Rules of the road please help

[darrsi]

http://www.dailystar.co.uk/news/latest-news/570730/Transport-Secretary-Chris-Grayling-cyclist-hit-video-London-Westminster

[slappy]

Talking about insurance, does anyone else think that if cyclists are gonna play with the big boys on the road, shouldn't they have insurance as well?
Bearing in mind they continue to dangerously jump red lights, undertake lorries and buses, and generally throw caution to the wind on a daily basis!

There is a petition going around that calls for insurance and road tax for cyclists. I'm in two minds about it. Sure they are bloody annoying especially the ones with black bikes and clothing and no lights but on the other hand it would be a shame if the last free form of transport were to disappear.

Walking, running, skipping........

Don't get me started on pedestrians and joggers, and what is it with bloody unicycles? Seen a guy a few times on my way to work on one, riding along the pavement, makes  " normal" cyclists look safe.

[Bretty]

I think it's funny that people suggest that cyclists should take a CBT style test as if it would make them better riders? ...because that works for moped riders!!!

[darrsi]

Talking about insurance, does anyone else think that if cyclists are gonna play with the big boys on the road, shouldn't they have insurance as well?
Bearing in mind they continue to dangerously jump red lights, undertake lorries and buses, and generally throw caution to the wind on a daily basis!

There is a petition going around that calls for insurance and road tax for cyclists. I'm in two minds about it. Sure they are bloody annoying especially the ones with black bikes and clothing and no lights but on the other hand it would be a shame if the last free form of transport were to disappear.

Walking, running, skipping........

Don't get me started on pedestrians and joggers, and what is it with bloody unicycles? Seen a guy a few times on my way to work on one, riding along the pavement, makes  " normal" cyclists look safe.

Or i keep seeing some nutter on one of those long push bikes that you lay back on, so trucks have a better chance of mangling him.

[YamFazFan]

I've noticed that the latest fashion is riding cycles no handed with both hands stuffed in the coat pockets.

That's brave with all the pot-holes about

[Grahamm]

Talking about insurance, does anyone else think that if cyclists are gonna play with the big boys on the road, shouldn't they have insurance as well?

An argument that comes up many a time. Usually from drivers who don't understand that there's a difference between 100kg of cyclist and rider and 1.5 tonnes or more of car (not forgetting that it's estimated that over a million drivers on the road are uninsured).

As two-wheel users ourselves, we should be *encouraging* others to also use two wheels, doing so reduces pollution, reduces congestion, reduces the amount of space given over to car parking, reduces time lost due to ill-health etc.

Oh, and cycles were on the roads *before* the "big boys" too...

Yes, cyclists should have lights, ride responsibly, not jump red lights etc etc, but the ones who do that sort of stuff are not going to bother with getting insurance anyway because they know that there's virtually damn all chance of them getting caught without it in the first place.

[darrsi]

Talking about insurance, does anyone else think that if cyclists are gonna play with the big boys on the road, shouldn't they have insurance as well?

An argument that comes up many a time. Usually from drivers who don't understand that there's a difference between 100kg of cyclist and rider and 1.5 tonnes or more of car (not forgetting that it's estimated that over a million drivers on the road are uninsured).

As two-wheel users ourselves, we should be *encouraging* others to also use two wheels, doing so reduces pollution, reduces congestion, reduces the amount of space given over to car parking, reduces time lost due to ill-health etc.

Oh, and cycles were on the roads *before* the "big boys" too...

Yes, cyclists should have lights, ride responsibly, not jump red lights etc etc, but the ones who do that sort of stuff are not going to bother with getting insurance anyway because they know that there's virtually damn all chance of them getting caught without it in the first place.

Pedestrians were on the roads/tracks way before cars so that's really a moot point to be honest, times have changed!

[mickvp]

I think cyclists should really have some sort of basic insurance requirement and I dont see what sort of bearing the combined weight of cyclist + bike have on the matter either? A "100Kg cyclist+ bike" still has the ability to cause a lot of damage, not only directly through them colliding with another vehicle, but also by their actions directly causing an accident invlving multiple vehicles and then the scope of the damage becomes more apparent.

VED is a no-go though I would have thought as its based on emissions now? unless its a brussel sprout fuelled post-christmas ride, the emissions ought to be fairly low

Insirance for all road users if nothing else ought to make everyone who uses the roads a bit more accountable for their actions.

[Graham53]

I think cyclists should really have some sort of basic insurance requirement and I dont see what sort of bearing the combined weight of cyclist + bike have on the matter either? A "100Kg cyclist+ bike" still has the ability to cause a lot of damage, not only directly through them colliding with another vehicle, but also by their actions directly causing an accident invlving multiple vehicles and then the scope of the damage becomes more apparent.

VED is a no-go though I would have thought as its based on emissions now? unless its a brussel sprout fuelled post-christmas ride, the emissions ought to be fairly low

Insirance for all road users if nothing else ought to make everyone who uses the roads a bit more accountable for their actions.

