Life is full of little ups and downs

[tommyardin]

I'm sure it has been covered on many many occasions, but here goes again, an old chestnut.
My FZS600 Foxeye 2002, 03 registered (That's the silver one, yes you got it, the fastest colour) is a great bike and I love it, it has been in my possession for 3.5 years now.


I purchased it with about 28K on the clock, it had been used for commuting, but to be honest the previous owner had treated the bike well, and, I believe it was always been garaged when not in use.
He had a top end service done on the bike about 1K before trading it in (Valve clearances, new inlet manifold rubbers, carb tune and balance) plus a full engine oil/air filter service, including fuel filter and coolant change.
Looking through the bikes history, engine servicing was something of a regular theme with him, he appeared to change the oil and filter every 4K, and air filter every 8K.
So basically the bike was cared for, if not loved as it was a workhorse to him.
I purchased the bike from a dealer at £1,900, knowing I would need to spend some time on her if not money.

I have done the usual things to her, after a full day of washing and polishing and half a tube of Solvo polish on the alloy and chrome, I then purchased a set of S/Steel down pipes and collector, added a S/Steel link pipe and a Pipeworks sports can.
Other upgrades have been blue braided S/Steel brake pipes, back and front. Fitted a S/Steel FAZER radiator gaurd

Front carbon fender extender and matching rear huger, upgraded the headlight bulbs to 100 watt hint of blue units, replaced the side light bulbs with bright LED hint of blue bulbs and added two 50mm 30 watt Cree LED projector spot lights (I want to be seen, I ride with all on in the daytime, plus a bright yellow Full Face Bucket).  I have mid blue pin stripped the wheels, matching blue bar end weights and front screen screws, standard screen has been replaced with a flip screen (Not really sure it made any real difference) all the engine case screws have been replaced with blue S/Steel allan screws and other odd bits like the oil filer cap has been replaced with a blue alloy filler cap.
I have the 12 mm front sprocket nut and washer kit waiting to go on.
I have the Nitron gas mono-shock on order, OUCH! £414-00, but have been informed by a number of riders its much better than the Hagon unit, watch this space.

Now to the front end, The Forks, now this in itself is a minefield, some say progressive springs , some say get springs that are matched to your weight, other say stick with the standard springs and drain and clean out the forks and just replace the oil with something like Silkolean Pro fork oil at about 10 -15 weight.
I am open to suggestions from guys who have a valid opinion, IE: Have done the job themselves.

My riding style? I like to crack on a bit but definitely not a scratcher wanting to scuff knees, The old Fazer still motors on, I have had 140 out of her and I honestly believe she has another 5 mph in her.
Handling is OK at best that is why I want to do the suspension upgrades, the back end is up and down like a whores drawers, never thought I would be sea sick on a bike  but the Nitron should sort that out.
So any opinions on the front end would be much appreciated.

Cheers guys its a great forum with a shed full of knowledge and experience. 
Tom (tommyardin)
 

[anutz]

So i stuck some standard hyperpro progressives in mine, made a world of difference, combined with the R6 shock in the rear end


no more bobbing or diving in corners or under hard breaking, it picks up nicely.....

[tommyardin]

Thanks for the info anutz.


One other thing is someone said that by raising the fork stanchions/legs up through the yokes by 15 -20mm is supposed to help, this would drop the nose by that amount and throw the weight more forward, to be honest I'm not sure what the advantage would be as the bikes weight is the bike weight and moving the weight forward with unload the back wheel by that amount.
Anyone have any thoughts?
     

[anutz]

dont know the specifics but my gsxr has the forks poking through and its common to do, it changes the steering angles so the bike does turn quicker i think, but i only wanted it to stop dipping in regards to the FZS600, so the firmer springs sorted me out no probs.

[Frosties]

Tommy - as a test, it might be worth changing the fork oil first to a heavier grade (15w) and adding some spacers into the forks. This would effectively stiffen up the front and you can play around with the spacer size. Bigger spacer = firmer linear springs etc. Progressives don't suit every one due to the changing of the spring rate say mid corner when the front is loaded. Staying linear may be the way to go......and it's a damn site cheaper. After all, you have a fair bit of spare time on your hands judging by the lack of dirt on your bike. Got to be worth a go for the cost of fork oil + plastic tubing.

[tommyardin]

Got to be worth a go for the cost of fork oil + plastic tubing.

I think I may be setting myself up for a bit of piss taking here  what is the plastic tubing for ?

