
It's always seemed to seal them.




GhostCat

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Re: Header refurb questions
« Reply #13 on: 29 March 2017, 04:53:34 PM »
Well the inevitable happened. After 6 days of religious and thorough plus gassing I took the plunge and snapped a stud on the second from left cylinder - the top stud. Its snapped off flush with the nut so praying that some purchase can be got on the stud. its an awkward spot but i got a socket spanner on it.  I stopped trying there ! hope you dont think i was ignoring your advice but i would rather sort it out now then when an mot is looming  i have alternative transport at least. booked into my local mechanics next week


Ghostcat

fazersharp

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Re: Header refurb questions
« Reply #14 on: 29 March 2017, 05:12:03 PM »
maybe 6 days were not enough i soaked mine for about 6 weeks
I don't do rain or threat there of. dry rider only with no shame.

Disorderlypunk

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Re: Header refurb questions
« Reply #15 on: 29 March 2017, 11:40:26 PM »
refitting fzs600 thread has this in but will add in here for future
apparently ATF and Acetone 50/50 works great

if anyone trys it before me then please post here and let the world know

GhostCat

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Re: Header refurb questions
« Reply #16 on: 06 April 2017, 07:03:30 PM »
My local mechanic got the stud out. He said "lots of heat". Cost me an hours labour.
Let the refurb begin !
Next question - is draining the coolant a pain as I need to refurb a couple of the coolant pipes


Ghostcat

daviee

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Re: Header refurb questions
« Reply #17 on: 06 April 2017, 07:56:09 PM »
refitting fzs600 thread has this in but will add in here for future
apparently ATF and Acetone 50/50 works great
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CESDxCloCoQ
if anyone trys it before me then please post here and let the world know



i have herd plenty of good things about this but yet to try it but will give it a test soon


joebloggs

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Re: Header refurb questions
« Reply #18 on: 06 April 2017, 08:11:17 PM »
I say plan for a few studs to shear, drop the engine and  replace all the studs with stainless steel. Foc me , the studs have been seizing up for 15 years +, get over it.
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vinnyb

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Re: Header refurb questions
« Reply #19 on: 22 April 2017, 12:29:38 PM »
 In a reckless fit of curiosity, I decided this morning to see if my header nuts would come off without snapping any studs. I thought I'd just go at it really gently and if they  don't move I'd leave them for the moment and worry about them when I need to but if they do I'd remove them one at a time, fill them with CoppaSlip and replace them. Well I'm thrilled, overjoyed, ecstatic, pretty relieved to report that they all came off with no problems at all. :thumbup :woot

fazersharp

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Re: Header refurb questions
« Reply #20 on: 22 April 2017, 02:44:48 PM »
In a reckless fit of curiosity, I decided this morning to see if my header nuts would come off without snapping any studs. I thought I'd just go at it really gently and if they  don't move I'd leave them for the moment and worry about them when I need to but if they do I'd remove them one at a time, fill them with CoppaSlip and replace them. Well I'm thrilled, overjoyed, ecstatic, pretty relieved to report that they all came off with no problems at all. :thumbup :woot
:thumbup I was the same even though I had soaked them for weeks and I didnt need to do them it was like a button that says Do Not Press I couldn't help myself. All was good for me too. (no rain miles )
I don't do rain or threat there of. dry rider only with no shame.

vinnyb

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Re: Header refurb questions
« Reply #21 on: 22 April 2017, 03:24:03 PM »

Mine's only done 9,000 miles and looks like it hasn't been out in too much bad weather (even though the front of the barrels and one or two other areas look like they have) I think the thing to do is just take them off an reapply CoppaSlip regularly to prevent future problems. 

GhostCat

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Re: Header refurb questions
« Reply #22 on: 25 April 2017, 06:54:54 PM »
A word of warning, if you are going to use that acid etch primer, it requires that every last scrap of black paint is removed, which is really an engine out job. Mine looks a bit like a dogs dinner now.  :'( all the other bits are done, water pipes, headers, snapped the bottom radiator bolt off trying to remove the rad, so back to the shop for drilling ! And waiting on the correct exhaust stud to arrive, they sent an M10 !


GC

vinnyb

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Re: Header refurb questions
« Reply #23 on: 25 April 2017, 10:26:42 PM »

 Why? What happens if you spray over the old paint? There's no way the engine's coming out. I was planning to just remove the flaky, loose stuff and deoxidize the bare metal with alubright, etch prime just the areas that need it, then respray with PJ1 satin black. I've got a lot of masking to do before I start spraying. I was wondering if I could use standard gloss black paint on my radiator or if it would be unable to tolerate the heat. I can't decide whether to get the exhaust ceramic coated. It's pricey but no more than a stainless system. I'll probably just respray it for now, dunno yet.

Disorderlypunk

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Re: Header refurb questions
« Reply #24 on: 25 April 2017, 10:54:26 PM »
if you use the bike a lot like me just wire brush what you can get to on the frame and wait for a engine out catastrophy before you repaint the engine
-ive used hammerite smooth on the frame and on a few of the scratched casings that are a bit cooler then engine block
- she can wait till the full rebuild for her makeover