Totally agree with that , I used to be a bus driver in London ( don't hate me I always let motorcycles out !!)
And the crap I saw cyclists do in a 3 hour period one morning I counted 75 cyclists running red lights but the best one was I was in a queue at a red light and parked in a bay just before the lights in Clapham was a brand new Range Rover vogue SE and this girl on a cycle tried to ride through a gap between a lorry and the Range Rover next to it and her metal pedals caught and scraped the side of the Range Rover , she stopped looked at the damage giggled then rode off , fuck knows how much the damage cost the owner but it must have been big , reg number and insurance will make them accountable for misdemeanours as are all of us road users

[darrsi]

I think cyclists should really have some sort of basic insurance requirement and I dont see what sort of bearing the combined weight of cyclist + bike have on the matter either? A "100Kg cyclist+ bike" still has the ability to cause a lot of damage, not only directly through them colliding with another vehicle, but also by their actions directly causing an accident invlving multiple vehicles and then the scope of the damage becomes more apparent.

VED is a no-go though I would have thought as its based on emissions now? unless its a brussel sprout fuelled post-christmas ride, the emissions ought to be fairly low

Insirance for all road users if nothing else ought to make everyone who uses the roads a bit more accountable for their actions.

Totally agree with that , I used to be a bus driver in London ( don't hate me I always let motorcycles out !!)
And the crap I saw cyclists do in a 3 hour period one morning I counted 75 cyclists running red lights but the best one was I was in a queue at a red light and parked in a bay just before the lights in Clapham was a brand new Range Rover vogue SE and this girl on a cycle tried to ride through a gap between a lorry and the Range Rover next to it and her metal pedals caught and scraped the side of the Range Rover , she stopped looked at the damage giggled then rode off , fuck knows how much the damage cost the owner but it must have been big , reg number and insurance will make them accountable for misdemeanours as are all of us road users

When i worked in Londons Oxford Street years ago i would be out getting lunch and see at least something happen every day with a cyclist.
I think as their adrenaline levels were up it made them more carefree and also angry and quick tempered.
Red lights simply did not exist to them, and one thing that was really noticeable was that black taxi drivers absolutely hated them and would row with them at the drop of a hat, or just block their path on purpose.

[BBROWN1664]

CBT for cyclists - Something like the Cycling proficiency thing we used to do at school???

Many schools still do this though my youngest blames his lack of road skills on the fact that his school switched from doing it with yr6 students to yr5 students when he went to yr6. Stupid school decided it was too disruptive and costly to double up that year and do the yr6 students that missed out as well.

When I was younger, all cyclists over the age of about 10 rode on the road. Now very few do and the ones that do, ignore all the traffic lights etc.

[Fazerider]

Completely agree that training ought to be compulsory for cyclists.


Another issue is cycle lane markings at some junctions that seems intended to put cyclists in harm's way. There are several places on my route to work in W12 where a turn-off to the left has a dedicated left-only lane for traffic, but the cycle lane continues to be marked as such right up to the stop line/ASL. You then have cyclists intending to go straight on, riding up the inside of traffic turning left.

[fazersharp]

Completely agree that training ought to be compulsory for cyclists.


Another issue is cycle lane markings at some junctions that seems intended to put cyclists in harm's way. There are several places on my route to work in W12 where a turn-off to the left has a dedicated left-only lane for traffic, but the cycle lane continues to be marked as such right up to the stop line/ASL. You then have cyclists intending to go straight on, riding up the inside of traffic turning left.

Round here we have a separate green section covering the whole width of the lane at the lights with cars having a separate stop line further back

[Fazerider]

Completely agree that training ought to be compulsory for cyclists.


Another issue is cycle lane markings at some junctions that seems intended to put cyclists in harm's way. There are several places on my route to work in W12 where a turn-off to the left has a dedicated left-only lane for traffic, but the cycle lane continues to be marked as such right up to the stop line/ASL. You then have cyclists intending to go straight on, riding up the inside of traffic turning left.

Round here we have a separate green section covering the whole width of the lane at the lights with cars having a separate stop line further back

Yes, the Advanced Stop Line.
Only about 1% of cyclists get themselves into the correct position on the road for going straight on whether or not they have to wait in the green zone because they're reluctant to leave the "safety" of the cycle lane.
A solution might be to end the cycle lane 25 metres before the ASL and paint "Get In Lane" just before that point.

[Graham53]

all that road tax payers money spent on road markings,junctions, special lanes and solutions on a group that pays no road tax towards it ...... that makes financial sense
I think snipers positioned strategically around major cities are the answer ..... any cyclist ignoring a light 

A quick action sedative dart in the arse , stop over the line too far  in fact any cycling misdemeanour
They'll all be road rule abiding cyclists in no time 

[mtread]

The trouble is ........... to make anything (insurance, testing etc) about cycling 'compulsory' you'd have to register every bike and/or rider. That's not going to happen, is it because of the overhead? Can you imagine the police stopping every yoof on his MBX and asking to see his licence?
Cyclists are subject to the laws of the road as much as anybody else, and if they cause damage can be sued.
I was hit by a pheasant once. Typical, no licence, no insurance ......

[Fazerider]

I was hit by a pheasant once. Typical, no licence, no insurance ......

Happened to me once too. I had the last laugh though... I ate the bastard. 

[Grahamm]

Yes, the Advanced Stop Line.
Only about 1% of cyclists get themselves into the correct position on the road for going straight on whether or not they have to wait in the green zone because they're reluctant to leave the "safety" of the cycle lane.

And how about all those motorists who don't know (or don't give a foc) that that Advanced Stop Line is for *CYCLES* only? Theoretically, of course, they could be fined for stopping their car in one, but, as with the cyclists who jump red lights, they know that this is very unlikely ever to happen.

What we need is better training for *ALL* road users. Ironically, it's now the bikers who actually have to have the most training...