[anutz]

based on this and the nice graphs, i think it stiffens up the fork by putting you further up its graph for force/compression...


http://www.sportrider.com/technicalities-spring-rate-and-preload


So one way to make it feel firmer i guess, i did not do this, so not 100% but know some foccers have done

[Frosties]

based on this and the nice graphs, i think it stiffens up the fork by putting you further up its graph for force/compression...


http://www.sportrider.com/technicalities-spring-rate-and-preload


So one way to make it feel firmer i guess, i did not do this, so not 100% but know some foccers have done

That's basically it. Imagine a spring in a tube, the you put a spacer in the tube. All you've done is compress the spring which makes the travel shorter and the spring force stronger whilst still keeping it linear. I totally understand the piss taking caution - there is some history between us on that front but not this one mate....trust me. The thicker fork oil is also true - imagine pushing water through a syringe then try it with a thicker oil. The oil will take more force so makes the front suspension firmer.

[Graham53]

Had my 600 foxeye for 10 years although I've kept it pretty standard I have tried dropping the forks before , it's basically doing the same as a jack up kit which come in 2 sizes, 25mm and I think 50mm from lust racing  it quickens up the steering but does make it a bit less stable at speed I'm not sure but I think it changes the geometry of the bike but I might be wrong on that.
I have heard of some guys that do a jack up kit and drop forks but it always seemed a bit extreme to do both although dropping forks made it a bit quicker steering , changing fork oil weight did make a difference too that was done by a yam dealer when I took forks in for a rebuild.
Blue is by far the fastest colour for on saying that I've just bought a silver 1000

[tommyardin]

Blue is by far the fastest colour for on saying that I've just bought a silver 1000



Ahh! great choice the silver one, I'm glad it's not just me that likes his bikes in primer.


I have been chatting with anutz in messages and he has given me some things to think about fork wise, and some of the graphs that he has posted on here make sense about pre-load and spring rates, my Fazer FZS600 is a Foxy model so it has the pre-load adjusters on the fork tops, but I think I will still try a few large penny washer on top of the springs below the fork tube caps, I would guess bouncing up and down for 38K mile will have compressed/shortened the springs a tad.
The info on linear springs also makes sense to as the spring compression rate remains the same albeit progressive. that sounds like bollocks now I said it. lol   

[darrsi]

OEM springs are already progressive, albeit not very good ones.
15w oil does make a big difference for little cost and effort though, it may just do enough for your style of riding.

[Frosties]

Blue is by far the fastest colour for on saying that I've just bought a silver 1000



Ahh! great choice the silver one, I'm glad it's not just me that likes his bikes in primer.


I have been chatting with anutz in messages and he has given me some things to think about fork wise, and some of the graphs that he has posted on here make sense about pre-load and spring rates, my Fazer FZS600 is a Foxy model so it has the pre-load adjusters on the fork tops, but I think I will still try a few large penny washer on top of the springs below the fork tube caps, I would guess bouncing up and down for 38K mile will have compressed/shortened the springs a tad.
The info on linear springs also makes sense to as the spring compression rate remains the same albeit progressive. that sounds like bollocks now I said it. lol 

If you look at the length of spring Tommy I would start with about an inch of spacer first go. Only change one thing at a time so either spacers by itself or heavier oil. Changing 2 things gives too many variables to think about. It's only time we're talking about so bit by bit and decent test ride after each tweak. Good luck and we need updates 

[tommyardin]

If you look at the length of spring Tommy I would start with about an inch of spacer first go. Only change one thing at a time so either spacers by itself or heavier oil. Changing 2 things gives too many variables to think about. It's only time we're talking about so bit by bit and decent test ride after each tweak. Good luck and we need updates 

Thanks for the advice Frosties (You little Tiger you) but it makes sense, one thing at a time and then the changes can be accurately assessed, rather than doing a number of things and not being able to pinpoint the thing that has made the most significant difference.
15 weight Silkolean Pro Fork oil first and give it a couple of weeks, to assess. and move on to more pre-load by adding spacers/large penny washer to the tops of the springs. then maybe lifting the fork stanchion/tubes by 15mm through the yokes to add a bit more down-force at the front end and hopefully sharpen up the turn in.
Bit at a time is good advice. Thanks.  

I don't think the old Fazer FZS600 steers or handles badly, it's just not inspiring, and, all the confidence boosters this old fart can get will be gratefully received. I feel the chicken strips are laughing at me now, the tyres have done about 600 miles and I still have 3/4" of virgin rubber on both side of the back tyre.

Me dreaming on a Tyco, Mrs said get off it and act your bloody age not you shoe size, they can be so hurtful at times.
But in all fairness to her she cuts me a lot of slack in life, bless her.  

[kebab19]

You'll need heavier fork oil, 15w probably the best compromise.  Then you WILL need different fork springs, as adding preload can't compensate for the standard items.  They are dual-rate, but the 'soft' part of the spring is too soft and the 'hard' part of the spring is too hard. Replace them with springs more suited to your weight. I used VFR800 springs with the fork's inner steel spacers recut to size. Then finally, for the harshness in the damper rod forks I used emulators, which brings them close to cartridge forks for ride quality. If you don't do the first two mods above, the forks will never handle well enough to satisfy 'spirited' riding. the third is an optional luxury but I wouldn't go without it.

For the rear use a modified 2008-2016 R6 shock. It's a mod that I pinched from the Fazer 1000 brigade and can work just as well for the 600's with the correct weight spring and a few other parts.
For comparison, I had a Nitron 'Track' model fitted to my old FZS1000 and it was only slightly better than when I had the R6 shock fitted, but almost three times the price. 

Save yourself a few hundred £££ exploring the options above ... I've documented all this stuff across this forum if you search for it long enough

[tommyardin]

Cheers Kebab,
That is what I am looking for, as much advice and ideas as I can get from guys who have done the business, I have to admit though I am a bit on the stuborn side and have set my heart on the Nitron Mono-Shock.
I have heard nothing but praise from guys who have used them, not just on the FOC-U forum but from riders of different machines, the general consensus is that its the best you can get without going for a full race blown unit.
I'm not a scratcher, but I do like to ride in a spirited manner and wish to run the chicken strips off my rear tyre, so I have plumped for the Nitron on the rear and will slowly try to improve the front end, firstly with 15 weight Silkolene Pro in the forks, and, if necessary go down the spring change route.Thanks guys for your wisdom and great advice.

[Frosties]

Hey Tommy, nowt wrong with sitting on that Tyco, if you want it and can afford it then have it - one life so enjoy it.


Acting your age never comes into it - my kids are always telling me to grow up. Only a state of mind as you know, biking keeps you young.

[tommyardin]

Hey Tommy, nowt wrong with sitting on that Tyco, if you want it and can afford it then have it - one life so enjoy it.


Acting your age never comes into it - my kids are always telling me to grow up. Only a state of mind as you know, biking keeps you young.

I just looked at the Tyco pictures again and really believe its an omen, check out my socks they are perfect for the Tyco colour scheme, it is obviously meant to be, so I am changing the word from Omen to Amen. 

[tommyardin]

Just watched the Guy Martin prog on Channel 4, the idiot is now going to cross the English Channel on a pedal power helium filled Air Ship.
That Man's Balls are massive, lol!
He has no fear and he is incredibley fit, and strong as an OX.
He flipped over/righted in a swimming pool a 29 man emergency life raft by himself ,the military said they would expect it to take two men to flip it in water because of the suction effect of the water.
In guy's own words ' ITS PROPER '

[Dave48]

tommy when I got my latest 600 it had done 51000 miles & the suspension was shagged! After all it was basic when new.
Near me in West Mids (Halesowen) reside Revs Racing who only do suspension. I ordered a Wilbers rear shock((quality German brand) with spring designed for my weight -&.riding style which I suspect is similar to yours. To say it transformed the handling would be an understatement but it then highlighted the tired front end. So they rebuilt the front forks with new springs, seals & heavier weight oil. She now goes where I point her. Didnt want to mess about with jacking up rear/altering front fork leg height in yokes. Cost was £295 for rear unit & £212 for front rebuild. Very happy I am-no more pogo sticks

[Jules-C]

£295 for a Wilbers shock sounds like a bargain

[Frosties]

Hey Tommy, nowt wrong with sitting on that Tyco, if you want it and can afford it then have it - one life so enjoy it.


Acting your age never comes into it - my kids are always telling me to grow up. Only a state of mind as you know, biking keeps you young.

I just looked at the Tyco pictures again and really believe its an omen, check out my socks they are perfect for the Tyco colour scheme, it is obviously meant to be, so I am changing the word from Omen to Amen. 

Errrrrrrrr, shit socks and Sketchers = old age Tommy mate. Feckin bin 'em 

[tommyardin]

Fuck off I only just got rid of my Y fronts

[Frosties]

Don't panic mate - all sorted 

[Html33]

Is the fazer worth doing about £600 senpension mods, all these other mods when... It's just a fazer?
I might offend a few people saying that but i have just bought a cheap one to run around, and as fun as it is - It's no match against my ZX6R or newer up right bikes

[fazersharp]

Is the fazer worth doing about £600 senpension mods, all these other mods when... It's just a fazer?
I might offend a few people saying that but i have just bought a cheap one to run around, and as fun as it is - It's no match against my ZX6R or newer up right bikes

I think £600 is a lot against a 1-2k bike.
I actually find nothing wrong with the suspension although only 18k on the clock and I have been the owner for 15 years, I only weigh between 9.5 and 10 stone so perhaps the suspension doesn't get abused much.